Xl       3  .       (4. 


THE  LIBRARY 

OF 

THE  UNIVERSITY 

OF  CALIFORNIA 

LOS  ANGELES 


...^-j 


G  Soaaf.Jaif  d^ 


Prmted  b/  ItrdiVfesi 


MONUMENT  OF   FRANCIS  HORNER,  MP 
irv  Wesiminsler  Ahhey. 
Executed  V  Sir  FraJicis  CliajitiN'. 


MEMOIRS 


AND    COPiP.ESPONDENCE 


OF 


FRANCIS    HORNER,  M.P. 


EDITED    BY    HIS    BROTHER, 

LEONARD  HORNER,  ESQ.  F.R.S. 


IN     TWO     VOLUMES. 

VOL.   IT. 


BOSTON: 
LITTLE,  BROAVN  AND   COMPANY. 

1853. 


Entered  according  to  Act  of  Congrcfs  in  the  year  1853,  by 

LITTLE,  BllOWN  AND   COxMPANY, 

In  the  Clerk's  Office  of  the  District  Court  of  the  District  of  Massachusetts. 


CAMBRIDGE  : 
ALLEN   AND    FAKNILVM,  VKINTEUS. 


CONTENTS 


THE    SECOND    VOLUME, 


1810. 

"^  Page 

House  of  Commons.     Mr.  Horner  brings  forward  the  question 

of  the  State  of  the  Currency ;  appointment  of 

the  BuUion  Committee        .....       1 

Letter  150.  Fkoje  J.  A.  Murray,  Esq.     Has  heard  reports 

of  Mr.  Horner  being  about  to  accept  a  political 

office,  and  dissuades  him  from  it  ...       3 

151.  To  Sir  Samuel  Romilly.     Urging  him  to  print 

a  speech  he  had  made  on  a  reform  of  the  Crimi- 
nal Law    ........       4 

152.  To  Lord  Grenville.    Asks  his  advice  as  to  his 

proceedings  on  the  Cun-ency  question  .         .       5 

153.  From  Lord   Grenville.     Satisfaction  that  Mr. 

Horner  has  taken  up  the  subject  of  the   Cur- 
rency        ........       6 

Notes  by  Mr.  Horner.  On  the  vote  of  the  House  of  Com- 
mons on  the  Walcheren  expedition  ;  and  on  the 
question  of  privilege  in  the  commitment  of  Sir  F. 

Burdett  to  the  Tower 8 

Letter  153.*  To  Dugald   Stewart,   Esq.     Dr.  Brown  ap- 
pointed  Mr.    Stewart's   successor  in   the  Chair 
of   Moral   Philosophy ;    unsatisfactory   state   of 
public  affiiirs ;  conduct  of  the  Opposition  in  Par- 
liament     ........     10 

Letter  154.  To  Lord  Holland.  Question  of  privilege  .  12 
House  of  Commons.  Speeches  of  Mr.  Horner  on  the  same  .  13 
Letter  155.  To  J.  A.  Murray,  Esq.    The  same  subject        .    15 


yi  CONTENTS. 

Letter  15G.  To  the  same.     Scotch  parliamentary  reform        .     19 

157.  To  THE  SAME.     Report  of  the  Bullion  Committee; 

opmions  of  Lord  Erskine  and  Sir  S.  Romilly  on 
the  question  of  privilege ;  Sir  F.  Burdett's  re- 
turn from  the  Tower ;  his  character  ;  Mr.  George 
Wilson 20 

158.  To  F.  Jeffrey,  Esq.     Bullion  Report ;  protests 

against  the  introduction  of  party  politics  into  the 
Edinburgh  Review;  Mr.  Jeffrey's  critique  on 
"  Crabbe's  Borough "  .  ...     24 

158.*  To  J.  A.  Murray,  Esq.  Plan  for  their  passing 
the  vacation  together  ;  observations  on  the  ques- 
tion of  privilege  of  Parliament   .         .         .         .27 

159.  To    J.   A.   Murray,   Esq.     Projects  a  visit  to 

Ireland 30 

IGO.  To  his  Mother.  Account  of  his  tour  in  Ireland  31 
160.*  To  the  Rev.  T.  R.  Malthus.       The  Bullion 

Report 35 

160.**  To  the    Duke    of    Somerset.      Impressions 

from  a  visit  to  Ireland        .         .         .         .         .36 

161.  To    DuGALD    Stewart,    Esq.     Subject  of   the 

Bullion  Report  ......     38 

162.  To    J.  A.  Murray,   Esq.      Currency   question; 

illness  of  the  King     ......     40 

163.  To  the  same.     Mr.  Percival's  letter  to  the  Prince 

of  Wales  on  the  question  of  the  Regency  .         .     43 
House  of    Commons.     Mr.   Horner   speaks   on   the   Regency 

question ;  report  of  his  speech  .         .         .         .44 

1811. 

Letter  164.  To  F.  Jeffrey,  Esq.  Suggests  some  subjects 
for  the  Edinburgh  Review;  his  opmion  on  the 
question  of  peace ;  the  Prince  has  sent  for  Lords 
Grenville  and  Grey  ......     47 

165.  From  Lord  Grenville.    Asks  Mr.  Homer  to  be 

one  of  the  Secretaries  of  the  Treasury,  in  the 
event  of  a  change  of  ministry  taking  place  .     54 

166.  To  J.  A.  Murray,  Esq.     Tells  him  of  the  offer 

made  to  him  by  Lord  Grenville,  and  of  his  having 
declined  it 55 


CONTENTS.  y 

Letter  IGG.*  To  the  Hon.  Mrs.  "W.  Spencer.     Life  of  Sir 

Tliomas  More    .         .         .         .         .         .         .56 

166.**  To, J.  A.  Murray,  Esq.  Mr.  Murray  has 
refused  a  judicial  office.  Such  offices  privcn  by 
then  government  of  Scothmd  to  political  partisans  58 
167.  To  THE  Hon.  Mrs.  W.  Spencer.  His  progress 
on  the  circuit ;  is  going  to  pass  the  autumn  with 
his  father's  family  at  Torquay    .         .         .         .60 

House  of  Commons.  Mr.  Horner's  proceedings  in  bringing  the 
Report  of  the  Bullion  Committee  under  the  con- 
sideration of  the  House     ,         .         .         .         .62 

Letter  168.  To  his  Father.     Account  of  the  debate  on  the 

Bullion  Report 67 

169.  From  the  Rev.  T.  R.  Malthus.     Mr.  Horner's 

speech  on  the  Bullion  Report     .         .         .         .69 

170.  To  HIS  Father.     Currency  question ;   illness  of 

the  King 69 

170.*  To  J.  A.  Murray,  Esq.     Death  of  Lord  Presi- 
dent Blair;  his  character  .         .         .         .         .71 

171.  To  J.  A.  Murray,  Esq.     His  speech  on  the  Bul- 

lion Report        .......     73 

172.  To    the    Hon.  Mrs.  W.  Spencer.     Tunbridge 

Wells ;  the  nightingale's  note     .         .         .         .75 
172.*  To  J.  A.  Murray,  Esq.     Aspect  of  domestic 
politics  ;  Character  of  the  Prince  Regent ;  Duke 
of  Cumberland  and  Lord  Yaraiouth  leading  him     76    v^ 

173.  To  Lord  Grenville.     The  Currency   question     78  -'^ 

174.  To  HIS  Brother.     Advice  on  his  geological  pur- 

suits ;  invites  him  to  come  to  Torquay        .         .     81 

175.  To    HIS    Brother.       Describes    the    geological 

atti'actions  of  the  neighbourhood  of  Torquay ; 
remarks  on  "  Playfair's  Illustrations  of  the  Hut- 
tonian  Theory " 82 

176.  To  Lord  Webb  Seyjiour.     His  brother's  geo- 

logical pursuits  ;  his  own  occupations  at  Torquay     86 
176.*  To  J.  A.  Murray,  Esq.     The  same  subject  as 

letter  172* -       .     88 

177.  To  John  Allen,  Esq.     Transactions  of  the  Gov- 

ernment in  Ireland     ......     90 

178.  To  J.  A.  Murray,  Esq.     Question  .of  the  accept- 

ance of  a  judicial  office  by  an  mdividual  differing 
A* 


^2  CONTENTS. 

in  politics  from  the  Government  wliicli  confers  it ; 

Lord  Gillies 92 

House  of    Commons.     Mr.  Horner  speaks  on   the   subject   of 

sinecure  OlFices  .         .         •         •         •         .04 

1812. 

Letter  179.  To  J.  A.  Murray,  Esq.     Mr.  Brougham's  speech 

on  the  Droits  of  Admiralty         .         .         .         .96 

180.  To    THE    Rev.    T.    R.    Maltdus.      Lancaster's 

Schools,  and  the  National  Schools      .         .         .97 

181.  To  J.  A.  Murray,  Esq.     Failures  of  negotiations 

for  a  change  of  Ministry 98 

182.  To  Henry  Hallam,  Esq.     State  of  his  Health ; 

intends  to  visit  Scotland  ;  conduct  of  Lords  Grey 
and  Grenville  in  the  late  negotiations  for  their 
coming  into  office  ;  affairs  of  Spain    .         .         .100 

183.  To  HIS  Brother.     Visit  to  the  Rev.  John  Poole's 

village  school  in  Somersetshire  ....  103 

184.  To    J.   A.   Murray,    Esq.      Intending    to   visit 

Scotland 105 

185.  From  Lord  Webb  Seymour.    Asks  Mr.  H.  to 

pass  some  time  at  Bulstrode ;  anxiety  about  his 
health 107 

186.  To  Mrs.  L.  Horner.     Ls  going  to  Malvern        .  108 

187.  To    HIS    Sister,    Miss    Horner.      Journey   in 

Scotland;  society  at  Edinburgh;  visits  Mr. 
Dugald  Stewart 109 

188.  To  J.  A.  Murray,  Esq.     Has  been  visiting  Mr. 

Brougham  in  Westmoreland;  Sir  S.  Romilly's 
canvass  at  Bristol       .         .         .         .         .         .114 

189.  To  THE  Rev.  Sydney  Smith.     Liforms  hmi  that 

he  is  not  to  be  in  the  new  parliament  .         .115 

190.  To    Sir    Samuel    Romilly.     Sir   S.    R.  having 

been  defeated  at  Bristol,  he  urges  him  not  to 
refuse  to  sit  for  a  borough,  if  offered  to  him         .  116 

191.  From  the  same.     Answer  to  the  preceding         .  117 

192.  To  Lord  Holland.     Has  heard  that  he  is  to 

have  a  seat  in  parliament  through  the  friendship 
of  Lord  Grenville ;  urges  the  preferable  claims 
of  Sir  S.  Romilly 118 


CONTENTS. 


Vll 


Lettek  193.  To  J.  A.  Murray,  Esq.  Regrets  that  Mr. 
Brougham  has  been  unsuccessful  in  tlie  election 
for  Liverpool,  and  hopes  that  he  will  find  another 
seat ;  announces  his  own  expectation  of  being  in 
the  new  parliament    .         .         .         .         .         .120 

194.  To  THE  SAME.     Mr.  Brougham's  great  success  at 

the  bar ;  his  speech  in  defence  of  Hunt ;  Russian 
campaign  of  the  French    .         .  .         .         .123 

195.  To  THE  SAME.     EiFect  of  the  property  tax  on  the 

farmers  in  Scotland;  Lord  EUenborough's  con- 
duct on  Hunt's  trial 126 


1813. 

Letter  196.  To  Henry  Hallam,  Esq.  Rejoices  in  a  majority 
in  favour  of  the  Catholic  claims  in  the  House  of 
Commons  .         .  .  .         ,         .         .128 

197.  From   Wm.    Freemantle,   Esq.      Offer  to  Mr. 

Horner  of  a  seat  in  parliament  .         .         .130 

198.  To  the  same.     Accei^ting  the  offer     .         .        .  131 

199.  To  Lord  Holland.     Catholic  Relief  Bill  .  131    'N 
House  of  Commons.     Mr.  Horner  returned  for  St.  Mawes ;  he 

speaks  on  a  bill  on  the  affairs  of  India,  and  on  ^ 

the  Corn  Laws 133    f^ 

Letter  200.  To    Lord    Grenville.      Breaking  up   of   Mr. 

Canning's  party  in  parliament    .         .         .         .135 

201.  To  Lady  Holland.     The  Speaker's  speech  to 

the  Throne  at  the  close  of  the  session         .         .137 

202.  From    Lord   Grenville.      Dissolution  of  Mr. 

Canning's  party ;  the  Speaker's  speech       ,         .  138 

203.  To    HIS    Sister,  Miss  A.  Horner.      Visits   to 

Mr.  Rose  and  his  son,  in  Ham2)shire  .  .139 
203.*  To  J.  A.  Murray,  Esq.  Mr.  Jeffrey's  voyage 
to  the  United  States ;  management  of  the  Edin- 
burgh RevieAV  during  his  absence ;  Mr.  Horner 
proposes  to  contribute  some  articles;  visit  at 
Cheltenham 140 

204.  To  HIS  Sister,  Miss  Horner.     Visit  to  Lady 

Carnegie  at  Cheltenham ;   Mr.   Rogers ;  advice 

as  to  a  course  of  reading   .         .         .         .         .142 

205.  To  J.  A.  Murray,  Esq.    Campaign  in  Germany ; 

death  of  Moreau 145 


Yiii  CONTENTS. 

Letter  20G.  To  John  Allen,  Esq.     "What  the  foreign  policy 

of  the  opposition  party  onght  at  present  to  be      .  146 
207.  To  Loud  AVEUii  Seymour.     Visits   at   Chelten- 
ham    and    at     Minto ;    and    to    Mr.     Dugald 

Stewart 147 

207.*  To  Thomas  Thomson,  Esq.  Article  by  Sir 
James  Mackintosh  in  the  Edinburgh  Review  on 
Madame  de  Stael's  Allcmagne    .         •         .         .149 

House  of  Commons.  Mr.  Horner  takes  a  more  active  part 
in  the  business  of  the  House ;  speaks  on  the 
Lace    Frame-breaking   Bill ;    on    an   Insolvent  , 

Debtors'  Bill ;  on  the  Poor-Law  Bill  .         .151  X«^ 

1814. 

Letter  208.  To  Lord  Grenville.  The  Speaker's  speech 
at  the  close  of  last  session  a  breach  of  privi- 
lege   156 

209.  To  J.  A.  Murray,  Esq.  New  volume  of  Mr. 
Dugald  Stewart's  Philosophy  of  the  Human 
Mind 158 

House  of  Commons.  Mr.  Horner  speaks  on  the  Corn  Laws, 
and  on  the  Slave  Trade;  reports  of  these 
speeches ;  lie  speaks  also   on  the  Irish  Peace-  ^ 

Preservation  BUI ;  and  on  the  Alien  Bill   .         .  159    -^ 

Letter  210.  To  his  Father.      Increase   in   his   professional 

business 163 

211.  To  J.  A.  Murray,  Esq.     Plan  of  a  tour  on  the 

Continent  .         .         .         .         •         •         .163 

212.  To  THE  SAME.     Plan  for  their  continental  tour      .  165 

213.  To  Mrs.  Dugald  Stewart.     Tells   her  of  his 

continental  tour,  and  asks  Mr.  Stewart  to  sug- 
gest to  some  persons  in  France  to  write  in  the 
cause  of  the  abolition  of  the  Slave  Trade  .  .166 
213.*  To  Mrs.  Dugald  Stewart.  Conduct  of  the 
Prince  Regent  to  his  daughter,  the  Princess 
Charlotte,  on  her  proposed  marriage  with  the 
Prince  of  Orange 168 

214.  To   HIS   Sister,    Miss    A.    Horner.      Account 

of  some  visits  in  Devonshire ;  to  Mr.  Jeremy 
Bentham  at  Ford  Abbey 172 


CONTENTS.  ix 

Letter  215.  To  ins  Mother.     From  Dieppe         .         .         .  17;3 
21G.  To  THE  SAME.     From  Rouen       .  .         .         .  17G 

217.  To  HIS  Sister,  Miss  Horner.     From  Ptiris      ,  177 

218.  To  the  same.     From  Geneva      ....  179 

219.  To  Mrs.  L.  Horner.     From  Brieg  in  tlic  Yal- 

lais 182 

220.  From   Lord    Holland,   enclosing    a   letter    to 

Lafayette 187 

221.  The  Letter  to  Lafayette        ....  188 

222.  To  HIS  Sister,  Miss  A.  Horner.     From  Milan  189 

223.  To    DuGALD    Stewart,  Esq.      Account  of  Lis 

visit  to  Paris  and  of  some  of  the  persons  he  had 
seen  ;  M.  Gallois  ;  M.  de  Gerando ;  M.  CamUle 
Jourdan ;  M.  Suard  ;  the  Abhe  Morellet ;  pros- 
pects of  France 19  G 

224.  To   J.  A.  Murray,  Esq.     Introduction  of  juries 

in  civil  actions  in  Scotland  ....  201 

House  of  Commons.     Mi\  Horner  takes  an  active  part  in  the 
debates. 

Outline  of  his  speech  on  the  Treaty  with  the  King 

of  Naples 203 

Outline   of  his   speech   on  the    Irish  Peace-Pre- 
servation Bill 208 

Outline   of   his    speech   on   the    conduct   of  the 
naval     war    against     the     United     States     of 

America 209 

Letter  225.  To  Sir  James  Mackintosh,  at  Paris.     Message 
to  Madame  de   Stael  about  a  letter  of  Burke  ; 
debates  in  the  House  of  Commons  on  the  pro- 
ceedings of  the  Congress  at  Vienna    .         .         .212 
225.*  To  J.  A.    Murray,   Esq.      On  the  American 

war  of  that  time  ......  213 

226.  From  the  same.     Account  of  a  communication 

he  has  had  witli  the  Duke  of  Wellington  at  Paris, 
on  the  subject  of  the  abolition  of  the  Slave  Trade 
by  France 215 

1815. 

227.  From   the   Hon.    Geo.   Ponsonby.      Proposes 

that  Mr.  Horner  should  briner  forward  a  motion 


X 


i 


X  CONTENTS. 

for  a  committee  of  inquiry  into  the  conduct  of 
the  American  war      .         .         .         .         .         .219 

Letter  228.  To  J.  A.  Mckkay,  Esq.  Jury  trial ;  tlie  Corn 
Laws,  and  opinion  of  Mr.  Mahhus  upon 
them 220 

229.  To  THE   Rev.  T.  R.  Malthus.      On  the   Corn 

Laws 222 

House  op  Commons.  Mr.  Horner  speaks  on  the  transfer  of 
Genoa  to  the  King  of  Sardinia ;  and  on  the  Com 

Laws 228 

Letter  229.*  From  Lord  Holland,  from  Naples.  Char- 
acter of  Murat,  King  of  Naples  .         .         .  231 

230.  To  HIS  Father.     His   speeches  on  Genoa,  and 

the  Corn  Laws  ......  237     ^ 

23L  Wm.  Murray,  Esq.,  to  Mr.  Horner's  Father. 

The  same  subject       ......  239 

House  of  Commons.  Mr.  Horner  speaks  on  the  Bank  Re- 
striction Act 240     / 

Letter  232.  To  Earl  Grey.  On  differences  of  opinion 
among  the  leaders  of  the  opposition  on  the  inva- 
sion of  France  by  the  allies  ....  243 
232.*  To  J.  A.  Murray,  Esq.  Expects  Mr.  Murray 
to  visit  London ;  gloomy  prospects  in  political 
affairs,  from  the  projects  of  Bonaparte,  on  his 
return  from  the  island  of  Elba    ....  244 

233.  To  HIS  Father.     The  same  subject ;  possibility 

of  these  differences  affecting  him  as  to  his  seat  in 
parhament         .......  249 

234.  To  THE  SAME.     The  same   subject ;  explanation 

with  Lord  Grenville 250 

235.  To    F.  Jeffrey,  Esq.     Mr.  Jeffrey's  villa ;    re- 

commendation   as    to    the    laying    out    of    his 
garden      ........  253 

236.  To  THE  ]Marquis  of  Buckingham.     Offers  to  ^ 

resign  his  seat  in  parliament       ....  254    A 

237.  From  the  same.     Reply  to  the  preceding  letter  .256     / 

238.  To  his  Father.     His  recent  correspondence  with 

the  Marquis  of  Buckingham  ....  257 
House  of  Commons.    Mr.  Horner  speaks  on  the  treaty  with 

the  King  of  Naples 258 

Letter  238.*  To  Mrs.  Dugald  Stewart.    Renewal  of  the 

war  against  France 259 


X 


CONTENTS.  ^j 

Letter  238.**  To  Mrs.  Dugald   Stewart.     Proceedings  in 
parliament  on  the  question  of  war  with  France  ; 
preparations  of  Bonaparte  .         .         .         .262 

238.t  To  Francis  Jeffrey,  Esq.     His  views  on  the 
question  of  war  with  France ;    Jury   Court   in 
Scotland    .         .         .         .         .         .         .         .204 

House  of   Commons.     Mr.  Horner  speaks  on  a  bill  for  the  reg- 
ulation of  the  labour  of  children  in  the  factories     2G6  /^ 
Letter  239.  To  F.  Jeffrey,  Esq.     On  the  question  of  war ; 
vindicates  himself  against  the  supposition  of  his 
being  an  admirer  of  Bonaparte  .         .         .         .267 

239.*  To  his  Mother.     From  the  Circuit ;  deaths  of 
friends  at  the  battle  of  Waterloo ;  the  Duke  of 
Cumberland  and  his  Mother       ....   270 

239.**  To  the  Hon.  Mrs.  W.  Spencer.     Death  of 

Mr.  Whitbread 271 

239.t  To  the  Duke  of  Somerset.     Character  of  Mr. 

Whitbread 272 

240.  To  Henry  Hall  am,  Esq.     Death  of  Mr.  Whit- 

bread ;  his  character  in  the  House  of  Commons ; 
invasion  of  France  by  the  allies  .         .         .273 

240.*  To  HIS  Mother.     Death  of  a  relation ;    sends 

assistance  to  the  widow      .....  277 

241.  From  the  same.     State  of  France      .        .         .  278 
241.*  From  his  Mother.     Answer  to  the  preceding 

letter 280 

242.  To  HIS  Mother.     Bonaparte  in  Torbay ;  letter 

from  Charles  Bell,  Esq 282 

243.  From  Charles  Bell,  Esq.,  Surgeon.     Account 

of  his  professional  visit  to  Brussels,  after  the 
battle  of  Wat<!rloo  ;  description  of  his  operations 
on  the  wounded  ......  283 

243.*  To  his  Mother.  Describes  a  visit  in  East 
Lothian ;  Fletcher  of  Saltoun ;  visit  to  Lord 
Grey  at  Howick  ;  anecdotes  of  Queen  Charlotte    285 

243.**  To  J.  A.  Murray,  Esq.     Character  of  Lord 

President  Forbes 288 

244.  To  HIS  Sister,   Miss   Horner.     The   poem  of 

Don  Roderick  ;  Mr.  Milman's  tragedy  of  Fazio  .  289 
244,*  To   Earl    Grey.     Admiration  of  the  political 

conduct  of  a  friend 290 


Xll 


CONTENTS. 


291 


292 


294 


Letter  244.**  Fro^i  Earl  Grey.    Answer  to  tlie  preceding 
letter 

245.  To  THE  SAME.     Has  met  with  Canova  in  London  ; 

expedition  to  the  Niger      .... 

246.  To  J.  A.   Murray,  Esq.    Is  anxious  to   see   a 

review  by  Mr.  Jeffrey  on  the  state  of  France; 
distress  at  finding  his  own  views  in  pohtics  so 
different  from  those  of  many  of  his  friends  . 

247.  To   Thomas   Thomson,   Esq.     On  the  state  of 

public  affairs,  and  dread  of  the  illusions  that  mili- 
tary success  may  give  rise  to ;  Collins's  OdQ  on 
the  Superstitions  in  the  Highlands ;  Travels  in 
France,  by  Mr.  Alison  ;  visit  to  Sir  James  Mack- 
intosh       ......•■ 

247.*  To  Lady  Holland.     Condemnation  of  one  who 
had  accepted  a  political  appointment  improperly 

248.  To  THE  same.     Early  history  of  Scotland;  public 

affairs ;  treaty  of  Paris       .... 
248.*  To  THE  Duchess  of   Somerset.      Conduct  of 
the  allies  in  Paris  against  the  French  people     . 

249.  To  DuGALD  Bannatyne,  Esq.      Itinerant  book 

sellers  in  the  country  around  Glasgow ;   recent 
proceedings  at  Paris  .... 

From  Lord  Grenville.  Mr.  Dugald  Stewart's 
Preliminary  Essay  in  the  Encyclopaedia  Britan- 
nica  ;  expulsion  of  Locke  from  Oxford 

From  the  same.     The  same  subject     . 

To  HIS  Sister,  Miss  A.  Horner.  Mr.  Stew- 
art's Preliminary  Essay     .... 

To  THE  Duke  of  Somerset.     The  same  subject  309 
*  To    Lord    Grenville.      Expulsion   of   Locke 
from  Oxford 310 


250. 


251. 
252. 

253. 
253. 


296 


299 


301 


303 


304 


306 

307 

308 


1816. 


313 


Letter  254.  To  his  Mother.     Account  of  a  visit  at  Woburn 
Abbey       ...•••• 

255.  To  J.  A.  Murray,  Esq.     Unsettled  state  of  the 

financial  affairs  of  the  country  ;  dangers  attend- 
ing the  investment  of  capital       .         .         .         .314 

256.  To  HIS  Sister,  Miss  A.  Horner.     Advises  her 


X 


CONTENTS.  Xiii 

to   read    parts  of  SU'wart's    Philosophy  of  the 

Human  Mind,  and  refers  to  them        .  .  .  ol7 

Letter  257.  To   the    Duchess    of    Somerset.     Prosjject  of 

divisions  in  the  opposition  i>arty  in  parliament  on 

th?  subject  of  France         .         .         .         .         .319 
House  of  Commons.     Mr.  Horner  takes  an  active  share  in  the 

business  of  the  House  this  Session. 
Outline  of   his  speech  on  an  Amendment  to  the 

Address     .         .         .         .         .         .         .         .321 

Outline    of  his    speech    on   the   Naval   Victories 

dui'ing  the  war  .         .         .         .         .         .  .  323 

Outline  of  his  speech  on  the  Peace  Establishment  325 
Brings  forward  a  Bill  to  correct  the  proceedings 

of  Grand  Juries  in  Ireland  ....  328 
History  of  this  measure,  in  a  letter  to  Mr.  Murray  32i) 
Note  by  Mr.  Sj^ring  Rice  in  1831  on  the  beneficial 

effects  of  the  measure         .         .         .         .         .  33G 
House  of  Commons.     Mr.  Horner's  speech  on  the  treaties  of 

Peace        ........  339 

Letter  258.  To  his  Mother.     On  his  speech  on  the  Treaties    340^ 

259.  From   James  Macdonald,  Esq.,  M.  P.      The 

same  subject      .......  341 

260.  From  John  Whishaw,  Esq.     The  same  subject  341 

261.  To    J.   A.    Murray,    Esq.       Aspect  of   pubHc 

affairs ;  dread  of  the  efiects  of  the  increase  of 
the  militai-y  establishments  of  the  country  .         .  342 

262.  To  Henry  Haulam,  Esq.     Captivity  of  Bona- 

parte in  St.  Helena    ......  344 

263.  From    the    same.      Defeat  of   ministers   on  the 

Property  Tax ;  detention  of  Bonaparte      .         .  345 

264.  From  Lord  Webb  Seymour.     Change  in  their 

several  views  on  political  affairs ;  objects  to  the 
line  Mr.  Horner  has  taken  in  his  opposition  to 
the  Government;  danger  of  the  judgment  l)eing 
warped  by  party  connexions  and  attachments      .   347 

House  of  Commons.  Mr.  Horner  speaks  on  the  Alien  Bill, 
and  brings  forward  a  motion  on  the  resumption 
of  Cash  Payments  by  the  Bank  of  England        .  354    /\ 

Letter  265.  To   his    Sister,   Miss  A.  Horner.     Describes 
a  visit  with  Mr.  Grattan  to  Mr.  Sharp's  farm  at 
Mickleham ;  Scott's  novel  of  the  Antiquary        .  355 
VOL.   II.  B 


xiv  CONTENTS. 

Lettek  2GG.  To    iiis    Father.      Commencement   of   his   last 

illness 356 

2G7.  To  the  same.     Proposes  to  visit  Edinburgh         .  357 

268.  Xo  Thomas   Thomson,  Esq.     On  the  death  of 

Mr.  George  Wilson    .         .         .  *"    .         .         .358 

269.  To  Lord  Webb  Seymour.    On  the  death  of  Mr. 

George  Wilson,  and  reply  to  his  Lordship's  letter. 
No.  264 359 

House  of  Commons.  Mr.  Horner's  last  appearance  in  Parlia- 
ment ;  outline  of  his  Speech  on  the  occasion  of 
Mr.  Canning's  declaring  a  speedy  settlement  of 
the  Catholic  claims  to  have  become  necessary     .  361 

Letter  270.  To  his  Mother.     Describes  a  visit  at  Woburn 

Abbey,  and  at  Stowe  .         .         .         .         .364 

27L  To  Lady  Holland.  From  his  father's  house 
near  Edinburgh ;  is  consulting  the  Edinburgh 
physicians  .         .         .         .         .         .         .367 

272.  To    W.   J.    Adam,    Esq.      The  physicians  have 

ordered  him  to  suspend  all  professional  engage- 
ments .         .         .         .         .         •         .         .         368 

273.  To  Lady'  Holland.     Proposes  to  live  in-doors 

all  winter  in  his  house  in  London        .         .         .368 

274.  From  Lord  Holland.     Account  of  Ugo  Fos- 

colo ;    restrictions    on    Bonapai'te ;    abolition   of 
sinecure  offices  .         .         .         .         .         .369 

275.  To  Lady  Holland.      His  physicians   at   Edin- 

burgh have  recommended  him  to  spend  the  win- 
ter in  the  South  of  Eurojje         ....  371 

276.  From  Lady  Holland.      Urges  Mr.  Horner  to 

spend  the  winter  in  Holland  House     .         .         .  372 

277.  From    Lord  Holland.      Makes   the   same   re- 

quest ;  Ugo  Foscolo ;  Kean's  acting  .         .         .373 

278.  To  Lady'  Holland.      Has  decided  upon  going 

abroad ;  choice  of  place     .....  374 

279.  From  Sir  Samuel  Romilly.      Sorrow  for  Mr. 

Horner's  state  of  health 377 

280.  To  his  Father.     Consultation  with  Drs.  Baillie 

and  Warren       .         .         .         .         .         .         .377 

281.  To  Henry  Hallam,  Esq.     Tells  him  he  is  going 

abroad ;  his  anxiety  about  the  state  of  the  coun- 
try ;  financial  difficulties 378 


CONTENTS.  XV 

Letter  282.  To  nis  Father.  Dr.  Baillie's  opinion  on  his 
case ;  preparing  for  his  journey ;  proposes  to  go 
to  Pisa 380 

283.  From  the  Rev.   Sydney   Smith.      His  friend's 

iUness 381 

284.  To  Mrs.  L.  Horner,  from  CaLais       .         .         .381 

285.  From  Lord  Holland  to  Mr.  Horner's  father    .  383 

286.  To  Lady  Holland,  from  Paris.     The  Hon.  J. 

W.  Ward ;  Mr.  Canning ;  the  uUra  royalists 
declaring  for  freedom  of  the  press      .         .         .  384 

287.  To  Mrs.  Dugald  Stewart,  from  Lyons;  state 

of  his  health ;  political  state  of  France       .         .  386 

288.  To  Lady  Holland,    from    Susa:    passage   over 

Mont  Cenis 389 

289.  To  Mrs.  Sydney  Smith,  from  Turin  .         .  390 

290.  To  Lady  Holland,  from  Turin ;  progress  of  his 

journey ;  has  heen  reading  Sismondi's  Italian 
Republics;  dearth  of  new  books  in  Turin  .         .  391 

291.  To    HIS    Mother,    from    Genoa;    describes   the 

journey  from  Turin  by  Asti  and  Alessandria ; 
state  of  his  health  ;  is  going  by  sea  to  Leghorn     394 

292.  To  Lady  Holland.     Arrival  at  Pisa;  is  plan- 

ning Avhat  he  shall  read  during  the  winter  .         .396 

293.  To  J.  A.  Murray,  Esq.     Reminiscences  of  their 

former  journey  through  the  same  country  he  had 
recently  crossed ;  state  of  his  health ;  climate  of 
Pisa;  is  studying  Dante  and  Machiavel      .         .  399 

594.  To  Lady  Holland.  M.  Dumont  has  been  in 
Italy ;  is  making  a  study  of  Dante ;  MachiaA'el's 
Legations,  his  Letters,  his  "  Prince ; "  Altieri's 
Life  ;  Sismondi's  History  .....  402 

205.  To  Mrs.  Dugald  Stewart.  Remarkable  let- 
ter of  Machiavel ;  his  "  Prince  "...  405 

296.  To  J.  A.  Murray,  Esq.     On  the  Law  of  Scot- 

land, as  it  affects  the  liberty  of  the  subject,  with 
regard  to  persons  accused  of  crimes  ;  reforms  in 
the  law  seldom  favoured  by  lawyers  .         .         .  407 

297.  To  Lord  Holland.     On  public  afiairs  in  Eng- 

land ;  chief  subjects  for  discussion  in  the  ap- 
proaching session  of  Parliament ;    the  military 


XVI 


CONTENTS. 

establishments  and  foi'eign  policy ;  abolition  of 
sinecures  ;  importance  of  guarding  vested  rights  ; 
parliamentary  reform  ;  finance  ;  reduction  of  the 
army  ........  412 

1817. 


X 


Letter  298.  To  his  Mother.      Climate  of  Pisa;    sufferings 

of  the  poor  in  Tuscany,  from  the  bad  harvest      .  417 

299.  From  Johx  Allex,  Esq.     Dr.   BailHe's  opinion 

of  Mr.  Horner's  case         .         .         .         .         .419 

300.  To  Lady  Holland.     Has  consulted  a  physician 

at  Pisa,  Dr.  Vacca ;  information  about  the  art  of 
Niello .420 

301.  From   Lord   Holland.      Preparations   for  the 

meeting  of  Parliament ;  abolition  of  sinecures ; 
parliamentary  rcfoi-m         .         ...         .         .  422 

302.  To    Earl   Grey.     Anxiety  about  the  measures, 

relative  to  finance  and  expenditure,  to  be  adopted  , 

in  the  ensuing  session  of  Parliament  .         .  424   X 

303.  To  Lady  Holland.     State  of  his  health ;  some 

symptoms  of  improvement ;  is  reading  Father 
Paul's  Council  of  Trent ;  death  of  Lord  Guild- 
ford at  Pisa 426 

304.  To  the  same.     Favourable  weather,  and  improve- 

ment of  his  health ;  Father  Paul's  Council  of 
Trent 428 

305.  To   HIS  Father.     Encouraging  symptoms  as  to 

the  improvement  of  his  health  ;  is  enjoying  the 
genial  spring  weather ;  and  is  interested  in  the 
field  labours  of  the  peasantry  ....  429 
Mr.  Horner's  last  Illness  and  Death.  Sudden  attack, 
and  alanaing  symptoms  ;  his  own  unconscious- 
ness of  danger  .         .         .         .         .         .432 

tributes    to    the    memory   of   MR.    HORNER. 

By  Mk.  Allen,  in  an  announcement  of  Mr.  Horner's   death  in 

the  Morning  Chronicle  newspapci'    .....  439 
By  Mu.  Allen,  in  a  letter  to  Mr.  Horner's  father     .         .         .  440   .   ' 


CONTENTS. 


XVll 


By  Mr.  Wiiisiiaw  . 

By  the  House  of  Commons 

By  Mr.  Jei-^frey 

By  Mr.  Dugald  Stewart 

By  Sir  James  Mackintosh 

By  the  Rev.  John  Hewlett 

By  the  Rev.  Dr.  Parr 

By  the  Rev.  Sydney  Smith  . 

By  Earl  Dudley    . 

By  the  Speculative  Society  at  Edinburgh 

Monument  in  Westminster  Abbey 

M0NU3IENT    in    THE    CeMETERY   AT    LEGHORN    . 


443 
443 
4.55 

457 
459 
4G0 
4G2 
4G3 
408 
469 
469 
470 


APPENDIX. 

D.  Notes  by   Mr.  Horner  on    Dante,  with    remarks  on 

THEM  BY  Herman  Merivale,  Esq.      ....  475 

E.  "Designs" 479 

F.  Post-mortem  Examination 486 

G.  Subscribers  to  the  Monument  in  Westminster  Abbey  489 

selection  from  MR.  horner's  speeches  in  parliament. 


I.  On  the  Regenfcy  Question,  December,  1810        .         .         .  493 

II.  On  the  Corn  Laws,  May,  1814 508 

IIL  On  the  Shxve  Trade,  Jnne,  1814* 512 

IV.  On  the  Ti-ansfer  of  Genoa  to  Sardmia,  February,  1815       .  519 

V.  On  the  Corn  LIiavs,  February,  1815 523 

VI.  On  the  Introduction  of  Juries  in  Civil  Actions  in  Scotland, 

March,  1815 534 

VIL  On  the  Treaties  of  Peace,  February,  1816         .         .         .540 
VIII.  On  the  Alien  Act,  April  and  May,  1816]    .         .         .  .555 

IX.  On    the    Resum})tion  of  Cash  Payments    by  the  Bank    of 

England,  May,  1816 563 


MEMOIRS    AND    CORRESPONDENCE 


MEMOIRS  AND  CORRESPONDENCE 


FRANCIS    HOKNEH,  M.P. 


Parliament  met  on  the  23d  of  January,  and  on  the  1st 
of  February  Mr.  Horner  took  the  initiatory  step  in  the 
inquiry  into  the  alleged  depreciation  of  Bank  notes, 
which  he  afterwards  so  ably  conducted.  It  was  this 
measure  which  first  brought  him  into  general  notice  as 
a  member  of  the  House  of  Commons,  more  especially 
in  the  following  year,  when  the  publication  of  the  Re- 
port of  the  Bullion  Committee,  the  debates  in  both 
Houses  of  Parliament,  which  arose  out  of  that  Report, 
and  the  measures  that  were  adopted  relative  to  the  cur- 
rency, excited  the  public  attention  to  a  high  pitch.  On 
this  occasion,  he  moved  for  a  variety  of  accounts  and 
returns  respecting  the  existing  state  of  the  circulating 
medium  and  the  bullion  trade.     He  said,  — 

"  That  it  was  his  decided  opinion,  that  it  was  neces- 
sary for  the  House  to  make  an  inquiry  into  the  causes 
of  the  present  high  price  of  bullion,  and  the  consequent 
effect  upon  the  value  of  the  paper  currency,  not  only 
on  account  of  the  real  importance  of  the  subject,  but  in 
consequence  of  the  great  misconceptions  which  too  gen- 
erally prevailed  respecting  the  causes  of  the  actual  situa- 
tion of  the  country,  with  reference  to  this  subject;  that 

VOL.   11.  1 


2  HOUSE  OF  COABIONS.  [1810. 

the  most  effectual  mode  of  investigating  this  highly  in- 
teresting question  would  be  by  a  select  committee,  and 
that  it  was  therefore  his  intention,  on  an  early  day,  to 
move  for  such  a  committee  :  but  that  it  would  be  not 
only  convenient,  but  indispensable,  in  the  first  instance, 
to  obtain  all  such  information,  on  the  whole  of  the  sub- 
ject, as  papers  might  afford;  which  information  could 
afterwards  be  referred  to  the  committee." — After  some 
farther  general  observations,  he  concluded  by  moving 
for  eight  different  returns  respecting  bullion  and  the 
issue  of  Bank  notes. 

The  committee  was  nominated  on  the  19th  of  Febru- 
ary, without  any  preliminary  remarks  by  Mr.  Horner. 
It  was  directed,  "  to  inquire  into  the  cause  of  the  high 
price  of  gold  bullion,  and  to  take  into  consideration  the 
state  of  the  circulating  medium,  and  of  the  exchanges 
between  Great  Britain  and  foreign  parts."  It  consisted 
of  twenty-one  members/==  and  met  on  the  22d,  when  Mr. 
Horner  was  chosen  as  chairman.  It  continued  its  sittings 
till  the  25  th  of  May,  having  sat  thirty-one  days,  and  ex- 
amined twenty-nine  witnesses.  Mr.  Horner  was  in  the 
chair  at  twenty-one  of  the  meetings  :  between  the  19th 
of  March  and  the  16th  of  April  he  was  absent  on  the 
circuit,  when  the  chair  was  generally  taken  by  Mr.  Hus- 
kisson. 

On  the  8th  of  June,  Mr.  Horner  presented  the  Report 
of  the  Committee  to  the  House. 


*  Among  the  members  of  the  committee  were  the  following :  —  The  Right 
Hon.  Spent-er  Pcrcival,  Chancellor  of  the  Exchequer;  the  Right  Hon.  George 
Tierney ;  the  Hon.  James  Abercromby  (the  present  Lord  Dunfermline) ; 
Henry'  Parnell,  Esq.  (the  late  Lord  Congleton)  ;  Alexander  Baring,  Esq. 
(the  present  Lord  Ashburton)  ;  "William  Huskisson,  Esq. ;  and  Henry  Thorn- 
ton, Esri-,  Bank  Director,  and  author  of  the  work  on  the  Paper  Credit  of 
Great  Britain,  reviewed  in  the  Edinburgh  Review  by  Mr.  Horner,  in  October, 
1802.  — Ed. 


iEx.  32.]  CORRESPONDENCE. 


Lettkii  CL.      from  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 
My  dear  Horner,  ICdinburgh,  Sth  February,  1810. 

I  was  much  gratified  with  your  note  of  the  30th. 
I  had  before  heard  various  reports  that  you  were  to 
form  a  part  of  a  new  administration.  You  were  some- 
times designed  Secretary  for  Ireland,  and  various  other 
pohtical  situations  were  assigned  to  you.  The  same 
morning  that  your  letter  arrived,  I  had  some  conversa- 
tion on  the  subject  before  I  received  it,  and  I  expressed 
my  belief  very  confidently  that  you  would  not  accept 
any  political  situation.  If  I  had  received  your  letter  at 
the  time,  I  might  perhaps  have  been  a  little  more  re- 
served in  expressing  my  opinion  than  I  was,  when  I  did 
not  even  know  that  it  had  been  offered,  and  felt  no 
restraint  from  that  circumstance,  and  your  kind  and 
friendly  confidence.  You  have  decided  most  wisely  for 
your  own  happiness,  and  I  think  well  in  every  other 
respect.  I  believe  there  is  no  department  in  which  your 
attainments  and  views  can  be  of  so  much  use  as  in  that 
which  you  have  traced  out  for  yourself  If  you  remain 
out  of  office,  your  weight  and  influence  upon  general 
questions  will  increase  every  year.  You  will  have  the 
choice  of  those  in  which  your  interference  may  be  of  use ; 
and  in  the  great  department  of  the  legislation  connected 
with  English  law,  the  circumstance  that  3'ou  belong  to 
the  profession  will  give  you  more  authority  and  influ- 
ence, than  you  would  have  were  you  to  leave  it.  Who 
is  there  to  second  Eomilly,  and  to  succeed  to  his  views 
and  principles  in  the  profession  ?  In  all  great  and  essen- 
tial points  you  agree,  and  the  tone  of  your  opinions  is 
more  English,  which  may  enable  you  to  make  improve- 
ments palatable,  which  he  has  failed  in  accomplishing. 


4  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1810. 

Much  is  also  to  be  clone  in  opposing  bad  laws,  and  there 
the  circumstance  of  being  a  lawyer  is  of  great  im- 
portance. I  consider  a  new  ministry  as  now  out  of  the 
question. 

Ever  yours  truly, 

J.  A.  Murray. 


Lkttkr  CLI.     to  sir  SAMUEL  ROMILLY. 
My  dear  Sir  Lincoln's  Inn,  10th  Februai'y,  1810. 

It  appears  to  me  to  be  very  important  that  you 
should  publish  your  speech  of  last  night,  if  you  can  pos- 
sibly find  leisure  for  it  while  it  is  still  fresh  in  your 
mind.'-=  The  irresistible  argument  for  your  particular 
bills,  which  is  founded  upon  the  returns,  will  not  be  seen 
in  all  its  force,  unless  the  numbers  are  all  set  down ;  and 
then  I  am  quite  persuaded,  that,  upon  the  subject  of  a 
reform  of  the  criminal  law,  the  public  is  quite  ready  for 
instruction,  if  delivered  to  them  with  the  authorit}^  of 
your  name,  and  with  the  attractions  which  your  topics 
of  reasoning  and  illustration  cast  over  the  argument. 
It  is  because  you  cannot  know  this  so  well  as  others, 
that  I  take  the  liberty  of  suggesting  to  you  to  make 
this  exertion,  always  an  irksome  one,  but  which  will  be 
greatly  and  immediately  useful.  It  will  tend  very  much 
to  make  3-our  future  progress,  in  the  same  subject,  more 

*  "  Fch.  OtJi.  —  I  moved  for,  and  obtained  leave,  to  bring  into  the  House  of 
Commons  three  bills  to  repeal  the  acts  of  10  &  11  AVill.  IIL  c.  23.,  12  Anne, 
St.  1.  c.  7.,  and  2-1  Geo.  II.,  -which  punish  with  death  the  crimes  of  stealing 
privately  in  a  shop  goods  of  the  value  of  five  shillings,  and  of  stealing  to  the 
amount  of  forty  shillings  in  dwelling-houses,  or  on  board  vessels  in  navigable 
rivers.  The  Solicitor-General,  with  his  usual  panegyrics  on  the  wisdom  of 
past  ages,  and  declamations  on  the  danger  of  interfering  with  what  is  already 
established,  announced  his  intention  of  opposing  the  bills  after  they  should  be 
brought  in." 

",i/flrr7(  12///.  —  I  published  the  substance  of  my  speech  of  the  9th  of  Febru- 
ary, in  the  form  of  a  pamphlet." 

Memoirs  of  Sir  Samuel  Iiomill>/,  (1st  edit.)  vol.  ii.  p.  303. 


2Et.  32.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  5 

easy.  Nothing  seems  to  me  so  certain  now,  as  that  par- 
liament in  all  these  matters  of  legislative  improvement 
follows  only  the  public  opinion ;  and  that  to  overcome 
in  the  House  of  Commons  the  resistance  of  which  Plomer 
is  so  worthy  a  leader,  you  must  bring  the  weight  of  pub- 
lic opinion  to  bear  upon  the  House,  by  enlightening  it 
through  the  press.  On  the  subject  of  the  criminal  law, 
the  prejudices  are  all  among  the  lawyers ;  the  public  in 
general  seem  to  have  none,  and  at  the  same  time  take  a 
lively  interest  always  in  such  discussions. 
Ever,  my  dear  Sir, 

Sincerely  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 

Letter  CLII.    TO  LORD  GRENVILLE. 
JVIy  Lord  Lincoln's  Inn,  11th  February,  1810. 

The  unsatisfactory  returns  which  are  made  to 
the  orders  which  I  moved  for  in  the  House  of  Commons 
upon  the  subject  of  Bullion  and  Currency,  and  the 
ready  desire  which  was  expressed  on  both  sides  of  the 
House  to  see  that  subject  fully  examined,  induce  me  to 
propose  in  a  few  days  the  appointment  of  a  select  com- 
mittee. But  before  going  so  far  in  a  matter  of  such 
public  importance,  I  feel  an  anxious  wish  to  have  the 
sanction  and  benefit  of  your  Lordship's  advice  as  to  the 
proper  objects,  as  well  as  the  best  course  of  investiga- 
tion ;  in  order  that  it  may  be  conducted  to  an  useful  re- 
sult. Hitherto,  I  have  abstained  from  forming  any  con- 
clusion, even  in  my  own  mind,  respecting  the  causes  of 
the  present  state  of  money  prices ;  nor  am  I  sure  that  I 
have  yet  gained  a  clear  and  exact  notion  of  that  change, 
whethep  depreciation  or  not,  of  which  the  cause  remains 
to  be  ascertained.     In  this  suspense  of  opinion,  I  have 

1* 


g  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1810. 

been  desirous,  before  I  enter  into  the  inquiry,  to  collect 
the  various  solutions  which  the  difficulty  may  seem  to 
admit  of  at  present,  while  our  information  is  incomplete, 
in  order  that  the  search  for  farther  information  may  be 
so  directed  as  to  bring  each  of  those  explanations  to  the 
test.  I  fear  that  I  ask  too  much  of  your  Lordship, 
whose  time  is  so  filled  up,  in  requesting  that  you  would 
have  the  goodness  to  instruct  me  in  the  views,  which 
your  Lordship  entertains  upon  this  important  question ; 
but  I  am  prompted  to  make  that  request,  by  my  anx- 
iety to  get  into  the  right  track  through  so  intricate  a 
subject,  and  by  my  conviction  that  injury  of  no  slight 
degree  may  be  done  to  the  public  interest  by  taking  a 
false  step,  and  even  by  the  publication  of  erroneous 
opinions. 

I  have  the  honour  to  be,  my  Lord, 

Your  Lordship's  faithful,  obedient  servant, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter   CLHI.    FROM  LORD   GRENVILLE. 
Dear  Sir  Cjimelford  House,  12th  February,  1810. 

I  saw  with  the  most  lively  satisfaction  that  you 
had  announced  an  intention  of  taking  up  a  subject  of 
so  much  difficulty  and  importance  as  that  of  the  present 
state  of  the  currency  of  the  kingdom,  and  of  the  trade 
in  bullion.  It  would  give  me  great  pleasure  to  have  an 
opportunity  of  conversing  with  you  on  the  subject  at 
whatever  time  would  best  suit  your  own  convenience. 
I  am  generally  at  home  from  twelve  to  two,  but  I  could 
with  equal  convenience  fix  any  other  hour  that  might 
suit  you  better,  and  be  less  liable  to  interruption. 

The  difficulty  of  arriving  at  any  precise  opinion  as  to 
the  causes  of  the  existing  evil  arises  in  great  degree 
from  the  concurrent  operation  of  so  many  circumstances 


2Er.  32.]  COKRESPONDENCE.  y 

wholly  unprecedented.  Nothing  but  a  well  conducted 
inquiry  ascertaining  as  distinctly  as  may  be  the  real 
effect  (as  it  is  now  practically  experienced)  of  each  of 
these  circumstances,  separately  or  combined  with  the 
others,  can  give  one  full  satisfliction  as  to  the  appli- 
cation of  those  theories,  which  one's  general  notions  of 
tl  e  subject  would  lead  one  to  form  upon  it.  But  on  a 
general  view,  I  am  inclined  to  attribute  the  effect  com- 
plained of,  in  a  very  great  degree,  to  the  stoppage  of 
money  payments  at  the  Bank  —  a  measure  originally 
adopted  to  meet  a  sudden  and  very  urgent  pressure,  but, 
I  think,  very  ill  calculated  for  any  long  continuance. 
While  the  necessity  of  money  payments  then  continued, 
every  increased  demand  for  bullion,  which  either  the 
ordinary  fluctuations  of  trade,  or  the  extraordinary  cir- 
cumstances of  these  times,  occasioned,  was  immediately 
felt  there,  and  was  met  (or  ought  to  have  been  so)  by 
adequate  measures  to  diminish  the  circulation  of  paper, 
and  by  a  corresponding  issue  and  importation  of  bullion, 
by  a  body  possessed  at  all  times  of  a  considerable  store 
of  that  article,  and  having  both  capital  and  commercial 
means  for  rapid  purchases  and  importations. 

I  am  far  from  thinking  that  the  question  admits  of  so 
simple  a  solution  as  to  be  answered  merely  by  a  refer- 
ence to  this  single  principle  —  but  I  am  inclined  to 
believe  that  its  operation  will  more  or  less  be  traced 
through  all  the  complicated  details  in  which  the  subject 
is  involved  ;  and  I  entertain  sanguine  hopes  that,  under 
your  conduct,  the  inquiry  will  lead  to  an  issue  satis- 
factory both  in  the  elucidation  of  this  branch  of  politi- 
cal science,  and  in  the  practical  measures  to  which  it 
may  lead. 

Believe  me  ever,  my  dear  Sir, 

Most  truly  and  faithfully  yours, 

Grenville. 


WALCHEREN   QUESTION.  [1810. 


Note  hjj  Mr.  Horner^  dated  the  Zd  of  April,  1810. 

"In  the  late  vote  on  the  Walcheren  question f,  there 
were  many  members,  I  doubt  not,  who  voted  with  minis- 
ters, though  they  condemned  the  whole  of  their  conduct 
in  that  fatal  expedition,  from  a  sincere  conviction  of  the 
superior  fitness  and  excellence  of  the  present  set  of 
ministers,  for  holding  the  government,  in  the  present 
circumstances,  above  any  other  set  of  public  men. 

"  The  vote  of  such  men  may  have  been  given,  in 
consequence  of  their  perceiving,  that  if  the  House 
condemned  that  expedition  by  a  vote  of  the  majority, 
the  King  would  be  compelled  to  change  his  ministers. 
I  have  no  doubt  that  a  sufficient  number  of  men  were 
influenced  by  this  manner  of  considering  the  thing,  to 
give  the  ministers  the  majority  they  had,  when  added 
to  their  crowd  of  corrupt,  devoted,  or  unthinking  parti- 
sans. Perhaps,  this  is  far  from  being  the  only  instance 
that  might  be  mentioned,  in  which  well-meaning  and 
disinterested  members  of  parliament  have  been  deterred 
from  voting  in  condemnation  of  a  particular  measure  of 
government,  lest  the  effect  of  that  vote  should  go 
farther  than  they  wished,  and  lead  to  an  entire  change 
in  the  administration, 

"  In  this  manner,  it  would  appear,  that  the  weight  and 
importance  which  belongs  to  a  vote  of  the  House,  upon 

*  After  lie  had  ceased  to  keep  a  journal,  Mr.  Horner  appears  to  Lave  been 
in  the  habit  of  making  notes  on  separate  slips  of  paper,  to  which  he  affixed  a 
date,  usually  under  some  general  title,  such  as,  "  Pohtical  Anecdotes,"  "  Politi- 
cal Philosophy,"  "  Temper  of  the  public  Mind,"  &c.  —  Ed. 

t  On  the  30th  of  March,  Lord  Porchoster  moved  a  series  of  resolutions  con- 
demnin<T  the  conduct  of  ministers  in  the  late  expedition  to  the  Scheldt.  The 
last  of  the  resolutions  concluded  with  these  words :  —  "  And  that  the  advisers 
of  this  ill-judged  enterprise  are,  in  the  opinion  of  this  House,  deeply  respon- 
sible for  the  heavy  calamities  with  which  its  failure  lias  been  attended."  On 
the  division,  27.5  voted  for  ministers,  and  227  for  the  resolutions;  giving 
ministers  a  majority  of  48. —  Ed. 


.T:t.  32.]  WALCHEREN  QUESTION.  9 

what  is  called  a  ministerial  question,  is  itself  a  cause  of 
tlie  House  departing,  in  particular  instances,  from  its 
professed  and  proper  line  of  duty.  And  thus  the  power 
which  the  House  has  over  the  crown,  does,  in  a  certain 
respect,  make  it  likely  to  fall  into  disrepute  with  the 
people.  The  regular  division  of  political  reasoners  and 
public  men  into  two  distinct  parties,  in  this  country,  has 
probably  led  to  this  state  of  things  in  the  House  of 
Commons. 

"  Whether  such  a  state  of  things  be  more  or  less  ex- 
pedient, than  that  other,  more  agreeable  at  least  to  the 
theory  of  the  constitution,  in  which  the  parliament 
should  exercise  its  controlling  and  inquisitorial  func- 
tions, by  adhering,  as  nearly  as  human  nature  will  per- 
mit, to  the  exercise  of  a  sort  of  judicial  opinion  upon 
the  merits  of  each  particular  measure  of  government,  is 
a  speculative  question  of  some  curiosity  and  difficulty. 
That  it  is  not  wholly  a  speculative  question,  however, 
may  be  seen  from  this,  that  a  certain  number  of  mem- 
bers in  the  House  of  Commons  at  present  profess  to  act 
independently  of  party ;  and  one  or  two  of  those  who 
profess  it,  do  in  fact  keep  themselves  independent.  A 
considerable  difference  has  taken  place  in  the  circum- 
stances, by  which  this  question  of  expediency  is  to  be 
solved,  since  the  increase  of  reading,  and  of  the  daily 
press,  has  brought  almost  every  question  of  government 
and  parliament  to  the  bar  of  the  people  ;  who  will  of 
course  pronounce  upon  each  question  separately,  with- 
out looking  to  the  distant  operation  of  a  more  complex 
system  of  conduct,  and  may  therefore  come  (as  they 
have  done)  to  look  upon  parties  in  parliament  as  a  jug- 
gle, and  parliament  itself  as  uninfluenced  in  its  decisions 
by  any  regard  to  the  real  merits  of  the  questions  which 
are  discussed  there,  or  to  the  interests  of  the  public." 


10  HOUSE   OF  CO^IMONS.  [1810. 

On  the  26th  of  March,  Sir  Francis  Burdett  was  com- 
mitted by  the  House  of  Commons  to  the  Tower  for  the 
publication,  in  Cobbett's  Journal,  of  "  a  libellous  and 
scandalous  paper,  reflecting  upon  the  just  rights  and 
privileges  of  this  House."  Sir  Francis  brought  an  action 
at  law  against  the  Speaker  for  issuing  the  warrant  for 
his  arrest  and  imprisonment,  and  another  against  the 
Sergeant-at-arms  generally,  for  executing  the  warrant. 

On  this  subject  there  is  the  following  note  by  Mr. 
Horner,  dated  the  6th  of  May :  — 

"  The  proceedings  at  law  on  the  part  of  Sir  Francis 
Burdett  against  the  Speaker  of  the  House  of  Commons 
raise  this  question,  —  whether  the  House  ought  to  suffer 
its  Speaker  to  appear  in  the  court  below  and  plead,  or 
to  deny  that  its  privileges  shall  in  any  manner  be 
examined  and  judged  of  in  any  court  of  law ;  and  so  to 
exercise  its  power  of  commitment,  for  breach  of  privi- 
lege, against  every  person  who  takes  any  step  in  those 
proceedings,  as  by  intimidation  to  put  an  end  to  them." 

"  It  is  a  subsequent  question,  whether  the  Speaker 
shall  plead  to  the  jurisdiction,  or  shall  plead  the  orders  of 
the  House  in  lar  of  the  action ;  which  does  not  arise, 
until  after  the  Speaker  has  entered  an  appearance. 
The  prior  question  is,  whether  he  shall  appear  and 
plead." 

Letter   CLIIT*    TO   DUGALD   STEWART,   ESQ. 
My  dear  Sir,  Lincoln's  Ina,  8th  May,  1810. 

I  have  heard  this  morning  with  the  highest  satis- 
faction and  pleasure,  that  3^ou  have  accomplished  your 
wish  of  having  Brown '='  nominated  to  be  your  successor. 
On  every  public  as  well  as  private  account,  this  event 

*  Dr.  Thomas  Brown. 


iET.  32.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  n 

gives  me  the  most  sincere  gratification.  It  does  the  cor- 
poration of  Edinburgh  much  credit,  and  ahiiost  inspires 
a  hope  that  the  University,  and  all  the  important  interests 
which  hang  upon  it,  may  be  rescued  from  the  ruin 
which  so  lately  appeared  certain.  The  appointment 
must  be  felt  as  a  vital  wound  by  that  base  church  party, 
who  under  the  conduct  of  the  Dundas  junto,  have  hith- 
erto kept  up  so  successful  a  contest  against  every  person 
suspected  of  a  free  spirit,  or  of  liberal  opinions;  and  who 
must  have  looked  upon  the  acquisition  of  the  chair  of 
Moral  Philosophy  as  their  final  triumph.  I  would  write 
to  you  more  frequently  about  our  little  politics,  if  I  had 
any  thing  cheering  to  tell  you.  But  I  despond  so  disa- 
greeably in  my  own  views  that  I  feel  no  disposition  to 
communicate  my  impressions.  The  absurdity  and  wick- 
edness of  the  leaders  of  the  democratic  party  in  Middle- 
sex have  very  recently  brought  matters  to  a  worse 
pass  than  ever ;  in  the  result  of  which  one  cannot  fore- 
see any  thing  as  very  probable,  but  a  new  accession  of 
strength  to  the  crown,  and  the  disappearance  of  all 
moderate  notions  of  liberty,  in  a  distracted  but  not 
doubtful  struggle,  between  popular  frenzy  and  military 
force.  A  faint  effort  you  will  observe  in  the  proceedings 
of  the  House  of  Lords  last  night,  is  about  to  be  made 
by  the  leaders  of  the  Whig  party,  to  regain  the  confi- 
dence of  the  public,  by  an  explicit  declaration  of  their 
views ;  but  I  fear  they  are  hardly  prepared  to  go  as  far, 
as  in  the  present  circumstances  they  ought,  and  it  is 
perhaps  too  late  to  recover,  except  by  a  ver}^  decisive 
tone,  and  by  a  very  plain  line  of  conduct,  the  effects  of 
their  blameable  reserve  and  hesitation  upon  those  ques- 
tions of  economy  and  reform  which  so  much  agitate  the 
people.  Never  were  men  treated  with  so  much  injustice 
by  the  public  as  they  have  been,  w^ith  respect  to  their 


22  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1810. 

administration  ;  but  their  resentment  of  this  injustice, 
at  variance  always  with  the  real  hberality  of  their  inten- 
tions and  principles,  has  made  them  most  indecisive  and 
inefficient  as  leaders  of  the  opposition.  The  dangers  of 
the  times  have  at  length  awakened  them  to  the  necessity 
of  taking  a  more  marked  and  intelligible  course ;  and 
this  is  rendered  more  easy  indeed,  by  the  plainness  with 
wdiich  that  small  but  noisy  party  of  which  Cobbett  is 
the  organ,  have  avow^ed  their  designs.  But  it  is  setting 
out  with  great  disadvantages  if,  in  collecting  a  popular 
party,  you  must  exclude  those  w^ho,  in  appearance  only, 
carry  popular  feelings  to  excess ;  and  I  must  confess  to 
you,  that  w^e  have  a  still  greater  disadvantage  against 
us  in  this,  that  though  our  leaders  in  the  House  of 
Lords  entertain  very  enlightened  and  even  popular 
principles,  they  have  very  little  of  popular  feelings.  In 
the  House  of  Commons  too,  where  the  main  fight  should 
be  carried  on,  we  have  no  leader  at  all.  You  w^ill  not 
wonder  that,  taking  such  a  view  of  our  situation,  I 
should  despair.  With  kindest  regards  to  Mrs.  Stewart, 
I  am  ever,  dear  Sir, 

Most  sincerely  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter   CLIY.    TO  LORD  HOLLAND. 
Dear  Lord  Holland,  Lincoln's  inn,  9th  May,  1809. 

I  wish  to  take  a  copy  of  the  papers  you  have 
sent  me,  for  my  own  use  in  future  j  and  then  I  will  re- 
turn them  to  you.  I  am  to  dine  at  Calcraft's  on  Satur- 
day, and  may  be  kept  too  late  for  the  play,  where  I  will 
come  to  see  you  if  I  can.  But  it  will  not  be  in  my 
power  to  go  to  Holland  House,  for  I  mean  to  be  seriously 
busy  for  some  mornings  to  come,  in  order  to  ease  my 


iEx.  32.]  HOUSE  OF   COMMONS.  I3 

conscience  of  many  a  heavy  load,  and  my  table  of  some 
papers  that  stare  me  daily  in  the  face,  to  my  great  dis- 
quiet. 

I  am  ashamed  to  say  that  I  am  in  a  sea  of  difficulties 
and  doubts  about  privilege ;  and  what  keeps  me  so 
long  in  uncertainty  is,  the  confidence  with  which  I  hear 
both  the  opposite  opinions  maintained.  I  am  much 
shaken  by  Pigot's  speech ;  and  though  I  see  Lord  Ers- 
kine's  is  as  much  relied  on  by  the  other  side,  it  was  so 
wild  and  foolish  as  to  give  me  a  still  greater  bias.  Then 
there  are  Eomilly  and  Wilson  the  other  way,  and  the 
latter  especially  has  great  weight  with  me,  so  much  am 
I  the  slave  of  authority  on  such  occasions ;  but  in  such 
an  emergency,  when  my  oracles  give  discordant  re- 
sponses, I  mean  to  try  if  I  can  form  an  opinion  for 
myself,  provided  I  can  get  leisure. 

I  wish  you  had  heard  Lord  Grey's  short  speech,  as  the 
best  specimen  of  his  manner. 

Most  faithfully  yours. 

Era.  Horner. 


On  the  18th  of  May,  Mr.  Davies  Giddy  brought  up  a 
second  report  from  the  committee  appointed  to  consider 
the  notices  of  action  sent  by  Sir  Francis  Burdett.  On 
the  motion  that  it  be  laid  on  the  table,  and  printed,  Mr. 
Horner  said,  — 

"  He  was  surprised  that  the  committee  should  have 
thought  it  necessary  to  go  into  such  details,  with  respect 
to  a  right,  which  the  House  undoubtedly  had  exercised 
from  time  immemorial.  He  did  not  think  the  commit- 
tee were  entitled  to  go  into  an  argumentative  detail 
upon  the  subject ;  and  if  such  a  report  should  be  re- 
ceived without  any  notice  being  taken  of  it,  the  foun- 

VOL.  II.  2 


14  HOUSE   OF    COMMONS.  [1810. 

dation  of  the  privilege  might  be  brought  into  doubt, 
where,  otherwise,  there  could  have  been  no  reasonable 
ground  whatever  of  doubt  on  the  subject.  He  believed 
this  was  the  first  time  that  a  committee  appointed  for  an 
inquiry  into  the  privileges  of  the  House  had  resorted  to 
the  authority  of  the  courts  of  law  and  of  judges.  He 
believed  it  had  been  the  constant  maxim  of  the  most 
enlightened  men  who  lived  in  times  when  the  principles 
of  liberty  were  at  least  as  well  understood  and  acted 
upon  as  now  ;  —  men  who  had  defended  the  liberties  of 
the  people  through  the  privileges  of  that  House,  —  that 
their  privileges  were  not  to  be  judged  of  by  analogy  to 
common-law  proceedings,  nor  to  be  founded  upon  the 
authority  of  judges.  But,  not  content  with  adverting 
to  common-law  proceedings,  and  the  authority  of  judges, 
the  committee  had  gone  into  a  detailed  reasoning  upon 
the  general  expediency  of  this  privilege.  This  did  ap- 
pear to  him  to  be  going  beyond  their  authority :  the}^ 
should  have  looked  at  the  Journals,  and  stated  simply 
in  their  report  what  was  to  be  found  there  as  to  the  pri- 
vileges of  the  House  ;  they  ought  not,  in  his  opinion,  to 
have  entered  upon  general  discussion  as  to  the  question 
of  utility.  They  would  not,  he  believed,  be  borne  out 
in  the  course  they  had  taken  by  the  practice  of  the  best 
times.  Then  they  said  that  the  existence  of  the  privi- 
lege had  been  assented  to  in  a  conference  with  the 
House  of  Lords :  this  did  appear  to  him  an  improper 
mode  of  supporting  the  privileges  of  the  House  of  Com- 
mons. Their  dissent  could  not  have  weakened  the  real 
foundation  of  these  privileges." 

The  subject  was  resumed  on  the  23d  of  May ;  and, 
after  several  members  had  spoken,  Mr.  Horner  rose  to 
move  the  recommittal  of  the  Report,  with  a  view  after- 
wards to  move  resolutions  declaratory  of  the  existence 


.Ex.  32.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  15 

of  tlio  privilege  to  the  utmost  extent  to  which  it  had 
been  claimed.     He  said,  — 

"The  more  he  considered  the  objections  which  he  had 
on  a  former  occasion  stated  to  the  Report  the  stronger 
they  appeared  to  his  mind.  He  objected  to  the  refer- 
ence to  the  authority  of  courts  of  law,  and  to  the  ad- 
mission of  the  existence  of  the  privilege  on  the  part  of 
the  House  of  Peers.  He  objected  to  the  argument 
founded  upon  the  analogous  proceedings  of  courts  of 
law^  The  authority  of  the  common-law  courts  to  pro- 
ceed by  summary  attachment  was  founded  on  immemo- 
rial usage ;  that  of  parliament  could  not  rest  on  any 
such  foundation.  He  thought  these  matters  extraneous, 
and  calculated  only  to  throw  a  doubt  upon  the  existence 
of  the  privilege ;  which  doubt  might  have  the  most  per- 
nicious effect  at  a  future  period,  if  the  time  should  ever 
arrive  when  the  Crown  might  find  it  convenient  to  join 
a  popular  clamour  against  the  House  of  Commons.  All 
this  irrelevant  matter,  he  thought,  ought  to  be  struck 
out." 

He  concluded  by  moving,  that  the  Report  be  recom- 
mitted;  but  his  amendment  was  negatived,  without  a 
division. 


Letter  CLV.     TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 
My  dear  Murray,  Lincoln's  hm,  22d  May,  1810. 

I  am  not  sure  that  you  w^ll  be  of  opinion  that 
the  House  acted  right  in  its  vote  of  Friday  last,  respect- 
ing the  question  of  privilege ;  resolving,  that  the  Speaker 
should  plead,  with  an  understanding  (not  expressed  in 
the  resolution)  that  it  should  be  a  plea  in  bar.  I  cannot 
say  that  I  am  so  well  satisfied,  as  not  to  have  something 
like  misgivings  in  my  own  mind,  that  we  may  have 


IQ  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1810. 

yielded  up  part  of  what  I  am  convinced  ought  to  be  re- 
tained in  full  possession :  but  the  most  prudent  persons 
think  the  course  taken  to  be  the  right  one,  and  I  admit 
that  I  see  no  other  course  to  Avhich  there  are  not  more 
conclusive  objections.  Those  who  are  against  the  House 
of  Commons,  in  its  claim  of  privilege,  among  whom  I 
am  sorry  to  say  are  the  best  of  our  lawyers,  quite  con- 
cur in  the  vote ;  they  think  the  privilege  ought  to  be 
over-ruled  by  a  court  of  law,  and  they  are  glad  that  this 
form  of  plea,  by  admitting  the  jurisdiction,  will  give  the 
court  an  opportunity  of  deciding  against  the  claim. 
These  lawyers  and  the  republicans  are  in  unison  about 
this.  The  ministers,  and  we  who  concurred  with  them, 
think  the  Court  will  respect  the  privilege.  The  more 
rigid  Whigs  are  alarmed  by  this  very  appearance  of  con- 
cert among  such  parties,  who,  how  repugnant  so  ever  to 
one  another  in  their  ultimate  views,  are  all  of  them 
more  or  less  adverse  to  the  constitutional  power  and 
authority  of  the  House  of  Commons.  It  is  of  the  essence 
of  the  republican  spirit,  to  hate  every  semblance  of  dis- 
cretionary power,  and  particularly  the  complex  structure 
of  a  mixed  government,  in  wdiich  there  is  a  conflict  of 
such  powers,  and  to  insist  that  all  authority  should  be 
reduced  to  the  rules  of  a  constant  law  administered  in  a 
course  of  judicial  proceeding.  The  lawyers  are  brought 
to  the  same  conclusion  by  the  habits  of  their  professional 
life,  and  resent,  as  a  sort  of  reflection  cast  upon  the  per- 
fection of  their  system,  every  departure  from  their 
modes.  The  present  ministers,  who  are  almost  all  law- 
yers, bred  upon  the  lowest  benches  of  the  forum,  are 
guided  partly  (I  have  no  doubt)  by  their  old  habitudes, 
though  much  more  by  the  convenience  of  taking  that 
course  which  shall  most  easily  bring  to  an  end,  or  seem 
to  bring  to  an  end,  their  present  difficulties.     Both  the 


/Et.  32.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  X7 

republicans  and  the  lawyers  appear  to  me  wholly  mis- 
taken, as  to  what  it  is  possible  for  the  law,  judicially  ad- 
ministered, to  accomplish ;  as  well  as  Avhat  the  constitu- 
tional law  of  this  country  has  provided  for  cases  like 
that  which  has  occurred.  It  is  not  in  human  nature 
possible  to  frame  a  government  without  leaving  a  cer- 
tain power,  not  indeed  arbitrary  and  wholly  without 
rule,  but  discretionary,  and  to  be  exercised  within  cer- 
tain rules,  according  to  circumstances.  The  peculiar 
character  of  the  English  constitution  is,  that  that  por- 
tion of  discretionary  power  is  shared  among  the  several 
constituted  authorities,  instead  of  residing  in  one  ;  and 
the  chances  of  an  improper  exercise  of  it  are  lessened, 
by  the  checks  which  are  thus  established.  The  doctrine 
of  the  lawyers,  and  that  of  the  republicans,  tend  to  the 
establishment  of  a  simpler  frame,  whether  of  democracy 
or  monarchy,  in  which  they  would  speedily  find  that 
there  would  still  be  a  discretionary  power  somewhere 
lodged,  and  that  the  universal  dominion  of  the  law 
would  still  be  disputed,  as  the  judicial  law  would  still  be 
inadequate.  The  only  plan  that  has  yet  proved  success- 
fid,  in  confining  this  discretionary  power  within  proper 
limits,  is  that  system  of  mutual  controls,  which  results 
from  the  partition  of  this  power  among  the  several 
branches  of  a  mixed  government. 

My  view  of  parliamentary  privilege  is  this,  that  it  is 
not  a  law  to  be  applied  (like  the  rules  of  criminal  jus- 
tice) to  every  case  that  occurs,  and  which  is  brought  be- 
fore the  court,  but  a  discretionary  power,  to  be  exercised 
or  not,  and  to  the  full  extent  of  the  rule,  or  much  short 
of  it,  according  as  it  shall,  upon  a  view  of  all  existing 
circumstances  and  probable  consequences,  appear  to  be 
useful  and  necessary,  or  otherwise,  that  such  an  inter- 
position of  authority  and  punishment  should  take  place. 

9.  =S: 


18  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1810. 

But  then  I  have  another  doctrine,  that  this  power  is  not 
imUmited  and  undefined,  but  of  limits  and  a  definition 
which  may  be  certainly  known,  by  consulting  properly 
the  records  of  parliamentary  customs  and  usage.  I 
think  the  House  of  Commons  has  an  ancient  and  most 
necessary  criminal  jurisdiction,  excluding  all  other  courts, 
for  the  punishment  of  offences  committed  against  itself 
and  its  members  as  such ;  and  Avhoever  will  read  the 
Eolls  and  the  Journals,  in  the  spirit  with  which  all  pre- 
cedents ought  to  be  studied,  (not  to  square  the  circum- 
stances of  particular  cases,  but  to  extract  the  principle 
which  is  implied  in  all  of  them,  the  principle  which  was 
aimed  at  in  the  precedents  of  good  times,  and  which,  in 
those  of  bad  times,  was  made  the  pretext  of  violence,) 
will  have  no  difficulty  in  collecting  the  evidence  of  this 
right  of  jurisdiction,  as  well  as  its  fixed  and  due  limits. 
I  cannot  at  all  approve  of  the  doctrine,  which  Mr.  Pon- 
sonby  quoted  the  other  night,  with  approbation,  from 
Blackstone,  that  it  would  be  inexpedient  and  hazardous 
to  the  independence  and  authority  of  parliament  to  have 
its  privileges  defined.  They  seem  to  me  to  be  all  very 
plainly  defined  already,  as  much  as  things  of  that  nature 
can  be ;  and  if  they  were  not,  I  should  think  it  most 
wise  to  give  them  at  length  that  definition.  We  have 
defined  prerogative,  which  was,  perhaps,  a  bold  experi- 
ment in  government ;  the  success  of  it  may  satisfy  us 
that  there  is  no  hazard  in  bringing  privilege,  if  it  be  yet 
to  bring,  within  the  bounds  of  legal  description.  But 
by  legal  description,  I  do  not  intend  a  statutory  enact- 
ment, and  still  less  the  more  narrow  conception  of  the 
law  as  administered  in  courts  of  justice,  but  in  the  man- 
ner practised  in  all  ages  by  parliament,  by  a  resolution 
of  the  House  itself 

I  have  no  manner  of  doubt,  that  the  Judges  in  West- 


/Et.  32.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  19 

minster  Hall  '^vill  recognise  this  privilege  in  the  present 
instance.  They  are  bound,  by  the  law,  to  recognise  it ; 
and  unhappily  the  present  instance  of  its  exercise  comes 
from  that  quarter,  with  whose  feelings  they  are  always 
found  too  uniformly  to  sympathise. 

Ever  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CLVI.     TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 
Mv  dear  Murray  Lincoln's  Inn,  nth  June,  1810. 

Before  the  inhabitants  of  Edinburgh  are  scat- 
tered into  the  country,  I  wish  very  much  you  would 
take  some  opportunity  of  sounding  them  upon  the  ques- 
tion of  Scotch  Parliamentary  Reform.  The  longer  I 
live,  I  become  the  more  keen  on  that  subject ;  both  be- 
cause I  become  daily  more  convinced  that  there  is  no 
part  of  the  kingdom  which  would  send  more  useful  re- 
presentatives than  Scotland  would,  if  there  were  a  popu- 
lar choice  ;  and  because  it  is  manifest  that  none  of  the 
other  great  objects  can  be  gained  for  Scotland,  such  as 
jury  trial,  until  you  have  more  active  representatives. 
The  measure  will  never  be  carried  without  a  very  de- 
cided opinion  in  favour  of  it,  indeed  a  strong  call  for  it 
from  Scotland  ;  such  as  there  seems  to  have  been,  before 
the  excesses  of  the  French  revolution  stopped  the  pro- 
gress of  all  our  political  improvements.  I  know  there  is 
no  such  anxiety  upon  the  matter  at  present ;  but  one 
should  like  to  feel  the  pulse,  and  guess,  whether  by  ad- 
ministering proper  materials,  the  fever  could  once  more 
be  brought  on.  ''•  *  '''  '•' 

Yours  most  affectionately, 

Fra.  Horner. 


20  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1810. 


Letter  CLYU.    TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 
My  dear  Murray,  Lincoln's  inn,  2Gtli  June,  1810. 

The  Report  of  the  BuUion  Committee  is  not  yet 
out  of  the  printer's  hands ;  so  that  those  who  praised  it 
to  you  were  hberal  enough  to  bestow  that  praise  upon 
credit.  I  can  let  you  into  the  secret,  however,  that  the 
Eeport  is  in  truth  very  clumsily  and  prolixly  drawn ; 
stating  nothing  but  very  old  doctrines  on  the  subject  it 
treats  of,  and  stating  them  in  a  more  imperfect  form 
than  they  have  frequently  appeared  in  before.  It  is  a 
motley  composition  by  Huskisson,  Thornton,  and  my- 
self; each  having  written  parts,  which  are  tacked 
together  without  any  care  to  give  them  an  uniform 
style,  or  a  very  exact  connection.  One  great  merit 
the  Report,  however,  possesses;  that  it  declares,  in 
very  plain  and  pointed  terms,  both  the  true  doctrine  and 
the  existence  of  a  great  evil  growing  out  of  the  neglect 
of  that  doctrine.  By  keeping  up  the  discussion,  which 
I  mean  to  do,  and  by  forcing  it  again  upon  the  attention 
of  parliament,  we  shall  in  time  (I  trust)  effect  the  restora- 
tion of  the  old  and  only  safe  system. 

The  story  you  heard  of  Lord  Erskine  and  the  Prince 
had  some  foundation ;  but  was  exaggerated,  and  the 
scene  was  mislaid.  There  was  some  argument  between 
them  about  privilege,  at  a  dinner  at  the  Foundling  Hos- 
pital, which  was  magnified  by  Erskine's  enemies  into  a 
sharp  and  angry  dispute.  But  I  understand  it  was  at  a 
private  dinner  that  the  retort  you  allude  to  was  made 
by  the  Prince,  who,  when  Erskine  said  the  principles  he 
maintained  were  those  which  had  seated  H.  R.  H.'s  fam- 
ily on  the  throne,  said  they  were  principles  which  would 
unseat  any  family  from  any  throne. 


.Ex.  32.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  21 

I  have  no  idea  that  there  is  any  serious  displeasure 
felt  by  the  Prince  against  Erskine  on  this  account; 
though  Erskine  has  not  left  it  to  this  day  for  him  to 
prove,  that  rather  than  yield  liis  public  opinions  he  is 
ready  to  encounter  that  displeasure.  His  opinions  upon 
this  occasion  are,  I  think,  quite  erroneous;  his  prejudices 
as  a  lawyer,  perhaps  an  itch  for  popular  flivour,  perhaps 
too  a  dislike  of  the  House  of  Commons,  all  conspire  to 
lead  him  wronar.     The  House  of  Commons  was  not  his 

o 

theatre  of  glory ;  he  was  perpetually  losing  there  the 
fame  he  won  in  Westminster  Hall. 

I  am  more  surprised  at  Romilly  having  erred,  as  I  can- 
not but  think  he  has  done  ;  and  I  regard  it  as  a  striking 
proof,  how  difficult  it  is  for  a  man,  whose  mind  is  trained 
in  the  course  of  administering  justice,  especially  if  he 
be  a  lover  of  liberty,  to  allow  the  propriety  or  necessity 
of  any  thing  like  discretionary  power  being  left  any- 
where. Both  the  habits  of  a  lawyer's  mind,  and  the 
sentiments  which  compose  one's  love  of  liberty,  are  in 
favour  of  the  simpler  system  of  constant  and  known 
rules  and  forms  for  every  case  that  occurs ;  and  the  true 
theory  of  freedom  is,  unquestionably,  to  carry  that  prin- 
ciple as  far  as  possible.  For  my  part,  this  question  came 
upon  me  by  surprise  :  I  hesitated  a  good  deal,  before  I 
acquiesced  in  the  doctrine  of  privilege,  to  the  extent  to 
which  I  would  now  be  prepared  to  state  it ;  but  I  am 
satisfied  now,  after  as  accurate  a  view  as  I  can  take  of 
what  is  the  real  necessity,  that  it  is  necessary  for  the 
efficient  existence  of  the  Commons'  House,  that  they 
should  be  entrusted  with  the  discretionary  privilege  of 
punishing,  by  commitment,  those  who  either  obstruct  or 
libel  them. 

I  regret  deeply  that  Romilly  is  on  the  other  side  of 
this  great  question ;  it  weakens  both  the  claim  of  privi- 


22  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1810. 

lege  and  his  reputation  that  they  are  not  found  together. 
You  need  not,  however,  be  under  any  apprehension, 
that  he  does  not  stand  well  with  our  party  :  no  lawyer 
ever  stood  hisrher  than  he  does  in  the  House  of  Com- 
mons,  or  more  thoroughly  possessed  the  confidence  of 
his  party. 

What  a  curious  scene  was  exhibited  last  week  in  this 
city ;  and  what  would  John  Wilkes  or  Cardinal  de  Retz 
have  said,  to  such  a  false  step  as  Burdett  has  made,  in 
failing  to  appear  in  the  jDrocession  prepared  for  hiin. 
He  has  acted  in  that  a  more  temperate  and  peaceable  part, 
than  I  had  previously  given  him  credit  for;  but  it  is  mani- 
fest, that  his  conduct  is  inconsistent  with  itself,  that  all  he 
had  done  before  required  him  to  go  on,  and  that  he  had 
advanced  too  far  in  the  popular  race  to  turn  back.  His 
popularity  is  accordingly  very  much  impaired.  The 
agitators  and  desperate  spirits  have  had  it  proved  to 
them,  that  he  is  not  a  leader  for  them,  and  has  not 
mettle  enough ;  and  the  good-hearted  mob  have  found, 
to  their  disappointment,  that  whether  it  be  want  of 
courage,  or  too  good  a  taste,  he  ^\i\\  not  always  enter 
into  all  their  noise.  The  more  intelligent  of  his  party 
must  be  satisfied,  that  he  is  deficient  in  resolution,  and 
cannot  always  be  depended  on.  His  powers  of  doing 
mischief  are  diminished,  therefore,  if  he  ever  had  any 
mischievous  designs,  which  I  do  not  believe ;  and  if  the 
public  were  once  satisfied  that  he  is  no  longer  popular 
with  the  multitude,  and  thereby  formidable,  I  think  he 
has  qualities  that  would  enable  him,  in  his  way,  to  do 
good  occasionally,  and  to  assist  other  public  men  in 
doing  good  in  theirs.  Vain  he  is,  no  doubt,  and  always 
acting  upon  the  suggestions  of  others,  and  those  often 
inferior  to  himself;  but  he  has  a  prompt  indignation 
against  injustice  and  oppression,  one  of  the  best  elements 


Mr.  32.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  23 

of  the  passion  for  liberty ;  and  by  great  and  fortunate 
labour  he  has  acquired  a  talent  for  speaking  in  public. 
I  believe  he  loves  his  country  and  the  ancient  institu- 
tions. I  think,  too,  he  has  considerable  candour  in  judg- 
ing of  the  talents  as  well  as  motives  of  other  men  ;  but 
there  have  been  some  symptoms  of  a  very  pitiful  jealousy, 
towards  those  who  have  interfered  with  him  in  his  own 
line  of  Westminster  popularity.  He  has  rendered  him- 
self a  remarkable  man,  though  I  fear  he  is  not  likely  to 
do  any  great  or  lasting  service  to  the  public :  his  late 
transactions  have  extended  his  popularity  beyond  the 
capital,  to  which  it  was  confined  before ;  but  in  the  end 
they  ho.ve  lessened  it  in  the  capital. 

I  have  been  led,  without  thinking,  to  write  a  great 
deal  more  about  these  matters  than  I  intended  when  I 
sat  down  :  they  are  more  the  notions  which  have  pre- 
sented themselves  in  writing  than  the  result  of  much 
reflection,  so  I  beg  you  will  help  me  to  make  them  more 
correct,  if  you  think  me  wrong. 

I  am  glad  you  saw  so  much  of  Mr.  Wilson  ;*  because 
you  would  then  see,  for  yourself,  that  the  high  opinion  I 
have  of  his  sense  is  not  exaggerated.  He  has  one  of  the 
most  clear-sighted  intellects  I  ever  knew,  and  certainly 
the  most  free  and  erect  one ;  he  has  neither  prejudice, 
nor  error,  nor  levity.  He  always  sees  things  in  their 
just  proportions  j  and  he  always  arrives  at  the  right  con- 
clusion by  the  shortest  way.  Since  the  illness  last  year, 
which  induced  him  to  give  up  his  profession,  and  in 
a  great  measure  detached  him  from  the  world,  he  has 
seemed  to  me  a  still  more  instructive  and  interesting 
person  to  converse  with  than  he  was  before  :  he  is  a 
mere  spectator,  but  with  as  active  a  spirit  of  curiosity 
and  observation  as  if  he  expected  to  remain  long  among 

*  Mr.  George  Wilson.     See  note,  vol.  i.  p.  196. 


24  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1810. 

US,  though  he  is,  in  a  manner,  separated  already  from  us 
and  almost  from  life.  He  has  reduced  to  practice  the 
purest  and  most  fearless  philosophy,  and  reaps  the  best 
fruits  of  it  in  the  most  entire  tranquillity  of  mind,  and 
all  the  pleasures  of  benevolence  and  enhghtened  specu- 
lation. 

Most  sincerely  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CLVIII.     TO  FRANCIS  JEFFREY,  ESQ. 
My  dear  Jeffrey,  Lincoln's  inn,  16th  July,  1810. 

I  am  just  returned  to  town,  after  an  absence  of 
about  ten  days.  The  Bullion  Keport,  I  am  rather  sur- 
prised to  find,  is  not  yet  delivered  from  the  printers ;  I 
revised  the  proof  sheets  before  I  left  town.  I  would 
rather  do  something  for  you  myself,  if  you  will  let  me 
know  the  utmost  time  you  can  allow  me  ;  rather,  I 
mean,  than  trust  that  subject  in  the  hands  of  any  of 
your  mercenary  troops,  one  of  whom  was  guilty  of  de- 
plorable heresies  in  the  account  of  a  book  by  one  Smith. 
I  will  do  a  short  article  for  yoa  this  time,  to  do  justice 
to  Mr.  Eicardo  and  Mr.  Mushet,  who  called  the  public 
attention  to  this  very  important  subject  at  the  end  of 
last  year. 

Will  you  allow  me  once  again  to  protest  against  your 
suffering  so  much  party  politics  in  the  Edinburgh  Re- 
view? You  knew  my  sentiments  on  that  point  long 
ago  ;  nor  would  I  now  obtrude  them,  if  I  had  not  been 
led  to  feel  with  increased  weight  the  justness  of  all  my 
former  objections,  by  the  manner  in  which  the  last  num- 
ber has  been  received.  I  am  quite  sure  the  character 
and  efficient  usefulness  of  the  work  is  very  considerably 
impaired ;  and  it  appears  to  me  to  be  of  great  public  im- 


^T.  32.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  25 

portance,  that  that  injury  should  be  retrieved  as  speedily 
as  possible.  The  power  of  the  Review  over  the  public 
mind,  which  was  once  so  great,  and  is  still  very  consid- 
erable, depended  very  much  upon  that  general  tone  of 
politics,  which,  when  it  was  the  transcript  of  your  senti- 
ments, it  almost  uniformly  preserved.  But  the  turn  it 
has  taken  of  late,  by  descending  to  questions  between 
ministry  and  opposition,  and  even  to  individual  crimi- 
nation, has  lowered  its  name,  and  given  a  prejudice 
against  all  its  opinions  and  reasonings,  even  upon  other 
occasions.  Some  time  before  I  left  town,  I  heard  a  long 
conversation  about  the  Review  between  Lord  Holland, 
Tierney,  and  Allen,  in  which  they  all  expressed  the  same 
opinion  which  I  have  now  taken  the  liberty  of  repre- 
senting to  you;  and  I  think  you  ought  to  give  the 
more  weight  to  a  sentiment  in  which  so  many  persons 
agreed,  who  would  naturally  feel  very  differently  about 
the  Review.  You  would  hardly  have  expected  that 
Tierney  would  refuse  any  party  aid  from  the  press ;  and, 
in  truth,  I  believe  his  opinion  upon  the  subject  was 
taken  up  in  this  light,  that  a  more  powerfid  aid  was 
given  by  the  Edinburgh  Review  to  the  Whig  party, 
composed  as  it  is  at  present,  and  still  more  to  the  ques- 
tions and  principles  to  which  that  party  is  pledged, 
while  the  work  preserved  its  independent  judicial  air  of 
authority,  than  it  can  furnish  by  all  its  activity  and 
skill  as  a  partisan.  I  meant  to  have  told  you  of  this 
conversation  before,  which  impressed  me  very  strongly 
at  the  time,  as  conclusive  evidence  of  the  effect  which 
the  recent  conduct  of  the  Review  had  produced  upon 
its  own  reputation.  But  I  felt  some  reluctance  in  urg- 
ing a  topic  which  might  be  a  disagreeable  one  to  you, 
on  account  of  the  difficulty  and   delicacy  you   might 

VOL.  II  3 


26  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1810. 

feel  in  acting  upon  my  view  of  the  matter,  even  if  you 
agreed  with  me.  Brougham  has  been  too  useful  and 
powerful  an  ally,  to  make  it  easy  for  you  to  point  out 
any  change  you  might  wish  for ;  but  when  I  recollect 
the  many  admirable  articles  he  formerly  gave  you  upon 
more  general  subjects,  I  own  that  I  regret  very  much 
that  he  should  misplace  his  compositions  so  much,  as  to 
print  in  the  Review  what  he  ought  to  speak  in  the 
House  of  Commons. 

I  wish  very  much  that  Brougham  and  I  were  upon 
such  a  footing  that  I  could  state  these  things  to  himself^ 
but  that  has  been  long  otherwise  :  a  consideration  which 
more  than  any  other  has  made  me  backward  in  stating 
them  to  you.  But  I  have  been  latterly  so  much  urged 
by  other  persons  to  use  my  influence  with  you,  that  I 
have  been  induced  to  make  that  effort  upon  this  occa- 
sion. 

I  must  not  conclude  mthout  thanking  you  very  grate- 
fully for  the  pleasure  I  received  in  reading  your  ex- 
tracts from  Crabbe's  Borough  ;  some  of  which,  particu- 
larly the  Convict's  Dream,  leave  far  behind  all  that  any 
other  living  poet  has  written.  Does  not  your  critique, 
in  some  of  its  expressions  and  illustrations,  break  in  a 
little  upon  the  doctrines  which  you  urged  against  Words- 
worth? In  the  general  principles,  I  am  satisfied,  3'ou 
are  consistent ;  and  as  far  as  I  am  capable  of  judging  of 
such  matters,  I  think  you  right ;  but  a  captious  person 
mio-ht  set  you  in  some  sentences  against  yourself  You 
must  some  day  or  other  bring  your  thoughts  on  the  phi- 
losophy of  poetry  and  poetic  expression  into  the  form  of 
a  systematic  essay ;  which  I  shall  insist  upon  your  pol- 
ishing with  much  care.  That,  and  a  little  treatise  on 
the  ethics  of  common  life,  and  the  ways  and  means  of 


^T.  32.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  27 

ordinary  happiness,  are  the  works  which  I  bespeak  from 
you  for  after-times. 

Believe  me  always  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CLVIIL*     TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 

My  dear  Murray,  London,  iTth  July,  isio. 

I  delayed  saying  any  thing  to  you  about  our 
autumn  plans,  until  the  Judges  had  fixed  the  days  of 
our  Circuit,  that  I  might  know  how  much  time  we  had 
to  reckon* upon.  What  I  should  most  wish  for,  is  to 
have  a  full  week  at  some  one  place,  where  the  walks 
and  rides  are  fine,  that  we  might  pass  such  another  time 
as  at  Crickhowel.  I  am  but  a  torpid  animal,  when 
locked  up  in  a  carriage,  and  undergo  so  much  violent 
locomotion  in  the  course  of  the  year,  that  repose  is  what 
I  like  best.  I  believe  in  this  we  feel  alike.  I  should  like 
nothing  better  than  going  for  the  whole  of  that  month 
to  some  pretty  neighbourhood  in  Wales,  near  the  sea 
and  the  mountains,  and  taking  a  few  books  with  us. 

I  believe  the  best  tract  that  has  been  published  on 
the  question  of  privilege,  is  Charles  Wynne's ;  as  much 
as  I  read  of  it  seemed  to  me  perspicuous  and  moderate. 
I  have  read  no  others.  You  will  find  me  go  great  lengths 
for  the  privileges  of  the  House  of  Commons,  and  parti- 
cularly in  that  branch  of  them  which  has  been  lately 
called  into  question.  The  case  came  upon  me  by  sur- 
prise, and  I  vacillated  for  a  day  or  two,  chiefly  I  beheve 
from  the  weight  of  Romilly's  authority,  whose  pure  love 
of  liberty  I  am  thoroughly  convinced  of  But  I  fixed 
at  last  very  hard,  and  this  very  privilege,  which  I  admit 
to  be  in  the  exercise  of  an  arbitrary  power,  appears  to 
me  altogether  essential  for  the  preservation  of  a  demo- 


28  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1810. 

cratic  constitution.  I  must  reserve  till  we  meet,  my 
arguments  in  support  of  this  doctrine.  In  the  mean- 
while, I  shall  only  say,  that  I  think  it  rests  both  upon 
principle  and  upon  precedents  well  understood.  For  in 
this,  as  in  the  law,  there  are  precedents  of  all  sorts ;  and 
if  the  argument  were  built  upon  them  only,  the  most 
opposite  conclusions  might  be  presented  in  almost  equal 
strength.  The  law  of  parliament,  however,  like  the 
common  law,  consists  not  of  cases,  but  of  principles.  As 
applied  to  the  common  law,  this  was  a  maxim  for  ever 
in  the  mouth  of  Lord  Mansfield,  who  borrowed,  I  think, 
his  usual  form  of  expressing  it  from  one  of  the  best 
treatises  that  I  know  upon  the  law  of  parliament,  the 
report  from  a  committee  of  the  House  of  Lords  upon 
the  great  case  of  Ashby  and  White,  which  you  will  find 
in  the  journals  of  1704,  and  in  the  third  volume  of 
Hatsell.  Lord  Holt  is  said  to  have  drawn  that  paper. 
"The  law  of  England,  (it  is  there  said,  I  think  very  phi- 
losophically,) is  not  confined  to  particular  precedents 
and  cases,  but  consists  in  the  reason  of  them,  which  is 
much  more  extensive  than  the  circumstance  of  this  or 
that  case."  In  the  spirit  of  this  maxim,  the  parliamen- 
tary precedents  ought  to  be  read  in  the  Rolls  and  the 
Journals,  extracting  the  principle  involved  in  all  of  them, 
as  being  that  which  was  aimed  at  in  the  precedents  of 
good  times,  and  which  in  bad  times  was  used  as  the  pre- 
text. Like  all  discretionary  power,  it  has  been  exercised 
more  or  less  honestly  at  different  periods,  and  more  or 
less  knowingly.  For  it  is  indispensable,  in  my  view  of 
this  privilege,  to  remember  that  it  is  a  branch  of  execu- 
tive discretion ;  and  is  by  no  means  to  be  regarded  in 
the  hght  of  a  branch  of  criminal  judicature,  where 
every  case  of  offence  that  occurs  must  be  tried.  Each 
case  of  privilege,  on  the  contrary,  presents  a  question  of 


^T.  32.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  29 

expediency,  liow  far  upon  a  view  of  all  actual  circum- 
stances and  probable  consequences  it  is  useful  to  make 
such  an  interposition  of  authority.  There  is  a  very  fine 
passage,  which  you  must  remember,  in  Hume's  history 
of  Charles  the  First,  in  which  he  describes  the  novelty 
and  boldness  of  the  experiment  which  was  made  by  the 
Patriots  of  the  Long  Parliament,  when  they  established 
what  he  calls  the  noble  but  dangerous  principle  of  ad- 
hering strictly  to  law,  and  removed,  (as  he  represents  it 
I  think  incorrectly,)  all  arbitrary  power  from  the  frame 
of  our  government.  In  the  present  question  of  privilege, 
we  have  chiefly  to  consider,  whether  it  be  possible  to 
form  a  government,  in  which  the  dominion  of  the  law 
shall  be  universal,  and  in  which  there  shall  be  no  rem- 
nant, in  any  part  of  the  constitution,  of  a  discretionary 
will.  I  confess  it  seems  to  me  impracticable;  though 
both  lawyers  and  men  of  a  republican  cast  of  opinion, 
proceed  without  always  declaring  it,  upon  that  supposi- 
tion :  — the  republican,  as  disliking  all  arbitrary  will,  and 
all  complexity  in  the  structure  of  government,  the  law- 
yer, from  a  similar  love  of  simplicity  in  the  distribution 
of  authorities,  and  from  an  implicit  confidence  in  the 
sufficiency  and  perfection  of  the  modes  and  instruments 
of  judicial  procedure.  To  me,  however,  it  seems,  that 
all  the  argmuents  that  are  ever  stated  in  fiivour  of  a 
mixed  government  resolve  into  a  confession,  that  some 
power  must  be  left  to  the  exercise  of  a  sound  discretion, 
and  that  the  only  security  for  a  permanent  soundness  of 
discretion  is  to  be  found  in  the  partition  of  that  power, 
and  the  check  which  results  from  mutual  control.  But 
I  find  myself  getting  much  deeper  into  the  subject  than 
I  had  intended,  perhaps  you  will  think  already  out  of 
my  depth. 

I  am  delighted  with  Mr.  Stewart's  new  book ;  with 

3* 


30  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1810. 

the  style  and  the  matter  of  it ;  delighted  with  it  all. 
The  composition  is  softer  and  more  flowing  than  in  his 
former  writings,  and  has  less  of  that  emphasis  and  strain 
which  gives  a  hardness  to  some  parts  of  the  Philosophy 
of  the  Mind.  He  is  particularly  satisfactory  to  me,  in 
what  he  states  with  respect  to  Berkeley's  speculations 
and  those  of  Home  Tooke. 

Ever,  my  dear  Murray, 

Affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 

P.  S.  Use  all  your  influence  with  Jeffrey  and  with 
Brougham  to  keep  out  of  the  Edinburgh  Review  those 
party  declamations,  which  are  destroying  its  influence 
with  the  public.  Let  them  leave  the  last  word  to  the 
Quarterly  Review,  and  break  off  from  this  useless  war- 
fare at  once. 


Letter  CLIX.     TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 
Mv  dear  MurraV  Salisbury,  7th  August,  1810. 

It  was  quite  a  pleasure  to  me  to  receive  a  letter 
from  you  again.  I  could  not  help  fancying  sometimes 
you  might  be  unwell ;  though,  upon  the  whole,  I  satis- 
fied myself  that  you  must  be  busy. 

I  will  certainly  give  you  the  meeting  in  Dublin,  and 
on  the  earliest  day  on  which  I  can  reach  it.  I  must  of 
course  remain  till  the  Somerset  Assizes  are  almost  over, 
which  will  not  be  till  Friday  the  31st  instant.  I  calcu- 
late that  if  I  am  not  disappointed  in  places,  and  have  an 
ordinary  passage,  I  may  land  at  Dublin  early  in  the 
morning  of  the  4th.  You  cannot  rely  upon  me  however 
for  that  day. 

If  you  should  come  there  sooner,  I  hope  you  will  see 


iEx.  33.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  31 

as  much  as  you  cau,  tliat  wc  may  bo  off  for  Killarney 
without  delay ;  which  I  agree  with  you  ought  to  be  our 
chief  object.  I  have  a  great  curiosity  to  see  something 
of  an  Irish  court  of  justice.  The  Lawyers  will  probably 
be  upon  their  circuits  at  that  time ;  but  you  may  as  well 
ask  if  the  Recorder's  Court  at  Dublin  has  any  sittings. 
Most  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Lktter  CLX.     to  his  MOTHER. 
Mv  dear  Mother  Klllamey,  IStli  September,  1810. 

We  came  here  last  night,  having  made  two  days 
of  it  from  Limerick,  and  rather  tiresome  ones ;  I  had 
the  pleasure,  upon  my  arrival,  to  find  your  letter  of  the 
6th  instant,  which  had  been  forwarded  to  me  from 
Dublin,  together  with  one  from  "Warwick. 

I  hope  you  got  the  note  from  Dublin;  which  I  wrote 
immediately  after  I  landed,  that  you  might  be  relieved 
from  your  fears  about  the  deep  sea.  I  was  very  lucky 
in  being  able  to  reach  it,  the  very  day  we  had  fixed  as 
the  first  that  we  had  a  chance  of  meeting ;  by  travelling 
two  nights  in  the  mail,  and  being  fortunate  enough  to 
get  on  without  delay  either  at  Birmingham  or  Shrews- 
bury ;  at  both  which  places  I  changed  coaches.  I  left 
Bristol  on  Monday  evening  at  seven,  and  was  at  Holy- 
head on  Wednesday  about  two  in  the  afternoon.  The 
packet  sailed  about  an  hour  afterwards ;  but  we  were 
three  and  twenty  hours  upon  the  passage,  and  near 
twenty  of  those  were  to  me  hours  of  mortal  sickness :  I 
thought  of  poor  Jonah  in  the  whale's  belly,  and  fancied 
myself  in  as  bad  a  plight,  as  I  lay  in  my  crib  with 
nothing  to  relieve  me  in  my  nausea,  but  the  sighs  of 
sympathising  Welsh,  Irish,  and  Scotch  around  me,  men, 


32  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1810. 

women,  and  children.  I  had  just  retired  to  my  berth, 
and  was  in  my  first  pangs,  when  I  heard  the  loud,  good- 
natured,  vulgar  voice  of  a  raw-boned  Scotch  lad,  asking 
the  cabin-boy,  for  information  only,  if  "  ony  body  was 
seek  yet  ? "  I  cannot  say  that  I  had  not  some  satisfac- 
tion for  a  moment,  when  I  heard  this  bumpkin,  about  an 
hour  afterwards,  expressing  himself  in  very  different 
tones,  as  if  he  was  about  to  render  up  his  very  entrails. 
For  all  this,  however,  I  was  fully  compensated  by  the 
view  of  the  bay  of  Dublin,  as  we  sailed  into  it ;  it  is 
very  deep  and  broad,  the  coast  all  round  appears  lined 
with  woods,  great  houses  or  villages,  and  the  Wicklow 
mountains,  which  rise  on  the  left  hand,  have  quite  a 
Highland  form  and  character. 

We  spent  the  best  part  of  two  days  in  Dublin.  It  is 
rather  a  handsome  town;  the  quay  along  the  Liflfey, 
with'  the  bridges  one  after  another,  four  or  five  of  them, 
gives  a  fine  town  view ;  and  there  is  one  point,  where 
several  public  buildings  are  assembled  together,  the  Col- 
lege, the  Parliament  House,  and  some  others,  to  which  I 
should  be  at  a  loss  to  say  what  there  is  in  London  that 
is  equal ;  Whitehall  I  think  is  not.  The  public  offices 
in  Dublin  are  all  very  ornamental  buildings;  the  Cus- 
tom House  is  most  talked  of,  but  I  would  praise  the  Par- 
Hament  House,  now  the  Bank,  more  highly.  We  went 
a  few  miles  out  of  Dublin,  to  see  the  Phoenix  Park,  and 
a  gentleman's  seat  called  Luttrel's  Town;  the  last  is 
always  recommended  to  strangers,  but  is  hardly  worth 
their  while ;  we  were  much  more  pleased  with  the 
grounds  of  the  Duke  of  Leinster,  a  little  farther  on,  and 
with  the  situation  of  the  village  of  Leixlip. 

From  Dublin  we  went  to  Limerick  by  the  mail-coach; 
through  a  tame  country,  level  the  greater  part  of  the 
way,  all  (except  where  there  is  bog)  under  cultivation, 


^T.  33.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  33 

and  passing  (in  the  county  of  Tippcrary  particularly) 
some  wild  villages.  The  cultivation  of  every  thing  but 
potatoes  seemed  to  be  sorry ;  but  its  extent  is  so  great, 
as  to  give  the  idea  of  an  immense  produce,  even  if  we 
did  not  see  the  multitudes  who  crowd  the  whole  coun- 
try. All  that  I  had  heard  in  description  of  the  num- 
bers of  the  Irish,  and  of  their  dirt,  rags,  and  beggary, 
seems  to  me  now  to  have  been  short  of  the  truth.  The 
streets  of  Limerick  were  like  a  great  fair;  though  it 
was  not  even  market  day ;  and  this  from  morning  to 
night.  It  seemed  as  if  every  house  had  poured  out  its 
inhabitants;  yet  every  cellar  we  looked  into  seemed 
full.  It  was  more  or  less  the  same  in  all  the  towns  and 
villages  we  came  through ;  and  we  never  went  a  mile 
upon  the  highway,  without  seeing  a  great  many  persons. 
None  of  them  seem  to  have  any  thing  to  do ;  through 
all  that  we  should  call  the  workino;  hours  of  the  dav,  we 
saw  large  lasses,  and  lads  six  feet  high,  lounging  round 
the  cabin  doors.  It  is  literally  true,  that  the  only  ap- 
pearance of  industry  we  saw,  was  in  the  number  of 
schools  that  we  observed  on  this  side  of  Limerick; 
schools  for  the  ragged  children  of  those  same  cabins : 
and  we  two  or  three  times  passed  a  little  swarm  of  them 
sitting  on  the  outside,  to  all  appearance  because  it  was 
quite  full  of  them  within,  reading,  writing,  and  cipher- 
ing. Murray  got  into  conversation  with  one  of  the 
schoolmasters,  in  a  village  where  there  was  not  a  hovel 
better  than  a  hog-sty,  who  was  a  young  man,  and  who 
told  him  that  Telemachus  was  one  of  the  books  he  read 
with  the  children.  All  this,  when  one  sees  the  idleness 
of  the  people  and  the  backwardness  of  the  country,  is  a 
little  puzzling.  With  this  idleness,  and  dirt,  and  naked- 
ness, they  look  a  much  happier  people  than  I  have  seen 
in  any  part  of  England  or  Scotland ;  the  English  peasant 


34  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1810. 

is  a  torjDid  animal,  and  the  Scotch  one  eaten  with  care, 
compared  with  the  light-hearted  cheerful  people  of  this 
country.  They  seem  for  ever  talking,  and  in  a  high  tide 
of  spirits ;  their  volubility  is  somewhat  distressing,  and 
their  language  is  more  full  of  submission  than  is  pleasant, 
because  it  reminds  one  how  they  have  been  taught  it 
by  oppression  ;  but  among  themselves,  they  seem  to 
have  a  great  deal  of  merriment  and  enjoyment.  They 
have  all  of  them  a  real  share  of  sharp  drollery  and 
imagery ;  enough  to  mark  them  as  entirely  a  different 
race  of  peojple  from  those  on  our  side  of  the  Channel. 
I  have  seen  but  very  little  in  the  course  of  these  few 
days ;  but  all  this,  I  think,  I  have  observed  distinctly. 
It  is  very  likely  they  have  not  the  same  steadiness  of 
understanding,  which  makes  the  Englishman  always  a 
master  of  his  own  particular  profession,  and  which  makes 
the  Scotchman  (who  seldom  knows  one  profession  tho- 
roughly) ready  to  turn  his  hand  to  almost  any  one,  and 
to  get  through  it  well  enough  to  thrive  by  it ;  but  the 
Irish  have  a  quickness,  readiness,  and  sharpness,  which 
the  others  seldom  possess. 

Nothing  has  surprised  me  so  much  in  Ireland  as  the 
excellence  of  the  roads;  all  the  way  from  Dublin,  even 
into  this  unfrequented  country,  they  are  most  admirable, 
and  must  have  been  made  at  a  great  expense.  Prob- 
ably, there  has  been  particular  attention  paid  to  this 
since  the  rebellion,  from  political  considerations ;  it  is  a 
care  well  bestowed,  and  must  assist  very  rapidly  the 
civilisation  of  the  country.  We  came  from  Limerick  by 
Adair,  Newbridge,  Glyn,  Tarbet,  Listowel,  and  Tralee. 
The  views  we  had  of  the  Shannon  going  down  to  Glyn, 
and  of  the  mountains  at  Tralee,  were  very  fine.  We 
have  spent  this  day  upon  the  lower  and  middle  lakes 
here ;  I  must  write  another  letter  about  this  place  :  we 


Mt.  33.]  .  CORRESPONDENCE.  35 

have  the  best  of  it  yet  to  see,  but  I  would  say  already, 
that  it  exceeds  greatly  all  the  scenery  with  which  I 
have  been  hitherto  acquainted. 

With  kindest  love  to  my  father  and  my  sisters, 
I  am,  my  dear  mother. 

Most  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter   CLX  *    TO  THE  REV.  T.  R.  MALTHUS. 
Mv  dear  Mai  thus  Killarney,  IStli  September,  1810. 

I  received  last  night  your  letter  of  the  7th  in- 
stant, in  which  you  so  very  kindly  invite  me  to  spend 
some  time  with  you  at  Haileybury ;  as  soon  after  my 
return  as  I  have  some  days  of  leisure,  it  will  afford  me 
a  real  enjoyment,  to  have  an  opportunity  of  passing 
some  days  with  you  in  the  country. 

I  am  glad  you  are  satisfied  with  the  Bullion  Report, 
so  far  as  it  goes.  There  are  still  in  the  Theory  of  the 
subject  some  points  which  give  me  difficulty,  particu- 
larly in  what  relates  to  exchange,  and  which  I  should 
like  to  try  if  they  could  be  cleared  up  by  a  little  more 
thinking  about  them.  In  the  Report,  of  course,  we  give 
the  slip  to  all  such  problems,  as,  for  the  useful  and 
necessary  purposes  of  the  practical  conclusion,  there  is 
a  plain  road  upon  the  principles  that  have  been  long 
well  settled.  As  it  is,  the  Report  has  more  the  air  of  a 
dissertation  than  was  desirable ;  and  any  savour  of  novel 
speculation,  how  just  soever  it  might  have  been,  would 
have  tainted  it  to  all  true  born  Englishmen.  All  the 
hopes  I  have  of  immediate  success  with  the  House  of 
Commons,  and  those  are  but  very  faint,  are  built  upon 
what  seems  to  be  our  strong-hold  of  former  experience 
and  former  doctrines,  in  opposition  to  what  we  have 


36  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1810 

called  tlie  Theory  of  the  Bank  Directors.  It  will  be 
very  pleasant  to  prevail  by  raising  that  cry.  I  have  no 
doubt  that  at  no  distant  time,  the  evils,  proceeding  from 
the  want  of  responsibility  in  the  Bank,  will  get  to  such 
a  pitch,  as  to  force  upon  parliament  a  recurrence  to  the 
old  systems.  I  am  only  afraid  that  some  mischief  may 
be  done,  in  the  mean  time,  by  interfering  unwisely  with 
the  country  banks,  and  with  that  diffused  and  subdivided 
credit,  afforded  by  their  means,  to  the  enterprises  of  small 
capitalists  in  remote  parts  of  the  country.  I  have  had 
no  time  to  make  political  inquiries  of  any  sort  in  this 
country ;  but  the  little  I  have  learned  about  the  state 
of  currency  and  credit  at  Dublin  for  the  last  few 
months,  makes  me  expect  to  receive  an  ample  com- 
mentary from  that  quarter,  upon  all  the  doctrines  of 
our  Report.  I  beg  you  will  make  my  kindest  respects 
to  Mrs.  Malthus,  and  believe  me 

Ever  most  sincerely  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter   CLX.«     TO   THE  DUKE   OF   SOMERSET. 
Mv  dear  Lord  Lincoln's  inn,  2cl  November,  1810. 

I  was  too  short  a  time  in  Ireland  to  learn  much 
more  about  the  state  of  the  lower  orders  in  that  country, 
than  that  it  is  very  different  from  the  condition  of  the 
people  in  either  of  the  other  two  kingdoms,  and  that  it 
is  a  subject  of  great  curiosity,  and  which  strongly  invites 
speculation.  Their  immense  numbers,  their  rags  and 
dirt,  excel  in  reality  all  the  descriptions  which  I  formerly 
believed  to  be  exaggerated ;  and  so  does  their  gaiety  of 
manner,  their  cheerfulness  in  the  midst  of  all  this  show 
of  indigence  and  misery,  and  their  education.  The 
only  appearance  of  industry  I  saw  was  in  the  village 


^T.  32.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  31^ 

schools,  which  seemed  so  many  bee-hives  in  swarm- 
ing time  ',  I  was  only  in  the  Catholic  part  of  Ireland, 
and  have  not  quite  information  enough  to  conclude  what 
I  rather  presume  to  be  true,  that  it  is  to  the  zeal  in- 
spired by  religious  persecution  that  this  singular  effect 
is  to  be  ascribed.  The  instance  would  for  the  present 
appear  to  be  one  on  their  side  of  the  argument,  who 
deny  the  advantages  of  education  ;  but  the  good  fruits, 
I  am  convinced,  will  be  reaped  in  due  season.  It  was 
during  the  persecution  of  the  Presbyterians  in  Scotland, 
that  their  system  of  parish  education  was  founded  and 
organized,  and  the  lower  orders  of  that  country  re- 
mained for  many  years  after  the  union  in  a  state  of 
wretched  beggary,  idleness,  and  insubordination.  Fletcher 
of  Salton's  description  of  them  would  pass  for  too  high 
colouring  in  describing  the  present  Irish.  They  are, 
generally  speaking,  unemployed  and  lawless ;  and  the 
greatest  political  evil  of  Ireland  is  their  excessive  num- 
ber. Nothing  seems  likely  to  remedy  this  but  that 
change  in  the  occupation  of  landed  property  by  the 
breaking  down  of  vast  territories  held  by  Absentees  into 
smaller  estates,  and  the  reverse  process  of  converting' 
the  present  fractions  of  leasehold  into  large  farms,  which 
will  take  place  in  the  natural  progress  of  wealth.  It  is 
a  revolution  which  will  cause  some  violent  struggles,  on 
the  part  of  the  displaced  tenantry  5  and  there  have 
been  already  some  proofs  of  the  change  having  com- 
menced, and  of  the  struggles  which  attend  it.  This 
progress  of  agriculture  in  Ireland  will  be  accelerated,  I 
expect,  by  two  circumstances,  which  may  be  regarded 
as  accidental.  The  peculiar  circumstances  of  England 
in  respect  of  population  and  wealth  give  Ireland  a  near 
and  vast  market  for  grain  ;  and  Sir  John  Newport's  Act 
has  rendered  the  trade  quite  free.     The  other  circum- 

VOL.  II.  4 


38  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1810. 

stance  is,  that  the  rebeUion  of  1798  has  led  both  govern- 
ment and  the  country  gentlemen  of  Ireland  to  pay  an 
extraordinary  attention  to  the  improvement  of  their 
roads,  which  are  better  in  that  country  and  more  nume- 
rous, than  in  almost  any  other. 

The  late  unexpected  turn  of  things  here  will  probably 
bring  your  Grace  sooner  to  town  than  you  intended.  I 
have  not  heard  how  the  King  is  to-day,  but  I  have  good 
reason  to  believe  that  he  was  worse  yesterday  than  was 
publicly  given  out.  The  pains  taken  at  Windsor  to  con- 
ceal the  real  extent  of  his  illness,  only  make  one  believe 
it  to  be  much  more  severe  and  serious. 

Believe  me,  my  dear  Lord, 

Most  faithfully  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter   CLXI.    TO  DUGALD   STEWART,  ESQ. 
My  dear  Sir  Lincoln's  Inn,  16th  November,  1810, 

I  was  much  chagrined,  upon  my  coming  to  Lon- 
don, to  find  that  no  copy  of  the  Bullion  Report  had 
been  sent  to  you  from  the  Vote  Office,  though  I  wrote 
from  the  circuit  expressly  to  desire  it,  and  I  had  taken 
for  granted  that  it  had  been  sent.  It  is  now  out  of 
print ;  but  there  is  a  copy  which  I  have  lent  to  a  gen- 
tleman who  is  now  in  Yorkshire,  and  which,  as  soon  as 
I  can  recover  it,  I  will  send  to  you ;  if  I  should  not  be 
fortunate  enough  to  procure  another  sooner.  I  hope 
you  have  got  Huskisson's  tract,  and  pray  let  me  know 
if  you  have  Mr.  Blake's  which  is  very  goodj  the  subject 
has  produced  much  discussion  in  England,  and  I  have 
no  doubt  will,  within  a  year  or  two,  be  practically  settled 
agreeably  to  our  views.  Every  day,  I  hear  of  converts. 
You  could  not  do  me  a  greater  favour,  than  by  commu- 


,Et.  33.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  39 

nicatiiig  to  me  what  particular  points  there  are  in  the 
doctrine  stated  by  the  committee,  on  which  you  either 
entertain  a  different  opinion,  or  feel  difficulties ;  for 
myself  I  will  own,  that  there  are  a  few  instances,  in 
which  I  think  the  argument  has  not  yet  been  placed 
accurately  upon  the  right  grounds,  as  there  are  some  in 
which  I  contented  myself  (in  drawing  my  part  of  the 
Report)  with  assuming  what  might  have  been  deduced 
from  principles,  but  not  without  an  air  of  more  theory 
and  general  speculation  than  I  thought  it  prudent  (on  ac- 
count of  my  own  situation)  that  the  Report  should  bear. 
I  suppose  it  is  with  respect  to  the  wages  of  labour,  and 
the  pay  of  the  army  and  navy,  that  you  wish  we  had 
spoken  out  more  fully,  and  followed  out  the  conse- 
quences of  our  reasoning.  I  think  the  time  will  come 
when  all  those  consequences  ought  to  be  explained 
without  reserve  ;  but  in  first  breaking  the  subject, 
against  the  prejudices  of  a  large  portion  of  the  English 
public,  and  against  the  arts  of  misrepresentation,  which 
Government  and  the  Bank  were  sure  to  put  in  practice, 
it  seemed  more  advisable  to  rest  the  argument  upon 
those  grounds  with  which  it  was  most  difficult  to  mix 
any  topics  of  declamation ;  and  the  more  so,  as  a  single 
hint,  with  respect  to  those  other  momentous  conse- 
quences of  a  depreciated  currency,  is  more  than  suffi- 
cient for  all  who  are  already  acquainted  with  the 
principles  of  such  subjects. 

I  Avas  in  the  minority  last  night  against  the  renewed 
adjournment.*  The  difference  among  us  upon  that 
motion,  though  it  may  be  represented  as  party  disunion, 
will  have  no  bad  consequences ;  I  rather  think  the  con- 
trary.   The  constitutional  principle  is  saved  by  so  strong 

*  An  adjournment  of  the  House  for  a  fortnight  Tvas  proposed  by  the  Govern- 
ment, on  account  of  the  King's  illness.  —  Ed. 


40  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1810. 

a  protest ;  and  the  conduct  of  the  rest  of  the  Opposition 
secures  the  party  from  any  charge  of  indelicacy  towards 
the  King,  or  undue  eagerness  to  make  the  most  of  the 
present  crisis. 

The  account  of  the  King  is,  that  he  had  some  fever 
again  yesterday,  that  he  has  had  some  sleep  in  the  night, 
and  that  his  fever  is  again  a  little  abated.     I  beg  to  be 
most  kindly  remembered  to  Mrs.  Stewart, 
And  am,  my  dear  Sir, 

Most  truly  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CLXII.     TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 
Mv  dear  MurraV  Lincoln's  Lm,  29t]i  Nov.  1810. 

It  was  very  negligent  in  me  not  to  satisfy  you 
about  my  health,  which  is  now  perfectly  good. 

Huskisson's  pamphlet  is  excellent.  There  are  still 
some  points  in  the  theory  of  this  subject  not  quite 
cleared  up ;  and  I  can  put  my  finger  now  on  one  or  two 
parts  of  the  Bullion  Keport,  from  which  I  dissent.  There 
is  one  especially,  from  which  indeed  I  dissented  at  the 
time  I  drew  up  the  Report,  but  adopted  it  as  the  sense 
of  the  majority  of  the  committee,  and  particularly  Hus- 
kisson,  Thornton,  and  Baring ;  which  is  this,  that  the 
whole  depression  of  the  exchange  was  originally  occa- 
sioned by  the  state  of  trade,  and  that  the  operation  of 
the  excessive  and  depreciated  currency  was  to  prevent 
its  restoration.  This  way  of  stating  it  gives  a  confusion 
to  the  reasoning,  and  involves,  I  am  satisfied,  an  error  in 
principle  ;  inconsistent,  indeed,  with  the  very  foundation 
of  the  argument.  Depreciation  must  produce,  under  all 
circumstances,  its  appropriate  and  proportionate  effect 
upon  the  foreign  exchanges;  and  produces  that  effect 


^T.  33.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  41 

independently,  though  it  may  be  combined  in  the  result 
with  the  effect  produced  upon  the  balance  of  payments 
by  political  or  commercial  circumstances.  It  may,  in 
some  instances,  require  a  good  deal  of  address  to  sepa- 
rate, in  a  particular  instance  of  the  exchange  with  a 
foreign  country,  those  other  circumstances,  the  effect  of 
which  is  mixed  with  that  of  depreciation  ;  and  in  some 
instances,  from  our  imperfect  knowledge  of  the  state  of 
the  currency  of  the  other  country,  with  which  our  ex- 
change is  stated,  the  case  may  stand  for  a  while  unsolved, 
and  apparently  as  an  objection,  which  it  is  not  in  reality, 
to  the  general  conclusion. 

I  have  not  read  the  whole  of  Blake's  pamphlet ;  it 
seemed  to  me  very  perspicuous  and  satisfactory  :  I  shall 
read  it  in  a  day  or  two.  I  had  dismissed  the  subject 
from  my  mind  as  soon  as  the  Report  was  presented,  but 
am  now  deep  in  it  again.  The  discussion,  which  is  in 
great  activity  in  London,  will  do  much  good  ;  and  enable 
us  to  set  a  good  many  questions  at  rest.  You  cannot  do 
me  a  greater  favour,  than  by  stating  to  me  any  doubts 
or  difficulties  that  you  feel  upon  any  part  of  the 
question.  Bosanquet's  dexterous  but  somewhat  unfair 
pamphlet  has  given  me  a  good  deal  of  exercise  in  this 
way :  he  leaves  the  main  argument  quite  untouched, 
when  his  misapprehensions  of  the  facts  are  explained. 

The  recommendation  in  p.  33  of  the  Report,  that  the 
Bank  of  England  should  be  permitted  to  issue  notes 
under  5/.  for  some  little  time  after  the  resumption  of 
payments  in  specie,  is  founded  upon  this  principle,  that 
the  former  policy  of  the  legislature  ought  to  be  resorted 
to,  by  prohibiting  their  issue  of  notes  under  5/.  The 
reason  upon  which  that  rests  is,  that  it  is  important  to 
have  a  certain  proportion  of  specie  in  actual  circulation, 

in  order  to  prevent  those  sudden  panics  respecting  the 
4* 


^2  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1810. 

credit  of  paper  among  the  common  people,  which  are 
always  attended  with  inconvenience.     Smith's  principle 
is,  that  the  paper  circulation  should  be  confined  as  much 
as  possible  to  the  transactions  among  the  dealers,  and 
that  there  should  be  as  much  specie  as  possible  for  the 
transactions  between  the  dealers  and  the  consumers.     If 
I  recollect  right,  he  grounds  this  principally  upon  the 
inconveniences  which  the  consumers  must  suffer  when 
there  is  any  sudden  failure  of  credit,  which  diminishes 
the  value,  or  impedes  the  circulation,  of  the   smaller 
paper.    There  is  another  thing  to  be  taken  into  account, 
which  I  have  not  yet  considered  so  fully  as  to  have  a 
clear  view  of  it :  I  suspect,  however,  that  convertibility 
alone  of  all  paper  into  specie,  without  an  actual  inter- 
change of  a  certain  portion  of  specie  circulating  along 
with  the  paper,  is  not  sufficient  to  secure  the  permanent 
value  of  the  paper.     The  American  states  have  nothing 
but  paper  in  common  circulation ;  it  is  all  convertible 
by  law  into  specie,  but  coin  is  seldom  if  ever  seen :  I 
suspect  that  they  have  an  excess  of  this  paper,  and  that 
its  relative  value  is  lower  than  it  would  have  been  if 
there  had  been  always  an  interchange  of  specie.     But, 
as  I  have  already  said,  this  is  a  part  of  the  subject  which 
I  have  not  sufficiently  examined.     I  am  very  anxious  to 
get  at  the  truth  on  every  point  of  it ;  and  I  really  think 
I  have  no  prepossessions  about  it,  nor  have  laid  up  any 
opinion  which  I  am  not  ready  to  examine  and  to  dismiss, 
if  it  will  not  stand  the  test.     You  know  my  declared 
hostility  to   all  argument  and   controversy  in  conver- 
sation, but  I  delight  to  have  materials  presented  to  me 
for  self  examination  upon  my  opinions. 

I  am  inclined  to  think  that  the  King,  if  he  does  not 
die  from  bodily  weakness,  will  recover  from  his  present 
madness  ;  but  probably  not  for  several  weeks.      The 


2Et.  33.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  43 

question  for  the  parliament  seems  to  be,  liow  long  can 
the  government  go  on  -without  the  monarchy  ;  in  this 
respect,  the  royalists  are  playing  rather  a  hazardous 
game ;  and  as  I  am  all  for  the  monarchy,  I  wish  the 
country  and  the  parliament  were  aware  of  this  danger. 
In  a  mere  party  point  of  view,  it  is  much  wiser  to  let 
the  ministers  have  all  the  time  they  wish  to  gain ;  for 
nothing  is  more  to  be  dreaded,  in  the  present  circum- 
stances of  the  country,  than  a  short  interval  of  a  new 
administration,  under  a  precarious  regency. 

Ever  most  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CLXIII.    TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 

My  dear  Murray,  ^^^^^  December,  1810. 

Percival  wrote  to  the  Prince  yesterday,  an- 
nouncing his  plan  of  a  limited  regency,  exactly  like 
that  of  1789 ;  except  that  he  is  to  be  allowed  to  confer 
peerages  for  signal  military  or  naval  services,  and  that 
the  duration  of  the  regency,  so  limited,  is  fixed  for  a 
year,  and  six  weeks  after  the  commencement  of  the 
next  session  of  parliament  ;  like  the  restriction  upon 
the  distilleries.  The  Prince's  answer  was,  in  substance, 
this  ;  that  this  communication  was  made  to  him,  not 
like  that  of  Mr.  Pitt  after  the  two  Houses  had  passed 
certain  resolutions,  upon  which  it  was  no  longer  fit  for 
him  to  animadvert ;  but  before  such  resolutions  were 
proposed  to  parliament,  which  he  could  not  anticipate 
that  parliament  would  now  agree  to  ;  if  they  should  be 
passed,  he  would  then  refer  to  his  letter  of  1789,  for  the 
sentiments  and  principles  which  he  still  retains. 

After  he  had  sent  this  answer,  he  summoned,  in  the 
evening,  all  his  brothers  and  the  Duke  of  Gloucester ; 


44  SPEECH   ON  REGENCY   QUESTION.  [1810. 

and  stated  to  tliem  what  had  passed.  They  drew  up  a 
letter  to  Percival,  which  they  all  signed,  protesting 
against  a  restricted  regency.  This  is  something  like 
business. 

Yours  ever  affectionately, 

Fra.  Hoener. 


Parliament  stood  prorogued  to  the  1st  of  November, 
but  had  not  been  summoned  to  meet  "  for  the  despatch 
of  business ; "  and  as  the  commission,  which  had  been 
prepared  for  a  further  prorogation  to  the  29th,  could 
not  receive  the  King's  signature,  by  reason  of  his  Ma- 
jesty's illness,  both  Houses  met  on  the  1st.  On  the  pro- 
position of  Ministers,  an  adjournment  for  a  fortnight  was 
agreed  to ;  on  the  15th,  another  adjournment  to  the 
29th  took  place,  and  a  third  on  that  day  to  the  13th  of 
December ;  the  alleged  uncertain  state  of  the  king's 
health  forming  the  ground  for  these  proceedings,  and  the 
consequent  postponement  of  the  imj)ortant  measure  of 
appointing  a  Eegent. 

On  the  20th  of  December,  the  House  of  Commons  re- 
solved itself  into  a  committee  of  the  whole  House,  to 
take  into  consideration  the  state  of  the  nation,  in  con- 
sequence of  the  mental  derangement  of  the  King. 
Ministers  proposed  the  appointment  of  the  Prince  of 
Wales  as  Regent,  and  that  the  appointment  should  be 
made  by  a  Bill.  Mr.  Ponsonby,  the  leader  of  the  Op- 
position, moved  an  amendment,  that  an  Address  should 
be  presented  to  his  Royal  Highness,  praying  that  he 
would  assume  and  exercise  the  sovereign  authority, 
during  the  continuance  of  the  king's  indisposition,  under 
the  title  of  Regent. 

A  long  and  interesting  debate  ensued,  in  which  Mr. 


^T.  33.]  SPEECH^  ON  REGENCY   QUESTION.  45 

Horner  spoke  at  some  length,  strongly  urging  the  adop- 
tion of  the  latter  course  of  procedure,  as  more  consonant 
with  the  principles  and  maxims  of  the  constitution. 
That  his  speech  made  a  great  impression,  appears  not 
only  from  the  remarks  made  upon  it  in  the  House  itself, 
but  from  the  following  letter,  which  he  received  from 
Mr.  Cobbett,  who,  at  that  time,  published  the  most  ac- 
curate reports  of  the  debates  in  parliament :  — 


gjp  Newgate  *  30th  December,  1810. 

From  what  I  have  heard  from  several  gentlemen, 
and  especially  from  Lord  Folkestone,  I  must  believe  that 
your  speech  upon  the  Kegency  question  was  one  of 
the  most  important  of  the  whole ;  and  it  is  with  great 
mortification  that  I  perceive  that  my  reporter  has  imi- 
tated those  of  the  newspapers  in  giving  you  about  a 
dozen  or  twenty  lines.  I  did  not  know  this  till  yester- 
day, when  I  had  to  review  the  matter  prepared  for  the 
first  part  of  the  debates  of  this  session ;  if  I  had  sooner 
perceived  it,  I  should  sooner  have  made  an  application 
to  you,  to  request  you  to  have  the  goodness  to  write 
out,  from  your  notes  or  recollection,  the  substance,  at 
least,  of  what  you  delivered  upon  that  occasion ;  for,  I 
should  be  guilty  of  shameful  partiality  were  I  to  neglect 
any  thing  in  my  power  to  give  your  speech  its  proper 
space  in  these  debates.  But  I  should  inform  you,  that  it 
was  not  till  the  debate,  in  which  your  speech  would  have 
been,  was  actually  going  to  the  press,  that  I  discovered 
the  omission ;  whence  you  will  perceive  the  necessity  of 
my  having  any  report  of  it,  that  you  may  be  pleased  to 
furnish  me  with,  as  soon  as  possible. 

*  Mr.  Cobbett  was  tben  undergoing  imprisonment  for  a  political  libel.    The 
Mr.  Budd  he  mentions  was  his  publisher.  —  Ed. 


46  SPEECH  ON  REGENCY  QUESTION.  [1810. 

Mr.  Biidd,  who  is  the  bearer  of  this,  will  bring  me 
your  answer  ;  and  if  he  should  not  find  you  at  home,  I 
beg  the  favour  of  an  answer  by  letter,  as  soon  as  possi- 
ble, seeing  that  the  press  is  now  waiting. 

I  am,  Sir,  your  most  obedient,  &c. 

W.    COBBETT. 

To  this  letter  Mr.  Horner  sent  the  following  answer,  a 
copy  of  which  is  written  on  the  back  of  Mr.  Cobbett's 
letter :  — 


gjv.  Lincoln's  Inn,  30tli  December,  1810. 

-  I  owe  you  my  best  thanks  for  your  obliging  at- 
tention, in  giving  me  an  opportunity  to  insert  in  your 
Reports  a  note  of  what  I  said  the  other  night. 

But  I  am  unable  to  avail  myself  of  it ;  as  my  argu- 
ments turned  chiefly  on  what  had  been  urged  by  others 
in  the  course  of  the  debate,  I  could  hardly  bring  the 
different  topics  to  my  recollection,  Avithout  taking  more 
time  to  do  it  than  you  can  spare  me. 
I  have  the  honour  to  be,  Sir, 

Your  obedient  humble  servant, 

Fra.  Horner. 

On  receiving  this  answer,  Mr.  Cobbett  sent  a  second 
letter,  as  follows :  — 

gjj.  Newgate,  31st  December,  1810. 

Upon  consulting  with  my  printer,  I  find,  that,  if 
we  wait  till  the  10th  of  January  for  your  speech,  it  will 
not  do  us  much  injury.  If,  therefore,  you  will  let  me 
have  it  by  that  time,  I  will  wait  for  it,  being  extremely 
anxious  that  my  Debates  should  not  appear  without  it. 


iEx.  33.]  CORRESrONDENCE.  ^^ 

Your  answer,  left  with  Buddj  or  sent  here,  will  very 
much  oblige 

Your  obedient  servant, 

W.    COBBETT. 

On  the  back  of  this  letter,  there  is  the  following 
memorandum  in  Mr.  Horner's  handwriting :  — 

"  olst  Dec.  Said  to  Budd,  I  should  send  him  a  note." 

I  have  given  the  report  of  Mr.  Horner's  speech  on 
this  great  constitutional  question,  in  full,  in  the  Appen- 
dix. It  is  the  only  one  of  his  speeches  in  jD^^liament 
that  he  corrected,  as  far  as  I  am  aware,  except  a  short 
one  on  the  Scotch  Judicature  Bill  in  1815.  Mr.  Cobbett 
says  that  his  reporter  had  given  "  about  a  dozen  or 
twenty  lines "  to  the  speech ;  it  is  evident,  therefore, 
both  from  the  length  and  the  style  of  the  report,  that  Mr. 
Horner  must  have  written  as  full  an  account  of  what  he 
had  said  as  he  could  recollect,  after  an  interval  of  a  fort- 
night from  the  day  of  the  debate. 

Letter  CLXIV.    TO  FRANCIS  JEFFREY,  ESQ. 
My  dear  Jeffrey,  Lincoln's  inn,  18tb  January,  1811. 

I  received  Malthus's  manuscript  from  you,  and 
have  since  transmitted  it  to  him,  with  such  remarks  as 
occurred  to  me  in  perusing  it. 

The  Quarterly  Keview  was  sure  to  be  right  about  de- 
preciation ;  being  under  the  command  of  Canning,  who 
is  under  the  command  of  Huskisson.  I  have  heard  it  is 
George  Ellis,  who  has  set  Sir  John  Sinclair  upon  his 
black  ram.  By  the  way,  I  wish  you  would  take  Sin- 
clair's two  pamphlets  into  your  own  hands,  and  make  fun 


48  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1811. 

of  liim,  in  a  good-natured  way.  You  would  do  me  a 
peculiar  service,  if  you  will  deal  with  his  currency,  as 
you  did  with  his  longevit}^  The  inconsistency  of  his 
opinions  at  present,  with  those  which  he  published  in 
1797,  in  a  pamphlet  against  the  Bank  restriction,  and 
which  he  repeated  in  the  strongest  terms  in  1803,  in  the 
second  volume  of  his  History  of  the  Kevenue,  is  rather 
a  matter  of  grave  charge,  for  which  he  ought  to  be  put 
upon  the  defensive.  I  am  told  that  George  Chalmer 
has  put  forth  a  volume  against  us,  more  extravagantly 
wrong  than  even  Sinclair ;  perhaps  you  could  contrive 
to  put  them  side  by  side  into  one  frame,  and  exhibit  the 
pair  of  portraits,  like  Noodle  and  Doodle  in  their  old 
tie  and  buckle,  and  in  the  full  complacency  of  conscious 
wisdom. 

The  subject  you  suggest  of  the  present  state  of  com- 
merce, with  all  its  circumstances,  and  all  the  consider- 
ations, both  retrospective  and  in  prospect,  that  naturally 
belong  to  it,  is  a  noble  one,  but  of  very  difficult  execution. 
I  do  not  know  what  to  say  about  peace  :  I  should  like, 
of  all  things,  to  have,  for  my  own  judgment,  the  benefit 
of  the  views  which  you  could  suggest  j  but  for  the  sake  of 
the  public,  I  reaUy  think  your  opinion  ought  to  be  very 
deliberately  weighed  and  confidently  formed,  before  you 
give  the  sanction  of  your  authority  to  sentiments  and 
expectations,  which,  though  remarkably  dormant  at 
present,  may  be  raised  any  day  among  the  people  to  an 
unmanageable  size. 

Upon  the  question  of  peace,  I  parted  company  with 
some  of  my  best  advisers,  and  you  (I  fear)  among  them, 
at  the  moment  of  the  Spanish  insurrection  ;  thinking 
that  the  circumstances  of  that  event  recommended  an 
extension  of  hostilities,  upon  the  very  same  principle, 
which  condemned  the  original  hostilities  on  our  part, 


Mt.  33.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  49 

with  which  this  long  war  commenced.  However  persons 
may  differ,  as  to  the  policy  of  having  acted  upon  this 
principle  towards  Spain,  they  must  all,  I  apprehend,  ad- 
mit that  we  have  bound  ourselves  by  our  treaty  with 
the  insurgents,  and  that  we  cannot,  in  good  faith,  aban- 
don them,  while  they  preserve  any  hopes.  Besides  this 
obligation  of  good  faith,  in  respect  of  which  there  can 
be  no  difference  between  us,  I  have  not  yet  myself  re- 
linquished such  hopes,  though  you  will  probably  regard 
me  as  somewhat  enthusiastic  in  retaining  them  so  long ; 
but  miserable  as  our  disappointments  have  been,  beyond 
all  former  estimates  of  the  degradation  to  which  a  long 
course  of  despotism  could  reduce  a  great  people,  I  do 
not  yet  see  that  the  affairs  of  the  insurgents  in  the 
peninsula  are  desperate.  And  I  would  have  this  country 
act  upon  the  same  views,  and  if  possible  with  the  same 
magnanimity,  as  Elizabeth  showed  to  the  rebels  in  the 
Netherlands,  and  persevered  in  at  the  lowest  ebb  of 
their  fortunes.  This  is  an  immediate  consideration, 
which  would  prevent  me  from  acquiescing  in  any  pre- 
sent proposal  of  peace,  unaccompanied  by  a  stipulation 
on  the  part  of  France  to  evacuate  Spain.  But  it  grows 
out  of  a  principle,  which  carries  me  a  great  deal  farther, 
and  compels  me  almost  to  make  up  my  mind  to  what 
you  will  call  an  indefinite  prospect  of  war ;  a  prospect 
never  to  be  avowed,  however,  even  when  it  appears 
most  certain. 

In  the  situation  to  which  the  continent  of  Europe  is 
reduced,  and  in  the  situation  which  England  commands, 
I  cannot  imagine  a  general  peace  of  any  duration ;  and 
without  it,  we  can  have  no  peace  with  France.  I  rest 
very  little  argument  now,  upon  the  personal  character 
of  Bonaparte ;  the  direct  effect  of  his  name  and  genius, 
so  prodigious  for  a  certain  period  of  time,  is  at  length 

VOL.  II.  5 


50  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1811 

almost  sunk  in  that  change  of  the  state  of  the  world 
which  he  has  effected.  I  rest  no  argument  at  all  upon 
his  particular  designs  against  this  country,  which  is  the 
grand  reason  with  our  vulgar  for  perpetual  war ;  because, 
though  to  prevail  over  England  must  be  the  final  scope 
and  aim  of  his  ambition,  without  which  the  absolute 
disposal  of  the  whole  Continent  leaves  his  love  of  glory 
unsatisfied,  and  would  be  insufficient  to  transmit  his 
name  to  posterity  as  equal  to  those  conquerors  of  former 
ages  who  overcame  all  that  was  great  and  civilised 
in  their  own  time,  and  all  that  was  opposed  to  them ; 
yet  his  personal  passion  for  making  a  conquest  of  us 
cannot  be  a  better  reason  for  war,  than  the  national 
design,  pursued  under  all  changes  of  government,  which 
France  has  ever  entertained  against  us,  and  which  we 
have  ever  entertained  against  France.  It  is  the  natural 
condition  and  infirmity  of  powerful  neighbours ;  which 
never  can  become  a  reason  to  either  of  them  for  refus- 
ing to  make  peace  wdth  the  other,  as  long  as  they 
preserve  any  thing  near  an  equality  of  force  for  the 
maintenance  of  war.  My  view  of  our  situation  is  taken 
from  other  circumstances.  What  is  likely  to  be  the 
state  of  the  Continent  for  many  years  to  come  ?  And 
in  the  probable  condition  of  the  Continent,  what  must 
be  the  conduct  of  England  ;  which  (whatever  her  inter- 
est might  be,  if  it  could  be  managed  for  years  together 
with  perfect  wisdom)  cannot  but  be  impelled  by  the 
voice  of  the  people,  and  by  the  ancient  habits  of  politi- 
cal as  well  as  commercial  connexion  ?  If  the  whole 
Continent  were  to  be  tranquillised  into  one  empire,  and 
should  slumber  for  years  in  repose  under  a  vigilant  and 
well-organised  despotism,  no  fate  could  be  intended  for 
us  but  annexation  to  the  mass;  nor  could  we  devise  any 
safety  for  ourselves,  but  by  adopting  public  institutions, 


Ml.  33.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  gj 

and  by  fostering  sentiments  of  individual  ambition  and 
conduct,  of  which  defensive  war  and  the  most  rigid 
prejudices  of  local  patriotism  were  the  constant  objects. 
But  it  is  seldom  that  human  affairs  fall  into  such  a  forced 
state.  It  seems  infinitely  more  probable,  that  the  new 
empire  of  France  will  be  perpetually  disturbed  by  efforts 
in  one  member  or  another  to  throw  off  the  yoke  ;  in  the 
north  of  Germany,  for  instance,  where  military  genius 
might  win  a  fair  kingdom,  or  in  the  hereditary  states  of 
Austria,  where  the  natives  cannot  yet  have  despaired 
of  recovering  their  ancient  independence.  Should  such 
chances  arise,  even  if  the  struggle  of  Spain  were  over,  I 
conceive  it  would  be  the  duty  of  this  country,  and  I  am 
sure  it  would  be  unavoidable  at  any  rate,  to  contri- 
bute from  our  resources  every  aid  and  encouragement 
to  the  insurgents.  It  is  idle  to  sigh  for  peace,  if  it  can- 
not be  had  upon  system,  and  for  a  period  to  be  sure  of; 
England  forms  a  part  of  Europe,  and  must  share  its 
vicissitudes  and  agitations. 

The  point  to  be  considered  is,  by  what  mode,  and 
upon  Avhat  principles  the  war  may  be  conducted,  so  as 
to  afford  the  best  chance  of  contributing  to  the  ultimate 
restoration  of  independence  to  some  of  those  kingdoms, 
which  never  can  be  incorporated  with  France,  from  the 
diversity  of  race  and  languages.  In  my  judgment,  we 
have  only  to  act  upon  the  principles  by  which  Elizabeth 
was  guided,  and  afterwards  King  William ;  forbearing 
all  little  bye  objects  of  gain  and  aggrandisement,  and 
keeping  steadily  in  view,  through  all  fortunes  and  in 
the  lowest  depth  of  our  despair,  the  ultimate  partition 
of  the  Continent  into  independent  states,  and  the  revival 
of  a  public  law  in  Europe.  For  such  conduct,  looking 
so  far  forward,  much  patience,  and  constancy,  and 
public    integrity,  will   be  required  ;    but   it  is  a  part 


52  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1811. 

worthy  of  this  nation,  and  no  more,  in  proportion  to  its 
present  means,  than  it  has  done  before. 

You  will  consider  me  very  belligerent :  I  do  not  know 
that  I  ever  before  exposed  to  you,  or  indeed  to  any- 
body else,  the  full  extent  of  my  warlike  disposition.  It 
has  been  growing  upon  me,  ever  since  the  news  of  the 
memorable  day  at  Aranjuez.  I  will  not  say  there  is  no 
inconsistency  between  my  present  views  of  the  question, 
and  those  which  induced  me  to  give  ray  vote  in  support 
of  Whitbread's  last  motion  for  peace  ;  but,  besides  hav- 
ing reflected  more  upon  the  whole  subject,  the  main 
parts  of  it  have  undergone  an  essential  alteration,  both 
by  the  immense  acquisitions  of  empire  which  Bonaparte 
has  made  since,  and  by  the  great  example  which  the 
poor  Spaniards  have  set  to  the  rest  of  the  world. 

Before  I  quit  the  subject,  I  ought  to  say,  that  it  would 
form  an  essential  part  of  my  plan  of  policy,  to  adopt 
Bonaparte's  kings,  without  disputing  their  title  ;  to 
teach  them  to  look  to  England  for  support,  if  they  have 
either  a  mind  to  show  themselves  ungrateful,  or  find 
him  too  exacting  in  the  gratitude  he  requires.  Berna- 
dotte,  therefore,  and  Joachim,  I  would  make  a  point  of 
gaining ;  as,  if  there  had  been  any  chance  of  assisting 
Louis  with  effect,  I  would  have  supported  him  in  resist- 
ance to  his  brother.  These,  I  will  own  at  the  same  time, 
are  operations  of  diplomacy,  requiring  more  talent  than 
I  am  afraid  we  possess  in  that  department,  and  a  more 
uniform  course  of  foreign  policy  than  we  are  likely  to 
see  pursued.  But  it  is  time  to  put  an  end  to  this  letter, 
which  your  kind  little  note  that  I  received  at  breakfast 
has  drawn  from  me. 

I  have  not  yet  read  your  review  of  Stewart  with 
sufficient  attention  to  judge  between  you,  which  I  mean 
to  do  with  as  much  impartiality  as  my  infirm  nature 


Mt.  33.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  53 

will  allow  of,,  though  I  shall  set  about  it  with  an  old 
opinion  on  Stewart's  side,  in  the  main  question  about 
which  you  differ.  I  was  much  pleased  with  the  just 
praise  you  have  bestowed  on  him ;  and  there  is  a  kind- 
ness in  the  particular  turn  of  those  praises,  which  satis- 
fies me  that  you  now  feel  what  sort  of  merit  his  is. 

With  regard  to  party  politics,  I  have  little  to  tell  you ; 
except  that  the  Prince  has  sent  for  Lord  Grenville,  and 
that  he  and  Lord  Grey  (who  comes  to  London  this  even- 
ing), are  the  persons  to  whom  he  will  apply  for  advice 
as  soon  as  he  is  Regent.  The  Prince  has  conducted 
himself  throughout  the  whole  transaction,  in  very  deli- 
cate circumstances,  with  eminent  propriety,  and  with 
perfect  honour  towards  the  Whigs  ;  who  had  in  truth  no 
right  to  consider  him  as  owing  any  obligation  to  them. 
Whether  the  King  will  ultimately  recover  or  not,  and 
whether  during  the  precarious  interval  of  a  regency 
administration,  any  good  can  be  expected  to  be  done,  is 
more  than  I  can  tell  you. 

I  am  really  obliged  to  you  for  reporting  to  me  what 
Brougham  has  said  of  me  ;*  not  only  because  I  love 
praise  dearly,  but  because  it  gives  me  more  pleasure  to 
hear  of  any  thing  like  partiality  in  Brougham  about  me 
or  any  thing  I  have  done,  than  even  if  I  could  be  con- 
vinced that  I  had  deserved  his  favourable  testimony. 
His  alienation  from  me,  for  reasons  which  I  never  have 
been  able  even  to  guess,  is  the  only  considerable  misfor- 
tune I  have  ever  suffered  in  my  life ;  and  it  would  take 
quite  a  load  off  my  mind,  if  he  would  give  me  a  hint  to 
catch  at,  for  forffettins;  that  I  ever  had  suffered  it.     I 

*  "  I  have  really  heard  a  great  deal  about  your  speech,  and  especiallv  from 
Brougham,  who  says  it  was  full  of  Instruction  and  sound  argument,  admirably 
delivered.  7'his  testimony  gave  me  a  feeling  of  very  unusual  delight ;  and  I 
think  it  will  please  you  to  hear  of  it."  —  Extract  from  a  Letter  of  Mr.  Jeffrey 
to  Mr.  Horner,  lAth  January^  1811.  —  Ed. 

5* 


54  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1811. 

have  always  cherished  a  hope,  that  we  may  in  time 
approximate  again. 

I  am  glad  to  hear  your  account  of  your  health.  Per- 
severe in  exercise  and  temperance  of  all  kinds.  I  shall 
rely  upon  having  a  letter  from  you  very  soon  ;  give  me 
that  gratification  next  week,  when  I  shall  be  suffering 
all  the  complicated  afflictions  of  frost,  and  absence  from 
London,  and  "  Crowner's-quest "  law.  I  go  down  to 
Wells  on  Sunday,  but  my  sure  address  is  always  here. 
Ever  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter   CLXV.    FROM  LORD  GRENVILLE. 
Dear  Sir  Camelford  House,  2 2d  January,  1811. 

I  have  waited  with  much  impatience  for  your 
return  to  town,  being  very  desirous  of  conversing  with 
you  on  a  subject  in  the  highest  degree  interesting  to 
myself  It  may  perhaps  save  some  time  if  I  take  this 
mode  of  mentioning  the  matter  to  you  generally,  re- 
questing at  the  same  time  that  you  will  allow  me  the 
opportunity  of  seeing  you  on  the  subject  to-morrow,  at 
any  time  that  may  suit  you  best.  I  shall  be  at  home 
the  whole  morning. 

There  is  some  question,  as  I  will  then  more  particu- 
larly explain  to  you,  of  the  formation  of  a  new  Ad- 
ministration. In  this  arrangement,  if  it  should  take 
place,  I  have  been  requested  to  resume  my  former  situ- 
ation at  the  head  of  the  Treasury,  and  Mr.  Tierney 
would,  in  that  case,  probably  be  Chancellor  of  the 
Exchequer. 

It  would  afford  to  me,  under  the  anxiety  inseparable 
from  such  a  prospect,  a  satisfaction  not  to  be  described, 
if  I  could  hope  to  persuade  you  to  assist  me  as  one  of 


iEx.  33.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  55 

the  Secretaries  of  the  Treasury.  I  do  not  mean  to  flat- 
ter you  when  I  say,  that  I  should  myself  feel,  and  I  am 
confident  such  would  be  the  universal  impression,  that  I 
had  in  that  way  secured  the  assistance  of  the  person  in 
all  England  the  most  capable  of  rendering  efficient  ser- 
vice to  the  public  in  that  situation,  and  of  lightening 
the  burthen  which  I  am  thus  to  undertake* 

Believe  me,  dear  Sir,  with  great  truth  and  regard. 

Most  sincerely  yours, 

Grenville. 


Letter  CLXVI.    TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 
My  dear  Murray,  London,  30th  January,  1811. 

I  received  your  last  kind  letter  when  I  was  at 
Wells ;  and  have  since  heard,  by  a  message  from  Syd- 
ney through  Whishaw,  that  the  poney  is  upon  the  road. 

Of  course  you,  who  know  me  so  well,  could  not  enter- 
tain any  apprehensions,  from  what  you  may  have  read 
in  the  newspapers,  that  I  was  likely  to  be  tempted  to 
take  a  political  situation.  I  wish,  however,  to  let  you 
know,  but  in  confidence  for  the  present,  that  I  have 
been  put  to  the  trial,  and  have  decided  without  any 
difficulty  to  adhere  to  the  rule  which  I  laid  dow^n  for 
myself  when  I  went  into  Parliament,  not  to  take  any 
political  office  until  I  was  rich  enough  to  live  at  ease 
out  of  office. 

There  is  a  high  probability  that  the  Regent  will  form 
a  new  administration,  though  the  point  is  not  yet  settled ; 
because  the  advice  he  has  received  upon  the  question  is 
made  to  rest,  upon  what  he  shall  find  to  be  the  real  con- 
dition of  the  King,  which  hitherto  has  been  concealed 
from  his  family,  and  studiously  involved  in  contradictory 

*  The  answer  to  this  letter  has  not  been  found.  —  Ed. 


56  CORRESrONDENCE.  [1811. 

and  false  reports.  My  own  conviction  is,  that  he  will 
be  found  so  far  from  the  appearance  of  a  probable  re- 
covery, that  the  Regent  will  take  his  measures  as  for  a 
permanency.  With  a  view  to  the  arrangement  that 
would  then  be  formed,  I  have  been  asked,  in  a  manner 
very  flattering  to  me,  to  undertake  the  office  of  financial 
secretary  of  the  Treasury ;  which  I  have  declined.  The 
opportunity  there  is,  at  present,  in  that  department,  of 
rendering  service  to  the  country,  both  in  meeting  the 
difficulties  which  are  coming  on  in  its  revenue,  as  well 
as  commercial  concerns,  and  in  conducting  to  a  proper 
result  the  discussions  which  have  been  stirred  respecting 
the  state  of  the  currency  ;  the  field  which  is  opened  by 
the  present  state  of  the  House  of  Commons ;  the  plea- 
sure of  having  a  man  in  whom  I  entirely  confide  for  my 
colleague,  and  the  gratification  of  accepting  office  with 
the  rest  of  one's  party,  at  a  moment  when  such  a  step 
is  attended  with  some  uncertainty  and  adventure  :  are 
considerations  which  would  have  strongly  tempted  me, 
if  I  had  permitted  myself  to  bring  into  doubt  the  pro- 
priety of  my  previous  resolution.  I  decided  therefore 
at  once,  and  of  course  consider  it  a  decision  for  life.  I 
beg  that  you  will  not  mention  what  I  have  now  told 
you,  for  obvious  reasons. 

Affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 

Letter   CLXVI.*    TO   THE   HON.  MRS.   SPENCER. 
Dear  Mrs.  Spencer,  London,  February,  1811. 

I  saw  Ward  in  the  House  on  Tuesday,  not  look- 
ing ill  I  thought ;  but  I  was  not  aware  that  he  had  been 
unwell.  He  keeps  himself  at  such  a  distance  from  me, 
that  it  is  by  accident  only  I  ever  hear  of  him.     He  was 


^T.  33.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  57 

easily  alarmed  about  his  health  ;  and  has  a  most  excel- 
lent constitution. 

I  do  not  remember  any  thing  worth  your  reading  in  the 
two  volumes,*  after  the  life  of  Wolsey.  I  entirely  agree 
with  you  in  thinking  the  only  blemish  in  Sir  Thomas 
More's  perfections  was  his  being  too  good  a  Catholic. 
Yet  I  doubt  whether  he  was  sincerely  so,  to  the  full  ex- 
tent of  his  professions.  The  part  he  took  against  the 
reformation  appears  to  have  proceeded  in  some  degree 
from  an  apprehension  that  it  was  likely  to  endanger  the 
political  order  and  safety  of  Europe,  and  subvert  the 
institutions  of  society ;  for  the  whole  of  Christendom 
formed  at  that  time  one  state  under  the  Pope,  and  cast- 
ing off  his  supremacy  was  a  revolution  of  which  the  im- 
mediate effects  were  very  hurtful  to  the  quiet  and  pros- 
perity of  every  nation  ;  and  it  required  a  very  firm  eye 
to  see  beyond  them  the  remote  beneficial  consequences. 
I  have  sometimes  fancied  there  was  a  considerable  like- 
ness in  Sir  Thomas  More's  conduct  in  the  reformation  to 
Windham's  about  the  French  revolution  -,  they  were 
both  friendly  to  the  innovation  in  its  commencement, 
both  eager  liberty-boys  in  their  youth,  but  became  dis- 
gusted and  shocked  by  the  violence  to  which  it  led,  and 
could  not  endure  the  prospect  of  the  whole  system  of 
laws  and  government  undergoing  an  untried  change. 
There  are  other  traits  of  resemblance  that  one  migJit 
trace.  I  have  great  admiration  for  Margaret,  who 
seems  to  have  been  the  only  one  of  the  fiimily  worthy 
of  the  father.  I  am  in  no  hurry  to  have  the  books 
back. 

Ever  ftiithfully  yours, 

Fka.  Horner. 

*  Of  Wordsworth's  Ecclesiastical  Biography. 


58  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1811. 


Letter  CLXVI.**     TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 
Mj  dear  Murray,  Launceston,  26th  March,  1811. 

When  I  was  at  Exeter  last  week,  I  had  the 
pleasure  of  receiving  your  letter  from  Bruntisland ; 
which  has  since  furnished  me  with  several  agreeable 
meditations.  I  had  heard  nothing  before  of  the  Sheriff- 
ship of  Peebles-shire  ;  Montgomery's  conduct  was  most 
friendly  towards  you,  and,  in  a  public  point  of  view, 
liberal  as  well  as  judicious.  Your  own  conduct  has  been 
most  strictly  correct,  and  quite  worthy  of  yourself  and 
all  your  former  life  ;  the  sentiments  which  you  express 
regarding  the  judicial  nature  of  the  Sheriff's  office,  and 
the  impropriety,  on  the  part  of  a  professional  man,  in 
either  soliciting  it  or  accepting  it,  as  a  political  favour, 
or  refusing  it  when  conferred  without  solicitation,  appear 
to  me  sound,  and  such  as  become  every  man  who  pur- 
sues the  profession  of  the  law  upon  just  and  honourable 
principles.  With  this  conviction,  it  will  seem  rather 
inconsistent  that  I  should  feel  a  sort  of  satisfaction  in 
reflecting  that  you  have  not  been  made  a  Sheriff  on  this 
occasion,  and  that  I  regard  it  as  an  escape  from  some 
danger ;  I  cannot  reason  myself  out  of  this  incorrect 
feeling  about  it,  and  therefore  I  own  it  to  you.  At  first, 
I  disliked  that  there  should  have  been  a  chance  of  your 
owing  any  promotion  to  those  whose  public  conduct  you 
condemn ;  but  I  satisfied  myself,  that  your  view  of  the 
nature  of  the  Sheriff's  place  was  more  proper,  and  that, 
by  the  manner  in  which  you  gave  your  answer  to  Sir 
James's  proposal,  you  had  clearly  guarded  yourself 
against  any  mistake  on  that  head.  But  what  I  cannot 
dismiss  from  my  mind  is,  an  apprehension  that  your  con- 
duct would  not  have  been  universally  understood ;  be- 


jEt.  33.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  59 

cause  the  motives  upon  which  you  would  have  acted  in 
accepting  the    place,  are  not  such  as  the  vulgar  can 
readily    apprehend.       One    of    the    lamentable    conse- 
quences of  the  manner  in  which  the  patronage  of  Scot- 
land has  so  long  been  dispensed,  is,  that  it  is  hard  for  a 
man  to  act  up  to  his  own  standard  of  public  duty,  who 
wishes   to    command   the    means  of  rendering  service 
to  the  public  by  the  weight  of  a  character  not  only 
pure,  but  never  questioned.     A  part  of  Lord  Melville's 
policy,  in  managing  his  burgh  of  Scotland,  has  been  to 
make  Sheriffships  political  gifts ;  and  in  this  he  has  suc- 
ceeded so  well,  and  with  respect  to  judicial  offices  indeed 
of  a  higher  rank  than  the  Sheriff's,  that  the  vulgar  here 
almost  forget  that  they  are  judicial,  and  regard  them 
much  in  the  same  light  as  he  does,  who  has  so  degraded 
them.     The  present  rancour  and  illiberality  of  political 
differences  make  the  vulgar  a  much  more  numerous  and 
powerful  body,  than  they  have    been  in  better  times ; 
and  one  of  the   evils  of  their  ungenerous  domination 
over  public  sentiment  is,  that  the  sphere  within  which 
a  man  may  turn  his  talents,  knowledge,  and  integrity  to 
the   public  service,  is  contracted,  by  the   necessity  of 
guarding  against  possible  imputations,  and  his  real  use- 
fulness diminished,  by  the  prudence  which  is  imposed 
upon  him,  of  foregoing  small  opportunities  of  being  ser- 
viceable, in  order  to  maintain  that  reputation  which  is 
to  be  the  means  of  doing  greater  service.     I  will  not 
say  that  there  is  nothing  strained  in  this,  to  apologize 
for  a  feeling  about  this  recent  affair  of  yours,  which  I 
cannot  justify  upon  sounder  and  plainer  reasons. 

But  1  could  not  have  boine  any  reflections  to  have 
been  made  upon  your  conduct  if  the  place  had  been 
conferred  as  it  ought,  though,  for  myself,  I  knew  it  to 
have  been  inflexibly  right ;  and  although  I  allow  it  to 


(JQ  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1811. 

be  a  species  of  cowardice,  which  I  have  caught  from  the 
present  tone  of  the  pubUc,  with  respect  to  public  situ- 
ations, yet  I  am  more  satisfied  upon  the  whole  that  you 
have  not  been  named  to  the  office  which  you  so  well 
merited.  I  am  perfectly  aware  that  this  sort  of  self- 
denial  may  be  carried  a  great  deal  too  far,  and  that  the 
public  interests  are  permanently  injured  by  the  back- 
wardness of  men  of  the  higher  caste  to  accept  of  official 
places ;  but  I  am  well  pleased  it  has  so  happened,  that 
you  have  not  been  made  a  sacrifice.  I  am  much  pleased 
with  the  prospect  of  seeing  you  in  town,  though  it  will 
be  for  so  short  a  visit.  I  am  glad  to  find  by  your  letter 
from  Bruntisland,  that  you  have  resumed  the  salutary 
practice  of  retreating  to  a  solitude  beyond  the  seas,  in 
the  intervals  of  vacation.  Nothing  is  more  delightful 
or  more  beneficial  to  one's  mind,  than  solitude  so  en- 
joyed occasionally^,  both  in  raising  and  clearing  all  our 
views  of  life,  and  in  strengthening  our  best  attachments. 
I  have  never  so  much  of  your  company,  as  when  I  get 
a  fine  day  by  myself  in  the  country ; 

'  But  cliief,  when  evening  scenes  decay, 

And  the  faint  landskip  swims  away. 

Ever  very  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter   CLXVII.    TO   THE   HON.  MRS.  W.   SPENCER. 

My  dear  Mrs.  Spencer,  Lincoln's  Lm,  4th  May,  isii. 

I  have  allowed  too  many  days  to  elapse  without 
answering  the  kind  inquiries  you  made  in  your  last 
letter.  I  will  reply  to  all  your  questions,,  though  it  will 
cost  me  some  egotism.  I  did  next  to  nothing  upon  the 
circuit ;  but  that  was  not  worse  than  before  ;  I  have  no 


iET.  S3.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  01 

right  to  expect  success  yet.  I  am  getting  on  at  Sessions, 
which  is  the  step  that  leads  to  success  on  the  circuit ; 
and,  considering  every  thing,  I  have  got  on  better  than 
I  had  any  reason  to  expect.  It  is  a  very  slow  progress 
that  one  makes  in  my  profession,  according  to  the  usual 
routine  of  advancement ;  and  I  am  not  entitled  to  have 
miracles  wrought  in  my  favour,  nor  qualified  to  work 
miracles  myself  I  enjoy  a  very  happy  poverty,  and, 
though  I  shall  be  very  fond  of  advancement,  if  it  comes 
upon  me,  I  shall  not  repine  much  if  it  never  does.  I 
am  going  to  Sessions  at  the  end  of  this  week,  which  will 
keep  me  from  town  about  eight  or  ten  days ;  I  thought 
you  had  learned  what  these  are,  as  distinguished  from 
the  circuit.  Did  not  I  teach  it  you,  when  you  gave  me 
a  little  dinner  in  Curzon  Street,  before  setting  out  one 
winter  night  upon  one  of  these  irksome  journies  ?  I  do 
not  forget  any  thing  that  passed  upon  those  pleasant 
occasions,  which  I  often  bring  to  mind  as  among  the 
best  days  I  have  seen. 

My  mother  is  not  in  bad  health,  but  not  very  strong ; 
sea-bathing  always  does  her  good,  and  I  have  recom- 
mended Torquay  to  her,  as  so  very  beautiful  and  quiet. 
I  mean  to  pass  a  month  with  her  and  my  sisters  and  my 
father,  at  that  place  in  the  autumn ;  which  will  do  me  a 
great  deal  of  good  in  another  way :  they  are  all  so 
amiable,  and  my  sisters  out-growing  me  so  fast  in  under- 
standing and  reading,  that  I  shall  rub  off  some  of  the 
ignorance  that  one  contracts  in  the  business  of  London, 
and  some  of  the  selfishness  that  steals  upon  one  by  not 
living  with  other  people  very  intimately.  I  have  not  yet 
fixed  whether  I  shall  pass  September  at  Torquay,  or  Oc- 
tober.       ^_^_J^Vgr^^y  dear  Mrs.  Spencer, 

Most  truly  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 

VCTLai. 

!l9        .-       -: 


62  BULLION  REPORT.  [1811. 

The  great  discussion  on  the  Report  of  the  Bullion 
Committee  commenced  in  the  House  of  Commons  on 
the  6th  of  May.  The  Report  had  been  presented  to  the 
House  on  the  8th  of  June  preceding,  so  that  it  had  been 
in  the  hands  of  members  and  of  the  public  for  several 
months.  In  the  earlier  part  of  this  session  several  pro- 
ceedings had  taken  place  upon  the  subject,  preparatory 
to  the  chief  debate.  Thus,  on  the  20th  of  February,  Mr. 
Rose  *  asked  Mr.  Horner,  whether  it  was  his  intention  to 
proj^ose  any  legislative  measure  on  the  subject  of  the 
Report ;  and  if  it  was,  when  he  would  be  prepared  to 
introduce  the  question  for  discussion  ? 

Mr.  Horner  replied,  that,  "in  his  opinion,  the  docu- 
ments and  accounts  already  before  the  House  were 
amply  sufficient  to  enable  the  House  to  proceed  to  this 
investigation  without  the  production  of  any  further 
papers ;  —  that  he  believed,  however,  that  the  accounts 
lately  moved  for  would  require  some  time,  and  create 
some  difficulty  before  they  could  be  obtained ;  —  that 
he  should  therefore  wait  till  his  return  from  the  circuit, 
and  bring  the  subject  forward  early  in  April ;  —  and  that 
it  was  his  intention  to  'submit  a  legislative  measure, 
founded  on  the  Report  of  the  Committee ;  which  mea- 
sure would  be,  the  repeal  of  the  Bank  Restriction  Act." 

On  the  5th  of  April,  Mr.  Horner  stated  more  fully  the 
course  he  intended  to  take  ;  he  said,  that,  "  having  un- 
derstood that  his  honourable  and  learned  friend  (Mr. 
Abercromby)  had  given  a  notice  in  his  absence  of  his 
intention,  on  that  day,  to  fix  the  period,  and  declare  the 
mode  in  which  he  proposed  to  bring  forward  the  discus- 
sion upon  the  Report  of  the  Bullion  Committee,  he  now 

*  The  Right  Honourable  George  Rose,  Vice-President  of  the  Board  of 
Trade. 


jEt.  33.]  BULLION  REPORT.  (33 

rose  to  state  what  appeared  to  him  to  be  the  most  expe- 
dient course  of  proceeding.  In  the  first  place,  as  to 
the  mode  ;  it  had  been  his  earher  intention  to  move  for 
leave  to  bring  in  a  bill  for  the  repeal  of  the  Bank  Re- 
striction Act.  He  found  since,  on  consulting  with  some 
gentlemen,  to  wdiose  experience  of  parliamentary  busi- 
ness he  was  bound  to  pay  the  greatest  deference,  that 
the  most  advisable  mode  would  be,  to  submit  some  pre- 
vious resolutions,  expressive  of  the  general  opinion  of 
the  House  on  the  question  at  issue,  and  which  resolutions 
might  lay  a  foundation  for  a  subsequent,  and  more  con- 
clusive, series  of  measures.  He  apprehended  that  this 
would  be  done  in  the  best  manner  in  a  committee  of 
the  whole  House ;  and  if  the  right  honourable  gentle- 
man opposite  (the  Chancellor  of  the  Exchequer)  should 
entertain  a  similar  opinion,  he  was  desirous  of  making 
it  immediatel}^  an  order  of  the  day,  that  the  House 
should  go  into  a  committee  for  this  purpose  on  Monday 
the  29th  of  April.  If  there  should  be  any  objection  to 
this  suggestion,  he  begged  that  he  might  now  be  con- 
sidered as  giving  a  general  notice  on  the  subject  of  his 
intention  to  bring  on  the  discussion  very  soon  after  the 
recess.  As  to  the  consideration  of  time,  he  was  ex- 
tremely sorry  that  a  delay  of  such  duration  had  taken 
place  ;  but  he  trusted  that  when  the  nature  of  the  busi- 
ness in  which  parliament,  at  its  first  assembling,  had 
been  engaged,  was  remembered,  and  the  necessity  he 
was  under  of  attending  his  professional  avocations  in  the 
country,  he  should  stand  acquitted  of  blame.  Indeed, 
he  could  not  help  thinking  that  the  interval  which  had 
thus  been  suffered  to  elapse  would  be  far  from  proving 
productive  of  any  injurious  consequences  to  the  dis- 
cussion. It  had  been  alleged  that  the  causes  of  the  pre- 
sent condition  of  our  paper  currency  were  quite  of  a 


64  BULLION  REPORT.  [1811. 

temporary  nature,  and  it  might  therefore  be  well  to 
allow  the  force  of  this  argument  to  be  fairly  tried.  He 
had  hoped  for  an  opportunity  of  introducing  the  question 
on  some  day  before  the  recess  -,  but  as  the  present  was 
certainly  too  late  an  hour,  and  there  was  no  clear  day 
before  the  holidays,  he  would  propose,  if  the  course  he 
had  suggested  was  approved,  to  move.  That  the  Report 
of  the  Bullion  Committee  be  referred  to  a  committee  of 
the  wdiole  House,  on  Monday  the  29th  of  April." 

On  the  11th  of  April,  Mr.  Horner  stated  the  substance 
of  the  resolutions  which  he  intended  to  propose  in  the 
committee. 

"  The  main  purpose,"  he  said,  "  which  he  professed  to 
have  in  view,  was  to  embody  the  opinions  of  the  Bullion 
Committee  into  his  resolutions,  for  the  adoption  of  the 
House.  In  the  first  place,  he  would  state,  in  those  re- 
solutions, that  it  was,  from  time  immemorial,  the  cus- 
tom, law,  and  policy  of  the  coimtry,  that  the  standard 
should  be  of  the  lawful  coin  of  the  realm ;  that,  having 
thus  resolved,  then  it  would  be  his  object  to  propose 
that  a  deviation  was  apparent  in  the  present  currency, 
compared  with  the  actual  currency,  as  established  by 
law.  He  should  then  propose  to  state  w^hat,  in  his  opi- 
nion, was  the  cause  of  the  deviation  in  the  actual  cur- 
rency from  what  by  law  it  was  intended  it  should  be ; 
and  next,  to  state  what  appeared  to  be  the  recent  state 
of  the  foreign  exchanges ;  and  lastly,  he  should  submit, 
for  the  approbation  of  the  committee,  what  in  his  opin- 
ion appeared  best  calculated  to  remedy  the  evil  com- 
plained of." 

He  then  stated  the  various  regulations  imposed  by 
acts  of  parliament  from  the  time  of  Elizabeth,  to  the 
present  time,  for  settling  the  standard. 

"Upon  these  acts  he  should  propose   a  resolution, 


iEx.  33.]  BULLION  REPORT.  65 

stating,  that  the  only  legal  money,  which  can  pass,  is 
gold  and  silver,  as  declared  by  the  various  proclamations 
alluded  to,  with  a  reference  to  the  acts ;  and  that  such 
being  the  fact,  the  fall  or  deviation  in  the  currency  was 
occasioned  by  too  abundant  an  issue  of  paper  by  the 
Bank  of  England  and  country  bankers;  and  that  the 
only  security  for  the  country  was  to  convert  this  paper 
into  legal  currency,  at  the  option  of  the  holder,  at  the 
then  price  of  exchange ;  and  he  should  conclude  with  a 
resolution,  recommending,  as  expedient  and  necessary, 
the  amending  of  the  law,  which  authorises  the  Bank  of 
England  to  suspend  their  cash  payments.  These  were, 
he  said,  the  substantial  heads  of  his  resolutions ;  and  he 
trusted  that  if  gentlemen  on  the  opposite  side  were  dis- 
posed to  offer  any  thing  by  way  of  amendment,  they 
would  do  him  the  courtesy  to  make  him  acquainted  with 
the  substance  of  their  propositions  previous  to  the  day 
on  which  he  should  move  the  House  to  go  into  a  com- 
mittee." 

The  Chancellor  of  the  Exchequer  (Mr.  Percival)  ex- 
pressed his  acknowledgments  to  Mr.  Horner  for  the 
candour  of  his  communication^,  and  assured  him  that 
the  resolutions  he  intended  to  propose  would  be  met 
with  equal  candour  on  that  side  of  the  House. 

On  the  24th  of  April,  Mr.  Vansittart  *  stated  his  in- 
tention to  propose  a  series  of  resolutions  on  the  subject 
of  the  Bullion  Report,  in  case  those  of  his  friend  Mr. 
Horner  should  not  be  adopted. 

On  the  3 0th  of  April,  the  Committee  of  the  whole 
House  was  postponed  to  the  6th  of  May.  Mr.  Horner 
on  that  occasion  stated,  — "  that  he  was  perfectly  pre- 
pared to  go  into  the  discussion  at  any  time ;  but  as  the 

*  Nicholas  Vansittart,  Esq.,  afterwards  Chancellor  of  the  Exchequer,  the 
present  Lord  Bexley. 

6* 


6(3  BULLION  REPORT.  [1811. 

counter-resolutions  of  Mr.  Vansittart  were  founded  upon 
an  extensive  mass  of  evidence,  which  it  would  be  im- 
possible for  gentlemen  to  decide  upon  justly,  without 
making  themselves  acquainted  with  that  evidence  par- 
ticularly, he  thought  the  delay  would  be  useful." 

Mr.  Horner's  speech  on  the  6th  of  May  occupied  three 
hours  in  the  delivery ;  and  he  concluded  by  moving  a 
series  of  resolutions,  sixteen  in  number.  The  debate 
was  adjourned  at  half-past  one  in  the  morning :  it  was 
resumed  next  day,  and  the  following,  and  was  brought 
to  a  close  on  the  fourth  day,  when  Mr.  Horner  replied. 
His  resolutions  were  lost  by  a  majority  of  76,  —  75  vot- 
ing in  favour  of  them,  and  151  against  them.  A  second 
division  took  place  on  the  last  of  the  resolutions,  —  viz. 
"That  in  order  to  revert  gradually  to  this  security, 
(against  an  excess  of  paper  currency,  and  for  maintain- 
ing the  relative  value  of  the  circulating  medium  of  the 
realm,)  and  to  enforce  meanwhile  a  due  limitation  of 
the  paper  of  the  Bank  of  England,  as  well  as  of  all  the 
other  bank  paper  of  the  country,  it  is  expedient  to 
amend  the  act  which  suspends  the  cash  payments  of  the 
Bank,  by  altering  the  time,  till  which  the  suspension 
shall  continue,  from  six  months  after  the  ratification  of  a 
definitive  treaty  of  peace,  to  that  of  two  years  from  the 
present  time."  This  resolution  was  negatived  by  a  ma- 
jority of  135,  —  45  voting  for  it,  and  180  against  it. 

A  few  days  afterwards,  Mr.  Vansittart  brought  for- 
ward his  counter-resolutions,  and  at  the  close  of  the  de- 
bate upon  them,  Mr.  Horner  moved  his  own  resolutions 
as  an  amendment,  for  the  purpose  merely  of  having 
them  entered  on  the  Journals. 

I  have  thus  given  a  summary  of  what  took  place  in 
the  House  of  Commons  on  this  celebrated  question,  be- 
cause of  the  prominent  part  which  Mr.  Horner  bore  in 


2Et.  33.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  67 

the  inquiry  and  discussion ;  and  it  is  sufficient,  I  believe, 
to  give  a  give  a  general  view  of  the  opinions  he  held, 
and  the  conclusions  to  which  he  had  come,  at  this  period, 
upon  this  difficult  and  intricate  branch  of  political  econ- 
omy. The  limits  assigned  to  this  work  prevent  me  from 
doing  more ;  and  if  there  are  any  who  now  feel  disposed 
to  investigate  the  history  of  the  proceedings  in  parlia- 
ment on  this  important  subject,  they  will  find  a  pretty 
full  report  of  Mr.  Horner's  speech,  and  the  resolutions 
he  moved,  in  Hansard's  Debates. 


Letter  CLXVIU.    TO  fflS  FATHER. 
Mv  dear  Sir  Lincoln's  Inn,  lOtli  May,  1811. 

I  have  been  prevented  from  writing  to  you  these 
few  days,  by  being  very  busy.  I  have  at  last  got  through 
my  share  of  the  bidlion  question,  which  we  have  had 
for  four  late  nights.  I  shall  take  very  little  charge  of 
what  remains  to  be  done  or  proposed.  Vansittart  is  to 
move  his  resolutions  in  the  committee  on  Monday,  on 
one  of  which  Tierney  will  move  an  amendment ;  amount- 
ing to  a  declaration  very  much  like  one  of  my  rejected 
resolutions,  that  the  Bank  ought  (during  the  restriction) 
to  keep  the  same  principles  in  view  which  limited  their 
notes  before,  and  implying,  farther,  the  princij)le  (some- 
what beyond  mine)  that  the  Bank  ought  to  consider  itself 
bound  to  be  ready  to  resume  cash  payments  at  the  ear- 
liest notice.  I  hardly  think  that  I  shall  urge  any  of  the 
amendments  upon  Vansittart's  resolutions,  which  I  print- 
ed some  time  ago ;  my  chief  purpose  in  circulating 
them  was  to  have  a  concise  counter  statement  of  facts 
in  the  hands  of  members  before  the  debate.  I  have 
nothing  further  to  do,  so  far  as  I  am  at  present  con- 
cerned with  the  question,  but  to  move  my  resolutions 


6g  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1811. 

again  in  the  House,  for  form's  sake,  that  they  may  be 
put  upon  the  Journals. 

The  divisions  were  better  than  I  expected,  particularly 
upon  the  last ;  that  division  I  took  at  a  venture,  contra- 
ry to  the  wishes  of  some  who  left  me  :  but  I  am  satisfied 
that  good  has  been  done  by  getting  the  forty-five  names 
which  I  shall  have  to  show  for  that. 

One  is  very  apt  to  fancy  the  best  of  the  argument  on 
one's  own  side ;  and  I  am  indulging  myself  at  present 
in  that  belief  It  seems  to  me  that  a  very  important 
impression  has  been  made  upon  the  House  by  the  dis- 
cussion, such  as  will  not  soon  be  worn  out,  and  will  be  a 
ground-work  for  a  future  attempt  of  the  same  sort,  to 
cure  this  great  disorder.  It  is  very  creditable  to  the 
House,  that  so  tedious  a  debate  upon  so  uninviting  a 
subject  was  heard  with  much  attention,  and  without 
any  impatience ;  nothing  perhaps  could  prove  more 
strongly,  that  however  the  votes  have  gone,  from  timidi- 
ty, as  well  as  from  the  usual  motives  that  make  majori- 
ties, there  is  a  general  persuasion  that  something  of 
importance  to  every  man's  own  private  concerns,  as 
well  as  the  public  interests,  was  involved  in  the  question. 

The  best  speech  was  Canning's,  which  astonished  every 
body,  by  the  knowledge  which  he  showed  of  the  sub- 
ject, which  must  be  a  very  unpalatable  one  to  him,  and 
by  the  business-like  manner  in  which  he  treated  it ;  he 
had  all  his  fancy  and  wit  about  him  too,  and  played 
with  the  most  knotty  subtilties  of  the  question  as  easily 
as  if  it  had  been  familiar  to  him. 

Ever  most  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 

P.  S.  Brougham  made  a  speech  in  the  Court  of  King's 
Bench  yesterday  which  is  highly  commended. 


^T.  33.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  .  gg 


Letter   CLXIX.     FROM  THE  REV.  T.  R.  MALTIIUS. 
My  dear  Horner,  E.  I.  College,  Hertford,  12tli  May,  1811. 

I  congratulcate  you  most  sincerely  on  your  two 
very  able  and  eloquent  speeches,  which  I  hear  from  all 
quarters  far  exceeded  what  could  possibly  have  been 
expected  from  the  subject.  I  wonder,  indeed,  how  you 
could  contrive  to  treat  a  question,  necessarily  involving 
so  many  dry  details,  in  a  manner  which  seems  to  have 
so  completely  commanded  the  attention  of  your  hearers. 
It  is  impossible  that  the  discussion  should  not  do  good ; 
and  I  have  no  doubt  that  you  have  convinced  many  who 
voted  against  you. 

I  am  somewhat  surprised  at  Tierney,  and  hope  he  will 
do  better  on  the  debate  upon  Vansittart's  propositions, 
in  which  I  hear  he  means  to  propose  some  amendments. 

We  shall  rely  upon  seeing  you  and  Whishaw  on  Sat- 
urday. 

Ever  truly  yours, 

T.  EoB^-  Malthus. 

Letter  CLXX.     TO  HIS  FATHER. 
Mv  dear  Sir  Lincoln's  Inn,  IGtli  May,  1811. 

My  mother  rather  expected  a  letter  from  you 
this  morning ;  she  called  here  on  her  way  to  the  exhi- 
bition, to  which  she  has  taken  some  of  her  young  friends. 
She  is  remarkably  well. 

I  have  at  last  got  rid  of  bullion ;  the  country,  I  fear, 
will  not  get  rid  of  the  necessity  of  resuming  the  ques- 
tion very  soon.  So  far  as  the  mere  votes  of  the  House 
of  Commons  go,  mischief  has  been  done  by  the  parlia- 
mentary discussion ;  for  we  have  concluded  by  two  re- 


70  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1811. 

solutions,  one  of  which  misrepresents,  in  a  very  danger- 
ous manner,  the  prerogative  of  the  King  over  the  stand- 
ard of  money,  and  the  other  is  a  ridiculous  evasion  of 
the  fact  of  depreciation.  They  will  probably  give  birth 
to  a  new  host  of  pamphlets.  But,  in  another  point  of 
view,  the  impression  made  upon  the  public  mind,  as  to 
the  importance  of  the  question,  I  believe  much  good 
has  been  done ;  in  the  House,  it  was  manifest,  that  we 
established  unanswerably  our  conclusions,  though  the 
apprehensions  naturally  excited  by  such  a  statement, 
and  magnified  by  the  obscurity  in  which  most  persons 
find  themselves  upon  such  a  subject,  make  them  dread 
the  effect  of  confessing  its  truth.  I  hear,  also,  that  there 
has  been  a  considerable  change  in  the  sentiments  of  the 
city.     You  must  be  sick,  however,  of  this  business. 

The  King  has  been  materially  worse  in  point  of  bodily 
health  lately,  and  the  delusions  of  his  mind  are  said  to 
recur  still  very  frequently.  The  ministers  speak  rather 
diffidently  now  of  his  ultimate  recovery,  though  the 
physicians  are  as  ready  as  ever  to  swear  to  it.  The 
session  of  parliament  will  probably  be  drawn  out  till 
after  the  first  w^eek  of  July,  when  there  will  be  another 
quarterly  Report  from  the  Queen's  counsel.  He  com- 
plains very  much  of  being  under  petticoat  government, 
and  is  much  puzzled  to  make  out  why  he  should  be  sub- 
jected to  this  thraldom  at  present,  when  he  says  he  is 
not  worse  than  he  has  been  for  years.  Such  are  the 
stories.  There  was  a  very  affecting  proof  of  his  melan- 
choly state,  given  last  week  at  the  concert  of  ancient 
music ;  it  was  the  Duke  of  Cambridge's  night,  who  an- 
nounced to  the  directors  that  the  King  himself  had  made 
the  selection.  This  consisted  of  all  the  finest  passages 
to  be  found  in  Handel,  descriptive  of  madness  and  blind- 
ness ;  particularly  those  in  the  opera  of  Samson ;  there 


JEx.  33.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  >ji 

was  one,  also,  upon  madness  from  love,  and  the  lamen- 
tation of  Jephtliali  upon  the  loss  of  his  daughter ;  and 
it  closed  with  God  save  the  King,  to  make  sure  the  ap- 
plication of  all  that  went  before.  It  was  a  very  melan- 
choly as  well  as  singular  instance  of  sensibility ;  that  in 
the  intervals  of  reason  he  should  dwell  upon  the  worst 
circumstances  of  his  situation,  and  have  a  sort  of  indul- 
gence in  soliciting  the  public  sympathy. 

I  am  very  happy  to  hear  that  you  mean  to  take  a 
little  excursion  into  the  Highlands ;  it  is  a  charming  sea- 
son for  it.  I  am  going  down  with  Whishaw  for  two 
days  to  visit  Malthus  in  Hertfordshire,  and  hear  his 
nightingales;  we  shall  go  on  Saturday.  You  will  be 
comforted  to  hear  that  Leonard's  little  Mary  is  almost 
quite  well  again. 

Ever,  my  dear  Sir, 

Most  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CLXX.*    TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 
My  dear  Murray,  Lincoln's  inn,  24th  May,  isn. 

I  heard  of  the  President's*  sudden  death  yester- 
day ;  by  some  means,  the  intelligence  reached  London 
before  it  could  have  been  brought  by  the  post.  It  is 
impossible  to  figure  any  loss  by  which  Scotland  could 
have  suffered  so  deeply,  as  by  this  afilicting  event ; 
whether  what  we  have  actually  been  deprived  of  be 
considered,  or  what  we  have  to  place  in  Mr.  Blair's 
room.  I  had  no  personal  acquaintance  with  him,  and 
have  had  no  opportunity  of  seeing  him  in  his  judicial 
situation,  but  I  have  long  felt  the  greatest  admiration 

*  Robert  Blair,  Lord  President  of  the  Court  of  Session^in  Scotland. 


72  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1811. 

for  his  manly,  venerable  character,  and  have  indulged 
the  most  agreeable  expectations  of  the  beneficial  influ- 
ence which  his  administration  of  the  law  would  have 
upon  the  jurisprudence  and  upon  the  public  mind  of  his 
country. 

Short  as  his  Presidency  has  been,  I  cannot  but  cherish 
a  belief,  that  he  has  left  a  permanent  imjoression.  His 
example  will  remain,  a  pattern  for  those  who  have  been 
most  sensible  of  his  merits,  and  who  may  hereafter  have 
a  similar  opportunity  of  labouring  in  the  pubHc  service ; 
and  his  name  and  memory  may,  even  in  the  meanwhile, 
be  some  check  on  those  unworthy  ones,  who  are  likely 
to  be  his  immediate  successors.  What  a  fortunate  and 
enviable  close  of  such  a  life,  and  how  suitable  a  reward, 
if  one  may  venture  to  say  so,  of  that  long  tenor  of 
purity  and  loftiness  of  conduct,  that  he  should  be  allowed 
to  withdraw  himself,  without  an  interval  of  decay,  while 
his  reputation  was  still  growing. 

The  conduct  of  the  bar  upon  this  occasion  does  them 
great  honour,  and  I  must  own  that  what  you  mention  of 
Lord  Craig's""  firmness  has  quite  affected  me.  In  his 
languishing  condition,  the  fame  and  usefulness  of  his 
great  friend,  and  the  prospect  of  their  continuance  long 
beyond  the  period  of  his  own  life,  must  have  been  the 
chief  circumstance  on  which  he  could  look  with  any 
pleasure,  and  the  loss  of  all  this  will  leave  nothing  to 
him  but  gloom.  With  the  sensibility  which  has  always 
depressed  and  enfeebled  him,  it  required  no  common 
portion  of  virtue  to  assume  on  such  a  day  a  decent  com- 
posure. 

The  statue  will  perhaps  be  erected  at  the  expense  of 
the  Faculty  as  a  corporation.     If  it  should  be  done  by 

*  One  of  the  Judges. 


iEx.  33.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  73 

the  subscription  of  inclividuals,  or  if  there  should  be  a 
subscription  in  the  Faculty  among  the  members,  3'ou 
will  not  forget  that  I  am  one,  and  I  beg  you  will  do  for 
me  what  you  do  yourself  You  ought  to  have  it  exe- 
cuted by  Westmacot,  who  has  much  more  talent  than 
any  other  artist  of  the  present  day.  I  am  much  pleased 
with  what  you  report  to  me  of  Moneypenny's'-'  conversa- 
tion with  Jeffrey ;  it  is  a  proof  how  little  Jeffrey  and  I  met 
lately,  that  he  did  not  tell  me  of  this,  as  he  is  always 
ready  to  do  justice  to  those  whom  party  separates  from 
him.  This  sort  of  candour  and  manly  difference,  which 
is  far  more  practicable  in  party  hostilities  than  is  com- 
monly imagined,  would  disarm  them  of  all  the  ill  they 
are  attended  with,  and  would  give  double  efficacy  to 
the  good  and  utility  which  the  public  derives  from 
parties. 

Most  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CLXXI.    TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 
Mv  dear  MurraV  Lincoln's  inn,  29th  May,  1811. 

In  my  last  letter,  I  omitted  to  give  you  an  answer, 
as  to  my  intentions  with  respect  to  the  publication  of 
the  speeches  I  made  on  the  bullion  question.  All  the 
reluctance  which  I  felt  about  exposing  myself  in  that 
shape  to  the  public,  has  been  so  powerfully  seconded  by 
my  indolence,  that  if  I  had  any  longer  resolution  enough 
to  attempt  it,  it  would  not  be  in  my  power.  I  must  be 
content,  therefore,  with  such  treatment  as  the  newspaper 
reporters  have  bestowed  upon  me,  and  as  I  did  not  read 
these  at  the  time,  I  shall  know  nothing  of  them  till  Cob- 

*  After\Yards  Lord  Pltmilly,  one  of  the  Judges  of  the  Court  of  Session. 
VOL.  II.  7 


Y4  CORRESPONDENCE.  •       [1811. 

bett's  debates  are  published.  The  principal  grounds 
upon  which  I  rested  the  resolutions  that  I  proposed  to 
the  House,  are  contained  in  the  Keport,  and  are,  indeed, 
old  and  well  established,  not  only  in  the  political  writers 
of  this  country,  but  in  the  policy  itself  of  our  laws ; 
there  is  nothing  new,  therefore,  to  record.  Some  points 
in  the  theory  of  money,  and  in  the  scientific  expla- 
nation of  some  of  its  principles,  are  still,  indeed,  but  ill 
settled ;  though  not  so  as  to  affect  materially  the  prac- 
tical conclusions,  belonging  to  our  present  question.  I 
have  sometimes  had  thoughts  of  writing  a  short  essay 
upon  these  speculative  parts  of  the  subject,  and  men- 
tioned it  to  my  father,  who  seems  to  have  misunderstood 
my  intention.  As  for  the  practical  question  now  de- 
pending, I  shall  confine  myself  to  the  parliamentary 
discussion  of  it.  With  respect  to  Rose's  misrepresenta- 
tions, it  would  be  endless  and  discreditable  to  engage  in 
a  controversy  of  facts  with  him ;  he  did  not  mention  a 
single  error  of  the  least  consequence  in  the  statements 
of  the  Report,  though  I  could  have  helped  him  to  some, 
and  it  is  ludicrous  to  scrutinise  a  paper  of  that  sort  as  if 
it  were  a  laboured  composition. 

It  is  very  good  in  you  to  acquiesce  in  my  arrange- 
ment for  the  early  part  of  the  vacation  ;  after  the  12th 
of  October,  I  shall  consider  myself  entirely  at  your  dis- 
posal, in  whatever  way  you  like,  and  shall  think  you 
dispose  of  me  very  well  if  you  summon  me  to  Edin- 
burgh. 

Ever,  my  dear  Murray, 

Faithfully  and  affectionatel}^  3^ours, 

Era.  Horner. 


^T.  33.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  ^5 


Letter    CLXXII.     TO   THE   HON.  MRS.   W.    SPENCER. 

My  dear  Mrs.  Spencer,  Friday,  May,  1811. 

Here  is  another  letter  from  Willj,  and  I  have 
sent  yours  to  his  captain. 

I  am  dehghted  with  your  account  of  Tunbridge,  that 
is  Rastal  Common,  which  I  always  thought  the  finest 
part  of  it.  In  this  beautiful  season,  and  especially  after 
the  business  of  Brighton,  it  must  be  quite  a  luxury  to 
you.  Pray  keep  it  up  till  I  come.  I  find  that  the  3d 
and  4th  of  next  month  are  holidays,  and  the  2d  is  a 
Sunday ;  I  propose  to  come  then,  and  take  up  my  resi- 
dence at  the  little  hotel  at  Tunbridge  Wells,  if  that 
time  will  suit  you. 

I  am  amused  with  your  interrogatory  to  me  about  the 
nightingale's  note.  You  meant  to  put  me  in  a  dilemma, 
with  my  politics  on  one  side,  and  my  gallantry  on  the 
other.  Of  course  you  consider  it  as  a  plaintive  note  ; 
and  you  were  in  hopes  that  no  idolater  of  Charles  Fox 
would  venture  to  agree  with  that  opinion.  In  this  diffi- 
culty, I  must  make  the  best  escape  I  can,  by  saying  it 
seems  to  me  neither  cheerful  nor  melancholy  ;  but 
always  according  to  the  circumstances  in  which  you 
hear  it,  the  scenery,  your  own  temper  of  mind,  and  so 
on.  I  settled  it  so  with  myself  early  in  this  month, 
when  I  heard  them  every  night  and  all  day  long  at 
Wells.  In  daylight,  when  all  the  other  birds  are  in  con- 
cert, the  nightingale  only  strikes  you  as  the  most  active, 
emulous,  and  successful  of  the  whole  band.  At  night, 
especially  if  it  is  a  calm  one,  with  light  enough  to  give 
you  a  wide  indistinct  view,  the  solitary  music  of  this 
bird  takes  quite  another  character,  from  all  the  associ- 
ations of  the  scene,  from  the  languor  one  feels  at  the 


76  '  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1811. 

close  of  the  day,  and  from  the  stilhiess  of  spirits  and 
elevation  of  mind  which  come  upon  one  walking  out  at 
that  time.  But  it  is  not  always  so ;  different  circum- 
stances will  vary  in  every  possible  way  the  effect.  Will 
the  ni<>;htino;ale's  note  sound  alike  to  the  man  who  is 
going  on  an  adventure  to  meet  his  mistress,  supposing 
he  heeds  it  at  all,  and  when  he  loiters  along  upon  his 
return  ?  The  last  time  I  heard  the  nightingale,  it  was 
an  experiment  of  another  sort ;  it  was  after  a  thunder- 
storm, in  a  wild  night,  while  there  was  silent  lightning 
opening  every  few  minutes,  first  on  one  side  of  the 
heavens,  then  on  the  other ;  the  careless  little  fellow 
was  piping  away  in  the  midst  of  all  this  terror :  there 
was  no  melancholy  in  his  note  to  me,  but  a  sort  of  sub- 
limity ;  yet  it  was  the  same  song  which  I  had  heard  in 
the  morning,  and  which  then  seemed  nothing  but  bustle. 
I  suspect  I  have  been  quite  sentimental  upon  this 
most  trite  of  all  subjects;  by  the  way,  if  you  should  tell 
me  so,  I  will  accuse  you  of  being  a  little  precieiise  in 
what  you  say  about  acquaintances  at  Tunbridge. 

Yours  ever, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CLXXIL*      TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 
My  dear  Murray,  Lincoln's  Inn,  24tli  June,  1811. 

I  wish  we  could  meet  and  have  a  gossip  upon  the 
present  state  of  things;  which  is  very  curious,  and  an 
excellent  subject  for  speculation  and  gossip.  Nothing  of 
importance  has  occurred  for  a  long  while,  in  the  domes- 
tic politics ;  but  the  little  circumstances  which  pass  daily 
and  accumulate,  give  one  by  degrees  a  sort  of  history, 
which  would  be  very  untruly  given  without  reporting 
all;  and  indeed  of  themselves,  by  their  accumulation  and 


^Et.  33.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  77 

gradual  effect,  work  a  change  in  the  position  and  ar- 
rangement of  political  persons.  Nothing  can  be  more 
whimsical  than  the  present  posture  of  what  are  still 
called  parties ;  and  the  anxious,  uncertain  state  of  many 
of  the  politicians,  of  all  descriptions.  I  expect,  that  the 
prorogation  of  parliament  will  be  the  signal  for  a  more 
active  course  of  intrigues  at  Carlton  House ;  which,  in  a 
certain  way,  have  been  going  on  a  long  while. 

I  believe  the  Regent  to  be  completely  in  the  hands 
of  Earl  Yarmouth  and  the  Duke  of  Cumberland  j  two  of 
the  worst  men,  in  point  of  principle,  public  and  private, 
that  are  to  be  found  in  this  or  any  other  country.  The 
Lord  Chancellor  is  intriguing  under  the  wings  of  the 
Duke  of  Cumberland ;  working  out  his  separate  salva- 
tion, and  betraying  Percival  (so  far)  just  as  he  betrayed 
the  Doctor  '^  in  1804.  The  Regent  courts  Lord  Grey, 
on  the  one  hand,  and  Sir  Francis  Burdett  on  the  other ; 
and  has  adopted  all  the  unjust  and  mean  prejudices  of 
the  higher  aristocrats  and  Windsor  against  Lord  Gren- 
ville ;  to  whom,  if  the  whigs  do  not  repay  (as  I  trust  and 
believe  they  will)  the  same  fidelity  which  he  has  observed 
since  their  coalition,  there  will  be  an  end  of  all  honour 
in  politics.  Cobbett's  silence  about  the  Duke  of  York, 
which  finally  settles  his  character  in  point  of  honesty,  is 
said  to  turn  upon  some  expectations  which  have  been 
held  out  to  him  of  a  remission  of  his  sentence ;  he  is 
said  to  have  been  talked  to  by  Denis  O'Brien,  who  is  the 
friend  of  Bate  Dudley,  who  is  the  friend  of  Sheridan, 
who  is  the  friend  of  the  Prince  Regent.  Cobbett  said 
he  would  not  pledge  himself,  but  has  been  silent  on  the 
subject.  Do  not  be  surprised,  therefore,  if  Cobbett  lies 
on  in  gaol ;  and  in  the  end  betrays  the  whole  communi- 
cation, and  reviles  the  Duke  of  York  and  the  House  of 

*  Lord  Sidmouth. 
7  * 


78  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1811. 

Commons.  I  think  it  would  have  been  a  fair  measure 
for  popularity,  to  have  given  an  amnesty  to  all  the  state 
libellers,  with  whom  the  King's  Bench  has  crowded  the 
prisons  ;  but  such  negotiations  with  individuals,  and 
making  terms  on  the  part  of  the  sovereign  with  those 
whom  the  law  has  convicted,  are  not  merely  a  great  im- 
propriety, but  must  give  those  unprincipled  and  fero- 
cious persons  such  a  hold  over  a  nervous  mob-led  mind, 
like  the  Regent's,  as  will  prove  embarrassing  to  him  in 
the  extreme. 

One  may  judge  of  a  favourite's  character  by  very 
slio'ht  circumstances.  From  what  I  saw  of  Earl  Yar- 
mouth,  and  heard  fall  from  him  at  the  fete  the  other 
night,  my  conclusion  was,  that  he  has  no  command  or 
possession  of  himself,  but  must  speedily  render  himself 
odious.  I  find  this  impression  very  general.  The  arro- 
gance and  assuming  vanity,  and  rudeness  of  his  man- 
ners, were  very  offensive.  We  shall  have  sport  with  him 
one  of  these  days,  unless  the  Prince  takes  fright  himself, 
before  we  have  an  explosion. 

Parliament  will  be  prorogued  next  week,  as  soon  as 
the  quarterly  report  is  made  by  the  Queen's  Council, 
which  is  to  sit  on  Tuesday  the  2d. 

Ever,  my  dear  Murray, 

Affectionately  yours, 

Era.  Horner. 

Letter   CLXXIII.      TO   LORD  GRENVILLE. 
TVJy  Tjord  Lincoln's  Inn,  28th  June,  1811. 

I  happened  to  be  waiting  at  the  bar  of  the  House 
of  Lords  yesterday,  when  Lord  Stanhope  presented  a 
Bill,  for  maintaining  and  enforcing  the  value  of  Bank 
of  England  paper ;  and  I  cannot  resist  the  wish  I  feel  to 


jEt.  33.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  79 

call  your  Lordship's  attention  to  the  great  importance 
of  what  passed  upon  that  occasion.  The  manner  in 
which  the  extraordinary  proposal  of  Lord  Stanhope  was 
received  by  Lord  Liverpool  and  the  Chancellor,  and  the 
opinions  which  the  former  intimated  upon  the  subject  of 
legal  tender,  convince  me,  that  the  ministers  have  had 
the  question  of  making  Bank  notes  a  legal  tender  under 
their  consideration,  and  that  they  are  prepared  to  take 
the  first  opportunity  of  effecting  that  momentous  change 
in  the  system  of  our  commercial  and  financial  economy. 
I  have  been  confirmed  in  the  same  conviction,  by  an 
expression  which  the  deputy-governor  of  the  Bank  used 
to  me,  just  before  the  debate  took  place,  in  talking  of 
Lord  King's  notice  to  his  tenants,  that  he  hoped  Govern- 
ment would  not  be  compelled  to  make  their  notes  a 
legal  tender.  The  directors  affect  to  deprecate  such  an 
alteration  of  the  law ;  but  they  look  to  it  as  their  ulti- 
mate protection,  against  the  necessity,  to  which  the  gen- 
eral adoption  of  Lord  King's  notice  by  landlords,  and  of 
such  actions  against  country  bankers  as  have  been 
brought  lately  in  the  "West  of  England,  would  compel 
the  Bank  of  limiting  its  issues  in  order  to  remove  the 
depreciation  of  its  notes.  It  appeared  to  me  yesterday, 
that  the  discussion  brought  on  by  Lord  Stanhope  gave 
the  ministers  an  opportunity,  not  merely  of  feeling  the 
pulse  of  the  House  upon  this  question,  but  of  making 
an  impression  favourable  to  such  an  expedient,  when 
they  shall  hereafter  bring  it  forward  •  and  I  cannot  but 
think  it  will  be  a  great  misfortune  to  the  public,  if  the 
session  of  parliament  closes  with  such  an  impression  as 
will  be  left  both  in  the  House  of  Lords  and  upon  the 
public  mind,  by  such  opinions,  stated  and  not  exposed, 
nor  protested  against,  by  those  who  have  most  weight 
and  authority.    The  several  successive  steps,  which  have 


80  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1811. 

been  observed  in  every  country  that  allowed  its  cur- 
rency to  fall  into  a  state  of  depreciation,  are  coming 
upon  us  faster  than  was  to  have  been  expected  in  this 
country ;  and  as  there  will  be  no  recovery  after  Bank 
notes  are  made  a  legal  tender,  the  discussions  which 
precede  such  a  measure  are  evidently  of  the  last  im- 
portance. 

I  take  it  for  granted,  that  Lord  King  will  attend  on 
Monday :  the  turn  which  was  given  to  the  debate  yes- 
terday renders  that  indispensable.  If  your  Lordship 
can  make  it  convenient  to  yourself,  to  take  a  part  in 
the  discussion,  I  am  persuaded  that  the  expression  of 
your  sentiments  will  be  of  most  essential  benefit  to  the 
public  interests  in  this  great  question,  and,  I  would 
even  flatter  myself,  might  deter  the  ministers  from  fol- 
lowing so  fast  that  course  of  measures,  into  which  their 
own  infatuation  and  the  ignorance  of  their  commercial 
advisers  seem  driving  them.  I  have  the  honour  to  be 
Your  Lordship's  most  faithful  and  obliged 

Fra.  Horner. 


The  session  of  parliament  terminated  on  the  11th  of 
July.  After  his  concluding  speech  on  the  bullion  ques- 
tion, on  the  15th  of  May,  Mr.  Horner  is  not  reported  as 
having  taken  a  part  in  any  other  subject  before  the 
House ;  and  in  the  early  part  of  the  session,  after  his 
speech  on  the  Regency,  there  are  only  short  notices  of 
his  having  spoken,  on  five  questions,  and  all  of  them  of 
minor  importance. 


iET.  34.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  81 


Letter   CLXXIV.    TO  HIS  BROTHER,  AT  MINEHEAD. 

My  clear  Leonard,  Torquay,  30th  August,  isii. 

I  received  the  enclosed  letter  this  morning. 
There  has  been  some  impatience  expressed  in  this 
house  to  hear  from  Minehead. 

I  am  engaged  at  present  in  reading  your  paper/"* 
which  I  have  not  sufficient  knowledge  of  external  char- 
acters to  get  on  with  very  rapidly.  But  I  am  very 
much  delighted  with  the  manner  of  it :  the  simplicity, 
plainness,  and  neatness  of  your  style  and  arrangement 
are  in  perfectly  good  taste,  and  quite  suited  to  your 
subject.  I  was  glad,  also,  to  see  that  you  had  preserved 
a  candid  and  philosophical  neutrality  between  contend- 
ing systems ;  a  circumstance  which  enhances  much  the 
value  of  your  observations.  Do  not  let  this,  however, 
prevent  you  from  studying  all  the  systems,  and  know- 
ing the  strong  and  weak  parts  of  each ;  for,  after  all,  a 
theory,  but  a  true  one,  is  the  only  legitimate  aim  of  all 
particular  observations  and  studies  of  nature,  which  end 
in  nothing  unless  they  serve  to  establish  general  conclu- 
sions :  a  remark,  indeed,  which  is  implied  in  what  }' on 
have  very  justly  and  well  expressed  at  the  close  of  your 
memoir.  I  cannot  tell  you,  my  dear  Leo,  how  much  I 
am  gratified,  and  how  much  my  vanity  and  self-impor- 
tance are  raised  by  this  success  of  yours,  which  is  so 
honourable  to  yourself,  and  which  lends  not  a  little 
credit  to  all  who  belong  to  you. 

I  forgot,  in  my  last  note,  to  say  what  success  I  had 
upon  the  last  circuit ;  it  amounted  to  little  or  nothing. 
I  have  not  lost  ground,  however,  but  rather  gained.  In 
my  own  county,  I  had  more  than  at  any  former  assizes ; 

*  On  the  ]Mineralo":y  of  tUc  IMalvern  Hills. 


32  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1811. 

and  at  Exeter,  I  led  one  cause,  not  a  considerable  one, 
but,  in  our  little  routine,  that  is  looked  upon  as  some- 
thing. I  scraped  together  about  half  the  amount  of  my 
expenses. 

You  have  little  notion  how  beautiful  a  scene  we  live 
in  here,  and  wdiat  walks  we  have  all  round.  To  increase 
the  temptation,  there  are  several  most  remarkable  junc- 
tions of  the  limestone  and  grauwacke  ;  the  former  of 
w^hich  is  quarried,  upon  the  face  of  the  coast,  in  several 
places.  Then  you  will  be  within  eight  miles  of  the 
Bovey  coal,  and  the  clay-pits,  and  w^ithin  a  dozen  of 
Dartmoor  granite. 

I  had  a  letter  this  morning  from  Sir  John  Newport, 
who  says,  that  the  Catholic  body  through  the  country 
are  coolly  and  determinately  identifying  themselves 
with  their  committee,  and  are  every  where  warmly 
supported  by  a  very  considerable  proportion  of  the 
Protestants. 

I  shall  be  glad  to  hear  what  you  are  doing.  If  you 
can  point  out  aii}^  stones  for  me  to  look  at  here,  or  to 
get  specimens  of  for  you,  I  ^^ill  try.  Give  my  kind 
remembrances  to  Anne.  My  mother  wishes  to  know 
how  the  bathing  agrees  with  our  dear  Mary. 

Affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Lktter  CLXXV.     to  his  BROTHER,  AT  MLNEHEAD. 
My  dear  Leonard,  Torquay,  3d  September,  1811. 

I  cannot  tell  you  how  much  we  are  delighted  at 
the  thoughts  of  your  bringing  Anne  here.  My  mother 
will  tell  you  the  particulars  as  to  lodging  and  living.  I 
shall  remain  here  till  the  6th  of  October,  when  I  must 
leave  it  for  the  sessions;  so  that  if  you  come  about  the 


^T.  34.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  83 

20tli,  we  shall  be  a  fortnight  together  —  ample  time  for 
me  to  show  you  many  delightful  walks,  and  for  you  to 
lecture  me  upon  junctions;  which,  as  far  as  I  can  pre- 
tend to  judge,  from  a  very  slight  and  ignorant  glance, 
must  be  well  worth  your  examination. 

The  quarries  have  exposed  several  broad  faces  of  the 
rock,  at  different  points  of  the  coast,  as  well  as  inland ; 
what  is  worked  is  the  limestone,  in  some  places  a  mar- 
ble; they  leave  what  they  call  slate,  and  which  they 
say  lies  above  it,  in  the  rotten  shivery  state  in  which  it 
appears  all  round  the  West  coast,  for  I  take  this  slate  to 
be  the  same  grauwacke  of  which  so  large  a  portion  of 
the  West  of  England  consists.  I  have  not  yet  gone  to 
the  junction,  described  by  Mr.  Playfair  in  his  book,  a 
little  to  the  south  of  Paignton,  where  he  says  the 
ancient  schistus  receives  a  covering  of  horizontal  red 
sandstone ;  this  is  what  I  wish  you  to  examine  particu- 
larly, in  order  to  ascertain  the  relation  which  the  lime- 
stone has  to  those  other  two  rocks.  It  is  a  compact 
limestone  of  a  very  dark  blue,  full  of  calcareous  veins ; 
it  must  be  the  same  which  Dr.  Berger  describes  be- 
tween Chudleigh  and  Ashburton,  and  it  would  be  im- 
portant to  trace  how  near  it  goes  up  to  Dartmoor.  Dr. 
Berger  does  not  appear  to  have  come  down  to  Torbay  ; 
and  it  would  appear  from  the  manner  in  which  Mr. 
Playfair  mentions  the  north  shore  of  the  bay,  that  he 
had  not  examined  the  whole  of  it.  Lord  Webb,  to  be 
sure,  must  know  it  all ;  for  he  lived  here  a  considerable 
time.  You  see,  therefore,  how  many  strong  reasons 
there  are  for  your  coming  over  to  this  coast,  as  soon  as 
you  have  done  with  grauwacke  on  the  north. 

I  doubt  very  much  whether  you  may  not  err  in 
choosing  the  siijle  of  Mr.  Playfair's  work  as  a  model  to 
be  imitated ;  if  you  mean,  by  style,  the  mere  structure 


g4  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1811 

of  sentences.  It  is  a  charming  style,  and  has  an  elo- 
quence well  suited  to  his  subject;  but  it  would,  for  this 
very  reason,  be  hazardous  to  imitate  it,  for  it  has  a  man- 
ner and  rhythm,  which  the  ear  easily  catches,  but  which, 
at  second  hand,  would  not  be  so  agreeable.  The  models 
to  imitate  are  always  those  of  the  simple  and  pure  sort ; 
if  there  is  to  be  a  manner,  and  it  is  better  avoided,  let 
it  be  your  own.  In  Mr.  Playfair's  composition,  there 
are  merits  of  another  sort,  which  you  can  never  suffi- 
ciently study,  and  labour  to  imitate  ;  of  these  I  shall 
speak  presently.  But  his  style,  like  that  of  Mr.  Stew- 
art, has  beauties  which  are  very  attractive,  but  which  it 
might  prove  very  pernicious  to  copy.  I  do  not  know 
any  one  English  author,  in  this  line  of  writing,  who  can 
be  mentioned  as  a  model;  you  must  make  yourself 
familiar  with  those  who  have  written  the  language  with 
the  greatest  purity  and  plainness,  for  if  you  can  handle 
the  genuine  idioms  of  the  true  English  dialect,  you  will 
always  write  well  on  a  subject  upon  which  you  are  in 
earnest.  The  great  thing  to  avoid  is  an  air  of  made 
sentences  ;  which  the  illustrations  of  the  Huttonian 
theory  have,  perhaps,  rather  too  much  recommended 
to  your  admiration.  The  little  that  I  read  of  Saussure, 
a  few  years  ago,  has  left  a  very  favourable  impression 
upon  me  ;  I  should  think  that  your  best  exercise  would 
be  to  translate  a  volume  of  his  travels,  and  make  a 
point  of  rendering  it  into  pure  English,  if  possible. 
There  is  a  little  work  of  natural  history,  the  style  of 
wdiich  I  have  always  admired;  "White's  Account  of 
the  Country  round  Selbourne ; "  he  is  an  excellent 
describer,  and  writes  in  good  taste. 

But  Mr.  Playfair's  work  deserves  to  be  perpetually  in 
your  hands,  for  its  merits  of  the  highest  order  in  philo- 
sophical composition.    Though  he  has  varnished  over  too 


^T.  34.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  g5 

partially  the  imperfections  *  of  Dr.  Hut  ton's  reasoning, 
respecting  tlie  hypothesis  of  a  central  fire,  and  in  this 
particular  has  probably  violated  the  rules  of  just  philo- 
sophy, yet  I  know  no  work  in  which  the  logic  of  induc- 
tive reasoning  may  be  learned  to  more  advantage  than 
in  the  Illustrations.  He  always  looks  at  his  great  sub- 
ject in  the  just  point  of  view,  and  sees  it  in  all  its  mag- 
nitude ;  the  precision  and  patience  with  which  he  de- 
duces his  reasonings  upon  the  most  minute  particulars, 
and  the  grandeur  with  which  he  comprehends  all  the 
distant  and  complicated  relations  of  the  whole  frame  of 
nature,  form  a  very  rare  union  of  philosophical  powers. 
And  this  work,  though  the  hypothetical  part  of  its 
theory  will  probably  be  in  a  great  measure  dismissed, 
when  our  knowledge  of  the  earth  is  more  extended, 
may  be  a  standard  at  all  times  to  be  referred  to,  both 
for  the  true  description  of  the  nature  and  object  of  geo- 
logical science,  and  for  the  rules  as  well  as  for  examples 
of  the  proper  method  of  forming  its  general  conclusions. 
You  mention  the  contortions  of  the  strata  of  grauwacke 
which  you  have  observed  at  Minehead ;  you  will  see 
some  of  the  same  sort  here,  and,  if  I  am  not  mistaken, 
similar  irregularities  in  the  limestone.  It  seems  to  me, 
that  sufficient  attention  has  not  yet  been  paid  by  geolo- 
gists to  these  appearances. 

Examine  the  limestone  at  "Watchet,  and  its  relation 
to  the  grauwacke  there  ;  that  you  may  compare  it  with 
the  limestone  here,  and  consider  whether  there  is  a 
similarity  in  the  relation. 

Here  is  a  whole  letter  upon  a  subject  of  which  I 
know  next  to  nothing  :  you  will  perhaps  look  upon  me 
as  somewhat  like  the  gentleman  who  gave  Hannibal  a 
lecture  upon  the  art  of  war.  My  secret  purpose,  how- 
ever, is  to  bring  you  here. 

VOL.   II.  8 


36  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1811. 

I  am  glad  to  hear  that  Mary  is  as  great  a  wonder  in 
bathing  as  in  every  thing  else.  We  all  long  to  see  her 
again.     With  kind  love  to  Anne. 

Affectionately  yours, 

Era.  Horner. 


Letter  CLXXVI.     TO  LORD  WEBB  SEYMOUR. 
My  dear  Seymour,  Torquay,  4th  September,  1811. 

I  fear  that  I  may  have  delayed  this  letter  too 
long,  for  its  reaching  Penrith  before  you ;  but  I  had 
some  expectation  of  hearing  from  you,  in  answer  to  my 
long  sceptical  ej)istle  about  conversions  and  deprecia- 
tion. 

I  have  been  now  ten  days  at  Torquay,  and  am  enjoy- 
ing my  leisure  very  much ;  delighted  with  the  beauty 
of  the  scenes  that  lie  all  round  within  short  walks,  and 
with  the  luxurious  amenity  of  the  climate.  My  father 
and  I  took  a  ride  yesterday  to  Stokeinhead,  one  of 
those  which  you  pointed  out.  Babbacombe  Bay,  and 
the  chain  of  little  coves  that  connect  it  with  Torbay, 
are  my  favourite  haunts. 

I  expect  my  brother  to  come  over  here,  when  he  has 
satiated  himself  with  grauwacke  at  Minehead ;  and  then 
I  expect  to  know  something  of  the  mineralogy  round 
the  bay,  which  seems  worthy  of  being  well  examined, 
in  order  to  trace  the  relation  which  the  slate,  limestone, 
and  the  horizontal  sandstone  mentioned  by  Mr.  Playfair, 
have  to  each  other.  If  you  can  find  an  idle  half  hour, 
I  wish  you  would  take  the  trouble  of  telling  us  what  to 
look  at  in  this  point  of  view.  Have  you  read  my  bro- 
ther's account  of  the  Malvern  hills,  which  I  have  been 
perusing.  Though  too  ignorant  of  fossils  to  enter  into 
it  fully ;  it  seems  to  me  written  with  great  neatness 


^T.  34.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  g'j' 

and  plainness,  and  with  considerable  candour  and  im- 
partiality between  contending  systems.  I  wish  you 
would  have  the  goodness  to  give  him  any  advice  that 
you  think  would  be  useful  to  him,  either  as  an  observer, 
or  as  a  reporter  of  his  observations.  For  it  is  likely 
that  he  will  pursue  this  study  in  the  same  way  for  two 
or  three  years  to  come,  and  he  has  every  disposition  to 
be  taught  and  improved.  Do  not  you  think  the  Geo- 
logical Society  are  in  a  right  track  for  improving  the 
science,  by  collecting  minute  local  descriptions  of  the 
surface  of  the  whole  country  ?  This  volume  of  their 
Memoirs  contains  one  or  two  papers  by  their  traveller. 
Dr.  Berger;  I  should  like  to  hear  what  you  think  of 
them. 

You  ask  me  to  tell  you  how  I  am  employing  my 
leisure.  Alas !  I  am  never  systematic  in  execution, 
though  abundantly  so  in  my  schemes.  Besides,  the 
air  and  scenery  in  which  I  live  at  present  are  so  agree- 
able, that  I  have  hardly  done  any  thing  since  I  came 
but  drink  the  light  by  sun  and  by  moon,  and  read 
Homer.  One  of  my  resolutions  was  to  go  through  the 
Iliad  ;  Greek  is  always  a  task  for  a  Scotsman ;  and  I 
rather  think  I  have  enjoyed  it  more  here,  and  read  it 
more  currently,  than  I  could  have  done  in  London. 
This  sea,  w^ith  its  beautiful  shores,  and  the  neighbouring 
mountain,  explain  him  better  than  a  score  of  scholiasts. 
I  have  another  set  of  books,  to  fill  me  with  meditations 
of  another  kind  :  Machiavel's  Discourses  on  Livy,  Mon- 
tesquieu's Greatness  and  Decline  of  the  Romans,  Hume's 
Political  Discourses,  and  Burke's  tracts  on  the  French 
Revolution.  I  have  read  them  at  different  times,  till 
they  are  quite  familiar ;  but  I  have  never  before 
brought  them  together,  so  as  to  compare  them,  and 
make  them  as  it  w^ere  sit  in  council,  in  my  hearing 
upon  the  same  points.     My  purpose  in  studying  them, 


88  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1811. 

is  to  apply  their  reasonings  to  the  awful  and  desperate 
circumstances  of  our  own  time,  and  to  apply  these  cir- 
cumstances to  their  reasonings.  I  have,  besides  all  this, 
brought  two  other  books,  which  I  do  not  know  that  I 
shall  find  time  to  open  ;  Playfair's  Illustrations,  and 
Paley's  Natural  Theology. 

You  thus  see  my  retreat  from  law  and  little  politics. 
In  my  volume  of  Hume's  Essays  there  are  two  which 
set  me  a  thinking  upon  some  of  your  speculations ;  that 
on  Tragedy,  and  that  on  the  Delicacy  of  Taste  and  Pas- 
sion, particularly  the  last.  I  wish  you  would  examine 
the  speculations  which  he  has  just  raised  in  these  two 
essays. 

Here  is  a  fact  for  you.  A  gentleman  whom  I  met 
with  about  three  weeks  ago,  told  me  he  was  present  at 
the  execution  of  a  man  upon  the  wheel,  at  Hanover, 
not  many  years  ago.  The  malefactor  was  a  soldier,  his 
crime  a  robbery  with  atrocious  violence.  He  knew  he 
was  condemned  to  die,  but  the  manner  of  his  death  was 
not  told  him  till  he  was  brought  upon  the  scaffold.  The 
person  who  gave  me  the  account  stood  very  near  him, 
when  it  was  communicated  to  him  that  he  was  to  be 
broke  on  the  wheel.  The  instantaneous  effect  upon  his 
mind  was,  that  he  looked  at  his  limbs,  his  arms,  his  legs 
—  one  after  the  other.  He  submitted  to  his  flite  with 
fortitude. 

Affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CLXXVL*     TO   J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 

My  dear  Murray,  Torquay,  uth  Sept.  isii. 

I  am  very  happy  to  have  got  some  intelligence, 
though  indirectly,  of  your  projected  journey.  Jeffrey  I 
hear  is  coming  to  London,  and  you  are  to  be  his  travel- 


JEt.  34.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  gg 

ling  companion.  This  is  a  most  agreeable  arrangement 
for  you.  You  will  get  to  London  before  the  next  quar- 
terly Report  about  the  King,  which  has  always  been  a 
period  of  much  political  gossip,  intrigue,  and  speculation; 
and  a  favourable  time  for  using  one's  eyes  and  ears. 
The  character  of  the  Regent  appears  to  be  now  tho- 
roughly developed  ;  he  has  evidently  none  of  the  ambi- 
tion, good  or  bad,  that  his  station  inspires  into  all  manly 
minds ;  but  is  as  devoid  of  activity  in  public  concerns, 
as  I  always  believed  him  to  be  of  public  principle.  The 
life  he  leads  is  one  of  stupid,  superannuated  profligacy, 
which  is  disturbed  by  fearful  anxieties,  lest  the  public 
should  discover  his  habits  and  haunts :  he  has  been  on  a 
visit  to  Lord  Hertford's,  at  Ragley,  and  the  newspapers 
were  all  carefully  cautioned  and  paid  to  make  no  men- 
tion of  it.  Instead  of  the  business  and  ardour  which 
w^ould  have  been  natural  to  a  man  in  the  vigour  of  life ; 
becoming  sovereign  of  such  a  people  as  this,  at  such  a 
moment  of  their  history,  nothing  is  known  of  him,  but 
such  languid  luxury,  and  effeminate  profusion,  as  we 
read  of  at  Paris,  in  the  last  years  of  Louis  XV. 

At  present  he  is  completely  under  the  management 
of  the  Duke  of  Cumberland  and  Lord  Yarmouth ;  of 
the  former  it  is  not  a  year  since  he  used  to  express 
openly  the  w^orst  opinion  ;  the  latter  is,  by  the  general 
opinion  of  every  body,  considered  to  be  one  of  the 
very  worst  men  living,  w^holly  unprincipled  in  every 
particular,  but  with  considerable  talents  from  nature. 
He  ingratiated  himself  with  the  Prince  not  long  before 
the  Regency  was  formed,  and  assumed  the  management 
of  his  household  expenses  and  bed-chamber  politics. 
He  will  perhaps  not  have  temper  or  manners  to  main- 
tain his  ascendancy  very  long ;  he  disgusted  many  of 
the  nobility  at  the  fete  in  Carlton  House,  by  a  vulgar 

8* 


90  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1811. 

insolence  wliicli  he  could  not  conceal ;  and  the  Prince  is 
very  likely  to  discard  him  on  an  instant,  for  some  un- 
guarded freedom.  In  the  meanwhile  he  has  the  direc- 
tion of  repairs  at  Carlton  House,  which  are  to  cost  half 
a  million  ;  though  the  Prince  means,  as  soon  as  he  is 
Kins-,  to  remove  to  Buckingham  House,  which  will  also 
need  repairs. 

Let  me  hear  from  you  soon. 

Most  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CLXXVII.     TO  JOHN  ALLEN,  ESQ. 
Dear  Allen  Torquay,  14th  September,  1811. 

It  is  very  hard  to  believe  that  the  transactions  of 
government  in  Ireland  are  not  in  the  same  character 
of  a  crooked  intriguing  policy,  for  the  purpose  of  man- 
aging the  Prince.  Have  you  any  hesitation  in  thinking 
that  Opposition  ought  to  take  up  this  matter  in  Parlia- 
ment in  the  most  decided  manner,  without  any  more  of 
that  forbearance  and  reserve  which  they  practised  last 
session  ? 

If  the  Irish  judges  support  their  government,  in  the 
construction  of  the  Convention  Act,  we  ought  to  move 
for  the  repeal  of  so  abominable  a  statute,  and  in  discus- 
sing it  have  no  mercy  for  the  judges.  If  by  any  un- 
looked-for turn  of  patriotism,  or  fear  in  the  judges,  they 
should  construe  the  act  as  it  seems  to  me  it  ought  to  be, 
then  w^e  shall  have  a  much  freer  game  to  play,  by  an 
attack  upon  the  administration  alone  ;  but,  in  either 
event,  I  feel  very  anxious  that  Opposition  should  go  re- 
solutely to  the  attack,  without  any  compromise  towards 
the  Regent.  It  is  not  unlikely  that  Parliament  will 
meet  before  the  legal  question  can  be  decided  at  Dublin ; 


2Et.  34.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  91 

in  that  case,  ought  we  not  to  act  without  any  delay,  as- 
suming our  own  construction  of  the  act  to  be  clear  and  in- 
dubitable ?  I  have  not  the  least  faith  in  any  stories  of 
secret  intelligence  possessed  by  government,  as  to  de- 
signs on  the  part  of  the  Catholics ;  if  government  is 
sincere,  they  may  have  been  frightened  by  the  appear- 
ance of  a  little  more  eagerness  among  the  Catholics, 
when  they  believed  the  day  of  emancipation  was  at 
last  coming  on ;  and  the  show  of  a  little  more  determi- 
nation and  system,  when  they  found  that  day  bring  them 
a  fresh  disappointment.  I  am  much  more  inclined  to 
believe  that  Percival  and  the  Archbishop  of  Canterbury 
have  worked  upon  Lord  Manners,  who  is  a  timid  man,  and 
very  bigoted.  The  conduct  of  the  Wellesleys  in  all  this 
business  is  very  pitiful,  for  they  have  no  bigotry  on  the 
subject. 

It  would  appear  now,  I  think,  that  there  is  some  re- 
laxation in  the  violence  of  the  King's  disorder,  and  that 
the  height  to  which  it  rose  two  months  ago  was  probably 
owing  to  the  heat  of  the  season.  As  I  understand  he  is 
better  in  health,  I  begin  to  think  it  likely  that  w^e  shall 
have  the  question  of  restrictions  to  dispose  of  in  Parlia- 
ment ;  that  will  not  fail  to  be  a  pleasant  scene.  I  suppose 
the  coronation  of  his  wife  is  a  matter  that  may  be  left 
to  the  new  king's  fancy.  If  he  means  any  farther  in- 
dignities, or  to  impose  any  hardships  upon  her,  it  will  be 
diso^raceful  to  the  nation  to  suffer  them  ;  with  all  her 
folly  and  low  vices,  she  is  a  stranger ;  and  though  she 
has  not  conducted  herself  in  her  disgrace  so  as  to  de- 
serve any  respect,  she  has  already  been  used  very  ill. 
Remember  me  to  Sydney,  if  he  is  with  you. 

Sincerely  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


92  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1811. 


Letter  CLXXVIII.     TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 
JVIv  cIGcIT  MurraV  Lincoln's  Inn,  23d  November,  1811. 

I  am  much  surprised  to  hear  that  some  persons 
entertam  a  doubt,  whether  GilUes*  has  done  right,  in 
point  of  poHtical  principle,  by  his  acceptance  of  the 
judicial  place  offered  him  by  the  government.  To  me 
it  appears  most  certain,  that  the  office  of  Judge  in  any 
of  the  supreme  courts,  is  and  ought  ever  to  be  regarded 
as  entirely  independent  of  political  party ;  and  that 
when  the  ruling  party  is  compelled,  either  by  a  just 
sense  of  merit  and  public  duty,  or  by  the  utter  incapa- 
city of  their  own  troop  of  adherents,  to  look  for  Judges 
in  the  opposite  band  of  barristers,  he  to  whom  the  offer 
is  made  (supposing  it  to  be  made  without  any  improper 
terms)  is  perfectly  at  liberty  to  accept  of  it,  without 
any  compromise  of  his  principles  upon  the  management 
of  public  afliiirs,  and  without  any  failure  of  duty  to- 
wards the  political  party  to  which  he  has  hitherto  be- 
longed. It  is  a  fit  question  for  him  to  put  to  himself,  no 
doubt,  on  such  an  occasion,  whether  he  feels  inclined 
and  thinks  it  right  to  quit  the  active  duties,  very  im- 
portant and  useful  ones  in  every  free  government,  that 
are  required  of  a  party  man,  and  which  are  incompa- 
tible altogether  with  the  character  and  station  of  a 
Judge  ;  but  that  is  a  question  which  he  would  have  no 
less  to  put  to  himself,  and  to  decide  on,  if  he  received 
the  offer  from  his  own  party.  It  is  manifestly  for  the 
public  interest,  on  various  accounts,  that  the  patronage 
of  judicial  situations  should  be  uniformly  regarded  in 
this  light  by  barristers  of  all  parties ;  and  none  but  the 

*  See  note,  Vol.  L  p.  139. 


iET.  34.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  93 

dunces,  that  are  in  the  tail  of  each  party,  have  any  inte- 
rest in  estabhshing  a  rule  to  the  contrary,  which,  upon 
the  part  of  the  men  of  talents  who  carry  on  the  business 
of  the  bar,  w^ould  amount  to  a  self-denying  ordinance,  of 
the  worst  nature  for  the  public.  The  principle  upon 
which  Gillies  has  most  properly  acted,  gives  the  state 
the  best  chance  of  having  judges  who  really  know  the 
laws ;  and  gives  us  a  better  chance  of  the  sentiment 
being  impressed  upon  them  all,  that  when  judges,  they 
are  not  party  men  ;  and  the  differences  of  political 
opinion  that  will  still  remain  among  them,  —  for  they 
are  not  to  be  required  to  have  no  opinions,  because  they 
cease  to  enforce  them  by  political  activity,  —  will  give  a 
fairer  probability  of  an  even  and  equitable  determina- 
tion in  all  state  trials  or  political  suits  that  may  come 
into  the  courts  of  justice.  I  understand  this  to  be  the 
established  morality  of  Westminster  Hall,  and  it  appears 
to  be  founded  on  the  best  reasons  of  public  usefulness 
and  propriety.  The  example  of  so  eminent  an  advocate 
as  Gillies  will  sanction  and  establish  the  same  principle, 
I  hope,  in  the  Parliament  House,  which  will  be  a  great 
benefit  to  Scotland,  resulting  from  his  acceptance  of  the 
gown,  as  the  offer  of  it  to  him  by  the  ministers  has  pro- 
duced a  still  greater  benefit,  in  giving  a  victory  to  pub- 
lic opinion  on  the  subject  of  judicial  appointments.  I 
have  no  doubt  you  agree  with  me  in  all  this ;  but  as 
you  might  possibly  be  told  that  a  few  of  our  friends 
here,  but  a  very  few,  are  factious  enough  to  say  that 
Gillies  might  as  well  have  suffered  the  ministers  to  go 
on  making  bad  appointments,  I  was  anxious  that  you 
should  not  imagine  that  I  agreed  with  them.  Lord  Hol- 
land, Abercromby,  and  Ward,  concur  exactly  in  the 
same  view  of  it  with  me  :  and  I  mention  these  three, 


94  HOUSE    OF    COMMONS.  [1811. 

because  they  are  not  likely  to  agree  except  where  their 
joint  opinion  is  the  true  one. 

Yours  ever  affectionately, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Parliament  met  on  the  7th  of  January,  and  the  session 
lasted  till  the  30th  of  Jul}^  Mr.  Horner  did  not  origin- 
ate any  measure,  and  does  not  appear  to  have  taken  an 
active  part  in  any  of  the  great  subjects  of  debate.  He 
is  reported  as  having  spoken  on  several  questions  in  the 
early  part  of  the  session;  but  all  that  is  given  of  his 
speeches,  on  any  of  those  occasions,  occupies  a  very 
brief  space  in  the  columns  of  Hansard. 

On  the  17th  of  March,  Mr.  Percival  brought  forward 
a  bill,  for  the  purpose  of  continuing,  under  certain  amend- 
ments, and  of  extending  to  Ireland,  an  act  passed  in  the 
preceding  session,  which  made  bank  notes  a  legal  tender. 
It  was  discussed  on  the  bringing  up  of  the  Report  on 
the  20th  of  April ;  and  Mr.  Horner  is  reported  as  hav- 
ing spoken  "  at  considerable  length "  on  that  occasion ; 
but  the  report  occupies  a  dozen  lines  only. 

On  the  7th  of  May,  Mr.  Creevey  brought  under  the 
notice  of  the  House  the  large  incomes  derived  b}'  the 
Marquis  of  Buckingham  and  Lord  Camden  as  tellers  of 
the  Exchequer,  although  wholly  sinecure  offices ;  and 
moved  a  series  of  resolutions,  the  purport  of  which  was, 
to  reduce,  and  fix  at  a  definite  sum,  the  incomes  of  those 
officers.  The  motion  was  resisted  by  the  government. 
Mr.  Brand  moved,  as  an  amendment,  that  a  committee 
should  be  appointed. 

Mr.  Horner,  on  this  occasion,  said,  —  "he  was  desirous 
of  stating  his  reasons  for  the  opinion  he  entertained  on 


^T.  34.]  HOUSE  OF   COMMONS.  95 

this  subject.  No  committee  was  necessary  to  prove 
what  was  an  nndoiibted  right.  Had  he  entertained  any 
hesitation  on  the  subject,  the  speech  of  his  right  honour- 
able friend  (Mr.  Ponsonby)  would  have  convinced  him 
of  this.  Nothing,  he  conceived,  could  be  so  clear,  as 
that  in  all  regulations  for  economical  purposes,  vested 
rights  must  be  sacredly  protected.  If  there  was  even 
a  solitary  precedent,  as  had  been  alleged,  in  the  year 
1740,  in  which  a  contrary  line  of  proceeding  had  pre- 
vailed, still  he  should  hold  that  to  be  a  bad  precedent, 
and  one  which  ought  not  to  be  followed.  No  man 
could  deny  the  right  of  the  House  to  regulate,  reform, 
and  even  abolish  offices ;  but  still  that  must  be  done 
subject  to  regulations.  He  was  prepared  to  go  as  far 
in  regulations  which  had  economy  for  their  object  as 
any  man ;  but  in  doing  so,  the  rights  of  those  having 
vested  interests  in  such  offices  must  be  kept  sacred. 
The  property  of  the  state  was  not  to  be  protected  at 
the  expense  of  private  property.  All  property  was  the 
creature  of  the  law,  and  equally  depended  upon  it  for 
protection.  If  this  principle  were  once  broken  through 
by  the  House,  temptation  would  grow  upon  them,  and 
there  would  be  no  end  to  it.  He  reminded  the  House 
that  such  an  interference  had  been  one  of  the  steps, 
taken  by  those  frenzied  politicians  in  a  neighbouring 
country,  to  whom  it  was  to  be  attributed,  that  that 
country  had  so  long  been  the  prey  to  anarchy,  and 
every  other  description  of  horrors."  The  motion  was 
negatived  by  a  large  majority. 

Mr.  Horner  is  not  reported  as  having  again  spoken 
during  the  remainder  of.  the  session  :  his  attendance  had 
been  very  much  interrupted  by  ill  health.  A  dissolu- 
tion took  place  on  the  29th  of  September.  The  new 
parliament  met  on  the  24th  of  November,  and  sat  till 


96  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1812. 

the  22d  of  December,  when  it  adjourned  to  the  2d 
of  February ;  but  Mr.  Horner  was  not  then  a  member 
of  the  House. 


Letter  CLXXIX.     TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 
My  dear  Murray,  Lincoln's  inn,  22d  January,  1812. 

I  was  unluckily  prevented  from  hearing  the 
whole  of  Brougham's  speech  last  night;  what  I  did 
hear  was  most  excellent,  and  the  rest,  I  am  told  by  the 
best  judges,  was  still  better.  He  has  made  an  impres- 
sion upon  both  sides  of  the  House  much  more  near  the 
proportion  of  his  talents  and  powers,  than  he  had  made 
by  any  former  exertion  of  them  in  that  place.  He  has 
done  this,  too,  upon  a  subject  of  the  first  importance, 
and  which  has  been  waiting  some  years  to  be  treated 
by  so  able  a  hand.=-=  The  time  for  an  adjustment  of 
that  matter  with  the  Crown  is  not  indeed  till  an  actual 
demise ;  but  it  w^as  desirable  to  have  the  ground  broken 
up,  and  topics  thrown  out  for  discussion  among  the  pub- 
lic, that  when  that  time  arrives,  the  public  may  support 
its  own  interests,  and  second  those  who  maintain  them. 
It  was  objected  by  some  of  our  critics,  that  he  over- 
charged his  statements;  and  it  is  true  that  his  style 
in  general  has  that  fault,  with  another,  which  is  akin 
to  it,  of  charging  the  different  parts  of  his  subject  and 
argument  with  an  equal  w^eight  of  earnestness  and  em- 
phasis. 

But  the  practical  purpose  to  be  effected  last  night, 
was  not  to  gain  the  question,  which  would  have  been 
a  premature  success,  but  to  make  an  impression  as  to 

*  On   the   Droits  of  Admiralty.      Sec   Hansard's  Debates,   vol.  xxi.  p. 
241.  — Ed. 


JEt.  34.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  r)*j 

the  nature  and  importance  of  it.  Besides  this,  there 
were  names  and  possible  cases  held  out  in  tenwrm, 
which  may  stop  in  the  mean  while  some  abuses  of  this 
fund  that  were  perhaps  meditated.  I  was  told  by  some 
of  the  members  who  sat  near  Lord  Yarmouth,  that  the 
words  mistress  and  minion  were  rung,  till  he  looked 
black  upon  them.  Since  I  came  into  parliament,  I  have 
heard  the  Droits  of  Admiralty  spoken  of  as  the  private 
patrimony  of  the  king,  not  to  be  controlled,  nor  even 
inquired  into ;  but  by  successive  questions  and  discus- 
sions, this  doctrine  has  been  utterly  exploded,  and  the 
right  of  the  House  of  Commons  to  order  accounts  of  the 
distribution  of  it,  established  in  full  exercise ;  such  is  the 
practical  utility  of  ojoposition. 

Yours  affectionately, 

Fra.  Horner. 

^  Letteu  CLXXX.     to  the  REV.  T.  R.  MALTHUS. 

My  dear  MalthuS,  London,  8th  February,  1812. 

I  am  very  glad  it  occurred  to  you,  to  offer  Lan- 
caster's committee  the  sanction  of  your  name  as  a  stew- 
ard at  our  meeting  ;  and  I  have  written  to  Joseph  Fox, 
telling  him,  that  I  have  reason  to  believe  you  would 
not  refuse  to  serve  in  that  capacity,  if  it  were  proposed 
to  you. 

I  entirely  concur  in  your  sentiments  upon  the  sub- 
ject, that  both  societies  ought  to  be  encouraged ;  nay  I 
go  a  little  farther,  for  if  I  could  be  convinced  that  the 
church  would  sincerely  and  zealously  set  themselves  to 
accomplish  the  work  of  national  education,  the  church 
should  have  the  best  of  my  wishes  by  preference ;  inas- 
much as  I  regard  the  establishment  as  our  best  pre- 
servative against  fanaticism,  though  I  am  persuaded  it 

VOL.  II.  9 


98  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1812. 

can  only  operate  effectually  to  that  end,  or  indeed 
subsist  long  as  an  establishment,  by  acting  upon  the 
true  principles  of  the  Reformation,  of  which  educating 
the  common  people  is  the  most  important.  It  is  impos- 
sible not  to  feel  strong  suspicions  against  the  sincerity 
of  all  recent  converts,  especially  from  a  prejudice  which 
seemed  but  very  lately  so  inveterate,  as  that  of  church- 
men against  the  education  of  the  lower  classes.  And 
even  allowing  them  to  be  for  the  present  sincere,  it  is 
hard  to  expect  real  and  continued  activity  from  that 
description  of  persons  who  have  undertaken  this  charge. 
It  is  right,  however,  they  should  have  a  fair  trial ;  the 
result  will  speedily  appear,  for  we  can  only  know  them 
by  their  fruits :  and  the  public  will  be  ready  to  hold 
them  to  a  strict  account,  if  they  cannot,  a  year  or  two 
hence,  give  a  satisfactory  account  of  the  efficient  em- 
ployment of  the  large  funds  which  have  been  put  at 
their  disposal.  In  the  mean  time,  they  cannot  crush 
the  system  of  Lancaster,  whose  zeal  is  as  unconquerable 
as  that  of  John  Knox ;  the  only  thing  to  be  regretted 
is,  that  that  zeal  should  have  so  large  an  admixture  of 
polemic  irritability,  which  begins,  I  fear,  to  disgust  some 
of  those  persons  whose  taste  is  fastidious,  and  who  can- 
not, for  the  sake  even  of  the  good  that  is  effected,  over- 
look the  rudeness  of  the  means  by  which  such  good  has, 
almost  in  every  instance  of  the  sort,  been  accomplished. 

Most  truly  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CLXXXI.     TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 
IMv  dear  Murrav  Lincoln's  Lm,  18tli  June,  1812. 

I  would  have  written  to  you  more  frequently, 
during  the  late  remarkable  transactions  in  politics,  if  the 


JEt.  34.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  99 

nature  of  what  passed,  or  the  way  m  which  I  obtained 
from  time  to  time  some  knowledj^e  of  it,  had  admitted 
of  any  inteUigible  communications  in  an  abridged  shape. 
The  apparent  changes  of  conduct  succeeded  each  other 
so  rapidly,  that  the  story  of  one  day  looked  Hke  nothing 
but  a  contradiction  of  that  before  it,  though  all  have  in 
the  end  proved  to  be  true.     Nor  was  it  possible,  while 
the  thing  was  going  on,  to  adopt  with  confidence  any 
conjecture  that  seemed  to  solve  such  contrarieties;  until 
the  most  recent  disclosures  explained  them,  by  proving 
a  depth  of  intrigue,  which,  upon  mere  guess,  was  hard  to 
be  believed.     The  result  has,  probably,  been  an  unfortu- 
nate one  for  the  country,  because  an  administration  with 
Grenville,  Grey,  and  some  others  included  in  it,  might 
perhaps  have  brought  about  successfully  some  of  those 
changes  in  our  policy,  both  foreign  and  internal,  which 
they  think  so  desirable  :  at  the  same  time,  the  public 
voice  would  second  them  so  reluctantly  in  those  mea- 
sures, and  would  be  so  much  upon  the  catch  to  disap- 
point them,  if  there  was  any  difficulty  to  be  overcome, 
that  I  trembled  for  my  friends  and  for  their  cause,  when 
I  thought  them  upon  the  brink  of  an  administration,  in 
which  they  were  preparing  to  undertake  the  govern- 
ment under  such  difficulties   as   the   present,  without 
either  court  favour  or  a  popular  cry.     From  all  this  they 
are  saved  ;  not  by  any  want  of  courage  on  their  side, 
but  by  the  triumph  of  inveterate  duplicity,  and  the  low 
arts  of  a  palace,  over  an  inflexible  and  proud  integrity. 
I  believe  the  general  opinion  to  be  at  present  against 
the  Whigs ;  and,  with  the  usual  sagacity  of  the  public, 
they  see  nothing  but  a  struggle  for  a  few  places,  in  the 
determination  not  to  accept  office  without  power :  at 
the  same  time,  it  is  likely  enough,  that  a  very  sincere 
disappointment  is  at  the  bottom  of  this  rage  ;  and  the 


100  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1812. 

anger  against  the  Whigs  for  not  accepting  the  ministry, 
carries  with  it  a  strong  disHke  of  those  who  have,  and 
may  produce  a  reaction. 

Being  interrupted,  I  have  only  time  to  tell  you,  that 
Canning's  motion  is  put  off,  in  consequence  of  there  not 
being  members  enough  before  four  o'clock  to  make  a 
House. 

Affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter   CLXXXII.     TO  MR.  HALLAM. 
My  dear  Hallam,  Exeter,  24th  July,  1812. 

You  very  kindly  enjoin  me  to  give  you  some  re- 
port of  myself  Though  not  quite  robust  yet,  I  have 
the  satisfaction  of  considering  myself  as  materially  im- 
proved in  general  health ;  for  which  I  am  indebted  to 
the  regimen  which  was  enjoined  me  by  my  medical  ad- 
visers. By  persevering  in  that,  and  adding  to  it  exercise 
on  horseback,  which,  by  constant  experience,  I  find  suits 
me  best,  I  have  little  doubt  of  re-establishing  myself  in 
as  much  strength  as  I  ever  enjoyed. 

I  go  from  Bristol  into  Scotland,  by  way  of  the  lakes, 
that  I  may  pay  a  short  visit  to  Brougham.  I  shall  re- 
main in  the  north  till  it  is  necessary  to  come  to  Taunton 
for  the  Sessions ;  after  which,  I  shall  pass  the  rest  of  the 
vacation  with  my  family,  wherever  they  may  be.  At 
present  they  talk  only  of  Hampstead ;  but  as  Hastings 
has  also  been  spoken  of,  and  the  sea-bathing  always  does 
my  mother  good,  I  think  it  is  not  unlikely  that  we  shall 
go  there  in  the  month  of  October.  I  should  be  very 
much  gratified  if  our  arrangements  should  coincide, 
that  I  might  have  the  enjoyment  of  your  society  away 
from  London ;  but  in  the  busy  time  of  the  year,  I  have 


jEt.  34.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  IQ] 

SO  little  opportunity  of  being  with  my  family,  that  I 
make  it  a  first  object  to  live  one  part  of  the  vacation 
with  them. 

I  regret  very  much,  that  you  are  not  satisfied  with 
the  conduct  of  Lord  Grey  and  Lord  Grenville  in  their 
rupture  of  the  negotiation.  It  is  perhaps  a  nice  ques- 
tion of  conduct,  and  one  of  those  in  which  there  is  hardly 
any  other  test  but  success  to  be  resorted  to.  Upon  the 
whole  circumstances,  particularly  with  what  has  been 
added  to  our  knowledge  of  them  by  Lord  Moira's  subse- 
quent conduct,  and  by  Lord  Spencer's  statement  in  the 
House  of  Lords,  I  think  their  mode  of  closing  the  nego- 
tiation was  the  most  honourable  and  upright  for  them- 
selves, though,  with  a  little  more  reserve,  they  might 
have  left  it  to  be  terminated  with  more  disgrace  to  the 
Prince.  I  was  prepared,  I  own  at  the  same  time,  to 
pardon  them  if  they  had  been  less  sturdy  about  the 
household,  and  thought,  if  there  was  a  possibility  of 
their  getting  power,  with  the  views  they  had  of  using  it, 
that  they  might  be  defended  against  the  abuse  that  was 
in  preparation  for  them,  if  they  should  have  yielded  to 
the  Court  its  pretensions  respecting  the  household.  I 
am  now  satisfied,  looking  back  to  the  whole  intrigue, 
that  they  never  had  any  chance  of  coming  into  office  ; 
and  am  somewhat  inclined  to  apprehend,  that  the  high 
tone  of  personal  honour,  and  the  strict  stoical  maxims 
of  political  conduct,  which  the  present  leaders  of  the 
Whig  opposition  are  guided  by,  in  their  negotiations 
about  office,  and  without  the  observance  of  which  power 
can  have  but  little  to  gratify  such  men,  are  not  calculated 
to  obtain  place  for  them,  except  in  a  fiivourable  con- 
juncture of  accidents ;  or  to  win  immediate  favour  for 
them  with  the  public,  whether  they  gain  the  places  or 
are  disappointed.     I  will  not  say  that  nothing  of  the 

9* 


102  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1812. 

peculiarities  of  temper  was  to  be  detected  in  their 
prompt  and  peremptory  manner  of  negotiating ;  but,  on 
the  other  hand,  they  negotiated  with  all  the  odds 
against  them,  arising  from  their  integrity  and  rigid 
honour  being  known  to  those  who  intrigued  against 
them  with  fewer  scruples.  Never  was  there  a  time,  in 
my  remembrance  of  politics,  which  brought  out,  in  so 
strong  a  light,  the  characters  of  all  the  persons  engaged 
in  the  transaction ;  and  I  am  sorry  to  say,  that  some,  of 
whom  I  was  anxious  to  form  or  to  keep  a  high  opinion, 
such  as  Canning  and  Whi thread,  sunk  a  great  way  in 
my  estimation,  before  it  was  all  over. 

I  tremble,  when  I  think  of  Spain.  Surely,  something 
more  might  have  been  done  by  us,  particularly  on  the 
side  of  Catalonia,  by  sending  into  the  Peninsula  every 
company  or  troop  that  could  possibly  be  spared,  at  the 
time  that  the  forces  of  France  are  draw^n  to  such  a  dis- 
tance. Bat  Bonaparte  and  all  his  army  had  crossed  the 
Vistula,  before  we  would  suffer  ourselves  to  believe  that 
the  price  of  corn  would  admit  of  his  marching  at  all.  I 
am  very  sorry  to  see  such  wretched  talk  in  the  House 
of  Commons  about  the  overture  of  April  last ;  wdiatever 
it  might  have  been  reasonable  to  say  about  it  then, 
while  Bonaparte  was  still  in  Paris,  and  in  our  delusion 
that  he  did  not  think  of  leaving  it,  there  can  be  but  one 
language  to  hold  now,  respecting  such  a  j)roposal.  Sher- 
idan's is  nearest  the  right  language  ;  if  he  had  not 
accompanied  it  with  such  baseness  towards  Whitbread, 
who  has  been  slaving  for  a  year  and  more  in  his  private 
afflxirs,  to  get  him  bread,  and  committed  this  ingratitude 
for  the  sake  of  patching  up  his  ruined  reputation  by  an 
address  to  popular  sentiments.  Col.  Hutchinson's  unjus- 
tifiable expressions  about  Bonaparte  will  be  imputed,  of 
course,  to  all  the  Opposition,  and  very  likely  to  all  the 


^T.  34.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  103 

Catholics.  It  is  incomprehensible  to  me,  how  any  friend 
of  liberty,  as  Hutchinson  is  very  honestly,  can  help  de- 
testing the  very  name  of  this  restless  barbarian. 

Yours,  my  dear  Hallam, 
Most  truly, 

Era.  Horner. 


Letter  CLXXXIII.     TO  HIS  BROTHER. 

My  dear  Leonard,  Powderbam,  25th  July,  1812. 

In  consequence  of  your  recommendation,  I  went 
with  Adam  to  see  Mr.  Poole's  village  school  at  Enmore,=-= 
having  first  procured  his  book  and  read  it.  The  work 
gave  me  a  great  prepossession  in  favour  both  of  himself 
and  the  method  of  his  school :  for  though  I  never  shall 
concede  to  any  one  the  originality  of  Joseph  Lancaster's 
inventions,  and  think  that  it  is  an  act  of  injustice  to- 
wards him  to  call  Dr.  Bell  the  original  inventor,  (as  Mr. 
Poole  does  in  his  preface,)  yet  that  preface  is  written  in 
such  a  tone  of  good  sense  o,nd  genuine  benevolence, 
that  I  do  not  recollect  to  have  met  with  any  composi- 
tion, for  a  long  while,  that  has  afforded  me  a  more  real 
gratification. 

Independently  of  the  improvements  which  he  has 
added  to  the  general  method,  his  idea  of  the  advantages 
to  be  derived  from  the  mixture  of  farmers'  sons  with 
the  peasant  boys  in  the  same  school,  is  one  of  those 
thoughts  that  show  a  masterly  sense  for  the  business  of 
life,  apparently  too  simple  to  have  much  in  it,  but,  in 
practice,  fruitful  of  most  useful  consequences.  The  ex- 
pectations we  had  formed  from  reading  the  book,  were 
exceeded  by  what  we  saw  at  the  school ;  which  was 

*  The  Rev.  John  Poole,  Rector  of  Enmore,  near  Bridgwater.  The  title  of 
the  book  here  spoken  of  is,  "  The  Village  School  Improved."  —  Ed. 


104  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1812. 

indeed  a  most  pleasing  and  satisfactory  spectacle.  We 
passed  near  an  hour  there,  and  were  lucky  enough  to 
find  Mr.  Poole  himself.  The  achievements  of  the  chil- 
dren in  working  sums  by  the  head  were  quite  astonish- 
ing ;  but  what  was  of  more  importance,  was  the  order, 
intelligence,  and  cheerfulness  with  which  the  ordinary 
business  of  the  school  was  despatched.  I  was  thoroughly 
convinced  upon  the  spot  of  the  good  effects,  resulting 
from  the  mixture  of  the  farmers'  boys  with  those  of 
their  ploughmen ;  the  former,  who  bring  a  little  more 
education  from  home,  and  stay  at  the  school  till  some- 
what a  more  advanced  age,  gain,  in  the  usual  competi- 
tion of  their  learning,  a  superiority  which  appears  to  be 
owing  to  nothing  else  than  their  fate  in  this  fair  rivalry, 
while  it  puts  upon  the  most  pleasing  footing  that  differ- 
ence which  is  to  last  through  life ;  at  the  same  time, 
that  the  competition,  and  the  level  upon  which  they 
are  all  placed,  gives  both  that  just  sense  of  equality 
which  both  ought  to  be  taught,  and  the  teaching  of 
which  in  common  to  boys  of  the  middling  and  higher 
ranks  is  one  of  the  main  advantages  of  the  public 
schools  of  England.  I  like  very  much  too  the  putting 
girls  and  boys  in  the  same  classes,  at  so  early  an  age  -,  it 
gives  the  boys  a  new  spur  to  emulation,  the  girls  are 
usually  so  much  quicker.  Of  course  Mr.  Poole's  method 
will  not  have  the  same  complete  success  as  at  Enmore, 
except  where  a  person  like  himself  will  take  as  much 
pains.  But  I  am  convinced,  that  the  dissemination  of 
his  work  cannot  fail  to  do  infinite  good,  both  in  improv- 
ino:  the  schools  where  Bell's  method  or  Lancaster's  has 
already  been  adopted,  and  in  setting  a  noble  example 
to  country  clergymen  of  the  Establishment,  which  is 
very  likely  to  be  followed  in  many  instances. 

I  suppose   it   is  in  vain  to   remonstrate  any  more 


Mr.  34.]  CORKESPONDEXCE.  105 

against  the  sea-voyage  ;  I  wish  we  could  have  contrived 
to  make  the  journey  into  Scotland  together.  We  shall 
meet  at  Edinburgh,  I  suppose,  towards  the  end  of 
August.  I  thank  Anne  for  her  very  kind  letter ;  re- 
member me  to  her  very  affectionately,  and  to  my  dear 
Mary.  I  am  sorry  to  think  that  my  father  is  not  going 
to  the  sea-side ;  it  always  does  my  mother  so  much 
good.  There  is  nothing  for  me  to  report  about  the  cir- 
cuit ;  my  quarter  is  at  the  fag  end  of  it,  the  week  after 
next.  I  have  had  as  usual  some  driblets  of  business  in 
coming  along. 

Ever,  my  dear  Leonard,  affectionately. 

Era.  Horner. 

I  finish  my  letter  at  this  castle,  having  come  down 
yesterday  with  Courtenay.*  We  go  on  to  Ivy  Bridge 
to-day. 

Letter  CLXXXIV.    TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 

My  dear  Murray,  Wells,  2d  August,  1812. 

You  are  quite  right  not  to  move  from  Edin- 
burgh, until  you  have  full  authority  to  do  so  from 
your  physician.  You  must  wait  there  till  my  arrival, 
and  after  that,  I  should  like  to  have  several  days  of 
rest,  which  it  will  be  better  for  both  of  us  to  pass  very 
quietly.  I  trust  to  your  telling  me  faithfully,  that  the 
cause  of  your  illness  is  removed  ;  otherwise  I  should  be 
uncomfortable. 

I  have  had  the  gratification  of  a  very  friendly  letter 
from  Brougham,  in  consequence  of  which  I  shall  stay  a 
couple  of  days  at  his  house ;   after  that,  I  leave  the 

*  The  present  Earl  of  Devon. 


106  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1812. 

whole  distribution  of  the  time  I  shall  pass  in  Scotland 
to  your  direction.  The  only  engagement  I  have  made 
is  a  visit  to  Raith/'=  which  I  wish  to  pay  when  the  Gene- 
ral*}* is  there.  Dunkeld  I  should  like  much  to  see  again, 
though  I  like  the  remembrance  of  it  too  well  not  to  ap- 
prehend some  disappointment.  I  fancy  Leonard  will 
take  Mrs.  Horner  some  way  into  the  Highlands ;  and  I 
think  it  would  not  be  disagreeable  to  you,  if  we  could 
contrive  to  meet  them  somewhere,  and  pass, one  or  two 
days  in  that  sort  of  scenery  with  them.  They  will  be 
at  Edinburgh  in  the  course  of  this  week,  as  they  set  out 
to-day ;  that  is,  set  sail,  for  they  have  resolution  enough 
to  encounter  the  horrors  of  so  long  a  voyage.  Direct 
your  next  letter  to  me  at  Brougham's. 

I  am  not  so  well  acquainted  with  Sir  William  Tem- 
ple's writings,  as  I  ought  to  be ;  what  I  know  of  them 
has  given  me  a  most  favourable  impression  of  his  char- 
acter. I  have  been  reading,  on  the  circuit,  Eulhiere's 
history  of  the  troubles  in  Poland,  which  is  a  most  inter- 
esting work ;  full  of  information  with  respect  to  many 
of  the  persons  who  disturbed  Europe  on  the  eve  of  the 
French  revolution,  and  compiled  with  a  great  deal  of 
skill  in  the  narration,  and  much  observation  of  the  arti- 
ficial characters  that  are  to  be  seen  in  courts  and  in 
diplomacy.  I  am  surprised  that  such  a  work  has  at- 
tracted so  little  notice  in  this  country.  It  was  published 
about  five  years  ago,  under  the  auspices  of  the  French 
government,  the  author  having  died  many  years  before ; 
Bonaparte's  schemes  for  Poland  are  plainly  disclosed  in 
the  editor's  preface,  and  very  possibly  some  parts  of  the 
bock  may  have  been  touched  and  coloured  to  serve 


*  The  scat  of  Robert  Ferguson,  Esq.,  in  Fifeshire. 
t  Lieutenant-Gencral  Sir  Ronald  C.  Ferguson. 


^T.  34.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  107 

their   purpose  :   the    events   of  the    present   campaign 
make  the  subject  doubly  interesting. 

Yours  affectionately, 

Fiu.  Horner. 


Letter   CLXXXV.    FROM  LORD  WEBB  SEY^IOUR. 
Mv  dear  Horner  Bulstrode,  2d  August,  1812. 

Whishaw  has  just  left  us.  Having  had  a  good 
deal  of  conversation  with  him  upon  the  subject  of  your 
health,  I  am  become  very  impatient  to  see  you ;  for 
your  case  seems  to  bear  a  great  resemblance  to  my  own, 
and  I  think  I  might  give  you  some  useful  hints,  founded 
upon  my  own  long  experience.  A  letter,  which  Whi- 
shaw received  from  Brougham  this  morning,  mentions 
your  intention  of  reaching  Westmoreland  about  the 
12th.  I  understood  from  Murray  that  your  circuit 
would  finish  on  the  8th.  Now,  this  allows  you  only 
three  or  four  days  for  your  journey  down,  and  my  first 
earnest  advice  is  to  avoid  any  such  hurry  in  travelling. 
Before  this  letter  arrived,  I  had  schemed  a  plan  for  you 
far  more  prudent.  I  must  set  off  for  the  North  about 
the  20th.  The  Lansdownes  are  to  go  this  week  to 
Malvern,  and  to  remain  there  till  September.  I  would 
invite  you  to  come  to  Bulstrode,'='  and  to  stay  here,  in 
perfect  quiet,  till  I  set  ofi^  were  there  not  objections  in 
the  length  of  the  journey  eastward,  and  to.  your  being 
thus  brought  within  the  temptations  of  the  busy  town. 
Let  me  only  say,  that  if  you  will  come  to  us,  tiith  a  firm  re- 
solution to  stay,  we  shall  be  most  happy  to  see  you.  I  will 
however  propose  another  plan ;  that  you  should  go  from 
Bristol  to  Malvern,  and  remain  with  the  Lansdownes  till  I 

*  Then  in  the  possession  of  the  Duke  of  Somerset. 


108  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1812. 

come  there,  and  take  you  up  to  proceed  to  the  North.  I 
will  set  you  down  at  Brougham's,  or  carry  you  forward, 
as  you  may  like  best.  With  me  you  will  be  secure  from 
all  hurry ;  and  ten  days  spent  in  the  delightful  society 
of  the  Lansdownes  will  do  much  to  recruit  you,  after 
the  fatigues  of  the  circuit,  which,  I  am  confident,  have 
been  more  than  you  had  strength  to  encounter.  Indeed, 
my  dear  friend,  you  must  not  trifle  with  your  complaints. 
As  I  observed  formerly,  I  am  not  alarmed  by  them, 
except  in  reference  to  your  situation  in  life,  and  your 
habits.  I  well  know  the  pain  of  submitting  to  inactivity, 
and  am  equally  aware  of  the  necessity  of  it,  in  such  a 
case  as  yours.  If  you  spend  your  autumn  in  rapid 
journeys,  and  a  variety  of  animated  conversation  with 
minds  in  their  full  vigour,  you  will  not  regain  health  for 
the  still  more  active  exertions  of  the  winter.  Let  me 
entreat,  and  hmst,  that  you  adopt  my  advice  upon  the 
present  occasion.  You  cannot  conceive  the  imjDortance 
I  attach  to  it. 

Yours  ever  affectionately, 

Webb  Seymour. 


Letter    CLXXXVI.     TO  MRS.   L.  HORNER. 
Mv  dear  Anne  Newport  in  Gloucestersliiro,  8th  Aug.  1812. 

I  begin  to  wish  very  much  to  hear  of  an  event 
which  I  trust  has  taken  place  by  this  time,  your  arrival 
at  Edinburgh.  I  shall  not  receive  the  intelligence, 
which  you  will  send  for  me  to  Brougham  Hall,  so  early 
as  I  intended  I  should,  when  I  gave  you  that  direction  ; 
for  I  have  made  a  small  alteration  in  my  plans,  which 
will  keep  me  a  week  later  in  the  South.  In  order  to 
have  the  chance  of  travelling  most  part  of  the  way 
North  with  Serjeant  Lens,  I  mean  to  loiter  away  about 


iET.  35.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  109 

a  week,  and  this  sort  of  rest  will  be  very  grateful  to  me 
after  the  circuit.  Where  do  you  think  I  am  going  for 
this  repose  ?  to  your  own  favourite  Malvern ;  where  I 
shall  enjoy  some  of  the  very  walks  you  used  to  take, 
and  examine  the  hill  with  Leonard's  description  of  it  in 
my  hand.  The  Sergeant  is  to  be  at  Ross  for  some  days, 
■with  his  sister  who  lives  there,  and  we  are  to  meet  at 
Leominster  :  this  will  give  me  till  next  Saturday  to  stay 
at  Malvern.  I  mean  to  stop  at  the  Wells,  and  try^o 
get  rooms  of  some  kind  or  other,  where  I  can  be  alone, 
for  the  ordinary  of  a  watering-place  is  not  in  the  least 
to  my  taste ;  not  that  I  mean  to  be  absolutely  alone 
either,  for  the  Lansdownes  went  there  yesterday,  and 
have  got  a  house,  which  you  probably  know  by  its 
absurd  name,  Pomona  Cottage ;  and  Lady  Lansdowne's 
sister.  Lady  Elizabeth  Fielding,  has  got  our  friend  Mrs. 
Beddoes's  house.  I  wash  I  had  fixed  upon  this  scheme  in 
time  to  have  received  your  particular  instructions  for 
walks  and  rides ;  for  I  do  not  send  my  horse  back  to 
London  till  I  quit  Malvern.  When  I  come  to  Edin- 
burgh, however,  I  shall  compare  notes  with  you.  I 
have  written  to  Fanny,  to  bid  her  send  me,  if  she  can 
find  -  one,  the  separate  copy  of  my  dear  Leo's  memoir, 
that  I  may  have  it  to  walk  out  with.  I  expect  to  reach 
Brougham  about  the  20th,  or  soon  after ;  your  letter 
from  thence,  if  you  have  written  to  me,  will  be  for- 
warded to  me.  Yours,  my  dear  Anne,  very  affection- 
ately, Fra.  Horner. 

Letter   CLXXXVII.    TO   HIS  SISTER,  mSS  HORNER. 
Mv  dear  FannV  Edinburgh,  9th  September,  1812. 

Leonard's  letter  to  you  more  than  a  week  ago 
explained  to  you  why  I  have  been  so  long  of  writing  to 
VOL.  II.  10 


110  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1812. 

any  body.  My  wrist  is  now  so  much  better,  that  I  can 
write  without  any  pain,  though  it  must  be  some  time 
before  I  recover  the  free  use  of  my  hand.  I  met  with 
the  accident  in  riding  a  little  pony,  which  fell  under 
me ;  and  in  saving  myself,  I  came  with  my  weight  upon 
my  hand. 

I  made  a  very  agreeable  journey  with  Serjeant  Lens, 
the  greater  part  of  the  way  through  country  which  was 
new ;  indeed,  the  only  portion  of  it  I  had  seen  before 
was  in  Cumberland,  from  Kendal  to  Penrith,  which  it 
was  very  gratifying  to  see  again.  We  had  as  fine  a  day 
as  could  be,  and  had  views  of  Windermere,  Grassmere, 
and  Keswick  Lake,  in  all  their  glory.  At  Keswick  we 
found  Rogers  the  poet,  staying  at  the  inn ;  he  was  good 
enough  to  take  an  evening  walk  with  us,  and  led  us  to 
a  favourite  station  of  his,  which  gives  the  most  striking 
prospect  of  the  lake.  As  Murray  could  not  meet  me  on 
the  borders,  I  postponed  my  visit  at  Brougham  till  my 
return,  when  he  will  accompany  me  thither  ;  I  only  re- 
gret that  I  lost  our  intended  tour  through  Ayrshire ; 
which  I  must  delay  till  another  year. 

Since  I  came  to  Edinburgh,  I  have  been  continually 
enjoying  the  society  of  my  old  friends,  who  have-  re- 
ceived me  with  all  the  affection  that  is  most  gratifying. 
It  gave  me  a  particular  pleasure  to  find  Mrs.  Murray  so 
little  the  worse  for  seven  more  years  of  old  age  ;  she  is 
a  little  thinner,  but  only  a  little ;  in  every  respect  she 
is  entirely  in  possession  of  her  faculties  and  excellent 
understanding.  Next  to  Murray  I  have  lived  most  with 
Thomson,*  who  since  I  was  last  here  has  fitted  up  a 
very  pretty  house,  and  put  in  order  his  valuable  library. 
We  all  spent  a  very  pleasant  day  at  his  brother's  par- 

*  Thomas  Thomson,  Esq. 


^T.  35.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  m 

sonage  at  Duddingstone  ;  and  in  the  course  of  the 
morning,  I  went  to  the  top  of  Arthur's  Seat,  Avith  the 
two  Thomsons  and  Pillans ;  the  last  of  whom  is,  I  take 
it,  the  most  completely  happy  person  in  the  Kegent's  do- 
minions ;  having  found  exactly  the  corner  that  fits  him 
in  the  world,  where  he  can  be  most  useful,  and  as  uni- 
versally respected.  He  has  already  done  wonders  with 
his  school,  and  will  yet  do  a  great  deal  more  :  he  thinks 
of  nothing  else.  I  have  been  for  a  couple  of  dnys  also 
to  Hatton,  where  Jeffrey  lives  in  a  great  house,  and 
writes  his  reviews  in  a  little  gilded  closet;  the  More- 
head  family  and  his  brother  make  up  a  household  for 
him,  in  which  he  is  perfectly  comfortable,  being  strongly 
attached  to  them  all.  When  I  was  there,  I  rode  to  pay 
a  visit  to  Mr.  Henry  Erskine,'='  who  has  retired  fi'om  the 
bar,  and  is  living  among  the  plantations  he  has  been 
making  for  the  last  twenty  years,  in  the  midst  of  all  the 
bustle  of  business ;  he  has  the  banks  of  the  river  Al- 
mond for  about  four  miles ;  he  told  me  he  had  thrown 
away  the  law  like  a  dirty  clout,  and  had  forgotten  it 
altogether.  It  is  delightful  to  see  the  same  high  spirits 
which  made  him  such  a  favourite  in  the  world,  while  he 
was  in  the  career  of  ambition  and  prosperity,  still  at- 
tending him  after  all  the  disaj)pointments  that  would 
have  chagrined  another  man  to  death  :  such  a  tem^jer 
is  worth  all  that  the  most  successful  ambition  could  ever 
bestow. 

My  greatest  enjoyment  in  Scotland  has  been  in  the 
society  of  Mr.  Stewart  and  Mr.  Playfair,  who  have  been 
growing  younger  all  the  while  that  their  pupils  had 
been  turning  grey,  and  are  in  such  good  health  and 
such  ardour  of  study,  that  the  world  will  probably  have 

*  The  Honourable  Henry  Erskinc,  brother  of  the  Chancellor  Lord  Er- 
skine. 


112  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1812. 

the  benefit  of  many  years  of  their  labour.  It  is  a  grati- 
fication which  I  enjoy  more  than  I  can  describe,  to  be 
admitted  to  the  confidence  and  unrestrained  conversa- 
tion of  two  such  sages,  who  first  imparted  to  me  a  true 
rehsh  for  hterature.  They  have  both  many  projects : 
Mr.  Stewart  has  already  a  great  deal  of  manuscript 
quite  ready  for  the  press ;  we  shall  have  two  volumes 
of  his  Philosophy  of  the  Mind,  in  the  course  of  next 
year.  He  is  printing  at  present  a  memoir,  which  he 
read  to  the  Royal  Society  of  Edinburgh,  upon  the  case 
of  the  blind  and  dumb  boy,  upon  whose  eye  an  opera- 
tion was  performed  by  Wardrop  ;  it  cannot  fail  to  be  a 
most  interesting  dissertation,  in  the  way  in  which  he  has 
treated  the  subject.  My  vanity  will  not  let  me  conceal 
from  you,  that  he  has  contrived,  from  the  accident  of 
my  having  sent  him  an  old  book,  to  pay  me  a  very  par- 
tial compliment,  in  a  note  to  this  memoir ;  it  is  not  a 
little  flattering,  though  I  owe  it  to  nothing  but  his  good 
nature,  to  have  his  friendship  for  me  recorded  in  writ- 
ings which  will  live  as  long  as  those  of  Cicero  and  Plato, 
and  will  go  down  to  distant  times  with  their  works.'-" 
We  went  to  Kinneil,  four  of  us  in  a  landau,  (the  same  I 
suspect  the  bailies  go  in  to  the  races,)  Murray,  Thom- 
son, Mr.  Playfair,  and  myself  The  day  being  very 
bright  and  beautiful,  we  drove  through  Lord  Rose- 
berry's  grounds,  which  are  equal  to  any  that  I  know 

*  The  passage  in  Mr.  Stewart's  Memoir,  here  referred  to,  is  as  follows  :  — 
"  The  work  from  which  these  quotations  are  taken,  is  a  very  small  volume, 
entitled  '  DidaacaJocopJniii,  or.  The  Deaf  and  Dumb  Man's  Tutor,  printed  at 
the  Theater  in  Oxford,  1680.'  As  I  had  never  happened  to  see  the  slightest 
reference  made  to  it  by  any  subsequent  writer,  I  was  altogether  ignorant  of  its 
existence,  when  a  copy  of  it,  purchased  upon  a  London  stall,  was  a  few  years 
ago  sent  me  by  a  friend,  who,  amidst  a  multiplicity  of  more  pressing  enofatre- 
ments  and  pursuits,  has  never  lost  sight  of  the  philosophical  studies  of  his  early 
years." 

The  works  of  George  Dalgarno,  the  author  of  the  above  treatise,  were  re- 
printed at  Edinburgh  in  1834  by  the  Maitland  Club,  at  the  expense  of  Lord 
Cockbum  and  Thomas  Maitland,  Esq.  —  Ed. 


.Ex.  35.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  213 

any  where  for  prospects  and  scenery.  The  Romillys 
came  to  Kinneil  the  same  day ;  next  morning  all  went 
away  but  Mr.  Playfair,  with  whom  and  Mr.  Stewart  I 
passed  an  entire  day.  We  went  a  mile  beyond  Falkirk, 
to  see  Mrs.  Dalzel. 

You  do  not  know  Mr.  Wilson/-'  but  it  has  been  no 
small  addition  to  the  pleasure  which  my  visit  to  Edin- 
burgh has  afforded  me,  to  see  him  upon  the  whole  so 
well,  and  so  comfortably  settled  with  his  nieces,  who  are 
in  the  best  style  of  Scotch  girls.  Lord  Webb,  too,  ar- 
rived yesterday,  and  I  have  written  this  rambling  scrib- 
bled letter  in  his  room,  waiting  till  the  rain  clears  off 

The  weather  is  painfully  uncertain,  for  it  depends 
upon  the  weather  now,  Avhether  Scotland  is  to  suffer 
next  winter  the  extremity  of  a  dearth. 

I  am  happy  to  say  Leonard  and  our  favourite  Anne 
are  quite  well.  They  have  got  a  drawing  of  Mary, 
which  they  think  not  very  like  ;  but  as  I  have  a  differ- 
ent opinion,  they  have  given  it  to  me ;  and  with  two  or 
three  sittings  more,  which  I  mean  to  have  when  we 
come  to  town,  I  shall  have  it  quite  like :  and  if  it 
should  be  finished  to  our  satisfaction,  I  have  two  pro- 
jects about  the  disposal  of  it ;  one  is,  to  have  it  in  my 
study  at  Lincoln's  Lm ;  the  other,  to  indulge  a  grand- 
mamma, if  she  has  a  fancy  for  putting  it  into  her  bed- 
room, in  Russell  Square.  But  she  must  ask  this  as  a 
great  favour. 

Affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 

*  Mr.  George  Wilson.     Sec  Vol.  I.  p.  196. 

10* 


]^24  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1812. 


Letter  CLXXXVHI.    TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 

My  dear  Murray  Clifton,  4th  October,  1812. 

I  had  a  very  agreeable  journey  with  Brougham 
as  far  as  Preston ;  nothing  could  be  more  entertaining, 
or  in  better  humour.  Indeed,  since  our  old  days  of 
careless  fellowship,  I  haye  never  known  him  in  so  good 
a  tone  of  mind,  as  through  the  whole  of  our  late  visit. 
After  parting  with  him,  I  slept  at  Chorley,  a  dirty 
hole  —  Lancashire  and  manufactures  ;  I  strove  to  make 
it  more  endurable  by  a  vivid  recollection  of  Dinwoodie 
Green.  I  was  repaid  for  this  the  following  night  at 
Wolseley  Bridge,  a  country  inn  of  the  right  English 
sort;  next  morning  brought  me  to  Birmingham.  All 
this  journey  I  performed  in  a  chaise  by  myself,  but  an 
indifferent  sulky  species  of  travelling,  unless  one  has  an 
interesting  book,  in  which  respect  I  had  managed  ill.  I 
tried  in  vain  at  Manchester  to  get  the  new  volume  of 
Burke's  Works,  for  which  I  am  thirsting,  and  again  at 
Birmingham  ;  and  then  becoming  desperate,  I  cast  my- 
self into  the  mail  coach,  and,  after  a  whole  night  of  star- 
gazing, (for  I  never  saw  so  fine  a  sky,  or  Sirius  in  such 
splendour,)  I  came  here  this  morning. 

I  was  anxious,  of  course,  to  learn  upon  the  spot  what 
is  likely  to  be  the  result  of  Romilly's  election,  which  be- 
gins on  Tuesday ;  upon  the  accounts  which  I  collected 
from  several  people  in  the  morning,  I  had  formed  an 
impression,  doubtful  upon  the  whole,  though  inclining 
to  the  favourable  side.  This  evening  I  have  seen  him- 
self; he  entertains  scarcely  a  doubt  of  success,  and 
thinks  it  not  unlikely  he  will  stand  at  the  head  of  the 
poll :  this  is  after  a  very  minute  scrutiny  of  all  the  in- 
formation in  possession  of  his  committee,  who  have  con- 


^T.  35.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  115 

ducted  their  canvass  and  survey  of  the  votes  by  paro- 
chial subdivisions ;  Romilly,  however,  is  in  all  such 
things  apt  to  be  very  sanguine.  He  does  not  complain 
of  any  fatigue  or  irksomeness  in  the  canvass,  though  he 
has  had  four  days  of  it  from  door  to  door ;  and  they  tell 
me  he  does  it  well. 

You  will  be  glad  to  hear  that  Abercromby  is  to  be 
returned  for  Calne. 

Yours  affectionately, 

Era.  Horner. 


Letter  CLXXXIX.    TO  THE  REV.  SYDNEY  SMITH. 
My  dear  Sydney,  Bowood,  nth  October,  1812. 

I  received  your  letter  at  Taunton  the  other  day, 
where  I  was  attending  the  sessions.  Your  reproaches, 
for  what  you  call  want  of  egotism,  I  take  very  kind, 
and,  in  return,  I  use  my  first  opportunity  of  leisure  to 
tell  you  all  about  myself  It  is  very  soon  told ;  in 
those  two  respects  on  which  you  desire  information ; 
my  health  is  considerably  improved ;  and  I  am  not  to 
be  in  Parliament.  I  have  been  very  careful  and  atten- 
tive about  the  former  for  several  months,  and  am  reap- 
ing the  fruits  of  this  in  a  more  uniform  course  of  com- 
fortable  easy  health  and  good  spirits,  than  I  knew  all 
last  year ;  though  I  cannot  describe  myself  as  having 
yet  regained  my  former  robustness,  or  the  privileges  of 
a  freeman,  for  I  am  still  under  the  slavery  of  medicine 
and  regimen.  As  to  Parliament,  I  have  no  seat,  be- 
cause Lord  Carrington,  to  whom  I  owed  my  last,  has  to 
provide  for  a  nephew,  who  has  come  of  age  since  the 
last  election,  as  well  as  for  his  son-in-law,  who,  being 
abroad,  loses  his  seat  for  Hull ;  and  because  I  have  not 
money,  or  popularity  of  my  own,  to  obtain  a  seat  in  the 


11(3  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1812. 

more  regular  and  desirable  way.  I  need  not  own  to 
you,  for  3'ou  would  guess  as  much,  that  it  is  some  morti- 
fication to  me  to  be  thrown  out  of  the  course,  and  that 
I  indulge  myself  with  regretting  that  I  shall  no  longer 
have  the  opportunity  of  trying  to  be  useful  in  the  im- 
mediate concerns  of  the  public.  With  the  usual  repent- 
ance that  is  felt  at  the  close  of  any  state  of  existence,  I 
am  something  sorry  and  something  ashamed,  that,  dur- 
ing the  time  I  had  such  opportunity,  I  did  so  little.  As 
for  the  future,  I  am  not  inconsolable ;  my  own  resources 
for  employment  and  amusement  are  quite  enough.* 

(unfinished.) 

Letter  CXC.     TO  SIR  SA^klUEL  ROMILLY. 
Mv  dear  Sir  Lincoln's  Inn,  15th  Oct.  1812. 

I  feel  very  painfully  our  disappointment  at  Bris- 
tol. What  annoys  me  most  at  present,  is  my  uncer- 
tainty about  your  coming  into  Parliament  at  all.  I 
hope  you  will  not  decline  a  seat,  if  any  of  those  who 
have  boroughs  should  (as  I  cannot  doubt  they  will)  put 
it  in  3^our  power.  I  know  your  objection  to  that  mode 
of  holding  a  seat  in  the  House ;  but  as  long  as  the  re- 
presentation continues  on  its  actual  footing,  I  cannot 
agree  that  a  man  who  knows  he  can  serve  the  public, 
ought  to  refuse  that  opportunity  of  serving  them. 
While  I  take  so  great  a  freedom  as  to  express  this  to 
you,  from  my  earnest  anxiety  to  see  you  again  in  the 

*  This  unfinished  letter  had  fallen  accldently  among  my  brother's  papers. 
I  regret  that  I  cannot  give  even  one  of  the  many  letters  he  must  have  Avritten 
to  this  intimate  friend. '  I  applied  to  Mr.  Smith,  several  years  ago,  to  know  if 
he  had  any  in  his  possession,  and  he  replied  in  nearly  the  same  terms  as  the 
following,  "which  he  afterwards  used,  on  a  similar  occasion,  to  Mr.  Robert  Mack- 
intosh : —  "  You  ask  me  for  some  of  your  late  father's  letters;  I  am  sorry  to 
sav  I  have  none  to  send  you.  L^pon  principle,  I  keep  no  letters  except  those 
on  business.  I  have  not  a  single  letter  from  him,  nor  from  any  human  being, 
in  my  possession."  —  Life  of  Sir  James  MacJcintosh,  voh  ii.  p.  499.  —  Ed. 


jEt.  35.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  117 

House  of  Commons,  I  can  at  the  same  time  assure  you, 
that  I  should  not  hold  this  opinion,  if  I  entertained  the 
least  doubt  that  such  a  step  could  in  any  degree  affect 
your  public  or  parliamentary  reputation.  I  shall  re- 
gard it  as  one  of  the  greatest  public  losses,  if  you  are 
not  in  the  House  this  Parliament ;  I  trust  you  will  not, 
by  refusing  a  close  borough,  compel  us  to  impute  that 
misfortune  to  yourself  Believe  me,  my  dear  sir,  with 
much  attachment, 

Very  sincerely  yours, 

Fea.  Horner. 


Letter  CXCI.    FROM  SIR  SAMUEL  ROMILLY. 
Mv  dear  Sir  Eastbourne,  18th  Oct.  1812. 

T  am  very  much  obliged  to  you  for  the  anxiety 
you  have  felt  about  me.  I  really  believe  that  my 
friends  feel  more  sensibly  my  disappointment  at  Bristol 
than  I  do  myself  I  certainly  was  very  anxious  to  suc- 
ceed, and,  till  the  third  day  of  the  election,  I  thought 
my  success  certain ;  but  after  that,  I  soon  saw  what  was 
to  happen,  and  had  made  up  my  mind  to  it.  It  is  not  a 
little  fortunate  for  me,  that  I  have  got  out  of  such  a 
contest  without  a  single  occurrence  unpleasant  to  me, 
though  I  had  the  Tories  on  the  one  hand,  and  Hunt  on 
the  other,  anxiously  watching  to  take  advantage  of  any 
thing  I  might  do,  or  any  unguarded  expression  I  might 
use,  which  could  be  turned  to  my  disadvantage.  Since 
the  election  was  over,  I  have  been  reflecting  on  many 
circumstances,  which  I  would  not  allow  to  occupy  my 
mind  while  it  was  depending,  and  which  seem  to  aflbrd 
reasons  why  I  should  rejoice  at  my  defeat.  The  Bristol 
business  certainly  Avould,  in  addition  to  my  other  la- 
bours, have  overloaded  me  with  fatigue,  and  no  doubt 


llg  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1812. 

the  very  West  India  merchants  who  most  actively  op- 
posed me,  would  not  have  been  the  most  backward  in 
exactinfj"  my  services  on  all  occasions.  There  seems  no 
prospect,  too,  that  Bristol  will  in  future  be  ever,  in  my 
time,  without  a  contest,  and  a  long  tedious  election, 
which  is  to  me  most  hateful.  I  don't  know  how  suffi- 
ciently to  thank  the  gentlemen,  who  were  kind  enough 
to  form  themselves  into  a  committee  to  conduct  what 
related  to  my  election  in  London,  nor  the  manner  in 
which  I  can  best  do  it.  Will  you  do  it  for  me  ?  or  shall 
I  write  a  letter  to  the  chairman ;  and,  in  that  case,  will 
you  tell  me  who  the  chairman  is  ?  The  Bristol  com- 
mittee I  had  frequent  opportunities  of  thanking  in 
person. 

I  certainly  have  not  made  up  my  mind  to  refuse 
coming  into  Parliament  in  the  way  you  mention.  My 
opinion  upon  that  subject  is  greatly  altered,  since  it  has 
become  the  only  legal  way  in  which  to  me  Parliament 
can  be  accessible  :  there  will  be  time  enough,  however, 
for  me  to  consider  what  I  should  do,  if  any  offer  were 
made  me. 

I  remain,  my  dear  Sir, 

Ever  and  most  sincerely  yours, 

Samuel  Romilly. 


Letter   CXCII.     TO  LORD  HOLLAND. 
Mv  dear  Lord  Lincoln's  Inn,  19th  Oct.  1812. 

When  I  came  home,  I  found  a  letter  from  Lord 
Lansdowne,  in  which  he  tells  me  of  Lord  Grenville's 
great  kindness  al)out  me.  He  has  written  a  second  let- 
ter to  Lord  Lansdowne,  in  which  he  says  he  has  reason 
to  think  that  I  may  be  returned  very  soon  after  the 
meeting  of  Parliament,  in  a  way  that  will  be  agreeable 


^T.  35.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  Hg 

to  me.  I  need  not  say,  how  much  I  am  gratified  by 
this  unmerited  service  and  attention  to  me  from  Lord 
Grenville  ;  and  I  wish  him  to  know  that  I  am  perfectly 
sensible  of  this.  But  I  suppose  it  is  not  proper  for  me 
to  say  any  thing  to  him  myself,  until  the  thing  is  over 
one  way  or  the  other ;  for,  either  way,  I  shall  feel  quite 
the  same  towards  him.  But  I  wish  you  to  consider,  in 
the  first  instance,  claims  that  are  far  before  mine.  When 
the  Bristol  contest  was  over,  I  wrote  to  Romilh',  under 
an  idea  that  he  might  object  to  come  in  for  a  rotten 
borough,  urging  him  as  strongly  as  I  could,  not  to  suffer 
a  feeling  of  that  nature  to  stand  in  the  way  of  his  duty 
to  the  public,  if  he  should  have  such  a  seat  offered  liim. 
I  have  heard  from  him  this  morning,  and  I  am  happy  to 
find  he  is  not  disposed  to  decline,  it.  He  says,  "  I  cer- 
tainly have  not  made  up  my  mind  to  refuse  coming  into 
Parliament  in  the  way  you  mention ;  my  opinion  upon 
that  subject  is  greatly  altered,  since  it  has  become  the 
only  legal  way  in  which  to  me  Parliament  can  be  acces- 
sible. There  will  be  time  enough,  however,  for  me  to 
consider  wdiat  I  should  do  if  any  offer  were  made  me." 
It  seems  to  me  so  very  important  on  every  public  ground, 
and  for  the  true  interests  of  the  Whig  party,  that  Eo- 
milly  should  be  brought  in,  that  I  thought  it  right  to 
put  you  in  possession  of  his  sentiments. 

Yours  most  truly, 

Fra.  Horner. 

P.  S.  If  Lord  Grenville's  communication  to  Lord 
Lansdowne  has  any  connexion  with  what  you  hinted  to 
me  yesterday,  pray  let  there  be  no  doubt  whatever  left 
of  my  determination  to  vote  for  parliamentary  reform, 
or  of  the  full  extent  of  my  democratical  tendencies  and 
opinions. 


120  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1812. 


Letter  CXCHI.     TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 
My  clear  Murray,  Lincoln's  inn,  21st  Oct.  1812. 

I  received  both  your  letters  from  Liverpool,  and 
am  much  j)leased  that  you  made  the  exertion  of  going 
there  to  assist  Brougham,  particularly  as  he  tells  me 
you  did  him  an  important  service  in  an  affair  of  some 
delicacy.  His  disapjDointment  came  upon  me  quite 
unexpectedly,  for  I  looked  upon  his  return  at  least  as 
certain ;  and  nothing,  except  Eomilly's  similar  disappoint- 
ment, has  given  me  greater  or  more  sincere  distress.  It 
is  a  great  public  loss,  not  to  have  Brougham  in  Parlia- 
ment ;  it  is  rendered  greater,  by  his  failing  in  an  attempt, 
to  which  he  had  been  encouraged  by  the  popularity  of 
his  eminent  services  last  summer  ;  and  what  aggravates 
it  as  a  public  misfortune,  is,  that  Canning,  the  author  of 
those  same  Orders  in  Council,  should  be  elected,  with 
such  triumph,  upon  the  very  spot  where  their  ruinous 
consequences  w^ere  most  severely  experienced.  It 
seems  clearly  enough  ascertained,  that  the  real  cause  of 
Brougham's  failure  is  the  indiscretion  of  having  joined 
Creevy  with  him,  and  attempted  to  carry  both  members 
upon  the  popular  interest.  It  is  a  mistake  which  has  been 
committed  over  and  over  again,  with  the  same  fatal  re- 
sult. It  is  among  the  very  sincere  and  zealous  friends 
of  liberty,  that  you  will  find  the  most  perfect  specimens 
of  wrong-headedness,  men  of  a  dissenting,  provincial 
cast  of  virtue,  who  (according  to  one  of  Sharp's  favour- 
ite phrases)  will  drive  a  wedge  the  broad  end  foremost, 
utter  strangers  to  all  prudence  and  moderation  in  politi- 
cal business,  who  are  sensible  enough,  when  they  find 
themselves  in  defeat,  that  it  is  worse  than  partial  success, 
but  who,  while  the  thing  is  in  contest,  imagine  it  would 


Mr.  35.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  121 

be  a  sort  of  treachery  to  their  cause  to  accept  hi  the 
first  instance  a  whole  half  of  the  object  they  are  con- 
tending for. 

If  Brougham  is  to  be  out  of  Parliament,  which  I  hope 
and  trust  will  not  be  the  case,  I  am  very  far  from  being 
able  to  accede  to  your  opinion,  that  this  public  loss  will 
be  counterbalanced  by  advantages  to  him  in  a  private 
point  of  view,  such  as  ought  to  take  away  all  regret 
from  his  friends  and  himself  I  cannot  conceive  any 
single  private  advantage  he  will  gain  by  it,  of  the  least 
moment.  Money,  to  be  sure,  he  may  make  in  abun- 
dance by  parliamentary  business ;  for  that  loose,  ram- 
bling sort  of  practice  is  richly  paid ;  but  no  professional 
fame  or  science  is  to  be  gained  in  that  department  -,  and 
what  are  a  few  hundred  acres  more  in  Westmoreland 
worth  to  Brougham  ?  Depend  upon  it,  he  will  not  quit 
politics,  even  for  the  time  he  is  out  of  Parliament ;  but 
will  exert  his  boundless  activity  in  another  sphere,  and 
in  other  directions,  where  his  exertions  will  be  probably 
less  advantageous  to  his  own  reputation,  and  to  the  wel- 
fare of  the  public.  I  was  made  quite  happy  by  your 
account  of  the  manner  in  which  he  took  leave  of  the 
contest  when  it  became  hopeless ;  and  I  lost  no  time  in 
communicating  your  account  of  it  to  such  of  our  friends 
in  London  as  were  sure  to  take  a  proper  interest  in  what 
concerns  him. 

I  have  some  news  to  give  you  about  myself:  as  I 
have  now  reason  to  believe,  that  very  soon  after  the 
meeting  of  Parliament,  when  the  double  returns  are  dis- 
posed of,  I  shall  have  a  seat  in  my  power,  which  comes 
to  me  in  a  manner  so  perfectly  satisfactory  and  agree- 
able to  me,  that  I  shall  have  no  hesitation  in  accepting 
of  it.  I  shall  give  you  the  particulars,  as  soon  as  I  am 
at  liberty ;  in  the  mean  while,  I  wish  not  to  say  that  I 

VOL.  II.  11 


]^22  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1812. 

have  any  such  prospect,  except  to  my  nearest  friends. 
I  suppose  you  will  regret  all  this,  according  to  your 
former  opinions ;  which  I  am  far  from  thinking  as  erro- 
neous as  that  in  Brougham's  case  appears  to  me ;  but 
which  do  seem  to  be  mistaken  upon  the  whole,  though 
for  quite  other  reasons.  I  am  in  much  greater  danger 
of  losing  all  interest  in  party  politics,  than  of  carrying 
those  feelings  to  excess ;  and  have  not  the  least  doubt, 
that  I  could  return,  with  undiminished  enjoyment,  to  all 
the  pleasures  and  luxurious  tranquillity  of  speculative 
literature.  But  my  choice,  if  a  wrong  one,  was  made 
long  ago ;  and  I  do  not  permit  myself  now  to  canvass 
the  propriety  of  it,  but  should  regard  it  as  a  misfortune 
to  be  thrown  out  of  the  course  in  which  that  choice, 
aided  by  circumstances  and  connexions,  had  directed 
me. 

If  thrown  out,  I  shall  not  find  it  hard  to  make  up  my 
mind  to  the  change  ;  but  I  would  rather  go  on.  A  very 
slow,  and  a  very  quiet  walk  for  a  public  life,  is  the  only 
one  for  which  I  feel  myself  to  be  fit ;  though  in  such  a 
one,  with  steadiness,  I  hope  I  may  in  process  of  time 
find  some  opportunities  of  rendering  service  to  the 
country.  One  thing  I  feel  more  every  day  ;  that 
nothing  but  the  alliance  of  politics,  in  the  manner  in 
which  I  take  a  share  in  them,  would  be  sufficient  to 
attach  me  to  the  pursuits  of  the  legal  profession,  in 
which  I  have  little  prospect  of  eminence,  and  very  mo- 
derate desires  of  wealth ;  but  in  which,  by  possessing 
the  opportunities  of  legislative  experiment,  I  do  not 
despair  one  day  of  doing  some  good.  The  occasion 
has  drawn  from  me  too  much  egotism,  which  you  must 
forgive. 

Yours  ever  affectionately, 

Fra.  Horner. 


JEx.  35.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  123 


Letter  CXCIV.    TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 

My  dear  Murray,  London,  8th  Dec.  1812. 

I  hope  Mrs.  Murray  has  not  been  more  indis- 
posed again  since  William  left  Edinburgh.  I  heard  of 
her  illness,  first  from  him,  and  at  the  same  time,  as  I  flat- 
tered myself,  of  her  recovery.  Pray  let  me  hear  how 
she  is. 

There  was  not  the  slightest  reason  to  believe  that 
Tierney  was  going  to  Madras  ;  that  he  either  had 
thoughts  of  it,  or  had  it  in  his  power.  Some  of  the  Di- 
rectors may  have  given  out  that  they  would  be  glad  of 
such  an  appointment,  as  they  would  no  doubt  have  rea- 
son to  be.  But  Tierney,  whatever  faults  he  may  have, 
is  not  the  man  to  take  an  office  of  any  sort  from  the 
present  ministers,  or  to  avail  himself  of  the  untrue  pre- 
text, that  an  Indian  government  can  be  accepted  with- 
out being  held  under  the  actual  administration  at  home. 
His  being  out  of  Parliament  is  entirely  owing  to  acci- 
dent and  bad  management,  which  (I  hope)  will  soon  be 
remedied. 

Brougham's  success  at  the  bar  is  prodigious  ;  much 
more  rapid  and  extensive  than  that  of  any  barrister 
since  Erskine's  starting,  I  am  going  down  to-morrow  to 
hear  him  in  defence  of  Hunt,  which  is  a  cause  of  great 
expectation.  I  have  been  present  at  several  arguments 
of  his  in  Banc  ;  of  which  I  should  not,  to  say  the  truth, 
make  a  very  high  report ;  that  is,  in  comparison  of  his 
powers  and  his  reputation.  Great  reach  and  compass  of 
mind  he  must  ever  display,  and  he  shows  much  industry, 
too,  in  collecting  information ;  but  his  arguments  are 
not  in  the  best  style  of  legal  reasoning.  Precision  and 
clearness  in  the  details,  symmetry  in  the  putting  of  them 


124  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1812. 

together,  an  air  of  finish  and  unity  in  the  whole,  are  the 
merits  of  that  style  ;  and  there  is  not  one  of  those  qua- 
lities in  which  he  is  not  very  defective.  But  his  desul- 
tory reasonings  have  much  force  in  some  parts,  and 
much  ingenuity  in  others ;  and  he  always  proves  himself 
to  have  powers  for  another  sort  of  speaking,  and  a 
higher  sort.  What  I  say  now,  applies  only  to  his  ap- 
pearances in  Banc ;  having  never  yet  heard  him  address 
a  jury. 

How  deeply  interesting  is  the  Russian  war  now  be- 
come !  It  seems  hardly  too  sanguine  to  expect,  that  the 
world  is  to  be  set  free  from  bondage,  and  that  the  jus- 
tice of  fortune  is  at  length  to  be  made  manifest,  in  the 
signal  punishment  of  the  Conqueror,  who  has  so  long 
harassed  the  earth  and  subjugated  the  fairest  portion  of 
it ;  qui  res  Jmmanas  (would  we  could  say)  miscuit  oUm. 
We  cannot  wish  for  a  more  signal  vengeance  to  the 
cause  of  the  liberties  of  mankind,  than  that  he  should 
fall,  or  at  least  lose  his  purple,  in  this  unsuccessful  aggres- 
sion upon  the  independence  of  a  great  nation.  It  will 
be  no  small  enhancement  of  this  triumph,  if  we  are 
really  to  enjoy  it,  because  it  will  strengthen  that  sense  of 
security,  which  is  the  best  fruit  of  it,  that  the  victory  is 
due,  not  to  the  government  of  Russia,  which  would 
have  long  ago  submitted,  but  to  the  body  of  the  Mosco- 
vite  people,  nobles  and  peasantry.  Surely  there  is 
nothing  in  history  so  delightful  to  read  or  witness,  no- 
thing so  useful  in  its  example,  as  the  successful  resistance 
of  foreign  invaders ;  whether  it  be  by  the  patriotism  of 
a  civilised  and  free  state,  or  by  the  instinct  of  barbarians 
and  slaves  ;  whether  it  be  Greek,  or  Dutch,  republicans, 
whom  we  have  to  admire ;  whether  it  be  the  repulse  of 
partitioning  confederates  by  the  enthusiastic  Jacobinism 
of  France,  or  the  repulse  of  French  genius,  and  military 


iEx.  35.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  ]^25 

science  in  perfection,  by  the  brute  valour  of  Russians 
and  Tartars.  How  vast  will  the  events  of  our  clay  ap- 
pear, to  those  who  shall  be  at  a  sufficient  distance  from 
them  to  see  their  real  magnitude  !  Will  not  the  march 
of  the  French  host  to  Moscow  be  judged  the  very  mas- 
terpiece of  the  military  art,  in  point  of  execution  :  an 
achievement,  that  deserved  no  meaner  disappointment, 
than  by  the  barbaric  magnanimity,  which  the  people  in- 
vaded have  shown,  in  burning  the  ancient  capital  of 
their  empire.  One  can  hardly  think  of  such  things  and 
not  use  big  words. 

Wednesday.  —  The  Hunts  are  convicted  -,  but  not  with- 
out the  jury  retiring  for  about  ten  minutes.  Brougham 
made  a  powerful  speech,  unequal,  and  wanting  that  unity 
which  is  so  effective  with  a  jury ;  some  parts  rather  elo- 
quent, particularly  in  the  conclusion,  where  he  had  the 
address,  without  giving  any  advantage,  to  fasten  the 
words  effeminacii  and  coivardice  where  every  body  could 
apply  them.  One  very  difficult  point  of  his  case,  the 
conduct  of  the  regent  to  the  princess,  he  managed  with 
skill  and  great  effect ;  and  his  transition  from  that  sub- 
ject to  the  next  part  of  his  case  was  a  moment  of  real 
eloquence.  Lord  Ellenborough  was  more  than  usually 
impatient,  and  indecently  violent :  he  said  that  Brougham 
was  inoculated  with  all  the  poison  of  the  libel,  and  told 
the  jury,  the  issue  they  had  to  try  was,  whether  we 
were  to  live  for  the  future  under  the  dominion  of  li- 
bellers. 

Yours  ever  sincerely, 

Fiu.  Horner. 


11 


126  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1812. 


Letter  CXCV.    TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 
My  dear  Murray,  Lincoln's  inn,  ICth  Dec.  1812. 

You  give  me  a  kind  scold  for  having  said  no- 
thing of  myself  I  have  nothing  to  say  but  good.  My 
health  is  much  better  this  winter  than  it  has  been  for 
two  or  three  years ;  I  adhere  virtuously  to  my  water 
beverage  ;  and  if  I  could  keep  early  hours,  I  believe  I 
should  never  ail  at  all ;  but  that  is  not  to  be  done  in 
London. 

I  entirely  agree  with  you  in  opinion,  that  the  property- 
tax,  as  collected  from  the  farmers  in  Scotland,  must 
have  a  hurtful  effect  upon  agriculture,  and  is  assessed 
by  an  unequal  and  arbitrary  rule.  The  principle  of  the 
tax  in  other  cases  is,  that  of  an  assessment  upon  actual 
profits,  and  rackrent  is  no  criterion  of  the  farmer's  ac- 
tual profits.  I  cannot  see  that  there  is  any  greater  diffi- 
culty in  raising  this  tax  from  that  class  of  men,  by  a 
requisition  from  them  of  their  gains  every  year,  than  in 
the  instance  of  mercantile  and  professional  persons ;  on 
the  contrary,  a  farmer's  income  from  his  proper  business 
is  far  more  ostensible  to  his  neighbours  than  those  of  the 
other  sort,  and  his  actual  rent  affords  such  a  check  upon 
false  returns,  as  would  protect  the  revenue  against  them 
much  more  effectually,  than  it  protects  itself  against 
them  from  merchants  and  men  of  professions.  What 
you  suggest,  —  a  corresponding  committee,  including  all 
the  counties,  is  the  most  likely  method  of  obtaining 
redress,  if  the  matter  is  taken  up  by  people  of  respecta- 
bility and  with  resolution.  And  I  should  be  glad  to  see 
this.  Without  a  previous  demonstration  of  that  nature,  it 
is  of  no  use  to  call  the  attention  of  the  House  of  Com- 
mons to  it ;  it  is  very  difficult  to  get  their  attention  to 


iEx.  35.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  127 

any  thing  Scotch.  The  business  was  taken  up  with 
much  spirit  formerly  by  several  of  the  counties,  particu- 
larly (I  think)  Roxburgh ;  why  did  they  let  it  drop  ? 
You  may  rely  upon  me,  if  you  wish  me  to  take  any  part 
about  it ;  only  give  me  timely  information. 

There  is  but  one  sentiment  of  condemnation,  respect- 
ing Lord  Ellenborough's  intemperate  and  indecent  con- 
duct at  Hunt's  trial.  This  is  not  only  universal  among 
the  bar,  who  feel  this  as  a  professional  concern;  but 
among  laymen,  of  all  political  denominations.  I  have 
reason  to  believe,  also,  that  the  other  judges  regret  his 
conduct  very  much.  The  session  of  Parliament  can 
hardly  pass  over,  without  some  pointed  notice  of  it. 

I  am  delighted  to  see,  at  last,  another  good  number 
of  the  Review,  worthy  of  its  former  name.  There 
seems  to  be  but  one  article  of  montlily  politics,  which  is 
too  short  a  life  for  a  quarterly  book.  Allen  is  delighted 
with  the  orthodoxy  of  the  review  of  Leckie's  pamphlet, 
and  says  it  is  the  best  constitutional  article  Jeffrey  has 
ever  written.  The  Miisce  Edinenses  excite  a  very  irreve- 
rent mirth  among  your  collegers,  who,  instead  of  being 
disposed  to  give  a  liberal  encouragement  to  our  at- 
tempts, seem  to  regard  it  as  an  improper  ambition,  and 
something  out  of  the  course  of  nature  for  Scotsmen, 
even  to  try  such  excellence  ;  I  saw  Bobus  and  the 
Mufti  *  snickering  together  at  the  very  mention  of  this 
title.  This  scorn  of  theirs  makes  me  anxious  that  we 
should  give  them  one  more  Buchanan. 

Yours  affectionately, 

Fra.  Horner. 

I  shall  not  be  returned  to  Parliament  till  after  the 
adjournment ;  I  expect  it  in  the  course  of  February. 

*  Mr.  Robert  Smith  and  Mr.  Whishaw. 


128  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1813. 


Letter  CXCVI.    TO  HENRY  HALLAM,  ESQ. 
My  dear  Hallam,  Salisbury,  7th  March,  1813. 

I  thank  you  for  your  very  kind  inquiries,  which 
I  can  satisfy  in  the  fullest  manner  j  for  all  the  symptoms 
of  my  late  indisposition  are  now  gone,  except  the  un- 
avoidable weakness  which  must  continue  for  a  few  days 
still.  I  am  taking  special  care  of  myself;  keeping  out 
of  the  way  of  these  piercing  winds,  and  not  venturing 
to  do  more  than  sun  myself  under  a  south  wall,  like  a 
selfish  tortoise,  at  this  season. 

When  we  recollect  the  diffident  language  that  we 
held  about  the  Catholic  cause,  before  the  debate  came 
on,  the  advantages  secured  by  the  late  vote  seem  im- 
mense.* We  thought  for  certain  that  some  ground  had 
been  lost  since  the  resolution  of  the  last  Parliament, 
whereas  it  is  now  manifest  that  we  w^ere  gaining  ground 
all  along,  and  that  the  progress  of  temperate  conviction 
has  been  steady  and  unremitted.  What  an  illustration 
of  the  benefits  of  continued  discussion,  through  Parha- 
ment  and  the  press,  where  the  great  interests  of  justice 
and  liberty  are  the  subject  of  controversy ;  and  what  a 
pride  it  is  for  England,  to  have  such  a  controversy  lead- 
ing slowly  but  surely  to  the  truth,  and  to  one  of  the 
most  signal  ameliorations  of  government  in  favour  of 

*  Upon  a  motion  of  Mr.  Grattan,  "  That  this  House  will  resolve  itself  into 
a  Committee  of  the  whole  House,  to  take  into  its  most  serious  consideration 
the  state  of  the  laws  affecting  his  Majesty's  Roman  Catholic  subjects  in  Great 
Britain  and  Ireland,  with  a  view  to  such  a  final  and  conciliatory  adjustment, 
as  may  be  conducive  to  the  power  and  strength  of  the  United  Kingdom,  to 
the  stability  of  the  Protestant  Establishment,  and  to  the  general  satisfaction 
and  concord  of  all  classes  of  his  Majesty's  subjects," 

Tlie  division  was  —  For  Mr.  Grattan's  motion       .        .        .         264 
Against  it       .         »         .         .         •         •         224 

Iklajority  ...  40 

Ed. 


^T.  35.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  129 

civil  freedom,  during  the  terror  and  darkness  in  which 
the  rest  of  the  world  is  involved.  I  look  with  great 
anxiety  to  the  Committee  ;  not  only  on  account  of  the 
arts  which  will  be  employed  to  embarrass  it,  but  for 
fear  of  the  unfavourable  impression  with  which  the  late 
vote  may  be  received  throughout  the  country,  even  by 
liberal  men,  if  it  has  the  appearance  of  being  followed  by 
difficulties  which  the  ablest  men  in  Parliament  cannot 
remove.  I  believe  none  such  exist  in  the  nature  of 
the  measure,  though  there  may  be  in  the  habitual 
alienation  and  mutual  repugnance  which  several  of 
those  leaders  feel  for  one  another.  Yet  I  would  fain 
hope,  the  public  spirit,  which  they  all  possess,  will  on 
this  great  concern  bring  them  together  in  earnest,  and 
make  them  feel  how  much  the  reputation  of  all  of  them 
as  statesmen  is  staked,  upon  their  skilful  and  successful 
use  of  the  advantage  which  an  honest  vote  of  the 
House  has  put  into  their  hands,  and  how  the  final  ad- 
justment of  this  embarrassing  claim  will  clear  the  great 
field  of  public  affairs  for  other  exertions  of  their  am- 
bition and  patriotism,  whether  they  are  to  be  still 
adverse  to  one  another,  or  shall  make  an  experiment 
of  acting  together.  I  cannot  think  that  Grattan,  and 
Lord  Grey,  and  Canning  would  find  it  very  difficult  to 
agree  upon  a  plan  of  emancipation  and  securities ;  and 
if  they  come  to  the  Committee  with  a  plan  agreed  on, 
that  Bankes  and  Bragge  Bathurst  would  find  it  easy  to 
disunite  them.  Though  the  House,  in  its  present  tem- 
per, might  perhaps  be  induced  to  pass  a  partial  measure, 
I  own  it  seems  to  me  imprudent  in  any  of  the  great 
leaders  of  the  Catholic  cause  to  think  of  originating  any 
compromise  of  that  sort ;  they  may  be  forced  to  accept 
at  present  only  part  of  their  claim  for  the  Catholics; 
but  to  preserve  the  strength  of  their  cause,  they  ought 


130  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1813. 

to  keep  it  entire,  and  there  is  no  part  of  the  argument 
which  it  is  more  important  to  impress  upon  the  pubhc 
mind,  than  that  to  do  good  you  must  give  all. 

I  am  sorry  to  hear  that  the  negotiation  for  an  ex- 
change of  prisoners  is  broke  off.  What  a  hint  to  the 
Royal  Family  is  conveyed  by  Wortley's  speech  ;  it  is 
like  some  of  the  signs  that  appeared  among  the  Tories, 
after  the  trial  of  the  Bishops. 

Yours,  my  dear  Hallam,  very  truly, 

Fea.  Horner. 


Letter  CXCVH.    FROM  WILLIAM  FREEMANTLE,  ESQ. 
Dear  Horner,  Stanhope  Street,  16th  March,  1813. 

I  wrote  a  note  to  you  yesterday,  not  recollecting 
you  were  on  the  circuit  :  my  object  was  to  speak  to 
you  on  the  subject  of  a  seat  in  parliament. 

I  have  reason  to  know  that  a  seat  will  be  vacant  in 
the  course  of  ten  days,  which  I  am  authorised  to  offer 
you,  begging  you  to  understand  it  to  be  without  stipu- 
lation or  pledge  of  any  sort  or  kind,  saving  that  which, 
of  course,  you  would  feel  it  just  to  admit,  namely,  to 
resign  whenever  your  politics  should  differ  from  the 
person  who  has  the  means  of  recommending  you  to  the 
seat.  The  expense  will  be  merely  the  dinner,  which  I 
rather  think  does  not  usually  amount  to  more  than  30/. 
or  40/. 

If  this  meets  with  your  wishes,  I  will  trouble  you  to 
let  me  know,  as  I  am  sure  it  has  long  been  an  object 
with  the  person  whose  sentiments  I  speak,  to  place  you 
w^here  your  character  and  abilities  have  before  rendered 
you  so  useful ;  and  it  has  only  been  from  unavoidable 
circumstances  that  the  offer  was  delayed. 

Ever  believe  me,  dear  Horner,  truly  yours, 

W.  Freemantle. 


^T.  35.]  CORRESPONDENCE. 


Letter  CXCVIII.    TO  WILLIAM  FREEMANTLE,  ESQ. 

Dear  Freemantle,  E-^*^*^^'  ^^^^^  ^''^^••^'^'  i^i^. 

I  have  this  evening  received  your  letter  dated 
yesterday,  and  at  the  same  time  the  one  which  you  had 
sent  the  day  before  to  Lincoln's  Inn.  It  is  a  very  high 
gratification  to  me  to  have  been  supposed  in  any  degree 
worthy  of  the  proposal  which  you  have  had  the  kind- 
ness to  convey  to  me,  and  nothing  can  be  more  per- 
fectly satisfactory  to  my  mind  than  the  terms  in  which 
you  have  expressed  it.  I  beg,  therefore,  you  will  be  so 
good  as  to  communicate  my  acceptance  of  this  offer,  by 
which  I  feel  myself  to  be  so  much  flattered  and  obliged. 
It  will  not  be  in  my  power  to  return  to  London  for 
some  time ;  but  you  will,  perhaps,  take  the  trouble  of 
writing  to  me,  when  you  can  give  me  further  informa- 
tion or  directions. 

Believe  me  yours  truly, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CXCIX.    TO  LORD  HOLLAND. 

Dear  Lord  Holland,  London,  20th  May,  1813. 

Your  argument,  from  the  manifesto  of  the  Re- 
gency, does  not  admit  of  an  answer;  yet  the  foolish 
people,  who  manage  the  No-Popery  cause  at  present, 
were  all  delighted  with  the  appearance  of  those  docu- 
ments. 

You  and  Allen  must  be  right,  I  think,  about  the  ad- 
vantage to  be  derived  from  keeping  the  Dissenters  and 
Catholics  on  the  same  footing,  so  as  to  give  to  each  the 
services  of  the  other  in  their  common  cause :  though  I 
was  not  prepared  to  go  so  far  as  he  did  some  time  ago. 


132  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1813. 

that  the  CathoHcs  should  not  be  relieved,  if  we  could 
not  give  the  Dissenters  at  the  same  time  all  they  ought 
to  have.  It  will  be  a  great  consolation  to  Lord  Grey, 
to  find  what  your  sentiments  are  upon  the  omission  of 
the  words  respecting  the  Sacrament  in  the  Catholic 
Bill ;  for  his  chief  apprehension  on  that  point  seemed  to 
be,  that  you  would  think  the  Dissenters  ill  used  by  that 
omission.  For  myself,  I  would  rather,  I  own,  have 
given  the  Catholics  that  farther  step,  though  one  ahead 
of  the  Dissenters ;  for  it  seems  that  we  can  hardly 
expect  to  obtain  our  object  of  complete  toleration  by 
regular  approaches,  or  by  skilful  management  of  parties, 
but  that  we  must  scramble  for  it,  and  make  the  most  of 
lucky  moments,  and  take  as  much  for  any  description  of 
sectaries  as  the  accidents  or  humour  of  the  day  will  let 
us  have.  And,  indeed,  I  think,  if  we  had  got  an  express 
release  from  the  Sacramental  Test  to  the  Catholics,  the 
argument  for  granting  the  same  ease  to  Protestant  Dis- 
senters would  next  year  have  been  found  irresistible. 
However,  it  will  be  some  comfort  for  the  loss  of  this,  if 
it  shall  have  the  effect  of  inducing  the  Dissenters  and 
Catholics  to  pull  together. 

Have  you  heard  enough  of  our  doings  in  Sicily,  in 
March  last,  to  have  formed  an  opinion  upon  them  ? 
They  have  very  much  the  cast  of  our  Indian  proceed- 
ings with  nabobs  and  rajahs.  There  are  stories  of  some 
arbitrary  imprisonments,  which  I  do  not  like,  and  both 
King  and  Queen  seem  to  have  been  treated  with  more 
violence  than  was  warrantable,  without  doing  more  : 
but  I  am  imperfectly  informed  about  this.  Lamb,  I 
suppose,  has  come  home  to  give  government  a  full 
account  of  all  that  has  passed. 

Ever  yours  truly, 

Fra.  Horner. 


^T.  35.]  HOUSE  OF   COMMONS.  I33 

From  the  time  of  Mr.  Horner's  return  as  member  for 
St.  Mawes,  on  the  17th  of  April,  to  the  end  of  the  session 
on  the  22d  of  July,  he  is  reported  to  have  spoken  on 
five  occasions,  but  only  very  briefly  on  each. 

In  a  discussion  on  the  affairs  of  India,  on  the  14th  of 
June,  Sir  John  Newport  contended,  that  the  preamble 
of  the  bill  then  under  the  consideration  of  the  House 
should  declare,  —  that  the  sovereignty  of  the  Crown  of 
the  United  Kingdom  of  Great  Britain  and  Ireland  over 
the  territory  and  population  of  India  is  paramount  and 
undoubted.  Mr.  Horner  took  the  same  view  of  the 
question,  and  said,  "  he  considered  such  a  declaration  to 
be  peculiarly  necessary,  as  well  from  certain  assertions 
which  had  been  made  by  an  honourable  director  of  the 
East  India  Company  in  that  House,  as  to  a  claim  of  pro- 
perty in  India,,  independent  of  the  Crown,  as  from  seve- 
ral publications  which  had  gone  forth,  affecting  to  sup- 
port the  pretensions  of  the  East  India  Company.  But 
this  declaration  was  also  expedient,  with  reference  to  the 
claims  frequently  advanced  heretofore  by  foreign  powers, 
which  claims  might  be  renewed  on  the  return  of  peace." 

Next  day  Sir  Henry  Parnell,  as  chairman  of  the  Select 
Commi]ttee  on  the  Corn  Trade  of  the  United  Kingdom, 
called  the  attention  of  the  House  to  the  report  of  the 
committee,  which  had  been  laid  on  the  table.  A  series 
of  resolutions  had  been  laid  before  the  House,  of  which 
the  two  most  important  were  to  this  effect :  —  to  allow 
the  free  exportation  of  corn  from  the  United  Kingdom, 
without  duty  and  without  bounty ;  and,  to  allow  the 
importation  of  corn  under  a  graduated  scale  of  duties. 
Sir  Henry  Parnell  moved,  "  That  the  House  will  imme- 
diately resolve  itself  into  a  Committee  of  the  whole 
House,  to  consider  of  the  said  Report." 

VOL.  II.  •  12 


234  CORN  LAWS.  [1813. 

Lord  Archibald  Hamilton  moved  as  an  amendment, 
"  That  the  Report  be  taken  into  consideration  this  day 
three  months ; "  and  the  Chancellor  of  the  Exchequer 
having  spoken  in  favour  of  going  into  committee,  Mr, 
Horner  said,  that  "  he  was  astonished  that  the  Chancel- 
lor of  the  Exchequer  should  lend  his  authority  to  a  pro- 
ject like  the  present.  It  so  happened,  that  though  we 
had  corn  laws  in  our  statute  book,  we  had,  in  fact,  no 
corn  laws,  and  that  there  was  the  most  perfect  freedom 
in  the  trade  of  grain.  Now,  what  was  the  state  of  the 
country  with  respect  to  agricultural  improvement  ? 
The  fact  was,  that  tillage  had  never  increased  so  much, 
and  that  prices  had  never  been  before  so  regular.  For 
this,  if  reference  was  necessary,  he  would  refer  to  the 
Report  itself  With  respect  to  the  supply  of  grain  from 
foreign  countries,  the  evil  was  admitted  to  be,  not  in 
the  supply  itself,  but  in  the  danger  to  which  it  was 
exposed  of  being  cut  off.  Now,  it  so  happened,  that  at 
a  time  when  it  was  the  policy  of  an  enemy  to  prevent 
our  supply,  and  when  political  circumstances  were  the 
most  favourable  for  such  a  measure,  the  amount  of 
foreign  grain  imported  into  this  country  had  been 
greater  than  ever.  This  Report  proved,  that  in  spite 
of  all  the  regulations  of  the  enemy,  whenever  this 
country  was  in  want  of  foreign  grain,  it  could  get  it. 
There  were  several  principles  in  the  Report,  with  which 
he  agreed :  he  had  no  hesitation  in  agreeing  to  exporta- 
tion, and  the  abolition  of  a  bounty.  But  the  discussion 
of  that  night  convinced  him,  that  these  principles  were 
merely  thrown  out  by  way  of  conciliation,  and  that  the 
main  object  of  the  measure  was  to  prevent  importation 
from  foreign  countries,  except  when  prices  should  rise 
to  the  enormous  sums  stated  in  the  Report.  At  pre- 
sent, he  contended,  the  price  of  corn  was  high  beyond 


^T.  35.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  I35 

example,  and  was  such  as  to  afford  a  fair  profit  both  to 
landlord  and  tenant.  Supposhig  the  measure  of  his 
honourable  friend,  the  worthy  baronet,  (Sir  Henry  Par- 
nell,)  to  be  adopted,  then  would  the  increase  in  the 
price  of  grain  go  on,  depending  not  on  the  value  but 
on  the  depreciation  of  the  commodity.  The  poor  lists 
of  the  different  parishes  in  the  country,  he  contended, 
were  loaded  with  persons  perfectly  able  to  exist  by 
their  labour,  were  it  not  for  the  high  artificial  price  of 
commodities.  It  was  only  by  those  artificial  prices  that 
the  poor  were  prevented  from  living,  without  being 
burdensome  on  the  community." 

The  amendment  was  lost,  32  only  voting  for  it,  and 
136  against  it. 


Letter  CC.     TO  LORD  GRENVILLE. 
My  dear  Lord,  Lincoln's  inn,  22d  July,  1813. 

I  flattered  myself  it  would  have  been  in  my 
power  to  avail  myself  of  your  Lordship's  kindness,  in 
asking  me  to  Dropmore,  and  that  it  would  have  been 
in  my  power  to  have  proposed  a  visit  to  your  Lordship 
before  going  the  circuit ;  but  I  have  been  so  much  occu- 
pied, that  I  shall  be  under  the  necessity  of  setting  out 
for  the  West  of  England,  without  having  that  gratifi- 
cation. 

A  singular  political  event,  and  one  not  very  intelli- 
gible, was  announced  last  night ;  that  Canning  has  for- 
mally, and  with  some  solemnity,  disbanded  his  party ; 
telling  the  gentlemen  who  have  been  his  supporters 
during  the  session,  that  they  may  for  the  future,  consi- 
der themselves  as  unengaged  ;  and  that  he  is  no  longer 
to  be  regarded  as  their  head.  Ward  says  they  are  all 
turned  adrift  upon  the  wide  world,  but  as  he  has  stayed 


136  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1813. 

a  year  in  his  place,  he  thinks  himself  entitled  to  a  good 
character  from  his  master.  He  had  his  discharge  from 
the  mouth  of  Canning  liimself,  the  day  before  yesterday ; 
and  the  same  notification  was  made  to  Mr.  Robert  Smith 
yesterda}^  The  only  other  circumstance  I  have  yet 
heard,  connected  with  this  strange  incident,  is,  that 
Wellesley  Pole  has  been  complaining  very  much  that 
Canning  did  not  bring  matters  to  bear  with  the  ministry, 
and  that  he  is  now  considered  both  by  the  Marquis  his 
brother,  and  by  Canning,  as  perfectly  free  to  do  w^hat 
he  can  in  that  way  for  himself  Whether  this  is  a  deep 
measure,  or  the  sudden  effect  of  some  ill  humour ;  and 
whether  Canning,  in  reducing  his  establishment  thus  ab- 
ruptly, points  towards  Government  or  Opposition ;  I  have 
heard  nothing  yet  that  enables  me  to  guess.  But  very 
erroneous  ideas  these  men  must  have  of  party  connexion, 
or  indeed  of  political  morality,  who  consider  their  par- 
liamentary associations  as  held  together  and  as  disso- 
luble without  any  reference  to  opinions. 

I  dare  say  your  Lordship  will  receive  from  others  a 
more  correct  and  particular  account  of  this  occurrence  ; 
but  it  is  so  odd  a  one,  and  so  much  deserves  to  be  well 
understood  and  watched,  that  I  have  taken  the  chance, 
by  my  report  of  it,  of  contributing  to  give  your  Lord- 
ship a  full  account. 

I  beg  you  will  present  my  compliments  to  Lady  Gren- 
ville,  and  am  ever, 

My  dear  Lord, 

Most  sincerely  and  faithfully. 
Yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


^T.  35.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  I37 


Letter   CCI.     TO  LADY   HOLLAND. 

Dear  Lady  Holland,  London,  23d  July,  1813. 

I  delivered  your  message  to  Whishaw,  and  he  will 
bring  me  to-morrow;  when  I  hope  we  shall  find  you 
better.  What  do  the  judges  of  such  things  say  to  the 
Speaker's  harangue/^  which  seems  very  much  out  of  the 
ordinary  course ;  and  is  more  like  the  panegyrics  which 
the  French  government  pronounces  upon  itself  by  the 
mouth  of  a  senator  or  tribune,  than  the  propriety  and 
reserve  that  ought  to  be  adhered  to  by  the  president  of 
an  assembly  really  free.  That  part  of  it  which  refers 
to  the  Catholic  question,  considering  the  numbers  of  the 
vote  and  the  circumstances  under  which  it  was  notori- 
ously procured,  is  out  of  all  decency.  Have  you  heard 
any  thing  more  of  Canning's  abdication  ? 

Yours  affectionately, 

Fra.  Horner. 


*  The  Speaker,  (Mr.  Abbot,  afterwards  Lord  Colchester,)  after  stating  that 
a  financial  plan  had  been  devised  and  executed  to  postpone  or  greatly  mitigate 
the  demands  for  new  taxation,  and  that  measures  had  been  adoj^ted  for  the 
future  government  of  the  British  possessions  in  India,  which  would  combine 
the  greatest  advantages  of  commerce  and  revenue,  and  provide  also  for  the 
lasting  prosjjerity  and  happiness  of  that  portion  of  the  British  Empire,  thus 
continued :  — 

"  But,  Sir,  these  are  not  the  only  subjects  to  which  our  attention  has  been 
called:  other  momentous  changes  have  hQan proposed  for  our  consideration. 
Adhering,  however,  to  those  laws  by  which  the  Throne,  the  Parliament,  and 
the  Government  of  this  country  are  made  fundamentally  Protestant,  we  have 
not  consented  to  allow,  that  those  who  acknowledge  a  foreign  jurisdiction, 
should  be  authorised  to  administer  the  powers  and  jurisdiction  of  this  realm  ; 
willing  as  we  are,  nevertheless,  and  willing,  as  I  trust  we  ever  shall  be,  to 
allow  the  largest  scope  to  religious  toleration."  —  Hansard's  Debates.  —  Ed. 


12* 


138  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1813. 


Letter  CCH.     FROM  LORD  GRENVILLE. 
My  decar  Sir,  Dropmore,  25th  July,  1813. 

It  is  a  great  disappointment  to  us  not  to  have  the 
pleasure  of  seeing  you  before  you  set  off  for  the  West. 
I  hope  you  will  make  this  place  in  your  way,  on  your 
return,  if  you  possibly  can. 

Living  in  a  time  of  strange  events,  yet  I  have  been 
seldom  more  surprised  than  by  that  which  you  mention 
in  your  letter.  What  I  most  lament  in  it  is,  the  discre- 
dit which  it  throws  on  all  party  connection,  the  uphold- 
ing which,  on  its  true  foundation  of  pubHc  principle,  I 
take  to  be  essential  to  the  benefit  of  a  parhamentary 
constitution. 

Otherwise  the  mere  fact  of  a  party  being  thus  dis- 
solved, shows  abundantly  it  could  exist  to  no  good  pur- 
pose. How  Pole  is  to  come  into  ofi&ce  I  do  not  well 
understand,  as  his  pretensions  are  said  to  be  so  high. 
Canning,  if  he  is  to  be  had  singly,  would  I  suppose  be  a 
very  desirable  acquisition  indeed  to  a  government  so 
unusually  weak  as  this  is  in  House  of  Commons'  debate. 
Ever,  my  dear  Sir,  most  truly  yours, 

GREmiLLE. 

P.  S.  I  have  been  not  a  little  surprised  by  the  Speak- 
er's speech,  if  we  are  to  take  the  newspaper  report  of  it 
as  correct.  Does  your  recollection  furnish  you  with  any 
instance  of  a  Speaker  remarking  to  the  Throne  on 
motions  made,  hit  rejected,  in  the  House  of  Commons. 
How  is  the  King  (or  Prince  Regent)  to  know  that  such 
matters  passed  there  ?  and  what  authority  has  the 
Speaker  to  assign  grounds  of  such  decisions  ? 


JEx.  35.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  139 


Letter   CCHI.     TO  HIS   SISTER,  MSS  ANNE   HORNER.* 

My  clear  Nancy,  S*''"'"'  -'^  ^"S"^*'  i^^^- 

I  had  the  pleasure  of  receiving  your  letter  at 
Winchester.  It  was  very  kindly  done  of  you  and  Fanny 
to  take  advantage  of  my  mother's  absence  at  Kentish 
Town,  to  save  her  as  much  as  possible  of  the  irksome 
labour  she  would  have  undertaken  had  she  been  at 
home.  It  is  a  very  melancholy  event  this  to  me  ;  for  I 
shall  be  the  greatest  sufferer,  by  losing  my  home,  and 
being  left  to  my  solitude  in  Lincoln's  Inn.  But  I  trust 
your  absence  will  not  last  longer  than  the  winter.f 

I  made  a  pleasant  excursion  to  the  sea-coast  from 
Winchester  on  Saturday.  I  set  out  early  enough  to  ar- 
rive to  breakfast  at  Cuffnell's,  old  George  Rose's,  where 
I  had  appointed  to  meet  his  son  William.  Old  George 
has  got  a  very  comfortable  and  pretty  place,  and  was  all 
over  civility  and  sincerity  :  he  has  built  a  large  room 
for  Lord  Marchmont's  library,  and  there  are  a  few  origi- 
nal portraits  that  were  left  him  likewise,  the  best  of 
which  is  Richardson's  of  Pope,  the  same  that  is  spoken 
of  somewhere  by  Sterne  ;  there  is  a  daub  of  Lord  Bo- 
lingbroke,  and  another  of  Sir  William  Windham,  but 
apparently  good  likenesses ;  the  former  I  knew  at  once, 
from  the  bust  I  have  seen  at  Lord  Egremont's,  and  the 
latter  is  like  all  the  family  of  the  Grenvilles.  I  went 
with  William  Rose  in  a  gig  to  his  house  at  Muddiford, 
near  Christ  Church,  and  passed  a  very  agreeable  day : 
he  has  much  literary  conversation  of  all  kinds  -,  he  had 


*  She  married,  in  1821,  Major  William  Power,  of  the  7th  Regiment  of 
Dragoon  Guards. 

t  His  father  left  London,  and  again  fLxed  his  residence  in  Edinburgh.  — 
Ed. 


o" 


140  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1813. 

a  great  deal  to  tell  of  his  travels  last  year,  which  he 
undertook  for  the  recovery  of  his  health,  in  the  course  of 
which  he  saw  Sicily,  Constantinople,  and  the  plain  of 
Troy.  At  Muddiford  he  has  built  a  fanciful  house,  close 
to  the  beach,  and  except  that  he  has  made  a  library 
with  a  Grecian  fagade,  it  is  not  very  different  in  appear- 
ance from  the  habitation  of  Robinson  Crusoe. 

I  came  here  yesterday  by  Ringwood  and  Fording- 
bridge. 

Yours,  most  affectionately, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CCHI.*     TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 
Mv  dear  MurraV  Cheltenham,  31st  August,  1813. 

I  am  very  anxious  to  know  in  what  manner  Jef- 
frey's expedition  has  been  affected,  by  a  letter  from  the 
Under  Secretary  of  State  addressed  to  Liverpool,  which 
was  in  the  newspapers  a  day  or  two  since,  prohibiting 
all  British  subjects  from  going  in  the  cartel,  and  all 
American  subjects  except  the  prisoners.  In  the  present 
circumstances,  I  hardly  know  which  to  wish  about  this ; 
that  he  should  be  compelled  to  yield  to  an  overruling 
command,  or  that  he  should  at  any  risk  execute  his 
scheme  without  farther  delay. 

Will  you  have  the  goodness,  also,  to  give  me  some  infor- 
mation with  res^Dect  to  the  state  of  the  Review,  you  being 
one  (I  am  told)  of  the  Commissioners  for  executing  the 
ofl&ce  of  Editor,  during  the  absence  of  King  Jamfray 
beyond  seas.  If  possible,  I  wish  to  make  some  contri- 
bution to  the  next  number,  because  he  particularly  ex- 
pressed a  wish  that  I  should,  and  that  is  my  reason  for 
passing  next  month,  as  I  propose,  in  London,  instead  of 
coming  to  Edinburgh,  which  upon  my  father's  journey 


^T.  3G.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  14] 

thither  being  determined  upon,  I  felt  much  inclination 
for.  When  is  it  necessary  that  articles  should  be  ready 
for  the  next  number  ?  and  can  you  suggest  any  thing 
for  me  to  do  ?  There  are  a  great  many  subjects  which 
I  should  be  very  averse  from  being  known  to  write  about 
anonymously,  and  almost  all  remaining  subjects  are  be- 
yond my  means  of  information.  If  you  could  devise 
two  or  three  short  easy  articles  for  me,  that  is  what  I 
should  like  best.  Is  there  any  new  work,  a  mere  analy- 
sis of  which  would  be  thought  passable,  such  as  Eustace's 
Travels  in  Italy  ?  or  must  the  evil  fashion  of  the  Review 
be  still  adhered  to,  of  writing  dissertations  beside  the 
work  ? 

I  took  so  much  exercise  in  the  course  of  the  circuit, 
and  rode  about  so  much  to  see  the  country,  that  I  read 
little  or  nothing.  I  brought  two  Greek  plays  with  me, 
the  Hippoly tus  and  the  Heraclida) ;  but  I  only  read  the 
first  in  a  very  cursory  way.  Before  we  meet,  I  shall 
perhaps  have  done  a  little  more,  so  as  to  be  able  to  go 
over  with  you  some  parts  of  Euripides.  I  am  taking 
for  granted,  that  I  shall  find  you  in  October :  w^ill  it  be 
so  ?  My  time  at  Edinburgh  will  be  uncomfortably  short, 
for  I  can  hardly  leave  Taunton  before  the  8th  of  that 
month,  and  I  must  be  in  London  again  as  early  as  the 
4th  of  November.  From  what  my  sisters  say,  I  am 
happy  to  think  that  Playfair  will  probably  be  at  home 
about  that  time  ;  and  as  I  know  that  Thomson  is 
seldom  absent  from  Edinburgh,  I  am  only  anxious  about 
Mr.  Wilson's  return,  for  I  have  heard  some  hints  of  his 
intending  a  very  long  stay  at  Aberdeen. 

I  came  here  upon  Lord  Webb's  summons,  and  was 
very  glad  to  have  an  opportunity  of  paying  a  visit  to 
Lady  Carnegie ;  Seymour  and  I  are  domesticated  in  her 
house,  and  he  is  at  this  moment  receiving  a  lesson  on 


142  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1813. 

the  pianoforte  from  Miss  Christina,  under  a  very  agree- 
able illusion  that  he  is  thereby  contributing  to  his  philo- 
sophical stores.  I  like  them  all  extremel}^,  and  the 
more  for  the  many  recollections  that  they  have  of  you. 
My  affectionate  regards  to  Mrs.  Murray ;  I  am  very 
happy  to  think  that  I  shall  see  her  so  soon. 

Ever  yours  truly, 

Era.  Horner. 


Letter   CCIV.     TO   fflS   SISTER,  I^^SS  HORNER. 

My  dear  Fanny,  Buistrode,  oth  Sept.  i8i3. 

I  did  not  leave  Cheltenham  with  Lord  Webb  till 
yesterday,  and  we  came  no  farther  than  Oxford,  where 
w^e  slept.  The  morning  unluckily  was  not  favourable 
for  going  about,  but  we  lounged  a  little  among  the 
venerable  buildings.  I  shall  stay  here  to-morrow ;  Ro- 
gers, and  Mr.  Stewart  of  Glasserton,===  are  of  the  party. 

I  spent  a  most  agreeable  ten  days  at  Cheltenham ; 
from  the  first  day  I  felt  myself  in  a  family  party.  We 
spent  the  whole  day  at  Lady  Carnegie's  house  at  Bay's 
Hill,  about  a  quarter  of  a  mile  from  the  town ;  by  the 
whole  day,  I  mean  beginning  with  breakfast,  and  keep- 
ing it  up  till  past  midnight.  In  the  morning  as  many 
as  were  disposed  made  out  a  ride  or  a  long  walk,  before 
and  after  which  there  was  some  loitering  under  those 
old  trees,  and  in  the  evening,  after  a  genuine  "four-hours  " 
all  round  a  table,  we  had  music  and  waltzing ;  we,  I  say, 
for  after  some  morning  lessons  from  Miss  Elliot,  I  was  hardy 
enough  to  attempt  to  swing,  "and  mocJc'd  all  tune,  and  marr'd 
the  dancers  sMlir  In  the  course  of  our  rides  or  walks, 
we  saw  the  old  abbey  church  at  Tewksbury,  the  ruins 

*  Now,  The  Right  Hon.  James  A.  Stewart  Mackenzie :  the  present  Lord 
High  Commissioner  of  the  Ionian  Islands. 


^T.  3G.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  X43 

of  Sudely  Castle,  where  Queen  Catherine  Parr  lived, 
after  her  second  marriage,  and  the  ancient  house  of 
Squire  Delabere,  who,  at  eighty-three  years  of  age,  lives 
with  a  brotlier  and  two  sisters,  all  very  old,  and  all  un- 
married, being  the  last  of  a  family  which  dates  from  the 
Conquest,  and  had  a  knighthood  in  it,  for  saving  the 
Black  Prince  at  Poictiers. 

London,  Sejdembcr  IWi.  —  So  much  of  a  letter  was 
written  to  you  last  Thursday  evening ;  the  two  days 
after  that,  which  I  stayed  at  Bulstrode,  were  consumed 
upon  some  imavoidable  letters  of  business.  I  came 
yesterday  to  town  with  Rogers,  a  very  entertaining  com- 
panion at  all  times,  by  the  original  remarks  he  has  been 
storing  up  all  his  life  about  the  ways  and  modes  of  Lon- 
don, and  the  characters  he  has  seen  in  it ;  and,  when  he 
is  in  the  humour  for  showing  his  own  real  sentiments, 
an  amiable  and  enlightened  companion,  as  I  found  him 
yesterday. 

I  meant  in  that  letter  to  have  given  you  some  account 
of  the  very  agreeable  ladies  I  passed  my  time  with  at 
Cheltenham  ;  I  might  refer  you  to  Murray  for  his  opin- 
ion of  Lady  Carnegie,  for  through  him  I  have  known 
something  of  her  for  several  years ;  but  you  may  tell 
him  that  he  had  not  exaggerated  any  thing  in  the  praises 
he  often  bestowed  upon  her.  She  is  an  instance  of  the 
best  Scotch  female  manners,  affability,  sincerity,  a  turn 
for  speculation  and  inquiry,  sprightliness  of  understand- 
ing as  well  as  manner,  united  with  a  great  relish  for 
humour,  and  considerable  execution  in  that  way,  and  all 
refined  and  regulated  by  natural  good  sense,  and  the 
experience  of  good  company.  There  is  not  a  word  of 
panegyric  in  what  I  am  saying ;  it  is  but  a  very  imper- 
fect likeness  of  her.  Nothing  can  be  more  delightful 
than  to  find  such  a  character  at  the  head  of  a  very 


1^4,  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1813. 

large  family,  and  to  see  all  the  cares  and  anxieties  it 
must  occasion  borne  so  gracefully.  I  must  not  allow 
myself  to  write  with  the  same  truth  of  the  young  ladies, 
lest  you  become  censorious ;  you  have  some  notion  of 
my  taste,  and  what  I  require  to  be  pleased,  and  will 
therefore  guess  that  I  should  not  have  been  so  much 
gratified  as  I  was,  if  I  had  not,  besides  an  unusual  degree 
of  information,  and  that  use  of  accomplishments  which 
gives  an  air  of  elegance  to  common  sense,  and  to  good 
feelings,  found  in  them  a  cheerful  activity,  and  polished 
unaffected  manners.  This  is  what  they  have  in  conimon : 
they  all  differ  however  in  character. 

I  am  glad  to  hear  you  are  reading  regularly,  —  I 
should  like  much  to  know  more  particularly  what  your 
schemes  are  in  that  way.  Besides  the  usual  chances  of 
new  books  and  periodical  publications  that  must  be 
read  as  they  are  passing,  in  order  that  you  may  be  up 
with  other  people  in  conversation,  and  indeed  to  profit 
most  by  conversation  which  derives  excellent  topics 
from  these  materials,  I  strongly  advise  you  to  have 
some  settled  plan  of  your  own  for  the  winter,  in  which 
a  little  may  be  done  every  day,  by  which  a  great  deal 
will  be  found  done  at  the  end  of  the  campaign,  some 
one  subject  to  be  mastered  thoroughly,  by  reading  the 
best  of  all  that  relates  to  it,  and  keep  it  a  secret  to 
yourself,  and  Nancy,  and  me ;  for  talking  spoils  all  such 
undertakings,  and  cuts  them  short.  If  you  take  one, 
and  Nancy  another,  there  will  be  information  upon 
both,  for  both  of  you,  when  you  want  it ;  and  for  me, 
too,  when  we  all  live  together  again;  and  one  little 
scheme  of  that  sort,  fairly  and  well  executed  in  the 
course  of  the  year,  will,  at  the  end  of  two  or  three 
years,  leave  you  in  possession  of  more  than  you  can 
dream  of  at  present.     While  it  is  going  on,  nothing  is 


iEx.  3C.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  145 

SO  satisfactory  as  to  have  that  regular  occupation  to 
lean  upon  as  a  resource,  for  a  portion  of  every  day.  I 
seem  to  have  written  you  a  monstrous  wise  letter  in 
the  latter  part  of  it ;  for  fear  of  getting  too  deep  into 
the  prosing  line,  it  is  high  time  I  should  stop. 

Yours  affectionately, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Lettek  CCY.    to  J.  a.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 

My  dear  Murray,  1^°"^°"'  -^^^  ^^P*- 1^^^- 

I  approve  highly  of  your  scheme,  and  shall  have 
greater  pleasure  in  the  visit  I  have  promised  at  Minto, 
by  meeting  you  there.  About  the  12th  or  13th  I  ex- 
pect to  arrive  in  that  part  of  the  w^orld ;  though  this  is 
a  little  uncertain,  for  I  cannot  say  to  a  day  wdien  the 
Sessions  will  be  over.  My  visit  must  be  a  very  short 
one  indeed,  for  I  am  anxious  to  be  in  Edinburgh,  and  to 
pass  as  much  as  possible  of  the  time  I  shall  be  in  Scot- 
land with  my  family. 

I  am  impatient  to  have  a  talk  with  you  about  con- 
tinental politics ;  about  which,  my  w^arlike  feelings  have 
now  spread  from  Spain  to  Prussia.  It  seems  certain, 
that  the  immense  loss  of  veterans  and  officers  in  the 
Kussian  campaign  has,  for  a  long  time  to  come,  im- 
paired the  vigour  of  the  French  soldiery ;  and  also,  that 
there  is  at  last  a  strong  national  spirit  roused  into  action 
in  the  north  of  Germany.  The  independence  of  those 
nations  may  yet  be  restored ;  and  the  Continent  saved 
from  that  military  despotism  which  two  years  ago 
seemed  irresistible.  But  there  are  a  thousand  things  to 
discuss,  before  you  will  allow  me  to  acquiesce  in  this 
conclusion,  I  know ;  I  am  the  more  anxious  to  be  kept 
right,  because  I  suspect  many  of  our  Whig  friends  do 

VOL.  II.  13 


l^Q  CORRESrONDENCE.  [1813. 

not  move  so  fast  as  I  have  been  going  for  the  last  six 
weeks.  What  a  singular  fate  is  Moreau's !  The  loss  of 
his  advice  to  the  allies,  an  incalculable  injury.  His  mili- 
tary fame  will  probably  be  heightened  with  posterity,  by 
the  last  passage  of  his  life,  not  only  for  the  confidence 
which  Europe  felt  in  his  name,  but  for  the  greatness  of 
that  design  with  which  he  opened  the  campaign.  His 
moral  reputation  is,  according  to  my  sentiments  of  such 
conduct,  stained  with  guilt,  by  taking  arms  against  his 
country ;  though  there  are  casuists,  and  I  know  some 
rigid  ones,  who  deny  there  is  any  indefeasible  alle- 
giance, and  hold  him  to  have  been  absolved  by  banish- 
ment ;  I  cannot,  however,  see  it  in  that  light ;  and  his 
joining  the  allies,  like  a  Swiss,  or  a  Condottiere,  whe- 
ther excited  by  hatred  of  Bonaparte  or  by  love  of  arms, 
strikes  me  as  one  of  the  many  instances  which  the 
French  Revolution  affords,  though  on  occasions  mostly 
of  a  different  sort,  of  that  deficiency  of  moral  principle 
without  which  no  historical  greatness  is  to  be  attained. 

Ever  yours  affectionately. 

Era.  Horner. 


Letter  CCVI.     TO  JOHN  ALLEN,  ESQ. 
Dear  Allen  Edinburgh,  25th  Oct.  1813. 

Your  account  of  the  view  which  Lord  Grenville 
is  expected  to  take  of  Continental  affairs,  in  a  speech 
upon  the  first  day  of  the  session,  has  relieved  me  from 
an  anxiety  which  I  felt  on  that  subject;  for  I  have  had 
fears,  that  we  were  to  make  the  same  false  step  respect- 
mca  this  German  war,  that  has  been  so  fatal  to  the 
party,  and  deservedly  so,  with  respect  to  the  Spanish 
cause.  That  the  financial  difiiculties  of  the  country 
will  be  increased  by  our  embarking  so  deeply  with  the 


^T.  36.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  I47 

allies,  as  I  think  we  ought  to  do,  is  true,  and  ought  not 
to  be  disguised ;  that  the  sanguine   expectations,  pro- 
fessed by  the  friends  of  government,  of  a  speedy  settle- 
ment of  the  affairs  of  Europe,  have  apparently  no  just 
foundation  in  the  present  aspect  of  them,  ought  like- 
wise, in  my  opinion,  to  be  stated :  but  I  cannot  hesitate 
now  in  believing,  that  the  determination  of  the  French 
military  force,  and  the  insurrection  of  national  spirit  in 
the  North  of  Germany,  form  a  new  conjuncture,  in  which 
the  Whigs  ought  to  adopt  the  war  system,  upon  the 
very  same  principle  which  prompted  them  to  stigmatise 
it  as  unjust  in  1793,  and  as  premature  in  1803.     The 
crisis  of  Spanish  politics  in  May,  1808,  seemed  to  me 
the  first  turn  of  things  in  a  contrary  direction ;  and  I 
have  never  ceased  to  lament  that  our  party  took  a 
course,  so  inconsistent  with  the  true  Whig  principles  of 
continental  policy,  so  revolting  to  the  popular  feelings  of 
the  country,  and  to  every  true  feeling  for  the  liberties 
and  independence  of  mankind.    To  own  that  error  now, 
is  a  greater  effort  of  magnanimity  than  can  be  asked 
for ;  but  the  practical  effects  of  it  Avill  gradually  be  re- 
paired, if  a  right  line  of  conduct  is  taken  with  respect 
to  German  affairs. 

Give  my  kindest  regards  to  Lady  Holland.    I  received 
Lord  Holland's  letter. 

Ever  faithfully  yours, 

Era.  Horner. 

Letter  CCVII.    TO  LORD  WEBB  SEYMOUR. 

My  dear  Seymour,  Edinburgh,  26tli  Oct.  1813. 

I  received  your  letter  of  the  14th  instant,  and 

took  it  very  kind  that  you  gave  me  some  account  of 

the  proceedings  of  our  Berkeley  Street  party,  after  I 


]^48  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1813. 

left  it ;  in  the  fate  of  which,  and  all  its  doings,  I  felt  so 
lively  an  interest.  Those  few  days,  and  the  week  w^e 
passed  at  Cheltenham,  continue  to  afford  me  much 
o-ratification  in  the  recollection  of  all  we  enjoyed,  and 
in  the  confidence  that  I  have  added  to  the  number  of 
my  friends  Lady  Carnegie  and  one  or  two  of  her  daugh- 
ters. It  was  a  very  pleasing  sequel  to  the  period  we 
had  spent  together,  to  have  a  couple  of  days  at  Minto, 
to  communicate  my  impressions  to  Lady  Anna  Maria, 
and  compare  them  with  her  judgments  of  her  friends, 
which  are  so  discriminating,  and  yet  so  affectionate. 
Your  guess  was  correct  by  halves,  as  to  my  occupations 
at  Minto ;  the  state  of  Europe  I  discussed  with  William 
Elhot,  and  found  we  entirely  coincided  in  our  view  of 
the  new  conjuncture  wdiich  marks  the  present  year,  as 
well  as  of  the  conduct  which  ought  to  be  pursued  in 
parliament  with  regard  to  it.  My  notions  I  had  imper- 
fectly communicated  to  you  before  ;  it  was  delightful  to 
me  to  have  them  cleared,  and  raised,  and  confirmed  by 
Elliot's  sagacious  and  comprehensive  ideas.* 

I  spent  the  best  part  of  two  days  at  Kinneil  last 
w^eek  ;  my  two  sisters,  Playfair,  Murray,  and  Thomson, 
formed  the  party.  You  will  understand  that  I  was 
highly  gratified ;  with  nothing  more,  however,  than  to 
see  them  both  so  well,  particularly  Mr.  Stewart,  whose 
robust  and  tranquillised  health  makes  me  hope  to  see 
him  live  to  the  age  of  Plato,  and  continue  writing  to 
the  last.  1  had  472  printed  pages  of  his  new  volume  f 
in  my  hands,  ran  through  a  considerable  portion  of  it 

*  The  Rigbt  Hon.  William  Elliot,  M.  P.,  a  relative  of  the  Earl  of  INIinto. 
He  was  the  intimate  friend  of  Mr.  Burke,  Mr.  Windhaoi,  and  Dr.  Lawrence  ; 
and  -was  much  beloved  and  respected  by  all  who  knew  him.  When  the  Duke 
of  Bedford  was  Lord  Lieutenant  of  Ireland  in  1806,  Mr.  EUIot  was  Chief 
Secretary.  —  Ed. 

t  The  second  volume  of  the  Elements  of  the  Pliilosophy  of  the  Human 
Mind. 


JEr.  36.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  ]^49 

cursorily,  and  read  one  or  two  chapters  with  ease  ;  par- 
ticularly one,  in  which  he  has  placed  the  doctrine  of  the 
Nominalists,  with  regard  to  general  ideas,  in  so  striking 
and  clear  a  light,  that  no  conceptualist,  I  think,  w^ill 
any  longer  surmise  that  there  is  any  shadow  of  a  gene- 
ral idea ;  he  has  been  remarkably  fortunate  in  illustrat- 
ing the  use  of  signs  in  reasoning,  by  tracing  the  history 
of  a  student's  mind,  as  he  learns  the  first  book  of  ele- 
mentary geometry.  We  shall  hear,  however,  what  Dr. 
Thomas  Brown  has  yet  to  say  for  the  conceptualists ; 
Playfiiir,  I  was  surprised  to  find,  leans  to  the  same 
heresy.  It  seems  probable  that  Stewart's  remarks  upon 
the  writings  of  Aristotle,  and  upon  the  use  which  has 
been  made  of  them  in  modern  times,  will  excite  a  little 
commotion,  and  do  a  little  good  at  Oxford.  They  will 
still  make  some  fight  for  Dr.  Aldrich ;  but  he  is  fast  on 
his  way  to  the  catacombs.  If  the  Stagirite  himself 
could  be  inovolced  to  hear  such  things,  he  would,  I  make 
little  doubt,  be  far  more  proud  of  Stewart's  estimate  of 
his  merits,  and  of  the  ground  on  which  he  rests  his  fame, 
than  of  all  the  devotion  of  all  the  doctors  in  convo- 
cation. 

Yours  ever  affectionately, 

Era.  Horner. 


Letter  CCVIL*    TO  THOMAS  THOMSON,  ESQ, 
Dear  Thomson,  London,  November,  1813. 

Allen  is  very  angry,  and  I  own  with  some  rea- 
son, at  a  typographical  blunder  in  the  first  page  of  his 
review  of  Marina's  work  on  the  ancient  legislation  of 
Spain.  His  character  of  Mariana  the  historian  is  ren- 
dered useless  and  unintelligible,  by  the  name  being 
erroneously  printed  four  times  as  if  it  were  the  same 

13* 


150 


CORRESPONDENCE.  [1813. 


with  that  of  the  author  of  the  work  reviewed.  You 
must  set  this  right  by  putting  it  in  as  marked  a  manner 
as  can  be,  into  a  table  of  Errata  at  the  end  of  this 

number. 

I  have  read  only  Mackintosh's  two  articles,  which 
contain    many    brilliant    passages,    and    some    original 
speculations.     The  critique  on  L'Allemagne  is  an  article 
of  much  interest,  not  as  a  judgment  of  that  work,  but 
as  a  specimen  of  Mackintosh  himself;  not  a  favourable 
one,  I  must  own,  in  some  respects ;  particularly  in  the 
bad  faith,  which  scarcely  hides  itself,  in  what  is  said 
upon  the  subject  of  rehgion.     It  is  very  much  to  be 
regretted  that  the  Edinburgh  Review,  "  that  scourge  of 
impostors,  the  terror  of  quacks,"  has  upon  this  occasion 
laid  by  its  thunders  ;  when  a  work  was  before  that 
tribunal  which  is  calculated  to  make  way  for  whatever 
it  contains  by  the  reputation  of  the  author,  as  well  as 
by  the  genius  with  which  some  parts  of  it  are  written, 
and  which  contains  much  that  is  repugnant  to  good 
sense  and  rational  morality,  as  well  as  vicious  in  point 
of  feeling.     Jeffrey,  however,  himself  set  the  example, 
in  his  account  of  the  same  author's  work  upon  litera- 
ture.    Much  and  lasting  injury  will  be  done,  wherever 
the  Edinburgh  Review  is  read,  by  the  unqualified  ap- 
probation which  it  will  be  understood  to  have  bestowed 
upon  a  great  deal  of  nonsense,  that  looks  like  fine  writ- 
ing,  and  a  great  deal  of  paradox,  artifice,  and  exag- 
geration that  pretends  to  the  character  of  good  feeling. 
Yours,  my  dear  Thomson,  in  great  haste, 

Most  truly, 

FiiA.  Horner. 


^T.  3G.]  CAPITAL  PUNISHMENT.  151 

Parliament  met  on  the  4th  of  November,  and  sat  till 
the  20th  of  December,  when  an  adjournment  took  place 
to  the  1st  of  March ;  and  on  that  day,  in  consequence 
of  a  message  from  the  Prince  Regent,  there  was  a  far- 
ther adjournment  to  the  21st  of  March. 

From  the  commencement  of  this  session,  Mr.  Horner 
took  a  more  active  part  in  the  business  before  the 
House.  He  is  reported  as  having  spoken  frequently, 
and  his  speeches  are  given  at  greater  length  in  the 
reports  of  the  debates. 

Government  brought  in  a  bill  on  the  29th  of  Novem- 
ber "  For  continuing  an  Act  for  the  inflicting  the  pun- 
ishment of  death  on  all  persons  convicted  of  mali- 
ciously breaking  lace  and  stocking  frames,  or  cutting 
any  lace  or  stockings  in  such  frames."  Mr.  Horner 
strenuously  opposed  this  measure,  in  several  stages  of 
the  bill :  he  contended,  — 

"  That  there  was  no  plea  of  necessity  for  the  continu- 
ance of  so  cruel  a  law.  There  might  be  circumstances 
which  would  render  that  an  offence  at  one  time  which 
would  be  quite  innocent  at  another ;  as,  for  instance,  an 
act  had  once  existed  against  drinking  healths,  because 
that  was  a  badge  of  hostility  to  the  Crown  —  the  sign 
of  a  disloyal  conspiracy.  The  cutting  of  stockings  or 
lace  might  two  years  back  be  deemed  a  capital  offence, 
because  such  was  the  conduct  of  a  dangerous  combina- 
tion ;  and  yet  such  cutting  might  be  consistently  met  at 
this  day  by  a  much  less  severe  punishment,  because  the 
combination  had  ceased  to  exist.  He  could  see  no  rea- 
son for  retaining  the  capital  punishment  in  the  act 
under  consideration  :  in  point  of  fact,  this  act  had  never 
been  enforced,  either  at  the  commission  or  elsewhere, 
the  delinquencies  which  the  act  professed  to  have  in 


152  INSOLVENT  DEBTORS.  [1813, 

view  being  all  met  by  the  old  established  laws  of  the 
land.  By  that  law  he  Avished  the  country  to  be  go- 
verned, and  it  was  quite  disarranged  by  such  statutes  as 
that  under  discussion.  Such  statutes,  indeed,  as  were 
too  severe  in  comparison  with  the  offence  against  which 
they  professed  to  provide,  only  served  to  put  the  inge- 
nuity of  the  judges  in  action,  in  order  to  evade  them." 

The  Attorney-general  (Sir  William  Garrow)  having 
said,  in  an  after  stage  of  the  bill,  on  the  6th  af  Decem- 
ber, that  the  diminution  of  the  punishment  would  be  at 
the  discretion  of  the  judge,  Mr.  Horner  observed  upon 
this,  —  "  That  the  House  knew  but  too  well  the  practice 
that  had  prevailed  on  this  subject.  The  recent  discus- 
sions on  the  proposed  repeal  of  some  of  the  old  statutes 
had  put  them  in  possession  of  it.  In  the  times  when 
those  statutes  were  passed,  a  more  extended  discretion 
might  be  necessary  ;  but  was  it  to  be  endured,  when 
passing  a  new  penal  law,  that  parliament  should  be 
told,  ^  Make  the  punishment  as  severe  as  you  can ;  the 
judges  will  take  care  that  it  shall  seldom  be  inflicted  ? ' 
He  had  always  thought  that  it  was  the  peculiar  praise 
of  the  British  law,  possessing  as  we  did  judges  of  great 
wisdom  and  unimpeached  integrity,  that,  nevertheless, 
their  discretion,  in  cases  of  a  criminal  nature,  should  be 
narrowed  as  much  as  possible.  In  the  best  works  on 
jurisprudence,  it  had  always  been  laid  down  as  a  princi- 
ple, —  that,  although  the  quantum  of  punishment  might 
sometimes  be  left  to  the  discretion  of  the  judges,  the 
description  of  it  should  always  be  regulated  by  the  law.'* 

A  bill  to  amend  the  law  relating  to  insolvent  debtors, 
particularly  as  to  the  discharge  of  them  when  in  prison, 
was  read  a  third  time  on  the  7th  of  December.  Mr. 
Seijeant  Best  '••  proposed  the  introduction  of  a  clause  to 

The  present  Lord  Wynford. 


jet.  3c.]  insolvent  debtors.  153 

extend  the  benefits  of  the  bill  to  debtors  not  in  prison ; 
or,  not  going  to  prison,  who  were  insolvent,  and  could 
satisfactorily  prove  that  their  insolvency  was  the  result, 
not  of  criminal  extravagance,  but  of  inevitable  mis- 
fortune. 

Mr.  Horner  resisted  the  proposal  of  the  learned  Ser- 
jeant: he  said,  —  "He  was  not  prepared  to  say  that 
there  might  not  be  great  wisdom  in  the  adoption  of 
such  a  proposition,  but  it  was  an  innovation  on  the  ex- 
isting law  of  such  an  extent,  as  to  require  a  great  deal  of 
consideration;  and  he  w^ould  take  upon  himself  to  as- 
sert, that  a  more  novel  or  a  more  daring  innovation  on 
our  jurisprudence  had  never  been  proposed,  either  in 
that  House  or  elsewhere.  It  was  very  true  that  there 
were  cases,  in  which  insolvency  could  be  traced  only 
to  an  extraordinary  concurrence  of  calamitous  circum- 
stances, and  in  which  the  insolvent  person  was  wholly 
free  from  blame.  At  the  same  time,  it  was  well  known 
that  those  cases  were  of  rare  occurrence ;  and  that  the 
task  of  distinguishing  between  such  cases  and  cases  of 
an  opposite  description,  was  one  of  the  most  unfit  duties 
that  could  be  imposed  on  courts  of  justice.  For  what 
were  the  objects  that  courts  of  justice  must  consider,  in 
an  investigation  of  that  nature  ?  They  must  examine 
the  whole  history  and  circumstances  of  a  man's  life, 
from  his  commencement  in  business,  until  the  period  at 
which  his  affairs  might  be  brought  before  them !  They 
must  inquire  into  all  his  connections  —  they  must  ascer- 
tain all  his  resources  —  they  must  investigate  all  his 
modes  of  expenditure  —  they  must  trace  him  through 
all  the  ramifications  of  his  manners,  and  habits,  and 
occupations.  Even  if  a  moral  tribunal  were  constituted 
for  such  a  purpose,  it  would  be  found  inadequate  to  its 
execution ;   but  that  a  person,  possessed  of  such  legal 


154  POOR  LAWS.  [1813. 

knowledge  and  experience  as  the  honourable  and 
learned  seijeant,  should  think  of  making  it  a  matter 
of  judicial  proceeding,  did,  he  confessed,  not  a  little  sur- 
prise him.  He  repeated,  that  the  cases  were  rare  in 
which  insolvency  was  attributable  solely  to  misfortune. 
More  or  less  of  indiscretion  and  criminality  was  usually 
mingled  with  the  cause  ;  and,  in  his  opinion,  it  was 
much  better  to  leave  the  determination  on  this  subject 
with  those  individuals  with  whom  an  insolvent  person 
had  now  to  deal  (his  creditors)  than  to  submit  it  to  any 
tribunal  W'hatever,  moral  or  judicial.  Those  individuals 
had  the  best  opportunities  of  knowing,  from  their  ac- 
quaintance with  the  debtor,  whether  or  not  his  conduct 
had  been  culpable  or  otherwise.  The  honourable  and 
learned  serjeant,  however,  seemed  not  to  think  so  ;  and 
all  at  once,  on  the  third  reading  of  the  bill,  he  proposed 
a  clause,  declaring  that  an  insolvent  person,  who  could 
show  that  he  had  become  insolvent  from  misfortune 
alone,  and  who  had  surrendered  all  his  effects,  should 
be  discharged  without  an  hour's  imprisonment  —  with- 
out affording  the  time  required  to  make  the  necessary 
arrangements  attendant  on  all  insolvency,  and  in  which 
arrangements  the  insolvent  person  was  frequently  as 
much  interested  as  any  other  person."  The  clause  was 
negatived  without  a  division. 

On  the  loth  of  December,  Mr.  Horner  proposed  to 
the  House,  to  adopt  certain  resolutions  which  might 
prevent  the  introduction  of  any  clause  or  clauses  into 
local  bills  for  the  relief  of  the  poor,  contrarj^  to  and 
inconsistent  with  the  established  law  of  the  land.  He 
stated,  "  That  the  objectionable  clauses  in  question 
easily  found  their  way  into  local  poor  bills,  because 
they,  being  of  the  nature  of  private  bills,  did  not  re- 
ceive that  attention  from  the  House  which  would  be 


Mt.  3g.]  poor  laws.  1;5;5 

likely  to  prevent  the  introduction  of  them.  It  ap- 
peared from  the  report  of  the  committee,  that  these 
clauses  were  of  a  two-fold  description.  The  one  sort 
went  to  alter  the  law  of  the  land  in  the  mode  of  assess- 
ments, rating,  &c.,  which  ought  never  to  be  permitted, 
unless  a  strong  exception  could  be  made  out  in  the  case 
of  particular  districts,  where  the  adoption  of  the  ordi- 
nary methods  would  be  inadequate.  The  other  sort  of 
clauses  altered  the  law  of  settlement  in  certain  parishes, 
and  (to  the  shame  of  the  legislature  be  it  spoken)  gave 
the  power  of  inflicting  corporal  punishment  on  the  poor 
to  persons  quite  unfit  for  such  an  authority.  It  was  his 
decided  opinion,  that  upon  no  pretence  whatever  ought 
such  clauses  as  these  last  to  receive  the  sanction  of  that 
House ;  and  it  was  to  these  in  particular  that  he  now 
meant  his  intended  remedy  to  apj^ly.  Some  regulation, 
indeed,  ought  to  be  adopted  with  respect  to  the  others, 
relating  to  the  mode  of  assessment,  rating,  &c. ;  but  a 
remedy  for  that  would,  perhaps,  grow  more  naturally 
out  of  the  discussion  on  the  bill  of  his  learned  friend 
(Mr.  Serjeant  Onslow).  He  should  therefore,  move, 
that  it  be  a  standing  order  of  the  House,  for  the  present 
session,  that  no  bill  should  be  introduced  containing  any 
clause  or  clauses  relating  to  the  settlement  of  the  poor, 
or  the  corporal  punishment  of  them,  contrary  to  the 
law  of  the  land." 

The  Chancellor  of  the  Exchequer  expressed  his  entire 
concurrence  in  the  sentiments  of  Mr.  Horner,  and  his 
satisfaction  at  the  manner  in  which  he  had  introduced 
his  resolutions :  they  were  also  approved  of  by  Mr.  Ser- 
jeant Onslow,  Sir  Samuel  Romilly,  and  others,  and  were 
passed  unanimously. 


156  CORRESPOKDENCE.  [1814. 


Letter  CCVIU.    FROM  LORD  GRENVILLE. 
My  dear  Sir,  Dropmore,  7th  February,  1814. 

My  notion  is  that  the  Speaker's  speech  ought  to 
be  considered  simply  as  a  breach  of  privilege,  on  the 
constitutional  ground  which  you  mention,  and  according 
to  the  old  doctrine,  that  the  Speaker  has  neither  eyes  to 
see,  ears  to  hear,  nor  tongue  to  speak,  in  the  business  of 
the  House,  but  as  the  House  commands.* 

The  question  of  discretion  I  should  myself  disclaim, 
saying  distinctly,  that  if  I  thought  the  Speaker  had  any 
such  discretion  to  exercise,  though  even  then  I  should 
think  this  a  very  indiscreet  use  of  it,  yet  I  should  by  no 
means  wish  the  House  to  interpose  with  any  censure  of 
a  mere  error  in  judgment,  however  glaring.  But  if  we 
are  right  in  our  view  of  the  case,  it  is  absolutely  neces- 
sary to  declare,  for  the  j)urpose  of  the  future  main- 
tenance of  the  privileges  of  the  House  of  Commons, 
that  they  have  not  intrusted  to  their  Speaker  any  dis- 
cretion to  communicate  to  the  Throne,  in  presence  of 
the  Lords,  any  part  of  the  proceedings  of  the  House, 
other  than  such  as  have  been  brought  to  that  state  in 
which  they  are  constitutionally  and  necessarili/,  and  by 
order  of  the  House  itself,  so  communicated. 

In  this  view  of  the  case,  the  proper  course,  I  think, 
would  be,  to  begin  by  a  resolution  simply  declaratory  of 
the  law  of  parliament  and  privilege  of  the  House  of 
Commons  in  this  respect.  Nor  do  I  see  that  in  any  case, 
whether  of  the  passing  or  rejection  of  this  resolution,  it 
could  be  necessary  to  follow  it  by  any  vote  directly  ap- 
plying this  rule  to  the  recent  conduct  of  the  Speaker. 

*  See  Letter  to  Lady  Holland,  page  137,  and  from  Lord  Grenville,  page 
138. 


jet.  3g.]  correspondence.  l^-y 

In  such  a  case,  prevention  is  the  proper  object  to  be  pro- 
fessed and  to  be  pursued  ;  and  this  will,  I  think,  infalli- 
bly be  obtained  by  such  a  motion,  in  whatever  manner 
it  may  happen  to  be  disposed  of  at  this  moment. 

The  wording  of  such  a  motion  would  require  some 
care  and  attention,  to  be  quite  sure  that  the  privilege  is 
correctly  and  accurately  stated ;  and  on  this  subject  it  is 
probable  that  Charles  Williams  Wynne,  who  has,  I  doubt 
not,  looked  carefully  through  the  precedents,  can  give 
better  advice  than  any  body  else. 

For  the  argument,  however,  it  is  obvious  that,  in  this 
way  of  treating  the  subject,  precedents  are  of  much  less 
importance,  because  the  Speaker's  speeches  not  being 
properly  matter  of  record,  it  was  natural,  and  indeed 
unavoidable,  that  slight  breaches  of  the  rule  should  pass 
lumoticed  ;  and  it  is  not  until  the  violation  of  it  is  ^ross 
and  flagrant,  that  it  attracts  attention.  This  is  the  case 
with  almost  every  other  privilege  of  parliament :  the 
daily  and  habitual  breach  of  these  in  slight  cases  is  never 
understood  to  prejudice,  in  the  slightest  manner,  the 
rule  of  privilege  itself,  which  it  remains  in  the  breast  of 
the  House  to  exercise  and  assert  to  its  full  extent,  when- 
ever the  occasion  requires  it.  In  the  present  case,  it 
may  easily  be  shoAvn  that  the  violation  is  such  as,  if 
wholly  unnoticed,  must  destroy  the  privilege  itself 

I  confess  I  doubt  whether  the  matter  has  hitherto 
been  taken  up  and  spoken  of  quite  in  as  high  a  tone  as 
its  importance  requires  ;  if  it  be,  as  I  really  believe,  the 
greatest  direct  violation  of  the  independence  of  the  House 
of  Commons  that  has  been  attempted,  I  might  say,  for  a 
century  and  a  half  By  independence,  I  do  not,  of  course, 
mean  its  right  of  free  action,  with  which  this  matter  has 
no  concern,  but  its  right  of  separate,  distinct,  and  imcom- 
municated  proceeding.     It  is  far  less  in  degree,  but  in 

VOL.  II.  14 


;j[58  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1814. 

principle  exactly  similar  to  the  case  I  alluded  to  at  the 
beginning  of  this  note,  the  case  of  the  five  members. 

Ever  most  truly  yours, 

Grenville. 


Letter  CCIX.     TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 
Mv  dear  MurraV  Lincoln's  inn,  25th  February,  1814. 

I  fear  you  have  been  looking  upon  me  for  some 
time  past  as  unpardonably  idle,  in  omitting  so  long  to 
write  to  you.  I  can  be  a  very  diligent  correspondent,  if 
we  keep  up  a  pretty  constant  fire  of  great  or  small  shot ; 
but  if  a  pause  takes  place,  it  seems  as  if  neither  of  us 
could  break  it. 

I  have  read  Mr.  Stewart's  new  volume  with  great 
satisfaction  and  instruction  ;  it  is  full  of  matter,  little  to 
the  taste  of  readers  of  the  present  day,  but  highly  valu- 
able for  every  person  who,  in  any  intellectual  pursuit  or 
profession,  is  called  upon  to  correct  and  strengthen  his 
understanding.  Besides,  I  like  these  subjects.  What 
seems  to  me  the  most  complete,  as  well  as  original  por- 
tion of  the  volume,  is  all  that  which  treats  of  mathema- 
tical evidence  and  reasoning.  The  part  I  cared  for 
least,  is  the  dissertation  upon  Aristotle's  logic,  though  it 
can  hardly  fail  to  have  some  salutary  influence  upon 
education  in  England,  provided  it  provokes  anger  at 
Oxford.  I  wish  he  had  examined  more  fully,  and  per- 
haps with  rather  more  perspicuity,  that  curious  but  dif- 
ficult subject,  Analogy,  on  which  he  has  made  some  ob- 
servations that  make  one  regret  they  are  not  farther 
pursued.  In  his  remarks  upon  the  use  of  final  causes  in 
philosophy,  he  is  clear  as  Avell  as  just ;  but  these  he 
might  have  illustrated  more  at  length ;  and  it  would 
have  been  a  great  service,  as  a  practical  guide  to  those 


iEi.  3C.]  HOUSE  OF  COMMONS.  159 

who  would  profit  by  these  remarks,  had  he  brought  us 
nearer  to  an  express  rule  for  distinguishmg  the  use  of 
that  auxiliary  in  scientific  inquiry,  from  the  abuses  of 
which  it  is  susceptible  in  all  the  sciences.  In  the  present 
low  state  of  literature,  while  any  thing  is  the  mode  but 
studies  of  a  high  aim,  this  volume  may  possibly  draw 
less  admiration  than  his  former  writings,  where  he  had 
more  occasions  to  illuminate  his  metaphysical  reasonings, 
for  popular  effect,  by  applications  of  moral  and  critical 
reflections ;  but  it  cannot  fail  to  give  greater  solidity  to 
his  philosophical  reputation. 

I  cannot  pretend  to  give  you  any  news ;  for  I  see 
nobody  that  knows  more  than  the  newspapers  give  us. 
The  state  of  public  opinion  is  an  amusing  subject  of 
observation  at  the  present  moment ;  I  never  knew  it 
more  violent  or  more  nearly  unanimous,  though  I  find 
myself,  by  the  compulsion  of  all  the  reflections  that  I 
have  been  able  to  make  upon  this  great  crisis,  in  the 
small  minority  of  those  who  dread  the  consequences  of 
the  restoration  of  the  Bourbons,  or  the  conquest  of 
France.  Some  of  the  wisest  men,  I  know,  are  praying 
for,  and  even  expecting,  the  restitution  of  the  church 
lands.  The  anxiety  of  this  suspense  is  quite  painful ;  it 
cannot  last  much  longer. 

Ever  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Parliament  re-assembled,  pursuant  to  the  adjourn- 
ments, on  the  21st  of  March,  but  Mr.  Horner's  name 
does  not  appear  in  any  of  the  debates  until  the  2d  of 
May :  during  the  greater  part  of  the  interval,  he  was 
on  the  circuit.  From  that  time,  to  the  close  of  the  ses- 
sion on  the  30th  of  July,  he  spoke  on  several  occasions : 


160  HOUSE   OF   COMMONS.  [1814. 

the  most  important  of  these  were,  when  the  Corn  Laws 
were  under  consideration  on  the  loth  and  16th  of  May, 
and  a  motion  which  he  himself  made  on  the  28th  of 
June,  for  the  production  of  papers  to  show,  how  far 
ministers,  in  the  hate  negotiations  for  peace,  had  exerted 
their  influence  to  promote  the  abolition  of  the  Afri- 
can slave-trade,  on  the  part  of  France.  As  his  speeches 
on  these  occasions  are  reported  at  some  length,  and 
as  they  do  not  refer  merely  to  the  time  when  they  were 
delivered,  but  are  on  subjects  of  a  more  general  interest, 
I  have  inserted  them  in  the  Appendix,  as  they  are  given 
in  Hansard's  Debates. 

A  bill  had  been  introduced  by  Government  on  the 
8th  of  July,  "  to  provide  for  the  preserving  and  restor- 
ing of  peace  in  such  parts  of  Ireland  as  may,  at  any 
time,  be  disturbed  by  seditious  persons,  or  by  persons 
entering  into  any  unlawful  combinations  or  conspi- 
racies;" and  on  the  motion  for  the  second  reading  of 
the  bill,  on  the  13th  of  July,  Mr.  Horner  opposed  it. 

"  He  arraigned  it  as  an  unconstitutional  measure,  and 
brought  forward,  towards  the  close  of  the  session,  when 
most  of  the  members  for  Ireland  were  absent,  without 
any  statement  that  it  was  called  for  by  any  sudden 
emergency,  or  any  new  or  extraordinary  occurrence  in 
Ireland.  It  w\as  a  measure  which,  as  it  stood,  would  go 
to  deprive  his  Majesty's  subjects  in  Ireland  of  the  in- 
valuable privilege  of  grand  and  petit  juries,  and  transfer 
the  office  of  these  juries  to  county  magistrates,  who,  with 
the  aid  of  a  serjeant  or  barrister-at-law,  were  to  try  and 
condemn  to  transportation,  for  an  indefinite  time,  any 
persons  whom  they  should  deem  guilty  of  offences,  not 
defined  by  law,  and,  at  most,  merely  constructive.  He 
deprecated  the  habit  of  bringing  bills  into  the  House,  of 
late,  to  pass  new  laws  for  Ireland,  without  laying  any 


^Et.  3c.]  alien  act.  161 

foundation  to  satisfy  the  House  of  the  necessity  of  such 
laws,  and  in  the  absence  of  the  members  for  Ireland,  who 
were  most  competent  to  judge  of  such  necessity;  and 
such  was  the  bill  introduced  this  night,  for  extending  to 
Ireland  the  English  law  of  extents,  the  policy  of  which 
was  extremely  questioned  in  this  country  by  the  ablest 
lawyers  and  statesmen,  and  must  be  therefore  still  more 
questioned  in  a  country  where  it  never  was  introduced 
before.  As  to  the  present  bill,  he  was  convinced  it  must 
tend  rather  to  exasperate  the  people,  and  considerably 
exaggerate  the  mischief  it  proposed  to  remedj^,  than  to 
produce  any  salutary  consequences ;  and  he  never  could 
consent,  without  grounds  infinitely  stronger  than  he  had 
heard,  to  such  a  violation  of  the  constitution  of  the 
country,  as  to  abolish  the  trial  by  jury,  or  suspend  the 
ordinary  and  constitutional  operation  of  the  laws,  which 
must  be  fully  adequate  to  all  necessary  purposes." 

The  following  night  Mr.  Hiley  Addington,  Under- 
secretary of  State  for  the  Home  Department,  moved  the 
second  reading  of  a  Bill  for  the  repeal  of  the  existing 
Alien  Act,  and  to  substitute  another.  "  He  described  it 
as  being  nothing  more  than  a  renewal  of  the  Act  of 
1802 ;  that  it  did  not  give  greater  power  to  ministers 
than  they  were  entrusted  with  by  that  Act:  whether 
these  powers  were  originally  too  great  it  was  for  the 
House  to  decide ;  for  his  own  part,  considering  all  cir- 
cumstances, he  had  never  been  of  opinion  that  that  Act 
went  too  far."     Mr.  Horner  on  that  occasion  said, — 

"  It  was  not  enough  to  urge,  in  support  of  any  mea- 
sure, that  it  was  a  transcript  of  some  former  act  of  par- 
liament. There  had  been  many  suspensions  of  the 
Habeas  Corpus  Act,  each  of  which  was  the  transcript  of 
some  other ;  but  such  a  measure  would  at  any  time  be 
very  ill  received,  without  some  statement  of  the  neces- 

14:1: 


1G2 


ALIEN  ACT.  [1814. 


sity  of  taking  from  his  Majesty's  subjects  their  constitu- 
tional protection.     The   Bill  before  the  House  was  a 
measure  analogous  to  the    suspension   of  the    Habeas 
Corpus,  for  it  took  from  the  aliens,  in  amity  with  his 
Majesty,  that  protection  which  it  was  the  boast  of  our 
constitution  to  afford  them.   The  question  then  returned 
to  the  necessity  of  the  case ;  and  he  should  assume  that 
none  such  existed,  because  it  had  even  been  alleged  that 
the  present  state  of  things  was  not  in  any  degree  extraor- 
dinary.  The  policy  of  the  first  Act  on  this  subject  was,  to 
prevent  the  influx  of  dangerous  foreign  political  prin- 
ciples.   In  the  feverish  time  which  followed  the  last  war, 
the  same  danger  was  apprehended  to  exist.     Could  it  be 
said,  that  any  trace  of  the  circumstances  of  those  times 
existed   at  present?     Indeed,  at   present,  there  was  a 
greater  fear  of  an  influx  of  those  which  were  thought 
the  dangerous  principles  of  France   in  a  former  period 
of  our  constitution,  the  principles  of  arbitrary  govern- 
ment.    These  principles,  however,  it  was  fortunate  were 
not  of  a  nature  to  inflame  the  people  in  their  favour. 
As  there  had  been  stated  no  ground  of  necessity  for  the 
measure,  it  should  have  his  decided  opposition ;  and  not 
the  less  for  one  of  the  reasons  stated  in  support  of  it  by 
the  right  honourable  gentleman  opposite  to  him,  that 
a  power,  similar  to  that  given  to  the  Government  by 
this  Bill,  was  possessed  by  all  the  other  governments  of 
Europe.     All  these  sovereigns  possessed  the  same  arbi- 
trary power  over  their  own  subjects,  yet  it  would  not  be 
contended  that,  in  this  respect,  we  should  assimilate  our 
institutions  to  theirs." 


iEr.  3G.]  CORRESPONDENCE. 


Letter  CCX.    TO  HIS  FATHER. 
JVIv  deiXr  Sir  Lincoln's  Inn,  lOtli  June,  1814. 

I  had  the  pleasure  of  receiving  a  letter  from  you 
the  end  of  last  week,  which  I  would  have  answered 
sooner  if  I  had  not  been  very  busy. 

I  have  been  doing  more  business  this  spring  than 
ever  before ;  chiefly  in  the  House  of  Lords,  upon  Scotch 
appeals,  though  I  have  had  a  few  glimpses  of  business 
opening  to  me  in  other  channels.  The  circuit,  which  I 
must  mainly  look  to,  stands  just  as  it  has  done  for  a 
year  or  two ;  when  any  material  amendment  takes 
place,  I  shall  be  sure  to  let  you  know.  In  the  mean 
time,  you  will  be  glad  to  be  assured  that  my  business, 
such  as  it  is  at  present  altogether,  makes  me  quite  inde- 
pendent ;  and  that  I  have  no  fear  of  its  falling  short  of 
that. 

Believe  me,  my  dear  Sir, 

Most  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 

Letter  CCXI.     TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 
My  dear  Murray,  London,  26th  June,  1814. 

I  have  had  some  talk  with  William  *  about  our 
travelling  plans,  which  it  is  time  now  to  take  seriously 
into  our  consideration.  We  shall  finish  the  assizes  at 
Wells  on  Wednesday,  the  17th  of  August,  and  I  mean 
to  save  myself  the  trouble  of  going  to  Bristol ;  so  that 
we  may  be  sure  of  setting  sail,  either  from  Dover  or 
Brighton,  on  Saturday,  the  20th. 

*  Mr.  Murray's  brother.     Sec  Vol.  I.  p.  307. 


264  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1814. 

Have  3^011  been  planning  any  alterations  of  the  route 
we  talked  of?  That  was,  if  I  remember  right,  to  go  by 
Dijon  to  Geneva,  and,  after  seeing  the  Lake,  to  come  by 
Chambery  and  the  Great  Chartreuse  round  to  Lyons, 
then  down  the  Rhone  to  Marseilles ;  and  we  had  left  it 
uncertain,  to  return  by  the  Garonne  or  by  the  Loire. 
The  Rhone,  and  that  part  of  the  Mediterranean  shore 
which  lies  near  Marseilles,  ought  certainly  to  be  regarded 
this  time  as  our  principal  object.  What  we  are  to  add 
to  it,  and  in  what  order  we  are  to  take  the  whole,  must 
depend  upon  the  time  we  have. 

Suppose,  instead  of  the  Garonne  or  the  Loire,  we 
were  to  make  the  addition  on  the  eastern  side.  We 
might  either  proceed  from  Geneva  over  the  Great  St. 
Bernard  to  Turin,  then  to  Nice,  and  from  that  to  Mar- 
seilles, a  most  beautiful  line  of  journey ;  and  so  up  the 
Rhone  to  Lyons.  Or  Ave  might  go  at  once  from  Paris  to 
Lyons,  down  to  Marseilles,  then  to  Nice,  Turin,  and 
Geneva  ;  and  then,  if  we  found  any  time  left,  we  might 
still  make  a  round  by  the  Chartreuse  to  Lyons  again. 
If  we  go  first  to  Marseilles,  and  then  by  Nice  and  Turin 
to  the  Lake  of  Geneva,  we  should  have  the  advantage 
of  going  down  the  Rhone,  and  of  having  the  Alps  in  a 
long  view  before  us,  as  we  go  north.  If  we  should  take 
this  route  in  a  contrary  direction,  we  should  perhaps 
have  a  chance  of  finding-  the  Hollands  settled  in  a  house 
at  Geneva,  and  of  making  a  party  with  Allen  and 
Charles  Fox=^  to  Mont  Blanc.  Lady  Holland  tells  me 
that  the  tour  by  Turin,  Nice,  and  the  Rhone  may  cer- 
tainly be  executed  in  six  weeks,  from  and  back  to  Dieppe. 
I  shall  have  seven,  I  hope,  if  Sir  Matthew  Ridley's  bill 


*  Now  Colonel  Fox :  in  Lord  Melbourne's  administration,  he  was  Surveyor- 
General  of  the  Ordnance. 


^r.  3G.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  105 

is  not  stopped  by  Lord  Ellenborougli :  it  is  safe  through 
our  House,  without  a  word  against  it. 

Ever  most  truly  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CCXII.     TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 

My  dear  Murray,  Cockpit,  icth  July,  isu. 

William  showed  me  yesterday  in  the  House  of 
Lords  the  letter  he  had  just  received  from  you ;  I  re- 
gretted that  I  had  no  leisure  to  write  to  you.  I  quite 
agree  with  you  in  wishing  to  pay  a  short  visit  to  Paris 
at  the  commencement  of  our  tour,  for  the  sake  of  seeing 
the  half-dozen  pictures  and  statues  which  all  the  world 
talks  of;  it  will  be  very  agreeable  to  see  them  again 
upon  our  return,  after  we  have  talked  of  them  and 
reflected  npon  our  first  impressions.  This  part  of  the 
gallery,  and  the  theatre,  are  all  that  I  feel  any  thing  like 
impatience  to  see  at  Paris.  I  am  much  inclined  to  see 
a  little  of  their  courts  of  justice,  where  we  find  them 
open ;  and,  indeed,  for  seeing  as  much  of  every  thing  as 
our  time  will  admit  of 

As  to  the  particular  route  we  are  to  adopt,  I  have  no 
preference,  provided  we  contrive  to  see  the  coast  of  the 
Mediterranean,  for  which  I  have  a  longing.  I  do  not 
know  any  subject  on  which  I  would  not  take  Seymour's 
advice,  except  the  article  of  speed.  Pie  always  forgets 
the  brevity  of  human  life,  and  the  necessary  imperfec- 
tion of  all  human  performances.  At  his  rate  of  exam- 
ining a  country,  we  should  have  some  chance  of  reaching 
Paris  by  the  end  of  three  or  four  long  vacations,  dili- 
gently employed.  Did  you  suppose  I  wished  to  ascend 
Mont  Blanc  ?  In  that  case,  I  do  not  wonder  Seymour 
laughed  aloud.     I  have  no  ambition  for  that  sort  of  phi- 


1(36  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1814. 

losophical  experiment  upon  my  own  person,  and  should 
as  soon  think  of  going  up  in  a  balloon,  or  of  baking  my- 
self in  an  oven  with  Dr.  Blagdcn.  What  I  proposed 
was,  a  view  of  Mont  Blanc  from  the  valley  of  Chamouny, 
which  is  an  expedition  of  two  days  from  Geneva;  and 
to  add  to  that,  that  we  should  see  the  two  passes,  the 
Col  de  Balme  and  the  Tete  Noire,  that  lead  to  Martigny, 
from  which  we  should  have  another  different  view  of 
Mont  Blanc.  As  to  the  route,  from  Marseilles  by  Nice 
and  Turin,  over  the  Great  St.  Bernard  to  Geneva,  we 
will  talk  of  all  that  when  we  meet,  and  as  we  go  along ; 
I  believe  we  shall  find  it  quite  practicable,  if  we  prefer 
it.  If  we  go  another  3^ear  to  Italy,  which  I  hope  we 
shall  certainly  do  next  summer,  the  St.  Bernard  would 
not  be  our  best  course,  but  the  Simplon,  (where  Bona- 
parte's famous  road  is,)  which  enters  the  most  interesting 
part  of  Italy,  by  the  Lago  Maggiore  and  Milan ;  I  am 
impatient  that  we  should  compare  that  famous  lake  with 
Killarney. 

Affectionately  yours. 

Era.  Hoener. 


Letter  CCXIII.     TO  MRS.  DUGALD  STEAYART. 
Dear  Mrs.  Stewart,  Salisbury,  24th  July,  1814. 

I  have  sent  your  letter  to  Doctor  Marcet,  and 
hope  no  material  harm  is  done  by  its  following  me  so 
much  farther  than  you  meant  it  should.  It  gave  me  a 
pretence  for  writing  to  our  excellent  friend  myself;  and 
an  opportunity  of  asking  him  to  give  me,  if  he  can,  a 
letter  of  introduction  to  some  intelligent  native  at  Avig- 
non, for  I  have  a  great  fancy  that  \ye  should  lounge 
some  few  days  round  that  spot,  to  see  the  Maison  Quarree 
on  one  side,  and  Laura's  haunts  on  the  other ;  and  to  see 


^T.  36.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  10 -jr 

something  of  the  people  in  their  own  ways,  at  an  inland 
place  as  far  south  as  we  can  go.  William  Murray  has 
found  out  that  there  is  excellent  trout  fishing  in  the 
Sorga ;  and  I  encourage  him  by  all  means  to  carry  his 
rod  across  France  on  purpose. 

Will  you  ask  Mr.  Stewart  to  turn  in  his  mind  what 
can  be  done  by  persons  in  this  country  to  prompt  any 
French  men  of  letters  to  write  against  the  slave-trade  ? 
In  the  state  of  opinions  upon  the  subject  in  that  coun- 
try, there  is  as  much  to  be  done,  and  as  much  glory  to 
be  won  by  those  who  will  do  it,  as  before  Granville 
Sharp  and  Clarkson  had  started  it  in  England.  Yet 
there  is  so  little  of  colonial  interest  as  yet  organised 
against  it,  and  there  is  so  much  in  the  arguments  of  the 
cause  that  would  be  captivating  to  Frenchmen,  if  ad- 
dressed to  them  in  the  modes  and  fashion  of  their  own 
literature,  that  there  wants,  I  should  think,  but  a  skilful 
hand  to  sow  the  seed  in  proper  places.  Except  at 
Geneva,  one  knows  not  where  to  look  for  men  of  letters ; 
but  the  press  of  Geneva  may  once  more  be  rendered  a 
j)owerful  engine  for  the  instruction  of  France.  I  am 
told  that  Chateaubriand  is  an  abolitionist,  and  his  way 
of  writing  is  in  vogue.  I  have  been  inquiring  about 
the  Huguenot  clergy ;  but  they  are  said  to  be  very  low 
in  learning,  and  to  be  too  much  afraid  of  losing  their 
toleration  under  the  Bourbons,  to  be  likely  to  do  any 
thing  that  might  be  displeasing  to  the  government. 
The  African  Institution  named  a  committee,  of  which  I 
am  one,  to  consider  of  the  means  of  promoting  the  cir- 
culation of  abolition  tracts  in  the  French  lancjuase  ; 
nothing,  I  am  satisfied,  can  be  done  to  any  purpose,  but 
by  giving  an  impulse  to  the  French  press  itself  If  Mr. 
Stewart  will  have  the  goodness  to  suggest  what  occurs 
to  him,  I  will  use  his  communication  in  any  manner. 


168  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1814. 

and  with  any  degree  of  reserve  that  he  may  desire.     No 
one  could  be  so  useful  to  us,  if  any  thing  can  be  pointed 
out  to  be  done.     My  kind  regards  to  Miss  Stewart :  I 
rely  upon  the  pleasure  of  seeing  you  all  in  December. 
Ever  yours  most  sincerely, 

Fra.  Horner. 

Have  you  heard  that  the  King  of  Sardinia  has  sig- 
nalised Jus  restoration,  by  prohibiting  vaccination  as  a 
dangerous  novelty?  This  would  be  a  match  for  the 
revival  of  the  slave-trade,  and  the  re-establishment  of 
the  inquisition. 

Letter  CCXIII*     TO  MRS.  DUGALD  STEWART. 
Dear  Mrs.  Stewart,  Salisbury,  24th  July,  1814. 

I  happen  to  know  more  of  the  Princess  Char- 
lotte's story  than  I  usually  care  to  do  of  the  concerns  or 
transactions  of  that  uninteresting  family;  and  though 
one  never  ought  to  be  sure,  in  any  thing  connected  with 
them,  that  one  knows  the  truth,  my  conviction  is  very 
strong  that  she  has  been  ill  used  in  the  extreme,  and 
considering  her  education,  and  the  blood  she  has,  has 
conducted  herself  well,  both  in  point  of  sense  and  of 
good  feeling.  The  unlucky  incident  of  the  Hackney 
Coach  and  her  flight  to  Connaught  House  appears  to 
have  been  unpremeditated,  in  the  despair  and  agita- 
tion very  natural  to  so  young  a  person,  so  ill  brought 
up,  in  the  confusion  she  was  thrown  into  by  a  harsh 
and  sudden  notice  to  her,  that  she  was  to  be  separated 
at  once  from  every  one  she  cared  for,  and  put  under  the 
custody  of  those  whom  she  dreads.  It  is  not  worth 
wdiile  giving  you  the  details ;  they  are  very  circumstan- 
tial, and  it  is  only  from  the  whole  that  a  fair  impression 


^T.  30.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  ]^(;9 

can  be  taken ;  this  motion,  announced  by  the  Duke  of 
Sussex,  will  probably  lead  to  a  very  general  publica- 
tion of  them.  The  conduct  of  the  Regent  throughout 
has  exhibited  an  entire  absence  of  all  natural  affection 
for  her,  as  his  daughter,  a  neglect  even  of  the  care  and 
attentions  which  he  owed  to  her  as  a  young  woman 
committed  to  his  guardianship,  and  all  the  harshness, 
tyranny,  and  want  of  nerves  that  belong  to  his  charac- 
ter. The  whole  story  of  her  education,  projected  mar- 
riage, and  present  imprisonment,  is  unlike  English  man- 
ners, and  savours  strongly  of  that  taste  and  principle  in 
domestic  life,  which,  by  the  Princess  Wilhelmine's  ac- 
count, were  habitual  in  the  German  courts.  I  am  quite 
persuaded  that  he  had  no  other  reason  for  wishing  the 
marriao;e  but  to  remove  his  next  successor  from  his 
sight,  and  the  galling  popularity  of  a  more  youthful 
court  than  his  own.  To  carry  his  point,  it  was  a  neces- 
sary part  of  the  scheme,  to  insure  her  residence  abroad, 
though  his  real  intentions  on  this  head  were  concealed 
from  her  at  first,  and  were,  as  I  understand,  detected, 
after  her  consent  to  the  match  had  been  obtained, 
by  finding,  from  the  Prince  of  Orange,  that  a  different 
language  was  held  to  him  on  the  subject,  than  had  been 
used  to  her,  in  the  single  conversation  which  ended  in 
that  consent.  From  the  moment  of  this  discovery,  she 
assumed  a  language  which  she  maintained  throughout ; 
and  she  appears  to  have  received  from  those  who  were 
about  her  at  this  time,  very  judicious  and  honest  advice. 
She  insisted  upon  a  parliamentary  security  for  her  resi- 
dence in  England  as  the  assurance  of  its  being  a  practi- 
cal security.  To  this  she  adhered  till  the  last ;  and  the 
match  was  finally  broken  off,  upon  her  ascertaining  that 
no  house  was  to  be  provided  for  her,  and  that  the  Prince 
of  Orange  confessed  he  was  under  the  necessity  of  resid- 
VOL.  II.  15 


170  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1814. 

ing  in  his  own  country.  One  of  the  most  reprehensible 
circumstances  in  the  Regent's  conduct  to  his  daughter, 
was,  that  after  he  found  himself  disappointed,  by  her 
firmness,  of  his  purpose  to  send  her  abroad,  he  contrived 
to  throw  upon  her  the  task  and  the  seeming  dishonour 
of  breaking  off  the  engagement,  by  getting  the  sove- 
reign of  the  Netherlands  to  write  such  a  letter  to  his 
son,  as  made  his  future  residence  there  a  public  duty  : 
the  proof  of  this  is  very  curious,  and  depends  upon  a 
comparison  of  dates,  and  upon  the  terms  in  which  some 
letters  that  passed  were  expressed.  Whether  the  scene 
that  was  acted  at  Warwick  House,  in  the  beginning  of 
last  week,  was  merely  dictated  by  the  Regent's  resent- 
ment for  his  disappointment,  or  is  part  of  a  scheme  laid 
for  still  forcing  upon  her  the  marriage  and  foreign  resi- 
dence, I  do  not  know.  It  had  been  threatened  for 
some  days,  and  yet  was  attended  with  much  precipita- 
tion in  the  manner  of  its  execution,  as  well  as  violence. 
From  the  day  that  her  consent  to  the  marriage  was 
procured,  I  believe  I  might  say  very  unfairly,  she  never, 
except  at  a  public  assembly  at  Carlton  House,  had  a 
siarht  of  her  father  for  about  three  months.     She  was 

o 

prohibited  from  having  any  intercourse  with  her  mother. 
After  his  return  from  his  freaks  at  Belvoir,  she  wrote  to 
him  inquiring  after  his  health ;  he  had  not  leisure  to 
answer  her  note,  but  sent  Mac.  Malion  with  a  verbal 
reply,  and  this  mode  of  communication  was  all  she  was 
honoured  with  for  some  weeks. 

She  has  some  disorder  in  her  knee ;  probably  the 
family  taint.  Last  summer,  sea-bathing  was  recom- 
mended for  her ;  she  asked  him  to  let  her  go ;  he  said 
he  could  not  make  the  necessary  arrangements,  and 
she  did  not  go.  On  the  Saturday  before  the  Hack- 
ney Coach  scene,  a  certificate  prescribing  sea-bathing 


^T.  36.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  ^^'j'^ 

for  her  was  written  by  Baillie,  Cline,  and  Keake.  She 
communicated  their  advice  to  her  father  in  a  re- 
spectful letter,  which  I  have  seen,  and  which  would 
melt  your  heart  to  read.  There  was  no  other  answer 
given  to  this  application,  but  his  arrival  on  the  Tues- 
day following,  at  the  head  of  the  three  old  ladies  and 
the  Bishop  of  Salisbury,  to  take  possession  of  the 
house,  (that  was  his  own  phrase  to  Miss  Knight,)  and  to 
tell  his  daughter  that  Miss  Knight  was  to  be  dismissed 
instantly ;  she  must  sleep  that  night  at  Carlton  House, 
and  then  go  with  the  same  old  ladies  to  Crauford  Lodge, 
a  lone  house  in  Windsor  Park.  When  the  Duke  ot 
York  carried  her,  in  the  middle  of  the  night,  from  her 
mother's  to  Carlton  House,  he  refused  at  first  sternly, 
and  was  only  prevailed  on  by  the  most  urgent  entreaties, 
to  allow  her  maid  to  accompany  her,  a  Mrs.  Lewes. 
His  R.  Highness  said,  it  was  not  in  his  orders.  Could 
a  Prussian  corporal  have  behaved  worse  ?  The  Princess 
Charlotte  is  not  yet  gone  to  the  sea.  But  after  all  this 
had  passed,  the  Regent  talked  of  his  affection  for  her  to 
Lady  Rochester  for  an  hour  together,  and  shed  a  flood 
of  tears  —  another  most  characteristic  trait. 

All  this  in  answer  to  your  single  question,  is  she 
really  ill  used  ?  You  will  suspect  me  to  be  getting  deep 
into  the  secrets  of  the  royal  family,  and  will  at  the 
least  suppose  me  to  be  much  interested  for  this  captive 
Princess.  In  truth,  neither  is  the  case.  But  enough  of 
this  subject  for  the  present. 

Affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


172  CORRESrONDENCE.  [1814. 


Letter  CCXIV.     TO  HIS   SISTER,  MISS  ANNE  HORNER. 

My  dear  Nancy,  Bodmin,  sth  August,  ish. 

Tell  my  mother,  that  I  have  received  her  kind 
answer  to  the  letter  I  wrote  from  Salisbury. 

The  only  excursions  I  have  made  this  circuit  for  sights 
have  been  in  Devonshire ;  and  two  of  them  very  plea- 
sant, one  to  see  an  old  Gothic  house,  the  other  a  new 
one.  I  have  always  heard  of  Ford  Abbey  since  I  first 
knew  Devonshire,  as  an  antiquity  worth  going  to  see ; 
and  who  should  have  become  the  occupier  of  it  but  Mr. 
Jeremy  Bentham,  who  has  taken  a  lease  of  the  place  for 
seven  years  ?  He  asked  me  to  come  and  see  him,  and  to 
bring  Adam  with  me  :  we  spent  two  days  with  him.  It  is 
upon  the  side  of  the  little  river  Axe,  about  eight  miles 
above  Axminster.  For  three  or  four  miles  round,  the  roads 
are  so  bad  that  the  place  is  almost  inaccessible,  and  lies 
secluded  in  very  green  meadows.  The  house  was  once  a 
Cistertian  monastery ;  but,  in  the  reign  of  Charles  the 
First,  it  came  into  the  possession  of  a  family  of  Pri- 
deauxs,  who  were  opulent  enough  to  employ  Inigo 
Jones  to  give  the  exterior  of  it  an  entirely  new  form, 
in  which  he  has  mixed  battlements  and  Roman  arches 
with  the  oriel  windows  of  the  older  style.  The  archi- 
tecture, therefore,  is  not  very  curious  for  its  age,  though 
the  front  is  very  showy.  Within  the  house  there  are 
some  remains  of  its  original  state ;  a  fine  hall  or  refec- 
tory and  two  sets  of  cloisters,  one  of  them  almost  dark, 
with  the  cells  on  one  side,  which  the  monks  inhabited, 
resembling  very  much  a  ward  in  a  modern  mad  house. 

There  are  some  handsome  rooms,  furnished  in  the 
taste  of  King  William's  time ;  one  of  these  very  spa- 
cious and  hung  with  tapestry,  Mr.  Bentham  has  con- 


JEx.  3G.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  I73 

verted  into  what  he  calls  his  "  scribbling  shop  : "  two  or 
three  tables  are  set  out,  covered  with  white  na])kins,  on 
which  are  placed  two  or  three  music  desks  with  manu- 
scripts ;  his  technical  memory  (I  believe),  and  all  the 
other  apparatus  of  the  exhaustive  method.  I  was  pre- 
sent at  the  mysteries,  for  he  went  on  as  if  we  had  not 
been  with  him.  A  long  walk,  after  our  breakfast  and 
before  his,  began  the  day.  He  came  into  the  house 
about  one  o'clock,  the  tea  things  being  by  that  time  set 
by  his  writing  table,  and  he  proceeded  very  deliberately 
to  sip  his  tea^vhile  a  young  man,  a  sort  of  pupil  and 
amanuensis,  read  the  newspapers  to  him,  paragraph  by 
paragraph.  This  and  the  tea  together  seemed  gradually 
to  prepare  his  mind  for  working,  in  which  he  engaged 
by  degrees,  and  became  at  last  quite  absorbed  in  what 
was  before  him,  till  about  five  o'clock,  when  he  met  us 
at  dinner.  He  permitted  me  to  sit  in  the  same  room, 
for  the  purpose  of  looking  over  some  old  volumes  which 
he  had  found  in  the  house ;  but  I  was  much  more  atten- 
tive to  his  own  proceedings:  this  is  his  daily  course 
throughout  the  year.  Adam,  who  had  never  seen  him 
before,  was  delighted  with  the  suavity  and  cheerfulness 
of  his  manner.  Besides  the  young  man  I  have  men- 
tioned, Mr.  Cohen,  he  has  living  with  him  Mr.  Mill=^=  (a 
gentleman  who  writes  a  good  deal  in  the  Edinburgh 
Review)  and  his  whole  family. 

The  other  house  we  have  been  to  see  is  a  contrast  of 
modern  luxuries  and  elegance  to  the  bare  grandeur  of 
Ford  Abbey;  it  is  called  a  cottage, built  by  the  Duke  of 
Bedford,  but  a  cottage  which  has  cost  thirty  thousand 
pounds  in  the  building.  It  is  in  a  fine  highland  situa- 
tion, upon  the  banks  of  the  Tamar,  between  Tavistock 

*  The  late  James  Mill,  Esq.,  author  of  the  History  of  British  India.  — Ed, 

15* 


174  CORRESrONDENCE.  [1814. 

and  Laimceston,  and  is  called  Endsleigh ;  that  fine  river, 
which  has  not  half  the  reputation  it  deserves,  winding 
before  it  for  two  miles,  among  steej)  slopes  covered  with 
oak  coppices.  I  do  not  much  admire  the  building, 
though  there  are  beautiful  parts :  it  wants  character  and 
effect :  it  is  in  that  mixed  manner,  half  cottage,  half 
manor  house,  which  our  modern  tradesmen  in  the  pic- 
turesque have  put  together,  and  which  has  no  style. 
Jeffrey  W^^att  and  Repton  have  had  full  scope  at  Ends- 
leigh, and  are  there  now :  Mr.  Adam  came  down  to 
meet  them,  and  invited  William  and  me  to  take  it  m 
our  way  from  Exeter.     We  spent  all  yesterday  there. 

Yours  affectionately. 

Era.  Horner. 


On  the  20th  of  August,  Mr.  Horner,  Mr.  J.  A.  Murray, 
and  his  brother,  set  out  on  their  continental  tour.  He 
wrote  several  letters  to  different  members  of  his  family 
during  his  absence,  which  w^ere  very  interesting  at  the 
time ;  but  as  they  are  chiefly  descriptive  of  parts  of 
France  and  of  the  north  of  Italy,  through  which  they 
travelled  very  rapidly,  and  which  have  now  become 
familiar  to  so  many,  I  have  given  only  a  few  of  them, 
and  these  somewhat  abridged.  They  will  be  read,  I 
think,  with  some  interest,  as  showing  the  impressions 
made  upon  the  writer,  who  was  then  visiting  France  and 
Italy  for  the  first  time ;  and  from  which  Englishmen  had 
been  excluded  for  so  many  years,  with  only  one  short 
interval. 


iET.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  I75 


Letter   CCXV.    TO   HIS  MOTHER. 
My  dear  Mother,  Dieppe,  Sunday  Morning,  21st  Aug.  1814. 

I  wrote  to  my  father  yesterday,  in  the  short  time 
we  stopped  at  Brighton.  We  left  that  place  about 
eleven  o'clock  hi  tlie  forenoon,  and  were  landed  upon 
the  quay  here  at  two  o'clock  this  morning.  The  day 
was  extremely  fine,  and  the  wind  favourable,  so  that  the 
voyage  was  quite  delightful  to  both  my  fellow-travellers, 
who  are  not  affected  with  sea-sickness.  Nothing  can  be 
more  different  than  Dieppe  and  Brighton  -,  the  difference 
is  striking  and  amusing :  we  have  been  in  the  church  for 
a  few  minutes ;  it  was  very  full,  chiefly  of  women  of  the 
middling  and  lower  classes,  dressed  in  a  manner  very 
new  to  our  eyes,  and  not  unpicturesque. 

We  supped  in  a  room,  in  an  alcove  of  which  were 
beds  for  two  of  us,  with  a  tiled  floor,  up  two  pair  of 
stairs,  the  furniture  half  very  fine  and  old,  the  other 
half  coarse  and  ill-contrived.  A  marble  table  with  gilt 
feet,  some  chairs  as  if  from  a  state  apartment,  a  deal 
door  with  iron  bands,  dessert  dishes  for  wash-hand  basins, 
will  give  you  some  notion  of  the  contrast  all  this  is  to 
English  neatness.  I  must  not  omit  to  tell  you,  that 
while  we  were  supping  on  an  excellent  fowl  very  dirtily 
roasted,  with  a  bottle  of  Burgundy,  for  which  we  pay 
three  shilHngs  and  four-pence,  our  beds  were  making  by 
a  chambermaid. 

Your  very  affectionate 

Fra.  Horner. 


176  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1814. 


Letter  CCXYI.     TO  HIS  MOTHER. 
My  dear  Mother,  Rouen,  Sunday  night,  21st  Aug.  1814. 

We  arrived  here  about  eight  o'clock,  having  been 
delayed  at  Dieppe  till  past  two  :  this  seems  a  large  town, 
but  we  shall  see  nothing  of  it,  as  we  mean  to  start  early. 
The  country  we  came  through  from  Dieppe  is  well  cul- 
tivated all  the  way,  and  has  quite  the  appearance  of  the 
south  of  England,  —  for  the  first  thirty  miles  and  more, 
an  open  country  without  any  enclosures,  but  cultivated 
with  every  sort  of  corn  and  green  crops,  with  orchards 
intermixed.     The  road,  a  very  noble  one,  from  seventy 
to  ninety  feet  wide  all  the  way,  and  made  of  flint  gravel : 
a  few  miles  from  Rouen  we  came  upon  a  pavement  or 
causeway.     The  general  appearance  of  this  part  of  the 
country  kept  me  in  mind,  except  for  the  orchards  and 
fruit-trees,  of  some  parts  of  Hampshire  and  other  dis- 
tricts of  England,  where  downs  have  been  lately  taken 
into  culture,, or  common  field  system  prevails.     The  ap- 
proach to  Eouen  is  through  an  avenue  of  high  trees, 
with  a  broad  footpath,  and  some  lamps  suspended  on 
lines  drawn  from  tree  to  tree  across  the  road.     It  being 
Sunday  evening,  the  w^hole  w^orld  was  abroad  ;  and  in 
all  the  little  villages  it  was  very  agreeable  to  see  such  a 
multitude  of  well-dressed  peasants  and  labourers,  appar- 
ently most  comfortable  and  happy.     My  impressions  all 
yesterday  w^ere  pleasant  and  satisfactory,  both  from  the 
views  of  the  country  we'  passed  through,  and  from  the 
looks  and  dress  of  the  people  we  saw.     We  take  the 
lower  road  to  Paris,  which  carries  us  along  the  course  of 
the  Seine  by  Mantes  and  Vernon. 

Ever,  my  dearest  Mother,  yours, 

Era.  Horner. 


^T.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  277 


Letter   CCXVII.     TO   HIS   SISTER,  I^HSS  HORNER. 
My  dear  Fanny,  Paris,  soth  August,  i8i4. 

We  have  stayed  several  days  longer  in  Paris 
than  we  originally  intended ;  but  we  are  now  waiting 
for  horses  to  set  out  for  Dijon  and  Geneva,  meaning  to 
sleep  to-night  at  Fontainebleau.  I  wrote  to  my  mother 
from  Dieppe  and  from  Rouen.  Between  Rouen  and 
Paris  we  slept  at  a  little  village  called  Tiel,  which  gave 
us  the  entry  into  Paris  at  mid-day,  and  an  opportunity, 
by  the  way,  of  seeing  St.  Germain,  the  waterworks  at 
Marly,  and  Josephine's  villa,  Malmaison. 

Our  chief  objects  in  coming  to  Paris  were  the  Louvre 
and  the  theatre.  In  the  latter  we  have  been  disap- 
pointed, the  best  actors  being  at  this  season  in  the  pro- 
vinces, and  the  theatres  having  been  thrown  open  gratis 
to  the  common  people  most  of  the  daj^s  we  have  been 
here ;  an  indulgence  which  began  in  the  republican 
days  I  believe.  I  have  been  once  at  the  Theatre  Fran- 
^ais;  a  dehutautc  was  the  attraction  of  the  night,  who 
played  Amenaide  in  Tancrede,  with  a  good  deal  of  spirit 
and  feeling ;  all  the  rest  seemed  to  me  very  bad ;  we 
went  also  to  the  Theatre  des  Vari^t^s,  where  the  enter- 
tainment consists  of  three  or  four  farces,  very  broad  and 
absurd,  but  extremely  well  acted.  Brunei  is  the  best  of 
the  performers.  What  struck  me  most  in  him,  and  one 
or  two  others  there,  was  their  under-acting,  by  which 
they  made  the  nonsense  and  extravagance  they  had  to 
go  through  appear  less  foolish  than  it  was  to  read,  and 
gave  something  both  of  elegance  and  nature  to  mere 
ribaldry.  The  theatres  are  small  and  comfortable  ;  one 
hears  even  in  the  high  boxes  distinctly ;  the  articula- 


][78  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1814. 

tion  of  the  actors  is  distinct,  and,  in  comic  dialogue,  de- 
lightfully spirited  and  smooth.  As  to  the  Louvre,  I 
cannot  attempt  a  description  of  it :  the  magnitude  and 
riches  of  the  gallery  quite  confounded  and  overwhelmed 
me  with  astonishment;  my  impression  is,  that  I  liked 
the  statues  better  than  the  pictures;  of  the  statues  I 
liked  the  Apollo  most,  and  of  the  pictures,  the  portraits 
painted  by  Raphael  and  the  Parma  Correggio.  The 
Transfiguration,  The  Descent  from  the  Cross,  and  Dome- 
nichino's  St.  Jerome,  rather  seemed  to  me  something 
admirable,  from  which  I  should  derive  delight  if  I 
studied  them,  than  conveyed  to  me  an  immediate  emo- 
tion of  pleasure  or  elevation. 

Paris  surpasses  London  infinitel}^  in  the  number  and 
magnificence  of  the  public  buildings.  The  quarter  of 
the  town  where  we  are  lodged,  Rue  de  la  Paix,  formerly 
Rue  Napoleon,  is  full  of  great  and  elegant  edifices : 
nothins;  that  I  had  seen  before  could  be  mentioned  that 
would  convey  to  3'ou  an  idea  of  the  effect  of  them. 
Napoleon's  hand  is  visible  every  where ;  not  so  much  in 
the  ornaments,  w^hich,  with  rather  a  childish  vanity,  he 
has  crowded  upon  works  that  had  been  erected  by  his 
predecessors,  as  in  the  numerous  buildings  of  every 
description  which  will  remain  as  long  as  Paris  itself,  — 
several  new  bridges,  that  of  Jena,  a  very  handsome  one, 
very  noble  quays  upon  the  river,  market-places,  tri- 
umphal arches,  columns,  &c.  The  embellishment  of 
Paris  seems  to  have  been  always  in  his  thoughts :  the 
vast  dome  of  the  Invalids  is  covered  with  gilding  on  the 
outside,  which  he  ordered  to  be  done  after  his  return 
from  Moscow ;  I  disliked  the  effect  of  this  at  first,  but 
am  now  reconciled  to  it. 

I  meant  to  make  this  a  long  letter,  but  find  I  must 


^T.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  1^9 

stop.  As  I  have  not  written  for  a  week,  I  think  it 
better  to  send  it  half  fmishedj  than  to  keep  it  for  ano- 
ther post. 

Most  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letteu   CCXVIII.     to   HIS    SISTER,  MISS   HORNER. 

My  dear  Fanny,  Geneva,  sth  Sept.  isu. 

We  left  Paris  on  the  afternoon  of  the  31st 
ultimo,  having  hired  a  large  open  barouche  with  a  seat 
for  the  servant :  this  is  drawn  by  three  horses ;  and,  in 
such  fine  weather  as  we  had  the  whole  of  the  jour- 
ney, is  a  very  commodious  and  pleasant  carriage.  We 
stopped  at  Fontainebleau,  the  interior  of  which  is  very 
magnificent :  the  old  gilt  ceilings,  some  of  them  of 
Henry  the  Fourth's  time,  were  saved  from  the  plunder 
to  which  the  furniture  and  decorations,  within  reach, 
were  delivered  up  during  the  Revolution,  and  are  cer- 
tainly very  fine ;  but  what  is  most  worth  mentioning  is, 
the  gallery  of  Francis  I,  built  and  embellished  by  that 
monarch,  in  which  Napoleon  has  placed  busts  of  the 
w^orthies  and  great  captains  of  all  nations,  and  has  intro- 
duced among  them  some  of  his  own  aide-de-camps  who 
had  fallen  in  action,  and  the  head  of  Dessaix,  who  was 
killed  in  the  battle  of  Marengo.  The  forest  of  Fontaine- 
bleau, which  we  crossed  in  coming  to  the  palace,  has 
some  striking  scenery ;  and  we  were  glad  to  see  a  few 
oaks  that  could  be  called  trees,  for  we  had  seen  no  trees 
of  any  sort  before,  and  have  seen  none  since.  In  the 
palace,  the  ornaments  of  which  had  been  restored  in 
great  splendour  by  Napoleon,  we  were  shown  the  suite 
of  apartments  which  the  Pope  occupied  there  for  the 
nineteen  months  of  his  imprisonment,  and  the  bed-room 


180  COKRESPONDENCE.  [1814. 

and  boudoir  of  Marie  Antoinette,  which,  by  some  man- 
agement, were  preserved,  and  were  afterwards  used  by 
Josephine  and  Marie  Louise.  I  felt  more  interest  in 
seeing  Napoleon's  room  and  bath,  and  little  cabinet,  and 
the  writing  table  standing  in  the  last  of  these  apart- 
ments, upon  which  he  signed  his  act  of  abdication. 

The  second  night  of  our  journey  from  Fontainebleau, 
we  meant  to  sleep  at  a  small  country  inn,  called  Lucy 
le  Bois,  and  arrived  there  about  midnight,  (for  the  de- 
lightful moonlight  induced  us  to  travel  so  late,)  but  we 
found  the  whole  in  possession  of  Lord  Bute,  who  was 
crossing  France  by  the  same  road,  with  a  suite  of  nine- 
teen persons.     We  went  on  to  the  next  stage,  Avallon, 
and  found  the  chief  inn  there  tenanted,  in  the  same 
manner,  by  Lord  Holland's  travelling  party,  which  is 
not  much  less.     Besides  this,  the  town  was  crowded 
with  natives  from  all  the  country,  on  account  of  a  "  dis- 
tribution des  prix,"  that  had  taken  place  that  very  day, 
and  was  followed  by  a  ball.     We  were  at  last  admitted, 
after  much  grumbling,  into  a  house  where  we  were  pro- 
mised something  to  eat,  but  nothing  to  sleep  on ;  which 
we  thought  no  bad  compromise.     The  landlord  in  the 
course  of  a  few  minutes  cooked  us  a  very  good  supper 
of  several  dishes,  swearing  loud  all  the  while ;  but  by 
the  time  we  had  found  out  from  his  wife  that  their  son 
had  got  Rollin's  Belles  Lettres  as  a  premium,  and,  in  addi- 
tion to  the  flattery  this  gave  us  a  handle  for,  had  or- 
dered his  best  Champagne,  he  got  into  perfect  good 
humour,  owned  he  was  "  un  pen  vif,"  and  bustled  about 
till  he  provided  us  with  beds.     All  this  cookery  and 
bustle  was  performed  en  deshahille,  for  he  had  nothing 
on  above  the  girdle  but  his  shirt,  with  the  neck  open. 
I  found  him,  however,  by  seven  o'clock  with  his  hair 
dressed,  and  all  his  stoves  and  saucepans  in  full  activity. 


2Et.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  281 

Don't  suppose  we  have  often  made  so  short  a  night  of 
it ;  but  as  I  was  put  into  a  room  where  there  were  two 
Frenchmen  ah^eadj,  of  whom  I  had  a  ghmpse,  as  they 
Lay  in  their  beds  without  nightcaps,  I  had  no  fancy  for 
indulging  myself  longer  than  was  necessary.     I  had  the 
pleasure  of  seeing  the  Hollands  for  a  Httle  while ;  and 
then  we  had  a  walk  round   the   ramparts  of  Avallon. 
Between  Avallon  and  Dijon,  we  crossed  the  high  part  of 
Burgundy,  where  it  blew  very  cold  indeed.     The  de- 
scent, which  begins  at  a  village  called  Sombernon,  is 
grand,  in  the  outline  not  unlike  some  of  the  steeps  in 
the    north    of  Derbyshire,    but    ornamented   with   the 
bright  green  of  the   vineyards,  and  by  the   beautiful 
sky,  which  we  now  became  sensible  had  a  deeper  blue 
than  we  were  used  to.     At  Dijon  we  perceived  that  we 
had  got  among  an  entirely  different  race  from  any  we 
had  yet  seen  :  the  number  of  beautiful  women  walking 
about  quite  surprised  us :  it  was  Sunday,  and  they  were 
endimauchees ;  but  their  regular  features,  dark  complex- 
ion and  hair,  and  fine  eyes,  had  an  uniform  and  marked 
character.     At  Auxonne,  we  saw  more  works  of  the 
hostilities  of  last  spring  than  at  any  other  place  in  our 
route ;   but  there,  as  every  where   else  that  we  saw, 
every  thing  was  repaired  or  repairing.     It  was  on  the 
waj^  to  Auxonne  that  we  first  observed  plantations  of 
maize,  or  iurqide,  as  they  call  it  in  the  country :  it  is 
very  showy;  and  we  had  little  else  but  maize,  hemp, 
and  vines  all  the  way  to  the  foot  of  Mount  Jura.    What 
I  have  next  to  tell  you  of  is,  our  route  from  Poligny 
across  the  ridge  of  Mount  Jura  to  the  side  of  the  Lake 
of  Geneva.     But  this  I  must  reserve  for  another  letter. 
Ever  most  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 

VOL.  II.  16 


182  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1814. 


Letter  CCXIX.    TO  MRS.  L.  HORNER. 
My  dear  Anne,  Brieg,  isth  Sept.  i8i4. 

We  crossed  the  Jura,  ascending  the  first  ridge  of 
that  great  mountain  at  Poligny  in  Franche  Comte  and 
coming  down  to  Nyon  upon  the  side  of  the  lake  of 
Geneva.  The  pleasing  impressions  that  we  received 
from  the  scenery  of  that  mountain  district  are  almost 
effaced  hy  the  greater  scenes  in  which  we  have  been 
living  for  the  last  four  days.  It  was,  however,  a  very 
interesting  journey ;  and  except  in  the  Alps,  I  have 
not  seen  any  thing  more  romantic  than  the  cliffs  of 
Poligii}^ ;  —  the  deep  dells  between  Champagnole  and 
Maison  Neuve,  where  we  first  met  with  mountain  pines, 
and  after  passing  the  last  of  these  places,  a  quiet  green 
vale  on  the  banks  of  the  river  Ain, 

After  a  morning  walk  at  Nyon,  in  the  course  of  which 
we  had  a  full  view  of  Mont  Blanc,  at  first  in  all  its  ex- 
tent, and  afterwards  of  its  summit  only,  in  bright  sun- 
shine above  the  clouds,  and  saw  likewise  a  small  house, 
where  Joseph  Bonaparte  has  taken  refuge  with  his 
famil}^,  w^e  went  along  the  side  of  the  lake  to  Geneva ; 
passing  through  Coppet,  where  Madame  de  Stael  lives. 
There  was  a  hise  blowing,  which  made  the  lake  very 
blue.  At  Geneva,  we  j)assed  three  entire  days  in  lodg- 
ings upon  the  ramparts,  which  have  a  very  fine  view. 
The  first  day  was  unfortunately  a  fast  day  or  festival, 
the  whole  of  which  was  spent  in  presbyterian  sermons, 
and  the  gates  of  the  town  were  shut  during  service.  I 
had  the  pleasure  of  meeting  with  Mr.  Mallet,  whose 
mother  lives  at  La  Prairie,  a  little  way  out  of  the  town. 
After  a  charming  evening  walk  by  the  side  of  the 
Rhone  down  to  its  confluence  with  the  Arve,  I  w^ent  to 


^T.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  183 

La  Prairie,  and,  in  a  Genevese  tea-party,  met  some  old 
acquaintances,  particularly  the  Constants. 

I  saw  a  good  deal  of  Mr.  Dumont,  who  has  been  in  a 
peck  of  troubles  about  the  blunders  his  fellow-citizens 
have  committed,  in  making  their  new  constitution.  We 
were  introduced  to  Professor  Pictet,  who  was  obliging 
enough  to  invite  us  to  the  sitting  of  a  Society  of  Natural 
History,  where  the  philosophers  ate  amply  of  peach  tart 
in  huge  .slices;  and  to  Professor  Prevost,  whose  amia- 
ble simplicity  of  manners  and  apparent  benevolence  of 
character  prepossessed  me  greatly :  I  was  sorry  not  to 
see  more  of  him,  and  not  to  see  Madame  Prevost  at  all. 
Unluckily  Dr.  Marcet's  letter,  which  he  was  so  very 
kind  as  to  send  me  for  the  purpose  of  introducing  me, 
did  not  come  to  my  hands  till  the  night  before  I  was  to 
leave  Geneva :  I  had  been  introduced  to  Mr.  Prevost  by 
a  letter  from  Mr.  Stewart.  My  last  morning  was  spent 
in  making  a  visit  at  Coppet ;  where  I  found  Sir  James 
Mackintosh,  and  was  glad  also  to  see  M.  Sismondi,  the 
historian  of  the  Italian  republics. 

Last  Sunday  morning  I  set  out  for  Chamouny  with 
William  Murray  in  a  char-a-banc,  his  brother  preferring 
to  keep  to  the  warm  shores  of  the  lake ;  it  being  ar- 
ranged that  we  should  meet  at  Martigny.  We  made  a 
day's  journey  in  the  cJiar-a-hanc,  as  far  as  St.  Martin, 
opposite  to  Sallenche.  At  Cluses,  whose  site  (at  the 
mouth  of  a  deep  winding  ravine,  in  which  the  Arve 
flows)  must  have  suggested  its  name  to  the  Romans,  we 
seemed  to  enter  into  the  heart  of  the  Alps,  by  a  road 
between  steep  walls  of  rock  immensely  high  and  richly 
clothed  with  pines.  This  continued  with  considerable 
variety  in  the  details,  as  far  as  St.  Martin,  where  we 
slept,  and  were  provided  with  another  char-ctrhanc,  and  a 
guide,  for  Chamouny.    In  going  there  what  pleased  me. 


184  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1814. 

perhaps  most  of  all,  was  the  hill-side,  upon  which  the 
church  of  Passy  and  a  few  cottages  discover  themselves 
among  innumerable  orchards  and  vineyards,  which  bury 
out  of  sight  a  considerable  village.  The  cottages  that 
appeared  through  the  orchards  were  like  so  many  Gre- 
cian temples  of  the  early  simple  form ;  for  the  fashion 
of  the  houses  is  almost  the  original  frame  of  Grecian 
architecture.  When  you  perceive  nothing  but  the  ga- 
ble end,  the  angle  and  uprights  of  ^^lich  are  in  that 
part  of  the  Alps  very  exact  and  neat,  as  it  breaks  out 
among  walnut-trees,  with  perhaps  a  silver  or  spruce  fir, 
here  and  there  among  them,  it  has  a  very  classical  ap- 
pearance. Next  to  Passy,  I  must  mention  Lcs  llontes, 
the  narrow  pass  into  the  valley  of  Chamouny ;  which  is 
magnificent  and  sublime  beyond  any  description  that  I 
can  give :  the  depth  of  the  ravine,  the  dark  colour  of 
the  rock  opposite  to  that  in  which  the  road  is  cut,  and 
the  blazing  snows  of  Mont  Blanc,  are  the  principal  fea- 
tures. In  this  defile,  we  met  Mr.  Eogers  the  poet,  and 
his  sister,  returning  from  Chamouny. 

In  the  valley  of  Chamouny  I  admired  much  the  gran- 
deur of  the  clifis,  and  the  beautiful  cultivation  of  the 
bottom,  watered  by  the  Arve,  and  covered  with  the 
neatest  cottages  of  the  same  form  which  I  have  described. 
Except  Mont  Blanc  itself,  I  rather  think  all  the  heights 
would  be  more  agreeable  to  look  at  if  they  were  with- 
out snow,  and  the  glaciers  are  very  ugly,  —  though  a 
curious  phenomenon  of  nature,  and  surprisingly  con- 
trasted with  the  trees  that  mount  above  them,  and  with 
the  corn-fields,  which  they  approach  within  a  few  yards. 
We  saw  reapers  at  work  as  near  as  that  to  the  Glacier 
des  Bossons,  which  is  the  one  that  comes  lowest  into  the 
valley.  It  was  the  time  of  oat  harvest,  which  is  the 
principal  grain  that  they  raise ;  and  a  very  novel  and 


JEt.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  ^85 

altogether  very  jDleasing  scene  it  was,  to  see  the  close  of 
the  evening  in  this  lovely  valley,  where  so  many  people 
were  busy  in  cutting  and  binding  the  oats,  amidst  the 
tinkling  of  a  hundred  cow-bells,  while  the  sun  was  only 
seen  by  its  strong  reflection  from  the  snow  above,  the 
summits  of  which  were  for  a  few  minutes  tinged  with  a 
faint  red. 

On  Tuesday  morning  we  set  out  on  mules  to  cross  the 
Col  de  Balme,  the  high  mountain  which  separates  Savoy 
from  Le  Valais;  our  guide  was  mounted  in  the  same 
manner,  and  carried  our  bag  of  provisions  for  the  day. 
The  ascent  is  not  very  steep,  and  took  us  no  more  than 
four  hours :  we  followed  the  Arve  up  to  its  source.  In 
our  way  we  Avere  fortunate  enough  to  witness  an  ava- 
lanche, far  enough  off  to  be  seen  without  danger :  as  we 
were  passing  under  the  Glacier  du  Tour,  a  noise  like  the 
burst  of  thunder  made  us  look  up ;  and  half  way  up 
this  glacier  there  was  a  cloud  of  snow,  like  the  smoke 
rolling  from  a  battery  of  cannon :  a  piece  of  ice  had 
burst  and  given  way,  and  left  one  side  of  a  great  rock 
bare. 

On  the  Col  de  Balme  we  had  a  full  view  of  the  sum- 
mit of  Mont  Blanc ;  its  dome,  likewise  covered  with 
snow ;  all  its  peaks,  or  aiguilles,  as  they  are  called  from 
their  form,  which  does  not  suffer  the  snow  to  lie  on 
them  but  partially,  and  its  glaciers  shooting  down  into 
the  valley.  Our  descent  to  the  valley  of  Trient  was 
very  steep,  through  a  forest  of  old  larch  trees  and  pines ; 
the  Bois  de  Magnan,  I  think :  so  steep  that  it  could  not 
even  be  ascended  except  on  foot ;  we  had  of  course  to 
drive  our  mules  before  us.  As  we  were  coming  down, 
we  met  a  lergerc,  with  half-a-dozen  cows ;  she  inquired 
of  our  guide  what  was  the  state  of  the  pasture  on  the 
mountain,  and  how  low  the  snow  was  already,  for  she 

16* 


186  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1814. 

was  going  to  the  chalet,  if  she  had  a  chance  of  finding 
pasture :  she  gave  the  cows  every  now  and  then  a  little 
salt,  which  made  them  mount  the  hill  with  great  avidity. 
We  crossed  the  sequestered  valley  of  Trient,  and  sloped 
along  a  height  above  it,  wdiich  brought  us  to  the  steep 
pass  called  La  Forcla,  which  was  still  shaded  with  pines, 
but  with  a  fine  verdure  between  the  opposite  banks. 
Half  way  down  La  Forcla,  we  came  to  a  superb  view  of 
the  Yalais,  from  the  bourg  of  Martigny,  which  seemed 
under  our  feet,  (though  we  were  more  than  an  hour  from 
from  it,)  to  the  white  walls  of  Sion :  it  was  the  prospect 
of  a  dead  level,  almost  covered  with  wood,  which  we 
afterwards  found  to  be  fruit  trees,  wdth  the  Rhone  wind- 
ins:  from  one  end  to  the  other,  and  the  Dranse  from  St. 
Bernard  passing  to  meet  it  iDctween  Martigny  and  an 
old  castle  upon  a  rocky  point.  From  the  spot  where  we 
commanded  this  prospect,  the  pass  changes  its  name  for 
that  of  Les  Eapes :  w^e  lost  sight  of  the  Alpine  pines, 
and  got  once  more  among  walnut  trees  and  vines,  and 
as  we  descended  lower,  we  rode  through  avenues  of  the 
finest  chestnut^  trees  and  patches  of  Indian  corn.  The 
change,  this  contrast,  the  beauty  and  profusion  of  all  the 
luxuriant  vegetation,  the  deep  blue  of  the  sky,  and 
detail  of  laborious  industry  upon  the  uplands  of  the 
craggy  Alps,  —  the  numberless  little  towns  that  we  could 
count  along  the  roots  of  mountains,  and  the  snowy  ridge 
that  was  perpetually  in  front,  and  seemed  to  bind  all  as 
with  a  crown,  —  made  this  one  of  the  most  delightful 
hours  I  ever  enjoj-ed  from  scenery.  I  should  be  well 
pleased  to  be  able  to  give  you  a  good  account  of  the 
country  we  travelled  over,  and  saw  in  our  way  from 
Martigny  to  the  place  at  which  I  shall  date  this  letter. 
It  is  not  more  interesting  by  picturesque  character,  than 
by  its  air  of  great  antiquity,  and  by  the  primitive  cus- 


.Ex.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  187 

toms  and  manners  of  the  inhabitants.  I  am  convinced 
that  it  would  be  worth  while  to  any  person,  who  can 
speak  German  familiarly,  to  give  a  few  weeks  to  exam- 
ine all  this  valley  minutely,  by  going  up  into  the  villages 
upon  the  mountains,  and  seeing  the  usages  and  genius 
of  those  who  have  never  seen  the  face  of  strangers.  In 
the  midst  of  the  industry,  simplicity,  and  plenty  which 
reigns  in  the  Lower  Valais,  it  is  melancholy  to  see  so 
large  a  proportion  of  the  inhabitants,  particularly  the 
children,  pallid  and  unhealthy;  in  travelling  through 
the  country,  the  children  usually  delight  one  with  their 
looks :  here,  I  have  not  seen  one  beauty ;  most  of  them 
are  loathsome.  The  air  of  the  plain  is  bad,  I  have  no 
doubt,  great  part  of  the  year ;  and  I  dare  say  they  have 
not  been  taught  all  they  have  to  learn  on  the  subject  of 
diet. 

From  Sion  we  came  by  Sierre  and  Turtman  to  Brieg. 
From  this  point  we  start  early  to-morrow,  upon  the  new 
road  by  the  Simplon  to  Domo  d'Ossola.  Remember  me 
to  my  dear  Leonard  and  the  little  ones,  and  believe  me 
ever 

Very  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter   CCXX.      FROM  LORD  HOLLAND. 
Dear  Horner,  Geneva,  i7th  Sept.  isu. 

I  enclose  a  letter  for  Lafayette.  Pray  see  him, 
even  if  you  must  go  to  La  Grange  for  it.  I  know  you 
will  like  one  another,  and  he  is  truly  a  veteran  in  the 
good  old  cause,  and  one  who  has  had,  and  is  likely  to 
have,  no  recompense  for  his  sacrifices  but  that  (a  great 
one!)  of  the  respect  of  such  men  as  yourself  Good 
bye. 

V.  Holland. 


]^88  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1814. 


Lktteu   CCXXI.     FROI^I   LORD  HOLLAND   TO   THE  MARQUIS 
DE  LA  FAYETTE.* 

My  dear  General,  Geneva,  i7tii  Sept.  isu. 

It  is  not,  I  assure  you,  every  one  of  my  country- 
men whom  I  think  worthy  of  being  introduced  to  so 
consistent  and  warm  a  friend  of  rational  liberty  as  your- 
self, but  I  cannot  deny  my  intimate  friend,  Mr.  Horner, 
that  pleasure,  because  I  know  he  has  both  sense  and 
principles  to  value  such  an  advantage  as  it  deserves.  He 
is,  indeed,  one  of  the  most  promising  men  in  our  Parlia- 
ment, as  well  as  in  his  profession  of  the  law,  the  duties 
of  which  oblige  him  to  return  sooner  than  he  otherwise 
would  wish,  to  England.  In  principle  he  has  always 
proved  himself  firmly  attached  to  my  uncle's  politics, 
though  his  career  began  as  my  uncle's  was  unfortunately 
closing,  and  he  consequently  knew,  and  but  barely  knew, 
him  personally.  As  hefeels,  however,  so  much  satisfac- 
tion in  having  known  him,  I  am  convinced  that  I  cannot 
procure  him  a  greater  pleasure  in  France  than  by  intro- 
ducing him  to  the  acquaintance  of  his  friend,  who  under 
yet  more  difficult  and  trying  circumstances  than  we  have 
experienced  in  England,  has  practised  and  upheld  the 
principles  which  guided  him  through  life,  so  nobly  and 
so  consistently.  My  anxiety  to  please  him,  perhaps  my 
vanity,  has  made  me  venture  to  assure  him,  that,  if  you 
are  not  at  Paris,  you  will  allow  him  the  satisfaction  of 
seeing  you  at  La  Grange. 

Lady  Holland  begs  to  be  kindly  remembered,  and  I 
cannot  close  my  letter  without  repeating  once  more  to 

*  Mr.  Horner  liad  no  opportunity  of  delivering  tliis  letter ;  it  was  found 
among  his  papers  -with  the  seal  unbroken  ;  I  insert  it  with  Lady  Holland's 
consent.  —  Ed. 


2Et.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  189 

you  the  pleasure  it  gave  me  to  find  you  so  well,  and  to 
assure  you  of  the  respect  and  gratitude  which  your  pub- 
lic conduct  and  personal  kindness  have  inspired  in  your 
Sincere  and  obliged  Friend, 

Vassall  Holland. 


Letter   CCXXII.      TO   HIS    SISTER,  MISS   ANNE   HORNER. 

My  dear  Nancy,  ^^^i-'i"'  ^^^h  Sept.  i8i4. 

In  a  letter  to  Fanny,  which  I  think  I  wrote  from 
Geneva,  I  said  I  should  give  you  some  account  of  our 
journey  to  that  town  by  the  Jura ;  but  all  those  scenes, 
which  pleased  us  very  much  at  the  time,  have  been  so 
surpassed  by  what  we  have  seen  since,  that  they  are  not 
very  fresh  in  my  memory  at  the  present  moment,  and  I 
will  therefore  leave  that  part  of  our  travels  to  be  des- 
cribed some  other  time,  when  repose  from  this  perpetual 
succession  of  new  objects  shall  have  allowed  me  to  look 
back  at  leisure  on  all  that  we  have  gone  through.  You 
will  be  surprised  to  see  this  dated  from  Milan;  three 
days  ago  it  was  not  our  intention  to  come  so  far,  as  you 
would  learn  from  a  short  letter  I  wrote  to  my  mother 
from  Brieg.  But  the  temptations  from  one  thing  to 
another  are  so  strong,  that  you  will  have  reason  to  think 
our  resistance  to  them  very  virtuous,  when  you  find, 
that  being  so  far  in  Italy,  we  can  turn  our  back  upon  all 
those  famous  places  which  we  have  been  reading  of  all 
our  lives.  From  Geneva  we  all  set  out  on  Sunday  the 
11th  for  the  usual  tour  to  Chamouny,  and  we  all  met 
again  on  the  following  Tuesday  in  the  evening  at  Mar- 
tigny,  and  thence  by  Sion,  the  capital  of  the  A^alais,  to 
Brieg ;  last  Friday  was  spent  in  crossing  the  Alps  by 
Napoleon's  road,  the  Simplon,  from  Brieg  to  Domo  d'Os- 
sola  J  on  Saturday,  after  a  short  drive  by  Yogogna  to 


190  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1814. 

Baveno,  upon  the  Lago  Maggiore,  we  went  upon  the 
water,  visited  the  Boromean  islands,  and  were  rowed 
down  in  a  lovely  evening  to  Arena ;  yesterday  we  crossed 
the  Ticino,  the  ancient  boundary  of  Piedmont  and  Lom- 
bardy,  at  a  place  called  Sesto,  and  arrived  in  the  middle 
of  the  day,  at  this  capital  of  the  late  kingdom  of  Italy. 

I  have  written  to  Anne  a  long  letter  about  Chamouny 
and  the  Valais ;  after  I  had  finished  it,  I  saw  a  little 
more  of  Brieg.  It  is  a  rude  country  town,  at  the  head 
of  Le  Valais,  where  the  Rhone  is  lost  in  a  narrow  ravine, 
and  is  joined  by  a  torrent  called  La  Saltine,  which  comes 
down  from  the  side  of  Simplon.  I  was  told  there  by  a 
person  who  must  know  the  country  very  well,  that  the 
people  of  the  mountains  are  much  more  lively  as  well 
as  more  robust  than  those  of  the  plain.  The  same  per- 
son confirmed  to  me,  what  I  had  heard  from  others  less 
likely  to  be  well  informed  on  such  a  point,  that  cretin- 
ism is  not  so  frequent  now  as  it  used  to  be  ;  and,  what 
is  very  curious,  that  at  all  times  it  was  the  children  of 
foreigners  newly  settled  in  the  country  that  were  most 
liable  to  it. 

We  left  Brieg  early  in  the  morning,  and  in  fourteen 
hours  reached  Domo  d'Ossola,  by  a  road  over  one  of 
the  great  heights  of  the  Alps;  but  so  well  conducted, 
that  in  the  ascent  there  is  scarcely  a  single  pull  that 
would  bring  one  of  our  postchaises  to  a  halt ;  and  the 
descent  is  a  good  trot  all  the  way  :  it  is  made  so  smooth 
and  is  so  handsomely  finished,  as  to  look  more  like  the 
approach  to  a  gentleman's  house  than  a  tract  over  a 
mountain  district  to  connect  distant  nations.  An  aj)pen- 
dage  of  this  noble  design,  which  is  but  half  finished,  is 
a  triumphal  arch  of  white  marble,  erected  where  the 
road  enters  Milan  :  we  passed  this  as  we  came  into  the 
town,  and  have  been  again  to  see  it.     On  our  way  from 


^T.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  JQl 

the  Simplon  there  was  lying  by  the  road-side  a  pillar  of 
white  marble,  in  one  piece,  more  than   32  feet   long, 
wrought,  but  not  polished,  which  was  one  of  eight  of 
the  same  size  that  had  been  cut  in  an  adjacent  quarry, 
and  were  to  be  carried  down  to  Milan  for  this   arch. 
The  work  is  at  present  suspended.     The  successors  of 
him  who  designed  it  could  not  do  better  than  to  inscribe 
upon    it,   that   it   was   commenced   by   Napoleon,  and 
finished  by   them,   whoever   they  may  be ;  but  there 
would  be  a  sort  of  magnanimity  in  that  mode  of  pro- 
claiming their  own  glory,  of  which,  perhaps,  they  will 
not  be  found  capable.     Already,  since  the  destruction  of 
the  French  power,  this  past  summer  has  broke  down 
some  of  the   side  walls  and  railings  which  as  yet  only 
spoil  in  a  few  places  the  neatness  and  finish  of  the  road ; 
but  one  little  bridge,  carried  away  by  an  avalanche,  and 
left  unrepaired,  would  make  it  wholly  unpassable.     The 
line  traced  upon  the  mountains  will  remain  for  ever  one 
of  the  most  lasting  (it  is  to  be  hoped)  of  the  many  im- 
pressions which  this  marvellous  adventurer  has   made 
upon  the  surface  of  Europe.     It  is  more  like  a  work  of 
the  old  Romans  than  any  thing  that  has  been  executed 
since  their  days.     The  magnitude  of  this  effort  of  human 
art  almost  prevented  us  from  enjoying  the  grandeur  of 
the  natural  scenery  through  which  it  passes.     In  mount- 
ing from  Brieg,  the  road  winds,  in  view  of  the  country 
which  I  have  described  round  that  town,  and  gains  in 
the  ascent  more  and  more  extensive  prospects  of  the 
Valais,  the  Rhone  flowing  through  it,  and  the  lofty  crags 
and  glaciers  which  bound  it  upon  the  north.     From  this 
you  will  readily  imagine,  better  indeed  than  with  my 
unpicturesque  eyes  I  could  even  see,  what  scenes  were 
continually  presented  to  us,  and  continually  shifting,  as 
we  mounted  the  sides  of  the  great  ridge ;  and  in  the 


192  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1814. 

winding  course  of  our  road  were  conducted  sometimes 
to  (i  projecting  precipice,  which  laid  the  whole  open,  and 
sometimes  had    narrow   landscapes  as  we  looked    out- 
wards from  the  close  and  deep  defiles.     This  way  of  de- 
scribing it  seems  like  sameness;  but  there  was  much 
variety.     Our  progress  through  the  different  regions  of 
vegetation,  in  the  course  of  the  day,  was  to  me  one 
of  the  newest  impressions  that  I  felt :  we  left  maize, 
and  vines,  and  walnut  trees ;  passed  through  forests  of 
pine    and   larch,   which   were   less  vigorous  as  we  ap- 
proached the  summits.     Near  the  Hospice  nothing  is  to 
be  seen  but  stunted  rhododendrons ;  in  descending,  the 
order  is  just  reversed,  but  is  more  delightful ;  it  was  like 
going  from  spring  into  summer  all  in  one  day,  and  to  a 
brighter   summer   and   richer  vegetation  than  we  had 
ever  seen  before.     The  gradual  approach  to  the  luxu- 
riance of  Italy  is  for  several  miles  through  a  deep  dark 
chasm,  not  much  wider  than  the  torrent  which  has  cut 
it;    and  by  the  side  of  which  the    road  descends,  the 
cliffs   on   both    sides  being  of  great  height   and   very 
savage.      After  a  few  miles  of  this   narrow  defile,  we 
came  to  a  very  handsome  one  of  two  lofty  arches,  which 
terminate  the   Simplon  road,  at  the  extremity  of  the 
glen,  which  leads  to  the  town  of  Domo  d'Ossola,  situ- 
ated near  the  end  of  a  flat  alluvial  plain,  about  a  league 
wide  and  six  long,  on  all  sides  of  which  are  lofty  alps, 
some  of  them   topped   with   snow.     We  were  now  in 
Italy :  according  to  the    old  and  present  political  geo- 
graphy, in  Piedmont,  which  goes  to  the  Ticino :  accord- 
ing to  Napoleon's  geography,  in  the  kingdom  of  Italy ; 
but  by  the  language,  and  the  houses  painted  in  fresco, 
and  the  thick  brilliant  vegetation,  and  the  market-place 
covered  with  large  baskets  of  macaroni,  in  Italy.     Our 
drive  next  morning  to  the  lake  was  through  a  country 


^T.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  I93 

of  quite  a  new  aspect,  owing  chiefly  to  the  elegant  forms 
of  all  the  commonest  houses,  an  elegance  not  consistr 
ing  in  trimness,  like  our  cottages  in  old  England,  for 
these  are  generally  in  a  rubbish  of  dirt  and  dilapidation 
when  you  come  very  near  them,  but  derived  from  the 
outline  and  frame  of  the  architecture :  so  mucli  of  the 
house  is  appropriated  and  contrived  for  the  enjoyment 
of  shade  in  the  open  air,  that  half  a  dozen  poor  ruinous 
habitations  present  a  mass  of  galleries,  corridors,  and 
arcades,  above  one  another,  the  light  coming  through  in 
many  places,  and  the  tall  creeping  vines  connecting 
these  pieces  together,  and  with  their  own  trellis-work ; 
the  chimney  is  of  so  handsome  a  shape,  that  it  seems  a 
studied  ornament  of  the  building,  and  the  deep  projec- 
tion of  the  roof  gives  a  breadth  of  shadow  that  seems  to 
finish  the  whole.  It  was  at  Vogogna  that  I  made  so 
minute  a  study  of  these  houses,  for  it  was  there  that  the 
first  effect  of  them  struck  and  pleased  me.  I  dare  say 
you  know  it  all  before  from  pictures,  but  the  jDainters  of 
Italy,  in  this  respect,  had  only  to  copy  what  they  found 
in  every  village. 

I  must  refer  you,  for  an  accurate  account  of  the  Lago 
Maggiore  and  its  islands  to  the  books  of  travels.  What 
distinguished  it,  at  the  first  view,  from  the  lakes  I  have 
seen  at  home,  and  in  Ii^eland,  is  the  soft  serene  clearness 
and  calmness,  "  la  tranquillissima  marina,"  and  the  num- 
ber of  towns  along  the  margin,  with  their  picturesque 
roofs  and  towers.  The  glory  of  the  lake,  however,  is 
the  art  that  has  been  lavished  on  its  islands.  We  were 
rowed  away  from  this  fairy  land,  towards  Arona,  which 
we  reached  in  about  three  hours ;  in  one  of  those  fine 
evenings,  which  are  remembered  all  the  rest  of  our  life. 

At  Milan  (for  I  am  now  writing  at  a  great  distance 
from  thence)  we  spent  two  days.     The  opera-house  is 

VOL.  II.  17 


3^94  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1814. 

the  handsomest  theatre  I  have  seen,  m  spite  of  being 
kept  in  the  dark;  I  was  not  very  much  pleased  with 
any  part  of  the  representation,  either   the   singing  or 
dancing  :  the  chief  piece,  a  half  serious  opera,  taken,  I 
beheve,  from  Mrs.  Opie's  tale  of  the  Father  and  Daugh- 
ter, the  serious  part  consisting  of  the  history  of  a  mad- 
man's cure,  and  the  comic,  of  all  the  buffoonery  which 
the  lowest  vulgar  practise  with  persons  in  that  unhappy 
state.     Any  thing  more  repulsive  to  good  taste  and  re- 
finement, in   dramatic   exhibitions,  cannot  be  fancied. 
There  was  one  fine  moment  for  theatrical  effect;  the 
maniac  in  his  recovery  hums  a  tune,  which  he  cannot  go 
through,  and  his  daughter  standing  by,  but  out  of  sight, 
finishes  it  for  him ;  it  was  her  tune  in  her  youth ;  and 
her  misconduct  had  brought  on  his  derangement :  but 
the  music  was  not  equal  to  this  situation.    It  struck  me, 
that  throughout  the  piece  there  was,  both  in  the  acting 
and  in  the  circumstances  of  the  story,  a  mixture  of  the 
details  and  habits  of  ordinary  life,  which  would  offend 
us  in  our  opera  or  modern  tragedy ;  and  which,  if  one 
is  safe  in  making  such  a  remark  upon  a  single  instance, 
is  perhaps  national,  the  observation  struck  me  the  more, 
because  I  observed  the  same  sort  of  thing  in  the  ges- 
tures and  elocution  of  a  preacher  whom  we  heard  in 
the   cathedral.     There  is  no  vulgarity  in  what  I  mean, 
but  a  common  manner  taken  from  common  life,  which 
must  aid  powerfully,  both  on  the  theatre  and  in  declam- 
ation, any  eloquence  that  has  strength  in  itself   I  would 
compare  what  I  am  talking  of  and  which  I  expect  I 
have  not  made  very  intelligible,  to  those  familiarities 
and  domestic  details  with  which  Shakspeare  touches  his 
highest  passages,  and  which  offend  French  critics  much, 
though  they  heighten  our  delight. 

You  may  be  sure  we  saw  the  remains  of  the  Cenacolo 


^T.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  I95 

of  Leonardo  da  Vinci,  in  the  refectory  of  the  old  monas- 
tery of  Notre  Dame  des  Graces :  enough  of  it  yet  re- 
mains to  exceed  all  the  ideas  which  the  best  prints  had 
given  me  of  the  majesty  and  plainness  and  pathos  of 
the  design;  the  principal  figure  is  little  injured,  and  is 
very  fine  and  affecting.  The  greatest  wonder  of  Milan 
is  the  cathedral  or  Domo ;  another  illustration  of  Bona- 
parte's ambition  for  the  fame  of  public  works.  There 
is,  I  dare  say,  a  great  mixture  of  style  in  a  building, 
which  it  has  taken  so  many  ages  to  erect ;  but  minute 
criticism  is  not  to  be  thought  of  in  the  sight  of  such 
vastness  and  richness.  Our  first  visit  to  the  cathedral 
was  on  Sunday,  about  dusk ;  the  whole  perfumed  with 
the  incense ;  a  monk  was  preaching  to  a  very  large  and 
attentive  congregation ;  his  pulpit  was  a  semicircular 
gallery  round  one  of  the  great  pillars,  a  form  very 
favourable  to  the  freedom  of  his  action,  which  was  easy 
and  graceful,  with  that  sort  of  familiarity  which  I 
alluded  to  before. 

We  left  Milan  on  the  20th  September,  and  came  to 
Turin,  where  we  remained  several  days ;  we  then  crossed 
the  Alps  again  over  Mont  Cenis,  by  another  great  road 
which  we  owe  to  Napoleon,  which  is  only  second  to  the 
Simplon  as  a  monument  of  his  power,  and  of  the  use  he 
could  make  of  it.  Our  course  was  by  Rivoli,  wdiich 
may  be  called  the  head,  I  believe,  of  the  plain  of  Lom- 
bardy.  We  found  the  heat  great,  and  in  the  middle  of 
the  day  oppressive,  while  we  were  on  this  low  level, 
which  is  covered  with  the  richest  meadows,  and  rice 
plantations  and  mulberry  trees.  The  view  of  the  Alps, 
"  the  stony  girdle  of  the  world,"  which  was  before  us  as 
we  traversed  the  plain,  was  grand  in  the  highest  degree  ; 
and  might  easily  suggest  the  prejudice  of  the  Italians  in 
all  former  times,  that  this  was  their  boundary  from  ano- 


196  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1814. 

ther  world  inhabited  only  by  barbarians.  The  finest 
single  object  was  Monte  Rosa,  as  seen  all  the  way  from 
the  Ticino  to  the  Seria.  We  came  through  the  Alpine 
valleys  of  Savoy,  beautiful  all  the  way,  if  we  had  not 
been  satiated  with  such  scenery,  to  Chambery,  and  then 
by  Les  Echelles  and  Pont  Beauvoisin  to  Lyons.  We 
passed  some  days  there,  and  are  now  upon  our  way  to 
Paris,  where  I  shall  not  be  able  to  stop  for  more  than  a 
couple  of  days.  I  am  tired  of  moving  about;  but  it 
would  be  very  agreeable  and  very  useful  to  make  a  resi- 
dence of  some  weeks  at  Paris ;  the  magistrates  of  Somer- 
set, however,  are  upon  the  alert,  and  I  must  hasten  to 
my  tasks  there.  I  must  reserve  for  other  letters,  or  for 
future  gossip,  the  greatest  part  of  what  I  have  seen  in 
these  travels ;  in  which,  because  I  wished  to  send  you 
long  letters  as  you  desired,  I  have  seldom  found  time  to 
write  at  all.  I  expect  to  hear  of  you  all  at  Paris :  in  the 
meantime  give  my  kindest  love  to  all  at  home,  and  let 
Mrs.  Murray  know  we  are  all  perfectly  in  health,  and 
that  I  send  her  my  affectionate  regards.  We  are  stopped 
by  the  breaking  of  a  wheel  at  this  place,  from  which  I 
shall  date  my  letter,  which  I  shall  put  into  the  Post  at 
Moulins. 

Ever,  my  dear  Nancy,  affectionately  yours. 

Era.  Horner. 

Varennes  sur  L'Allier,  5  Oct.  1814. 


Letter  CCXXIII.     TO  DUGALD  STEWART,  ESQ. 

My  dear  Sir  Bowood,  28th  Oct.  1814. 

I  ougcht  lono-  ao-o  to  have  thanked  you  for  in- 

eluding  me  in  the  letters,  by  which   you  introduced 

Murray  to  some  of  your  friends  at  Paris ;  particularly 

as  I  am  indebted  to  all  of  them  for  the  most  obliging 


iEr.  37.]  CORRESrONDENCE.  297 

and  marked  attention.  M.  Le  Chevalier  seemed  to  give 
us  his  whole  time  with  a  good  humour  and  cordiality 
that  made  all  of  us  feel  most  grateful  to  him.  He  is 
now  librarian  to  the  Lycee  d'Henri  Quatre,  the  modern 
transformation  of  the  convent  of  St.  Genevieve.  M. 
Gallois  did  us  the  favour  of  taking  us  to  the  Chamber 
of  Deputies,  on  a  day  of  public  discussion  ;  it  would  be 
well  for  France,  if  sentiments  as  liberal  and  enlightened 
as  his  were  to  prevail  generally  in  that  assembly,  which 
I  fear  has  not  sufficient  strength  of  materials  yet,  either 
in  point  of  talents  or  of  connexion  with  the  people,  to 
form  the  foundations  of  a  popular  constitution.  T  re- 
gret exceedingly  that  my  short  stay  in  Paris  prevented 
me  from  cultivating  the  acquaintance  of  M.  De  Geran- 
do ;  the  first  time  you  write  to  him,  I  wish  you  would 
assure  him  how  much  I  feel  myself  obliged  by  his  kind 
civilities  and  attention ;  he  took  the  trouble  of  writing 
many  letters,  to  render  our  travels  in  the  south  of 
France  more  agreeable ;  by  one  of  which  I  had  the 
satisfaction  of  seeing  that  excellent  and  agreeable  man 
Camille  Jourdan,  at  Lyons,  one  of  the  very  few  surviv- 
ors who  have  gone  through  the  revolution,  and  the  still 
more  difficult  trials  of  the  late  despotism,  with  an  un- 
sullied name,  and  an  unimpaired  attachment  to  the 
principles  of  moderate  liberty. 

You  will  be  glad  to  hear  that  I  saw  both  M.  Suard 
and  the  Abbe  Morellet  in  good  health ;  I  met  them  to- 
gether at  a  party  of  Mad.  Suard's,  where  Sir  J.  Mackin- 
tosh took  me.  It  was  very  interesting  to  see  in  person 
two  men,  who  connect  our  day  with  names  so  memorable, 
and  times  so  remote ;  for  I  think  the  Abbe  Morellet  was 
at  the  Sorbonne  with  Turgot  in  the  year  1748.  I  had 
remarked  his  sturdy  figure  in  the  Chamber  of  Deputies. 

From  what  I  could  collect,  though  any  judgment  I 

17* 


298  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1814. 

could  form  in  so  short  a  stay  is  good  for  little,  nothing 
can  be  more  problematical  than  the  future  prospects  of 
the  new  government  of  France.  That  the  Bourbon 
flimily  will  keep  their  place,  unless  they  are  exposed  to 
the  hazards  of  a  new  war,  or  commit  some  enormous  in- 
discretion at  home,  seemed  to  be  the  growing  opinion  of 
the  most  intelligent  persons..  But  there  appeared  to  be 
very  httle  conjecture,  and  very  little  hope,  with  respect 
to  the  probable  fate  of  what  they  call  their  constitution. 
In  the  king's  cabinet,  it  was  said,  there  were  almost  as 
many  systems  as  there  were  ministers ;  some  of  them, 
and  these  the  most  trusted,  urging  the  king  to  bring 
back  by  degrees  all  the  old  institutions  of  every  descrip- 
tion, at  the  head  of  whom  is  the  chancellor;  others, 
such  as  Talleyrand,  making  a  struggle,  out  of  some  re- 
gard to  appearances  of  personal  consistency,  for  as  much 
of  the  improvements  gained  by  the  revolution  as  can  be 
retained.  The  Abbe  Montesquieu  is  described  as  a 
mere  creature  of  the  court,  but  liking  to  make  his 
speeches  at  the  bar  of  the  assembly.  The  friends  of  the 
court  say,  that  Talleyrand  attempted  at  first  to  sur- 
round the  king  with  his  own  dependants,  and  to  make 
his  majesty  a  cypher  in  the  administration ;  on  the  other 
hand,  Talleyrand's  account  to  a  friend  of  mine  was,  that 
the  king  had  the  vanity  to  suppose  himself  capable  of 
doing  a  great  deal  of  business,  in  consequence  of  which 
it  was  in  fact  done  by  unfit  persons.  These  stories  are 
not  inconsistent. 

In  the  lower  assembly,  there  is  nothing  hke  party  sep- 
aration or  connexion.  A  remarkable  symptom  of  this 
nature,  however,  showed  itself  in  the  senate,  during  the 
discussion  of  the  law  by  which  a  censure  of  the  press 
has  been  established;  all  the  imperial  marshals  acting 
together,  against  the  measure  of  government.     I  was 


jEx.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  199 

informed,  also,  that  the  young  Due  de  Broghe  is  an 
eager  constitutionaHst,  and  that  he  has  always  shown  a 
predilection  for  popular  principles,  as  much  as  that  dis- 
position could  be  made  known  during  the  reign  of  Na- 
poleon. 

The  discussion  of  that  law  excited  a  very  lively  inte- 
rest in  Paris,  among  all  men  of  education  and  reflection ; 
I  was  there  at  that  time,  and  it  appeared  to  me  that  its 
vast  importance  was  duly  appreciated  and  felt.  I  am 
afraid,  however,  that  there  is  not  in  the  country,  or  in 
the  provincial  cities,  any  degree  of  steady  political  feel- 
ing, connecting  the  middling  classes  of  the  people  with 
their  inferiors  in  a  sentiment  of  common  interest.  The 
lower  people  in  general,  though  more  strongly  in  some 
districts  than  others,  regret  Bonaparte,  and  the  loss  of 
military  glory,  and  that  rapid  military  promotion  which 
provided  for  their  sons,  and  held  out  to  all  of  them  pros- 
pects of  ambition.  The  middling  classes,  who  felt  the 
conscription  as  a  tyranny  of  the  cruellest  description, 
rejoice  at  the  removal  of  their  late  ruler,  but  have  no 
feeling  of  attachment  either  to  royalty  in  itself,  or  to 
the  Bourbons,  who  were  literally  forgotten.  The  priests 
are  said  to  be  very  zealous  in  labouring  to  recall  or 
create  feeUngs  of  that  sort,  but  hitherto  without  success. 
The  populace  of  Paris  are  understood  to  be  more  disin- 
clined to  the  present  royal  family,  than  those  of  any 
other  part  of  France ;  they  gave  rather  an  unexpected 
proof  of  other  attachments,  upon  the  Duke  of  Orleans 
taking  possession  of  the  Palais  Royal,  for  he  was  hailed 
with  acclamations,  and  several  voices  in  the  crowd  spoke 
to  him  of  his  father,  and  said  he  was  always  the  friend 
of  the  people.  Among  the  people  of  rank  at  Paris,  the 
sentiment  that  is  uppermost  at  present  is,  that  they  are 
relieved  from  a  tyranny  which,  though  not  sanguinary, 


200  COERESPONDENCE.  [1814. 

pursued  them  through  every  interest  and  almost  every 
incident  of  domestic  life,  with  incessant  interference  and 
vexation. 

The  only  sure  and  permanent  prognostic  of  civil  lib- 
erty, that  I  could  hear  of  in  France,  is  the  prodigious 
subdivision  of  land,  and  the  unprecedented  multitude  of 
persons  directly  possessed  of  that  property.  An  estimate, 
which  seemed  to  come  from  authority,  made  it  as  high 
as  three  millions  of  persons.  So  great  a  proportion  of 
this  must  be  held  upon  revolutionary  titles,  or  upon 
titles  founded  in  the  new  law  of  succession,  that  one 
should  hope  that  so  much  at  least  of  the  benefits  earned 
by  the  revolution,  as  consists  in  this  equitable  law,  and 
in  the  salutary  transfer  of  vast  domains  to  the  people, 
must  be  secured  for  ever,  and  fortified  against  the 
designs  of  the  ccurt  by  an  insuperable  bulwark  of  such 
interests  and  such  numbers.  The  court  have  had  the 
folly,  however,  to  issue  secret  commissions  to  the  bishops, 
for  a  return  of  the  lands  held  by  the  church  in  1791, 
and  of  the  present  proprietors  by  whom  any  of  them 
are  possessed :  such  a  measure  never  can  lead  to  any 
consequences,  but  against  the  court  itself  The  fact  is  not 
much  known  in  France,  but  there  is  no  doubt  of  it. 

This  immense  multiplication  of  landed  proprietors 
has  led  to  a  great  extension  of  cultivation,  in  point  of 
surface,  and  probably  in  many  parts  has  made  the  culti- 
vation much  inferior  in  skill  and  efficacy  to  what  it  was 
before. 

There  are  complaints,  I  observe,  in  all  the  statistical 
reports,  of  the  unnecessary  increase  of  vineyards,  and  of 
the  diminution  of  the  woods.  I  was  assured,  however, 
by  a  very  intelligent  and  well-informed  man,  M.  De  Can- 
dolle.  Professor  of  Botany  at  MontpelUer,  whom  I  was 
introduced  to  at  Geneva,  that  of  late  years  there  has 


JEt.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  201 

been  a  very  great  progress  in  the  increase  and  manage- 
ment of  artificial  meadows.  He  told  me,  at  the  same 
time,  that  such  was  the  subdivision  of  lands  in  the  south 
of  Fran'ce,  that  the  footman  you  hire  is  connnonly  the 
owner  of  an  estate.  I  am  ashamed  to  have  allowed  my 
travelling  garrulity  to  run  on  to  such  a  length.  But  I 
was  anxious  to  tell  you  something  of  what  I  had  picked 
up  on  some  of  the  points  that  are  most  interesting  to 
you.  I  shall  have  much  more  to  say,  if  I  have  the  plea- 
sure of  meeting  you  before  Christmas,  which  I  do  not 
yet  despair  of,  though  this  unexpected  meeting  of  par- 
liament comes  very  much  in  my  way. 

With  best  and  kindest  regards  to  Mrs.  and  Miss  Stew- 
art, I  am  ever,  my  dear  Sir, 

Most  affectionately  yours, 

Era.  Horner. 


Letter  CCXXIV.     TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 
My  dear  Murray,  Lincoln's  inn,  24th  Nov.  1814. 

I  am  very  much  obliged  to  you  for  sending  me 
Lord  Meadowbank's  thoughts  on  the  introduction  of 
civil  juries  into  Scotland.  I  shall  read  with  avidity  every 
thing  that  relates  to  that  most  interesting  subject. 

Kennedy  must  have  misunderstood  Mr.  Adam,  I  think, 
when  he  collected  from  him  that  I  leant  in  favour  of  a 
vote  upon  the  jury,  rather  than  insist  upon  an  unani- 
mous verdict.  I  am  convinced  that  all  the  advantages 
of  a  jury  cannot  be  secured,  particularly  the  conclusive 
and  satisfactory  decision  of  matters  of  fact,  without  hav- 
ing what  we  call  unanimity  in  the  verdict ;  which  is  not 
a  real  concurrence  of  all,  (of  course,  it  cannot  be  in  the 
nature  of  things,)  but  a  contrivance,  which  holds  out  to 
the  public  the  show  of  such  concurrence,  and  is  attended 


202  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1814. 

with  this  iid vantage,  that  it  makes  every  juryman  sure 
of  being  heard  who  has  reasons  to  allege  for  his  peculiar 
opinion.  But  if  the  prejudice  be  as  strong  against  such 
a  structure  of  the  jury,  as  people  who  know  Scotland 
represent  it  to  be,  one  must  yield  to  the  force  of  that 
obstacle,  and  the  framers  of  the  present  Bill  will  do 
wisely  not  to  press  any  particular  innovation  against  the 
prevailing  sentiment  of  the  country ;  though  they  will 
show  their  ability  for  such  legislation  still  more  conspicu- 
ously, if,  while  they  yield  to  public  opinion  in  the  first 
instance,  they  make  their  new  institution  with  some  con- 
trivances for  gradually  improving  that  opinion  itself,  and 
for  imperceptibly  accommodating  the  machinery  of  the 
institution  to  such  future  iuiprovement  of  the  public 
sentiments.  The  oath  of  secrecy  proposed  is  but  a 
clumsy  expedient,  and  will  hardly  be  effectual.  An 
idea  occurred  to  me,  which  I  mentioned  to  Mr.  Adam,  to 
fix  by  the  statute  a  definite  number,  [nine  for  instance, 
of  a  jury  of  twelve,  or  twelve  of  fifteen,)  whose  agree- 
ment at  least  shall  be  required  for  a  verdict ;  to  receive 
the  verdict,  when  that  or  a  larger  number  are  agreed, 
as  the  verdict  of  that  definite  number  only ;  and  when 
so  many  cannot  agree,  to  instruct  the  jury  to  return 
their  verdict,  without  saying  any  thing  of  their  division, 
as  a  verdict  unfavourable  to  the  party  who  undertook 
the  affirmative  of  the  issue.  In  this  way,  a  verdict  in 
such  matters  would  come  to  be  habitually  considered  as 
the  decision  of  that  definite  numl)er  of  sworn  men  upon 
the  issue  joined  5  and  when  the  popular  notion  of  the 
thing  was  thus  fixed,  it  might  not  be  impracticable  to 
cut  ofi"  the  supernumerary  jurors.  This  will  a23pear  a 
crude  proposal ;  I  wish  you  would  give  it  some  consid- 
eration. I  have  sometimes  conjectured,  historicallj',  that 
it  was  by  some  progress  of  this  sort  we  got  our  una- 


^Et.  37.]         TREATY  WITH  THE  KING  OF  NAPLES.  203 

nimity  of  juries  in  England;  a  greater  number  being 
originally  sworn,  though  always  a  number  of  which 
twelve  was  the  majority,  as  in  our  grand  juries  to  this 
day,  (which  may  consist  of  twelve,  or  of  any  number 
greater  than  that,  but  not  exceeding  twenty-three,)  till 
verdicts  came  to  be  known  as  the  finding  of  twelve  men 
upon  their  oaths.  • 

Affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Parliament  met  on  the  8th  of  November,  but 
adjourned  on  the  1st  of  December  to  the  9th  of  Feb- 
ruary. During  this  short  session,  Mr.  Horner  spoke  on 
several  occasions. 


TREATY  WITH  THE  KING  OF  NAPLES. 

On  a  motion  for  the  House  going  into  a  committee  on 
the  Army  Estimates,  on  the  21st  of  November,  Mr.  Whit- 
bread  put  some  questions  to  ministers  relating  to  some 
proceedings  of  Lord  Castlereagh  at  the  Congress  of 
Vienna,  more  particularly  with  regard  to  a  treaty  be- 
tween Austria  and  the  King  of  Naples,  Murat,  to  w^hich 
the  British  government  had  become  parties ;  and  a  noti- 
fication, signed  by  Prince  Repnin,  of  a  convention,  by 
virtue  of  wdiich  the  Emperor  of  Russia,  in  concert  with 
Austria  and  England,  had  placed  in  the  hands  of  the 
King  of  Prussia  the  administration  of  the  kingdom  of 
Saxony.  Ministers  only  partially  answered  the  ques- 
tions ;  and  the  Chancellor  of  the  Exchequer  urged  "  the 
impropriety  of  bringing  forward  into  public  discussion 
every  thing  which  formed  the  subject  of  discussion  at 


204  TREATY  WITH  THE  KING  OF  NAPLES.  [1814. 

Vienna."  Mr.  Steiohen  (Master  in  Chancery)  took  the 
same  view,  saying,  that  "  it  would  be  a  practice  very 
inconvenient  for  the  House  to  have  questions  of  this 
sort  daily  put  to  ministers." 

Mr.  Horner  replied  to  Mr.  Stephen:  he  said  that 
"  nothing  could  show  more  clearly  the  change  that  had 
lately  taken  place  in  the  j^ractice  of  parliamentary  j)ro- 
ceedings,  than  to  find  a  gentleman  of  the  experience 
and  ability  of  the  lion,  and  learned  member  who  spoke 
last,  condemn  the  practice  of  seeking  information  of 
ministers.  What  had  become  of  the  functions  of  that 
House,  if,  when  ministers  demanded  a  large  suj)ply  of 
monej^,  gentlemen  should  be  told  that  it  was  irregular 
to  ask  for  what  purpose  it  was  wanted  ?  If,  indeed, 
there  were  any  irregularity  in  this  practice,  it  proceeded 
from  the  much  greater  irregularity  that  had  lately  been 
introduced  on  the  other  side  of  the  House,  in  proposing 
large  grants  of  money,  and  great  armies  to  be  kept  up 
in  time  of  peace,  without  condescending  to  inform  the 
House  for  what  purposes  they  were  wanted.  The  right 
hon.  gentleman  desired  them  to  wait  with  patience  till 
some  future  day,  when  those  subjects  might  be  discussed 
with  more  regularity.  He,  however,  conceived  that  the 
House  had  a  right  to  be  informed  generally  of  the  state 
of  our  foreign  relations,  although  they  knew  that  nego- 
tiations actually  pending  could  not,  with  propriety,  be 
communicated.  His  hon.  friends,  however,  had  not 
asked  about  any  thing  that  was  doing,  but  about  things 
actually  done.  They  did  not  ask  what  crimes  were 
meditating,  but  they  wished  to  be  informed  about  crimes 
actually  perpetrated.  They  did  not  inquire  about  an 
act  of  Prince  Repnin  alone,  but  they  asked  whether  this 
act  had  not  been  sanctioned  by  Lord  Castlereagh,  and 
whether  this  country  was  not  thereby  already  commit- 


iET.  37.]        TREATY  WITH  THE  KING  OF  NAPLES.  205 

ted  ?  He  saw  no  difference,  in  the  principle,  between 
the  annexations  that  were  now  making,  and  the  tyran- 
nical acts  of  that  government  against  which  we  had 
been  so  long  contending.  The  only  difference  that  he 
could  sec  was,  that  instead  of  being  the  work  of  one 
great  spoliator,  it  was  the  work  of  many." 

On  the  following  day,  Mr.  Whitbread  again  brought 
the  subject  of  this  treaty  before  the  House.  "  It  was," 
he  said,  "  a  treaty  of  alliance  between  the  reigning  King 
of  Naples  and  the  Emperor  of  Austria,  by  which  the 
possessions  of  the  former  were  guaranteed  to  him ;  and 
by  a  secret  article  in  the  same  treaty,  an  accession  of 
territory  was  promised  to  him  from  the  dominions  of 
the  Pope,  on  condition  of  the  immediate  co-operation  of 
his  army  with  the  army  of  the  allies.  This  treaty  was 
acceded  to,  on  the  part  of  the  British  government,  by 
Lord  William  Bentinck ;  and  a  note  signed  by  him  bore 
that,  in  case  the  Neapolitan  government  should  not 
exact  the  entering  into  a  written  treaty,  but,  relying  on 
the  word  of  a  British  minister,  should  be  contented  with 
a  verbal  engagement,  the  undersigned  was  instructed, 
officially,  on  the  part  of  the  British  government,  to  ap- 
prove of  the  treaty;  and  that,  if  the  English  govern- 
ment refused  to  sign  a  regular  treaty,  it  was  from  senti- 
ments of  delicacy  towards  an  ancient  ally,  the  King  of 
Sicily."  The  Chancellor  of  the  Exchequer,  in  reply, 
stated,  "  The  note  itself  assigned  a  reason  for  refusing 
to  enter  into  a  treaty;  and  it  never  surely  could  be 
contended,  that  the  faith  of  the  country  was  so  pledged, 
under  such  circumstances,  as  in  the  case  of  a  regular 
treaty ;  but,  at  all  events,  when  the  circumstances  were 
fully  known,  it  would  turn  out  that  this  country  had 
fully  performed  all  its  engagements." 

Mr.  Horner  replied  to  the  Chancellor  of  the  Exche- 

VOL.  n.  18 


206  TREATY  WITH   THE   KING   OF  NAPLES.  [1814. 

quer :  lie  said,  "  It  was  true  there  was  no  actual  treaty 
signed ;  but,  in  the  same  breath,  the  minister  of  the 
country  said,  although  he  would  not  sign  a  treaty,  he 
pledged  his  honour  and  the  faith  of  the  nation  to  the 
execution  of  his  engagement.  The  honour  of  the  coun- 
try was  as  much  given  to  Naples  as  if  the  most  solemn 
treaty  had  been  entered  into.  But  there  was  an  im- 
portant consideration  arising  out  of  this  business.  It 
had  been  stated  last  night,  on  the  part  of  govern- 
ment, in  that  House,  that  ministers  possessed  no  infor- 
mation whatever  of  any  accession  on  the  part  of  Lord 
William  Bentinck  or  Lord  Castlereagh  to  the  treaty 
between  Austria  and  Naples.  The  denial  was  not  so 
strong  to-day  as  that  which  they  had  heard  yesterday. 
But,  at  all  events,  he  hoped  the  House  would  not  for- 
get, that  if  there  was  any  accession  to  this  treaty  on  the 
j)art  of  this  country,  ministers  were  in  utter  ignorance 
of  it :  if  there  was  any  such  thing,  they  were  altogether 
strangers  to  it.  With  respect  also  to  the  order  of  Prince 
Repnin  for  the  surrender  of  Saxony,  they  had  no  official 
information  respecting  it.  It  had  been  stated,  that  Lord 
Castlereagh  had  given  his  sanction  to  this  order.  If  so, 
the  right  hon.  gentleman  ought  to  have  had  official  in- 
formation of  it.  A  Secretary  of  State  had,  in  this 
instance,  been  sent  abroad,  instead  of  one  of  the  descrip- 
tion of  persons  hitherto  delegated.  It  would  be  ex- 
tremely inconvenient  to  the  House  and  his  Majesty's 
ministers  in  general,  if  persons  holding  high  ministerial 
offices  should  be  sent  abroad,  who  might  not  think  fit 
to  communicate  regularly  with  the  government  at 
home,  and  thus  keep  his  colleagues  from  being  officially 
informed  of  such  important  proceedings  as  the  accession 
on  the  part  of  this  country  to  the  treaty  between  Aus- 
tria and  Naples,  and  the  order  of  Prince  Repnin  for  the 
transfer  of  Saxony  to  Prussia." 


iET.  37.]        TREATY  WITH  THE   KING   OF  NAPLES.  207 

The  subject  was  resumed  on  the  25th,  when  Mr.  Hor- 
ner again  spoke.  "  The  House,"  he  said,  "  had  a  right 
to  demand  information,  as  it  regarded  the  honour  and 
faith  of  the  Crow^n  in  its  foreign  relations,  which  should 
ever  be  dear  to  the  House,  whether  we  were  not  acting 
contrary  to  our  treaty  with  the  King  of  Naples.  We 
had  guaranteed  to  him  the  territory  of  Naples,  with  an 
addition  even  of  territory,  which  would  explain  his  pre- 
sent movements  on  the  shores  of  the  Adriatic,  in  the 
march  of  Ancona,  and  the  duchy  of  Romagna.  We  had 
not  pledged  our  honour  to  him  on  this  subject  gratui- 
tously, but  we  had  value  received  for  our  stipulation. 
We  had  not  rushed  into  the  arms  of  Joachim  Napoleon, 
from  any  w^ish  to  secure  those  persons  who  had  been 
raised  on  the  ruins  of  the  ancient  dynasties,  but  because 
he  had  assisted  us  to  overthrow  the  power  which  had 
raised  him.  We  had  received  his  co-operation  in  Italy, 
W'ithout  which  the  movements  of  the  allies,  as  well  on 
the  Rhine  as  in  Italy,  would  have  been  embarrassed. 
Even  at  the  time  when  Lord  Castlereagh  gave  instruc- 
tions to  Lord  William  Bentinck  to  conclude  the  engage- 
ment with  Joachim,  the  co-operation  of  that  monarch 
w^as,  he  understood,  necessary  to  render  the  position  of 
Count  Bellegarde  on  the  Mincio  secure.  The  state  of 
our  engagements  with  Joachim  was  this :  —  In  xVpril 
last,  a  treaty  was  concluded  with  Austria,  which  was 
presented  to  Lord  Castlereagh  for  his  concurrence. 
That  noble  lord  returned  the  treaty  with  alterations 
in  his  own  hand-writing,  which  secured  an  indemnity  to 
the  King  of  Sicily  for  Naples ;  and  which  territory  was 
left  to  King  Joachim,  provided  King  Joachim  should 
withdraw  his  claims  upon  Sicil}^  The  treatj^,  thus  al- 
tered, was  agreed  to  by  Naples ;  and  Lord  Castlereagh, 
at  Dijon  or  Chatillon,  signified  his  concurrence  in  it. 


208  miSII  TE ACE-PRESERVATION  BILL.  [1814. 

and  stated,  that  the  only  reason  Avhy  he  did  not  for- 
mally accede,  arose  from  motives  of  delicacy  to  the  King 
of  Sicily ;  but  that,  on  his  faith  and  that  of  England,  he 
pledged  himself  that  that  treaty  should  be  acceded  to, 
and  a  peace,  if  j^ossible,  negotiated,  pari  passu,  between 
the  King  of  Sicily  and  Murat.  The  noble  lord  did  not 
rest  there,  but  instructed  Lord  William  Bentinck  to 
give  the  same  assurance  in  writing  which  he  had  given 
verbally ;  and  in  consequence  of  the  strange  proclama- 
tion at  Leghorn,  he  wrote  a  despatch  to  remove  the 
possibihty  of  doubt ;  to  instruct  Lord  William  Bentinck 
to  disavow  that  proclamation  to  the  Neapolitan  minister ; 
to  assure  him  again,  that  Great  Britain  would  accede  to 
the  treaty  with  Austria ;  and  that,  if  Ferdinand  w^ould 
not  accept  an  indemnity  for  Naples,  Great  Britain  would 
not  only  desert  him,  but  would  support  Naples  against 
him.  And  so  strong  was  the  feeling  in  Italy  on  this  sub- 
ject, that  the  Queen  of  Naples,  the  sister  of  Bonaparte, 
made  a  declaration,  (which,  as  coming  from  her,  was 
rather  curious,)  that  she  would  rather  confide  in  a  decla- 
ration of  a  British  general,  than  a  solemn  treaty  signed 
and  sealed  with  any  other  power.  Such  was  the  state- 
ment, which  had  neither  been  admitted  nor  denied ;  and 
if  it  was  true,  he  would  put  it  to  the  House  whether  it 
was  not  a  violation  of  honour  and  good  faith  to  send 
money  to  Sicil}^,  to  enable  her  to  recover  that  territory, 
which  we  had  guaranteed  to  another  power." 


IRISH   PK\CE-PRESERVATION   BILL. 

On  a  motion,  on  the  25th  of  November,  for  the  third 
reading  of  a  Bill  brought  in  by  Mr.  Peel*  then  Secre- 

*  The  present  Sir  Robert  Peel. 


JEx.  37.]  AMERICAN  WAR.  209 

tary  for  Ireland,  to  amend  an  Act  passed  in  the  preced- 
ing session,  to  provide  for  the  better  execution  of  the 
laws  in  Ireland,  commonly  known  by  the  name  of  the 
Irish  Peace-Preservation  Act,  Mr.  Horner  took  occasion 
to  say,  that  "  he  had  originally  thought  this  Act,  when 
introduced  by  the  right  honourable  gentleman  (Mr. 
Peel)  a  most  unconstitutional  one;*  and  of  the  princi- 
ple of  it  he  still  entertained  the  same  opinion ;  but  from 
what  he  had  lately  heard,  and  particularly  what  had 
fallen  from  his  right  honourable  friend  who  had  spoken 
last,  (Sir  John  Newport,)  he  was  inclined  to  believe  it 
had  been  attended  with  salutary  effects;  and  it  gave 
him  the  highest  satisfaction  to  find  that  the  Irish  gov- 
ernment had  carefully  abstained  from  acting  on  the 
very  extraordinary  powers  with  which  the  Act  invested 
them.  On  this  account,  he  did  not  feel  inclined  to  give 
any  opposition  to  the  progress  of  the  present  Bill." 


WAR,    WITH    THE    UNITED    STATES    OF   AMERICA. 

On  the  1st  of  December,  Mr.  Horner  brought  forward 
a  motion  for  a  variety  of  papers  relating  to  the  conduct 
of  the  naval  war  against  the  United  States  of  America, 
which  he  represented  to  have  been  such  as  to  have 
brought  great  discredit  on  the  country.  He  pointed  out 
in  detail  the  errors  which  he  conceived  the  Government 
to  have  committed  in  their  mode  of  prosecuting  the 
maritime  war,  and  the  war  on  the  Lakes,  and  also  the 
insufficient  protection  that  had  been  afforded  to  the 
trade  of  the  country.  That  with  regard  to  the  maritime 
war,  notwithstanding  the  immense  naval  strength  and 
high  naval  skill  we  possessed,  we  had  sustained  many 


*  See  ante,  p.  160. 

18* 


210  AMERICAN  WAR.  [1814. 

defeats,  and  no  effectual  means  had  been  taken  to 
retrieve  the  tarnished  histre  of  our  character ;  that  there 
had  been  a  complete  neglect  of  all  the  means  that  com- 
mon prudence  would  suggest  for  the  defence  of  our 
Canadian  frontier,  and  for  carrying  on  the  war  on  the 
Lakes ;  and  that  while  he  was  ready  to  allow  that  all 
the  complaints  of  the  ineffective  means  for  protecting 
our  trade  might  not  be  well  founded,  he  felt  perfectly 
assured  that  so  uniform  and  so  long  continued  complaints, 
and  representations  to  ministers  from  all  parts  of  the 
country,  could  not  be  without  some  solid  foundation. 

The  Chancellor  of  the  Exchequer,  after  expressing  a 
wish  that  his  Majesty's  ministers  might  not  be  prejudiced 
on  a  question  of  such  importance,  said,  "  That  he  per- 
fectly agreed  in  the  importance  of  granting  information, 
and  had  no  objection  to  the  production  of  the  papers 
which  Mr.  Horner  had  moved  for  ;  but  that  it  would  not 
be  becoming  in  him  to  enter  into  the  different  subjects 
of  the  speech  they  had  heard,  as  it  would  be  best  an- 
swered by  affording  information." 

Sir  Joseph  Yorke  (one  of  the  Lords  of  the  Admiralty) 
said,  "  That  the  Admiralty  would  wait  till  the  papers 
were  produced  before  they  made  their  defence,  conscious 
that  the  contents  of  those  papers  would  afford  them  a 
complete  justification  in  the  eyes  of  the  public." 

Mr.  Horner,  on  rising  a  second  time  to  move  for  the 
production  of  another  paper,  said,  "It  was  certainly 
proper  for  the  right  honourable  gentlemen  opposite  to 
determine  in  what  way  they  would  meet  the  question ; 
nor  had  he  any  fault  to  find  with  them,  for  they  had 
granted  him  the  papers  he  required,  and,  from  their  con- 
duct that  evening,  he  should  consider  every  charge  he 
had  brought  against  them  as  undeniably  true,  until  they 
were  contradicted.     He  could  not,  indeed,  believe  it  pos- 


JEt.  37.]  AMERICAN  WAR.  211 

sible  that  men,  sitting  in  their  capacities,  before  parlia- 
ment and  in  the  face  of  their  country,  would  patiently 
endure  such  accusations  if  they  could  refute  them,  and 
shuffle  off  the  inquiry  for  three  months  longer !  What ! 
the  ministers  of  the  Crown,  the  ministers  of  a  great 
nation,  ministers  entrusted  with  all  the  affairs  of  govern- 
ment, would  they,  if  they  could  help  themselves,  say, 
^  Three  months  hence  the  voluminous  papers  you  require 
shall  be  ready  for  you ;  and  when  you  have  got  them, 
you  may  then  fish  out  for  yourselves  the  information 
you  want?'  Novel  as  their  proceedings  had  been  on 
various  occasions  during  the  present  session,  their  pre- 
sent conduct  exceeded  all  that  had  been  before  witnessed. 
But  the  best  times  of  that  House  were  gone  by :  they 
had  lost  those  men  who,  trusting  to  their  own  eloquence, 
trusting  to  their  own  elevation  of  mind  and  character, 
their  wisdom  and  integrity,  would  have  dared  their 
adversaries  to  the  proof  of  accusations  like  the  present ; 
and  not  have  sought  to  escape  them  by  petty  evasions. 
Such  a  scene,  as  was  now  beheld,  would  not  have  hap- 
pened in  their  days,  whose  example  and  precepts  the 
right  hon.  gentlemen  opposite  pretended  to  follow.  He 
would  not  repeat  the  name  of  Pitt  —  they  could  not 
look  up  so  high  as  that  —  but  in  the  days  even  of  Mr. 
Percival,  had  a  charge  of  gross  neglect  in  the  execution 
of  their  duty,  a  criminal  betraying  of  the  interests  of 
their  country,  been  preferred  against  the  administration, 
how  different,  how  widely  different,  would  have  been 
the  conduct  on  the  opposite  side !  Any  men,  having  the 
feelings  of  men,  any  statesmen,  having  the  feelings  that 
belong  to  their  high  condition,  could  not  silently  brook 
the  imputations  now  cast  upon  the  right  hon.  gentlemen 
opposite,  without  at  least  stating,  in  general  terms,  that 
the  facts  advanced  were  untrue,  and  the  inferences 
unjust." 


212  CORRESrONDENCE.  [1814. 

The  Chancellor  of  the  Exchequer  rose  after  Mr. 
Horner,  and  said,  "  that  government  was  in  possession  of 
more  than  sufficient  information  to  refute  all  the  facts 
of  the  hon.  and  learned  gentleman,  but  that  he  wished 
the  justification  of  ministers  to  rest  upon  authentic  doc- 
uments, and  not  upon  his  bare  assertions ;  and  he  would 
repeat,  notwithstanding  all  that  had  fallen  from  the  hon. 
and  learned  gentleman,  that  he  was  still  willing,  for  the 
present,  to  rest  the  case  upon  that  foundation."  Mr. 
Wellesley  Pole  and  Mr.  Bathurst  also  rose  on  the  part 
of  ministers,  defending  their  conduct  in  general  terms, 
but  resting  their  full  justification  upon  the  ficts  which 
the  papers  they  w^ould  lay  before  the  House  would 
disclose. 


Letter  CCXXV.     TO  SIR  JAMES  MACKINTOSH. 
My  dear  Sir   James,  Lincoln's  inn,  6th  Dec.  1814. 

You  may  remember,  the  morning  I  saw  you  at 
Coppet,  that  Madame  de  Stael  expressed  a  desire  to  see 
at  full  length  a  letter  of  Burke's,  which  was  mentioned.* 
I  have  copied  it  out  of  Hardy's  book ;  and  will  thank 
you  to  give  it  to  Madame  de  Stael  with  my  best  respects. 
It  was  with  much  regret  that  I  found  myself  compelled 
to  pass  through  Paris,  without  having  time  to  wait  upon 
her  at  Clichy. 

Our  short  session  of  parliament  has  not  been  inactive 
on  the  part  of  Opposition :  Tierney,  in  particular,  made 
considerable  exertions,  and  gave  us  three  or  four  speeches 
of  great  ability  and  effect.     While  we  were  protesting 


*  Letter  to  the   Earl   of  Charlemont,   9th   August,  1789.     See   Hardy's 
"  Life  of  Lord  Charlemont,"  p.  321.  —  Ed. 


JEt.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  213 

against  the  monstrous  proceedings  of  the  robbers  at 
Vienna,  I  never  ceased  to  wish  you  had  been  in  your 
place  to  enforce  our  remonstrances.  With  ^  hat  effect 
this  expression  of  what  I  believe  to  be  the  public  opin- 
ion of  all  England  will  be  attended,  rests  with  our  min- 
ister ;  upon  whom  parliamentary  control  is  not  wholly 
without  effect,  as  is  shown  in  the  publication  he  has 
made  at  Vienna  of  a  treatise  on  the  slave  trade.  A 
treatise  by  Castlereagh  in  favour  of  the  abolition,  who 
to  the  very  last  opposed  the  Bill  of  1807  in  the  House ! 
When  you  see  M.  Gallois  or  M.  De  Gerando,  I  beg  you 
will  give  them  my  kindest  respects ;  and  believe  me,  my 
dear  Sir  James, 

Most  truly  yours. 

Era.  Horner. 


Letter  CCXXV.*     TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 

My  dear  Murray,  London,  loth  Dec.  i8i4. 

I  am  coming  down  next  week,  and  hope  to  see 
you  on  Friday.  Thank  you  for  all  your  kind  cautions 
on  the  subject  of  cold  and  fatigue :  I  am  sufficiently 
careful,  I  assure  you. 

You  have  not  given  me  any  opinion  upon  my  scheme 
of  wheedling  the  people  of  Scotland  into  unanimous 
verdicts.  I  suppose  you  thought  it  not  worth  considera- 
tion, which  I  suspected  myself 

As  to  the  American  war,  the  historical  truth  I  take  to 
be,  that  we  goaded  that  people  into  war,  by  our  unjust 
extension  to  them,  while  neutrals,  of  all  the  unmitigated 
evils  of  maritime  war ;  and  still  more  by  the  insulting 
tone  of  our  newspaper  and  government  language ;  and 
that  when  the  English  nation  came  to  its  senses  about 
the  Orders  in  Council,  and  the  minister  was  dead,  who 


214  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1814. 

had  insanely  made  it  a  point  of  honour  to  adhere  to 
them,  by  that  time  the  American  Government  believed 
that  the  continental  system  of  Bonaparte  had  ruined 
the  resources  of  this  country,  that  he  was  to  become 
lord  of  the  ascendant,  and  that  it  was  as  well  for  them 
to  be  on  the  best  terms  with  the  winning  side.  What 
passed  prior  to  the  repeal  of  the  Orders  in  Council  may 
fairly  be  regarded  now  as  matter  of  history  only,  and  it 
is  in  that  view  of  it  that  I  consider  the  Americans  as 
noiv  aggressors  in  the  war  j  the  ground  of  complaint  they 
had,  we  have  relinquished ;  their  pretensions  against  our 
maritime  rights  are  matter  of  aggression. 

You  ask  me  about  the  general  feeling  of  London  and 
England  respecting  the  American  war.  I  am  convinced 
it  is  at  present  decidedly  unpopular.  The  want  of  suc- 
cess, announced  in  so  many  repeated  instances,  had 
gradually  weaned  the  public  from  their  idle  dreams  of 
immediate  subjugation ;  for  that  was  the  fancy,  and,  in 
this  state  of  dissatisfaction,  came  that  publication  of  the 
Ghent  negotiations,  which  jDroduced  a  great  sensation. 
I  have  so  little  confidence  in  the  steadiness  or  principle 
of  the  public  sentiments,  on  matters  of  war,  that  if  there 
were  some  signal  successes  won  by  our  troops  or  our 
ships  over  the  Americans,  I  should  rather  expect  to  hear 
again  the  old  cry  for  chastisement,  and  all  the  old  vulgar 
insolence.  It  is  a  sad  misfortune  to  America,  that  they 
have  not  had  for  President  of  their  republic,  during  this 
important  epoch  of  their  history,  a  man  of  a  higher  cast 
of  talent  and  public  sentiment  than  Madison ;  he  has 
involved  them  without  necessity  in  war,  and  has  debased 
very  much  the  tone,  which  a  people  destined  obviously 
for  such  greatness,  ought  to  maintain. 

Yours  my  dear  Murray,  affectionately, 

Fra.  Horner. 


^T.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  215 


Letter  CCXXVI.     FROM  SIR  JAMES  MACKINTOSH. 

My  dear  Horner,  i'^"^'  ^^th  Dec  i8i4. 

On  receiving  your  letter  yesterday,  my  first 
thought  was  to  request  you  to  call  on  Lady  Mackintosh, 
that  she  might  read  to  you  what  I  had  written,  when 
the  spontaneous  communications  of  the  Duke  of  Welling- 
ton were  fresh  in  my  recollection.  But  on  farther  re- 
flection, both  on  the  unspeakable  importance  of  the  sub- 
ject, and  on  the  just  authority  of  your  opinion,  I 
resolved  to  request  an  interview  with  him,  which  passed 
this  morning,  without  any  mention  of  your  name. 

He  behaved,  as  he  has  always  done  in  his  conversa- 
tions with  me  on  this  matter,  with  considerable  apparent 
frankness;    and,  whatever  his  original  opinions  might 
have  been,  he  seemed  to  have  a  fair  disposition  to  do 
his  utmost  in  the  discharge  of  his  present  trust.     The 
first  act  done  by  this  government,  in  consequence  of 
discussions  with  the  Duke  of  Wellington  tending  to  limit 
the  renewed  trade,  was  a  circular  letter  from  the  Minis- 
ter of  Marine  to  the  Maritime  Prefects,  in  the  end  of 
September,  instructing  them  to  grant  no  "  automations  " 
(I  know  no  corresponding  term  in  our  English  usages) 
to  vessels  fitted  out  for  the  slave  trade,  to  the  north  of 
Cape  Formoso.     Several  other  communications,  in  the 
following  month,  to  the  Prefects  and  to  the  Armatews  of 
Nantes  and  Havre,  convey  the  same  direction,  more  or 
less  forcibly,  but  with  the  expression  of  a  wish,  that  the 
limitation  should,  for  the  present,  not  be  much  noised 
abroad.     On  the  5th  of  November,  the  Duke  of  Welling- 
ton laid  before  the  Minister  of  Marine  a  set  of  regula- 
tions for  insuring  the  observance  of  this  limited  prohi- 
bition ;  of  which  the  principal  were,  provisions  to  declare 


216  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1814. 

all  vessels  and  negroes  coming  from  that  part  of  the 
coast  —  Prize,  —  as  well  as  all  slaves  found  on  board  any 
vessel  within  forty  leagues  of  the  shore  between  Cape 
Formoso  and  Cape  Blanco,  not  being  part  of  the  crew 
of  the  ship.     To  two  of  these  regulations  they  objected  j 
—  that  relating  to  the  payment  of  any  sum  to  captors, 
on  the  ground  of  poverty ;  and  to  the  establishment  of 
a  hovering  act  along  the  ivhole  coast,  on  the  ground  that  it 
was  nautically  inconvenient  for  ships  to  navigate,  at  that 
distance  from  land,  between  Cape  Formoso  and  Cape 
Palmas.     About  a  fortnight  ago,  they  communicated  to 
the  Duke  ^iwojct  de  regkment,  which  is  intended  to  be 
published  by  the  King,  to  carry  into  effect  his  declara- 
tion of  the  27th  of  May,  by  the  immediate  abolition  of 
the  trade  on  that  part  of  the  coast,  where  it  had  actually 
been  abolished  during  the  war.     This  is  stated  in  the 
preamble  to  be  one  of  its  objects ;  and  another  is  there 
said  to  be,  that  of  preparing  the  way  for  the  universal 
abolition,  at  the  term  fixed  by  the  treaty.     The  greater 
part  of  this  reglement  is  pretty  satisfactory :  but  they 
have  availed  themselves,  in  a  very  suspicious  manner,  of 
the  supposed  necessity  for  coasting  to  the  south  of  Cape 
Palmas.     Instead  of  a  prohibition  of  the  trade  to  the 
north  of  Cape  Formoso,  they  have  prohibited  it  in  the 
reglement  only  to  the  north  of  Cape  Palmas.     This  would 
be  nothing,  and  is  contrary  to  the  principle  avowed  in 
their  own  preamble ;  for  the  trade  had  actually  ceased 
as  much  on  the  coast  between  Cape  Palmas  and  Cape 
Formoso  as  to  the  north  of  the  former.     But  the  Duke 
intends  to  remonstrate  on  this  strange  substitution,  and 
he  confidently  expects  that  Cape  Formoso  will  be  in- 
serted in  the  reglement,   instead   of  Cape   Palmas.     He 
originally  proposed  that  the  ships  of  war  of  each  power 
should  have  the  right  of  enforcing  the  aboUtion  laws  of 


2Er.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  217 

the  other.  But  he  represents  the  government  here  as 
fearful  of  being  thought  to  be  too  much  under  Enghsh 
influence ;  and  for  that  reason  unwilUng  to  sanction  the 
principle  of  reciprocal  seizure. 

Lord  Castlereagh  and  he  had,  it  seems,  suggested  to 
Talleyrand  the  necessity  of  a  law  on  this  subject,  and  of 
course  the  concurrence  of  the  two  Chambers;  but 
neither  Talleyrand,  nor  any  of  the  other  ministers, 
admit  such  a  necessity.  They  represent  commerce  as 
being  capable  of  being  regulated  by  the  King's  preroga- 
tive. Your  question  is,  I  conceive,  not  put  as  a  French 
Whig,  but  as  an  English  abolitionist.  If  this  regUmcnt 
be  held  here  to  be  a  legal  abolition,  on  the  northern 
part  of  the  African  coast,  it  is  sufficient  for  our  purpose. 
To  this  information  I  venture  to  add,  that,  in  my  opinion, 
it  would  be  wise  to  give  the  ambassador  a  reasonable 
time  for  obtaining  this  reglement  on  as  good  a  footing  as 
he  can,  before  any  thing  be  done  or  said  on  the  subject 
in  Eni2;land. 

The  Duke  told  me,  though  perhaps  rather  in  a  more 
confidential  manner  than  the  rest  of  his  communication, 
that,  in  consequence  of  a  conversation  of  Talleyrand 
with  Lord  Holland,  he  (the  Duke)  had  been  authorised 
to  offer  a  colony  for  the  immediate  abolition ;  that  this 
offer  was  at  first  pretty  peremptorily  rejected,  but  that, 
since  some  discussions,  in  which  he  endeavoured  to  prove 
the  impossibility  of  recovering  vSt.  Domingo  by  arms,  and 
the  wisdom  of  offering  a  charter  to  that  island,  which 
should  insure  the  liberty  of  the  negroes,  and  procure  as 
much  compensation  as  can  be  had  to  the  ancient  land- 
owners, they  have  shown  rather  less  aversion  to  the 
exchange  of  their  slave  trade  for  a  colony.  It  appears 
that  Talleyrand  supports,  in  the  congress,  the  measure 

VOL.  11.  19 


218  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1814. 

of  an  abolition  by  all  Europe.  You  have  now  all  that 
I  know  or  think  on  the  subject. 

Nobody  can  be  here  without  feeling  the  great  hatred 
entertained  against  us  by  all  ranks  and  parties.  It  has 
been  a  little  abated  during  the  last  three  weeks,  by  the 
debates  of  the  House  of  Commons,  which  have  been 
more  important,  and  I  hope  more  beneficial,  on  the  Con- 
tinent, than  at  any  former  period  of  our  parliamentary 
history.  The  general  sentiment  wanted  an  organ,  and 
the  only  popular  assembly  in  Europe  partially  supplied 
it.  You  gave  the  sanction  of  a  public  body  to  the  prin- 
ciples of  common  sense  ;  and  you  have  certainly  contrib- 
uted to  all  the  success  which  may  attend  Talleyrand  in 
his  new  office  of  assertor  of  justice  and  protector  of 
weakness.  I  feel  sorrow  at  having  taken  no  part  in 
these  good  works.  But  at  the  beginning  I  consulted 
my  friends,  among  others  your  neighbour,=-=  whether  I 
should  return  to  the  short  session,  or  pursue  my  histori- 
cal inquiries  here. 

I  have  been  pretty  successful  here,  though,  for  the 
last  three  weeks,  my  public  researches  have  been  sus- 
pended, in  consequence  of  the  hostility  of  Hauterive, 
the  absence  of  Talleyrand,  and  the  jealousy  of  Lemon- 
tey,  who  is  writing  the  History  of  Louis  XV.,  from  the 
archives  opened  to  him  by  Napoleon.  Mr.  Falck  is, 
however,  to  send  me  a  copy  of  King  William's  Corres- 
pondence, by  M.  Fagel ;  and,  for  my  first  volume  at  least, 
I  shall  be  very  rich  in  materials.  In  the  course  of  next 
week  I  shall  probably  set  out  for  London ;  but  if  you 
have  any  further  inquiries  to  make,  your  letter  would 
probably  still  find  me  in  Paris,  and,  at  the  worst,  would 

*  John  Whishaw,  Esq.,  whose  chambers  adjoined  those  of  Mr.  Horner,  in 
New  Square,  Lincoln's  Inn.  — Ed. 


^T.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  219 

be  taken  care  of,  as  I  shall  leave  my  son-in-law  in  my 
lodgings ;  which  are,  Hotel  cle  Bourbon,  Rue  de  la  Paix. 
I  am,  my  dear  Horner, 

Yours  most  truly, 

J.  Mackintosh. 


Lktter   CCXXVJI.      from    THE    RIGHT    HON.    GEORGE 
PONSONBY.* 

Mv  dear  Sir  Dropmore,  25tli  Jan.  1815. 

We  who  are  here,  Lord  Grenville,  his  brother, 
Elliot,  Newport,  and  myself,  have  been  talking  over  the 
first  operations  fit  to  take  place  upon  the  meeting  of  the 
House ;  and  we  have  agreed  that  the  best  motion  to 
begin  with,  (upon  notice,)  is  one  relative  to  America; 
and  that  the  best  form  will  be  to  move  for  a  committee 
to  inquire  into  the  conduct  of  the  war.  The  paper?? 
which  have  been  published,  and  the  peace  which  has 
been  concluded,  since  the  adjournment,  seem  to  rendei 
such  a  motion  peculiarly  expedient ;  for  there  can  be  no 
doubt  that  the  feelings  of  the  country  must  be  strongly 
excited  by  the  disclosure  of  the  facts  contained  in  those 
papers,  and  by  the  conclusion  of  a  peace,  justifiable  only 
(in  the  opinion  of  those  who  concluded  it)  by  necessity ; 
a  necessity  arising  solely  from  their  own  mismanagement 
of  the  war.  We  hope  you  will  concur  in  our  view  of 
this  subject ;  and  that  you  will  have  the  goodness  to 
give,  when  the  House  meets,  a  notice  of  your  intention 
of  moving  for  the  Committee  upon  Thursday  the  16th 
of  February.  I  am  myself  persuaded  of  the  utility  of 
early  and  constant  action  in  the  House  ;  and  I  am  sure 


*  At  that  time,  the  acknowledged  leader  of  the  Opposition  in  the  House  of 
Commons.  — •  Ed. 


220  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

the  public  interest  demands  and  the  public  expectation 
requires  it.  To  our  friends  I  have  written  some  time 
ago,  requesthig  their  attendance ;  and  I  have  every  rea- 
son to  be  confident  of  their  compliance. 

I  shall  be  in  town,  to  remain,  on  Friday,  and  will  en- 
deavour to  find  you  at  leisure,  to  converse  a  little  upon 
these  matters,  very  soon  after. 

I  am,  with  the  truest  regard. 
Yours, 

George  Ponsonby. 


Letter  CCXXVIII.      TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 
My  dear  Murray,  Lincoln's  Inn,  SOth  Jan.  1815. 

I  thank  you  for  your  kind  attention  to  all  my 
commissions,  contained  in  my  two  last  notes.  I  never 
entertained  any  doubt  that,  upon  the  question  of  the 
unanimity  of  verdicts,  a  concession  must  be  made  to 
strong  prejudice  or  misconception;  as  upon  every  other 
part  of  the  Bill,  or  of  any  new  measure  that  respects 
the  administration  of  justice.  The  word  iinanimUy  has 
done  the  mischief,  which  is  none  of  ours.  The  princi- 
ple of  the  English  jury  is  no  more  than  this,  that  they 
should  agree  before  they  give  in  their  verdict ;  which, 
practically,  secures  all  those  benefits  of  discussion,  of  a 
disposition  in  all  to  be  reasonable  and  moderate,  and  of 
an  opportunity  still  left  to  a  single  dissentient  to  have 
his  arguments  heard,  that  would  be  excluded  by  the  rule 
of  a  majority.  Substantially  and  j^ractically,  in  nine 
cases  out  of  ten,  the  verdict  must  go  by  the  sentiments 
of  the  majority ;  but  the  operation  is  very  different  from 
what  it  would  be,  if  it  went  of  course  by  the  voice  of  the 
majority.  I  cannot  speak  from  much  of  what  can  be 
called  experience ;  though,  with  something  of  that  sort, 


Mr.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  221 

and  with  a  good  deal  more  of  reflection  upon  the  prin- 
ciples that  ought  to  regulate  the  constitution  of  courts  of 
justice ;  but  I  own  that  my  opinion  is,  without  any  hes- 
itation, that  the  requiring  of  the  jury  to  agree  before 
they  give  their  verdict,  and  the  taking  it  from  them  as 
being  said  by  them  all,  is  a  highly  valuable  part  of  our 
existing  system. 

There  is  certainly  no  foundation  for  the  distinction 
with  which  I  am  honoured,  it  seems,  at  Edinburgh,  of 
being  a  convert  to  the  Corn  Bill.  The  more  I  have 
read  upon  the  subject,  and  the  more  I  hear  upon  it,  I 
get  more  firmly  fixed  in  my  original  opinion,  that  noth- 
ing should  be  done  ;  of  course  it  will  be  carried  with  a 
loud  clamour,  and  with  much  abuse  of  all  lacJdand  theo- 
rists. It  would  be  as  absurd  to  expect  men  to  be  rea- 
sonable about  corn,  as  to  be  reasonable  in  matters  of 
relia;ion. 

I  do  not  imagine  any  new  discovery  is  made  about 
the  relation  of  the  price  of  labour  to  that  of  grain,  or 
the  effects  of  scarcity  or  plenty  upon  wages.  The  prin- 
ciples, upon  which  all  such  effects  must  depend,  are 
obvious  to  every  one  who  understands  the  operation  of 
demand  and  supply  upon  prices ;  indeed,  they  are  all 
an  application  of  that  single  principle.  A  great  many 
cases  are  necessary  to  be  put,  in  order  to  distinguish  the 
various  effects  of  scarcity  or  plenty  upon  wages,  accord- 
ing to  the  nature  of  the  particular  employment  in  which 
labour  is  to  be  paid  for ;  but  even  when  the  effects  are 
the  most  opposite,  it  is  still  the  operation  of  the  same 
principle.  All  this  is  stated  well  enough  by  Adam 
Smith,  towards  the  end  of  his  chapter  on  the  Wages  of 
Labour. 

The  most  important  convert  the  landholders  have  got, 
is  Malthus,  who  has  now  declared  himself  in  favour  of 

19* 


222  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

their  Bill ;  and,  to  be  sure,  there  is  not  a  better  or  more 
informed  judgment,  and  it  is  the  single  authority  which 
stao-crers  me.  But  those  who  have  looked  closely  into 
his  philosophy  will  admit,  that  there  is  always  a  leaning 
in  favour  of  the  efficacy  of  laws ;  and  his  early  bias  was 
for  corn  laws  in  particular.  It  was  a  great  effort  of  can- 
dour, in  truth,  to  suspend  his  decision  upon  this  particu- 
lar measure  so  long.  I  think  I  could  demonstrate,  from 
his  own  principles  of  population,  that  if  this  measure  is 
effectual  at  all,  it  must  be  attended  with  great  misery 
among  the  manuflicturing  classes,  as  well  as  among  the 
labourers  in  husbandry ;  and  with  a  violent  forced  alter- 
ation of  that  proportion,  in  this  countiy,  between  agri- 
cultural and  manufacturing  population  and  capital, 
which  the  freedom  of  both  has  adjusted,  and  would 
continue  to  maintain,  better  and  more  lightly  for  all  the 
people,  than  can  be  effected  by  all  the  wisdom  of  all  the 
squires  of  the  island,  with  the  political  arithmeticians  to 

boot. 

Affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CCXXIX.     TO  THE  REV.  T.  R.  MALTHUS. 
My  dear  MalthuS,  l-^^  February,  1815. 

I  have  to  thank  you  for  sending  me  your  two 
new  publications  upon  the  corn  question,  which  I  have 
read,  and  am  still  reading.  You  will  think  me  very  har- 
dened, but  I  must  own  that  my  old  faith  is  not  shaken 
by  your  reasonings ;  on  the  contrary,  I  am  even  so  per- 
verse, as  to  think  I  have  discovered,  among  your  inge- 
nious deductions  respecting  rent,  some  fresh  and  cogent 
aro-uments  in  fiivour  of  a  free  corn  trade  for  this  coun- 
try ;  by  which  I  always  mean,  as  free  a  trade  as  we  can 


JEt.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  223 

secure  by  our  own  good  sense,  however  it  may  be  im- 
paired by  the  deficiency  of  our  neighbours  in  that  quaU- 
fication.  If  tlic  consequence  of  "high  farming"  and 
curious  cultivation  be  a  progressive  rise  of  the  price  of 
produce,  an  importation  of  partial  supplies  from  coun- 
tries, which  by  a  ruder  agriculture  can  furnish  it  cheaper, 
seems  the  provision  laid  by  nature  for  checking  too  ex- 
clusive an  employment  of  capital  upon  the  land  least  fit 
for  culture.  It  would  be  a  palpable  sacrifice  of  the  end 
to  the  means,  if,  for  the  sake  of  extending  our  most  fin- 
ished husbandry  to  every  sterile  ridge  that  can  be  forced 
to  yield  something,  we  impose  upon  the  whole  body  of 
the  people  extravagant  prices  for  the  necessaries  of  life. 
Nor  do  I  see,  upon  your  peculiar  principles,  what  other 
result  there  would  be,  if  Dartmoor  and  Blackstone  Edge 
were  laid  out  in  terraces  of  garden-ground,  but  a  popu- 
lation always  in  some  peril  of  being  starved,  if  their 
rulers  will  not  let  them  eat  the  superfluity  of  their  neigh- 
bours. I  have  not  leisure  to  write  out  in  any  systematic 
form  what  has  occurred  to  me,  but  I  wish  you  would 
allow  me  to  suggest  some  objections  to  you,  and  to  re- 
quest farther  explanations  from  you,  on  some  points 
which  I  have  marked  in  a  very  hasty  perusal  of  "  The 
grounds  of  your  opinion."  I  mean  to  put  them  down 
without  any  attention  to  order,  and  will  stuff  as  many 
of  them  into  this  letter  as  I  have  time  for ;  I  have,  in 
truth,  very  little  time  for  these  speculations. 

Why  do  you  say,  p.  28.,  that  "  in  all  common  years, 
France  will  furnish  us  with  a  large  proportion  of  our 
supplies?"  This  affirmation  is  not  founded  upon  the 
parliamentary  evidence,  which  bears  the  contrary  way. 
The  witnesses  were  not  examined  till  a  considerable 
time  after  the  signature  of  the  Definitive  Treaty ;  yet, 
in  stating  the  various  countries  from  which  w^e  are  to 


224  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

look  for  imports  of  grain,  during  the  subsistence  of 
peace,  none  of  them  ever  name  France,  or  seem  to  think 
of  it ;  although  a  great  many  foreign  corn  factors  are 
brought  forward,  and  some  whose  experience  goes  back 
for  years,  previous  to  the  commencement  of  the  long 
war.  They  sa}^  indeed  expressly,  that  they  know  but 
one  instance  of  an  import  from  France,  w^hich  took  place 
after  the  harvest  of  1809,  and  until  the  prohibition  in 
July  1810.  That  exportation  was  allowed  by  the  French 
government,  to  relieve  the  pressure  of  an  excessive 
plenty.  But  why  did  not  the  same  motive  operate  more 
frequently,  if  you  are  right  in  what  you  state,  p.  13., 
that  "  prices  have  been  often  as  low  during  the  last  ten 
years  as  they  were  after  the  last  harvest  ? "  And,  by 
the  way,  in  your  statement  of  the  French  prices  in  the 
same  passage,  w^hich  is  made,  of  course,  for  the  sake  of 
comparisons  with  our  own,  should  you  not  have  included 
the  difference  of  exchange,  when  you  converted  their 
money  into  ours  ?  You  talk  of  the  law,  made  by  the 
two  Chambers  last  summer,  for  the  regulation  of  their 
export  price,  as  if  it  had  cast  quite  a  new  light  upon  the 
w^iole  subject,  and  as  if  it,  for  the  first  time,  had  ad- 
monished you  of  having  too  precipitately  made  admis- 
sions of  the  favourable  effects  of  a  free  trade.  Had  not 
the  French  always  such  a  regulation,  if  not  the  very 
same? 

You  state,  p.  5.,  that,  by  the  recent  improvements  of 
agriculture,  "  we  had  become  much  less  dej)endent  upon 
foreign  supplies  for  our  support."  What  proof  is  there 
of  this  ?  The  excess  of  imports  does  not  appear  to  have 
sensibly  decreased  of  very  late  years ;  it  never  was  so 
high  as  in  1810.  The  small  quantity  imported  in  1812 
(the  accounts  make  it  double  what  you  state  it  to  have 
been)  is  in  the  following  page,  not  consistently,  I  think, 


Mr.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  225 

used  by  you,  not  as  a  consequence  of  the  increase  of 
our  home  growth,  but  as  a  proof  of  the  difficulty  of  im- 
portation. A  fiict  of  this  nature  cannot  tell  both  ways, 
it  seems  to  me. 

Speaking  from  recollection  only,  I  should  not  say  that 
it  is  a  result  to  be  gathered  from  the  evidence  before 
Parliament,  that  "  a  continuation  of  low  prices  would, 
in  spite  of  a  cUmimdion  of  rents,  destroy  farming  capital, 
and  diminish  produce."  (p.  5.)  The  witnesses,  who  make 
this  prediction,  generally  at  least,  if  not  uniformly,  speak 
upon  the  supposition  of  the  present  rents  being  still  to 
be  paid.  I  may  observe,  too,  that  they  generally  take 
for  granted,  which  is  morefallacious,  that  with  low  prices, 
and  continued  low  prices,  all  the  expences  and  out- 
goings of  a  farm  are  still  to  keep  at  their  present  rate ; 
and  so  they  prove,  demonstrably  to  their  own  conviction, 
that  a  farmer  will  never  be  remunerated  if  he  gets  but 
8s'.  a  bushel  for  his  wheat  at  market,  while  he  is  feeding 
all  his  ploughmen,  and  buying  his  seeds,  and  paying  all 
the  auxiliary  labour  of  the  farm,  wdth  wheat  at  125'.  a 
bushel. 

You  have  made  a  fair  allowance  for  the  partiality  and 
interest  of  those  who  were  called  upon  to  (jive  evidence. 
You  thought  it  would  be  indecent  to  give  the  same 
indulgence,  or  rather  you  could  make  no  allowance  for 
the  bias  of  those  who  were  appointed  to  take  the  evidence. 
There  are  some  very  gross  instances  of  this  :  see,  in  our 
Commons'  Committee,  how  they  dispatch  Charles  Mant, 
when  he  hints  that  the  rate  of  the  protecting  price 
should  be  estimated,  not  according  to  the  present  ex- 
pences, but  according  to  that  very  fall  of  grain  and 
labour,  which  are  anticipated ;  they  huddle  up  that  sub- 
ject, and  pass  on  in  a  hurry  to  other  matters. 

I  think  some  portion  of  the  same  fallacy,  wdiicli  I  last 


226  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

mentioned,  has  slid  into  that  part  of  ^^our  argument,  p. 
24.,  where  you  point  out  the  advantages  the  labourer 
may  derive  from  a  high  money  price  of  corn,  and  conse- 
quently high  wages  to  himself  Do  not  you  assume  that, 
though  corn  should  fall  and  bring  down  wages,  yet  there 
will  be  no  fall  in  the  prices  of  any  other  articles  of  his 
consumption  ? 

In  considering  the  influence  of  a  low  price  of  corn 
upon  the  condition  and  comforts  of  the  labourer,  you 
have  wholly  omitted  this  consideration,  that  such  a  fall 
will  release  thousands  and  tens  of  thousands  from  the 
parochial  pauper  list,  and  restore  them  to  the  pride  of 
earning  their  bread  by  free  labour.  I  could  not  read 
without  indignation,  in  the  evidence  of  Mr.  Benett,  of 
Pyt  House,  who  seems  the  very  model  of  a  witness  for 
Corn  Committees,  his  cool  statement  of  the  rule  he 
makes,  and  unmakes,  for  the  distribution  of  rations  of 
provender  and  fodder  among  the  prsedial  slaves  of  a 
whole  district  of  Wiltshire.  It  is  this  audacious  and 
presumptuous  spirit  of  regulating,  by  the  wisdom  of 
country  squires,  the  whole  economy  and  partition  of 
national  industry  and  wealth,  that  makes  me  more  keenly 
averse  to  this  Corn  Bill  of  theirs  than  I  should  have 
been  in  earlier  da3^s  of  our  time,  when  the  principles  of 
rational  government  were  more  widely  nnderstood,  and 
were  maintained  by  stronger  hands  at  the  head  of  affairs. 
The  narrow  conceit  of  managing  the  happiness  of  the 
labouring  population,  and  of  directing  the  application  of 
industiy,  as  well  as  the  competition  of  the  market, 
works  in  the  present  day  upon  a  much  larger  scale  than 
when  it  busied  itself  with  the  pedlar  items  of  the  foreign 
trade. 

You  have  stated,  p.  27.,  rather  like  a  skilful  advocate 
than   quite  fully,  the  experience  of  the  last  hundred 


JEt.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  227 

years  respecting  the  fluctuations  of  the  price  of  corn. 
You  have  shown  but  one  side  of  that  experience,  which 
has  two  sides,  very  much  alike.  You  take  one  period  of 
fourteen  years,  and  show  a  considerable  fluctuation,  by 
including  remarkable  years  of  dearth.  This  is  during 
the  time  of  imports  being  in  excess.  But  take  another 
period  of  fourteen  years,  while  the  excess  was  on  the 
side  of  exports;  for  instance,  the  period  from  170G  to 
1720;  the  price  of  wheat  in  1706  was  2Qs.;  in  1709 
and  1710  was  786.;  in  1719  w^as  35^.  Take  the  first 
seven  years  of  the  last  century,  the  average  price  was 
oOs. ;  in  the  seven  subsequent  years  the  average  price 
was  as  high  as  57-5.  In  1740,  the  price  I  find  was  506'. ; 
in  1743  only  24^.;  in  1757  again  606-.  After  this,  it 
must  be  admitted  that  the  argument  concerning  fludua- 
tions  rests  still  in  tlieory  ;  and  then  mi/  theory  would  be, 
that,  upon  the  whole,  nothing  will  contribute  so  much  to 
make  prices  steady  as  by  our  leaving  our  own  corn  fac- 
tors unfettered  by  restrictions  and  regulations  of  our 
own  making;  and,  without  embarrassment  from  that 
source,  to  make  their  own  arrangements  for  bringing 
corn,  when  it  is  wanted,  from  the  various  large  and  inde- 
pendent markets,  of  which,  in  the  present  circumstances 
of  the  world,  they  have  their  choice.  And  though  one 
may  argue  from  experience,  it  can  never  be  a  sound  in- 
ference from  the  state  of  prices,  under  the  imports  of 
the  last  seven  or  eight  years,  to  conclude  that  there  will 
be  the  same  uncertainty  in  the  new  position  of  political 
circumstances. 

Though  I  have  something  more  to  object,  I  must 
release  you  for  the  present.  Excuse  the  perfect  freedom 
with  which  I  have  very  hurriedly  written  these  animad- 
versions ;  and  treat  me  still  as  one  of  whose  conversion 
from  heresy  some  hopes  may  be  entertained.     I  should 


228  TRANSFER  OF  GENOA.  [1815. 

be  sorry  you  should  set  me  down  for  obstinate,  and 
beyond  repentance ;  do  not  consign  me  to  silence  ;  I  do 
not  mind  being  consigned  to  the  flames  by  Squire  Wes- 
tern and  the  rabble  of  Irish  economists. 
Ever  very  truly  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 

P.  S.  By  the  way,  I  cannot  part  without  saying  how  I 
grudge  my  adversaries  on  the  bullion  question  the  lift 
you  have  given  them.  Surely  your  corn  zeal  has  les- 
sened too  much  in  your  eyes,  for  the  moment,  the  mag- 
nitude of  that  evil. 


The  House  of  Commons  met,  pursuant  to  adjourn- 
ment, on  the  9th  of  February ;  and  on  the  21st  Mr. 
Lambton  =•'■  moved  for  a  variety  of  papers  relative  to  the 
transfer  of  Genoa  to  the  King  of  Sardinia ;  which  he 
characterised  as  an  act  by  which  His  Majesty's  Ministers 
had  degraded  England  in  the  eyes  of  the  world ;  for 
they  had  abandoned  a  pledge,  given  to  a- nation  invited 
by  them  to  independence.  He  stated  that,  in  April, 
1814,  Lord  William  Bentinck,  in  a  proclamation,  had 
told  the  people  of  Genoa,  that  their  ancient  government 
w^as  restored.  That,  in  the  name  of  the  British  govern- 
ment, he  appealed  to  their  national  feeling,  —  recalled 
to  them  the  days  of  their  ancient  prosperity,  and  pledged 
his  country  to  reinstate  them  in  their  former  privileges. 
That,  notwithstanding  all  this,  in  eight  months  after- 
w^ards,  a  mandate  arrived  from  the  Congress  of  Vienna, 
annulling;  all  that  had  been  done  in  favour  of  Genoese 


*  Afterwards  Earl  of  Durliam. 


Mt.  37.]  CORN-LAWS.  229 

freedom,  and  delivering  up  the  country  to  the  King  of 
Sardinia.  That  the  transfer  was  made  by  a  British  pro- 
clamation, signed  by  a  British  officer;  —  that  in  this 
proclamation.  General  Dalrymple  informed  the  people 
of  Genoa,  that  the  government  appointed  by  Lord  Wil- 
liam Bentinck  had  been  delivered  up  into  his  hands ; 
and  that  he  surrendered  it,  by  command  of  the  Prince 
Kegent  of  England,  to  the  King  of  Sardinia/^ 

Mr.  Horner  is  said  to  have  made  on  this  occasion  "  an 
animated  speech,"  in  which  he  took  a  view  of  the  con- 
duct of  the  British  government  towards  Genoa.  The 
report  of  what  he  said,  as  contained  in  Hansard's  De- 
bates, is  given  in  the  Appendix ;  but  it  is  so  brief,  that 
it  can  be  little  more  than  an  outline  of  a  speech,  which 
could  call  forth  the  high  encomiums  that  several  eminent 
persons,  who  heard  it  delivered,  afterwards  bestowed 
upon  it. 


CORN-LAWS. 

During  the  month  of  February,  the  subject  of  these 
laws  was  several  times  under  the  consideration  of  the 
House,  and  Mr.  Horner  appears  to  have  taken  an  active 
part  in  most  of  the  discussions. 

The  Right  Honourable  Frederick  Robinson -|-  moved, 
on  the  14th,  that,  on  the  17th,  the  House  should  resolve 
itself  into  a  Committee,  to  consider  the  state  of  the  Corn- 
Laws  ;  and  he  announced  his  intention  of  then  submit- 
ting a  series  of  resolutions,  preparatory  to  the  introduc- 
tion of  a  Bill ;  and  on  the  motion  of  Mr.  Horner,  some 
returns  were  ordered,  to  render  more  complete  the  infor- 

*  Hansard's  Debates,  vol.  xxix.  p.  928. 

t  The  present  Earl  of  Kipon,  who  was  at  that  time  Vice-President  of  tlie 
Board  of  Trade.  —  Ed. 

VOL.  n.  20 


230  CORN-LAWS.  [1815 

mation  that  others,  ordered  on  the  motion  of  Mr.  Robin- 
son, were  intended  to  afford. 

Mr.  Alexander  Baring*  moved,  on  the  15th,  for 
another  return.  Mr.  Horner  asked  the  Chancellor  of 
the  Exchequer,  "  whether  he  intended  to  take  the  sense 
of  the  House  at  once  upon  resolutions,  Avhich  had  per- 
haps been  fully  discussed,  and  unanimously  carried,  at 
the  house  of  Lord  Liverpool,  but  of  the  grounds  of 
which,  or  the  justness  of  the  reasonings  urged  in  their 
support.  Parliament  could  have  no  knowledge.  In  all 
great  questions,  it  had  been  the  practice  to  communicate 
some  information,  before  calling  upon  the  House  to  vote ; 
instead  of  which,  a  sort  of  Lords  of  Articles  had  been 
sitting  in  Whitehall-yard,  to  determine  upon  what  should 
be  brought  forward,  and  making  a  compromise  of  opinions. 
He  certainly  did  consider  that  such  a  proceeding  had  a 
tendency  to  fetter  the  freedom  of  opinion  in  that 
House." 

Mr.  Robinson  brought  forward  his  resolutions  on  the 
17th,  the  most  important  of  which  were,  in  substance, 
—  that  foreign  corn,  &c.,  might  be  bonded  and  re-ex- 
ported without  payment  of  duty ;  and  that  the  importa- 
tion from  foreign  countries  for  home-consumption  should 
be  prohibited  altogether,  until  wheat  rose  to  eighty  shil- 
lings the  quarter,  and  other  kinds  of  grain  in  the  same 
proportions  as  then  existed;  and  that  the  same  prohi- 
bition should  apply  to  our  North  American  colonies, 
until  wheat  rose  to  sixty-seven  shillings.  After  a  long- 
debate,  it  was  agreed  that  the  resolutions  should  be 
recommitted,  ^^/'o /wv;^«,  on  the  20th,  and  the  Report  be 
received  on  the  22d.  On  the  latter  day  Colonel  Gore 
Langton,  after  stating  that  he  was  opposed  to  any  change 

*  The  preseut  Lord  Asliburton. 


^Et.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE,  231 

being  made  in  these  laws,  opposed  the  motion  for  the 
House  going  into  Committee ;  but  only  6  voted  with 
him  in  a  House  of  203.  On  that  occasion  Mr.  Horner 
said, — "he  came  down  to  the  House  with  a  sincere 
desire  of  hearing  the  question  fully  discussed ;  for,  how- 
ever strong  might  be  his  own  opinions,  he  thought  it 
due  to  the  importance  of  the  subject  to  hear  the  opin- 
ions of  all  who  had  considered  it,  and  to  ascertain 
the  various  modes  in  which  the  evidence  which 
had  been  adduced  had  struck  various  minds."  The 
debate  lasted  till  two  o'clock  in  the  morning,  and  was 
adjourned  to  the  next  day ;  and  then  Mr.  Horner  deliv- 
ered his  sentiments  on  the  question.  -The  report  of  his 
speech,  as  given  in  Hansard's  Debates,  will  be  found  in 
the  Appendix. 

Another  adjournment  took  place  at  half  after  three 
in  the  morning  to  the  24th,  when  Mr.  Robinson's  resolu- 
tions were  agreed  to.  Another  and  a  very  long  debate 
took  place  on  the  bringing  up  of  the  Report  on  the  27th; 
Mr.  Baring  proposed,  and  Mr.  Horner  seconded  a  motion 
for  adjournment,  which  was  negatived  ;  but  soon  after- 
wards the  motion  was  renewed  by  Mr.  Baring,  and 
seconded  by  Mr.  Horner,  and  carried.  The  resolutions 
were  finally  agreed  to  on  the  28th,  a  Bill  was  brought 
in  next  day,  and,  after  long  discussions  in  its  several 
stages,  was  passed  on  the  10th  of  March. 


Letter   CCXXIX.*     FROM  LORD   HOLLAND. 

Dear  Horner  Naples,  1st  JVIarch,  i8i5. 

The  King  of  Sardinia  and  the  Pope  have  inter- 
cepted all  regular  communication  by  post  and  private 


232  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

hands,  and  extraordinary  couriers  are  the  only  means  of 
intercourse,  and  in  case  either  should  occur,  I  write  this 
to  be  ready  for  the  opportunity.  You  may  be  curious 
about  the  court,  both  as  a  solitary  specimen  of  the  sort, 
and  as  a  dynasty  which  may  be  supposed  to  owe  its  ele- 
vation to  some  merit,  military  or  political.  The  King* 
is  a  fine  good-humoured  soldier,  too  theatrical  in  his 
dress  and  mode  of  playing  royalty,  but  even  his  deficien- 
cies calculated  to  put  those  with  whom  he  converses 
completely  at  their  ease.  He  pays  the  English  great 
court,  opens  every  privileged  place  to  them,  invites 
them  to  fetes,  balls,  chases,  and  reviews,  mounts  those 
who  like  to  ride,  talks  openly  on  politics  to  all  of  them,  • 
and  has  this  very  day  pardoned  a  delinquent  condemned 
to  death,  at  the  request  of  Lady  Gage.  At  the  same 
chase  one  of  his  horses,  lent  to  an  Englishman,  was 
wounded  by  a  boar,  in  a  way  that  made  it  necessary  to 
shoot  him  on  the  spot.  Such  misfortunes,  as  well  as  the 
loss  of  nine  games  of  chess  in  fourteen  to  Lord  Gran- 
ville Somerset,  and  two  in  three  to  me,  he  bears  with  a 
good-humour,  natural  enough  in  General  Murat,  but 
quite  uncommon  in  a  King  of  Naples.  His  own  taste, 
or  his  Queen's,  makes  him  abstain  from  all  vulgar  abuse 
of  Bonaparte,  and  preserve  his  pictures  and  busts  in  his 
palaces. 

The  Queen  is  pretty,  though  in  bad  health  ;  her  man- 
ners are  very  agreeable  and  gentle,  and  she  is  said  to 
possess  her  full  share  of  the  abilities  and  decision  of 
character,  for  which  her  family  are  remarkable.  She 
has  more  consistency  and  a  better  understanding,  than 
her  husband.  It  is  an  amiable  trait  in  the  latter  that  he 
has  been  more  attentive  to  her,  since  the  fall  of  Napo- 

*  Joachim  Murat. 


Mt.  37.1  CORRESPONDENCE.  900 

Icon,  than  when  he  was  in  power,  and  too  frequently 
made  the  umpire  of  their  disputes.  Joachim  is  evidently 
uneasy,  but  by  dint  of  saying  to  himself  and  to  others, 
that  he  can  make  a  stout  fight  for  it,  and  throw  Italj''  in 
confusion,  he  will,  if  driven  to  the  wall,  be  induced  to 
attempt  it,  and  may  perhaps  succeed  in  the  attempt. 
You  know  the  Austrian  treaty  and  Castlereagh's  letter. 
Joachim  seems  to  adhere  to  the  indemnity  of  400,000 
men,  and  to  Ancona  in  particular,  more  than  his  own 
execution  of  the  stipulations  j)erhaps  warrants ;  and 
certainly  more  than  justice  to  the  governed  can  sanction, 
or  sound  policy  and  discretion  in  his  situation  can 
approve.  In  short,  he  has  a  little  too  much  of  the  s^^irit 
of  a  military  chief,  ^;o?rr  nc  pas  dire  nn  avcnturier.  To 
excuse,  or  to  support  his  pretensions,  and  the  half  formed 
ambitious  designs  which  sometimes  dazzle  his  imagina- 
tion, he  has  some  personal  qualities,  some  adventitious 
circumstances,  and  an  army  strong  at  least  in  numbers, 
though  hitherto  untried  in  its  affections.  I  suspect  him 
of  some  such  designs,  or  rather  inclinations,  and  of  a 
keener  appetite  for  indemnities  and  conquests  than  is 
wise  or  honest ;  from  the  manner  rather  than  from  the 
substance  of  his  conversation.  He  spoke  of  his  adher- 
ence to  treaties,  and  particularly  of  his  fidelity  to  the 
Austrians,  as  an  exertion  of  very  painful  virtue,  and  the 
obvious  weakness  and  unpopularity  of  the  Austrians  in 
Italy  are  enough  to  tempt  any  Italian  Prince  of  a  war- 
like character  to  a  rupture,  even  if  his  elevation  were 
not  such  as  to  throw  some  doubts  on  the  value  of  a 
good  character,  to  the  attainment  of  which  he  may 
think  he  is  sacrificing  much. 

Of  England,  however,  he  is  evidently  afraid,  and  by 
her  councils,  if  treated  well,  he  would  be  implicitly 
guided.     His  personal  qualities,  to  which  I  have  alluded 

20* 


234  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

above,  are  great  courage  in  the  field,  gallant,  gay,  open 
manners,  and  great  mildness  and  good  nature  to  his  sub- 
jects; without  reckoning  the  advantages  of  a  martial 
figure,  and  the  accomplishments  of  horsemanship,  &c., 
&c.,  which  have  at  all  times  some  effect  on  the  vulgar 
and  on  the  soldiery,  and  are  the  more  respected  in  Italy 
from  having  been  so  rare  in  their  princes  and  governors. 
But  Bonaparte  knows  him  better  than  I  can,  and  he 
saj'S  of  him,  c'cst  iiu  hrave  militaire,  Vhomme  le  ijIus  hrilUant 
que  fai  jamais  vu  dam  tin  champ  de  hattaille.  Pas  beaiicoup 
de  talens,  pen  de  courage  morale  asscz  timide,  meme  ijour 
V arrangement  dcs  operaiions  ;  mais  devant  Vennemi  tout  cela 
disparait  ;  c'est  alors  le  coup  d'oeil  le  plus  rajyide,  la  valeur  vrai- 
ment  chcvaleresqiie  ;  d'ailleiirs  hel  homme,  par^  toiijours  avec 
beaiicoup  de  soin,  qiielqiiefois  un  pteu  fantasquement,  enfin  tin 
magnifique  lazzarone.  His  army  is  admirably  appointed, 
and  some  carry  its  numbers  as  high  as  100,000  men. 
There  is,  too,  in  it  more  military  spirit  than  ever  existed 
in  a  Neapolitan  or  perhaps  in  any  modern  Italian  arni}^ ; 
and  it  is  rather  the  attachment  of  the  army  to  Joachim, 
than  its  formidable  character,  which  is  questionable.  If 
he  can  reckon  on  their  dispositions,  he  is  a  great  inihtary 
power.  As  to  the  affections  of  his  people,  and  of  those 
whose  territories  are  adjoining  to  his,  and  likely  to  be- 
come the  theatre  of  war,  in  short  \i\&  force  morale^  as  they 
call  it,  it  is  perhaps  very  difficult  to  estimate  it  correctly. 
He  has  for  him  the  majority,  or  at  least,  the  most  active 
and  important,  of  the  nobihty.  Though  the  revolution 
and  the  tribunals  instituted  by  Joseph  have  reduced  the 
revenues  and  somewhat  partially,  and  even  unjustly, 
deprived  them  of  their  rights,  without  sufficient  indem- 
nity ;  yet  they  have  not  suffered  confiscation  or  persecu- 
tion from  Murat,  who  has  spared  the  property  of  his 
most   inveterate    enemies,   and    never    made    political 


JEt.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  235 

offences  subservient  to  his  rapacity.  They  have  gained 
in  pubUc  consideration,  and  many  of  them  are  indemni- 
fied for  the  losses  they  have  sustained  by  the  high 
offices  which  they  fill.  Above  all,  they  have  nearly  all 
committed  themselves  far  enough  to  preclude  all  hope 
of  forgiveness  from  Ferdinand's  government ;  the  un- 
merciful and  vindictive  spirit  of  which,  is  known  to 
them  by  experience,  and  heightened,  rather  than  softened, 
by  subsequent  misfortune.  The  men  of  letters  (a  small 
class  here)  and  the  active  men  of  business,  (a  very  large 
one,)  are  obviously  interested  in  his  support.  The  rich 
merchants  are  averse  to  any  change,  and  were  they  once 
satisfied  that  England  would  acknowledge  Joachim, 
would  be  active  and  eager  in  his  support.  Such  is  the 
full  amount  of  any  thing  that  can  be  called  popularity. 
As  to  the  just  claims  he  may  have  to  them,  though  noth- 
ing to  the  purpose  of  our  present  argument,  it  may  be 
interesting  to  you  to  know,  that  the  general  appearance 
of  the  people  and  town  is  much  improved,  that  obedi- 
ence to  the  laws  is  more  general  than  ever  known  in 
this  kingdom,  and  that  great  and  useful,  as  well  as 
showy  and  magnificent  works,  have  been  executing  and 
are  still  in  hand,  such  as  the  roads  in  the  environs  of 
Naples,  and  through  the  distant  provinces  of  the  king- 
dom, public  establishments  for  education,  the  excavations 
of  Pompeii,  &c.,  &c.,  the  establishment  of  provincial  tri- 
bunals and  the  more  uniform  administration  of  justice; 
and  above  all,  the  general  and  impartial  system  of  hu)/- 
ing,  and  the  strict  and  incorrupt  application  of  the  reve- 
nue when  raised,  are  the  brightest  parts  of  his  govern- 
ment, and  really  surprising  under  a  dynasty  imposed  by 
a  foreign  force,  dependent  on  it  during  its  whole  exist- 
ence of  five  or  six  years,  and  labouring  under  the  pres- 
sure and  privations  of  a  war  of  twenty  years. 


236  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

Sucli  is  the  bright  side  of  the  picture ;  on  the  other 
hand,  a  revenue  which  is  as  31  to  5  compared  with  that 
of  Charles  II.,  and  as  31  to  11  with  the  highest  year  of 
Ferdinand's  government,  cannot  be  raised  without  great 
pressure  of  taxes,  and  the  conscription  is  dreadfully 
oppressive.  These  considerations  weigh  with  the  mid- 
dling classes,  and  make  them  listen  to  the  suggestions  of 
the  priesthood  and  the  tories,  with  more  disposition  to 
embrace  the  cause  of  the  exiled  court  than  any  personal 
attachment  to  Ferdinand,  or  any  deep-rooted  regard  to 
a  long  line  of  princes,  (neither  of  which  sentiments  can 
make  much  impression  at  Naples,)  would  produce. 
Among  the  very  lower  orders,  Ferdinand  is  personally 
popular ;  and  the  rabble,  in  the  frequent  changes  of  gov- 
ernment, have  more  than  once  tasted  the  sweets  of  a 
pillage  of  palaces  and  libraries,  in  the  course  of  these  last 
eighteen  years,  and  would  not  be  sorry  to  renew  them. 
The  Lazzaroni,  however,  formerly  a  numerous  body, 
have  been  much  reduced  by  the  police  and  the  conscrip- 
tion. It  is  not  easy  to  say  how  the  soldiers  would  act, 
if  a  war  for  the  existence  of  Joachim's  government  were 
to  happen ;  and  it  is,  perhaps,  yet  more  doubtful  whether, 
if  that  army  were  in  the  field  in  such  a  cause,  an  insur- 
rection in  this  turbulent  city  might  not  palsy  its  exer- 
tions, or  recall  Ferdinand  to  the  throne.  If  his  army 
be  steady,  his  people  quiet,  and  England,  I  will  not  say 
friendly,  but  land  fide  neutral,  it  is  my  opinion,  strange 
as  it  may  appear  to  you,  that  Joachim  could  maintain 
himself  against  France  and  Austria ;  and  if  England 
were  really  friendly,  I  believe  it  is  more  essential  to 
Austria  to  secure  King  Joachim's  alliance,  than  it  is  to 
Kino;  Joachim  to  secure  Austria.  The  alliance  of  Eno-- 
land,  or  two  more  years  quiet  possession  of  the  throne 
of  Naples,  will,  I  believe,  make  Naples  rather  than  Aus- 


^T.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  237 

trill  the  preponderant  power  in  Italy.  What  policy,  then, 
is  it  our  interest  to  pursue  ?  This  is  for  you  in  England 
to  decide ;  but  can  it  be  your  interest  to  restore  a  family 
nearly  connected  by  ties  of  blood,  similarity  of  circum- 
stance and  feeling  with  France  and  Spain,  recently  irri- 
tated with  you,  —  who,  if  restored,  will  ascribe  this 
restoration  not  to  you,  but  to  France  ?  Can  it  be  your 
interest  to  disturb  a  prince  whose  cause  with  Spain  and 
France  is  desperate ;  who  can  have  no  connexions  but 
with  you  and  Austria,  and  who  will  feel  for  years  not 
only  that  he  owed  his  establishment  to  England,  but 
that  a  friendly  intercourse,  and  even  alHance  with 
that  power,  is  absolutely  necessary  to  his  security  ?  Can 
it  be  your  interest  to  substitute  for  the  only  government 
in  the  south  of  Europe  actuated  by  any  military  spirit, 
capable  of  any  military  exertion,  and  independent  of 
France,  a  miserable,  treacherous,  bigoted  and  revengeful 
Court,  whose  system  of  government  can  only  prepare  its 
territories  to  be  the  prey  to  whatever  military  power 
the  turn  of  a  battle  may  give  a  temporary  preponde- 
rance in  Italy  ?  Such  considerations,  exclusive  of  the 
disqualifications  arising  from  his  legitimacy  and  his  crimes, 
are  in  my  judgment  conclusive  against  Ferdinand;  I 
give  my  vote  for  king  Joachim  of  that  name  the  first, 
whom  England  grant  long  to  reign. 

Yours  ever, 

Vassall  Holl.\nd. 


Letter  CCXXX.     TO  IIIS  FATHER. 
Mv  deir  Sir  Lincoln's  Inn,  3d  March,  1815. 

I  have  had  no  time  for  writing  lately ;  for  w^e 
have  had  constant  sittings  in  the  House,  and  the  Chan- 
cellor has  been  driving  through  his  paper  at  a  hard  rate. 


238  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

I  am  engaged  in  so  many  of  the  causes  that  stand  for 
hearing  till  the  holidays,  that  I  have  given  up  thoughts 
of  going  the  first  part  of  the  circuit,  and  shall  probably 
not  join  it  till  the  end  of  Passion  week,  in  Cornwall. 
They  have  lately  taken  me  into  some  Irish  Chancery 
appeals. 

The  Corn  Bill  has  been  well  discussed,  though  carried 
clamorously  and  precipitately.  It  is  in  truth  a  most 
unwise  measure,  though  I  really  believe  that  most  of 
those  who  vote  for  it  have  brouoht  themselves  to  believe 
that  it  may  be  serviceable  to  the  agricultural  interests 
of  the  country ;  at  the  same  time,  the  most  conscien- 
tious of  them  cannot  but  know,  they  will  be  no  losers 
by  it :  for  if  it  proves  effectual  at  all,  its  operation  will 
be  merely  to  save  rents  a  little  in  their  unavoidable  fall, 
and  to  gain  this  advantage  to  landlords,  by  putting  the 
people  upon  shorter  allowance  than  they  would  other- 
wise have.  Petitions  are  now  coming  from  all  quarters, 
and  a  good  deal  of  heat  is  rising  in  the  large  towns; 
but  the  bill  will  probably  be  out  of  our  House,  before  the 
petitions  can  be  found  in  sufficient  numbers  to  intimi- 
date votes ;  and  in  the  House  of  Lords,  the  voice  of  the 
people  is  not  likely  to  be  heard.  I  hear  we  are,  in  all 
probability,  to  have  wheat  at  a  very  high  price,  before 
the  middle  of  summer ;  which  may  be  attended  with 
some  inconvenience,  if  the  popular  impression  should 
be,  that  that  is  owing  to  the  new-made  law. 

We  have  had  three  excellent  debates,  on  the  militia 
question  in  which  Sir  Arthur  Piggott  distinguished  him- 
self very  much,  and  on  the  two  cases  of  Genoa  and  the 
Spaniards  given  up  by  the  governor  of  Gibraltar,  on 
both  of  which  occasions  Sir  J.  Mackintosh  made  very 
able  speeches.  The  conclusion  of  the  one  he  made 
about  the  Spaniards  was  a  finished  and  very  eloquent 


iEr.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  239 

composition.  I  had  a  little  success,  in  my  little  way,  on 
the  Genoa  affliir;  it  was  an  easy  and  most  agreeable 
subject  to  speak  on  :  and  in  the  other  debate,  I  had  the 
satisfaction  of  expressing  some  very  whiggish  doctrines 
about  Ferdinand  the  Beloved.  Excuse  this  egotism. 
My  kind  love  to  my  mother  and  sisters. 

Ever  affectionately  yours. 

Era.  Horner. 


Letter   CCXXXI.     FROM   WILLIAM  MURRAY,   ESQ.  *   TO  MR. 
HORNER'S   FATHER. 

My  dear  Sir  Temple,  8th  Mcarch,  1815. 

I  cannot  resist  the  opportunity  which  a  frank 
offers,  of  writing  you  a  few  lines  of  congratulation  upon 
the  excellent  appearances  which  your  son  has  lately 
made  in  the  House  of  Commons.  His  speeches  upon 
Genoa  and  the  Corn  question  I  have  heard  mentioned 
with  the  most  unqualified  praise,  by  some  of  the  best 
judges ;  among  whom  I  may  mention  Sir  Samuel  Romilly 
and  Sir  James  Mackintosh.  The  latter  said,  that  "  two 
such  speeches  had  never  been  made  in  the  House  of 
Commons  by  the  same  person  in  one  week ;  or,  at  least, 
not  for  a  great  many  years."  It  seems  now  perfectly 
understood  that  his  character,  as  a  speaker,  is  firmly 
settled  in  the  very  first  rank  of  the  House  of  Commons, 

What  a  pity  it  is  that  the  speeches  to  which  I  allude 
were  so  imperfectly  given  in  the  newspa^Ders ! 

Believe  me,  my  dear  Sir, 

Yours  sincerely, 

Wm.  Murray. 

*  See  note.  Vol.  I.  p.  307. 


240  BANK  EESTRICTION  ACT.  [1815. 


BANK   RESTRICTION    ACT. 

Another  important  measure  of  the  Government  in 
this  session,  to  which  Mr.  Horner  naturally  directed  his 
attention  in  its  progress  through  the  House,  was  the 
renewal  of  this  Act.  On  the  first  day  the  House  met, 
after  the  long  adjournment,  that  is,  on  the  9th  of  Febru- 
ary, the  Chancellor  of  the  Exchequer  proposed,  that  on 
the  13th  the  House  should  go  into  Committee  to  con- 
sider this  Act.  Mr.  Horner  asked  him,  whether  he 
meant  to  propose  the  renewal  of  the  Act,  without  first 
moving  for  a  Committee  on  the  affairs  of  the  Bank ;  and 
the  Chancellor  of  the  Exchequer  having  replied  that  he 
had  no  intention  of  moving  for  such  a  Committee,  Mr. 
Horner  next  day  said,  —  "he  should  move  for  the  pro- 
duction of  such  papers  as  would  enable  Members  to 
form  some  judgment  on  the  state  of  the  currency  of  the 
nation,  and  the  issues  made  by  the  Bank  of  England. 
He  conceived  that  an  inquiry  should  be  made  into  the 
funds  of  the  Bank,  to  ascertain  whether  the  Company 
would  soon  be  capable  of  renewing  their  payments  in 
cash;  and  that  this  was  an  inquiry  in  which  the  feel- 
ings of  the  country  w^ere  deeply  interested.  Without 
more  information  than  had  yet  been  produced,  it  was 
not  possible  for  the  House  to  form  any  accurate  opinion 
relative  to  the  matter." 

On  the  16th  of  February  the  Chancellor  of  the  Ex- 
chequer stated  that,  "  w^hatever  difference  of  opinion 
might  prevail  as  to  the  period  at  which  it  might  be 
practicable  to  resume  cash  payments  at  the  Bank,  he 
apprehended  that  all  were  agreed  that  such  jDayments 
could  not  be  resumed  by  the  25th  March  next,  on  which 
day  the  Act  would  expire ;  it  was  therefore  necessary 


Mt.  37.]  BANK  RESTRICTION  ACT.  241 

that  a  Bill  should  be  brought  in,  to  continue  the  Act  for 
a  limited  time."  This  was  agreed  to  without  opposition. 
In  the  Committee  on  the  Bill  on  the  2d  of  March,  it  was 
agreed  that  the  continuance  should  be  to  the  6th  of 
July,  1816 ;  and  on  the  bringing  up  of  the  Report  on 
the  7th,  Mr.  Horner  said, — 

"He  was  decidedly  of  opinion  that  the  Bank  ought 
to  resume  cash  payments  as  early  as  possible,  and  he 
could  not  allow  this  opportunity  to  pass  without  enter- 
ing his  protest  against  the  Bill  altogether.  The  Chan- 
cellor of  the  Exchequer,  who  had  said  that  he  expected 
the  measure  would  not  continue  to  be  necessary  beyond 
July,  1816,  he  regarded  as  being  pledged,  not  that  the 
Bank  should  resume  its  payments  in  cash  at  that  time, 
but  that  he  would  not  lose  sight  of  the  subject.  It  was 
a  mere  delusion  to  suppose  that  the  Bank  would  resume 
cash  payments  if  left  to  themselves.  Government  must 
interpose  its  authority ;  for  it  was  not  natural  that  the 
Bank  should,  spontaneously,  give  u])  the  great  profits 
which  they  derived  from  the  system  of  restriction.  Was 
it  not  a  strange  circumstance  that,  during  the  period  of 
our  greatest  foreign  expenditure,  and  our  largest  im- 
portation of  grain,  the  price  of  gold  was  falling  j  and 
that  it  was  rising  this  year,  when  our  foreign  expendi- 
ture was  rapidly  diminishing  every  week,  and  the  im- 
portation of  wheat  had  ceased  ?  On  the  third  reading 
of  the  bill  he  should  propose  that  a  declaration  of  the 
principle,  that  the  Bank  must  resume  its  payments, 
should  be  introduced.  No  one  wished  cash  payments 
should  take  place  immediately^  but  that  ministers  should 
adopt  the  doctrine  of  the  necessity  of  their  taking 
place." 

On  the  third  reading  of  the  bill  on  the  9th  of  March, 
Mr.  Horner  moved  as  an  amendment,  "  That  whereas  it 

VOL.  II.  21 


242  I5ANK  RESTRICTION  ACT.  [1815 

is  highly  desirable  that  the  Bank  should,  as  soon  as  pos- 
sible, resume  its  payments  in  cash,  immediately  after  the 
passing  of  the  present  act,  measures  should  be  taken  by 
the  Bank  to  enable  them  to  resume  such  payments. 
His  object,"  he  said,  "in  proposing  this  amendment  was, 
that  the  Bank  should,  in  the  fifteen  months  longer 
allowed  them,  lose  no  time  in  preparing  to  resume  cash 
payments,  and  not  consider  this  as  a  new  lease  of  ex- 
emption from  paying  in  specie." 

The  Chancellor  of  the  Exchequer  said,  "  he  had  no  ob- 
jection to  the  introduction  of  the  first  part  of  the  amend- 
ment, which  expressed  the  desire  of  a  resumption  of 
cash  payments,  as  he  himself  felt  a  sincere  wish  for  that 
event ;  but  he  would  certainly  object  to  the  latter  part, 
which  required  the  adoption  of  immediate  measures  for 
that  purpose."  Mr.  Horner  consented  to  take  only  the 
first  part  of  his  amendment.  He  said  "  that  his  purpose 
in  proposing  the  amendment  was  to  record  the  differ- 
ence in  principle  on  this  question.  He  agreed  that  the 
Bank  could  not  commence  cash  payments  till  the  mar- 
ket and  Mint  price  of  gold  were  the  same ;  but  then  the 
Bank  must  take  steps  themselves  to  bring  this  about. 
He  contended  that  the  present  amendment  was  per- 
fectly consistent  with  the  Keport  of  the  Bullion  Com- 
mittee. We  had  been  already  ten  months  at  peace,  and 
by  the  present  bill  fifteen  months  were  added  to  the 
period  of  the  restriction,  which  amounted  to  more  than 
two  years.  The  House  might  rest  assured  that  unless 
Parliament  interposed,  payments  in  cash  would  never 
be  resumed  by  the  Bank  of  England,  whatever  might 
be  the  good  wishes  expressed  by  the  directors  in  that 
House.  He  then  altered  his  amendment  to  the  follow- 
ing words :  — '  That  it  is  highly  desirable  that  the  Bank 
of  England  should,  as  soon  as  possible,  return  to  the 


iET.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  243 

payment  of  its  notes  in  cash.' "     The  amendment  was 
agreed  to. 


Letter  CCXXXII.     TO  EARL  GREY. 
Dear  Lord  Grey  Launceston,  28tli  March,  1815. 

I  cannot  say  how  much  I  feel  obliged  to  you,  for 
taking  the  trouble  of  writing  to  me  so  fall  and  satisfac- 
tory an  account  of  the  sentiments  of  our  different 
friends  at  the  present  moment :  they  seem  all  of  them, 
upon  the  whole,  more  pacific  than  I  was  prepared  to 
expect.  The  preservation  of  peace  for  any  length  of 
time  is,  I  fear,  a  vain  wish ;  considering  the  parties,  on 
all  sides,  with  whom  it  rests.  But  the  manner  of  our 
renewing  the  war  is  a  point  of  principle,  upon  which  I 
dreaded  more  serious  differences  of  opinion.  These  may 
be  saved  probably  by  the  immediate  course  of  events, 
or  rather  by  the  conduct  of  the  single  man  who  guides 
or  drives  the  events  of  our  time.  But  if  he  should,  in 
the  first  instance,  think  it  for  his  advantage,  to  hold  out 
terms  of  peace  and  moderation,  a  schism  would  seem 
unavoidable ;  at  least  for  the  interval  of  such  a  discus- 
sion, between  those  who  are  for  an  immediate  invasion 
of  France,  because  Bonaparte  is  sure  in  the  end  to  play 
his  old  part,  and  those  who  think  that  every  thing  is 
gained  for  the  justice  and  popularity  of  the  war  through- 
out Europe,  by  forbearing  to  interfere  in  French  affairs, 
till  aggressions  are  again  attempted.  It  affords  me  the 
greatest  satisfaction  to  know,  that  the  opinion  I  had 
formed,  upon  this  turn  of  circumstances,  coincides  with 
that  of  your  Lordship,  in  all  points. 

A  war  renewed  now  upon  the  footing  of  the  Treaty 
of  Paris,  will  be  in  truth  a  war  for  the  restoration  of  the 
Bourbon  family  j  coupled  with  a  still  more  indefensible 


244  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

principle,  that  of  proscribing  an  individual  to  destruc- 
tion.    No  successes  would  ever  reconcile  me  to  such  a 
war ;  but  by  so  recommencing  it,  we  should  multiply  all 
the  chances  against  us.     The  entrance  of  foreign  troops 
upon  French  territory  will  give  the  Emperor,  at  once, 
all  the  strength  of  French  national  enthusiasm ;  certainly 
not  weakened  by  having  been  suppressed  for  a  year,  nor 
by  the  insults  which  it  has  recently  submitted   to.     If 
the  Austrians  march  across  the  Rhine,  I  suppose  they 
will  detain  the  empress  and  the  young  boy  as  hostages ; 
and  that  cannot  fail  to  give  Bonaparte  an  advantage  in 
the  war,  both  among  his  own  people  and  foreigners,  of 
all  the  interest  and  sympathy  which  such  a  circumstance 
must  naturally  inspire ;  and  all  this  is  to  be  done,  with 
the  hope  of  forcing  upon  France   a  family,  who,  in  a 
year's  possession  of  the  throne,  could  not  secure  a  dozen 
bayonets  to  keep  them  in  it ;  and  who  were  so  utterly 
insignificant,  that  they  were  not  molested  in  their  flight. 
Believe  me,  my  dear  Lord, 

Most  truly  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CCXXXIL*     TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 

My  dear  Murray,  Taunton,  3d  April,  1815. 

I  am  delighted  to  hear  you  are  in  Lincoln's  Inn, 
and  wish  much  it  were  less  uncomfortable  for  you.  But 
I  shall  have  a  better  bed  for  you  in  Great  Russell  Street, 
next  time.  I  must  contrive  to  be  in  town  on  Thursday, 
for  I  have  undertaken  to  argue  the  first  cause  in  the 
House  of  Lords  on  the  followino;  mornino*.  For  this,  I 
give  up  Sessions.  I  hope  you  will  remain  a  full  month 
in  London,  and  that  in  the  course  of  it  we  shall  contrive 
to  pass  a  few  days  quietly  somewhere  together,  to  have 


Mt.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  245 

more  leisure  for  conversation  tlian  London  usually 
affords.  God  knows  there  is  matter  enough  in  public 
affairs  for  much  anxious  conversation.  I  begin  to  feel 
myself  growing  a  mere  fatalist  about  politics,  we  seem 
so  much  the  victim  and  sport  of  uncontrollable  events. 
I  can  bestow  no  thoughts  at  this  moment  upon  the  hap- 
piness of  the  French  nation,  as  concerned  in  the  last 
marvellous  revolution  of  affairs ;  they  are  so  sunk  in 
my  estimation,  by  their  passive  acquiescence  under  two 
such  changes  of  government,  that  I  feel  no  interest 
about  their  political  or  civil  liberties.  But  the  possible 
consequences  to  our  own  liberties,  of  the  conduct  that 
may  be  pursued  by  our  government  in  the  present  new 
conjuncture,  do  incessantly  disturb  and  burthen  my 
mind.  So  many  persons,  in  whose  judgment  and  public 
spirit  I  have  the  best  confidence,  are  for  hurrying  into 
immediate  war,  that  I  am  afraid  almost  to  inquire  about 
your  sentiments  on  that  point,  lest  I  should  find  them 
differing  from  my  own.  But  my  impression  from  the 
first  moment  was,  that  we  ought  to  give  the  Emperor  of 
France  an  opportunity  of  maintaining  the  treaty  of 
Paris  if  he  would,  and  throw  upon  him  the  unpopularity 
of  being  the  first  to  make  aggressions  and  to  break  the 
tranquillity  of  Europe.  These  impressions  were  not 
shaken  by  the  authority  of  all  the  names  subscribed  to 
the  manifesto  from  Vienna,  and  they  have  derived  of 
course  some  addition  of  strength  from  the  formal  decla- 
rations now  made  by  Napoleon,  of  his  relinquishing  all 
former  schemes  of  a  mastery  over  foreign  nations,  and 
founding  a  great  empire.  Not  that  I  place  much  faith 
in  these  professions,  for  in  forming  a  practical  decision  as 
to  what  is  best  to  be  done,  I  would  look  upon  them  as 
entitled  to  none  at  all ;  although  I  think  it  not  impossi- 
ble that  reflections  in  exile,  and  older  years,  may  have 

21* 


246  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

given  prudence  some  ascendancy  in  his  plans,  and  not 
wholly  out  of  his  character  that  he  should  set  his  ambi- 
tion as  it  were  upon  a  new  theory  of  greatness  for  its 
gratification.  But  in  taking  the  practical  determination, 
what  I  would  be  guided  by  is  this,  that  if  we  are  to  open 
a  new  Iliad  of  war  against  the  military  power  of  France, 
it  is  of  the  last  importance  that  we  should  so  commence 
it,  as  to  stamp  upon  it,  in  the  opinion  of  the  people  of 
the  continent,  its  true  character  of  a  war  of  defence 
merely  against  aggrandizement.  By  going  to  war  now, 
we  go  to  war  for  the  Bourbons,  to  force  that  feeble  worn- 
out  race  upon  the  French  ;  we  go  to  war  too  upon  a 
still  more  hopeless,  and  in  my  sentiments  unjustifiable 
principle,  that  of  proscribing  an  individual,  and  through 
him  the  nation  which  has  adopted  him,  as  incapable  of 
peace  or  truce.  It  is  obvious,  that,  proceeding  in  that 
manner,  we  do  what  we  can  to  inspire  into  the  French 
soldiery  all  the  fire  of  enthusiasm,  every  feeling  of  pride 
for  their  national  independence,  and  the  utmost  devotion 
for  their  great  chief  The  argument  used  on  the  other 
side,  is,  that  in  prudence  it  must  be  assumed  that  he  will 
act  over  again  his  old  part  as  soon  as  he  has  collected 
sufficient  means,  and  that  the  interval  should  not  be  let 
slip  of  overbearing  him  while  he  is  miprepared  with 
the  whole  combined  numbers  of  the  allies.  In  this  rea- 
soning there  are  more  assumptions  than  one,  of  which  I 
doubt  the  correctness.  It  is  taken  for  granted,  that  he 
could  not  now  make  head  against  such  force  as  the  allies 
could  push  into  his  territory ;  in  which  I  apprehend 
those  who  reckon  the  strength  of  armies  by  the  tale  of 
numbers  might  be  proved,  by  the  issue  of  such  an 
experiment,  to  have  forgotten  in  their  estimate,  that  moral 
force  which  must  be  breathed  into  troops  by  the  romance 
and  marvellous  [prestige],  that  accompany  this  last  enter- 


JEt.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  247 

prise  of  this  extraordinary  man.  It  is  assumed,  too, 
that  the  alHes  are  all  to  be  had  as  they  were  last  year ; 
now  Avithout  considering  the  effect,  which  Bonaparte's 
declaration,  that  he  will  maintain  the  treaty  of  Paris, 
must  have  upon  those  powers  which  are  in  possession 
of  what  they  have  usurped  in  Italy  and  in  Germany,  it 
ought  to  be  recollected,  that  these  usurpations,  and  the 
indecent  spectacle  which  the  allies  exhibited  during  the 
whole  winter  in  their  congress  of  plunder,  have  deprived 
them  throughout  Italy  and  Germany  of  that  moral  force, 
which  tlwj  boasted  of  last  year,  and  with  truth,  as  the 
foundation  of  their  successes.  But  even  if  these  things 
could  be  taken  for  granted,  I  question  if  it  would  not 
still  be  but  a  short-sighted  prudence,  to  reject  the  oppor- 
tunity which  his  professions  of  peace  and  moderation 
might  afford  of  confirming  in  the  public  mind  of  Europe, 
an  impression  of  the  justice  of  our  cause  in  that  war, 
which,  if  it  be  renewed,  will  be  one  of  no  short  duration, 
and  must  in  the  course  of  it  involve  in  all  the  vicissi- 
tudes of  fortune  the  best  parts  of  the  world.  For  Eng- 
land, I  own,  I  cannot  see,  if  we  are  to  have  another 
period  of  war,  that  ultimate  success  abroad,  if  to  be 
hoped,  would  compensate  our  sure  and  irreparable  losses 
at  home;  the  inevitable  insolvency  of  the  Exchequer 
must,  in  one  disguised  shape  or  other,  bring  on  a  dread- 
ful convulsion  of  property,  with  the  ruin  of  all  those 
families,  whom  the  Courier,  (resuming  the  ancient  Jaco- 
binical phrase  of  its  Editor  when  he  was  the  hireling  of 
violence  of  another  sort,)  stigmatizes  as  the  drones  of 
society,  the  annuitants,  those  who  live  on  the  savings  of 
former  industry ;  and  in  addition  to  this  calamity,  we 
shall  witness  the  acceleration  of  that  change,  which  is 
already  begun,  of  our  old  civil  system  of  freedom  and 
law,  for  a  military  government.     Such  are  my  present 


248  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

melancholy  dreams ;  sleeping  or  waking,  they  are  about 
my  bed,  and  about  my  path,  speaking  most  literally ; 
for  since  this  devil  incarnate  rose  again  from  the  dead 
I  have  known  no  comfortable  day.  Some  differences  of 
opinion  among  my  political  friends,  are  also  come  at  last 
to  add  a  little  to  the  annoyance ;  but  that  is  a  trifle 
compared  with  the  dismal  prospects  that  one  has  before 
one's  mind,  for  England  and  all  that  we  are  attached  to. 
I  do  not  know  if  3^ou  could  give  me  any  comfort,  by 
helping  me  to  less  dreary  views,  but  it  would  be  some 
pleasure  at  least  to  talk  over  these  matters  with  you :  I 
wish  you  were  in  this  green  country  with  me  for  a  few 
idle  days,  it  is  more  beautiful  at  present  than  ever ; 


the  spring, 

All  unconcerned  with  our  unrest,  begins 
Her  rosy  progress  smiling  — 

and  furnishes  a  melancholy,  but  composing  contrast  to 
the  storms  and  perpetual  winter  of  the  political  world. 
I  am  much  concerned  to  hear  so  bad  an  account  of 
George  Ellis,  and  regret  sincerely  with  you,  that  I  have 
not  had  an  opportunity  of  knowing  better  a  person  of 
whom  you  entertain  so  high  an  opinion.  I  have  not 
read  the  3Iemoires  Seer.  Something  I  heard  of  them,  or 
something  I  accidentally  saw  on  opening  one  of  the 
volumes,  gave  me  an  impression  that  they  were  un- 
worthy of  credit.  Adam  desires  to  be  remembered  to 
you.  Pray  give  his  father  what  aid  and  comfort  you 
can  about  his  bill ;  he  is  sadly  teazed  by  the  ignorance 
and  want  of  reason  of  your  Scotch  heads,  as  you  call 
them. 

Ever,  my  dear  Murray, 

Affectionately  yours,  ^ 

Era.  Horner. 


yEr.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  249 


Letter  CCXXXIII.     TO  IIIS  FATHER. 
My  dear  Sir,  Lincoln's  Inn,  10th  April,  1815. 

I  have  just  time  to  acknowledge  your  letter  of 
the  7tli  with  its  kind  inclosure,  having  been  all  day  at 
the  House  of  Lords. 

I  have  a  good  deal  to  communicate  to  you,  connected 
with  politics ;  but  it  will  be  a  couple  of  days  before  I 
shall  find  time  for  so  long  a  letter  as  I  have  in  view. 
You  would  not  be  sorry,  I  am  sure,  to  see  my  name  in 
the  small  minority  the  other  night,  which  voted  that  we 
ought  not  to  begin  the  war  by  an  attack  on  France. 
The  question  is  a  very  difficult  one,  and  upon  which  dif- 
ferent views  may  be  taken,  even  by  those  who  are  most 
agreed  upon  political  principles  and  objects.  My  deter- 
mination was  not  taken  without  a  great  deal  of  previous 
consideration,  which  my  absence  from  London  gave  me 
an  opportunity  of  pursuing  at  leisure,  and  I  did  not 
give  that  vote  before  my  opinion  was  clear  and  satisfac- 
tory to  my  own  mind.  The  consequences,  in  the  event 
of  immediate  war,  may  be  important  to  myself,  with  re- 
spect to  my  seat ;  but,  of  course,  I  saw  all  these  conse- 
quences, and  gave  them  no  weight.  There  are  some 
differences  of  opinion  among  our  leaders,  which  may 
never  come  to  a  difference  in  Parliament ;  that  depends 
upon  events ;  but  having  had  confidential  communica- 
tions with  both  the  eminent  persons  to  whom  I  allude  % 
I  have  found,  in  this  instance,  only  fresh  occasion  to  re- 
spect the  patriotism  and  public  integrity  of  both.  But 
I  i^hall  be  more  particular,  when  I  can  find  time  to  write 
at  length ;  in  the  mean  time,  I  request  that  you  will 

*  Lords  Grey  and  Grenville.  —  Ed. 


250  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

keep  the  whole  of  this  to  yourself,  with  the  exception  of 
Leonard ;  for  the  time  is  not  yet  come  for  makino-  any 
such  disclosure,  and  it  is  possible  that  the  necessity  of 
making  any  disclosure  may  yet  be  averted. 

The  state  of  things  at  Paris  is  infinitely  curious,  and 
not  yet  intelligible. 

Most  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CCXXXIV.    TO  HIS  FATHER. 
Mv  dear  Sir  Lincoln's  Inn,  18th  April,  1815. 

Though  no  circumstance  has  occurred  since  my 
last  note,  to  terminate  the  suspense  in  which  all  politi- 
cal affairs  are  at  present  held,  or  to  break  the  silence 
which  mutual  kindness  and  unwillingness  to  difier  in  ac- 
tion have  thrown  over  the  differences  of  opinion  that  exist 
among  the  leading  persons  of  opposition,  I  feel  it  due  to 
the  impatience  which  my  note  may  have  occasioned, 
not  to  keep  you  any  longer  in  ignorance  of  what  has 
passed  about  myself  At  the  same  time,  I  must  request 
you  to  observe  still  the  same  confidential  secrecy  upon 
this  subject ;  on  which  it  would  be  improper  on  every 
account,  and  particularly  on  account  of  the  kindness 
with  which  I  have  personally  been  treated,  that  au}^  pre- 
mature disclosure  should  come  from  me. 

As  I  have  already  explained  to  you,  I  had  formed  my 
own  opinion,  upon  the  new  state  of  affairs  produced  by 
the  return  of  Bonaparte  to  France,  before  I  left  London 
for  the  circuit ;  and  the  leisure  of  travelling  by  myself, 
and  of  the  time  I  passed  in  the  country,  afforded  me 
an  ample  opportunity  of  reconsidering  all  the  circum- 
stances. It  was  but  too  certain  that  there  had  arisen 
an  entirely  new  conjuncture,  in  which  there  was  to  be 


iET.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  251 

expected  a  diversity  of  opinions,  and  in  which  every  in- 
dividual, having  a  seat  in  Parliament,  would  have  his 
vote  to  give  according  to  his  judgment. 

Before  I  left  London,  I  explained  the  views  I  then 
took  of  the  subject  to  Lord  Grey,  and  requested  him  to 
apprise  me  of  any  indication  that  might  appear  in  the 
party,  of  sentiments  more  inclined  to  Avar.  During  my 
absence,  I  was  apprised  by  him  of  a  correspondence  that 
had  passed  between  him  and  Lord  Grenville,  in  which 
the  latter,  with  that  frankness  and  public  integrity 
which  mark  every  part  of  his  political  conduct,  had 
sought  occasion  to  put  Lord  Grey  in  possession  of  the 
whole  of  his  opinions  upon  this  new  state  of  things. 
The  result  was,  the  statement  on  Lord  Grenville's  side, 
of  an  opinion  that  the  maintenance  of  peace  with  Bona- 
parte is  impossible,  and  that  our  policy  ought  therefore 
to  be  a  renewal  of  the  concert  of  last  year  for  immediate 
action ;  on  Lord  Grey's,  the  opinion,  that,  even  granting 
war  to  be  unavoidable  in  the  end,  it  is  the  duty  and 
policy  of  this  country,  and  of  the  allies,  to  take  every 
chance  of  maintaining  the  peace,  and  that  a  war  imme- 
diately begun,  by  an  aggression  against  France,  would 
both  want  the  justification  of  aggression  by  France,  and 
would  involve  the  unjustifiable  principle  of  interfering 
with  the  right  of  the  French  to  choose  their  own  gov- 
ernment. 

I  wrote  to  Lord  Grey,  and  expressed  the  satisfac- 
tion I  felt  in  coinciding  wholly  with  his  sentiments ;  and 
then  I  turned  myself  to  consider,  how  I  should  proceed 
with  most  propriety  and  delicacy  towards  Lord  Gren- 
ville, in  order  to  relieve  him,  or  Lord  Buckingham,  from 
the  disagreeable  necessity  of  making  any  communica- 
tion to  me,  and  at  the  same  time  to  avoid  every  thing 
like  fuss  or  eclat  in  relinquishing  my  seat  for  a  differ- 


252  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

eH'  e  of  opinion  with  those  from  whom  I  hold  it.  The 
impression  with  which  I  came  to  town  was,  that  I  should 
at  once  abstain  from  attendance  in  Parliament,  and  with 
that  feeling  I  declined  attending  a  meeting  held  that 
night  at  Mr.  Ponsonbj's,  for  the  purpose  of  considering 
what  was  to  be  done  next  day  upon  the  message  from 
the  Throne.  When  I  found,  however,  that  Lord  Gren- 
ville's  nearest  connexions  had  attended  that  meeting;-, 
and  not  only  they,  but  those  who  are  the  most  decided 
upon  the  question  of  immediate  war,  such  as  Mr.  Elliot ; 
and  when  I  saw  that  there  was  the  most  sincere  anxiety 
on  both  sides  to  avoid,  or  at  least  to  postpone  as  long  as 
possible,  any  public  declaration  of  the  difference  of 
opinion,  I  thought  it  would  be  better,  not  yet  to  go 
out  of  my  own  course,  but  to  wait  for  the  circum- 
stances that  would  either  force  such  declaration  or 
supersede  it. 

Upon  the  message,  every  thing  went  off  as  well  as 
could  be  desired  in  the  House  of  Lords,  in  conse- 
quence of  the  cautious,  if  not  pacific,  speech  made  by 
Lord  Liverpool :  the  same  forbearance  was  highly  de- 
sirable to  have  been  observed  in  the  House  of  Com- 
mons, but  in  that  we  were  disappointed,  partly  perhaps 
by  a  little  forwardness  on  the  part  of  Whitbread,  but 
much  more  by  the  tone  of  Lord  Castlereagh's  speech. 
An  amendment  therefore  was  put  to  the  question,  ex- 
pressive of  an  opinion  unfavourable  to  immediate  and 
aggressive  war ;  and  though  many  of  the  real  friends  of 
peace,  and  of  our  surest  adherents  in  politics,  voted 
against  the  amendment  in  consequence  of  Mr.  Ponsonby 
having  committed  himself  hastily  not  to  vote  for  any, 
yet  the  vote  being  taken,  I  had  no  hesitation  in  going 
out  with  the  minority,  and  reflect  upon  that  vote  now 
with  the  greatest  satisfaction. 


^T.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  253 

When  I  went  home  that  night,  I  found  a  note  from 
Lord  Grenville,  desiring  to  see  me,  in  order  to  have 
some  conversation  with  me  on  the  new  state  of  affiiirs, 
wliich  the  reverse  in  France  had  occasioned.  This  was 
exactly  what  I  most  desired,  and  what  relieved  me  from 
every  embarrassment.  I  waited  npon  him  next  morning, 
(the  8th  of  April,)  and  shall  now  endeavour  to  state  to 
you  as  much  as  I  can  recollect  of  the  conversation. 

'[Here  the  letter  terminates,  and  it  docs  not  apjjear  to  have  been  sent.  — Ed.] 

Letter  CCXXXV.     TO  FRANCIS  JEFFREY,  ESQ. 
My  dear  Jeffrey,  Lincoln's  inn,  19th  April,  1815. 

I  did  not  hear  before  of  your  being  ill,  nor  of 
your  growing  avaricious ;  if  your  avarice  and  indisposi- 
tion grow  together,  I  shall  not  be  very  uneasy  about 
your  health. 

You  did  right,  I  feel  quite  certain,  to  save  the  garden 
wall,  at  least  for  further  consideration.  Though  I  have 
never  seen  it  yet,  my  prejudice  is  much  in  favour  of  old 
garden  enclosures  near  a  house ;  shelter,  and  trimness, 
and  formality,  and  much  variety  and  luxuriance  of  vege- 
tation close  to  the  house,  are  my  notions  of  enjoyment 
in  a  garden,  which  are  all  borrowed  from  Lord  Bacon 
and  Sir  William  Temple's  descriptions,  with  a  little  im- 
provement from  Price,  and  are  diametrically  opposed  to 
the  late  fashion  of  having  nothing  in  sight  of  your  man- 
sion but  grass,  and  that  up  to  the  door,  and  that  close 
shaven,  in  order  that  there  may  be  as  little  of  richness 
in  the  vegetation  as  variety.  I  envy  your  occupations 
at  Craigcrook  greatly ;  for,  of  all  things  in  the  world, 
what  I  most  long  to  be  at,  is  to  be  in  my  own  garden  of 
Eden.  I  have  a  particular  fancy  for  making  a  winter  gar- 
den, full  of  all  the  shiny  evergreens  that  can  be  brought 

VOL.  IL  22 


254  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

together;  to  have  the  enjoyment  of  their  verdure  on 
those  winter  and  s^Dring  days  of  occasional  gleam,  which 
diversify  so  delightfully  our  stormy  climate.  You 
promise  me  shelter  for  our  stoicism ;  you  can  keep  no 
shelter  but  upon  the  old  plan  of  a  garden.  I  mean 
certainly  to  come  and  see  you  in  the  course  of  the  year ; 
if  I  can  manage  it,  in  August  and  September ;  and  I  fear 
that  by  that  time  no  ethics  but  stoicism  of  the  severer 
kind,  taken  from  Epictetus  rather  than  Marcus  Antoni- 
nus, will  suit  the  condition  of  this  poor  world.  We  are 
doomed,  it  seems,  to  a  farther  prolongation  of  those 
pangs  and  throes  by  which  the  continent  of  Europe  is 
agitated,  while  she  is  throwing  off  feudalism,  and  the 
divine  right  of  kings,  and  the  earthly  rights  of  priests. 
It  is  a  dismal  period  to  live  in.  I  own,  I  think  better 
now  than  I  did  two  years  ago,  of  the  ultimate  result  to 
the  other  nations  of  Europe,  and  worse  of  the  immediate 
prospects  of  our  own  country.  But  the  glimpse  of 
future  sunshine  is  so  faint  and  so  far  off,  that  it  scarcely 
relieves  at  all  the  gloom  and  discomfort  of  our  present 
circumstances. 

I  have  not  yet  read  much  of  the  Review  -,  but  in  all 
I  have  read  I  am  satisfied  and  jDleased  with  the  senti- 
ments expressed  on  the  subject  of  our  relations  with 
France.  All  those  greater  politics  are  within  your  legi- 
timate province  ;  and  you  do  infinite  service  to  the  pub- 
lic by  expounding  your  opinions. 

Affectionately  yours, 

Era.  Horner. 

Letter  CCXXXVI.    TO  THE  MARQUIS  OF  BUCKINGHAM. 
My  dear  Lord,  Lincoln's  Inn,  28th  April,  1815. 

In  the  course  of  a  conversation  which  Lord  Gren- 
yille  had  the  kindness  to  seek  with  me  some  little  time 


JEt.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE,  255 

ago,  for  the  purpose  of  stating  to  me  his  views  of  the 
new  conjuncture  in  which  our  foreign  poUtics  are  placed 
by  the  late  calamitous  reverse  of  affiiirs,  I  took  that 
opportunity  of  requesting  that  he  would  have  the  good- 
ness to  mention  to  your  Lordship,  that  I  unfortunately 
found  myself  differing,  upon  the  question  of  peace  or 
immediate  war,  from  the  sentiments  which  I  understood 
were  entertained  by  your  Lordship. 

I  cannot,  however,  but  fear,  that  by  too  long  a  delay 
in  making  this  communication  myself,  I  may  have  pre- 
vented your  Lordship,  in  your  kindness  and  delicacy 
towards  me,  from  proposing  the  new  arrangement  which 
such  circumstances  suggest.  The  vote  of  last  night 
upon  Whitbread's  motion,  in  which  I  concurred,  brought 
us  in  the  House  of  Commons  to  the  crisis  of  those  dis- 
cussions, which  are  rendered  unavoidable  by  the  present 
relations  of  this  country ;  and  there  seems  very  little 
reason  now  to  expect,  that  any  change  in  those  relations 
can  prevent  the  difference  of  opinion  which  exists  from 
being  permanently  marked  to  the  public,  in  the  daily 
recurrence  of  jDarliamentary  questions,  in  which  that 
difference  of  opinion  must  be  acted  upon  in  debate  as 
well  as  votes.  As  I  have  hitherto  taken  no  part  in  them 
but  by  my  vote,  I  am  very  anxious  not  to  leave  your 
Lordship  in  any  uncertainty  respecting  the  extent  of 
my  opinions,  as  evinced  by  that  which  I  gave  last  night 
in  support  of  Whitbread's  motion. 

I  have  never  before  expressed  to  your  Lordship  the 
sense  of  grateful  obligation  which  I  have  felt,  and  shall 
ever  continue  to  feel,  for  your  kind  and  partial  distinction 
of  me,  in  conferring  upon  me  the  most  valuable  of  all 
services.  If  any  conduct  of  mine  could  tend  to  show  me 
worthy  of  that  kind  preference  by  your  Lordship,  I 
know  it  would  be  in  my  wish  to  continue  the  important 


256  CORrvESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

trust  only  so  long  as  I  can  reconcile  the  discharge  of  it. 
to  my  own  ideas,  however  imj^erfect  they  may  be,  of 
what  is  good  and  safe  for  the  country.  Having  given 
notice  of  two  motions,  the  last  of  which  stands  for 
Thursday  next,  I  am  desirous  of  performing  these 
engagements;  after  which  I  shall  make  every  other 
consideration  give  w^ay  to  that  of  consulting  your  Lord- 
ship's wishes  and  convenience. 

Believe  me,  my  dear  Lord,  with  the  most  sincere 
attachment. 

Your  faithful  and  obliged 

Era.  Horner. 


Letter   CCXXXVII.    FROM  THE  MARQUIS  OF   BUCKINGHAM. 
My  dear  Sir,  Buckingham  House,  29t,h  April,  1815. 

I  do  not  lose  a  moment  in  answering  your  letter. 
I  was  quite  sure  that  the  honourable  and  delicate  feel- 
ings of  your  mind  would  induce  you  to  make  the  offer 
which  you  have  done ;  and  Lord  Grenville  did  ample 
justice  to  those  feelings  in  detailing  to  me  the  conversa- 
tion to  which  you  advert.  Li  contributing  my  assistance 
to  your  parliamentary  objects,  I  was  actuated  by  a  sin- 
cere wish  to  be  the  means  of  giving  the  public  the 
advantage  of  great  talents  and  pure  honourable  feelings, 
in  the  House  of  Commons.  I  have  derived  the  warm- 
est satisfaction  from  the  experience  of  the  entire  success 
of  that  wish,  and  I  shall  feel  the  greatest  regret  if  a 
continuance  of  the  expression  of  those  honourable  feel- 
ings on  your  part  should  render  the  carrying  into  effect 
of  the  measure  you  advert  to  in  your  letter  necessary 
for  your  own  satisfaction.  I  will  freely  confess  to  you 
that  I  will  not  relinquish  the  anxious  hope  which  I  en- 
tertain, that  the  present  difference  of  opinion  which 


^T.  37.]  CORRESrONDENCE.  257 

exists  between  us  upon  one  subject  will  not  lead  to  a 
continued  difference  in  our  public  line  of  conduct.  I 
am  happy  to  say  that  I  see  many  reasons  why  such  a 
result  need  not  take  place.  Last  night's  vote  does  not 
in  the  least  weaken  those  hopes,  or  change  that  opinion. 
Should,  contrary  to  my  hopes  and  expectations,  events 
take  that  turn  which  may  render  such  a  radical  and 
continued  difference  of  opinion  necessary,  as  may  make 
it  irksome  to  yourself  to  express  those  opinions  whilst 
holding  your  present  seat,  in  that  case  I  will  accept  the 
offer  so  honourably  tendered  by  you  now.  But  assure 
yourself  that  I  shall  do  it  with  the  deepest  regret,  as  I 
look  forward  to  a  continuance  of  a  connection  between 
us,  so  gratifying  and  so  advantageous  to  myself,  with  an 
anxiety  which  will  make  me  eager  to  postpone  to  the 
last  possible  moment  consistent  with  your  own  feelings, 
the  doing  any  thing,  or  the  accepting  any  offer,  which, 
though  it  may  prove  difference  of  public  opinions,  never 
can  diminish  the  sincere  regard  with  which  I  am. 

My  dear  Sir, 
Yours  very  faithfully  and  sincerely, 

Chandos  Buckingham. 


Letter  CCXXXVIII.    TO  HIS  FATHER. 
My  dear  Sir,  London,  3d  May,  1815 

I  have  been  prevented  by  a  good  deal  of  busi- 
ness of  one  kind  or  another  from  writing  to  you  at  the 
length  I  promised,  and  partly,  also,  by  circumstances 
remaining  still  precisely  as  they  stood  when  I  wrote 
last.  I  cannot,  however,  delay  showing  you,  for  your 
own  private  perusal,  the  inclosed  letters*,  which  I  will 

*  A  copy  of  his  letter  of  the  28tli  April  to  the  Marquis  of  Buckingham,  and 
his  Lordship's  answer.  —  Ed. 

22* 


258  HOUSE  OF  COMJklONS.  [1815. 

beg  you  to  return  to  me  after  you  have  read  them. 
They  will  explain  themselves ;  and  I  am  sure  you  will 
agree  with  ine  in  thinking,  that  nothing  can  be  more 
liberal  than  Lord  Buckingham's  manner  of  seeing  this 
business,  or  more  strictly  consonant  to  the  honour  that 
should  be  the  foundation  of  such  a  relation  as  subsists 
between  him  and  myself  I  had  a  conversation  to  the 
same  effect  with  Lord  Grenville ;  and  nothing  can  ex- 
ceed the  satisfaction  which  I  derive  from  the  footinir  on 
which  this  matter  is  placed.  I  shall  continue  acting  in 
my  own  way,  and  upon  my  own  opinions,  until  the 
event,  which  I  do  not  now  anticipate,  of  a  final  separa- 
tion ;  and  w^hen  that  takes  place,  which  I  shall  on  every 
public  account,  as  well  as  from  private  regard  to  those 
who  have  treated  me  with  so  much  kindness,  extremely 
lament,  I  shall  then  offer  a  second  time  my  resignation. 

I  fancy  I  made  heavy  work  of  it  last  night.  My 
stings  were  drawn  at  the  beginning,  by  hearing  that  the 
jDapers  were  to  be  granted. 

My  kind  love  to  my  mother  and  every  body. 
Most  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


TREATY  WITH  THE  KING  OF  NAPLES. 

The  allusion  towards  the  end  of  the  preceding  letter 
was  to  a  speech  which  he  had  made  in  the  House  of 
Commons  the  preceding  evening,  in  moving  for  the  pro- 
duction of  papers  relative  to  negotiations  between  Aus- 
tria and  the  then  king  of  Naples,  Murat,  to  which  the 
British  government  had  been  a  party.  The  motion  re- 
ferred to  the  same  transactions  as  those  to  which  Mr. 
Whitbread  had  called  the  attention  of  the  House  on 
the  22d  and  25th  of  November  preceding,  on  which 


Mt.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  259 

occasions  Mr.  Horner  also  spoke.  (See  p.  203.)  But 
this  time,  Lord  Castlereagh,  the  minister  more  directly 
implicated,  was  present ;  and  Mr.  Horner,  in  a  long 
speech,  entered  into  a  detailed  history  of  the  proceed- 
ings from  the  commencement  of  the  negotiations. 

"It  would  be  for  the  noble  lord  to  show,"  he  said, 
"whether  the  faith  of  this  country,  which  he  had  solemnly 
pledged,  had  been  kept  —  whether  the  promises  he  had 
made  were  redeemed.  Let  Austria,  which  had,  unfortu- 
nately for  herself,  no  parliament  to  inquire  into  the  pro- 
ceedings of  her  government,  answer  for  her  own  con- 
duct; but  it  was  incumbent  upon  the  noble  lord  to 
justify  the  part  w^hich  the  British  government  had  taken 
in  this  transaction,  chiefly  through  his  agency.  It  was 
for  the  noble  lord  to  show  whether,  in  this  instance,  the 
British  government  had  acted  upon  the  just  and  liberal 
principles  professed  in  the  celebrated  Declaration  of 
Frankfort  —  upon  those  principles  which  the  allies  in 
their  proceedings  at  Congress,  in  their  views  of  personal 
aggrandisement,  had  so  shamefully  abandoned.  These 
proceedings,  however,  would  remain  for  discussion.  He 
did  not  call  upon  the  noble  lord  to  enter  into  them  at 
present,  or  to  make  any  disclosure  upon  the  subject 
which  he  might  deem  inexpedient;  but  he  required 
from  the  noble  lord  an  explanation  of  what  notoriously 
took  place  with  respect  to  Naples." 


Letter   CCXXXVIIL*    TO  MRS.  DUGALD  STEWART. 

My  dear  Mrs.  Stewart,  Loudon,  4th  May,  isis. 

I  should  not  have  been  so  long  of  writing  to  you, 
if  there  had  been  any  one  day  on  which  I  knew  any 
thing  for  certain,  or  could  form  even  a  probable  guess, 


260  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

respecting  that  frightful  question  which  is  suspended 
over  us,  Uke  a  black  threatening  cloud.  It  is  manifest, 
as  far  as  our  government  is  concerned,  that  war,  if  the 
cooperation  of  others  can  be  had,  is  decided  on,  and  it  is 
understood  that  our  general,  the  Duke  of  Wellington, 
has  been  the  instigator  of  those  hurried  and  frantic  de- 
nunciations which  have  been  issued  from  Vienna.  He 
thirsts  no  doubt  for  his  old  sport  of  war  and  military 
rule,  as  much  as  that  appetite  can  be  imputed  to  Bona^ 
parte.  His  brother,  the  Marquis,  who,  upon  the  question 
of  peace  as  well  as  in  the  condemnation  of  the  projects 
of  the  Congress,  is  strongly  in  union  with  Lord  Grey, 
says,  that  Arthur  is  a  great  captain  of  infantry,  the 
greatest  in  the  world,  but  will  never  be  a  statesman. 
Some  persons  still  flatter  themselves  with  a  slender  hope 
that  one  or  other  of  the  allies  may  shrink  from  the  con- 
federacy, and  still  avert  the  war.  The  diversion  of  the 
Austrian  forces  on  the  side  of  Italy,  the  growing  jea- 
lousies between  that  court  and  Russia,  and  the  absolute 
want  of  money,  of  which  both  have  reason  to  complain, 
being  so  many  grounds  for  this  speculation.  Meanwhile, 
the  state  of  Paris  and  the  position  of  Napoleon  are 
almost  a  mystery  in  this  country.  The  most  recent 
letters  represent  the  friends  of  liberty,  or  those  enemies 
of  liberty,  the  Jacobins,  as  acquiring  daily  a  greater 
ascendency :  the  new  constitution  is  loudly  condemned 
as  savouring  too  strongly  of  monarchy,  and  the  indi- 
viduals who  were  employed  in  drawing  it  up  are  fallen 
into  popular  odium,  —  of  these  Benjamin  Constant  is 
named.  Upon  Bonaparte's  arrival,  he  took  shelter  in 
the  house  of  Crawford,  the  American  minister,  w^here  he 
supposed  himself  concealed  for  some  days,  till  he  re- 
ceived a  message  from  Fouche,  who  told  him  he  was 
putting  himself  to    unnecessary  inconvenience,  for   he 


yEx.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  2G1 

knew  very  well  where  lie  was,  and  should  be  glad  to 
have  his  company  at  dinner  next  day.  He  was  taken 
out  of  his  garret  to  be  made  Conseiller  d'Etat.  There 
has  been  a  report  these  two  days  that  Bonaparte  has 
privately  left  Paris ;  which  has  given  rise  to  an  expecta- 
tion that  he  will  appear  somewhere  at  the  head  of  an 
army,  and  either  overawe  the  flxctions  of  Paris  or  strike 
some  blow  against  the  allies.  It  is  not  very  likely  that 
he  would  venture  to  quit  the  capital,  but  upon  an 
understanding  which  in  his  own  opinion  he  could  trust 
to,  with  Fouche  and  Carnot.  So  that  if  he  has  left  it, 
which  I  very  much  doubt,  the  second  supposition  is  by 
much  the  more  probable  of  the  two.  It  is  even  reported 
that  he  has  had  a  council  of  such  of  the  Marshals  as  are 
with  him,  in  which  he  told  them,  they  were  to  play  a 
game  with  the  Great  Captain  who  escaped  from  them 
in  Spain,  and  that  he  must  have  a  victory  before  the 
Champ  de  Mai.  It  is  curious,  that  Lucien  Bonaparte 
is  at  present,  or  was  very  lately,  at  Geneva ;  it  is  even 
surmised  that  he  has  never  been  at  Paris.  An  officer  of 
Murat,  who  arrived  here  on  Sunday  last  with  a  fresh 
offer  of  alliance,  saw  at  Chamberry  an  army  of  30,000 
men,  and  was  told  by  Suchet,  at  Lyons,  that  he  had  in 
all  80,000  under  his  command.  Bonaparte  has  taken 
all  the  regular  troops  out  of  the  garrisons,  entrusting 
them  to  the  National  Guards.  I  must  add  a  word  about 
our  own  concerns  at  home.  Though  we  are  still  in 
dread  of  a  public  declaration  in  parliament  of  the  dif- 
ference of  opinion  which  subsists  between  Lord  Gren- 
ville  and  Lord  Grey,  I  have  much  better  hopes  now 
than  I  felt  originally,  that  this  declaration,  if  made,  will 
be  so  narrowed  to  the  single  point  on  which  the  differ- 
ence has  arisen,  as  to  preclude  the  necessity  of  a  perma- 
nent separation.     This  will  depend  altogether  upon  the 


262  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

turn  of  events  abroad.  In  the  mean  time,  nothing  can 
be  more  consolatory,  while  there  is  a  prospect  of  so 
great  a  public  calamity  as  that  separation  would  be, 
than  the  honourable  frankness  with  which  they  have 
explained  their  opinions  to  one  another,  and  the  regret 
mutually  felt  on  account  of  this  unavoidable  disagree- 
ment. My  kind  regards  to  Mr.  Stewart  and  to  Miss 
Stewart. 

Very  aJBfectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CCXXXVIH.**    TO  MRS.  DUGALD  STEWART. 

My  dear  Mrs.  Stewart,  London,  soth  May,  i8i5. 

I  meant  to  have  sent  you  a  note  after  our  divi- 
sion, and  to  have  told  you,  while  our  gladness  was  still 
fresh,  how  well  pleased  we  all  were  and  continue  to  be 
both  with  our  strength  in  point  of  numbers,  and  with 
the  excellent  conduct  of  many  individuals.  Persons 
long  accustomed  to  parliament  look  upon  the  divisions, 
in  both  Houses,  as  large  beyond  example  at  the  com- 
mencement of  a  war,  and  such  as  promise  a  speedy  ter- 
mination of  it,  if  success  does  not  make  us  forget  the 
principle  of  our  opposition  to  it,  or  a  change  take  place 
in  the  grounds  upon  which  it  is  prosecuted.  I  place  no 
great  reliance  on  such  speculations ;  the  whole  affair  of 
war,  and  all  the  politics  connected  with  it,  being  a  mere 
chapter  of  accidents.  But  there  is  great  comfort  in  the 
fidelity  and  steadiness  of  so  many  public  men  to  their 
principles,  after  such  repeated  disappointments  of  every 
hope,  and  under  such  a  change  of  circumstances  as 
seemed  to  afford  pretexts  for  being  shabby.  It  is  vain, 
in  my  opinion,  to  consider  the  j^resent  as  any  other  than 
a  renewal  of  the  old  coalition  of  1793  against  the  objects 


2Et.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  2G3 

of  the  French  in  their  revolution  ;  it  differs  from  that 
war  only  in  this,  that  the  coalition  of  the  despots  is  more 
formidable,  and  that  the  French  are  without  the  defen- 
sive enthusiasm  arising  from  the  possession,  or  the  near 
prospect,  of  liberty.  The  success  of  the  allies  will  pro- 
bably be  fatal  to  the  freedom  of  the  world  for  an  age  to 
follow,  and  though  I  sometimes  try  to  flatter  myself 
there  are  chances  against  them,  I  cannot  consider  that 
as  the  result  of  any  reasonable  calculation  one  can  form, 
and  am  filled  therefore  with  the  most  gloomy  apprehen- 
sions. There  is  an  idle  story  in  the  streets  to-day,  of  an 
expectation  still  entertained  that  somehow  or  other  a 
settlement  will  be  made  without  hostilities;  it  is  the 
Bourbonists  who  circulate  this  speculation ;  but  it  is  no 
more  than  their  idle,  confident  interpretation  of  that 
pause  and  stillness,  which  must  last  some  time  longer, 
and  which  so  dreadfully  makes  us  sure  of  the  calamities 
that  are  coming.  The  last  account  I  have  heard  of 
Paris,  is  the  detail  of  what  passed  in  putting  arms  into 
the  hands  of  the  lower  people,  in  the  Fauxbourgs  St. 
Antoine  and  Marceau.  It  was  a  measure,  it  seems,  of 
his  own,  without  previous  concert  with  any  of  his  min- 
isters. He  set  out  alone  on  horseback  in  a  brown  coat, 
into  that  quarter  of  the  town  ;  was  very  soon  recoo-- 
nized,  and  a  cry  set  up  that  it  was  the  Emperor,  round 
whom  a  great  crowd  was  speedily  collected ;  he  dis- 
mounted, entered  into  familiar  conversation  with  the 
people,  heard  all  their  grievances ;  they  told  him  they 
wanted  bread ;  he  promised  to  find  them  employment : 
they  said  they  would  have  defended  Paris  for  him  last 
year,  if  he  had  trusted  them  with  arms ;  he  said  they 
should  have  them  now ;  a  list  of  names  was  taken  down, 
before  he  left  the  spot,  on  which  five  thousand  men 
were  enrolled.     Next  day  a  thousand  of  these  were  set 


264  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

to  work  on  the  fortifications  of  Montmartre.  If  this 
scene  was  so  acted,  of  course  there  must  have  been  pre- 
paration for  it ;  it  rests  at  present  on  the  authority  of 
Adains,  the  American  Minister. 

The  effect  of  this  movement,  so  Hke  the  Days  of  Ter- 
ror, is  said  to  have  been  very  striking ;  all  Paris  became 
silent  and  alarmed,  a  great  many  royalist  families  left  it 
next  day.  There  was  a  check  immediately  to  the 
license  of  abuse  against  the  Emperor,  in  speaking  and 
writing,  which,  from  pamphlets  and  handbills  I  have 
seen,  was  carried  to  an  incredible  excess. 

My  kind  regards  to  Mr.  and  Miss  Stewart. 

Ever  affectionately  yours. 

Era.  Horner. 


Letter   CCXXXVIILf    TO   FRANCIS  JEFFREY,  ESQ. 
My  dear  Jeffrey,  Lincoln's  inn,  2d  June,  1815. 

The  letter  I  forward  is  from  Sydney  Smith,  who 
was  in  London  for  some  weeks  lately,  and  in  better 
spirits  I  think  than  in  his  former  visit.  I  have  been 
looking  out  for  a  letter  from  you,  for  I  had  flattered 
myself,  that  your  reproach  of  too  long  silence  to  me 
implied  intentions  of  amendment  on  your  side.  But  I 
hear  you  have  been  very  busy,  and  misemploying  God's 
gifts  of  speech  in  the  defence  of  his  profligate  Scotch 
Ministers. 

I  wish  much  to  know  your  sentiments  about  this  new 
war  in  which  we  are  embarked.  You  were  so  fierce  a 
warrior  in  1803,  that  I  almost  dread  to  find  you  differing 
in  opinion  from  me  on  the  present  occasion;  which 
seems,  however,  much  more  nearly  to  resemble  the  con- 
juncture of  1793,  though  with  many  incidental  differ- 
ences too,  that  may  affect  the  success  and  result  of 
the  war. 


^T.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  265 

But  in  principle,  when  you  remove  the  specious  pre- 
texts which  the  aUies  affect  to  throw  over  their  proceed- 
ings, surely  their  object  is  substantially  to  prevent  the 
French  from  having  any  king  but  a  Bourbon,  and  from 
consolidating  the  new  institutions  and  laws  that  have 
grown  out  of  their  revolution.  An  impracticable  under- 
taking, I  believe,  in  the  end,  but  they  may  have  calami- 
tous successes  for  a  while.  My  present  terror  is  the 
conquest  of  France  by  the  combined  forces;  which 
whatever  turn  they  may  give  to  it,  must  produce  lasting 
mischief  to  the  whole  world.  Whether  it  be  the  fate  of 
that  country  to  undergo  for  some  years  a  military  occu- 
pation by  Cossacks  and  Pandours,  or  to  be  shorn  for  a 
similar  period  of  the  frontier  provinces  necessary  to  its 
defence  as  an  independent  nation.  This  appears  to  me 
at  present  the  most  probable  danger  that  threatens  the 
w^orld.  Do  n't  suppose  that  I  see  none  the  other  v^ny. 
The  renovation  of  the  French  ascendency  in  Europe 
under  such  a  military  government  as  is  forming  anew, 
w^ould  be  a  calamity  worse  than  we  felt  it  before,  for  the 
soldiers  w^ho  now  lord  it  over  the  earth  are  becomino- 

o 

every  year  more  uncivilized  and  unprincipled.  But  this 
I  feel  for  certain,  that  it  is  owing  to  our  forcing  a  war 
upon  France  in  the  present  circumstances,  that  we  are 
reduced  to  the  alternative  of  two  such  evils;  when 
perhaps  we  might  have  contrived  to  shamble  on  for  a 
few  years  of  peace  until  some  of  its  old  habits  were 
formed  again  in  all  countries,  and  the  chances  of  mor- 
tality might  have  been  improved  to  the  advantage  of 
mankind. 

Let  me  hear  what  is  doing,  or  meant  to  be  done,  about 
your  Jury  Court.  That  will  be  a  great  field  for  you. 
The  success  of  the  new  institution  must  in  a  very  great 
measure  depend  upon  the  exertions  made  by  the  bar, 

VOL.  II.  23 


266  FACTORY  CHILDREN.  [1815. 

and  upon  their  skill  in  gradually  adapting  the  Scotch 
forms  of  pleading  and  the  Scotch  rules  of  evidence  to 
this  new  procedure.  There  is  a  great  deal,  too,  to  create. 
It  must  all  be  done  by  the  bar,  and  with  so  much  genius 
and  philosophy  as  adorns  the  Parliament  House  at  pre- 
sent, it  will  be  imputable  to  your  indolence  only,  if  you 
do  not  give  the  thing  a  right  impulse  at  first,  and  lay 
those  principles  in  the  ground  which  will  insure  in  proper 
time  a  fair  and  fruitful  system. 

I  beg  to  be  kindly  remembered  to  Mrs.  Jeffrey,  and 
am  ever. 

Affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


FACTORY     CHILDREN. 

Sir  Robert  Peel  =''  called  the  attention  of  the  House, 
on  the  6th  of  June,  to  the  expediency  of  some  legisla- 
tive enactment  to  restrict  the  labour  of  children  in  fac- 
tories, and  moved  for  leave  to  bring  in  a  bill  "  to  amend 
and  extend  an  Act  made  in  the  42d  year  of  his  present 
Majesty,  for  the  preservation  of  the  health  and  morals 
of  apprentices  and  others  employed  in  cotton  and  other 
factories."  Mr.  Horner  supported  the  motion,  and 
said  — 

"That  the  former  measures,  and  even  the  present 
Bill,  as  far  as  he  could  understand  its  object,  fell  far 
short  of  what  Parliament  should  do  on  the  subject.  The 
practice  which  was  so  prevalent  of  apprenticing  parish 
children  in  distant  manufactories,  was  as  repugnant  to 
humanity  as  any  practice  which  had  ever  been  suffered 
to  exist  by  the  negligence  of  the  legislature.     These 

*  The  father  of  the  present  Prime  Minister. 


^T.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  9f,7 

cliilclren  were  sent  often  one,  two,  or  three  hundred 
miles  from  their  place  of  Ijirth,  separated  for  life  from 
all  their  relations,  and  deprived  of  the  aid  and  instruc- 
tion which,  even  in  their  humble  and  almost  destitute 
situation,  they  might  derive  from  their  friends.  The 
practice  was  altogether  objectionable  on  this  ground, 
but  even  more  so  from  the  enormous  abuses  which  had 
existed  in  it.  It  had  been  known  that,  Avith  a  bankrupt's 
effects,  a  gang,  if  he  might  use  the  word,  of  these  chil- 
dren had  been  put  up  to  sale,  and  were  advertised  pub- 
licly as  part  of  the  property.  A  most  atrocious  instance 
had  been  brought  before  the  Court  of  King's  Bench 
two  years  ago,  in  which  a  number  of  these  boys,  appren- 
ticed by  a  parish  in  London  to  one  manufacturer,  had 
been  transferred  to  another,  and  had  been  found  by 
some  benevolent  persons  in  a  state  of  absolute  famine. 
Another  case,  still  more  horrible,  had  come  to  his  knowl- 
edge, while  on  a  committee  up  stairs  —  that  not  many 
years  ago  an  agreement  had  been  made  between  a  Lon- 
don parish  and  a  Lancashire  manufacturer,  by  which  it 
was  stipulated  that,  with  every  twenty  sound  children, 
one  idiot  should  be  taken.  A  practice,  in  which  there 
was  a  possibility  that  abuses  of  this  kind  might  arise, 
should  not  be  suffered  to  exist ;  and  now,  or  in  the  next 
session,  when  the  Bill  should  be  discussed,  should  meet 
with  the  most  serious  consideration." 


Letter  CCXXXIX.     TO  FRANCIS  JEFFREY,  ESQ. 
My  dear  Jeffrey,  London,  13th  June,  1815. 

I  had  heard  of  your  accident,'''  but  concluded  it 
to  be  a  trifling  wound,  from  Murray  making  no  mention 

*  He  had  been  struck  in  tlic  eye  by  a  fii-ework,  on  the  king's  birthday.  —  Ed. 


268  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

of  it.  Your  epitaph  on  yourself  is  the  purest  specimen 
of  the  hipidary  style,  since  the  death  of  Cock  Robin. 
You  must  really  leave  off  these  very  youthful  adven- 
tures ;  at  least  do  not  be  doubly  indiscreet  by  aping  loy- 
alty as  well  as  boyhood. 

I  am  not  going  to  enter  again  into  the  argument  of 
the  war.     It  is  a  dismal  subject  to  talk  of  with  those 
whom  one  agrees  with  about  it ;  and  an  irksome  one  to 
differ  upon.     We  now  understand  one  another's  expec- 
tations and  wishes;  the  upshot  of  a  thousand  accidents 
will,  a  few  years  hence,  decide  which  was  more  nearly 
in  the  right.     But  there  is  one  point  on  which  I  would 
rather  not  be  mistaken  by  you.     You  have  an  idea  that 
I  entertain  more  admiration  and  less  of  hate  for  Bona- 
parte than  you  feel :  you  have  given  me  a  hint  of  this 
more  than  once,  though  I  do  not  know  from  what  you 
can  have  collected  it.     I  am  the  more  surprised  that  you 
should  make  such  a  mistake  about  me  in  the  particular 
instance,  for  my  notions  about  him  are   derived  very 
much  from  my  habitual  sentiments  respecting  such  per- 
sonages and  characters.     I  have  no  admiration  for  any 
military  heroes,  conceiving  it  to  be  the  least  rare  of  all 
the  varieties  of  talent ;  and  I  have  a  constitutional  aver- 
sion to  the  whole  race  of  conquerors.     I  never  felt  any 
interest  in  wars,  either  reading  of  them,  or  looking  on 
in  our  own  days,  except  on  the  side  of  the  invaded ;  and 
whether  they  be  Greeks  or  Persians,  Russians  or  French, 
my  wishes  have  always  been  in  fiivour  of  each  in  their 
turn,  for  the  success  of  their  defence.     You  may  apply 
this  at  the  present  moment  in  its  fullest  force.     Bona- 
parte never  had  any  sympathy  or  applause  from  me; 
besides  his  belonging  to  the  odious  herd  of  military  dis- 
turbers of  the  world,  his  genius  is  of  so  hard  a  cast,  and 
his  style  so  theatrical,  and  the  magnanimity  he  shows 


jEt.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  2G9 

(which  cannot  be  denied  him)  is  so  far  from  being  sim- 
ple, and  is  so  little  softened  with  moral  affections,  that  I 
never  could  find  in  him  any  of  the  elements  of  heroism, 
according  to  my  taste.     Conceive  me  to  hate  Bonaparte 
as  you  do,  but  yet  to  wish  (as  I  do  fervently)  for  a  suc- 
cessful resistance  by  France  to  the  invasion  of  the  Allies, 
and  you  are  pretty  nearly  in  possession  of  all  my  present 
politics.     Could  I  make  the  future  to  my  mind,  "  sponte 
mea  componere  curas,''  I  would  balance  the  success  of  the 
war  upon  the  frontiers  of  old  France  very  evenly,  and 
would  keep  up  the  struggle  for  power  at  Paris,  between 
Napoleon  and  the  constitutional  party.     For  that  there 
is  something  of  a  conflict  and  compromise,  at  the  present 
moment,  between  the  military  chiefs  and  the  partisans 
of  civil  liberty,  seems  undeniable ;  it  may  last  only  for 
the  moment ;  but  it  is  a  glimpse  of  better  days.     I  feel 
very  happy  at  the  distinction  conferred  on  old  Lanjuinais ; 
particularly,  if  it  be  true,  that  Bonaparte  wished  the 
presidency  to  be  given  to  that  ruffian  Merlin  de  Douay. 
Though  not  occupying  a  place  in  the  foremost  rank, 
Lanjuinais  is  found  at  every  crisis  of  the  revolution 
from  the  meeting  of  the  states-general ;  ever  moderate, 
rational,  and  intrepid.     What  an  enviable  old  age !  to 
have  entered  on  the  struggle  for  public  liberty  after 
fifty,  to  maintain  his  consistency  through  all  the  horrors 
and  all  the  disappointments  of  six-and-twenty  years,  and 
when  at  last  there  comes  another  snatch  of  sunshine,  to 
be  honoured  with   the  confidence   of  every  one  who 
thinks  France  still  capable  of  freedom. 
My  kind  compliments  to  Mrs.  Jeffrey. 

Ever  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 
23* 


270  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 


Letter  CCXXXIX*    TO  HIS  MOTHER. 

My  dear  Mother,  AVinchestcr,  4tii  July,  i8i5. 

It  seems  a  great  while  since  I  wrote  to  you,  and 
it  seems  much  longer  since  you  wrote  to  me.  You 
have  not  given  me  the  hearty  pleasure  of  a  long  letter 
from  yourself,  for  many  a  day.  I  won't  pretend  to  rival 
the  grand-children  in  your  favour  ;  for  if  that  Avere  pos- 
sible, I  would  not  steal  from  them  any  of  your  partiality, 
but  I  am  a  little  inclined  to  scold  you  for  forgetting  the 
old  solitary  lawyer.  I  left  town  yesterday  with  Adam, 
who  is  remarkably  well.  From  this  place  we  must  cross 
to  Bridgewater  for  the  sessions,  which  fall  this  time  in 
the  second  week  of  the  circuit. 

We  shall  therefore  miss  the  assizes  in  Wiltshire  and 
Dorset,  and  shall  go  from  Bridgewater  to  Exeter. 

I  was  much  concerned  to  hear  of  the  death  of  Mr. 
Feltes,  who  seemed  to  be  an  amiable  young  man.  The 
blow  to  his  family  is  one  of  the  severest  that  life  admits 
of;  the  irreparable  disappointment  of  all  the  hoj)es 
that  gave  enjoyment  to  their  prosperity.  How  many 
tragedies  of  the  same  sort  accompanying  the  triumph  of 
the  last  great  victory  !  Some  of  the  deepest  are  in  Scot- 
land. Such  as  poor  Lady  Delancy's  case.  The  person 
I  knew  best  among  those  who  have  fallen  was  Sir  Wil- 
liam Ponsonby,  one  of  the  mildest  and  gentlest  of 
human  beings ;  but  in  the  field  always  flaming  with 
enterprise.  One  of  the  last  times  I  saw  him,  and  his 
cousin  Frederick  Ponsonby,  who  is  also  mutilated,  I  fear 
for  life,  by  many  severe  wounds ;  it  was  at  a  dress 
dinner ;  they  were  both  covered  with  orders  and  medals 
won  in  the  battles  of  Spain.  Sir  William  has  left  a 
widow  and  four  daughters. 


iET.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  271 

We  have  lost  Jekyll  from  our  circuit ;  he  is  made  a 
Master  in  Chancery  by  the  Regent.  The  Chancellor 
delayed  the  appointment  in  a  manner  the  most  disagree- 
able to  Jekyll's  feelings,  and  then  wrote  him  a  very  ful- 
some letter,  full  of  the  pleasure  he  felt  in  conferring  the 
office  upon  him. 

The  Duke  of  Cumberland's  disappointment  will  give 
universal  satisfaction.     Never  was  the  value  of  "-eneral 

o 

character  so  proved.  This  conduct  of  the  House  of 
Commons  makes  an  excellent  contrast  with  their  libe- 
rality to  the  Duke  of  Wellington.  The  old  Queen  is 
said  to  have  been  as  eager  against  her  son  Ernest,  as 
any  of  us  of  the  opposition,  who  had  an  old  score  against 
him  to  pay  off*;  I  know  that  several  of  her  old  cats  from 
Windsor  were  very  busy  abusing  him  all  Saturday  and 
Sunday. 

Good  night,  my  dear  mother,  and  give  my  affectionate 
love  to  my  father  and  all  at  home. 

FflA.   HORNE'.I. 

Letter  CCXXXIX.**     TO  THE  HON.  MRS.  WILLIAM  SPENCER. 
Dear  Mrs.  Spencer,  Winchester,  7th  July,  1815. 

I  do  not  much  like  your  account  of  yourself, 
though  you  say  you  get  strength ;  for  sleep  and  eating 
are  both  necessary  strengtheners,  and  you  say  you  can 
do  neither. 

I  am  thrown  into  very  low  spirits  to-day  by  hearing 
of  Whitbread's  death ;  I  have  passed  so  much  of  the 
last  nine  years  of  my  life  near  him,  that  the  rupture  of 
this  habit  merely  would  be  painful  to  me.  But  under 
his  rough  exterior,  there  were  so  many  good  and  so 
many  great  qualities,  that  to  the  end  of  my  own  life  I 
shall  ever  retain  for  him  a  feehng  of  affection,  and  much 


272  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

reverence ;  he  had  a  manly,  large  heart,  fearless  and 
generous  and  benevolent.  There  was  an  unbred  vanity, 
that  gave  a  look  of  rudeness  to  his  virtues,  and  upon  a 
few  occasions  even  misled  him  into  conduct  that  was  not 
perfectly  to  be  approved  of  But  there  was  a  more  con- 
stant magnanimity  and  justice  in  all  his  actions,  than 
will  be  found  in  most  of  his  latter  contemporaries.  He 
had  a  genuine  admiration  of  great  merit  in  other  men, 
and  passionately  loved  his  country,  as  he  most  diligently 
served  it.  I  have  been  expecting  to  hear  of  his  death 
any  day  these  last  three  months,  though  he  was  going 
about  till  the  moment  he  expired;  but  there  were 
symptoms  that,  compared  wath  his  habit  and  make, 
seemed  to  prognosticate  apoplexy  for  certain. 

You  must  direct  your  next  letter  to  Bridgewater  j  for 
I  am  going  off  the  circuit  to  sessions.     God  bless  you. 

Faithfully  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CCXXXIX.f     TO  THE  DUKE  OF  SOMERSET. 

My  dear  Lord,  Exeter,  istb  July,  1815. 

I  am  much  obliged  to  you  for  sending  me  Glas- 
serton's  note  from  Naples. 

I  knew  enough  of  Mr.  Whitbread  to  respect  him  and 
feel  attached  to  him,  in  spite  of  his  faults  of  manner ; 
and  I  regard  his  loss  in  the  House  of  Commons  as  a  very 
serious  diminution  of  the  public  strength.  He  was  a 
man  of  intrepid  justice  and  constancy  as  a  member  of 
parliament ;  and  no  one  ever  loved  his  country  more 
cordially,  or  more  prided  himself  in  all  its  honours  and 
glories.  He  was  not  qualified  in  any  respect  to  be  a 
jDolitical  leader,  and  he  was  very  far  from  being  well 
informed  either  upon  the  foreign  concerns  of  the  coun- 


iET.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  273 

try,  or  thoroughly  enlightened  in  the  principles  of  do- 
mestic legislation.  But  as  a  single  independent  com- 
moner, and  a  watchful  guardian  of  constitutional  rights 
for  the  people,  he  displayed,  for  many  years,  a  force  of 
character  as  well  as  talent,  that,  in  the  present  dearth  of 
men  of  genius  or  ascendency  in  parliament,  made  him 
the  most  conspicuous  and  the  most  usefid  man  of  his 
time.  He  cannot  be  viewed,  properly  speaking,  as  a 
statesman ;  but  he  was  the  very  model  of  that  sort  of 
public  man,  bred  in  the  House  of  Commons,  and  the 
native  growth  of  that  soil,  whose  proper  function  is  to 
keep  our  statesmen  to  their  duty. 

No  doubt  is  left  as  to  the  nature  of  the  disease  which 
led  to  his  death.  Some  of  those  who  lived  intimately 
with  him,  now  recall  various  instances  that  recently 
occurred  in  his  conduct  of  a  momentary  aberration  of 
mind  ;  and  since  the  examination  of  the  head,  I  under- 
stand the  medical  people  have  pronounced,  that  he 
must  have  been  soon  in  violent  phrenzy. 

I  wished  much  to  have  been  able  to  offer  you  a  visit 
at  Bulstrode  before  the  circuit,  but  till  the  day  I  left 
London  I  was  completely  occupied.  In  the  course  of 
next  month,  I  look  forward  to  it  with  much  pleasure. 

I  beg  to  be  remembered  to  the  Duchess,  and  am  ever. 
My  dear  Lord, 

Your  Grace's  faithful  servant, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CCXL.     TO  HENRY  IIALLAM,  ESQ. 
My  dear  Hallam,  Exeter,  Saturday,  22d  July,  1815. 

I  am  very  much  afflicted  to  hear  of  Rose  *  hav- 
ing had  so  serious  an  attack  upon  his  feeble  constitution. 

*  William  Stewart  Rose,  Esq. 


274  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

If  you  hear  any  farther  account  of  him  before  I  return 
to  town,  I  wish  much  to  know  it. 

I  thank  you  very  much,  and  Sir  Abraham  Elton  too, 
for  your  kind  inquiries  after  my  heahh.  It  gave  me 
much  regret  at  Bridgewater,  that  I  was  forced  to  be  so 
neglectful  of  the  attentions  which  I  owed  him  on  that 
occasion.  But  I  w^as  much  incommoded  then,  and  have 
been  since  I  left  town,  by  an  attack  of  a  complaint  to 
which  I  have  been  subject  of  late,  and  which  is  more  an 
inconvenient  illness  than  a  serious  one  at  present.  I 
have  been  induced  to  stop  here,  instead  of  going  with 
the  circuit  into  Cornwall,  in  hopes  of  being  made  well 
by  a  week's  repose.  I  am  certainly  better  already,  than 
I  was  at  Bridgewater. 

The  event  that  has  most  agitated  me  since  I  parted 
from  you,  is  the  death  of  Whitbread,  which  you  men- 
tioned with  sentiments  that  gave  me  a  real  pleasure  ;  for 
I  shall  ever  respect  his  memory,  and  with  something  like 
aflfection  too,  for  the  large  portion  of  my  life  which,  in  a 
certain  sense,  I  consider  as  having  been  passed  with  him, 
and  for  the  impression  he  had  made  upon  me  of  his 
being  one  of  the  most  just,  upright,  and  intrepid  of  pub- 
lic men.  As  a  statesman,  I  never  regarded  him  at  all ; 
he  had  no  knowledge  of  men  or  affairs,  to  fit  him  for 
administration;  his  education  had  been  very  limited, 
and  its  defects  were  not  supplied  by  any  experience  of 
real  political  business :  but  he  must  always  stand  high  in 
the  list  of  that  class  of  public  men,  the  peculiar  growth 
of  England  and  of  the  House  of  Commons,  wdio  perform 
great  services  to  their  country,  and  hold  a  considerable 
place  in  the  sight  of  the  world,  by  fearlessly  expressing 
in  that  assembly  the  censure  that  is  felt  by  the  public, 
and  by  being  as  it  were  the  organ  of  that  public  opinion 
which,  in  some  measure,  keeps  our  statesmen  to  their 


^T.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  275 

duty.  His  force  of  character  and  ability,  seconded  ]jy 
his  singular  activity,  had,  in  the  present  absence  of  all 
men  of  genius  and  ascendency  from  the  House,  given 
him  a  preeminence,  which  almost  marks  the  last  years 
of  Parliament  with  the  stamp  of  his  peculiar  manner. 
His  loss  will  lead  to  a  change  of  this :  in  all  points  of 
taste  and  ornament,  and  in  the  skill  too  and  prudence  of 
debate,  the  change  may  probably  be  for  the  better ;  but 
it  will  be  long,  before  the  people  and  the  constitution 
are  supplied  in  the  House  of  Commons  with  a  tribune 
of  the  same  vigilance,  assiduity,  perseverance  and 
courage,  as  Samuel  Whitbread.  The  manner  of  his 
death  quite  overwhelmed  me,  I  could  think  of  nothing 
else  for  days  together ;  nor  do  I  remember,  in  our  own 
time,  another  catastrophe  so  morally  impressive,  as  the 
instantaneous  failure  of  all  that  constancy,  and  rectitude, 
and  inflexibility  of  mind,  which  seemed  possessions  that 
could  be  lost  only  with  life ;  yet  all  the  while  there  was 
a  speck  morbid  in  the  body,  which  rendered  them  as 
precarious  as  life  itself 

Pray  give  me  your  speculations  upon  the  present 
state  of  France,  so  problematical,  so  pregnant  with  future 
consequences.  For  you  always  improve  and  correct  my 
judgments,  even  when  we  differ  most  widely ;  though 
we  do  not  agree  about  immediate  means,  nor  in  some 
respects  about  the  principles  w^hich  we  like  to  see  in 
action,  the  thing  we  both  wish  for,  in  the  end,  is  the 
same;  that  well-ordered  liberty,  wdiicli  gives  the  best 
chance  for  general  tranquillity,  and  the  only  chance  for 
national  welfare.  It  is  evident  the  present  state  of 
things  cannot  be  lasting ;  the  occupation  of  such  a  coun- 
try as  France  by  foreign  troops.  They  may  be  kept 
there  long  enough  to  devastate  the  surface  of  the  terri- 
tory, and  to  keep  the  Bou.bons  a  few  years  nominally 


276  CORRESrONDENCE.  [1815. 

upon  the  throne.  But  do  you  believe  it  practicable  for 
the  Allies  to  accomplish  the  restoration  of  that  family, 
and  then  to  leave  them  to  carry  on  the  government 
with  French  hands  and  French  guards  ?  or,  on  the  other 
hand,  do  you  consider  it  as  practicable  for  the  French  to 
be  permanently  subjugated  by  the  foreign  soldiery  ?  It 
may  be  a  long  while  before  the  peasantry,  and  the 
townsmen,  betake  themselves  to  assassination  in  detail ; 
but  to  that  horrible  extremity  I  think  it  must  come  at 
last,  if  the  Prussians  and  Russians  remain.  The  geogra- 
phy of  France  is  not  very  advantageous  for  guerillas,  but 
there  are  other  advantages  in  the  habits  of  the  people, 
from  their  discipline  and  docility.  Depraved  as  the 
French  are,  the  reaction  of  French  patriotism  will  be 
dreadful  and  resistless.  And  I  must  own  that  my  Avishes 
are  decidedly  for  the  deliverance  of  that  country,  by 
the  exertions  of  its  own  people,  from  the  conquest  of 
their  invaders.  I  am  conscious  that  I  can  honestly  and 
purely  cherish  this  wish,  without  abating  a  jot  of  that 
wholesome  distrust  of  France  which  we  must  always 
keep  up,  as  our  enemy  in  Europe ;  but  along  with  this 
distrust,  I  retain  also  so  much  of  the  notions  of  the  old 
school,  as  to  feel  persuaded  that  France,  as  a  separate 
country,  is  an  essential  member  of  the  European  system. 
But  how  idle  it  is  to  speculate,  when  the  fate  of  the 
world  is  in  the  hands  of  Metternich  and  Castlereagh. 

I  hope  Mrs.  Hallam  is  now  quite  recovered,  and  that 
the  children  are  in  great  vigour.  Let  me  hear  from  you 
very  soon. 

Truly  yours, 

Fra.  Hornek. 


iET.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  277 


Letter  CCXL.*    TO  HIS  MOTHER. 

My  decar  Mother,  ^-^^t^'"'  23<i  J^lv,  i8i5. 

I  am  much  concerned  to  hear  that  by  the  death 
of  Mr.  G.,  his  wife  is  left  in  a  very  destitute  situation 
with  several  children,  and  I  wish  you  to  enable  me, 
through  yourself,  to  contribute  a  little  to  her  present 
assistance.  I  can  easily  and  with  very  sincere  pleasure 
give  £20  a  year  for  this  purpose,  if  you  will  undertake 
to  manage  the  giving  of  it  in  such  a  way  as  will  be  least 
disagreeable  to  her  feelings.  But  I  must  make  one  con- 
dition about  it,  and  that  positively,  that  you  say  nothing 
about  me  in  the  matter,  but  give  it  entirely  from  your- 
self I  know  how  much  satisfaction  you  derive  from 
any  opportunity  of  being  kind  and  attentive  to  any  one 
connected  with  you,  and  it  is  for  the  sake  of  putting  an 
additional  satisfaction  of  that  sort  in  your  way,  that  I 
wish  to  make  this  arrangement,  not  but  what  I  would 
feel  myself  bound  to  do  the  little  I  could  at  any  time 
for  any  of  Mrs.  G.'s  family,  who  have  always  shown  so 
much  worth  and  propriety  in  their  conduct.  You  must, 
however,  let  me  do  this  for  the  present  in  my  own  mode, 
as  it  may  be  convenient  to  the  poor  lady  to  have  some- 
thing immediately.  I  enclose  two  £10  notes  of  the 
Bank  of  England.  My  kind  love  to  my  father,  and 
every  body  in  Charlotte  Square,  and  at  Whitehouse. 

Yours  most  affectionately, 

Fra.  Horner. 


VOL.  II.  24 


278  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 


Letter  CCXLI.    FROM  HENRY  HALLAIkl,  ESQ. 
My  dear  Horner,  ^^^l?  Office,  26th  July,  i8i5. 

Since  I  last  wrote  to  you,  I  have  seen  Mrs.  Spen- 
cer two  or  three  times,  and  think  she  is  better  than  I- 
expected  to  find.  The  long  continuance  of  her  illness 
is  certainly  alarming,  but  I  wish  to  hope  that  she  may 
finally  weather  it.  I  have  heard  more  of  Rose  since  I 
wrote  to  you  last.  The  accounts  are  certainly  as  favour- 
able as  could  well  be  hoped ;  and  his  family  entertain  a 
hope,  on  the  authority  of  his  physician,  that  the  seizure 
has  not  been  paralytic.  However  this  may  prove,  I 
hope  it  has  not  proceeded  from  constitutional  failure. 

It  is  very  difficult  to  form  any  speculations  upon  the 
state  of  affairs  in  France.  I  never  remember  any  poli- 
tical crisis  where  there  was  so  little  to  guide  our  antici- 
pations. It  is  a  very  thick  fog  indeed.  What  can  be 
more  wonderful,  than  that  the  actual  capture  of  Bona- 
parte, an  event  beyond  all  calculation,  and  which 
seemed  the  consummation  of  the  present  contest,  should 
not  raise  our  stocks,  and  hardly  our  spirits  ?  The  real 
difficulties  arising  out  of  this  extraordinary  crisis  are  not 
much  applams  by  possessing  his  person ;  though  it  is 
certainly  an  important  event,  if  it  were  only  as  it  sim- 
plifies the  course  we  ought  to  pursue. 

It  is  always  with  diffidence,  as  well  as  with  regret,  that 
I  differ  from  you,  as  we  sometimes  do  differ,  in  my  poli- 
tical theories ;  and  I  should  feel  this  sentiment  still  more 
strongly,  if  I  did  not  think  that  our  disagreement  was 
generally  more  owing  to  different  opinions  as  to  matters 
of  fact,  than  to  any  thing  incompatible  in  the  bases  we 
should  adopt.  You  only  do  me  justice  in  supposing 
that  we  are  united  in  desiring  the  prevalence  of  well- 


JEt.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  270 

ordered  liberty.  I  am  sure  that  I  have  no  jealousy  of 
this  liberty  in  France,  nor  any  undue  prejudice  against 
that  people.  On  the  contrary,  from  the  circumstance 
of  my  reading  having  lain  a  good  deal  in  French  history 
and  literature,  I  have  acquired  a  sort  of  partiality  to 
them,  which  makes  me  ready  to  forgive  their  great  na- 
tional faults.  But  I  certainly  have  formed  an  opinion, 
that  France  has  a  better  chance  for  tranquillity  and 
permanence  of  government,  and  consequently  for  lib- 
erty, which  never  survives  a  series  of  incessant  revolu- 
tions, under  the  Bourbon  dynasty,  than  under  any  other 
dominion,  which,  in  her  present  circumstances,  was  likely 
to  arise.  The  strong  and  general  desire  for  a  liberal 
government,  and  aversion  to  the  ancient  absolute  mon- 
archy, made  it,  in  my  judgment,  very  unlikely  that  the 
court  of  Louis  XVIII.  or  his  successors  could,  for  many 
years  to  come,  materially  infringe  upon  those  privileges, 
which,  as  conceded  in  the  charter  of  1814,  appeared  to 
be  sufficiently  ample  for  the  public  welfare ;  and  I  saw 
a  great  advantage  in  adhering  to  the  ancient  family, 
and,  as  far  as  possible,  to  the  ancient  denominations  and 
forms.  As,  in  England,  at  the  Revolution,  it  was  abso- 
lutely necessary  for  our  liberties  to  change  the  reigning 
family,  because  the  national  prejudices  ran  very  strongly 
towards  passive  obedience  and  hereditary  right;  so  I 
think  it  equally  necessary,  for  the  sake  of  permanent 
established  government,  and,  consequently,  of  liberty  in 
France,  to  preserve  the  hereditary  title  of  her  sovereign, 
because  all  those  principles  and  sentiments  which  tend  to 
the  maintenance  of  actual  establishments  require  to  be 
strengthened.  The  moral  securities  of  government  are 
strict  religious  principles  of  obligation,  sober  and  steady 
habits  in  domestic  life,  and  the  point  of  honour  in  keep- 
ing promises.     All  these  are  miserably  weak  in  France ; 


280  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

and  I  see  no  means  so  likely  to  restore  them,  as  the 
habit  of  paying  obedience  to  government  as  legitimate, 
and  even  as  prescriptive.  Though  the  prejudices  of  one 
party,  and  the  adulatory  spirit  of  the  people,  may  some- 
times occasion  a  language  to  be  spoken,  repugnant  to 
our  Whig  principles,  yet,  as  France  is,  and  must  be, 
there  would  be,  I  think,  little  or  no  probability  of  an  abso- 
lute power  being  established  in  the  person  of  a  Bourbon. 
These  w^ere  my  reasonings  in  last  spring.  What 
France  may  think,  is  quite  another  question.  I  have 
not  space  to  enter  on  the  vast  topic  before  us.  But  I 
concur  with  you  (though  we  stand  nearly  alone)  in  de- 
precating the  dismemberment  of  that  country ;  not  only 
from  its  ultimate  effects  on  Europe,  but  as  the  certain 
spring  of  new  and  more  dreadful  struggles.  I  do  not 
much  expect  that  any  such  event  will  happen.  Russia, 
I  now  hear,  and  always  expected,  is  taking  a  mediatorial 
line.  She  could  gain  nothing,  except  by  arrangements 
on  the  side  of  Poland,  to  which  the  other  two  230wers 
would  hardly  consent,  for  the  sake  of  precarious  acqui- 
sitions in  Alsace.  We  go  to-morrow  to  East  Bourne. 
Let  me  hear  from  you  there. 

Faithfully  yours, 

Henry  Hallam. 


Letter  CCXLL*    FROM  HIS  MOTHER. 
My  dearest  Frank,        White  House,  Edinburgh,  28th  July,  1815. 

I  have  this  moment  had  the  very  great  comfort  of 
receiving  a  letter  from  you.  As  your  father  and  I  have 
been  rather  uneasy  from  a  letter  Anne  received  from 
Leonard,  wherein  he  mentioned  your  having  been  un- 
well, but  at  the  same  time  said  that  you  were  better, 
your  father  wrote  to  you  yesterday,  and  although  not  a 


JEt.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  281 

post  day,  the  good  man  at  the  post-office  said  that  they 
would  forward  it.  Mr.  Ker  is  up  to  every  thing  good 
and  benevolent.  Now,  my  beloved  son,  let  me  return 
you  my  most  hearty  thanks  for  your  own  well-timed 
friendship,  and  may  I  be  thankful  to  Heaven  for  allow- 
ing me  to  be  your  mother.  I  am  infinitely  more  grati- 
fied than  if  you  were  raised  to  the  highest  office  in  the 
state, — there  you  are  liablp  to  trouble  and  change, — 
in  your  kindness  to  the  widow  and  the  orphan  you  have, 
and  must  have,  an  inward  satisfaction  far  beyond  any 
the  other  can  bestow,  and  here  your  pleasure  must  be 
permanent.  May  God  Almighty  bless  you,  and  preserve 
you  as  a  blessing  to  all  your  family ;  you  are  considered 
as  such  by  every  member,  and  beloved  with  the  most 
ardent  affection. 

The  £20,  which  came  quite  safe,  I  shall  not  fail  to 
give  it  in  a  way  that  I  am  bound  to  observe ;  at  the 
same  time,  the  person  it  is  designed  for  is  so  deserving, 
that  I  think  it  a  pity  she  should  not  know  from  whence 
it  comes.  But  as  to  your  fixing  any  annuity,  I  am 
against  it, —  every  day  convinces  me  how  many  changes 
take  place,  and  how  different  people  conduct  themselves 
in  these  changes.  Pray  write  and  say  how  you  are.  By 
a  kind  note  I  had  from  Lord  Webb  Seymour  with  some 
fruit,  he  told  me  he  had  a  letter  from  you  of  the  17th; 
but  ease  my  mind.  We  all  look  forward  to  your  visit 
to  Scotland  with  delight.  How  I  long  to  see  my  darling 
—  every  one  does  so.  God  bless  you.  Your  father 
and  Anne  unite,  in  every  wish. 

To  your  truly  affectionate  mother, 

Joanna  Horner. 


24* 


282  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 


Letter  CCXLII.     TO  HIS  MOTHER. 
My  dear  Mother,  Bridgewater,  29th  July,  1815. 

I  have  received  all  your  kind  letters  of  anxiety 
and  reproach  about  my  not  writing,  but  before  I  got  the 
first  of  them,  two  were  already  dispatched  from  me,  one 
of  which  was  written  the  very  hour  I  heard  from  you, 
after  your  long  silence. 

I  was  within  a  very  few  miles,  at  Exeter,  of  Bona- 
parte in  Torbay ;  a  number  of  people  went  down  to 
get  a  glimpse  of  him,  and  all  the  worthies  of  Torquay, 
and  the  other  watering-places,  went  out  in  shoals. 
Nobody  was  allowed  to  go  on  board;  but  they  were 
happy  to  row  round  the  ship  at  a  little  distance,  and 
catch  a  sight  of  him  as  he  walked  the  quarter-deck. 
How  little  did  we  dream  of  the  possibility  of  such  a 
change,  when  we  were  at  Torquay  ;  he  was  then  in  the 
midst  of  his  plans  and  preparations  for  the  invasion  of 
Russia,  the  most  wonderful  of  all  his  exploits  after  all, 
though  it  led  directly  to  his  fall.  The  only  thing  worth 
noticing  of  what  I  have  heard  respecting  his  behaviour 
on  board  the  Bellerophon  is,  that  he  never  made  any 
allusion  to  political  events. 

You  will  believe  I  am  much  pleased  with  your  ac- 
counts of  Whitehouse*,  and  Anne  and  the  children,  and 
the  happy  time  you  and  my  father  have  been  spending 
with  them.  You  cannot  be  too  minute  or  too  frequent 
in  such  accounts,  when  you  have  leisure  to  report  them 
to  me  at  full  length. 

I  was  in  hopes  when  I  began  this  letter  that  I  should 
have  time  to  write  to  Fanny  at  least,  if  not  to  others  of 

*  IVIy  own  residence  near  Edinburgh,  to  which  I  had  recently  removed 
from  London.  —  Ed. 


iET.  37.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  283 

the  family,  to  all  of  whom  I  am  in  debt.  But  I  must 
still  put  off  payment,  for  I  have  some  work  to  do.  By 
way  of  compensation  and  a  great  deal  more,  I  will  en- 
close for  you  and  them  a  letter  to  peruse,  which  you 
will  particularly  like,  as  it  is  full  of  horrors ;  it  is  from 
Charles  Bell,  giving  me  some  account  of  his  visit  to 
Brussels,  where  he  had  the  spirit  to  go  for  professional 
instruction,  among  the  wounded,  after  the  battle  of 
Waterloo.  It  is  written  with  great  feeling,  and  with 
much  genius,  too,  for  observation,  under  the  most 
overwhelming  circumstances.  Send  it  to  me  again  with 
great  care,  for  I  should  be  sorry  to  lose  it.  My  kind 
remembrances  to  my  father  and  the  ivhole  tot. 

Ever  most  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CCXLIII.    FROM  CHARLES  BELL,  ESQ.* 

My  dear  Horner,  'Jub'.  i8i5. 

I  write  this  to  you,  after  being  some  days  at 
home,  engaged  in  my  usual  occupations,  and  conse- 
quently disenchanted  of  the  horrors  of  the  battle  of 
Waterloo.  I  feel  relief  in  this,  for  certainly  if  I  had 
written  to  you  from  Brussels,  I  should  have  appeared 
very  extravagant.  An  absolute  revolution  took  j)liice 
in  my  economy,  body  and  soul ;  so  that  I  who  am  known 
to  require  eight  hours  sleep,  found  first  three  hours, 
and  then  one  hour  and  a  half  sufficient,  after  days  of 
the  most  painful  excitement  and  bodily  exertion. 

After  I  had  been  five  days  engaged  with  the  prosecu- 
tion of  my  object,  I  found  that  the  best  cases,  that  is, 
the  most  horrid  wounds  left  totally  without  assistance, 

*  The  late  eminent  anatomist,  Sir  Charles  Bell. 


284  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

were  to  be  found  in  the  hospital  of  the  French  woimded. 
This  hospital  was  only  forming ;  they  were  even  then 
bringing  these  poor  creatures  in  from  the  woods.  It  is 
impossible  to  convey  to  you  the  picture  of  human  misery 
continually  before  my  eyes.  What  was  heartrending  in 
the  day,  Avas  intolerable  at  night ;  and  I  rose  and  wrote, 
at  four  o'clock  in  the  morning,  to  the  chief  surgeon 
Gunning,  offering  to  perform  the  necessary  operations 
upon  the  French.  At  six  o'clock  I  took  the  knife  in  my 
hand,  and  continued  incessantly  at  work  till  seven  in  the 
evening ;  and  so  the  second  day,  and  again  the  third 
day. 

All  the  decencies  of  performing  surgical  operations 
were  soon  neglected :  while  I  amputated  one  man's  thigh, 
there  lay  at  one  time  thirteen,  all  beseeching  to  be 
taken  next ;  one  full  of  entreaty,  one  calling  upon  me 
to  remember  my  promise  to  take  him,  another  execrat- 
ing. It  was  a  strange  thing  to  feel  my  clothes  stiff  with 
blood,  and  my  arms  powerless  with  the  exertion  of  using 
the  knife  ;  and  more  extraordinary  still,  to  find  my  mind 
calm  amidst  such  variety  of  suffering ;  but  to  give  one 
of  these  objects  access  to  your  feelings  was  to  allow 
yourself  to  be  unmanned  for  the  performance  of  a  duty. 
It  was  less  painful  to  look  upon  the  whole,  than  to  con- 
template one  object. 

When  I  first  went  round  the  wards  of  the  wounded 
prisoners,  my  sensations  were  very  extraordinary.  We 
had  every  where  heard  of  the  manner  in  which  these 
men  had  fought  —  nothing  could  surjDass  their  devoted- 
ness.  In  a  long  ward,  containing  fift}^,  there  was  no 
expression  of  suffering,  no  one  spoke  to  his  neighbour. 
There  was  a  resentful,  sullen  rigidness  of  face,  a  fierce- 
ness in  their  dark  eyes,  as  they  lay  half-covered  in  the 
sheets. 


^T.  38.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  285 

Sunday.  —  I  was  interrupted,  and  now  I  perceive  I 
was  falling  into  the  mistake  of  attempting  to  convey  to 
you  the  feelings  which  took  possession  of  me,  amidst  the 
miseries  of  Brussels.  After  being  eight  days  among  the 
wounded,  I  visited  the  field  of  battle.  The  view  of  the 
field,  the  gallant  stories,  the  charges,  the  individual 
instances  of  enterprise  and  valour,  recalled  me  to  the 
sense  which  the  world  has  of  victory  and  ^yaterloo. 
But  this  was  transient,  a  gloomy  uncomfortable  view  of 
human  nature  is  the  inevitable  consequence  of  looking 
upon  the  whole  as  I  did  —  as  I  was  forced  to  do. 

It  is  a  misfortune  to  have  our  sentiments  so  at  vari- 
ance with  the  universal  sentiment.  But  there  must  ever 
be  associated  with  the  honours  of  Waterloo,  to  my  eyes, 
the  most  shocking  signs  of  woe ;  to  my  ear,  accents  of 
entreaty;  outcry  from  the  manly  breast,  interrupted 
forcible  expressions  of  the  dying,  and  noisome  smells.  I 
must  show  you  my  note  books,  for  as  I  took  my  notes 
of  cases  generally  by  sketching  the  object  of  our 
remarks,  it  may  convey  an  excuse  for  this  excess  of 
sentiment. 

Faithfully  yours, 

C.  Bell. 


Letter  CCXLIII.*     TO  HIS  MOTHER. 

My  dear  Mother,  Ho  wick,  iiih  October,  isis. 

You  will  have  heard  from  my  two  companions 
how  we  proceeded  on  Monday.  By  Murray's  care  and 
contrivance,  instead  of  a  head-achy  postchaise  all  the 
way  to  Hermiston,  we  had  horses  to  mount  at  Dalkeith, 
and  made  a  fine  ride  of  it  first  to  Oxenford,  and  then  by 
way  of  Ormiston  and  Saltoun  to  Lord  Gillies's.     Oxen- 


286  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

ford  is  a  comfortable  handsome  place,  with  almost  an 
English  look;  among  the  rubbish  of  family  pictures, 
there  are  some  portraits  of  people  that  deserve  to  be 
cared  for — such  as  Dr.  Robertson,  Adam  Ferguson,  and 
Sir  James  Stewart.  There  is  a  sign-post  image  of  David 
Hume,  which  gives  the  idea  of  a  glutton  and  a  blun- 
derer. We  found  the  Dalrymples  were  going  to  Her- 
miston  likewise.  In  the  v^ay,  besides  Ormiston,  Avhere 
we  saw  some  fine  trees  for  Scotland,  I  had  a  glimpse  of 
other  places  I  had  often  heard  of,  such  as  Winton,  Pen- 
caitland,  &c.  The  Gillies's  were  very  agreeable ;  they 
have  improved  each  other  much.  There  are  some  old 
portraits  in  that  house  too,  of  the  connections  of  the 
Sinclair  family ;  the  only  one  worth  naming  is  a  head  of 
Mrs.  Grizell  Baillie,  the  daughter  of  Sir  Patrick  Home, 
whose  story  is  so  interesting  and  amiable.  On  Monday 
forenoon,  we  went  out  in  a  body,  ladies  and  all,  with 
greyhounds,  and  had  what  is  called  a  good  day's  sport, 
in  slaughtering  eight  or  ten  hares,  and  frightening  as 
many  more.  After  that  we  walked  over  the  grounds 
at  Saltoun,  and  went  through  the  house ;  we  had  not 
leisure  to  examine  the  library  in  which  old  Andrew 
Fletcher's  books  are  preserved,  many  of  them  (it  is  said) 
with  notes  of  his.  There  is  a  picture  of  him,  which 
interested  us  greatly ;  it  is  a  countenance  of  keen  and 
refined  feeling,  not  without  effeminacy.  I  have  thoughts 
of  asking  permission  to  have  a  copy  of  it.  With  all  his 
faults,  he  had  an  elevation  and  purity  of  character, 
rarely  if  at  all  to  be  found  in  any  other  Scotsman  of  any 
age  who  has  meddled  with  politics.  Lord  Gillies  gave 
me  his  carriage  early  next  morning  to  go  to  Hadding- 
ton, and  Murray  went  with  me ;  we  got  there  in  time 
for  me  to  take  breakfast  before  the  vehicle  from  Edin- 


^T.  38.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  287 

burgh  arrived,  which  gave  me  the  pleasure  afterwards 
of  a  good  long  walk  from  Dunbar,  Avhile  the  other  tra- 
vellers halted.  I  was  set  down  at  Alnwick  by  six  o'clock, 
in  good  time  to  reach  this  [town],  which  is  not  more  than 
six  miles  off.  I  was  glad  to  see  Lady  Grey  in  better  looks 
than  I  expected  j  she  is  a  great  object  of  my  admiration, 
for  her  beauty,  and  still  more  for  her  character.  I  shall 
stay  here  till  to-morrow  evening;  by  sleeping  at  Aln- 
wick, I  expect  to  have  a  good  chance  of  a  seat  in  the 
mail  on  Friday  morning. 

I  have  heard  at  full  length  and  in  the  original  lan- 
guage the  old  Queen's  letter,  of  which  some  account  has 
been  given  in  the  Chronicle,  published  there  probably 
b}^  her  dutiful  and  pious  son  the  Duke  of  Cumberland. 
It  is  the  letter  of  one  most  seriously  expecting  and 
encouraging  the  person  to  whom  it  is  addressed,  to  come 
over  into  England,  with  a  great  deal  of  advice  how  she 
ought  to  conduct  herself  and  conform  to  the  manners  of 
this  country.  It  is  very  hard  for  us  to  say  how  far  royal 
dissimulation  and  artifice  may  be  carried ;  but  I  can  as 
little  understand  how  the  Queen  could  disapprove  of  the 
marriage  at  the  time  she  wrote  this  letter,  as  how  she 
can  justify  the  inconsistency  of  the  sentiments  expressed 
in  it,  with  her  subsequent  conduct  to  her  daughter-in- 
law.  It  would  have  been  difficult  too,  to  conceive  how 
far  thrift  could  be  carried  in  the  royal  house  of  Strelitz ; 
her  present  to  her  brother  is  six  pounds  of  tea,  and  two 
cheeses. 

Lord  Ossulston  is  the  only  visitor  here.  We  have  had 
a  walk  with  Lord  Grey  round  the  pleasure  grounds,  and 
along  the  sea-shore,  which  is  bold,  and  I  am  now  going 
to  have  a  ride  to  an  old  castle  of  the  Tankerville  family, 
called  Dunstanbury,  which  made  a  figure  in  the  Wars  of 
the  Koses. 


288  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

My  kind  love  to  all  the  two  houses  of  Charlotte  Square 
and  Whiteliouse. 

Most  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CCXLIH.**    TO  J.  A.  MURRAY. 
Mv  dear  Murray  Taunton,  20th  October,  1815. 

If  I  find  the  Culloden  papers  at  Bowood  I  will 
read  them,  and  mention  to  you  whatever  strikes  me. 
The  favourable  impression  you  have  received  from  them 
of  Forbes's*  character  is  a  very  pleasing  one,  and  I 
hope  you  will  meet  with  nothing  to  disturb  it.  There 
are  so  few  instances  of  pure  or  elevated  public  virtue  to 
be  met  wdth  in  the  modern  annals  of  Scotland,  that  it 
w^ould  be  something  gained  for  the  country  to  place  him 
in  that  light.  It  is  a  very  rare  distinction  to  have  first 
purified  the  administration  of  justice  in  his  country,  and 
one  would  expect  to  find  corresponding  sentiments 
throughout  his  conduct.  That  union  of  zeal  and  gen- 
tleness w^hich  you  speak  of,  is  the  most  delightful  excel- 
lence to  find  in  the  course  of  an  active  practical  life.  It 
w^ould  be  right  to  apprize  Mackintosh  of  there  being 
papers  at  Yester,  to  which  he  could  find  no  difficulty  in 
getting  access.  Did  Thomson  find  any  thing  at  Saltoun 
that  morning?  I  hope  Mrs.  Murray  continues  well. 
Give  my  very  kind  remembrances  to  her  and  Miss  Mur- 
ray, as  well  as  to  William. 

Affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Hornee. 

*  Lord  President  of  the  Court  of  Session  in  Scotland,  from  1737  to  1747. 


^T.  38.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  289 


Letter   CCXLIV.    TO  HIS  SISTER,  MISS  HORNER. 
My  dear  Fanny,  Bowoo.i,  2Gth  Oct.  181.5. 

I  told  you  I  was  reading  Don  Roderick  the  Goth ; 
and  notwithstanding  the  romance  of  the  original  story, 
it  was  with  fatigue  that  I  got  through  it.  I  am  not  sur- 
prised that  the  book  has  had  a  run,  because  there  is  a 
romantic  story,  and  because  it  is  seasoned  with  metho- 
distical  cant  to  the  taste  of  the  times ;  but  that  the  work 
should  be  commended  by  any  person  of  cultivated  taste, 
as  it  has  been,  seems  to  me  strange.  With  the  excep- 
tion of  a  few  passages  of  mere  description,  I  found  none 
containing  much  poetry;  and  such  as  there  is,  little 
more  than  a  string  of  the  images  and  expressions  that 
are  familiar  to  every  reader  of  the  poets. 

I  found  lying  here  a  new  tragedy  with  the  title  of  Fazio^ 
written  by  Mr.  Milman,  son  of  the  London  physician. 
It  is  worth  your  reading.  Though  full  of  great  and 
oljvious  faults,  they  are  those  of  a  young  writer,  who 
has  not  studied  the  decorums  and  contrivances  of  his  art ; 
and  in  spite  of  them  the  composition  affects  you  strongly, 
which  is  the  one  thing  needful :  there  is  a  power  of 
writing,  and  still  more  a  depth  of  feeling,  which  with 
good  discipline  may  make  him  a  great  dramatic  writer. 
I  hope  he  will  receive  encouragement  from  the  reviews. 
He  is  said  to  have  offered  this  play  to  Miss  O'Neil  for 
her  benefit,  and  there  is  a  character  in  it  that  would 
have  suited  her  ;  but  she  said  very  sensibly,  that  she  did 
not  feel  herself  sufficiently  established  with  the  audience, 
to  venture  upon  a  new  piece.  In  its  present  state,  I  do 
not  imagine  it  would  have  success  upon  the  stage.  Sneyd 
Edgeworth,  whom  you  remember  in  London,  has  pub- 
lished memoirs  of  the  Abbe  Edgeworth,  the  confessor 

VOL.  II.  25 


290  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

of  Madame  Elizabeth,  who  attended  Louis  XVI.  in  his 
last  moments.  A  short  narrative  by  the  Abbe  himself 
of  what  passed  at  the  Temple,  and  still  more  a  letter 
upon  that  subject,  and  upon  his  own  escapes,  addressed 
to  a  brother  in  Ireland,  are  written  with  a  simplicity  and 
truth  of  manner  that  is  interesting^  and  deliorhtful. 

The  Romillys  are  expected  at  home  this  week.  They 
have  been  as  far  as  Genoa,  and  Dumont  accompanied 
them.  His  spectacles  were  swept  away  by  an  Alpine 
torrent  in  the  Bochetta, 

Ever  yours  affectionately. 

Era.  Horner. 


Lktter  CCXLIV.*    to  EARL  GREY. 
Dear  Lord  Grey,  Bowood,  27th  October,  1815. 

I  am  so  much  gratified  with  the  pohtical  con- 
duct of  a  friend  of  mine,  of  which  you  are  not  likely  to 
hear  immediately,  that  I  cannot  deny  myself  the  plea- 
sure of  writing  to  you  on  purpose  to  mention  it.  It  is 
James  Macdonald  I  mean,  who  sits  for  the  county  of 

— ' .     He  did  not  return  from  the  continent  till  near 

the  end  of  last  session,  and  had  no  opportunity  of  giv- 
ing any  vote  but  upon  the  Duke  of  Cumberland's  ques- 
tion, in  which  he  and  Lord  voted  on  opposite 

sides.  But  he  was  so  little  satisfied  with  the  ambiguous 
manoeuvring  of  that  family,  with  which  he  is  so  nearly 
connected,  or  with  the  conclusion  to  which  it  manifestly 
tended,  that  he  took  upon  himself  to  explain  his 
own  opinions,  and  to  desire  an  explanation  of  theirs. 
After  some  evasion  the  corresjDondence  has  ended  in 
their  accepting  his  resignation,  and  he  is  to  take  the 
Chiltern  Hundreds  on  the  first  day  of  the  session.  Mac- 
donald has  the  greater  merit  for   acting  in  this  way, 


2Et.  38.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  291 

that  he  had  formed  no   political  connexion   but   with 

Lord ,  by  which  he  was  in  the  smallest  degree 

j)ledged  to  particular  opinions;  and  that  during  the 
whole  of  that  period,  which  has  put  men  to  so  strong  a 
test,  from  the  first  overthrow  of  Bonaparte  to  the  last 
declaration  of  war,  he  was  abroad. 

I  hope  Lady  Grey  continues  to  gain  strength,  and 
that  you  will  present  my  best  remembrances  to  her. 
Believe  me,  my  dear  Lord, 

Ever  faithfully  yours, 

Fka.  Hoener. 


Letter  CCXLIV.**    FROM  EARL  GREY. 
My  dear  Horner,  Howick,  ist  Nov.  isis. 

I  received  your  letter  of  the  27th  by  the  last 
post,  and  I  am  most  sincerely  obliged  to  you,  for  the 
account  you  have  been  so  good  as  to  send  me  of  the  re- 
sult  of  Macdonald's   explanations   with   Lord  . 

You  could  not  overrate  the  interest  I  take  in  it,  nor  the 
esteem  which  I  must  feel  for  such  conduct.  Without 
personal  obligations  or  connections  which  could  bind 
him  in  any  degree,  he  has  made  a  sacrifice  to  public 
principle,  which,  even  amongst  the  many  proofs  of  disin- 
terestedness which  the  party  now  in  opposition  has  fur- 
nished, must  stand  in  the  first  rank.  Great,  however,  as 
the  gratification  is  which  I  must  derive  from  an  example 
of  this  character,  and  which  so  strongly  sanctions  the 
opinion  I  had  formed  of  Macdonald,  I  confess  it  is  not 
unaccompanied  with  regret,  when  I  reflect  how  little  the 
public  are  inclined  to  do  justice  to  such  sacrifices.  On 
my  own  account,  I  can  look  back  at  nearly  thirty  years 
spent  almost  in  a  constant  opposition,  without  regret. 
But  when  I  see  so  many  of  my  friends  excluded  from 


292  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

the  situations  in  which  their  talents  and  integrity  would 
have  made  them  so  useful,  without  the  possibility,  even 
in  the  event  of  any  change,  of  retrieving  lost  opportu- 
nities, and  in  some  instances,  as  in  this,  with  the  aggrava- 
tion of  family  division,  I  cannot  help  experiencing  a 
good  deal  of  pain  in  the  reflection.  I  am  happy  to  tell 
you  that  Lady  Grey's  health  is  considerably  im^^roved 
since  you  were  here.  Pray  remember  me  very  kindly  to 
Lord  and  Lady  Lansdowne,  and  believe  me,  dear  Horner, 

Ever  most  truly  yours, 

Grey. 


Letter   CCXLV.    TO  HIS  SISTER,  MISS  HORNER. 
My  dear  Fanny,  London,  22d  Nov.  1815. 

I  met  the  Chevalier  Canova  a  second  time  at 
Holland  House  a  few  days  ago ;  and  it  was  indeed  a 
most  agreeable  day.  The  other  artists  we  had  to  meet 
him  were  Wilkie  and  Westmacott,  but  he  was  himself 
the  only  person  that  any  body  thought  of  He  talked 
a  great  deal,  partly  in  French,  which  he  pronounces 
very  ill,  partly  in  Italian,  which  I  am  told  he  s^^eaks  also 
as  a  provincial,  for  he  is  a  native  of  Venice,  but  always 
with  animation,  spirit,  and  cheerfulness.  I  told  you  of 
his  looks ;  a  fine  forehead,  with  sunk  mild  eyes ;  his 
manners  are  simple  and  easy,  perfectly  in  the  tone  of 
good  compan}^  His  brother  is  with  him,  the  Abate 
Canova,  a  man  of  learning  and  classical  attainments ; 
they  live  constantly  together,  and  their  habit  is,  that 
the  Abbe  reads  to  Canova,  while  he  is  at  work  with  his 
chisel,  out  of  some  Italian  classic,  or  translation  of  the 
ancients.  This  sounds  very  amiably  and  like  complete 
friendship. 

He  was  naturally  led  to  talk  of  Napoleon,  and  he  was 


^T.  38.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  293 

pressed  to  tell  us  something  of  those  scenes  of  familiar 
intercourse  which  that  personage  usually  permitted  him- 
self to  indulge  in  Avitli  Italians,  though  never  with 
Frenchmen,  and  which  he  was  known  to  permit  espe- 
cially with  Canova.  He  told  us  that  Napoleon  con- 
versed with  him  in  the  Venetian  dialect,  which  he  was 
fond  of,  a  circumstance  which  of  itself  would  render 
their  conversation  more  equal  and  familiar,  and  was 
probably  so  intended.  He  urged  him  to  settle  at  Paris, 
but  this  he  declined,  saying,  he  should  die  of  cold  in  less 
than  a  year.  I  have  heard  that  he  added  another  rea- 
son, that  he  was  not  qualified  to  vie  with  the  Parisian 
artists  as  a  courtier ;  but  this  he  did  not  repeat  to  us. 

The  new  expedition  for  the  Niger,  which  sailed  lately, 
is  fitted  out  in  a  very  liberal  style :  Government  has 
only  been  stingy  upon  one  point,  the  allowance  to  be 
held  out  to  the  black  soldiers  who  accompany  the 
expedition,  as  their  reward  for  returning  back  to  Sierra 
Leone.  This  is  the  very  point  on  Avhich  the  success  of 
the  travellers  may  depend,  and  I  fear  the  allowances 
are  not  large  enough  to  prevail  over  the  strong  inclinar 
tion  those  blacks  will  have  to  remain  in  their  own  coun- 
try when  they  reach  it.  The  stock  of  articles  laid  in 
for  the  traffic  of  the  travellers,  and  for  presents,  has  cost 
twenty  thousand  pounds;  it  is  curious  that  the  most 
expensive  article  is  coral,  of  which  they  have  taken  four 
thousand  pounds  worth,  and  two  thousand  pounds  worth 
of  amber.  If  I  can  finish  some  business  to-morrow,  in 
which  I  am  engaged,  I  mean  to  accompany  Whishaw  on 
a  visit  for  a  couple  of  days  to  Sir  James  Mackintosh  :  he 
lives  near  Aylesbury,  and  is  deep,  I  hear,  in  historical 
composition.  I  shall  write  to  my  mother  very  soon ; 
my  kind  love  to  them  all.         Very  affectionatelj'  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 
25* 


294  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 


Letter  CCXLVI.     TO  J.  A.  MURRAY. 
My  dear  Murray  Woburn  Abbey,  28tli  Nov.  1815. 

We  have  fallen  into  our  bad  habit  of  last  year 
again,  of  not  writing  as  we  used  to  do,  and  ought  to  do. 
If  we  do  not  take  care,  it  will  become  inveterate.  This 
time  it  has  come  on  my  side,  from  not  having  found  the 
Culloden  papers  at  Bowood,  and  so  losing  that  oppor- 
tunity of  writing  to  you  about  them  from  thence  ;  and 
afterwards  fancying  I  should  be  able,  when  I  returned 
to  town,  to  steal  time  enough  from  the  term  for  reading 
them.  By  this  time,  I  hope  you  have  printed  your 
account  of  them. 

I  am  impatient  to  see  the  Review  for  another  reason, 
to  know  what  Jeffrey's  speculations  are  about  France ; 
for  he  seems  to  have  given  different  persons  in  London, 
with  whom  he  talked  about  them,  the  most  contradictory 
impressions  of  his  opinions.  His  ingenious  powers  of 
diversifying  the  views  of  a  great  subject  are  a  copious 
source  of  instruction  to  those  who  submit  to  the  duller 
task  of  patiently  forming  a  judgment,  that  is  to  remain 
upon  their  minds  ;  and  the  assistance  which  one  derives 
from  his  inventions  and  reasonings  is  always  accom- 
panied with  a  delightful  confidence,  at  least  upon  seri- 
ous and  great  occasions,  that  his  sentiments,  however 
transient  they  may  j^rove,  are  honest  and  conscientious 
at  the  time.  For,  though  Jeffrey  often  trifles  with  a 
subject  expressly,  and  often  argues  for  exhibition,  he 
never  leaves  me  in  doubt,  when  he  means  to  do  so,  and 
when  he  is  for  the  time  in  earnest.  I  am  therefore  very 
impatient  to  see  what  he  has  to  say  about  France ;  for 
as  the  new  state  of  affairs  in  that  unhappy  countrj^,  and 
our  deep  participation  in  them,  must  be  a  constant  me- 


JEt.  38.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  995 

ditation  in  every  reflecting  and  feeling  mind,  so  I  con- 
clude from  the  opinions  lie  held  about  the  war  in  May 
last,  that  I  am  not  likely  to  find  him  judging  of  these 
matters  at  present  in  the  light  in  Avliich  I  see  them. 

It  was  a  very  painful  circumstance  in  my  last  visit  to 
Scotland,  from  the  little  politics  I  talked  with  any  body, 
to  find  myself  so  far  asunder  from  my  best  friends  in  our 
views  of  foreig-n  affliirs.  To  me,  it  is  losino;  the  chief 
relish  of  life  not  to  feel  alike  w^ith  them  upon  things 
wdiich  make  us  all  feel  strongly.  And  I  have  laid  noth- 
ing so  much  to  heart  for  many  years  as  the  difference 
which  I  imagine  exists  among  us,  respecting  the  nature 
and  character  of  the  present  crisis  of  European  politics. 
All  the  opinions  which  I  have  ever  cherished  seem  on 
this  occasion  concentrated,  and  all  the  principles  which 
have  been  gaining  strength  and  confirmation  in  my 
mind  every  year  of  my  life,  seem  put  in  peril  at  once. 
It  is  a  question,  whether  all  the  good  fruits  of  the  French 
Revolution,  dearly  and  cruelly  as  they  have  been 
earned,  are  to  be  lost  to  France ;  and  whether  it  is  not 
to  be  settled  in  the  instance  of  that  country,  that  the 
greatest  and  most  civilised  people  may,  by  the  confede- 
racy of  courts  and  the  alliance  of  armies,  be  subjected 
to  the  government  of  a  family  whom  they  despise  and 
detest.  It  is  a  question  whether  the  very  first  principle 
of  slavery,  that  the  people  are  the  property  of  certain 
royal  families,  is  not  to  be  established  as  a  fundamental 
maxim  in  the  system  of  Europe ;  and  whether  the  vital 
principle  of  our  English  liberty  and  our  revolution  is 
not  to  be  antiquated  as  a  Jacobinical  heresy  by  the 
force  of  English  arms.  The  degradation  of  our  army 
in  beino;  the  main  instrument  of  this  warfare  asrainst 
freedom  and  civilisation,  the  stain  upon  the  national 
name  in  making  so  ungenerous  a  use  of  our  triumph 


296  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

over  our  rival  in  arms,  our  keeping  ihe  police  of  Paris  to 
protect  the  Bourbons,  while  they  are  murdering  with 
judicial  forms  those  who  tried  the  fortune  of  war  with 
us,  and  to  whom  we  in  words,  and  they  by  fact  and  deed, 
gave  warrant  of  an  amnesty  -,  these  are  incidental  sub- 
jects of  grief  and  shame,  which  embitter  the  pain  with 
which  one  contemplates  the  course  of  events,  and  which 
will  leave  wounds  upon  our  honour,  even  if  the  future 
struggle  should  take  a  favourable  turn ;  but  the  struggle 
to  which  I  look,  is,  that  of  the  French  people  against 
the  Bourbons  and  against  the  confederate  sovereigns. 
And  the  most  anxious  and  the  most  depressing  reflection 
that  perpetually  recurs  upon  me,  is  the  conviction,  that 
for  the  success  of  this  great  contest,  the  principles  of 
liberty  must  rely  for  their  principal  support  upon  the 
enlightened  men  of  England,  while  most  of  these  are 
not  yet  awakened  to  a  sense  of  what  is  doing,  and  of 
what  the  consequences  will  inevitably  be. 

You  will  think  me  very  serious ;  but  I  cannot  write 
otherwise  to  you  on  these  matters,  if  I  write  at  all ;  for 
there  is  no  day  that  is  not  saddened  by  every  thing  I 
read  and  hear. 

Yours  ever  affectionately, 

Fra.  Horner. 

Letter   CCXLVII.    TO   THOMAS  THOMSON,  ESQ. 
My  dear  Thomson,  v^'ohuvr,  Abbey,  29th  Nov.  i8i5. 

I  have  never  had  the  grace  to  write  you  my 
thanks  for  your  magnificent  present  of  the  Acts  and 
Eegister,  which  I  found  in  my  library  upon  my  return 
from  Scotland.  They  are  very  handsome  books,  and  I 
prize  your  gift  very  highly. 

I  wish  you  would  write  now  and  then,  were  it  only  to 


^T.  38.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  297 

keep  me  in  the  knowledge  of  the  sentiments  and  impres- 
sions which  are  produced  in  you  by  these  dreadful  events 
of  our  time.  I  never  feel  comfortable,  when  any  of 
these  turns  of  public  affairs  take  place,  till  I  know  the 
opinions  of  about  half  a  dozen  friends  in  different  parts 
of  the  world.  This  treaty  of  peace,  as  it  is  called,  and 
the  novel  engagements  which  our  government  has  im- 
posed upon  us,  form  a  crisis  in  the  policy  of  England 
and  Europe,  which  will  bring  to  the  test  both  the  prin- 
ciples of  men  and  their  nerves.  I  anticipate,  at  no  great 
distance  of  time,  a  much  more  violent  difference  in  poli- 
tical sentiments  than  we  have  experienced  since  the 
peace  of  Amiens ;  and  as  far  as  I  have  yet  been  able  to 
judge,  though  my  means  of  information  are  very  limited, 
I  expect  that  in  the  country  (whatever  there  may  be  in 
parliament)  there  will  be  but  a  small  minority  who  will 
see  things  in  what  I  consider  the  true  light,  unless  some 
reverses  of  fortune  or  some  disasters  reaching  ourselves, 
correct  the  public  feeling.  I  say  correct,  for  it  is  the  illu- 
sion of  military  success  that  seems  to  have  blinded  many, 
who  used  to  be  guided  in  their  judgments  of  foreign 
politics  by  some  regard  to  justice  and  to  the  cause  of 
liberty. 

I  have  made  out  the  history  of  those  supplementary 
stanzas  in  CoUins's  Ode  on  the  Superstitions  of  the  High- 
lands, wdiich  puzzled  us.  They  are  a  mere  fabrication. 
Mackintosh,  who  told  me  the  story,  would  not  mention 
the  man's  name  ;  but  it  w^as  a  very  low  northern  littera- 
teur, who,  about  five  and  twenty  years  ago,  published  at 
Cadell's  shop  a  new  edition  of  that  ode,  as  from  another 
manuscript,  with  all  the  blanks  ^and  vacancies  supplied. 
The  additions  were  one  and  all  a  forgery  of  his  own,  of 
which  he  boasted  to  Mackintosh.  The  man  is  dead. 
This  piece  of  literary  history  ought  to  be  made  known ; 


298  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

for  the  forgery  has  not  only  crept  into  the  edition  of 
Collins  which  I  shewed  you,  and  that  is  part  of  a  gene- 
ral collection,  but  also  into  the  large  body  of  the  Eng- 
lish poets  published  by  Chalmers. 

I  met  lately  with  two  volumes  of  Travels  in  France 
published  at  Edinburgh,  which  the  bookseller  told  me 
was  the  work  of  one  of  the  young  Alisons.  I  found 
upon  the  perusal,  that  the  two  volumes  were  the  pro- 
duction of  different  hands.  In  the  volume  by  Alison, 
there  is  much  very  interesting  matter,  a  great  deal  of 
heart  and  liberal  sentiment,  some  occasional  power  of 
expression,  and  all  through  a  settled  regularity  of  copi- 
ous and  elegant  composition,  very  Scotch  in  the  cast  and 
all  the  thinking  of  it ;  but  very  good,  for  all  that,  upon 
the  whole.  You  must  let  me  know  which  of  the  Ali- 
sons it  is,  the  Doctor,  or  the  Advocate ;  =='  there  is  great 
promise  in  this  first  performance ;  and  though  there  are 
a  hundred  points,  on  which  I  should  be  inclined  to  think 
the  author  rather  less  liberal  than  he  ought  to  be  about 
France,  it  is  the  work  of  a  man  whose  sentiments  can- 
not be  long  or  much  deficient  in  refinement  or  elevation. 
If  I  am  not  mistaken,  I  could  put  my  finger  on  some 
passages  of  a  diffuse  and  mystical  elegance,  more  re- 
markable for  unction  than  strength,  which  I  would 
ascribe  to  the  father. 

I  have  got  a  copy  of  the  life  of  Tennant  f  for  you, 
which  I  shall  send  with  some  books  that  are  to  be  dis- 
patched in  a  few  days  for  Charlotte  Square.  Whishaw 
has  not  quite  rejected  my  proposal,  that  he  should  pub- 
lish it  with  his  name.  But  he  is  at  present  engaged 
with  another  object,  which  has  grown  out  of  that,  in 

*  I  am  informed  that  both  contributed  to  the  second  volume,  Dr.  "W.  P. 
Alison  and  Archibald  Alison,  Esq,,  the  author  of  the  "  History  of  Europe 
from  1789  to  1815."  — Ed. 

f  Smithson  Tennant,  Esq.,  F.  E.  S. 


JEt.  38.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  299 

consequence  of  receiving  some  papers  of  Brown,  the 
traveller,  Avliich,  upon  his  death,  were  transmitted  home 
from  SmjTna,  to  poor  Tennant's  care. 

I  paid  a  visit  lately,  in  company  with  Whishaw,  to 
Mackintosh,  at  Weedon  in  the  vale  of  Aylesbury ;  the 
ugliest  country  perhaps  in  England.  But  he  is  living 
comfortably,  and  I  should  think  very  happily ;  free  from 
the  hectic  fever  of  London  idleness,  and  working  just 
enough  to  keep  him  in  regular  spirits.  He  told  me,  he 
expected  before  the  meeting  of  parliament  in  February, 
to  have  nearly  finished  the  reign  of  King  William ;  but 
it  rather  surprised  me,  when  he  added,  that  this  would 
not  form  more  than  between  a  fourth  and  a  third  of  his 
first  volume. 

My  dear  Thomson, 

Affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 

Letter  CCXLYII*    TO  LADY  HOLLAND. 
Dear  Lady  Holland,  Temple,  December  2(1,  1815. 

I  am  very  sorry  to  perceive  that  is  in 

danger  of  receiving  such  bad  advice.  He  is  but  too  apt 
himself,  to  take  the  course  which  is  so  recommended. 

Lord may  be  right  or  wrong  in  the  conjecture 

which  he  had  evidently  formed  as  to  the  quarter  in 
which  the  notion  of  a  proceeding  in  parliament  origina- 
ted. But  he  knows  nothing  of  the  feelings  of  Westmin- 
ster Hall  upon  the  subject ;  if  he  supposes  that  the  con- 
demnation of for  holding  these  two  appoint- 
ments, is  confined  to  those  who  dislike  the  man  personally, 
or  who  are  excessive  puritans  in  their  politics.  It  would 
be  some  answer  to  the  objection  which  they  make,  to 
urge  that  Lord  EUenborough  had  a  seat  in  the  Cabinet, 


300  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

if  it  could  first  be  proved  that  that  was  not  very  wrong. 

And  if means  only  to  urge  that  personally,  and 

not  upon  principle,  what  is  that  personal  argument  to 
me  or  to  a  hundred  more  ?  It  is  making  a  very  bad  use 
of  the  compromise  with  principle,  which  the  necessities 
of  a  party  may  force  upon  them  for  the  sake  of  greater 
objects,  to  extend  such  instances  into  precedents  and  per- 
sonal appeals,  in  order  to  colour  every  other  compromise, 
for  which  there  may  be  no  stronger  necessity  than  in  the 
temptations  of  individual  advantage  or  convenience. 
But  he  says  it  is  not  the  pecuniary  advantage    that 

induces to  keep  this  office.    I  am  much  mistaken 

if  it  is  not  that  alone ;  but  if  it  is  not,  my  objection  to 
the  thing  becomes  much  stronger  ;  for  if  there  are  diffi- 
culties, as  he  says,  the  nature  of  which  cannot  be  easily 
surmounted,  there  must  grow  out  of  the  very  intercourse 
and  connexion,  which  it  is  the  most  improper  for  a  judge 
to  hold  with  the  person  of  the  sovereign.  I  do  not 
know  whether  for  all  this  I  should  be  ranked  by  Lord 

in  the  "  Band  of  Cossacks."     You  know  whether 

I   have   any   motive    of  unkindness   towards  's 


family,  that  would  influence  me  on  this  occasion,  or  am 
more  likely  to  feel  pain  and  distress  at  the  thoughts  of 
being  forced,  by  what  I  think  the  father's  misconduct, 
to  put  in  hazard,  by  the  course  which  I  shall  certainly 
take   upon  it,  one  of  my  best  and   dearest  friendshijDS. 

It  is  a  bad  simile,  for to  compare  some  of  our 

skirmishers  in  personal  questions  to  Cossacks ;  but  in  our 
Whig  army  there  used  to  be  some  camjD  followers  from 
another  country  of  the  North,  who  had  no  objection 
after  a  defeat  to  console  themselves  individually  with  a 
little  plunder,  not  much  minding  whether  they  took  it 
from  friend  or  foe  ;  and  the  race  of  these  does  not  seem 
extinct. 


^T.  38.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  301 

I  have  not  availed  myself  of  your  permission  to  show 

Lor(l 's  letter  to  Whishaw ;    because   it  would 

make  an  impression,  I  think  very  unfavouraljle  to  Lord 

— .     We,  who  know  his  personal  disinterestedness 

and  the  activity  and  warmth  of  his  friendship,  are  pre- 
pared to  make  allowances  for  the  views  he  takes  of  such 
questions,  when  the  interest  of  others  is  affected ;  but 
that  is  not  the  inclination  of  people  in  general  about  him. 

I  am  very  curious  to  know  what  answer  Lord  Grey 
thinks  can  be  made  to  Ney's  appeal  to  the  convention 
of  Paris.  I  have  not  yet  heard  one  suggested.  If  you 
have  any  farther  communication  from  him  upon  the 
subject,  give  me  a  hint  of  his  reasoning. 

I  went  to  your  box  last  night  to  see  the  Abercrombys. 
She  desired  me  to  tell  you,  how  much  she  Avas  obliged 
to  you  for  your  note.  Yours  affectionately, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CCXLYIII.    TO  THOMAS  THOMSON,  ESQ. 
My  dear  Thomson,  Temple,  2d  Dec.  i8i5. 

I  have  again  to  thank  you  for  your  kind  bounty 
to  me,  and  I  shall  not  be  content  to  place  your  Jewel 
Book  *  upon  the  shelf,  till  I  have  looked  into  it  for  some 
of  the  curious  matter.  I  wish,  however,  you  would  re- 
solve to  use  your  own  materials.  Not  that  I  would  not 
have  you  do  all  you  are  doing  now,  in  the  way  of  pub- 
lishino;  these  oris^inal  documents.  But  then  I  would 
have  you,  besides,  form  some  piece  of  history  or  disser- 
tation for  general  readers,  in  which  the  antiquities  you 
are  daily  extracting  might  be  placed  in  such  philosophi- 

*  A  Collection  of  Inventories  and  other  Records  of  the  Royal  Wardrobe- 
and  Jewel  House,  and  of  the  Artillery  and  Munition  in  some  of  the  Royal 
Castles,  1488-1606. 

VOL.  II.  26 


302  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

cal  and  useful  points  of  view,  as  would  give  them  a  per- 
manent value  and  interest.  The  early  History  of  Scot- 
land has  never  been  imiitcn  at  all ;  I  mean  Pinkerton's 
period ;  yet  it  is  a  very  instructive  j)ortioii  of  the  gene- 
ral history  of  laws  and  manners,  and  not  altogether 
deficient  in  the  characters  or  dramatic  events  that  best 
exhibit  manners,  by  showing  them  in  action.  The  Scot- 
tish annals  are  thrown  upon  a  scenery  so  marked,  and 
so  abound  in  peculiar  details,  that  they  would  afford 
many  subjects  for  an  artist  who  could  work  in  the 
strongest  relief 

Political  matters  are  worse  since  I  wrote  my  last  letter. 
The  treaty,  of  anti-jacobin  confederacy,  has  not  only 
realised  all  the  apprehensions  which  filled  me  then,  but 
avows  audaciously  the  design  of  suppressing  by  royal 
combination  all  attempts  in  all  countries  to  improve 
their  political  institutions.  Translate  their  phrases,  and 
you  have  their  avowal  of  all  this  in  plain  terms.  And 
to  show  you  how  far  these  sovereigns  are  disposed  to 
carry  their  practical  application  of  the  principle,  the 
Emperor  of  Russia  said  at  Paris  to  a  man  whom  I  know 
(an  Englishman,)  that,  from  the  sjmiptoms  that  appeared 
in  the  Prussian  army,  he  did  not  know  but  he  should 
very  soon  have  to  perform  the  same  service  for  his 
brother  of  Prussia,  at  Berlin,  which  he  had  already  ren- 
dered to  Louis  in  France. 

Will  the  general  sentiment  and  feeling  of  this  coun- 
try be  in  favour  of  such  a  treaty  ?  I  believe  it  will  be 
found  so,  unless  we  have  to  pay  for  enforcing  it. 

Yours  affectionately. 

Era.  Horner. 

I  shall  be  glad  to  hear  all  that  you  have  leisure  to 
tell  me  about  the  Jury  Court. 


JEt.  38.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  3O3 


Letter   CCXLVIIL*    TO  THE  DUCHESS  OF  SOMERSET. 
_  ^      ,  ^  „  ,  108  Great  Russell  Street, 

Dear  Duchess  01  Somerset,  2d  Dec.  181.5. 

I  think  it  very  long  since  I  have  heard  of  you, 
and  I  am  anxious  to  know  if  your  recovery  has  been 
progressive  since  I  had  the  pleasure  of  seeing  you  at 
Bulstrode. 

From  what  I  know  of  your  opinions,  I  think  you  can- 
not fail  to  have  sympathised  with  me,  upon  all  the  me- 
lancholy transactions  at  Paris,  of  which  every  newspaper 
is  full,  to  the  disgrace  of  our  national  character,  and  to 
the  destruction  of  all  the  hopes  of  peace  and  order  in 
Europe,  with  which  the  return  of  the  Bourbons  to  their 
throne  was  supposed  to  be  attended. 

Surel}^,  after  a  solemn  agreement  that  nobody  in 
Paris  should  be  molested  for  their  political  sentiments 
or  conduct,  these  executions  are  a  direct  breach  of  fiith ; 
and  though  the  engagement  was  nominally  signed  by 
the  allied  chiefs,  Louis  adopted  it  by  returning  to  Paris, 
which  he  entered  upon  the  faith  of  that  stipulation,  and 
it  could  only  be  against  Louis  that  his  subjects,  who  had 
taken  part  against  him,  could  feel  it  necessary  to  pro- 
tect themselves  by  the  article  of  amnesty  inserted  in  the 
convention.  Have  you  read  Count  de  Labourdonnaj^e's 
proposal  for  a  general  execution?  There  has  been 
nothing  so  murderous,  and  so  cold-blooded,  since  the 
Reign  of  Terror,  and  one  understands  now  what  is 
meant  by  a  White  Jacobin.  But  the  consummation  of 
all  is  this  Treaty  of  Alliance  among  the  four  powers,  to 
suppress  by  arms  any  appearance  in  future  of  what  they 
call  revolutionary  principles,  that  is  of  whatever  they 
may  choose  to  call  so,  that  is  of  any  attempt  in  any 
country  to  check  the  abuses  of  royal  authority,  or  to 


304  CORRESPONDEXCE.  [1815. 

mend  political  institutions.  If  this  is  submitted  to,  and 
can  be  put  in  force,  there  will  soon  be  an  end  of  the 
very  shadow  of  liberty,  and  of  all  that  can  be  called 
civilization  in  Europe.  The  Prussian  army  and  people 
are  said  to  be  tainted  wdth  some  washes  for  a  constitu- 
tion )  a  case  of  rank  Jacobinism.  Talking  of  this,  the 
Emperor  Alexander  said  to  an  English  gentleman  at 
Paris,  that  he  might  perhaps  be  called  upon  very  soon  to 
perform  the  same  service  at  Berlin  for  his  brother  of 
Prussia,  which  he  had  already  rendered  his  brother  Louis 
in  France  :  a  pretty  plain  declaration  of  the  extent  to 
which  he  is  prepared  to  carry  into  activity  the  principle 
of  this  dreadful  treaty.  Will  the  English  Parliament 
tamely  endure  this,  after  the  solemn  declaration  made 
last  summer,  that  it  was  no  object  of  the  war  to  impose 
any  particular  government  on  France,  or  to  interfere  in 
its  internal  concerns  ? 

I  was  a  few  days  lately  at  Woburn,  and  had  the  plea- 
sure of  meeting  there  that  very  charming  person  Lady 
Tavistock,  looking  beautiful  and  amiable  as  ever.  I  beg 
to  be  remembered  to  her  god-daughter  in  particular,  and 
all  my  other  young  friends  at  Bradley.  And  with  kind 
regards  to  the  Duke,  believe  me  ever  your  Grace's 
Sincere  and  faithful  Servant, 

Era.  Horner. 


Letter  CCXLIX.     TO  DUGALD  BAXNATYNE,  ESQ.,  GLASGOW. 
My  dear  Sir,  Temple,  4th  Dec.  1815. 

I  had  rather  indulged  myself  with  the  expecta- 
tion of  receiving  a  letter  from  you,  on  the  subject  of 
that  very  remarkable  traffic  in  books  round  Glasgow  by 
itinerant  retailers  with  which  you  interested  me  so 
much.     You  thought  it  likely  that  you  might  have  an 


^T.  38.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  3Qrj 

opportunity  of  verifying  the  curious  account  which  had 
been  given  you,  and  of  collecting  further  details.  If 
you  have  been  successful.  I  shall  feel  quite  obliged  to 
you  for  some  communication  of  the  particulars.  There 
is  nothing  in  the  interior  economy  of  our  own  country 
so  important  to  know,  as  the  progress  of  instruction 
among  the  industrious  classes.  It  is  especially  so  in  the 
new  turn  which  political  affairs  have  taken,  for  the  pre- 
sent, on  the  continent  of  Europe.  For  I  know  of  no 
protection  for  us  against  the  designs  which  the  confede- 
rated kings  have  now  plainly  avowed,  of  resisting,  by  a 
standing  combination  among  themselves,  every  move- 
ment that  tends  to  the  reformation  of  abuses  or  the  ex- 
tension of  liberty,  except  that  which  may  be  found  in 
the  effects  of  knowledge  steadily  and  solidly  diffused 
through  the  great  body  of  the  people. 

I  feel  considerable  curiosity  to  know  what  impression 
has  been  produced,  upon  the  thinking  and  active  popu- 
lation of  your  great  town,  by  the  recent  proceedings  at 
Paris ;  especially  by  the  breach  of  the  amnesty,  by  the 
employment  of  our  troops  in  the  most  odious  services 
for  the  Bourbons,  and  by  this  treaty  of  alliance  against 
revolutionary  principles.  There  were  times  when  such 
transactions  would  have  raised  a  cry  of  indignation  in 
England :  as  yet  I  have  not  perceived  any  expression  of 
correct  feeling.  I  should  expect  to  find  in  Glasgow  as 
early  an  indication  as  any  where  of  just  and  manly  sen- 
timents, on  so  great  and  so  new  an  occasion. 

I  beg  you  will  offer  my  best  compliments  to  Mrs. 
Bannatyne, 

And  believe  me,  my  dear  Sir, 

Very  sincerely  yours, 

Era.  Horner. 

26* 


306  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 


Letter  CCL.     FROM  LORD  GRENVILLE. 
My  clear  Sir  Camelford  House,  Gth  Dec.  1815. 

Having  been  called  to  town  for  a  few  days,  I 
found  on  my  table  a  copy  of  Professor  Stewart's  Dis- 
sertation. I  read  it  with  the  eagerness  which  the  sub- 
ject and  his  name  would  naturally  create,  and  I  have 
received  from  it  a  degree  of  delight  and  instruction, 
such  as  few  books  indeed  have  ever  afforded  to  me. 

It  was  not  till  last  night  that  your  letter  followed  me 
up  from  the  country,  and  informed  me  to  whom  I  was 
indebted  for  so  valuable  a  present ;  and  this  must  be  my 
apology  for  not  having  sooner  thanked  you  for  it.  With 
all  my  admiration  of  it,  I  do  not  acquiesce  in  all  he  says 
here  and  elsewhere  of  Oxford.  It  may  be  the  effect  of 
prejudice,  but  I  confidently  believe  that  he  thinks  of  our 
institutions  and  studies  there,  less  favourably  than  we 
deserve,  and  than  he  would  himself  think  of  us  if  he 
were  better  acquainted  with  the  facts.  He  has  also 
brought  against  us  a  charge,  that  of  expelling  Locke, 
which  certainly  is  not  historically  true,  and  I  believe  I 
shall  be  tempted  to  trouble  him,  through  you  (if  you 
will  allow  it)  with  a  very  short  note  to  place  that  tran- 
saction in  what  I  conceive  to  be  its  true  light.  Not  that 
any  of  us  is  much  concerned  to  vindicate  what  our 
predecessors  did  a  century  and  a  half  ago,  but  because 
historical  truth  is  valuable,  even  as  to  the  minutest  facts, 
and  still  more  so  when  it  concerns  the  conduct  of  public 
bodies.* 

*  Lord  Grcnville  published  in  1829  (]MuiTay,)  a  tract  entitled  "  Oxford 
and  Locke,"  in  -which  he  A'indicatcs  the  University  from  what  he  terms 
"  groundless  aspersions."  It  contains  a  letter  to  Mr.  Horner,  dated  14th 
December,  1815,  which  was  communicated  to  Mr.  Stewart,  and  Mr.  Stewart's 
reply.  —  Ed. 


^T.  38.]  CORRESrONDENCE.  307 

When  I  got  your  letter,  I  was  on  the  point  of  writing 
to  you,  to  express  how  happy  you  would  make  us  if  you 
could  contrive  to  pass  any  part,  the  longer  the  better, 
of  your  Christmas  holidays  at  Dropmore. 

Ever,  my  dear  Sir,  most  truly  yours, 

Grenville. 


Letter  CCLL     FROM  LORD  GRENVILLE. 
Mv  dear  Sir  Dropmore,  10th  Dec.  1815. 

The  time  you  mention  will  be  perfectly  conve- 
nient for  our  having  the  pleasure  of  seeing  you  here. 
Since  I  have  returned  here,  I  have  entered  upon  a  second 
and  more  deliberate  reading  of  Stewart's  Dissertation. 
I  am  afraid  you  will  not  think  very  highly  of  my  judg- 
ment in  selecting  for  observation,  amidst  such  a  mass  of 
the  most  valuable  matter,  a  slight  and  incidental  refer- 
ence to  an  almost  forgotten  anecdote.  But  something 
must  be  allowed  for  local  attachment,  and  I  have  no 
doubt  of  satisfying  you  when  I  see  you,  that  the  act  in 
question  was  in  no  respect  (what  Stewart  represents  it) 
the  act  of  the  University,  but,  solely  and  exclusively, 
the  act  of  that  profligate  and  ambitious  court  whom 
Locke  had  offended  by  his  attachment  to  Lord  Shaftes- 
bury. It  is  in  that  light  that  Fox  represents  it,  drawing 
from  it  its  proper  historical  inference,  that  of  the  inse- 
curity even  of  the  most  obscure  stations,  under  the 
tyranny  of  such  a  government. 

Ever  most  truly  yours, 

Grenville. 


108  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 


Letter  CCLTI.     TO  HIS  SISTER,  MISS  ANNE  HORNER. 

My  clear  Nancy,  London,  istii  Dec.  1815. 

For  the  last  week  I  have  been  reading,  over  and 
over  again,  Mr.  Stewart's  new  Dissertation,  which  re- 
freshes me  like  a  delicious  repast,  in  having  one's  atten- 
tion called  to  it  from  dull  law  and  gloomy  politics.  It 
is,  perhaps,  the  most  pleasing  of  all  his  compositions ; 
and,  from  what  I  have  heard,  is  likely  to  become  the 
most  popular.  It  has  the  greatest  of  all  charms,  in  com- 
mon with  all  his  writings,  an  uniform  tone  of  high  and 
pure  sentiment;  and  as  they  all  tend  to  inspire  a  confi- 
dence that,  in  spite  of  bad  governments  and  of  the 
mistakes  committed  by  those  who  oppose  them,  knowl- 
edge and  justice  at  last  make  their  way.  The  perusal 
of  a  work  which  abounds  in  so  many  elegant  illustra- 
tions of  this  hope,  is  peculiarly  calculated  to  cheer  and 
relieve  one's  mind,  at  a  time  when  the  best  governments 
have  been  seduced  into  a  league  against  liberty,  and 
many  of  her  most  watchful  friends  have  been  lulled  into 
a  dream  of  security.  It  required  something  to  comfort 
me,  when  I  found  the  Edinburgh  Review  dreaming  like 
the  rest. 

There  are  one  or  two  admirable  pages  of  an  article 
about  Carnot,  which  ought  to  have  roused  Jeffrey ;  but 
old  Simond  has  given  him  an  opiate  which  lulls  him  fast. 
Constable  told  me  yesterday,  he  has  sold  the  whole  edi- 
tion, amounting  to  7000,  of  his  first  vol.  of  the  Supple- 
ment to  the  Encyclopasdia,  and  that  he  means  to  print 
3500  more  of  the  next  number.  My  kind  love  to  every 
body. 

Very  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


^T.  38.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  oqq 


Letter  CCLIII.    TO  THE  DUKE  OF  SOMERSET. 
My  dear  Lord  Duke,  Temple,  icth  Dec.  1815. 

I  hope  you  have  by  this  time  read  Dugald  Stew- 
art's preUminary  Discourse  to  the  new  Supplement,  pub- 
Hshed  at  Edinburgh,  to  the  Encyclopa3dia  Britannica ; 
because  it  must  have  afforded  you  much  pleasure,  from 
the  magnificent  survey  which  he  takes  of  the  history  of 
human  knowledge  in  several  of  its  most  important 
branches,  and  from  the  splendid  eloquence  and  choice 
details  with  which  he  has  rendered  attractive  and  inte- 
resting even  the  progress  of  metaphysical  doctrines.  It 
seems  to  me  written  in  a  freer  spirit  of  criticism  and 
more  copiously  ornamented  than  any  of  his  former 
compositions ;  yet  the  ornaments  are  not  excessive,  but 
give  the  work  a  character  of  majesty  and  richness  quite 
appropriate  to  the  height  of  his  subject.  The  work  has 
still  another  charm  for  me,  borrowed  from  the  times  in 
which  it  has  made  its  appearance.  It  is  the  tendency 
of  all  Stewart's  writings  to  impart  to  his  reader  a  san- 
guine belief  in  the  real  progress  which  practical  knowl- 
edge and  human  improvement  are  steadily,  even  when 
most  imperceptibly,  making,  through  all  the  political 
troubles  and  all  the  philosophical  follies  which  at  par- 
ticular periods  seem  to  throw  every  thing  back  into  its 
original  disorder  and  ignorance.  In  none  of  his  former 
treatises,  had  he  so  direct  an  opportunity  of  proving  and 
illustrating  this  pleasing  opinion.  And  I  have  been 
seduced,  perhaps,  by  his  eloquence,  but  by  wdiat  I  feel 
at  present  like  unanswerable  arguments,  to  apply  even 
to  the  dismal  prospects  of  our  own  days  that  confidence 
in  the  ultimate  prevalence  of  truth  and  liberty,  which 
he  extracts  from  the  struggles  of  the  Protestant  Refor- 


310  CORRESPOXDENCE.  [1815. 

mation,  and  from  the  whole  subsequent  history  both  of 
opinions  and  of  legislation  in  Europe.  If  this  should 
prove  an  idle  hope,  at  least  it  ministers  some  present 
relief;  and  if  all  these  promises  about  the  future  are 
visionary,  I  for  one  would  not  forego  the  luxury  of 
dreaming  now  and  then,  and  escaping  for  a  while  from 
the  realities  of  the  age  in  which  we  live. 

I  had  the  pleasure  of  receiving  the  Duchess's  obliging 
and  agreeable  letter  from  Bowood ;  and  will  write  to 
her  Grace  very  soon. 

Believe  me  ever, 

Your  Grace's  faithful  Servant, 

Fea.  Horner. 

Letter  CCLUL*     TO  LORD  GRENVILLE. 
Mv  dear  Lord  Woburn  Abbey,  31st  Dec.  1815. 

I  inclose  the  answer,  which  I  have  received  from 
Mr.  Stewart,  to  the  communication  which  you  sent  him 
through  me,  respecting  Locke's  affair  at  Oxford  in  1684. 
AVith  his  usual  candour  and  love  of  accuracy,  he  yields 
to  your  Lordship's  explanation,  and  j)roofs,  of  the  real 
nature  of  that  transaction ;  which  has  been  so  errone- 
ously represented  by  every  writer,  I  believe,  who  has 
hitherto  mentioned  it.  The  inaccurate  language  which 
Dr.  Fell  and  Lord  Sunderland  themselves  used,  to  de- 
scribe what  they  had  done,  became  by  tradition  the 
only  memorial  of  what  had  passed.  At  a  period  nearly 
equally  distant  from  that  time  and  from  the  present,  we 
find  Pope,  when  he  takes  occasion  to  glance  at  the 
story,  calling  it  the  expulsion  of  Locke,  in  a  passage  of 
the  fourth  book  of  the  Dunciad. 

Though  I  perfectly  concur  Avith  your  Lordship  in 
thinking,  that  the  Chapter  of  Christ  Church   had  no 


^T.  38.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  3X1 

means  of  resisting  the  arbitrary  violence  of  government, 
I  am  rather  inclined  to  be  of  opinion,  that,  legally  they 
had  a  right  to  refuse  obedience  to  the  warrant.  When 
the  King  is  Visitor,  he  must  visit  by  his  Lord  Chancellor. 
I  take  this  to  have  been  clear  known  law  at  the  time 
we  are  speaking  of  Upon  ancient  authorities,  to  be 
found  in  the  Year-Books,  it  is  so  laid  down  by  Fitzher- 
bert,  in  treating  of  the  writ  of  Prohibition ;  by  Lord 
Coke ;  repeated  by  Rolle ;  and  after  an  interval,  dur- 
ing which  no  new  decision  on  that  particular  point  had 
occurred,  by  Comyn.  I  should  apprehend,  therefore, 
that,  in  1684,  the  opinion  of  lawyers  would  have  been, 
that  a  sign  manual,  countersigned  by  the  Secretary  of 
State,  was  not  legally  a  visitatorial  act 

This  consideration,  however,  if  well  founded,  still  does 
not  affect  the  conclusion,  that,  in  point  of  fact,  the 
chapter  submitted  to  an  act  of  power,  which  in  this 
point  of  view  only  appears  the  more  arbitrary  and  vio- 
lent. I  cannot  help  thinking,  that  the  Dean  of  Christ 
Church  must  be  regarded  as  a  willing  accomplice  in 
the  act ;  for  he  suggests  the  course  that  was  adopted, 
and  he  ousrht  to  have  known  so  much  of  the  laws  of  the 
country,  as  concerned  the  rights  and  protection  of  his 
college.  But  for  the  point  in  question,  it  is  not  material 
to  ascertain  how  far  Doctor  Fell  was  more  or  less  ser- 
vile to  the  Court. 

I  think,  too,  that  yoiiv  Lordship  has  show^n  unanswer- 
ably, that  it  is  quite  incorrect  and  unfair  to  couple  the 
transaction  of  1684  with  any  thing  in  the  state  of  philo- 
sophical opinions  at  that  time  in  the  University.  Li  all 
probability,  few  individuals  in  Oxford,  and  least  of  all 
the  senior  academies,  could  be  apprized  of  those  tenets 
and  speculations,  which  were  not  published  to  the  world 
till  two  years  after  the  Revolution.     For  if  my  recollec- 


312  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1815. 

tion  is  right,  the  first  edition  of  the  Essay  was  in  1690, 
after  Locke's  return  from  Holland. 

At  a  subsequent  period,  indeed,  and  when  the  gov- 
ernment of  the  Church  as  well  as  State  was  in  hands  in- 
capable of  illegal  violence,  and  not  adverse  to  free  in- 
quiry, there  ivere  proceedings  at  Oxford,  directed  ex- 
pressly against  the  Essay  on  Human  Understanding. 
And  these  appear  to  have  originated  within  the  body  of 
the  University,  and  to  have  grown  out  of  the  opinions 
that  reigned  there  on  metaphysical  and  theological  sub- 
jects. I  allude  to  a  meeting  of  the  Heads  of  Houses, 
which  is  said  to  have  been  held  in  1703,  in  order  to  dis- 
courage and  censure  the  reading  of  the  Essay ;  at 
which,  after  much  debate,  it  was  resolved,  without  com- 
ing to  a  public  censure  or  decree,  that  each  head  should 
prevent  it  from  being  read  in  his  college.  All  I  know 
of  this  is  from  Locke's  correspondence  with  Anthony 
Collins  in  the  same  year,  1703,  and  the  notice  given  by 
Des  Maizeaux,  the  editor  of  those  letters.  Locke  as- 
cribes this  attempt  to  "  damn  his  book "  to  an  opinion, 
entertained  by  those  learned  persons,  of  its  tendency  to 
discourage  the  School  Logic,  which  he  calls  "  the  staple 
commodity  of  the  place."  He  appears  to  have  obtained 
but  imperfect  information  of  what  had  been  actually  pro- 
posed, or  agreed  upon,  at  the  meeting ;  and  perhaps  no 
authentic  account  of  it,  more  circumstantial,  is  any 
where  preserved.  It  is  an  incident  of  no  inconsiderable 
importance,  in  the  history  of  English  philosophy ;  and, 
if  truly  stated  in  the  accounts  I  have  mentioned,  would 
seem  justly  to  admit  of  that  reflection,  which  has 
hitherto  been  inaccurately  attached  to  the  proceeding 
of  1684.  So  Locke  himself  understood  it.  It  was  this, 
too,  which  gave  Pope  the  hint  of  the  satirical  passage  to 
which  I  have  already  referred,  in  which  he  describes 


JEx.  38.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  313 

Aristotle's  friends  "  still  expelling  Locke,"  and  imputes 
their  prejudice  against  him  to  the  intolerance  of  men 
addicted  to  that  logic.  Warburton,  too,  who  was  pro- 
bably better  acquainted  than  Pope  with  the  literary 
traditions  of  our  Universities,  not  only  concurs  wdth  the 
poet  in  his  representation  of  the  fact,  but  uses  these  very 
remarkable  expressions  :  "  Such  was  the  fite  of  this  new 
IdUlosophy  at  Oxford." 

I  propose  to  have  the  pleasure  of  coming  to  Drop- 
more  on  Wednesday  next.     Believe  me, 
My  dear  Lord, 

Most  truly  and  faithfully  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CCLIV.     TO  HIS  MOTHER. 
My  dearest  Mother,        Wobum  Abbey,  New  Year's  Day,  181G. 

I  wish  you  many,  many  happy  returns  of  this 
day,  and  the  same  to  my  father  and  all  in  Charlotte 
Square  and  at  White  House.  I  got  your  Christmas 
letter  before  I  left  town,  and  took  it  very  kind  of 
you  to  remember  me.  I  came  here  on  Saturday,  and 
shall  go  to  Dropmore  on  Wednesday,  from  that  to 
sessions. 

We  have  had  no  winter  yet,  no  snow;  now  and 
then  a  little  frost  only.  This  is  as  fine  a  day  as  I 
ever  remember,  more  like  October  than  the  present 
season ;  I  am  just  returned  from  a  ride  with  Mr.  Fa- 
zakerley*  through  part  of  this  magnificent  park,  and 
the  adjoining  farms.  He  is  a  very  agreeable  man,  and 
has  travelled  more  than  any  body  of  his  age,  having 
been,  like  the  Spectator,  to  Grand  Cairo,  to  take  the 
measure  of  a  pyramid;  besides  living  a  great  deal  in 

*  I.  N.  Fazakerley,  Esq.,  M.  P. 

VOL.  n.  27 


314  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1816. 

Spain  and  Italy,  he  was  of  the  party  some  years  ago 
that  visited  the  Grecian  Islands  and  spent  a  winter  at 
Athens.  With  all  this,  he  has  excellent  and  moderate 
opinions  in  politics,  such  as  become  the  descendant  of  a 
Whig  lawyer.  We  have  had  as  yet  but  a  small  party ; 
Lord  aiid  Lady  Tavistock,  William  Adam,  and  an  old 
clergyman  of  the  name  of  Cartwright,  (brother  of  the 
visionary  Major,)  who,  in  his  younger  days,  wrote  two 
fine  stanzas  in  a  ballad  that  begins  with,  "A  hermit  on 
the  banks  of  Trent."  The  party  is  to  be  reinforced  to- 
day with  some  grandees. 

I  was  much  affected  with  your  account  of  poor  aunt 
Cowan's  decease.  It  was  leaving  the  world  as  easily  as 
possible,  and  in  a  way  that  was  a  reward  for  a  life  so 
long  and  so  blameless.  I  have  never  seen,  in  any  other 
instance,  so  much  innocence  and  contentment.  God 
bless  you. 

Ever  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Hornek. 


Letter  CCLV.    TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 
My  dear  Murray  Great  Russell  Street,  18th  Jan.  1816. 

I  am  not  surprised  you  should  tremble,  in  these 
times,  for  any  man  who  has  gone  largely  into  specula- 
tions for  the  improvement  of  land ;  and,  as  far  as  my 
knowledge  of  him  enables  me  to  form  a  judgment,  I 
should  agree  with  you  in  thinking  your  friend  not  the 
most  likely  to  be  wary  and  cool  in  such  speculations. 
But  what  has  happened  lately  must  bring  the  most 
sanguine  to  their  senses.  It  requires  but  a  superfi- 
cial observation  of  what  is  passing  to  be  convinced, 
that,  independent  of  the  check  which  all  eager  enter- 
prise in  the  employment  of  capital  must  occasionally 


JEt.  38.]  CORRESPONDENClk  315 

meet  with  from  its  own  excess,  there  was  for  some  time 
an  artificial  state  of  prices  and  credit  in  this  country, 
which  (even  if  it  could  be  revived  once  more  for  a  little 
while)  cannot  be  much  lo'^iger  maintained  ;  and  that  our 
unexampled  wars  have  made  an  encroachment  upon  the 
substantial  wealth  of  the  whole  body  of  the  people,  which 
could  not  fail  at  last  to  become  visible  to  the  dullest  eye, 
and  be  felt  everywhere.    The  distress,  as  a  national  one, 
will  soon,  I  believe,  pass  off,  except  in  what  regards  the 
finances  of  the  government;  because  the  real  wealth 
that  is  accumulated  and  remains  is   immense,  and   is 
shifted  and  applied  with  a  promptitude  and  confidence 
never  known  among  any  other  people.     But  the  pre- 
sent crisis  must  be  felt  severely  by  individuals,  and,  as 
in  the  progress  of  our  artificial  opulence,  there  was  much 
derangement  of  property,  and  many  a  sudden  as  well  as 
unjust  transfer,  something  of  the  same  sort  is  to  be  ex- 
pected while  things  are  falling  back  towards  a  more  na- 
tural state.     I  believe  it  to  be  very  fortunate  for  us, 
that  they  have  been  forced  back  so  soon,  and  in  a  man- 
ner which,  to  me  at  least,  was  wholly   unlooked  for. 
For,  if  I  am  not  wrong  in  my  way  of  seeing  it,  it  is  the 
very  prosperity  and  improvement  of  the  country  in  its 
first  of  all  branches,  the  agricultural,  which  has  wrought 
the    sharp  but   sure  remedy  for  all  the   errors  of  our 
policy.      What  I  mean  is  this.      The   great  exertions 
made  in  husbandry  have  at  length  given  us  so  large  an 
annual  produce,  that  for  three  successive  years  (no  one 
of  which  has  been  very  remarkably  fine)  we  have  had 
some  surplus  of  our  own  growth,     That  surplus,  in  the 
comparative  state  of  our  prices  and  those  abroad,  could 
not  be  sold  to  any  foreign  consumer.     The  smallest  sur- 
plus, it  is  well  known,  if  thrown  back  upon  the  market 
and  kept  there,  may  depress  it  almost  indefinitely.    The 


316  CORKESPONDENCE.  [1816. 

great  fall  of  prices  we  have  experienced  brought  a  very 
sudden  embarrassment  upon  the  farmers  and  proprietors. 
This  not  only  alarmed  all  the  reasonable  bankers  in  the 
provinces,  but  actually  withdrew  great  part  of  the  foun- 
dation upon  which  both  the  reasonable  and  the  foolish 
bankers  had  so  long  maintained  their  large  issues  of 
country  paper.  By  far  the  greatest  banker  in  the  west 
of  England  told  me  the  other  day,  that  their  circulation 
was  not  now  much  more  than  a  fourth  of  what  it  had 
been.  The  reduction  in  the  quantity  of  money  has  been 
followed  by  a  fl\ll  in  the  nominal  price  of  the  jDrecious 
metals,  an  improvement  of  all  the  exchanges,  a  fall  in 
the  wages  of  labour,  and  one  after  another  of  various 
commodities,  some  being  reached  much  sooner  than 
others.  Here  then  we  arrive  at  a  point,  at  which  mat- 
ters begin  to  take  a  favourable  turn ;  the  low  money 
price  which  the  grower  gets  for  his  corn,  being  already 
a  better  price  in  reality  than  the  same  money  price 
would  have  been,  while  money  was  more  abundant. 
Unfortunately  things  cannot  go  quite  round,  at  least  not 
smoothly.  The  public  debt  that  was  contracted  while 
the  money  was  abundant  and  low  priced,  and  the  taxes 
that  must  continue  to  be  raised  to  pay  the  interest 
of  that  debt,  w^ill  still  make  our  expenses  of  cultiva- 
tion so  high,  that  we  cannot  grow  corn  for  the  price  of 
the  foreign  market ;  so  that  it  would  seem  that,  as  long 
as  the  expenses  of  cultivation  are  kept  up  to  that  rate, 
we  must,  in  order  to  secure  our  farmers  a  fair  price,  grow 
less  than  we  actually  can  consume  ourselves.  Tell  me, 
how  many  blunders  there  are  in  this  deduction, — of 
course,  I  have  stated  it  but  roughly.  I  need  not  add, 
that  the  only  practical  measure  to  which  I  can  look,  as 
holding  out  any  promise  of  easing  the  present  suffering, 
would  be  such  a  reduction  of  establishments,  as  would 


2Et.  38.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  317 

render  it  practicable  for  the  government,  without  violat- 
ino-  any  of  its  engagements  to  the  pubUc  creditor,  to  re- 
move a  large  proportion  of  the  taxes  that  press  most  di- 
rectly and  heavily  upon  the  capital  employed  in  cultiva- 
tion. 

Ever  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CCLVI.    TO  HIS   SISTER,  mSS  ANNE  HORNER. 

My  dear  Nancy,  London,  29th  Jan.  isie. 

I  have  several  of  your  kind  letters  to  acknow- 
ledge, which  always  give  me  a  very  real  pleasure.  I 
believe  I  have  never  told  you  how  much  pleased  I  was 
to  find  you  had  read  Mr.  Stewart's  Dissertation,  and  with 
so  true  a  taste  of  what  forms  its  chief  excellence.  I 
entirely  agree  with  you  that  the  high  and  uniform  tone 
of  the  purest  and  noblest  morality,  which  breathes 
through  the  whole  composition,  is  its  principal  charm,  as 
it  is  that  which  distinguishes  Mr.  Stewart's  writings, 
even  more  than  his  unrivalled  beauty  of  style,  from  all 
the  other  works  of  the  present  day.  It  is  like  going 
into  another  climate,  to  pass  to  the  serene  and  great 
prospects  which  he  gives  to  the  eye,  and  over  which  he 
spreads  so  many  beauties  of  detail  and  so  much  senti- 
ment, from  the  factious  fever  or  flippant  ingenuity  which 
are  so  much  the  mode  among  his  contemporaries. 

After  having  made  this  experiment,  I  think  you  need 
not  be  deterred  by  the  titles  of  his  other  books,  from 
dipping  at  least  into  some  parts  of  them.  I  will  propose 
to  you  particular  portions ;  if  you  will  go  through  them 
in  the  order  in  which  I  set  them  down,  I  think  you  will 
derive  both  gratification  and  improvement  from  them. 

27* 


318  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1816. 

In  the  first  vol.  of  the  Philosophy  of  the  Mind :  — 

1.  The  chapter  on  Memory. 

2.  That  on  Imagination. 

3.  Part    Second    of  tlie  chapter    on   Associations, 

where  he  treats  of  its  influence  on  the  intel- 
lectual and  active  powers. 
In  the  volume  of  Philosophical  Essays :  — 

4.  The  two  Essays  on  Taste,  and  the  culture  of 

habits  connected  with  it. 

5.  Essay  on  the  Beautiful. 

In  the  second  vol.  of  the  Philosophy  — 

6.  The  last  hundred  pages. 

You  will  not  find  any  of  this,  at  least  very  little  of  it, 
"  above  your  comprehension ; "  in  all  that  he  writes 
about  the  improvement  and  cultivation  of  taste,  you 
will  find  perpetual  opportunities  to  apply  his  remarks 
to  a  variety  of  subjects  and  pursuits,  which  have  more 
or  less  occupied  you  for  some  years  past.  You  must 
know  I  told  Mrs.  Stewart  you  had  ventured  into  the 
Dissertation,  and  I  mentioned  to  her  the  particular 
delight  you  found  in  the  moral  impressions  you  received 
from  it.  She  told  me,  Mr.  Stewart  was  flattered  by  your 
remark ;  he  said,  that  these  are  the  invaluable  praises, 
from  a  simple  heart  and  unspoiled  taste ;  and  that  an 
author  is  sure  he  is  right,  when  such  readers  are  satisfied. 
Good  night,  my  dear  Nancy ;  as  it  is  not  likely  I  shall 
have  any  thing  to  add  on  Monday,  I  will  at  once  finish 
my  epistle. 

Affectionately  yours. 

Era.  Horner. 


jEt.  38.]  CORRESrONDENCE. 


Letter  CCLVII.     TO  THE  DUCHESS  OF  SOMERSET. 

Dear  Duchess  of  Somerset,  London,  29th  Jan.  i8ic. 

From  all  I  can  hear,  there  is  no  chance  of  a  divi- 
sion in  the  House  of  Lords  the  first  day.  The  first 
important  debate  there  will  probably  be  upon  the  Trea- 
ties, after  they  have  been  laid  by  the  Crown  before  Par- 
liament ;  and  it  can  hardly  take  much  less  than  a  fort- 
nierht  to  read  and  consider  them.  Lord  Grenville  will 
bring  forward,  I  expect,  a  specific  question  upon  the 
violation  of  the  constitution,  of  which  he  thinks  the 
Ministers  have  been  guilty,  in  not  asking  the  sanction  of 
Parliament  to  their  treaty  of  peace,  before  they  proceeded 
in  execution  of  it,  particularly  with  so  new  a  stipulation 
contained  in  it,  as  the  maintenance  of  an  English  army 
in  France  during  peace.  But  he  will  of  course  give 
ample  notice  of  this  motion,  which  is,  no  doubt,  one  of 
high  importance. 

I  fear  we  are  not  likely  to  go  on  long  very  harmo- 
niously in  opposition ;  there  are  such  wide  and  irrecon- 
cileable  differences  of  opinion,  between  those  who;  on 
the  one  hand,  will  hear  of  nothing  but  a  return  to  all 
that  was  undone  by  the  French  revolution,  and  who,  in 
the  present  moment  of  success,  declare  views  of  that 
sort  which  they  never  avowed  to  the  same  extent  before, 
and  those  who,  on  the  other  hand,  think  that  the  French 
people  have  some  right  to  make  and  mend  their  govern- 
ment for  themselves,  and  who  are  not  prepared  to  adopt, 
under  a  new  and  not  a  much  better  name,  the  old 
exploded  doctrines  of  divine  right,  kingcraft,  and  passive 
obedience.  If  this  was  only  a  speculative  interest  felt 
by  us  in  the  affairs  of  France  as  spectators,  we  might 
differ  in  sentiment,  and  go  on  together  with  respect  to 


320  HOUSE  OF  COMMONS.  [1816. 

the  concerns  of  our  own  country,  with  which  those  of 
France  ought  not  to  be  so  much  mixed ;  but  this  treaty 
for  putting  down  by  force  of  arms  whatever  the  kings 
combined  may  think,  or  choose  to  call,  revolutionary 
movements,  is  such  a  conspiracy  against  the  rights  and 
liberties  of  mankind,  as  it  is  impossible  to  refrain  from 
condemning  and  resisting.  You  may  expect  very  soon 
to  see  a  breach  in  the  opposition ;  I  think  it  cannot  be 
averted  much  longer.  It  is  this  circumstance  which 
makes  Lord  Grey's  absence  at  this  moment  so  peculiarly 
unfortunate  for  those  who,  as  I  do,  agree  with  him  in 
the  way  of  seeing  all  these  things,  and  look  up  to  him 
as  their  head.  I  am  particularly  obliged  to  your  Grace 
for  allowing  me  to  read  the  inclosed  letter,  which  I 
return  with  my  best  thanks.  Believe  me  ever  your 
obliged  and  sincere 

Era.  Horner. 

P.  S.  —  I  am  very  sorry  to  add,  that,  since  the  date  of 
Lady  Grey's  letter,  he  has  had  another  very  severe 
attack. 


Parliament  met  on  the  1st  of  February,  and  an 
amendment  to  the  address  to  the  Prince  Regent,  on  the 
first  day  of  the  session,  was  moved  by  Mr.  Brand,  and 
seconded  by  Lord  John  Russell,  —  that  it  was  the  duty 
of  Ministers  to  have  convened  Parliament  with  the  least 
possible  delay,  for  the  purpose  of  communicating  those 
important  treaties  with  the  allies,  and  with  France, 
which,  after  having  been  acted  upon  for  several  months, 
were  then  about  to  be  laid  before  the  House;  and 
pledging  the  House  to  a  speedy  revisal  of  the  civil  and 


JEt.  38.]      AMENDMENT  ON  THE  ADDRESS.         321 

military  establishments,  according  to  the  principles  of 
the  most  rigid  economy,  and  a  due  regard  to  the  public 
interests.  This  amendment  was  supported  by  Mr. 
Brougham,  Lord  Milton,  and  Sir  Samuel  Romilly ;  and 
after  the  latter  sat  down,  Lord  Castlereagh  spoke  in  sup- 
port of  the  Address.  Mr.  Horner  then  rose  and  said,  — 
"  The  noble  lord  who  had  just  sat  down  had  stated, 
that  the  House  in  acceding  to  the  proposed  Address 
would  pledge  themselves  to  approve  of  the  peace,  as 
being  more  glorious  than  any  which  had  been  obtained 
at  the  close  of  former  wars.  Against  this  proposition  he 
must  protest.  He  understood  the  Address  to  congratu- 
late the  Prince  Regent  on  the  peace,  and  on  the  unri- 
valled successes  which  had  blessed  his  Majesty's  arms  in 
the  progress  of  the  war  just  concluded ;  and,  without 
any  reference  to  party,  he  thought  no  man,  who  felt  as 
an  Englishman,  could  do  other  than  exult  in  those  tri- 
umphs, which  had  placed  the  military  character  of  this 
country  on  a  pinnacle  which  it  had  never  before  reached. 
He  could  not,  however,  give  the  peace  the  unqualified 
approbation  which  the  noble  lord  seemed  to  expect,  till 
the  treaties  were  before  the  House.  When  these  were 
examined  into,  he  should  be  glad  to  find  that  the  peace 
was  really  one  which,  while  it  gave  other  advantages, 
sustained,  at  the  same  time,  the  British  character  for 
good  faith.  He  had  no  doubt  the  noble  lord  thought  it 
merited  this  praise  ;  but  from  some  rumours  which  had 
got  abroad  in  Europe,  he  should  feel  it  to  be  his  duty 
to  look  closely  into  it,  to  satisfy  himself  that  in  this  the 
noble  lord  was  right.  With  respect  to  the  commerce 
and  internal  state  of  the  country,  he  should  reserve  him- 
self till  the  necessary  papers  were  before  the  House, 
and  these  were  subjects  which  he  should  be  careful  not 
to  mix  with  the  questions  of  peace  and  negotiation.     He 


322  AMENDMENT  ON  THE  ADDRESS.  [1816. 

was  aware  the  conclusion  of  a  war  in  every  community, 
more  especially  in  one  so  complicated  as  that  of  Eng- 
land, must  create  some  temporary  distress  j  but  he  was 
afraid,  that  which  was  now  complained  of  would  be 
found  to  bear  another  character,  and  that  the  remedy 
would  not  be  easily  supplied.     He  trusted  the  Minister 
was  not  disposed  to  propose,  or  the  House  to  adopt,  any 
new  departures  from  the  principles  of  our  ancient  laws 
and  policy.     He  was  led  to  make  this  remark,  from  a 
suggestion  thrown  out  by  his  honourable  and  learned 
friend,  with  regard  to  an  alteration  of  some  of  the  exist- 
ing laws.     The  present  amount  of  the  taxes  he  believed 
to  be  the  source  of  the   evil  complained  of,  and  this 
could  never  be  remedied,  but  by  going  to  the  root  of 
the  present  system  of  taxation.     He  agreed  with  the 
noble  lord,  that  whatever  pressure  might  be  complained 
of,  it  was  desirable  to  leave  the  Sinking  Fund  unbroken 
and  unimpaired.     But  if  this  was  suffered  to  remain 
untouched,  how  were  the  public  burthens  to  be  dimi- 
nished ?     By  economy  alone.     It  was  not  to  be  effected 
by  economically  taking  off  two  or  three  hundreds  from 
one  item,  or  two  or  three  hundreds  from  another,  but 
by  the  introduction  of  the  most  rigid  economy  into  all 
departments,  and  by  reducing,  where  it  was  practical, 
the  military,  civil,  and  financial  departments.     He  hoped, 
in   the    course  of  the   present   session,   that   Ministers 
would  not  come  to  Parliament  to  ask  for  an  increase  of 
emolument  for  any  of  the  public  officers.     He  trusted 
they  should  not  again  hear  of  an  addition  to  the  salary 
of  this  Lord  Advocate  of  Scotland,  or  that  Commissioner 
of  Excise,  nor  an  extended  provision  for  this  or  that 
branch  of  the  royal  family.     He  hoped  the  House  would 
be  careful  to  make  Ministers  attentive  to  economy ;  that, 
by  timely  retrenchment,  the  difficulties  complained  of 


Mt.  38.]  BATTLE   OF  TRAFALGAR.  323 

might  be  met,  and  that  the  nation  would  never  be  forced 
to  the  last  and  most  desperate  expedient,  that  of  break- 
ing its  faith  with  the  public  creditor.  He  should  con- 
clude with  declaring,  that,  for  the  present,  he  would  give 
no  opinion  on  the  character  of  the  peace." 


BATTLE    OF   TRAFALGAR. 

On  the  5th  of  February,  Lord  Castle reagh  moved, 
— that  an  address  be  presented  to  the  Prince  Regent,  to 
represent  that  the  House  was  desirous  of  commemorat- 
ing the  splendid  achievements  of  the  British  navy  dur- 
ing the  late  wars,  by  erecting  a  national  monument  to 
its  most  signal  and  decisive  victory,  in  the  battle  of  Tra- 
falgar. Mr.  William  Dundas  differed  in  opinion  from 
the  noble  lord,  and  proposed,  that  a  monument,  or 
monuments,  should  be  erected  to  commemorate  all  their 
naval  victories  during  the  late  wars:  upon  this,  Mr. 
Horner  rose  and  said, — 

"  He  gave  full  credit  to  the  feelings  of  the  right  hon- 
ourable gentleman  (Mr.  Dundas)  in  the  wdsh  he  had  ex- 
pressed, to  see  a  monument  by  which  the  services  of  the 
whole  navy  might  be  commemorated,  and  in  his  fear 
that  any  one  of  our  great  naval  victories  might  pass 
without  its  appropriate  reward.  Certainly,  it  might  be 
desirable  to  recall  every  deed  of  glory  that  had  distin- 
guished our  naval  annals ;  particular  individuals  might 
feel  more  interested  in  one  action  than  in  another,  from 
their  connexions  and  relations  in  life,  and  might  be  con- 
vinced that  its  omission  was  injurious  to  the  memory  of 
those  engaged  in  it ;  still  he  thought  that  the  proposi- 
tion of  the  noble  lord  was  more  eligible,  than  that  which 
was  stated  by  the  right  honourable  gentleman  who 
spoke  after  him.     A  selection,  he  thought,  was  neces- 


324  NAVAL  VICTORIES.  [1816. 

sary  to  be  made  ;  and  if  tliere  was  to  be  a  selection,  on 
"vvliat  victory  could  we  fix  so  properly  as  upon  that  of 
Traflilgar  ?  It  was  undoubtedly  the  greatest  in  our 
naval  history,  in  whatever  point  of  view  it  was  con- 
sidered. It  was  not  only  transcendently  great  from  the 
skill  and  heroism  displayed,  but  important  from  its  poli- 
tical consequences ;  it  carried  the  naval  renown  of  this 
country  to  a  height  it  never  before  had  reached,  and 
left  us  not  only  without  a  rival,  but  without  an  enemy 
to  contend  with  on  the  sea.  If  the  plan  of  the  right 
honourable  gentleman  was  to  be  adopted,  and  our  late 
naval  victories  were  to  be  commemorated  in  their  order, 
where  could  we  stop,  or  to  what  class  of  actions  would 
we  confine  ourselve  •>  ?  There  would  be  great  difiiculty 
in  determining  what  victories  the  national  monument 
should  record,  without  incurring  the  imputation  of  in- 
vidious omission,  where  the  exclusion  commenced.  If 
the  skill  and  intrepidity  displayed  in  an  action  consti- 
tuted alone  a  sufficient  claim  to  participate  in  the  pre- 
sent measure  of  national  commemoration,  then  there 
were  no  limits  to  our  list  of  celebrated  battles,  or  great 
naval  commanders.  All  the  navy  had  distinguished  it- 
self in  every  encounter  with  the  enemy ;  and  there  was 
often  as  much  intrepidity,  as  much  experienced  skill  and 
determined  bravery,  displayed  in  engagements  with 
single  frigates,  in  capturing  a  gun-boat,  or  in  cutting  out 
a  vessel  from  a  hostile  port  under  the  fire  of  an  enemy's 
batteries,  as  in  gaining  any  of  the  victories  which  illus- 
trate our  naval  history.  The  right  honourable  gentle- 
man seemed  to  fall  into  a  mistake,  with  regard  to  the 
object  of  the  noble  lord's  proposition.  He  seemed  to 
imagine  that,  because  a  particular  victory  was  selected, 
the  monument  was  therefore  to  be  exclusive  ;  and  that 
because  the  battle  of  Trafak-ar  was  to  be  the  action 


^T.  38.]  PEACE  ESTABLISHMENT.  325 

on  which  the  admiration  of  the  country  was  to  rest, 
therefore  none  were  to  share  in  the  glory  of  it  but 
the  officers  who  were  actually  present.  This  was  a 
narrow  view  of  this  great  exploit,  it  was  a  view  that 
the  country  should  not  take  of  it.  The  House  should 
consider  it  as  an  instance  of  splendid  success  repre- 
senting the  whole  of  our  naval  glory.  It  was  to  be 
considered  as  the  property  of  the  whole  navy,  —  as  the 
fruit  of  the  superior  skill,  gallantry,  and  heroism  of  all 
our  naval  defenders,  —  as  the  consummation  of  our 
naval  glory.  He  trusted,  under  all  these  circumstances, 
that  the  right  honourable  gentleman  would  not  j^ersist 
in  his  ojDposition  to  the  noble  lord,  or  disturb  the  una- 
nimity which  ought  to  prevail  on  such  an  occasion." 


PEACE   ESTABLISHMENT. 

On  the  bringing  up  of  a  Report  of  a  Committee  of 
Supply  on  the  13th  of  February,  and  the  Chancellor  of 
the  Exchequer  having  moved  that  the  resolutions  should 
be  read,  Mr.  Wynn  expressed  his  entire  dissent  from 
the  financial  plan  Avhich  had  been  developed,  the  pre- 
ceding night,  by  the  Chancellor  of  the  Exchequer,  as 
well  as  from  the  whole  scale  of  establishments  there 
laid  down  ;  for  it  was  a  war  establishment  under  the 
name  of  peace.  He  was  followed  by  Mr.  Barclay, 
who  said,  that  as  he  was  one  of  the  first  to  concur  in  the 
enactment  of  the  property  tax,  at  a  moment  of  national 
exigency,  so  he  was  now  among  the  foremost  of  those 
who  called  for  its  repeal,  when  the  necessity  for  its  en- 
actment no  longer  existed.  After  he  had  spoken  at 
some  length,  Mr.  Horner  rose,  and  said,  — 

"  He  would  take  that  opportunity  of  asserting,  that 
the    people    could    not  be  relieved  from  their  present 

VOL.  IL  28 


326  PEACE  ESTABLISHMENT.  [1816. 

appalling  difficulties  in  any  other  than  one  way; 
namely,  by  a  reduction  of  the  proposed  peace  estab- 
lishment. It  was  in  vain  to  listen  to  the  suggestions 
of  those  who  recommended  a  little  loan;  suggestions 
which,  by  the  way,  might  be  merely  intended  to  sound 
the  House,  upon  the  practicability  of  such  a  mode  of 
proceeding.  All  this  was  a  plain  and  palpable  delusion ; 
the  difficulties  of  the  country  were  most  urgent  and 
pressing,  they  must  be  met ;  and  if  Ministers  could 
show,  that  there  really  existed  a  necessity  for  the  main- 
tenance of  the  proposed  system,  he,  for  one,  would  not 
hesitate  to  vote  for  the  property  tax.  But  he  was 
firmly  satisfied  they  were  totally  incapable  of  estabhsh- 
ing  that  necessity.  He  had  indeed  consented  to  the 
enactment  of  that  tax,  during  the  war,  although  per- 
suaded of  its  odious,  oppressive,  burthensome,  inquisi- 
torial character;  because  he  felt  the  force  of  that 
policy  which  compelled  its  existence.  Those  times  had 
now  passed  away,  and  the  real  question  for  the  Com- 
mons of  England,  in  the  exercise  of  their  sacred  trust, 
was  at  once  to  say  aye  or  no  to  the  momentous  propo- 
sition now  submitted  to  their  consideration.  Was  it  neces- 
sary to  support  50,000  troops  for  the  British  Isles  ?  Was 
it  necessary  to  erect  a  peace  establishment  of  150,000 
men  ?  In  his  opinion,  he  would  reply  no ;  and  he  would 
affirm  and  maintain  that  negative,  through  every  part 
of  the  details  which  it  was  said  were  to  be  forthcom- 
ing. The  situation  of  the  country  was  not  what  it 
had  been  but  a  few  years  ago.  Was  the  necessity 
of  defence,  he  should  ask,  greater  or  smaller  than  at 
the  period  to  which  he  would  allude  ?  France,  at  the 
close  of  the  American  war,  had  a  navy  almost  at  our 
shores,  and  superior,  perhaps,  to  the  fleets  destined  for 
our  protection.     Spain  and  Holland  had  also  a  maritime 


2Et.  38.]  PEACE  ESTABLISHMENT.  327 

strength  of  no  inconsiderable  magnitude.  All  these 
external  considerations  had  happily  disappeared ;  the 
safety  of  our  colonial  settlements  was  also  placed  on  a 
steady  footing;  and  yet  the  country  was  required  to 
keep  up  a  military  force  of  an  enormous  and  most  un- 
exampled extent.  If  such  a  peace  establishment  as 
this  were  listened  to  by  the  people  of  England,  he 
would  predict,  from  a  measure  so  alien  to  their  system, 
the  downfall  of  their  liberty  and  constitution  in  a  very 
few  years.  It  was  nothing  less  than  a  project  to  alter 
the  uniform  policy  of  Great  Britain,  and  to  amalgamate 
her  character  with  that  of  the  military  states  in  Europe, 
by  a  total  subversion  of  the  principles  of  her  constitu- 
tion. From  her  insular  situation,  she  was  by  nature  a 
naval  and  maritime  state ;  and  to  the  preservation  and 
cultivation  of  the  advantages  necessarily  belonging  to 
that  state,  she  was  paramountly  bound  to  adhere.  She 
might,  indeed,  be  dazzled  with  the  newly  acquired 
glories  of  her  army  ;  she  might  take  her  rank  with  the 
despots  of  the  Continent ;  but  in  vain  could  she  expect 
to  prolong  the  native  pride  of  her  free  character.  The 
two  systems  were  incompatible.  Either  the  government 
or  the  military  establishment  must  give  way ;  and  when 
the  question  was  a  struggle  for  ascendency,  between 
liberty  and  the  constitution  on  the  one  hand,  and  power 
and  despotism  upheld  by  a  military  establishment  on 
the  other,  the  warning  experience  of  history  proclaimed, 
that  the  stru<2;2;le  was  short,  and  the  termination  most 
ruinous.  Independently  of  these,  to  him  conclusive  rea- 
sons against  the  adoption  of  the  present  measure,  the 
financial  state  of  the  country  presented  an  unanswer- 
able argument  on  the  same  side.  He  would,  therefore, 
protest  against  it  altogether,  and  insist  that  it  was  a 
mere  delusion  to  talk  of  expedients,  and  to  hope  for  a 


328  IRISH  GRAND  JURY  LAWS.  [1816. 

diminution  of  burthens,  if  the  proposed  establishment 
was  to  be  maintained.  If  the  people  were  to  hope  for 
relief,  they  had  but  one  chance  of  having  their  expecta- 
tions realised,  and  that  was,  by  a  reduction  of  the  peace 
establishment." 


IRISH    GRAND    JURY    LAWS. 

On  the  14th  of  February,  Mr.  Horner  brought  under 
the  consideration  of  the  House  a  measure  of  great  im- 
portance, connected  with  the  administration  of  justice 
in  Ireland.  He  stated,  that  an  extraordinary  practice 
prevailed,  in  the  proceedings  of  the  grand  juries,  of  find- 
ing bills  of  indictment  upon  the  mere  depositions  ob- 
tained from  witnesses  by  the  magistrates,  without  any 
resort  to  parole  evidence,  and  that  this  practice  was  estab- 
lished over  the  greater  part  of  Ireland.  That  it  was  not 
of  recent  growth,  but  almost  as  ancient  as  it  was  uni- 
versal ;  for  it  had  prevailed  so  long,  that  the  records  of 
the  courts-  scarcely  reached  back  to  a  time  when  it  did 
not  exist.  That  it  was  almost  unnecessary  to  say  how 
different  this  was  from  the  practice  that  prevailed  in 
England,  where  the  witnesses  of  the  prosecutor  were 
sworn  and  examined  before  the  grand  jury.  That  the 
common  law  of  England  and  Ireland  were  the  same ;  and 
that  in  determining  what  was  proper  to  be  done,  we 
had  only  to  inquire  what  was  the  law  of  England ;  and 
though  an  opposite  practice  had  been  long  established 
in  the  sister  kingdom,  the  length  of  usage  was  no  suffi- 
cient bar  against  a  return  to  the  punctual  administra- 
tion of  it.  That,  by  this  practice,  Ireland  was  deprived 
of  a  most  important  privilege ;  and  there  was  nothing 
that  could  be  more  essential  to  the  interests  and  rights 
of  those  individuals  who  were  exposed  to  trial,  whether 


^T.  38.]  IRISH   GRAND  JURY  LAWS.  399 

justly  or  unjustly,  than  restoring  this  privilege.  That, 
for  this  purpose,  there  would  be  no  necessity  for  an  en- 
acting statute,  but  merely  for  a  declaratory  one ;  that 
any  other,  besides  being  useless,  would  have  the  appear- 
ance of  altering  the  common  law  of  the  land.  He  con- 
cluded by  moving,  "  for  leave  to  bring  in  a  Bill  to 
declare  the  law  for  the  right  proceeding  of  grand  juries 
in  Ireland  upon  bills  of  indictment." 

The  Bill  was  strongly  opposed  by  the  Judges,  and 
by  many  eminent  lawyers  in  Ireland,  and  was  in  con- 
sequence retarded  in  its  progress  ;  but  it  passed  into  a 
law  before  the  close  of  the  session.  It  was  the  last  mea- 
sure which  Mr,  Horner  originated  in  Parliament,  and 
was  one  to  which  he  attached  great  importance.  I  am, 
for  this  reason,  induced  to  give  a  detailed  statement  of 
the  origin  and  progress  of  the  measure  ;  and,  by  a  slight 
deviation  from  chronological  order,  I  can  give  this 
account  in  Mr.  Horner's  own  words,  in  the  following 
letter  to  Mr.  Murray,  instead  of  having  recourse  to  the 
imperfect  records  of  the  proceedings,  in  the  successive 
stages  of  the  Bill,  contained  in  Hansard's  Debates. 

Mv  dear  MurraV  Woburn  Abbey,  !)tli  July,  181G. 

You  desire  to  have  some  account  of  my  Irish 
Grand  Jury  Bill.  The  history  of  it  is  this.  In  reading 
a  pamphlet  pubUshed  by  Mr.  Piice%  an  Irish  country 
gentleman,  upon  the  subject  of  their  money  present- 
ments, I  was  much  surprised  to  find  a  statement  by  him, 
that  the  grand  juries  of  that  country,  in  their  proceed- 
ings upon  criminal  charges,  frequently  found  the  bills 
without  examining  witnesses,  upon  the  mere  inspection 
of  the  depositions  taken  by  the  committing  magistrates. 


*  Thomas  Spring  Rice,  Esq.,  the  present  Lord  Monteagle. 

28=^ 


330  IRISH   GRAND  JURY  LAWS.  [1816. 

This  instance  of  the  corruption  of  law  and  justice  in  that 
neglected  country,  and  of  the  manner  in  which  the  gen- 
try disregard   the  rights  of  the  lower  orders,  made  so 
strong  an  impression  upon  me,  that  when  I  was  named  a 
member  of  the  committee  upon  presentments,  I  thought 
that  an  opportunity  not  to  be  lost  for  ascertaining  the 
extent  of  so  culpable  a  practice.     We  examined  as  wit- 
nesses  most  of  the    county   members   of  Ireland,  and 
many  other  gentlemen  who  had  served  as  grand  jurors; 
I  started  the  inquiry  with  the  very  first  of  them,  and 
the  committee  followed   it  up  with    the  rest,  and  the 
result    ascertained   was,   that    with    very   few    excep- 
tions, the  general  practice  of  the  grand  juries  was  to 
find  their  bills  without  examining  witnesses,  "unless," 
(as   the   Irish    gentlemen    very   simply    said,)    "  unless 
they    had    doubts ; "    and    with    the    universal    excep- 
tion of  bills   for   one    crime,  which  you    will   think  a 
curious    one,    rape,    in    which    they   always  made  the 
witness,  that  is,  the   woman,  tell  the  story.     The  Eng- 
lish  members   of  the    committee    were    much    scanda- 
lised at  this  discovery,  and,  with  the  assistauce  of  the 
most  respectable  Irishmen  upon  it,  we  tried  a  propo- 
sition for  a  special  report  to  the  House  upon  this  parti- 
cular point;  but  we  were  left  in  a  minority,  PeeP^=   and 
Fitzgerald  taking  a  strong  part  against  us.     I  then  told 
the   committee,  that  the  thing  seemed  to  me  so  import- 
ant that  I  would  take  it  upon  myself  to  bring  it  Ijefore 
the  House,  and  I  gave  notice  immediately  of  a  bill  to 
declare  the  law.     In  the  interval,  after  my  notice,  Peel 
had  an   opportunity   of  consulting  the  crown   lawyers 
here,  wdio  told  him,  of  course,  that  the  practice  in  Ire- 
land could  not  be  vindicated,  but  was  clearly  against 

*  The  present  Sir  Robert  Peel,  then  Chief  Secretary  for  Ireland. 


JEt.  38.]  IRISH  GRAND  JURY  LAWS.  33I 

law.  On  the  other  hand,  after  a  correspondence  with 
the  Irish  Chancellor  and  the  Judges,  he  found  them  ill 
prepared  to  admit  a  correction  of  the  practice,  and  very 
sore  under  the  apprehension  that  their  conduct  woidd 
he  reprobated  for  allowing  such  a  deviation  from  the 
certain  and  clear  principle  of  the  constitution  to  exist  in 
practice.  This  conflict  of  authorities  embarrassed  Peel ; 
and  as  the  summer  assizes  were  approaching,  he  natu- 
rally felt  some  anxiety  at  the  prospect  of  so  important 
a  change  being  suddenly  forced  upon  the  judges  and 
grand  juries. 

He  applied  to  me,  therefore,  with  a  request  that  I 
would  postpone  my  motion  to  the  following  session, 
stating,  at  the  same  time,  his  conviction  that  something 
ought  then  to  be  done,  to  make  the  Irish  practice  con- 
formable to  the  English  law.  I  felt  it  to  be  of  so  much 
importance  to  secure  his  assent  to  the  measure,  that  I 
agreed  to  postpone  it ;  and  we  came  to  a  distinct  under- 
standing about  it,  one  point  only  being  left  open, — 
whether  it  should  be  a  declaratory  bill,  which  I  thought 
the  only  right  course,  or  an  enacting  one,  which  he 
thought  would  save  the  Irish  judges  from  immediate 
reproach,  and  the  past  proceedings  of  the  criminal 
courts  from  being  questioned  by  the  people.  In  the 
present  distracted  state  of  that  unhappy  country,  I  felt 
there  was  some  weight  in  this  last  suggestion. 

Upon  the  prorogation  of  Parliament,  feeling  this  to 
be  a  subject  of  considerable  moment,  I  thought  I  could 
not  do  better  than  write  to  Plunkett,  desiring  his  advice 
about  it,  and  communicating  to  him  my  own  notions,  as 
well  as  the  footing  upon  which  the  matter  stood,  under 
my  arrangement  with  Peel.  I  considered  it  as  very 
blameable  in  him,  that  the  whole  summer  passed  without 
my  receiving  any  answer  from  him.   And  his  subsequent 


332  IRISH  GRAND  JURY  LAWS.  [1816. 

conduct  lias  since,  to  my  mind,  explained  his  silence,  in 
a  manner  that  does  not  leave  a  very  satisfactory  impres- 
sion. 

As  soon  as  Parliament  met  again,  I  renewed  my  notice 
of  motion ;  and  obtained  leave  to  bring  in  my  bill,  with- 
out opposition  from  any  quarter :  I  determined,  however, 
not  to  press  it  on,  until  there  was  a  full  attendance  from 
Ireland,  and  until  they  had  every  opportunity  of  urging 
any  objections  they  had  to  it.  I  likewise  took  a  decided 
tone  of  proposing  it,  merely  as  a  prospective  measure, 
for  the  better  administration  of  justice  in  future,  without 
loading  any  persons  with  blame  for  what  they  had 
suffered  to  be  done.  I  took  this  course,  from  a  convic- 
tion of  the  necessity,  above  every  thing  else,  in  Ireland, 
of  maintaining  the  authority  and  character  of  the  judges, 
difficult  as  it  is  to  do  so.  I  found  that  Peel  adhered 
most  honourably  to  the  engagement  he  had  come  under ; 
but  he  informed  me,  that  the  Irish  judges  were  extremely 
hostile  to  my  bill,  and  denied  the  law  to  be  what  I  stated. 
He  communicated  to  me  a  variety  of  documents  which 
they  had  prepared  upon  the  subject ;  a  long  letter  from 
the  Lord  Chief  Justice  Downes  to  Lord  Chancellor 
Manners ;  and  an  account  of  solemn  deliberations  held 
by  the  Irish  judges,  so  far  back  as  the  year  1762,  at  a 
time  when  Mr.  Justice  Aston,  who  had  recently  gone 
over  there  from  Westminster  Hall,  told  them  their  prac- 
tice, in  this  respect,  was  a  violation  of  the  law ;  but  they 
solemnly  decided  that  it  was  very  good  law  for  Ireland. 
I  shall  be  glad  to  show  you  these  papers  one  day ;  a 
careful  examination  of  their  arguments  and  mistaken 
authorities  satisfied  me  of  two  things;  first,  that  they 
found  themselves  defending  a  practice,  which  they  were 
conscious  could  not  in  point  of  law  be  defended ;  and^ 
secondly,  that  it  was  so  inveterate  an  abuse  that  it  was 


^T.  38.]  IRISH  GRAND  JURY  LAWS.  333 

hardly  to  be  imputed  as  matter  of  blame  to  the  judges 
of  the  present  day,  that  they  went  on  with  what  they 
found  established. 

At  this  stage  of  the  business,  after  I  had  considered 
all  these  documents,  I  was  annoyed  with  at  length 
receiving  a  letter  from  Plunkett,  in  which,  to  my  morti- 
fication, I  found  that  he  was  in  the  same  strain  with  the 
judges,  repeated  to  me  all  their  feeble  reasonings  and 
ill-understood  authorities,  and  was  so  entirely  in  concert 
with  them,  that  he  sent  me  copies  of  the  same  papers 
which  they  had  laid  before  the  secretary.  I  determined, 
against  these  j)rejudices  of  the  Irish  lawyers  in  favour  of 
their  own  practice,  to  make  the  best  use  I  could  of  the 
prejudices  of  the  English  lawyers  in  favour  of  their  own 
law,  and  to  go  on  with  my  Bill ;  putting  off  the  discus- 
sion till  Plunkett  should  come  to  England.  Though  he 
professed  much  anxiety  to  oppose  it  in  Parliament,  he 
gave  me  no  opportunity  of  meeting  him  in  discussion ; 
for,  coming  over  while  we  were  all  upon  our  circuits, 
before  my  return  he  went  away  to  Paris,  and  in  his  way 
back  to  Ireland  only  stopped  a  day  for  Grattan's  ques- 
tion.    I  shall  show  you  his  letter  to  me. 

When  I  brought  on  the  Bill,  which  I  made  declaratory 
in  its  form,  avoiding  all  offence  in  the  preamble,  I  met 
with  no  serious  opposition ;  government  acceding  to  its 
propriety  and  necessity.  The  judges  employed  a  gen- 
tleman, who  is  come  in  for  Armagh,  as  Dr.  Duigenan's 
successor,  a  retired  barrister,  to  urge  their  objections  and 
their  authority  against  it ;  but  he  showed  no  knowledge 
or  ability,  and  was  not  even  worth  answering. 

Lord  Castlereagh  urged  me  to  admit  a  clause  into  the 
bill,  by  which  the  judges  are  permitted  to  give  the 
grand  juries  the  use  of  the  depositions,  in  order  to  guide 
them  in  their  examination  of  the  witnesses,  as  well  as 


334  IRISH  GRAND  JURY  LAWS.  [1816. 

to  enable  them  to  detect  prevarication  and  perjury  in 
the  grand  jury  room.  I  did  not  reUsh  this;  because 
what  the  judges  have  maintained,  against  every  princi- 
ple of  law,  is,  that  these  depositions,  though  no  evidence 
to  the  petty  jur}^,  were  good  lawful  evidence  to  the 
grand  jury.  I  was  afraid,  therefore,  of  compromising 
the  principle  of  my  Bill ;  but  he  and  other  Irishmen 
urged  so  much  the  difficulties  their  grand  juries  would 
at  first  experience,  and  the  danger  of  perjury  being  mul- 
tiplied and  crimes  compounded,  if  witnesses  for  the 
crown  knew  that  they  might  with  impunity  unswear  in 
the  grand  jury  room  what  they  had  sworn  before  the 
magistrate,  that  I  found  myself  under  the  necessity  of 
consenting  to  this  clause ;  but  I  insisted,  at  the  same 
time,  upon  guarding  it  with  words  that  should  expressly 
negative  the  doctrine  of  the  judges,  as  to  these  deposi- 
tions being  in  any  point  of  view  lawful  evidence,  or  to 
be  used  as  such.  And  so  the  bill  passed.  I  happened 
to  be  on  the  steps  of  the  throne  one  day,  when  Lord 
Ellenborough  came  to  tell  me  he  had  just  been  reading 
it,  and  he  saw  nothing  to  object  to  but  one  clause ;  this 
was  Castlereagh's  clause,  and  I  told  him  so :  he  said  he 
disliked  giving  these  Irish  gentlemen  any  rope,  they 
were  so  apt  to  swing  too  far. 

I  have  made  a  tiresome  history  of  this  little  produc- 
tion of  mine ;  but  when  I  began  to  tell  you  any  thing 
about  it,  I  did  not  know  how  to  tell  you  intelligibly  less 
than  the  whole.  It  is  likely  enough  that  some  difficul- 
ties will  be  found,  and  some  made,  in  the  first  applica- 
tion of  a  law  which  both  the  judges  and  the  grand  juries 
dislike ;  the  former,  because  it  has  been  thrust  upon 
them,  and  carries  by  implication  no  inconsiderable  cen- 
sure upon  their  past  administration  of  the  penal  law ; 
the  latter,  because  the  more  careful  performance  of  their 


^T.  38.]  IRISH  GRAND  JURY  LAWS.  335 

duty,  as  a  grand  inquest  upon  bills  of  indictment,  Avill 
keep  them  from  proceeding  at  once  to  their  more  agree- 
able function,  of  voting  money  to  themselves  for  their 
roads  and  other  jobs.  One  indirect  benefit  that  will  be 
derived  from  my  Act  is,  that  it  will  render  some  new 
arrangement  indispensably  and  immediately  necessary, 
with  regard  to  the  business  of  these  money  present- 
ments, which  ought  never  to  have  been  coupled  with 
the  proceedings  of  the  assizes.  But  the  chief  advantage 
and  main  argument  for  the  Bill  lies  in  its  principle  ;  by 
which  a  more  solemn  and  deliberate  administration  of 
the  law,  in  those  proceedings  which  affect  the  lower 
orders,  and  are  laid  open  to  their  inspection,  wall,  by 
degrees,  be  introduced  and  enforced.  This  is  one  only 
of  many  legislative  measures  that  are  called  for  with  the 
same  view.  One  of  the  great  sources  of  disorder  and 
violence  in  Ireland  is  admitted  to  be  the  habitual  want 
of  reverence  and  submission  to  the  law,  that  prevails 
among  all  classes  of  the  community ;  and,  it  must  be 
owned,  wdien  one  comes  to  see  in  detail,  how  the  most 
important  institutions  provided  by  the  law,  for  solemnity 
and  for  the  protection  of  innocence,  are  slighted  and 
perverted,  wherever  the  selfish  interests  of  the  squire- 
archy (as  it  has  been  humorously  called)  come  in  compe- 
tition, and  how  the  most  palpable  corruptions  and  abuses 
are  screened  by  the  prejudices  of  the  law^yers,  one  can 
hardly  wonder-  that  the  law  and  the  government  in  that 
country  are  so  little  revered  and  obeyed.  The  vindic- 
tive power  of  the  criminal  law,  and  the  rapacity  of  civil 
justice,  are  well  known  to  the  peasantry  and  the  rest  of 
the  lower  orders ;  but  it  is  only  as  a  punisher  and  oppres- 
sor that  it  is  known  at  all.  I  believe  there  is  no  parti- 
cular, in  police  or  administration,  in  which  the  present 
situation  of  Ireland  differs  more  from  that  of  the  whole 


336  IRISH  GRAND  JURY  LAWS.  [1816. 

of  this  island.     Let  me   at  last  release  you  from   this 
volume  of  a  letter. 

Yours  ever  affectionately, 

Fra.  Horner. 

In  the  year  1831,  Mr.  Spring  Rice  had  the  kindness 
to  send  me  two  letters,  which  he  had  received  from  my 
brother,  in  June,  1815,  when  his  attention  had  been  first 
directed  to  this  subject,  by  reading  the  pamphlet  of 
Mr.  Rice,  referred  to  at  the  beginning  of  the  above  let- 
ter to  Mr.  Murray,  a  copy  of  which  he  had  received 
from  the  author.  As  the  letter  to  Mr.  Murray  contains 
the  substance  of  Mr.  Horner's  letters  to  Mr.  Spring  Rice, 
it  is  unnecessary  to  insert  them  here  ;  but  Mr.  Rice, 
when  he  sent  them  to  me,  added  the  following  interest- 
ing statement,  which  renders  the  history  of  the  measure 
more  complete. 

"  Mr.  Spring  Rice  expressed  to  Mr.  Horner  his  anxiety 
that  the  bill  should  be  declaratory  rather  than  enacting, 
as,  if  the  latter  course  were  taken,  it  might  raise  doubts 
whether  the  law  of  evidence  was  the  same  in  both  parts 
of  the  empire,  and  inferences  might  even  from  thence 
be  raised  with  respect  to  the  whole  common  law  of  Ire- 
land. Mr.  Peel's  apprehensions  with  respect  to  the  feel- 
ings of  the  Irish  judges  were  fully  realised  by  the  event. 
It  is  generally  understood  that  those  functionaries  met, 
and,  w^ith  one  or  two  exceptions,  protested  against  Mr. 
Horner's  measure,  not  only  as  an  innovation  wholly 
uncalled  for,  but  as  one  which  stigmatised  the  judicial 
procedure  of  Ireland  as  unconstitutional  and  illegal.  It 
was  said  that  this  existing  system  had  never  been  com- 
plained of,  that  it  had  existed  from  time  immemorial, 
that  it  had  not  only  been  sanctioned  by  the  authority  of 


^T.  38.]  IRISH  GRAND  JURY  LAWS.  337 

the  most  eminent  practical  characters  in  modern  times, 
Chief  Baron  Hussey  Bm-gh,  Lord  Kilwarden,  Lord  Avon- 
more,  and  others,  but  that  Cliief  Baron  Gilbert,  recog- 
nised as  a  text  writer  on  the  law  of  evidence,  had 
approved  of  a  practice  which  the  rashness  of  modern 
reform  and  the  theories  of  a  Scotchman,  miacquainted 
with  Ireland,  its  wants,  or  interests,  sought  to  overthrow. 
Mr.  Horner's  intended  bill  was  made  the  matter  of  acri- 
monious animadversion  by  Lord  Norbury,  the  Chief  Jus- 
tice of  the  Common  Pleas.  This  learned  person  endea- 
voured to  raise  a  cry  against  the  change,  as  involving 
an  attack  upon  Ireland,  and  all  its  institutions.  These 
efforts  entirely  failed,  and  Mr.  Horner's  bill  was  carried 
without  any  parliamentary  opposition. 

"  The  importance  of  this  reform  can  hardly  be  suffi- 
ciently appreciated.  It  should  be  recollected  that  in 
1815,  and  indeed  it  may  be  added  in  later  times,  the 
state  of  the  Irish  magistracy  was,  to  use  the  words  of 
the  late  Mr.  Ponsonby  '  amj  ilmg  hut  loliat  it  ought  to  he! 
Divided  into  parties,  where  one  justice  of  the  peace 
committed,  his  neighbour  interfered  to  bail.  No  meet- 
ings at  petty  sessions  were  known ;  and  local  politics 
and  religious  differences  were  but  too  frequently  the 
causes  of  partiality  and  of  undue  bias.  Where  an  infor- 
mation was  sworn,  the  usual  course  taken  on  the  part  of 
the  person  charged  was  to  apply  to  a  magistrate,  and 
swear  a  cross  information  against  the  complainant.  Both 
parties  were  either  bailed  or  committed,  and  the 
aggrieved,  as  well  as  the  criminal  party,  was  sent  in,  to 
stand  trial.  A  person  who  might  be  an  inconvenient 
witness  was  included  in  the  information,  and  all  became 
confusion,  as  well  as  injustice.  The  magistrates  were 
careless,  even  when  they  were  not  open  to  more  serious 
suspicions.     But   when   the    name  of  the    committing 

VOL.  II.  29 


338  IRISH  GRAND  JURY  LAWS.  [1816. 

magistrates  came  before  the  grand  jury,  and  that  the 
committal  and  charge  were  compared  with  the  evidence 
for  the  prosecution,  in  the  presence  of  twenty-three  of 
the  principal  gentry  of  the  county,  much  more  discre- 
tion was  necessarily  used,  and  not  only  were  the  people 
protected  against  unjust  accusations,  but  a  reform  was 
necessarily  produced  in  the  conduct  of  the  magistracy. 
The  course  of  justice  became  more  certain,  the  number 
of  convictions  increased  in  proportion  to  the  commit- 
ments. The  system  of  indictment  and  cross  indictment 
was  checked;  and  though  it  was  expected  that  the 
business  of  grand  juries  Avould  become  more  heavy,  it 
was,  in  fact,  lightened,  and  performed  in  a  manner  in- 
finitely more  satisfactory. 

"  If  the  life  of  Mr.  Horner  had  been  spared,  he  would 
have  had  the  satisfaction  of  finding  that  all  parties,  even 
including  the  judges,  concurred  in  approving  of  his  Bill 
within  a  very  few  years  of  their  mistaken  and  jealous 
opposition.  The  magnitude,  as  well  as  the  effective 
nature  of  this  reform,  is  now  admitted  on  all  hands ;  and 
it  is  certainly  not  among  the  least  important  of  Mr. 
Horner's  services  in  Parliament,  to  have  succeeded  in  this 
great  reform,  opposed  as  he  was  by  those  whose  legal 
authority  presented  an  obstacle  difficult  to  be  overcome. 
The  conduct  of  the  Irish  judges  is  one  among  many 
proofs,  that  those  who  administer  the  laws  can  seldom 
bring  themselves  to  take  large  or  useful  views  of  legal 
reform.  Their  faggots  of  ideas  are  bound  up,  they  can- 
not bring  themselves  to  unloose  them,  and  the  very 
complexities  and  obscurities  which  are  sources  of  loss  and 
inconvenience  to  others  jDresent  to  them  difficulties  to 
be  overcome,  opportunities  of  gratifying  their  self-love, 
by  displays  of  learning,  and  proofs  of  ingenuity  and 
research." 


JEt.  38.]  TREATIES  OF  PEACE. 


TREATIES    OF   PEACE. 

On  the  second  day  of  the  session,  Lord  Castlereagh 
presented  to  the  House,  by  command  of  the  Prince  Re- 
gent, the  "  General  Treaty,  signed  in  Congress  at  Vienna, 
June  9,  1815,  with  the  acts  thereunto  annexed,"  and  on 
a  subsequent  day,  the  Definitive  Treaty  concUided  at 
Paris,  on  the  20th  of  November,  1815,  with  the  King  of 
France.  On  the  19th  of  February,  in  moving  an  Ad- 
dress of  Thanks  to  the  Prince  Regent  for  these  com- 
munications, he  entered  into  a  full  exposition  and  de- 
fence of  the  policy  of  the  allied  powers  in  the  arrange- 
ments which  took  place  at  the  Congress  of  Vienna,  in 
the  whole  course  of  the  measures  which  led  to  the  com- 
mencement, the  prosecution,  and  conclusion  of  the  war, 
occasioned  by  the  return  of  Bonaparte  from  Elba,  as 
well  as  the  subsequent  negotiations  of  Paris ;  and  he 
characterised  the  proceedings  of  the  Congress  of  Vienna 
as  being  only  a  definitive  arrangement  of  the  treaty  of 
peace  concluded  at  Paris,  in  May,  1814.  He  ended  by 
moving  a  series  of  resolutions,  expressing  the  satisfaction 
of  the  House  with  the  terms  of  these  treaties,  and  more 
particularly,  "  that  it  had  been  found  practicable  to  com- 
bine the  measures  which  Europe  owed  to  its  own  safety 
with  a  just  and  liberal  policy  towards  his  most  Christian 
Majesty." 

Lord  Milton  moved,  as  an  amendment,  a  series  of 
counter  resolutions,  condemnatory  of  the  policy  which 
had  been  pursued,  and  of  the  terms  of  the  treaties  which 
had  been  concluded.  This  amendment  was  supported 
by  Sir  James  Mackintosh  in  a  long  and  able  speech  -,  and 
after  he  sat  down  the  debate  was  adjourned.  It  was  re- 
sumed the  following  day,  when  Sir  Samuel  Romilly  fol- 


340  CORRESrONDENCE.  [1816. 

lowed  on  the  same  side,  reprobating  especially  the  estab- 
lishment of  Louis  XVIII.  on  the  throne  of  France,  by  a 
military  force,  against  the  will  of  the  nation. 

After  several  other  members  had  spoken,  Mr.  Horner 
rose,  late  in  the  evening,  and  delivered  a  speech  which 
appears  to  have  made  a  great  impression.  It  is  de- 
scribed by  Sir  Samuel  Romilly  in  his  Diary  *  as  having 
been  "admirable ;"  and  I  am  informed  that  the  Speaker, 
the  late  Lord  Colchester,  said  of  it,  that  it  was  "  most 
powerful,  argumentative,  and  profound,  and  altogether 
one  of  the  most  able  speeches  he  had  ever  heard  in  that 
House."  The  report  of  it,  as  given  in  Hansard's  De- 
bates, will  be  found  in  the  Appendix. 


Letter  CCLYIII.    TO  HIS  MOTHER. 
My  dear  Mother,  2ist  Feb.  18I6. 

I  have  not  time  to  write  more  than  a  few  lines 
to-day ;  for  after  being  up  nearly  all  night,  I  have  been 
very  busy  all  morning  in  the  House  of  Lords.  You  will 
find  I  w^as  busy  too  in  the  other  House ;  whether  the 
newspaper  gives  any  correct  account  of  me,  I  do  not 
know  yet,  for,  except  looking  at  the  praises  bestowed 
upon  me,  which  of  course  I  found  time  to  read,  I  have 
not  read  the  report.  My  friends  tell  me  I  did  well ;  and 
I  have  great  satisfaction  in  having  had  my  breath  out 
about  the  Bourbons  and  Castlereagh. 
My  kind  love  to  all  at  home. 

Most  affectionately  yours, 

Fka.  Horner. 

*  "  The  topics  on  -which  I  principally  dwelt  had  not  been  touched  upon  by 
speaker  who  had  pi'eceded  me ;  but  most  of  them  Avere  afterwards  very 


iEx.  38.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  341 

Letter   CCLIX.     FROM  JAMES  MACDONALD,  ESQ.* 

My  dear  Horner,  Calne,  22a  Feb.  18IG. 

I  really  cannot  resist  writing  you  a  line  to  con- 
gratulate you  on  your  brilliant  success  on  Tuesday 
night.  Even  the  outline  of  your  speech,  as  given  in 
the  Morning  Chronicle,  enables  me  to  judge  a  little  of 
the  nature,  and  of  the  value  of  the  speech  itself  There 
is  no  man  in  the  House  of  Commons,  in  whose  career  I 
feel  a  more  lively  interest  than  yours  ;  and  I  may  say  to 
you,  without  being  suspected  of  flattery,  that  the  im- 
pression you  have  already  produced  in  the  present  ses- 
sion miiversalhj,  must  be  a  cause  of  exultation,  though 
certainly  not  of  surprise,  to  your  friends.  This  is  one 
of  the  considerations  which  make  me  rejoice  in  return- 
ing to  Parliament :  my  election  takes  place  to-morrow. 

Yours  faithfully, 

J.  Macdonald. 

Letter  CCLX.    FROM  JOHN  WHISHAAV,  ESQ. 
My  dear  Horner  Lincoln's  inn,  24th  Feb.  1816. 

I  have  been  particularly  desirous  of  seeing  you 
lately,  to  congratulate  you  upon  3^our  speech  of  Tues- 
day, which  has  been  the  topic  of  conversation,  wherever 
I  have  been  for  the  last  two  or  three  days.  You  must 
already  have  felt  that  it  establishes  your  character  and 
station,  not  only  in  Parliament,  but  with  the  public ;  and 
that  it  is  universally  considered  as  a  most  important 


eloquently  enforced  in  an  admirable  speech  made  by  Horner."  —  Memoirs  of 
Sir  Samuel  Rotnilly,  vol.  iii.  p.  220,  1st  edition. 
*  Son  of  Sir  Archibald  Macdonald,  Chief  Baron  of  the  Court  of  Exchequer. 

29* 


342  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1816 

event  for  the  political  party  to  which  we  are  attached. 
It  is  needless  for  me  to  say  how  much  I  have  been  de- 
lighted with  all  I  have  heard  upon  this  mteresting  sub- 
ject from  various  quarters,  and  which  I  have  felt  almost 
as  a  matter  o^ personal  congratulation. 
I  remain,  my  dear  Horner, 

Ever  yours  most  truly, 

John  "Whishaw. 


Letter  CCLXI.     TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 

My  dear  Murray,  Temple,  27th  Feb.  i8i6. 

My  circuit  begins  on  the  5th  of  March  ;  but  my 
engagements  in  the  House  of  Lords  will  not  permit  me 
to  join  it  early,  perhaps  not  before  the  18th.  I  shall  be 
back  from  it  by  Friday,  the  5th  of  April,  and  from  that 
time  I  shall  remain  in  London. 

It  is  no  common  degree  of  gratification  to  hear  from 
you,  that  you  coincide  with  me  in  the  opinions  which  I 
have  been  lately  expressing  in  Parliament,  if  you  include 
in  that  approbation  my  sentiments  upon  the  Treaty  of 
Peace.  For  I  was  afraid  that  there,  perhaps,  you  might 
think  me  too  unfavourable  to  the  principles  and  views 
upon  which  the  precautionary  measures  of  the  allies  are 
founded.  My  disapprobation  of  what  has  been  done, 
and  my  apprehensions  concerning  its  future  conse- 
quences, are  no  doubt  derived  out  of  opinions  which  I 
have  long  held  fast,  yet  I  cannot  accuse  myself  of  hav- 
ing failed,  upon  the  present  occasion,  to  review  and  re- 
consider them  Avith  some  coolness  and  anxiety.  There 
are  changes  in  the  whole  frame  of  European  politics,  and 
in  our  domestic  scheme  of  liberties,  which  are  going  on 
much  faster  than  politics  ever  before  seemed  to  me  to 
move.     It  is  a  movement,  perhaps,  which  has  resulted 


^T.  38.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  343 

from  causes  that  were  put  in  action  long  ago,  though 
their  force  has  been  compressed  for  an  interval  by 
counteracting  circumstances,  which  have  been  suddenly 
removed.  In  the  most  formidable  periods  of  the  French 
military  power,  my  dread  never  was  of  its  prevailing 
against  us  in  this  island  by  conquest,  but  of  the  inroads 
that  our  s^^stem  of  defence  was  making  upon  the  consti- 
tutional forms  of  our  parliamentary  government,  and 
upon  the  constitutional  habits  of  the  English  commons. 

We  are  nearly  declared  to  be  a  military  power.  If 
this  design  is  not  checked,  of  which  I  have  slender  hopes, 
or  does  not  break  down  by  favour  of  accidents,  we  shall 
have  a  transient  glory,  for  some  little  while  ;  the  bravery 
of  our  men,  the  virtues  which  the  long  enjoyment  of 
liberty  will  leave  long  after  it  is  gone,  and  the  financial 
exertions  of  which  we  are  still  capable,  will  insure  us 
that  distinction ;  but  it  is  a  glory  in  which  our  freedom 
will  be  lost,  and  which  cannot  maintain  itself  when  the 
vigour,  born  of  that  freedom,  is  spent.  Do  not  tell  any 
body  of  these  gloomy  visions  of  mine ;  they  will  appear 
absurd  and  insincere ;  above  all,  do  not  tell  them  to 
Jeffrey,  or  I  shall  see  mj^self  niched  in  some  sentence 
against  moping  Whigs  who  love  Bonaparte.  I  have  in 
my  heart  infinitely  more  apprehension,  about  the  future 
fate  of  English  liberty,  than  I  ever  permit  myself  to 
express  in  public;  one  chance  of  preserving  it,  is  to 
keep  up  the  tone  of  the  public  sentiment,  particularly 
in  Parliament,  to  the  consciousness  and  confidence  of 
still  being  free.  I  heard  you  were  to  dine  at  my  father's 
last  Saturday ;  I  hope  you  had  a  pleasant  day. 
Most  affectionately  yours. 

Era.  Horxer. 


344  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1816. 


Letter  CCLXn.    TO  HENRY  HALLAM,  ESQ. 
My  clear  Hallam,  SidmoutL,  irth  March,  1816. 

One  of  my  sisters  desires  me  to  forward  the  en- 
closed letter  to  Mrs.  Hallam. 

I  fancy  you  will  not  agree  with  me,  in  being  sorry  to 
see,  that  nothing  has  been  said  by  any  body,  upon  the 
bills  relating  to  the  prisoner  at  St.  Helena,  expressive  of 
a  regret  that  it  was  cast  upon  this  country  to  execute  so 
odious  a  part  of  the  arrangements  to  which  the  victory 
of  Waterloo  has  led.  You  know  all  my  sentiments 
about  the  man,  how  little  I  share  any  of  that  admiration 
which  his  extraordinary  fortunes  and  character  have 
imposed  upon  some  persons,  and  how  much  I  execrated 
all  along  his  tyranny  and  military  ambition,  and  enmity 
to  all  civil  liberty.  At  the  height  of  his  power,  I 
expressed  myself  more  strongly  against  him  than  I  should 
permit  myself  to  do  pubhcly  now.  In  the  treatment 
he  has  met  with,  I  feel  no  inclination  to  deny,  that  the 
sparing  of  his  life  is  an  act  of  humanity,  such  as  is  not 
recorded  of  any  of  those  former  ages  in  which  such 
characters  and  events  are  to  be  found  :  yet  I  cannot  but 
feel,  at  the  same  time,  that,  when  a  few  years  more  are 
gone  by,  and  we  can  all  look  back  upon  these  transac- 
tions from  some  distance,  it  will  be  our  regret  and  morti- 
fication that  the  government  of  this  day  could  see  no 
safety  for  Europe  against  a  single  man,  but  in  transport- 
ing him  to  a  rock  in  the  ocean,  and  that  in  leaving  him 
his  life,  we  have  taken  all  that  can  make  life  any  thing 
but  a  torment.  I  do  not  mean  to  make  a  stronger  im- 
putation, than  that  we  have  been  wanting  in  magna- 
nimity, where  the  opportunity  was  obvious  and  com- 
manding.    But  this  country  has  reached  too  high  a  star 


JEt.  38.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  345 

ti'on,  to  be  at  liberty  to  miss  such  opportunities.  Our 
virtues  must  rise  with  our  fortune,  or  we  shall  be  thought 
to  have  been  unworthy  of  it:  a  large  and  secure  gene- 
rosity, is  one  of  the  conditions  by  which  we  are  to  hold 
our  greatness.  Instead  of  this,  we  have  treated  our 
captive  with  the  timid  severity  of  a  little  republic ;  and 
have  lowered  ourselves  to  the  notions  of  our  despot  allies, 
who  know  nothing  of  safety  but  in  force  and  bonds. 
Perhaps,  some  years  hence,  at  the  point  of  view  which  I 
anticipate,  I  shall  soberly  discover  all  this  to  be  a  ro- 
mance. I  can  say,  without  any  affectation,  that  I  shall 
have  nothing  but  pleasure  in  seeing  the  glory  of  the 
country  quite  clear  of  the  stain  which  I  think  I  see 
upon  it  at  present.  Do  you  hear  any  thing  of  Canning's 
coming  into  office  ?  I  wish  he  were  back  in  the  House 
of  Commons ;  it  would  refresh  one's  mind,  to  hear 
something  like  eloquence  again,  and  to  see  a  man  at 
work,  who,  with  all  his  faults,  owes  his  means  of  great- 
ness to  his  power  in  that  House.  His  faults,  it  must  be 
owned,  and  especially  his  late  errors,  are  miserable. 

Yours  ever  faithfully, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter   CCLXIH.    FROM  HENRY  HALLAM,  ESQ. 
My  dear  Horner,  Stamp  Office,  lOth  March,  1816. 

I  suppose  that  you  will  expect  me  to  begin  by 
congratulating  you  on  last  night's  division;*  hit,  all 
things  considered,  I  am  much  inclined  to  do  so,  not  as  a 
party  triumph,  for  I  scarcely  think  your  keenest  jim/Yz- 
sans  can  well  put  that  construction  on  it ;  but  for  one 
or  two  reasons  which  rather  overbalance,  in  my  mind, 

*  On  tlic  Property  Tax, when  Ministers  were  in  a  minority  of  thirty-seven. 


346  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1816. 

the  very  serious  evil  of  adding  to  our  enormous  debt  in 
time  of  peace.  These  reasons  are,  first,  the  extreme 
distress  which  prevails  in  many  parts  of  the  country, 
and  which  must  render  the  tax  almost  insupportable  ; 
and,  secondly,  the  danger  of  increasing  the  odium  under 
which  the  House  of  Commons  already  labours  among  a 
large  class  of  people,  by  so  decidedly  resisting  the  wishes 
of  the  nation. 

I  believe  this  division  was  wholly  unexpected  on  both 
sides.  Arbuthnot  calculated  on  a  majority  of  40 ;  Oppo- 
sition rather,  I  believe,  expected  to  lose  it  by  20.  Stur- 
ges  Bourne  alone,  of  those  I  happened  to  see,  appeared 
to  anticipate  this  result,  though  not,  of  course,  by  so 

great  a  difference  of  numbers.     Perhaps  poor  

will  be  made  the  scape-goat ;  for  you  see  that  Huskisson 
never  committed  himself  by  a  syllable  in  favour  of  the 
tax. 

Perhaps  I  do  not  very  clearly  understand  your  feel- 
ings about  Bonaparte.  It  must,  I  think,  be  admitted 
that  he  could  not  have  been  left  at  liberty  without  pro- 
digious risk  of  excitinsc  fresh  disturbance  in  the  unset- 
tied  state  of  Europe.  I  do  not  perceive  that  you  disa- 
gree from  this ;  yet  you  speak  of  the  opportunity  of 
acting  with  magnanimity  being  obvious  and  command- 
ing. God  forbid  we  should  be  influenced  by  the  base 
spirit  of  trampling  on  a  man  whom  we  certainly  feared, 
thoudi  we  did  not  flatter,  like  our  continental  allies.  I 
once  wished  that  Bonaparte  should  have  found  a  tran- 
quil asylum  in  this  island ;  but,  when  I  see  the  foolish 
admiration  which  many  persons  entertain  for  that  man, 
and  the  still  more  foolish  association  of  his  name  with 
the  love  of  liberty,  I  cannot  desire  to  see  his  court,  as  it 
were,  frequented  by  all  the  discontented,  as  well  as  all 
the  idle  and  curious.     Nor  do  I  think  it  would  be  easy 


^T.  38.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  ^^^ 

to  obtain  an  adequate  security  against"  his  escape  from 
this  country,  except  by  measures  ahnost  as  severe  as 
those  now  adopted  at  St.  Helena,  of  which  I  shoukl  be 
sorry  to  see  a  precedent  estabUshed  in  Britain.  The 
condition  of  Ireland  affords  another  argument  against 
allowing  him  to  reside  in  this  country.  As  to  the  degree 
of  confinement,  no  doubt  that  ought  to  be  as  slight  as 
is  consistent  wdtli  security.  The  precautions  now  taken 
appear  to  be  needlessly  vexatious;  and  if  he  requires 
to  be  watched  so  strictly  upon  his  rock,  it  must  be  a 
much  less  secure  place  of  confinement  than  it  has  been 
represented.  Perhaps  you  only  object  to  this  excess  of 
surveillance;  and  in  this  I  should  thoroughly  concur. 
But,  as  Europe  now  stands,  I  hardly  see  where  else, 
imless  it  were  Malta,  he  could  be  detained  with  safety. 
Ever  most  truly  yours, 

H.  Hallam. 

Letter  CCLXIV.     FROM  LORD  WEBB  SEYMOUR. 

My  dear  Horner,  Edinburgh,  27th  March,  isiG. 

For  a  long  while  past  I  have  been  anxious  to  write 
to  you  upon  a  subject  on  which  I  cannot  enter  without 
some  embarrassment.  Our  views  and  sentiments  upon 
politics  have  been  growing  wider  and  wider  apart  for 
the  last  two  years,  and  though  such  differences  between 
friends  must  be  expected  in  the  course  of  life,  and  mu- 
tually indulged,  yet  any  material  error  in  politics  threa- 
tens to  detract  so  much  from  your  high  character,  and 
so  much  from  the  good  which  your  talents  and  virtuous 
intentions  may  produce  to  the  country,  that  I  cannot 
refrain  from  telling  you  I  think  you  are  in  the  wrong, 
and  how  I  think  you  come  to  be  so.  That  you  think 
me  equally  in  the  wrong,  follows  of  course  ;  and  you  are 


348  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1816 

of  course  amply  prepared  with  a  defence  against  any 
argument  I  should  offer  against  the  opinions  you  have 
entertained  respecting  the  characters,  measures,  and 
events  of  the  grand  story  we  have  witnessed.  Such  dis- 
cussion could  only  have  the  effect  of  calling  up  your 
habitual  trains  of  thought,  and  those  warm  feelings 
which  they  have  produced,  and  which  in  turn  have  done 
so  much  to  produce  them.  I  shall  therefore  address  you 
in  another  way,  and  venture  to  place  my  authority  in 
the  balance  against  yours;  with  all  respect  for  your 
more  extensive  and  accurate  knowledge  upon  political 
matters,  your  closer  intercourse  with  men  and  things, 
and  your  daily  and  hourly  reflections  upon  them ;  yet 
trusting  on  my  side  to  the  calmness  of  the  station,  from 
which  I  am  allowed  to  look  on,  to  my  freedom  from  the 
keenness  of  party  warfare,  and  to  the  constant  exercise 
of  a  judgment,  which  my  friends  allow  to  be  tolerably 
candid  on  other  subjects,  and  for  which,  on  the  present, 
I  can  see  no  source  of  bias,  except  what  might  have 
disposed  me  to  lean  too  much  towards  your  side.  I  will 
tell  you  plainly  my  opinion  of  the  state  of  your  mind, 
and  leave  it  to  any  weight  that  I  may  have  with  you  to 
bring  that  opinion  under  your  serious  consideration  in 
some  quiet  hour. 

It  seems  to  me,  then,  that,  from  your  habitual  antipa- 
thy and  active  zeal  against  the  members  of  our  present 
government,  and  your  warm  attachment  to  friends,  Avith 
whom  every  private,  as  well  as  public,  feeling  has  made 
it  almost  a  religion  to  agree,  your  favour  and  aversion 
have  been  extended  to  every  person  and  event,  accord- 
ing to  their  connexion  with,  or  opposition  to,  the  one 
party  or  the  other.  Thence  has  arisen  the  indulgent 
tenderness  towards  Bonaparte  and  his  adherents,  —  a 
tenderness  which  always  increased,  not  so  much,  I  be- 


iET.  38.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  349 

lieve,  with  the  clechne  of  their  fortunes,  as  with  the 
swelHng  triumph  of  their  enemies:  thence  the  ready 
suspicion  of  meanness,  treachery,  and  selfishness  in  tlie 
alUes,  the  angry  censure  of  every  step  that  did  not 
accord  with  the  most  high-minded  notions  of  poUtical 
moraUty,  and  the  insensibility  to  a  generosity  and  recti- 
tude in  the  great  outlines  of  their  conduct,  to  which  the 
history  of  the  world  affords  few  parallels:  thence  the 
asperity  against  the  Bourbon  family,  whose  weakness 
and  bigotry  were  for  ever  dwelt  upon,  while  the  diffi- 
culties of  their  situation  were  forgotten,  and  what  was 
humane  and  liberal  in  their  policy  overlooked :  thence 
the  apprehensions  of  a  revival  of  a  superstitious  rever- 
ence for  royalty,  while  it  w^as  not  considered  that  the 
restoration  of  the  old  djaiasty  w^as  connected  with 
the  deliverance  of  Europe  from  the  threatening  evils  of 
a  military  despotism  of  the  most  profligate  character ; 
and  that  with  respect  to  France,  the  weakness  of  the 
executive  power  favoured  the  growth  of  civil  liberty  at 
home,  while  it  promised  security  to  her  neighbours. 
The  j)revalence  of  such  partial  views  in  your  mind  may, 
in  some  degree,  be  ascribed  to  certain  noble  sentiments, 
which  the  circumstances  of  the  times  made  you  cherish 
in  early  youth,  an  admiration  for  talent  and  energy  of 
character,  and  the  wish  to  see  those  only  who  possess 
them  at  the  head  of  affairs,  a  hatred  for  the  corruptions 
of  superannuated  governments,  and  bright  hopes  for  man- 
kind from  their  overthrow,  an  abhorrence  of  the  crafty 
domineering  of  priests,  and  a  scorn  of  the  ignorance,  the 
incapacity,  and  the  low  vices,  so  often  occurring  in  the 
families  of  princes,  when  the  line  has  long  been  seated 
quietly  on  the  throne.  But  the  main  source  of  bias  is 
the  constant  society  of  your  party  friends  in  London. 
I  can  conceive  no  situation  more  seducing  to  the  mind, 
VOL.  II.  30 


350  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1816. 

than  to   be  going  on  among  a  set  of  men,  —  most  of 
whom  are  united  in  the  harmony  of  friendship  and  so- 
cial enjoyment,  —  all  extolling  the  talents  and  princi- 
ples of  each  other,  —  all  ardent  for  the  same  objects, 
though  each  impelled  by  a  various  mixture  of  private 
and  public  motives,  —  all  anxious  to  detect,  to  communi- 
cate, and  to  enlarge  upon,  whatever  is  to  the  disadvan- 
tage of  their  adversaries,  and  to  keep  out  of  sight  what- 
ever presents  itself  in  their  favour,  —  all  vicing  with 
each  other,  not  only  in  every  public  debate,  but  at  every 
dinner,  and  in  every  morning  walk,  to  magnify  the  partial 
views,  to  which  each  by  himself  is  naturally  led.     Most 
men,  when  long  actuated  by  any  keen  interest  in  their 
jDrivate  affairs,  are  liable  to  bias;  how  much  more  must 
this  be  the  case,  when  a  number  of  minds  are  re-actino; 
upon  each  other  in  the  strenuous  prosecution  of  a  com- 
mon  cause,  when  there  is  the   mutual  support  of  each 
other's  authority,  no  reference  to  opinion  beyond  the 
limits  of  the  party,  and  the  proud  notion  that  the  good 
of  the  country  depends  mainly  on  the  practical  adop- 
tion of  their  own  principles  ?     Look  around,  among  all 
you  have  ever  known,  and  name  me  a  man  whose  judg- 
ment you  would  have  said    beforehand  could   remain 
firm  and  right  under  such  warping  influence.     And  how 
seldom,  in  history,  do  we  find  an  active  associate  of  any 
sect  or  party  retaining  a  tolerable  degree  of  candour ! 
Such  reflections  should  make  you  occasionally  suspect 
yourself,  as  well  as  those  of  your  party  friends,  on  whose 
understandings  and  integrity  you  place  the  strongest  re- 
liance.    It  was  a  striking  lesson  to  remark  last  year,  and 
the  year   before,  the    unprejudiced  judgment  and  lan- 
guage of  the  Whigs,  who  were  at   a   distance  from   the 
struggle  between  the  parties,  when  compared  with  the 
sentiments  of  those  who  were  engaged  in  it  \  and  on  the 


jEt.  38.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  3  51 

former  side  of  this  contrast,  I  am  happy  to  place  Jeffrey, 
J.  Murray,  Dngald  Stewart,  Mr.  Wilson,  Mr.  J.  Clerk, 
Lord  Minto,  and  Ilallam.  Perhaps  your  consciousness 
of  a  high  spirit  of  independence  makes  you  too  little  on 
your  guard  against  the  influence  of  those  around  you. 
There  are  many  cases,  in  which  I  could  trust  to  the  can- 
dour of  your  judgment ;  but  not  so,  when  certain  strong 
feelings  are  connected  with  the  point  in  question. 
Above  all  I  conld  not  trust  you,  where  your  affections 
are  involved ;  for  that  warmth  of  heart,  and  steadiness 
of  attachment,  which  are  such  charms  in  your  character, 
must  then  interfere,  and  I  have  observed  them  to  do  so. 
I  wish  that  your  party  friends  were  more  aware  of 
the  light  in  which  their  temper  and  conduct  appear  to 
many  people,  who,  with  no  strong  feeling  either  for  or 
asrainst  Ministers,  are  anxious  for  the  best  interests  of 
their  country  and  of  mankind.  Men  thus  disposed,  and 
with  various  degrees  of  intelligence,  are,  I  imagine, 
pretty  numerously  scattered  throughout  the  island ;  and 
these  are  the  men,  whose  approbation  they  must  be  am- 
bitious of,  if  their  motives  are  pure,  and  whose  support, 
if  they  are  prudent,  they  must  be  eager  to  gain.  During 
the  last  two  years  they  would  have  often  found  the 
sentiments  of  such  people  at  variance  with  their  own. 
They  would  have  found  them  sometimes  lamenting, 
and  sometimes  indignant,  to  see  men,  who  profess 
themselves  patriots  and  philanthropists,  steadily  turn- 
ing away  from  every  joyful  event,  and  every  bright 
prospect,  to  dwell  only  upon  the  few  intermingled 
occasions  of  regret,  or  censure,  or  despondency,  and 
uttering  nought  but  groans  over  the  fate  of  Norway, 
or  Spain,  or  Saxony,  or  Genoa,  w^hile  our  own  country, 
and  half  the  civilised  world,  felt  as  if  breathing  wdien 
first  risen  from  a  bed  of  imminent  death.     I  wish  your 


352  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1816. 

friends  could  have  heard  iu  secret  the  opinions  of  the 
impartial  upon  the  justice  and  expediency  of  the  war 
last  year ;  I  wish  they  could  now  hear  the  expressions  I 
have  heard,  —  from  some  who  entertain  the  soundest 
Whig  principles,  and  lean  towards  their  party,  —  of  dread 
at  the  idea  of  any  man  being  in  office,  whose  indulgent 
favour  of  Napoleon  might  render  it,  in  however  small  a 
degree,  more  likely  that  he  should  escape  from  his  con- 
finement, and  again  throw  the  world  into  confusion. 

Opposition  in  Parliament  is  generally  conducted  upon 
one  very  false  principle,  namel}^,  that  the  measures  of 
Ministers  must,  in  every  case,  be  so  far  wrong,  as  to 
deserve,  upon  the  whole,  very  severe  reprobation.  I 
will  not  suppose  this  principle  to  be  speculatively  recog- 
nised ;  but  it  seems,  at  least,  to  be  practically  adopted. 
Now  it  is  plain,  that  where  a  set  of  men  have  the  good 
of  the  country  mainly  at  heart,  and  have  tolerable  capa- 
cities for  business,  though  their  talents  be  neither  pro- 
found nor  brilliant,  and  though  their  principles  lean 
rather  more  than  is  right  in  favour  of  the  Crown,  yet 
their  measures  must,  in  all  probability,  be  often  as  good 
as  circumstances  will  admit  of,  and  sometimes  entitled  to 
praise  for  unusual  prudence  or  magnanimity^  On  such 
occasions  justice  is,  for  the  most  part,  denied  them  alto- 
gether by  the  opposition  side  of  the  House  ;  or,  if  praise 
is  bestowed  at  all,  it  is  bestowed  in  feeble  terms,  and 
with  reservations  much  insisted  on ;  but  what  is  denied 
them  in  Parliament  is  granted  by  an  impartial  public 
without  doors,  with  proportionate  disgust  at  the  bitter 
and  unremitting  censures  of  factious  enmity.  Upon 
this  point  I  must  add,  that  I  heard  it  said  ( by  a  friend 
too)  that  you  hurt  yourself  in  the  opinion  of  the  pubHc, 
by  some  want  of  candour  towards  the  latter  part  of  the 
last  session. 


2Et.  38.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  353 

Do  not  conceive  that  I  am  insensible  to  the  benefits, 
which  the  country  derives  from  a  vigorous  opposition. 
But  I  am  confident  that  these  benefits  might  be  greatly 
increased,  and  every  interest  of  the  opposition  party 
much  advanced,  if  the  temper,  which  party  is  sure  to 
generate,  were  better  controlled  by  those,  at  least,  whose 
talents  place  them  at  its  head ;  and  if  their  views,  freed 
from  the  bias  of  that  temper,  accorded  more  with  the 
sentiments  of  an  enlightened,  and  almost  neutral,  part 
of  the  nation.  Opposition,  even  when  carried  on  with 
the  spirit  of  Sir  Francis  Burdett,  is  a  check  to  abuses, 
and  a  safeguard  to  our  liberty  ;  there  are  few,  however, 
with  intelligence  superior  to  that  of  the  mob,  who  would 
ftivour  his  political  objects.  Mr.  Whitbread's  conduct  in 
opposition  was  of  a  higher  character;  a  friend  of  the 
people,  and  a  firm  foe  to  corruption,  he  was  entitled  to 
great  respect ;  yet  there  were  occasions  when  I  could 
not  have  wished  to  see  Mr.  Whitbread  in  office,  from  the 
fear  of  his  acting  upon  those  mistaken  notions,  and  with 
that  vehement  and  perverse  spirit,  which  appeared  in 
his  attacks  upon  Government,  and  which  sometimes  made 
him  even  go  beyond  the  sentiments  of  his  own  political 
friends.  There  are  higher  stations  in  Opposition  than 
that  of  Mr.  Whitbread,  —  higher,  from  a  display  of  more 
temperate  and  candid  judgment.  I  would  fain  see  you 
occupying  the  highest  in  this,  as  well  as  in  other  re- 
spects ;  and  I  would  fain  know  that  the  dignified  pro- 
priety of  language  and  demeanour,  which  you  have  so 
successfully  cultivated  in  the  House,  was  founded  upon 
just  and  moderate  views  of  events,  and  men,  and 
measures.-''     Believe  me,  my  dear  Horner, 

Yours  ever,  very  affectionately, 

Webb  Seymour. 

*  Sec  the  answer  to  this  letter,  15th  June,  p.  332. 

30* 


or^  HOUSE  OF  COMMONS.  [1816. 


ALIEN    BILL. 

Lord  Castlereagh,  on  the  25tli  of  April,  moved  for 
leave  to  bring  in  a  Bill  to  repeal  the  Act  of  the  preced- 
ing session  respecting  aliens,  and  to  substitute  other  pro- 
visions, for  a  time  to  be  limited,  in  lieu  of  it  He  said, 
"  that  although  tranquillity  in  Europe  had  been  restored, 
the  situation  of  the  British  empire  Avas  still  such  as  to 
require  precautions  against  the  possibility  of  the  dis- 
turbance of  internal  security.  That  the  Crown,  in  truth, 
possessed  the  right  of  sending  aliens  out  of  the  realm, 
on  suspicion  that  they  were  concerned  in  practices  dan- 
gerous to  the  state ;  but  it  had  been  thought  wise,  since 
the  time  of  Mr.  Pitt,  to  arm  the  executive  with  the 
countenance  of  the  legislature." 

Mr.  Horner  ito mediately  rose  and  said,  that  he  should, 
in  the  very  outset,  give  such  a  proposal  his  decided  nega- 
tive. His  speech  on  this  first  introduction  of  the  Bill, 
as  well  as  those  which  he  delivered  in  its  subsequent 
stages,  will  be  found  in  the  Appendix.  He  denounced 
the  measure  as  unconstitutional ;  as  contrary  to  the  an- 
cient and  wholesome  system  of  poHcy,  which  treated 
strangers  with  liberality  and  confidence ;  and  as  inflicting 
upon  the  national  character  a  lasting  reproach.  He 
declared  it,  moreover,  to  be  unnecessary,  because  the 
operation  of  the  common  law  would  be  a  sufficient 
remedy,  for  any  misconduct  of  which  aliens  in  this 
country  might  be  guilty. 


BAl^K   OF    ENGLAND. 

On  the  1st  of  May  he  moved  for  the  appointment  of 
a  select  committee  "  to  inquire  into  the  expediency  of 


iEx.  38.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  355 

restoring  the  cash  payments  of  the  Bank  of  England, 
and  the  safest  and  most  advantageous  mode  of  effecting 
it."  The  outlhic,  contained  in  Hansard's  Debates,  of  his 
speech  on  this  great  question,  and  of  his  reply  to  those 
who  dissented  from  the  doctrines  he  laid  down,  are  given 
in  the  Appendix. 


Letter  CCLXV.     TO  IIIS    SISTER,  MISS  AXNE  HORNER. 

My  dear  Nancy,  London,  20tli  May,  isic. 

I  have  been  passing  Saturday  and  Sunday  at 
Mr.  Sharp's,  at  Mickleham,  with  Mr.  Grattan;  and  it 
was  a  very  agreeable  excursion.  I  went  and  returned 
with  Mr.  Grattan,  whose  conversation  about  Ireland,  and 
especially  the  past  history  of  Ireland,  as  well  as  upon 
literature,  is  full  of  interest  and  genius.  He  has  been 
giving  me  to-day,  as  we  came  to  town,  the  history  of 
what  was  done  at  the  famous  period  of  1782  ;  and  he 
made  me  acquainted  with  some  parts  of  that  great 
transaction,  and  particularly  his  own  share  in  it,  which 
I  did  not  know  before.  This  little  excursion  was  on 
purpose  to  hear  the  nightingales,  for  he  loves  music 
like  an  Italian,  and  the  country  like  a  true-born  English- 
man. Both  beauties  are  in  full  perfection  at  Eedley, 
where  there  are  more  nightingales  in  chorus  than  are 
to  be  heard  any  where  else.  He  is  full  of  English 
and  Latin  poetry,  too,  and  deals  very  much  in  pas- 
sages from  both,  when  he  is  at  his  ease ;  which,  with 
his  ardour  for  Ireland,  and  his  characteristic  sketches 
of  persons  with  whom  he  has  acted  in  public  life,  and 
a  great  deal  of  fun,  and  benevolence,  and  sense  about 
all  things,  make  him  a  very  entertaining  companion. 
At  the  age  of  seventy,  too,  for  I  fear  he  is  nearly  as 


356  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1816. 

much,  and  with  the  veneration  that  belongs  to  his  name, 
from  the  figure  he  has  made  in  our  poUtics,  it  is  impos- 
sible not  to  take  a  deep  interest  in  one  who  renders 
himself  so  accessible  and  so  instructive. 

I  have  read  the  Antiquary,  which  is  inferior  as  a 
story  to  the  other  two,  but,  indeed,  they  are  all  very  in- 
differently executed  in  that  respect.  The  scene  at  the 
Country  Post  Office  is  admirable  ;  the  humour  very  true 
and  lively,  and  poor  Jenny  Caxon's  disappointment 
quite  touching.  But  the  Fisherman's  Family  is  the 
real  interest  of  the  book  ;  and  I  have  forgot  if  there  is 
any  thing  in  Waverley  or  Guy  Mannering  equal  to  it. 
The  old  woman  is  quite  sublime,  till  she  is  awak- 
ened to  tell  her  story,  and  then  she  becomes  com- 
monplace ;  but  her  dotage  and  melancholy  are  terrify- 
ing. The  funeral  is  very  affecting  j  and  particularly  that 
stroke  of  nature,  where  the  mother  looks  for  some  relief 
from  her  sorrow  in  a  fiijte  with  Miss  Grizzell  at  Monk- 
barns.  The  Gaberlunzie  seems  to  me  exaggerated  and 
inconsistent,  and  a  bad  copy  of  Meg  Merrilies. 
Most  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CCLXVI.     TO  HIS  FATHER. 
Mv  dear  Sir  Holland  House,  5th  June,  181G. 

I  had  the  pleasure  of  receiving  jour  kind  letter. 
Leonard,  I  hope,  is  now  restored  to  good  health :  per- 
haps I  shall  have  accounts  to-day,  when  my  servant  re- 
turns from  town  with  my  letters.  I  have  been  here  for 
three  or  four  days,  during  our  Whitsun  holidays ;  Lady 
Holland  taking  almost  as  much  care  of  me,  when  she 
fancies  I  need  it,  as  if  I  were  in  my  own  dear  mother's 
hands.   I  am  still  a  little  plagued  with  a  cough,  in  which 


^T.  38.]  COmiESrONDENCE.  357 

there  is  nothing  at  all  material,  except  the  circumstance 
of  its  continuing  so  long,  which  I  think  is  owing  to  the 
cold  weather.  To  be  quite  sure  of  this,  I  have  (by  Lady 
Holland's  desire)  seen  Dr.  Warren,  who  thinks  there  is 
nothing  in  it ;  but  considers  the  stomach,  as  of  old, 
chiefly  in  fault,  and  has  given  me  some  directions  to 
observe  on  that  head. 

My  sisters  seem  to  have  taken  it  for  granted,  that  I 
have  fixed  upon  my  summer  plans,  to  the  exclusion  of 
Scotland.  But  that  is  by  no  means  the  case.  I  rather 
think,  if  I  travel  at  all,  it  will  be  to  see  you ;  but  I  am 
not  without  thoughts  of  staying  quietly  at  home,  in 
order  to  read  a  little  law,  for  which  I  have  but  few  op- 
portunities at  other  times  of  the  year.  But  I  have  made 
no  resolution  yet. 

My  kind  love  to  my  mother  and  my  sisters. 
Ever,  my  dear  Sir, 

Most  affectionately  yours, 

Era.  Horner. 


Letter  CCLXVII.     TO  HIS  FATHEK. 
My  dear  Sir,  Temple,  ISth  June,  1816. 

There  is  nothing  I  should  like  better  than  the 
plan  you  propose,  for  spending  the  autumn  in  a  house 
at  some  little  distance  from  Edinburgh.  I  am  only 
afraid  that  it  is  a  greater  expense  than  you  would 
like  to  incur,  w^ere  it  not  for  your  kind  attention  to  my 
fancies.  Though  I  shall  be  under  the  necessity  of  re- 
turning to  the  October  sessions,  yet  I  shall  have  a  full 
interval  of  six  weeks,  which  I  could  not  pass  so  happily 
any  where  as  with  you.  I  find  it  difficult  to  be  at  Edin- 
burgh, and  preserve  that  entire  command  of  my  time, 
without  which  one  has  not  half  the  enjoyment  of  leisure. 


358  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1816. 

Before  you  fix  upon  the  situation,  would  it  not  be 
well  for  3'Ou  to  consider,  whether  the  sea-side  would  not 
be  better  for  my  mother,  where  she  could  have  the 
benefit  of  bathing  ?  She  used  to  think  it  always  did  her 
good,  and  I  am  sony  to  hear  she  is  not  very  strong  at 
present.  Nothing  can  be  more  beautiful  than  the  neigh- 
bourhood of  Rosslyn,  or  more  to  my  taste ;  but,  if  my 
mother  should  be  advised  to  bathe  this  summer,  it  would 
be  excellent  to  combine  both  plans.  I  shall  probably 
be  released  from  the  circuit  on  the  23d  August,  at 
Bristol ;  and  I  may  arrange  matters  so  as  to  set  out  at 
once  for  the  North.  I  have  concealed  nothing  from  you 
about  my  health ;  and  am  only  afraid  that,  by  being  so 
particular,  as  I  was  in  my  last  letter,  I  have  made  you 
more  anxious  than  there  is  any  occasion  for.  Good 
weather  and  good  hours  will  set  me  up  again  com- 
pletely. 

My  home  is  quite  another  scene  for  me  with  my  pre- 
sent inmates,  who  make  me  very  happy  indeed.  Anne 
has  Lady  Holland's  box  to-night,  to  see  Miss  O'Neill  in^ 
the  Jealous  Wife  ;  and  I  believe  the  young  lady  is  to  be 
of  the  party.  William  Murray  is  to  dine  with  us,  and  to 
accompany  them,  for  I  must  go  to  the  House  of  Com- 
mons. My  kindest  regards  to  my  mother  and  sisters. 
Ever,  my  dear  Sir, 

Most  affectionately  yours, 

Fka.  Horxer. 


Letter   CCLXVm.    TO   THOMAS  THOMSON,  ESQ. 

My  dear  Thomson,  London,  utli  June,  i8i6. 

I  went  to  Lens  immediately.^-'     He  had  just  been 
informed  by  Adam.     My  next  object  was  to  communi- 

*  To  Mr.  Serjeant  Lens,  to  communicate  the  death  of  Mr.  George  Wilson, 
at  Edinburgh.     See  Vol.  L  p.  192.  — Ed. 


^T.  38.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  359 

catc  the  sad  event  to  poor  Attwater,  the  faithful,  affec- 
tionate servant  of  our  dear  friend.  There  is  somethino-. 
in  the  conviction  that  he  cannot  have  suffered  any  pro- 
tracted pain.  I  fear,  too,  this  is  a  release  from  sufi'erino-s 
of  a  keener  sort,  that  were  awaiting  him,  had  he  sur- 
vived a  little  longer,  in  the  accumulated  distresses  that 
are  heaped  upon  his  sister's  family. 

I  agree  with  you,  that  I  have  never  known  any  body 
in  life  of  the  same  kind  as  Mr.  Wilson.  So  circumspect 
an  understanding,  united  with  so  much  warmth  of  heart, 
and  such  refined  sensibility:  he  had  all  the  caution 
which  age  could  gain,  and  retained  for  every  thing  that 
concerned  the  happiness  of  mankind,  or  the  welfare  and 
reputation  of  his  friends,  an  ardour  like  that  of  youth. 
For  some  years  past,  he  seemed  to  look  upon  himself  as 
already  separated  from  the  world;  but  looking  upon 
every  thing  that  could  be  seen  to  go  well  in  it,  with  an 
affectionate  interest  and  benevolence.  All  that  remains 
of  him  to  you  and  to  me,  now,  is  the  memory  of  him ; 
and  we  shall,  to  the  end  of  our  lives,  have  a  gratifica- 
tion in  thinking  of  his  goodness,  and  of  the  kindness  he 
felt  for  us. 

My  dear  Thomson,  most  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CCLXIX.     TO  LORD  WEBB  SEYMOUR. 

My  dear  Seymour,  London,  isth  June,  1816. 

I  was  much  obliged  to  3-ou  for  your  kind  atten- 
tion, in  writing  to  me  an  account  of  the  melancholy  loss 
we  have  suffered  of  our  excellent  friend  Mr.  Wilson.  It 
was  an  event  I  had  long  anticipated  as  too  likely  to 
happen  any  da}^ )  and  all  that  one  could  wish  on  such 
an  occasion  has  been  granted,  since  he  died  without  suf- 


360  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1816. 

fering,  and  without  surviving  his  faculties,  which  I 
dreaded  still  more.  You  saw  enough  of  him,  to  estimate 
hio-hly  both  his  worth  and  his  intellectual  merit ;  but  he 
w^as  one  of  those,  who  are  well  known  only  to  intimate 
observers,  and  whom  a  friend  could  not  know  intimately 
without  making  daily  discoveries  of  virtue  and  wisdom 
and  sensibility.  Under  that  calm  and  cautious  exterior, 
and  behind  that  modesty  which  was  most  apparent, 
there  lay  the  utmost  warmth  of  heart  and  anxiety  of 
kindness,  and  an  ardour  for  all  good  things  fresh  and 
sincere  as  any  of  us  felt  it  in  youth.  And  the  wonder 
of  all  was,  that  he  had  preserved  this  through  London 
and  through  Westminster  Hall,  and  through  all  the 
habits  of  a  lawyer's  life.  I  have  seen  no  such  man  alto- 
gether, and  shall  see  none  such  any  more. 

You  will  not  think  it  odd,  that  I  have  not  said  any 
thing  of  the  friendly  letter  I  received  from  you,  Avhile 
I  was  on  the  last  spring  circuit.  I  took  it  as  you  meant 
it ;  as  the  interposition  of  your  authority  as  a  friend, 
rather  than  opening  a  controversy  with  me.  I  think  I 
could  justify  myself  on  many  points,  where  you  have 
mistaken  me,  or  been  misinformed  about  me ;  then  there 
is  a  great  allowance  to  be  made,  in  your  judgment  of 
my  conduct,  for  the  considerable  difference  of  opinion 
that  still  exists,  as  it  has  always  done,  between  you  and 
myself  upon  some  fundamental  points  of  politics,  both 
foreign  and  domestic.  I  do  not  mean  to  say,  that  my 
views  are  right,  and  yours  erroneous ;  that  is  a  separate 
discussion ;  but  that  my  opinions  being  allowed  me,  my 
conduct  is  to  be  estimated  with  reference  to  them,  as 
every  man  will  square  his  line  of  action  for  tlie  opinions 
which  he  conscientiously  believes  to  be  well-founded.  I 
will  not  pursue  this  any  farther ;  I  have  read  your  letter 
repeatedly,  which  was  what  you  intended  me  to  do ;  and 


2Et.  38.]  HOUSE  OF  COMMONS.  oqj 

though  I  hardly  confess  myself  as  wrong  on  any  particu- 
lar as  you  thmk  me,  I  feel  sure  that  your  advice  will, 
even  more  than  I  may  at  the  time  be  aware  of  it,  keep 
me  from  going  wrong. 

My  dear  Seymour, 

Affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Mr.  Horner  addressed  the  House  of  Commons  for  the 
last  time  on  the  25th  of  June;  and  it  was  in  the  cause 
of  religious  liberty  and  of  Ireland.  The  wrongs  and 
mis-government  of  that  country  had  made  a  deep  im- 
pression upon  his  mind  :  he  felt  that  the  harsh,  intolerant, 
and  ungenerous  treatment  of  so  large  a  portion  of  her 
people  left  a  stain  upon  the  character  of  England,  and 
engendered  a  spirit  of  discontent,  which  impaired  the 
strength,  and  endangered  the  safety,  of  the  empire. 
Had  his  life  been  spared,  we  may  safely  affirm  that  he 
would  have  laboured,  with  unwearied  zeal,  to  jDromote 
every  measure  that  was  calculated  to  advance  the  pros- 
perity, and  secure  the  tranquillity,  of  Ireland. 

Sir  John  Cox  Hippesley  having  brought  up  the  Report 
of  a  Select  Committee,  appointed  to  inquire  into  the 
laws  and  ordinances  of  foreign  states,  regulating  the  in- 
tercourse between  their  Roman  Catholic  subjects  and 
the  See  of  Rome;  Mr.  Canning  rose  and  said,  —  "That 
having  been  one  of  the  majority  which,  on  a  former 
occasion,  prevented  the  purpose  of  the  honourable  baro- 
net from  being  carried  into  execution,  he  was  desirous 
of  showing  the  difference  which  existed  between  that 
period  and  the  present.  Then  the  measure  proposed 
would  have  had  the  effect  of  impeding  the  progress  of  a 

VOL.  II.  31 


362  CATHOLIC  EMANCIPATION.  [1816 

Bill  before  the  House  ;  and,  rather  than  delay  a  Bill  of 
such  consequence,  he  had  no  hesitation  in  declining  the 
information  which  the  honourable  baronet  had  it  in  his 
power  to  give.  But,  on  the  present  occasion,  the  hon- 
ourable baronet  could  not  have  a  warmer  supporter  than 
himself;  nor  had  he  the  least  hesitation  in  saying  farther, 
that  the  information  contained  in  the  Report  was  neces- 
sary to  the  having  the  question  fully  understood.  Deeply 
as  they  were  all  interested  in  the  final  settlement  of  the 
question,  that  settlement  could  only  be  valuable,  in  so 
far  as  it  was  founded  on  the  firm  conviction  and  cordial 
assent  of  all  parties.  He  was  anxious  that  it  should 
now  be  finally  set  at  rest,  not  on  the  romantic  notion 
that,  with  it,  every  feeling  of  animosity  would,  at  the 
same  time,  subside ;  but  because  he  believed  that  the 
question  was  one,  without  the  settlement  of  which  no 
other  evil  in  Ireland  could  be  radically  cured ;  it  was 
not  only  an  evil  in  itself,  but  it  was  made  the  pretext 
for  many  more,  and  it  aggravated  them  all.  He  was 
more  and  more  convinced  of  the  necessity  of  emancipa- 
tion ;  and  that  with  the  conditions  which  it  might  be 
thought  advisable  to  annex  to  the  boon,  the  final  settle- 
ment of  the  question  ought  not  to  be  delayed.  To  this 
final  settlement  the  Report  of  the  honourable  baronet 
could  not  fail  greatly  to  contribute." 

Mr.  Horner  said,  "  He  could  not  help  congratulating 
the  Catholics  on  what  he  had  heard  with  so  great 
satisfaction, —  the  sentiments  delivered  by  the  right 
honourable  gentleman  (Mr.  Canning)  who  had  lately 
acceded  to  the  ministry.  He  could  not  help  inferring, 
from  the  manner  in  which,  as  well  as  the  occasion  when, 
these  sentiments  w^ere  delivered,  that  they  might  look 
forward  with  better  hopes  and  expectations,  than  they 
had  ever  yet  had,  of  a  speedy  settlement  of  the  great 


J£t.  38.]  CATHOLIC  EMANCIPATION.  3G3 

question  of  Catholic  emancipation.  When  he  coupled 
those  sentiments,  which  the  right  honourable  gentleman 
had  just  delivered,  with  the  circumstance  of  his  recent 
accession  to  the  administration,  he  felt  convinced,  that 
the  right  honourable  gentleman  would  not  have  ex- 
pressed his  increased  sense  of  the  importance  of  a  final 
settlement  of  the  question,  unless  he  had  previously 
come  to  a  distinct  understanding  on  the  subject  with 
the  rest  of  the  administration ;  and  he  felt  this  convic- 
tion the  more  strongly,  when  he  called  to  remembrance 
the  very  manly  grounds  on  which  the  right  honourable 
gentleman  stated,  some  time  ago,  that  he  had  declined 
acceding  to  the  same  administration.  He  hoped,  there- 
fore, that  the  right  honourable  gentleman  had  not  de- 
livered his  sentiments  on  this  occasion  merely  as  a  mem- 
ber of  parliament ;  that,  in  the  next  session,  the  ques- 
tion would  not  come  before  the  House,  as  usual,  merely 
in  consequence  of  petitions  from  the  Catholics ;  but  that 
it  would  be  officially  brought  in,  by  those  who  held  the 
most  prominent  place  in  the  councils  of  the  country, 
and  that  they  w^ould  no  longer  have  to  w^itness  that 
trifling  which,  year  after  year,  had  been  dis23layed,  of 
men  filling  the  highest  situations  of  the  government 
holding  out  this  as  a  measure  of  the  most  vital  import- 
ance, —  declaring  that  no  measure  with  regard  to  Ire- 
land was  likely  to  be  attended  with  any  good  effect  if  it 
was  not  carried,  —  that  Ireland  could  not  otherwise  be 
tranquillised,  —  and  yet  leaving  a  measure  of  such  vital 
importance  to  the  country,  to  be  brought  forward,  not 
by  themselves,  but  by  those  who  could  not  have  the 
same  weight  with  themselves,  and  whose  efforts  could 
not,  therefore,  be  expected  to  be  attended  with  the 
same  success." 


APPROACH  OF  SERIOUS  ILLNESS.  [1816. 


The  active  part  which  Mr.  Horner  took,  in  so  many 
of  the  questions  that  came  before  the  House  of  Com- 
mons this  session,  may  seem  to  indicate,  and  even  to 
have  required,  when  added  to  his  increased  professional 
occupations,  a  vigorous  state  of  health.  But  this,  unhap- 
pily, was  far  from  being  his  real  condition.  In  the  two 
last  letters  to  his  father  he  speaks  of  being  unwell,  and, 
as  usual,  makes  light  of  his  complaints ;  his  friends,  how- 
ever, had  seen  for  some  time,  that  his  health  required  a 
much  greater  degree  of  care  than  he  could  be  induced 
to  bestow  upon  it.  Symptoms  of  a  pulmonary  affection 
had  now  appeared,  w^hich  gave  them  so  much  uneasi- 
ness and  alarm,  that  they  urged  him  to  submit  his  case 
to  the  serious  consideration  of  eminent  medical  advisers, 
and  to  yield  implicit  obedience  to  their  directions.  He 
followed  this  advice;  but,  alas!  it  was  too  late.  The 
fatal  disease  could  not  be  arrested,  although  it  appeared 
in  so  indefinite  and  indistinct  a  form,  as  to  encourage 
hopes  of  his  recovery  to  the  very  last.  But  it  will  be 
seen,  in  what  remains  to  be  read,  that  the  increasing 
feebleness  of  his  bodily  frame,  during  the  few  remaining 
months  of  existence  that  were  allotted  to  him,  was  hap- 
pily unaccompanied  by  even  the  slightest  change  in  the 
vigour  and  activity  of  his  mind :  these  never  failed,  but 
continued  unimpaired  to  the  last  day  of  his  life. 


Letter  CCLXX.    TO  IHS  MOTHER. 

My  dear  Mother,  Oxford,  isth  July,  isie. 

I  have  had  leisure  enough  all  this  week  to  have 
written  to  you ;  but  when  one  is  quite  idle,  there  is  no 


^T.  38.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  305 

time  to  be  found.  I  have  indeed  been  thoroughly  idle, 
but  pleasantly  so,  and  quietly  too.  After  all,  I  did  not 
execute  any  of  my  schemes  with  Leonard,  though  that  of 
coming  to  this  place  with  him  for  a  week  seemed  too 
good  a  project  to  be  given  up.  But  I  found  it  hard  to 
resist  invitations,  which  I  received  when  I  gave  out  that 
I  was  to  leave  town ;  particularly  one  from  Lord  Buck- 
ingham, who  had  repeatedly  asked  me  to  Stowe,  with- 
out my  ever  being  able  to  go ;  and  particular  cir- 
cumstances made  it  difficult  for  me  to  decline  it  this 
time. 

I  went  to  Woburn  on  Saturday  last,  and  stayed  there 
till  Thursday :  there  was  nobody  in  the  house  but  Lord 
Grey's  family,  on  their  way  to  the  north.  This  made  it 
particularly  agreeable  to  me,  as  I  have  a  great  admira- 
tion for  Lord  Grey's  character,  and  feel  much  satisfac- 
tion and  pleasure  in  his  society.  He  passes  much  of  his 
time  with  his  daughters,  riding  every  day  with  three  of 
them ;  I  had  a  pony  placed  at  my  disposal,  and  joined 
their  party  ;  the  Duke  riding  with  us,  and  showing  us  a 
great  variety  of  rides,  both  in  the  park  and  in  the  coun- 
try round  it.  This  exercise,  and  going  early  to  bed, 
and  following  Dr.  Warren's  directions  about  regimen,  are 
altogether,  you  will  admit,  a  powerful  attack  made  upon 
my  old  enemy  the  cough  ;  and  I  begin  to  think  I  have 
made  some  impression  upon  him. 

On  Thursday,  I  went  by  way  of  Stony  Stratford, 
across  the  country,  to  Stowe,  where  I  was  till  this  after- 
noon. There,  too,  I  had  the  good  fortune  to  meet  only 
a  small  family  party.  It  is  a  very  magnificent  place, 
worthy  of  all  its  reputation;  too  magnificent  perhaps 
for  so  quiet  a  company  as  I  found  there,  and  more  suit- 
able for  a  large  assemblage  of  gaiety  and  grandeur,  and 
the  bustle  that  attends  them.   There  is  something  desert 

31* 


366  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1816. 

in  great  space  and  splendour,  without  crowds  to  enliven 
them.  Nothing,  I  think,  would  exceed  Stowe  in  a  gala. 
The  grounds  are  agreeably  laid  out,  though  the  coun- 
try admits  of  little  variety  of  prospect;  a  great  number 
of  ornamental  buildings,  some  of  which  are  handsome, 
supply  in  some  degree  that  want  of  objects  and  scenery, 
which  gives  siich  a  sadness  to  all  great  parks,  which  do 
not  let  in  views  of  the  villages,  and  cottages,  and  foot- 
paths of  their  humbler  neighbours.  The  architecture 
of  the  house  is  very  striking  in  its  general  effect,  and 
gave  me  at  the  first  moment  I  saw  it  from  a  distance, 
something  like  the  impressions,  which  Versailles,  and 
Versailles  alone  in  the  same  degree,  makes  upon  the  eye. 
The  body  of  the  house  has  a  front  of  450  feet,  and  the 
of&ces  extend  so  far  in  wings  on  each  side  as  to  make  a 
length  in  all  of  900  feet.  There  are  few  good  pictures 
in  the  house,  but  some  remarkable  portraits ;  the  most 
interesting  of  which  is  the  Chandos  Shakspeare.  A 
greater  treasure,  is  a  library  of  22,000  printed  books  for 
real  use  and  modern  reading ;  and  a  very  valuable  col- 
lection of  manuscripts  and  state  papers,  which  occupy 
a  room  by  themselves,  handsomely  fitted  up  in  the 
Gothic  style;  and  which,  for  that  reason,  was  de- 
scribed in  the  days  of  "  No  Popery,"  as  the  Catholic 
Chapel  where  the  Grenvilles  performed  their  super- 
stitions. 

I  will  write  in  a  day  or  two  to  my  father,  or  one  of 
my  sisters ;  in  the  mean  time  give  my  kind  love_to  them. 
My  dear  mother. 

Most  affectionately  yours. 

Era.  Horner. 


iEx.  39.]  CORRESPONDENCE. 


Letteu  CCLXXI.     to  LADY  HOLLAND. 

My  dear  Lady  Holland,  '"'"^^i^TiImr''' 

I  was  unfortunate  in  not  meeting  with  you  in 
Yorkshire.  I  staid  a  day  longer  at  Sydney  Smith's  for 
the  chance  of  it,  and  then  I  thought  there  was  another 
chance  of  fahing  in  with  your  march  between  Ahiwick 
and  York.  It  was  not  till  after  I  had  been  here  a  day 
or  two,  that  I  learned  by  a  letter  from  Lord  Grey  you 
had  remained  so  late  at  Howick  that  I  might  have  seen 
you  by  calling  there ;  I  was  impatient,  however,  to  get 
to  my  father's  house,  and  to  have  done  with  the  tiresome 
journey. 

I  am  living  at  a  retired  and  very  beautiful  j^lace  seven 
miles  from  Edinburgh,  where  I  have  only  been  once,  in 
the  morning,  since  I  came.  The  weather  has  been  cold 
and  disagreeable,  till  within  these  two  days ;  after  a  very 
sudden  change,  it  is  now  deliciously  warm  and  genial. 
This  has  given  me  a  release  from  coughing;  but  the 
shortness  of  breath  is  rather  more  incommodious  than 
it  was,  which  is  the  symptom  I  least  understand,  and  like 
least.  I  am  taking  the  advice  of  Drs.  Thomson  and 
Gordon,  w^ho  do  not  alarm  me  much  about  the  nature  of 
my  illness ;  but  have  imposed  upon  me  a  great  many 
cautions  against  cold  and  fatigue. 

I  must  expect  to  spend  the  greater  part  of  next  win- 
ter in  the  character  of  an  invalid.  My  friends  here 
have  been  very  kind  to  me,  coming  from  Edinburgh 
very  frequently. 

Ever  yours  affectionately, 

Era.  Horner. 


CORRESPONDENCE.  [1816, 


Letter  CCLXXII.    TO  ^Y.  J.  ADAM,  ESQ. 
My  dear  William,  Dryden,  27th  September,  1816. 

Many  thanks  for  your  kind  inquiries ;  I  certainly 
do  not  get  worse,  and  have  no  symptoms  yet  that  appear 
to  be  more  than  warnings  to  take  care  of  myself  I 
have  been  consulting  Drs.  Gregory  and  Hamilton,  and 
am  to  see  them  again  on  Sunday,  when  they  will  pro- 
nounce judgment ;  I  expect  it  to  be  a  sentence  of  im- 
prisonment, without  hard  labour.  Gregory  said  already, 
"  No  vociferation.  Sir  —  even  if  you  are  paid  for  it : " 
this  is  hard  enough  upon  one  of  my  craft.  I  am  quite 
perplexed  about  next  sessions ;  I  would  stay  away,  if  I 
thought  I  might  do  so  without  future  injury ;  but  then 
I  have  nearly  a  certainty  of  not  being  permitted  to 
attend  at  "Wells  in  January,  so  that  I  shall  seem  to 
abandon  them  entirely;  having  absented  myself,  for 
another  reason,  this  year  already.  Tell  me  your  mind. 
I  mean  still  to  set  out  for  London  upon  the  5th. 

Yours  affectionately, 

Era.  Horner. 

Letter  CCLXXm.     TO  LADY  HOLLAND. 

My  dear  Lady  Holland,  Brjden,  27th  Sept.  i8i6. 

I  was  going  to  postpone  writing  to  you  till  after 
Sunday,  when  I  am  to  see  Drs.  Gregory  and  Hamilton  a 
second  time,  and  receive  their  sentence.  But  I  cannot 
so  long  delay  thanking  you  for  the  kindness  of  your  late 
letters  to  me.  How  happy  I  should  be  in  your  house 
under  your  care,  in  the  way  you  propose !  But  I  had 
before  settled  to  adopt  another  plan,  which  I  think  you 
•will  approve  of     One  of  my  sisters  has  offered  to  spend 


Mt.  39.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  3(59 

tlie  winter  with  me  in  Russell  Street,  and  we  shall  set 
out  for  London  on  the  5th,  the  end  of  next  week ;  unless 
my  two,  or  as  I  ought  to  say,  your  two  doctors,  interpose 
other  advice.  I  will  write  again;  and  must  not  write 
more  at  present,  this  being  one  of  the  things  I  am  for- 
bid to  do,  on  account  of  the  stooping.  Once  more  ac- 
cept my  thanks  for  your  most  delightful  letters,  and  for 
the  proofs  you  daily  give  me  of  your  kind  friendship. 

Affectionately  yours, 

Fea.  Horner. 


Letter  CCLXXIV.    FROM  LORD  HOLLAND. 
Dear   Horner  Holland  House,  28th  Sept.  181G. 

Why  did  you  not  write  ?  Vie  expected  a  letter 
from  you  to-day,  and  hoped  to  hear  good  accounts  of 
your  health.  Here  is  John  Russell,  who  used  to  be  our 
invalid,  quite  well  and  strong,  and  not  a  little  delighted 
with  one  of  our  guests,  Foscolo  —  a  native  of  the  Greek 
Islands ;  who,  while  completing  his  education  in  Itcaly, 
was  overtaken  by  the  great  events  of  1796  and  1797, 
joined  the  Cisalpine  Republic,  and  forfeited  Bonaparte's 
favour,  by  the  imcourtly  mixture  of  admonition  which 
he  infused  into  a  speech  of  congratulation  on  his  election 
to  the  Presidency  of  the  Italian  republic  in  1802.  He 
has  since  that  time  served  in  the  army,  been  imprisoned, 
persecuted,  and  suspected,  till,  on  the  battle  of  Leipsig, 
he  espoused  the  falling  fortunes  of  Bonaparte  with  zeal, 
and  has  now  refused  to  take  oaths  to  the  Austrian  gov- 
ernment, and  come  to  settle  here  for  twelve  years,  dur- 
ing which  he  hopes  to  be  able  to  compose  something 
that  may  give  him  an  existence  with  posterity.  His 
learning  and  vivacity  are  wonderful,  and  he  seems  to 
have  great  elevation  of  mind,  and  to  be  totally  exempt 


370  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1816. 

from  aifectation,  though  not  perhaps  equally  so  from 
enthusiasm,  violence,  and  resentment.  Chateaubriand's 
pamphlet,  which  I  have  not,  and  will  not  read,  has 
excited  both  him  and  Allen  to  no  small  degree,  and  I 
should  hope  that,  between  them,  they  may  devise  some 
method  of  exposing  it  and  its  author. 

As  my  lady  has  written  to  you  lately,  I  conclude  you 
have  heard  that  they  have  had  the  meanness  to  abridge 
some  of  the  few  comforts  which  they  had  left  within  the 
reach  of  Bonaparte  and  even  thrown  new  obstacles  in 
the  way  of  his  acquiring  intelligence  of  what  is  passing, 
and  securing  to  himself  the  satisfaction  of  communicat- 
ing to  the  world  and  posterity  his  views  and  knowledge 
of  what  has  passed.  We  must  at  least  take  care  that 
some  of  the  base  lies  of  1815  shall  not  receive  the  same 
credit  with  posterity,  as  they  have  done  in  our  time. 

We  hear  no  more  of  dissolution.  The  King  was  seri- 
ously ill  some  few  days  ago,  which  would  force  one. 
There  is  a  report  of  bad  news  from  North  America. 

I  think  sinecures  will  not  be  able  to  stand  the  clamour. 
Apropos  to  that  subject,  —  I  and  your  friends  ought  to 
take  shame  to  ourselves  for  not  stating,  when  first  the 
subject  was  started,  the  real  state  of  the  case  with  respect 
to  your  commissionership.  It  was  natural  to  hold  such 
vulgar  calumny  cheap,  but  I  believe  the  people  are  in  a 
temper  where  they  listen  to  such  lies  with  some  plea- 
sure, and  even  draw  inferences  as  to  public  measures  of 
men  upon  them,  more  than  they  have  done  for  years. 
Yours,  dear  Horner,  sincerely, 

Vassall  Holland. 


^T.  39.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  ^*jl 


Letter  CCLXXV.    TO  LADY  HOLLAND. 
My  dear  Lady  Holland,  Dryden,  soth  Sept.  18I6. 

Dr.  Gregory,  with  the  concurrence  of  the  other 
physicians,  is  of  opinion  that  all  is  sound  yet,  no  harm 
done,  but  that  care  and  precaution  next  winter  are  in- 
dispensably necessary  ;  not  only  against  cold  and  fatigue, 
but  every  degree  of  exertion.  They  have  positively  in- 
terdicted me  from  my  profession  during  the  winter,  and 
have  strongly  advised  me  to  pass  the  cold  months  of 
that  season  and  the  spring  in  a  southern  climate.  I 
put  in  a  word  for  two  warm  rooms  at  home,  in  which  I 
would  promise  to  confine  myself;  but  they  urged  the 
importance  of  getting  to  a  climate  where  I  might  still 
have  open  air  and  regular  exercise.  That  consideration, 
and  a  conviction  that  after  this  opinion  has  been  de- 
livered by  them,  my  family  would  feel  constant  anxiety 
if  I  did  not  follow  it,  have  determined  me  to  go  abroad. 
My  brother  has  offered  to  go  with  me,  wherever  it  is ; 
and  we  shall  set  out  for  London  on  Saturday,  where  I 
must  be  for  two  or  three  days,  in  order  to  make  some 
necessary  arrangements. 

I  think  I  shall  go  at  once  to  Naples,  and  remain  in 
Italy  till  the  spring  is  over,  and  summer  fairly  begun. 
But  I  want  much  instruction  and  advice,  and  for  all  this 
you  must  let  me  come  to  you.  Will  you  let  my  brother 
and  me  pass  two  or  three  days  at  Holland  House  ?  It  is 
a  great  journey  to  undertake ;  but  I  have  more  courage 
for  that,  than  for  the  sufferings  of  a  sea  voyage. 
Ever  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


372  CORRESPONDENCE.  [181G. 


Letter   CCLXXVI.    FROM  LADY  HOLLAND. 

IloUand  House,  1st  Oct.  181G. 

I  am  glad  imj  doctors  send  you  from  the  keen  air 
of  your  native  mountains ;  it  must  be  insufferable,  but 
they  will   not  mend  the   matter  by  sending  you  into 
London.     I  accordingly  trust  to  your  docility,  and  your 
sister's   good-nature,  in   expecting   you   to    drive  from 
Barnet  straight  here,  where  you  will  occupy  three  south 
rooms,  regulated  as  Allen  shall  direct,  and  have  your 
hours,  and  company,  and  occupations  entirely  at  your 
own  disposal.     Such  books  and  papers  as  you  may  re- 
Cjuire  can  easily  be  brought  from  your  own  house.     Re- 
member your  own  house  is  in  the  heart  of  Loudon,  your 
sitting  and  bed  room  exposed  to  the  east;  that,  with 
your  facility  to  all  who  ever  pretend  from  acquaintance 
to  friendship,  you  cannot  be  denied  at  your  door ;  that 
the  calm,  which  is  so  necessary  to  you,  will  be  perj^etu- 
all}'  broken  in  upon.     These  three  rooms  o^^en  into  each 
other,  and  are  perfectly  warm  ;  your  servant  will  sleep 
close  to  you,  and  your  sister  will  have  a  room  adjoining 
to  this  apartment.     Pray  spare  me  all  the  commonplace 
compliments  of  giving  trouble,  and  taking  up  too  many 
rooms.     What  you  know  I  feel  towards  you  ought  to 
exempt  me  from  any  such  trash.     From  henceforward, 
till  June,  when  I  look  forward  to  a  thorough  amend- 
ment, you  must   lay  your  account  to  have  me,  heart, 
soul,  and  time,  entirely  devoted  to  your  welfare  and 
comfort ;  and  I  am  satisfied  in  this,  because  Allen  says 
it  is  right.     I  am  afraid  your  sister  may  think  it  a  bad 
exchange,  from  living  solely  with  you,  to  come  amongst 
strangers ;  but  tell  her  I  already  feel  warmth  towards 
her  for  her  affectionate  intention  of  nursing  you,  and 


^T.  39.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  3*5-3 

that  I  will  try  and  make  her  residence  as  little  irksome 
as  possible.  Do,  my  dear  friend,  yield  to  my  entreaties. 
As  to  abroad,  I  look  upon  it  as  fatal  to  an  invalid,  —  the 
coldness  of  the  inns,  the  bad  and  uncertain  accommoda- 
tion, the  smoky  chimneys,  the  unceasing  squabbles, 
which,  from  the  hatred  against  the  English,  are  arrived 
to  such  a  pitch  as  to  be  real  grievances,  the  total  want 
of  all  comforts  of  every  kind,  will  have,  I  trust,  put  it 
out  of  the  question.  Nothing  but  a  sea  voyage  to  Cadiz, 
or  Valencia,  or  Majorca,  can  be  thought  of  with  refer- 
ence to  any  real  benefit.  The  travelling  in  your  case 
would,  I  am  persuaded,  produce  the  mischief ;  for,  thank 
Heaven,  all  that  is  necessary  at  present  is  to  prevent 
any  forming,  and  exposure  to  cold  would  be  the  inevi- 
table forerunner  of  disease. 

Good  bye  —  take  care  of  yourself;  do  not  write,  and 
employ  a  friendly  hand  to  say  how  you  are  going  on. 
As  you  set  off  on  Saturday,  Allen  will  write  to-morrow, 
and  direct  his  letter'  to  Dunbar.  I  shall  write  to  you 
to  Ferrybridge,  perhaps  Durham,  if  any  thing  occurs ; 
only  let  your  sister  be  good  enough,  wherever  you  sleep, 
to  write  a  few  lines  to  say  how  you  bear  the  journey. 
Lord  Auckland  left  us  just  now;  he  promised  a  letter  to 
you  of  chit-chat. 

Yours  faithfully, 

E.  Y.  H. 


Letter  CCLXXVII.    FROM  LORD  HOLLAND. 
Dear  Horner  Holland  House,  1st  Oct.  181G. 

I  think  on   every  account  that  you  and  your 

sister  had  much  better  come  here  in  the  first  instance,  as 

it  would  be  very  foolish  to  encounter  the  bad  air  of 

London  without  necessity.     Lady  Holland  is  very  anx- 

voL.  n.  ■  32 


374  CORRESPONDENCE.  [181G. 

ious  you  should  do  so,  and  I  shall  leave  to  her  the  task 
of  persuading  you  and  Miss  Horner  to  acquiesce. 

Has  she  told  you  about  Foscolo,  our  late  inmate  here  ? 
He  is  without  exception  the  liveliest  and  cleverest  man 
I  know,  and  I  should  think  full  of  good  qualities  as  well 
as  talent.  In  genius  and  vivacity  like  Erskine ;  but 
Erskine  with  fixed  opinions,  great  and  various  knowl- 
edge, and  affections  as  warm  as  his  imagination.  We 
are  all  here  cngoues  with  him. 

You  will  see  I  was  taken  in  to  preside  at  a  Drury 
Lane  meeting.  No  dividend — but  a  divided  directory. 
It  is  a  bad  concern  —  all  except  Kean's  acting.  I  saw 
him  in  Othello  yesterday ;  by  far  the  finest  acting  I  ever 
witnessed  on  any  stage.  He  outdid  himself,  and  I  am 
confident  Garrick  himself  never  acted  a  fine  part  in 
Shakspeare  better.  I  am  sadly  afraid  your  countrymen 
at  Edinburgh  will  form  too  cold  an  audience  for  such  a 
genius,  as  I  am  more  than  ever  persuaded  that  little 
man  is. 

Yours  ever, 

V.  Holland. 


Letter  CCLXXVIH.    TO  LADY  HOLLAND. 

Dryden,  4tli  Oct.  1816. 

I  will  not  offer  you  a  syllable  of  thanks,  my  dear 
Lady  Holland,  either  on  my  own  part,  or  my  sister's,  for 
your  letter  to-day  and  Lord  Holland's.  Nothing  I  could 
say  would  express  what  I  feel.  You  have  already 
learned  my  change  of  j^lans ;  I  keep,  however,  to  my 
day,  and  set  out  with  my  brother  to-morrow.  We  will 
drive,  as  you  have  bid  me,  from  Barnet  to  Holland 
House;  and  in  all  probability  shall  arrive  there  on 
Thursday  next.     When  there,  I  shall  profit  by  your  best 


iEx.  39.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  375 

advice  about  my  travels.  All  the  four  physicians  here 
urged  me  to  go  abroad;  Gregory  and  Thomson  were 
the  most  urgent ;  the  former  would  not  hear  of  two 
warm  rooms  and  confinement;  and  since  I  intimated  to 
Thomson  that  I  was  ready  to  adopt  their  advice,  he  has 
repeatedly  said  he  is  convinced  it  is  the  safest  and  best 
course  for  me.  The  reason  that  has  weio-hed  most  with 
me  is,  the  opportunity  of  getting  a  little  exercise  most 
days  in  a  southern  climate,  or  at  least  with  a  short  inter- 
val of  confinement ;  whereas,  if  I  remain  in  England,  I 
must  lay  my  account  with  an  imprisonment  of  several 
months.  The  effects  of  this  upon  my  constitution  I  have 
formerly  experienced,  and  am  not  encouraged  to  repeat 
the  trial.  Besides  sinking  and  wearing  out  the  spirits, 
it  is  very  hurtful  to  the  whole  machinery  of  the  stomach ; 
and  a  derangement  of  that  organ,  or  some  part  of  the 
apparatus  belonging  to  it,  if  not  the  original  cause  of 
my  ailments,  forms  a  principal  part  of  them.  I  do  not 
mean,  however,  to  be  determined  by  my  own  reasonings 
on  the  point,  still  less  by  any  secret  wishes  to  turn  this 
misfortune  of  mine  (for  it  is  a  very  serious  one  to  be 
interrupted  in  my  profession)  to  the  most  advantage, 
but  shall  be  infinitely  more  swayed  by  your  opinion  and 
advice.  That  of  the  physicians  must  in  the  end  decide 
the  matter.  I  have  told  you  what  they  say  here ; 
Thomson  said  he  would  write  once  more  to  Allen ;  and 
when  I  get  to  town,  I  will  consult  Warren  again.  If  I 
go  abroad,  the  south  of  Italy  (that  is  Naples,  or  its 
neighbourhood)  seems  from  all  I  can  hear  to  be  the  most 
advisable.  If  I  was  to  go  to  Spain,  my  poor  mother 
would  dream  of  nothing  but  Fernan  Nunez'  application 
to  Castlereagh/^'  which  somebody  unluckily  told  her  of; 


*  In  a  discussion  on  the  1st  of  ISIarcli,  1815,  respecting  the  conduct  of  the 
British  authorities  at  Gibraltar,  in  delivering  up  to  the  iSpauish  government 
some  Spaniards  who,  on  account  of  political  offences,  had  sought  refuge  there, 


376  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1816. 

and  wherever  I  am,  a  little  of  English  society  in  the 
morning  must  be  part  of  mj  medicine.  Had  Anthony 
Maitland  been  going  out  immediately  to  the  Mediterra- 
nean, I  would  not  have  declined  the  offer  which  Lord 
Lauderdale  most  kindly  said  he  Avould  have  made,  of 
taking  both  me  and  my  brother ;  in  so  comfortable  a 
way,  I  would  have  ventured  on  the  experiment  of  a 
voyage,  though  hitherto  my  sickness  has  always  lasted 
the  whole  time  I  was  upon  the  water.  I  .am  in  hopes, 
that  by  warm  clothing  and  moderate  journeys,  I  may 
perform  the  land  journey  without  fatigue  or  exposure  to 
cold. 

All  this  while,  I  have  never  said  a  word  about  your 
indisposition.  I  trust  the  threatening  proved  a  false 
alarm,  and  that  I  shall  find  you  on  Thursday  quite  well 
again. 

3Iorpeili,  Sundai/  Evening.  I  have  had  two  days  of 
travelling,  and  am  nothing  the  worse  for  it ;  coming  very 
leisurely,  and  taking  every  precaution  against  cold.  The 
weather  has  been  delightfully  mild.  I  am  becoming 
quite  expert  in  the  selfishness  and  egotism  of  an  invalid. 

Your  accounts  of  Foscolo  are  so  interesting,  that  I  am 
quite  impatient  to  see  him.  Thank  Lord  Holland  for 
his  most  kind  letters. 

God  bless  you,  my  dear  Lady  Holland. 

Affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Mr.  Horner  spoke  of  the  King,  Ferdinand,  in  very  strong  terms  of  reproba- 
tion, lie  described  him  as  being  hated  and  despised  throughout  the  Spanish 
nation  ;  and  expressed  a  hope  that  the  people  of  Spain  might  be  excited  to 
reassert  their  rights,  and  depose  Ferdinand.  The  Spanish  Ambassador 
appHed  to  the  government,  (much  to  the  amusement,  it  is  said,  of  the  Foreign 
Secretary,)  to  have  the  member  punished  for  speaking  of  his  Catholic  Majesty 
in  such  terms.  —  Ed. 


^T.  39.J  CORRESPONDENCE.  377 

Lktter  CCLXXIX.    from  SIR  SAMUEL  ROMILLY. 

Knill  Court,  6th  Oct.  18 IG. 

Many  thanks  to  you,  my  dear  Horner,  for  the  trou- 
ble you  have  taken  respecting  the  portrait.  You  have  a 
good  deal  disappointed  me  by  not  saying  any  thing 
about  yourself.  I  was  in  hopes,  though  your  own  health 
is  a  subject  which  does  not,  I  believe,  occupy  much  of 
your  thoughts,  that  I  should  have  heard  from  you  that 
you  had  quite  got  rid  of  the  cough  with  wdiich  you  left 
town,  and  that  you  had  no  remains  of  that  languor 
which  I  think  I  lately  observed  in  you.  I  have  often 
longed  to  tell  you,  and  I  avail  myself  of  this  opportu- 
nity of  doing  it,  that  I  do  not  think  you  nearly  as  care- 
ful of  yourself  as  you  ought  to  be.  If  you  took  little 
account  of  your  health  for  3^our  own  sake,  and  for  that 
of  your  friends,  yet  3^our  regard  for  the  public  good 
should  induce  you  to  pay  the  utmost  attention  to  it. 
You  will  not,  I  am  sure,  suspect  me  of  flattery,  though 
your  modesty  may  question  the  soundness  of  my  judg- 
ment, but  it  is  my  most  sincere  opinion,  that  there  is  no 
public  man  whose  life  it  is  of  such  importance  to  the 
country  should  be  preserved  as  yours.  Lady  Romilly 
desires  to  be  most  kindly  remembered  to  you. 
Ever,  my  dear  Horner, 

Most  sincerely  yours, 

Samuel  Romilly. 

Letter  CCLXXX.    TO  IIIS  FATHER. 
My  dear  Sir  C^reat  Russell  Street,  11th  Oct.  181C. 

We  arrived  to-day  soon  after  twelve,  and  I  have 
already  seen  Dr.  Warren.     He  wishes  me  to  see  Dr. 

32* 


378  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1816. 

Baillie,  and  to  state  my  case  without  communicating 
either  what  he,  Dr.  W.,  has  said  to  me  formerly,  or  what 
I  understood  from  my  physicians  at  Edinburgh,  in  order 
that  he  may  form  his  own  opinion,  and  afterwards  confer 
with  Dr.  Warren.  I  have  accordingly  written  to  Dr. 
Baillie,  requesting  him  to  name  a  time  when  I  may 
call  upon  him. 

Dr.  Warren  said  to  me  there  is  a  nicety  in  the  case ; 
an  equivalent  expression,  I  suppose,  to  one  Dr.  Thomson 
used,  that  there  was  an  anomaly  in  it.  You  shall  hear 
exactly  what  they  tell  me.  I  found  your  kind  letter, 
besides  others  from  all  the  family.  We  are  much  com- 
forted by  knowing  that  they  are  all  well.  My  kind  love 
to  them. 

My  dear  Sir, 

Most  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 

I  ought  to  tell  you  that  Dr.  W.  thought  me  looking 
better  than  when  I  left  town. 


Letter   CCLXXXI.     TO  HENRY  HALLAM,  ESQ. 

My  dear  Hallam,  Holland  House,  utii  Oct.  18I6. 

I  have  heard  of  your  kind  inquiries  and  your 
friendly  anxiety ;  if  I  were  not  under  orders  to  be 
very  taciturn,  and  almost  constantly  in  a  state  of  re- 
pose, I  should  have  made  a  point  of  seeing  you ;  but 
I  fear  I  shall  not  have  that  pleasure  before  I  go 
abroad. 

I  have  made  up  my  mind  to  a  system  of  exclusive 
attention  to  my  health,  for  some  time.  From  all  I 
hear,  Pisa,  or  some  one  of  the  small  towns  in  that  part 


^T.  39.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  379 

of  Tuscany,  will  be  the  best  residence  for  me  during  the 
three  or  four  months  of  winter ;  if  my  health  improves, 
I  shall  be  tempted  to  go  farther  south  about  the  end 
of  March,  for  I  do  not  mean  to  come  back  till  the  east 
winds  have  ceased  to  blow  here.  It  will  be,  as  you 
know,  a  great  act  of  kindness  to  write  to  me  as  often  as 
you  have  leisure.  I  shall  be  anxious  and  nervous  about 
public  matters  at  home,  till  this  lowering  winter  is  over, 
and  most  of  all  about  the  state  of  the  public  mind, 
which  I  look  upon  as  very  diseased  at  present,  and 
much  inclined  to  give  ear  to  quack  doctors,  and  to 
try  the  experiment  of  violent  prescriptions.  As  the 
people  never  dies,  we  shall  get  through  the  actual 
malady,  and  become  prosperous  again ;  but  I  dread 
what  sacrifices  we  may  be  tempted  to  make  of  essential 
principles  of  policy,  and  especially  of  those  which  guard 
and  consecrate  property. 

Upon  the  subject  of  the  public  debts,  I  look  npon  the 
whole  body  of.  country  gentlemen  to  be  altogether  un- 
principled; as  eager  and  sharpset  for  rapine,  as  the 
Jacobins  ever  w^ere  for  their  acres.  Then  you  have 
a  very  feeble  ministry  ;  and,  between  their  financial 
difficulties  on  the  one  hand,  and  the  clamours  of  the 
idle-headed  reformers  on  the  other,  I  fear  they  will  be 
base  enough  to  make  compromises  that  will  produce 
no  real  ease  to  the  state,  but  which  wall  leave  the  last- 
ing mischief  of  bad  example  and  violated  principle. 
Never  were  virtue  and  good  sense  on  the  part  of  the 
House  of  Commons  more  fervently  to  be  prayed  for. 
If,  under  such  a  conjuncture  as  the  present,  they  shall 
compel  the  reduction  of  the  army,  and  at  the  same 
time  strengthen  the  government  with  an  efficient  sys- 
tem of  taxation,  abstaining  from  all  predatory  inroads 
upon  property  of  any  description,  they  will  make  our 


380  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1816. 

liberties  immortfil ;  and  if  they  do  not  do  all  this,  these 
liberties  have  not  much  longer  to  survive. 
Give  my  very  kind  regards  to  Mrs.  Hallam, 

And  believe  me  most  truuly  yors, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CCLXXXII.     TO  HIS  FATHER. 
My  dear  Sir  Holland  House,  14th  Oct.  1816. 

As  I  saw  Leonard  write  a  long  letter  to  my 
mother  this  morning,  I  dare  say  he  has  said  every 
thing  respecting  Dr.  Baillie's  visit  yesterday  that  I  could 
report.  Allen  is  to  write  fully  to  Dr.  Thomson,  and 
will  desire  him  to  show  you  the  letter,  that  you  may 
know  w^ith  precision  and  exactness  the  view  which  Dr. 
B.  takes  of  my  disorder. 

A  good  deal  of  the  conversation  passed  not  in  my 
presence  ;  but  from  what  he  said  to  myself,  coupled 
with  what  I  have  heard  of  the  rest,  I  think  there  is  fair 
reason  to  conclude,  first,  that  the  removal  of  this  disorder 
may  be  effected  by  care  and  precaution,  if  I  get  no  acces- 
sion of  accidental  cold ;  and,  secondly,  that  the  scheme 
of  going  abroad  affords  the  most  favourable  means  of 
carrying  that  system  of  precaution  into  effect.  I  am  to 
see  Dr.  Warren  again,  after  he  has  had  a  conversation 
with  Dr.  Baillie,  and  I  shall  endeavour  to  have  another 
consultation  with  the  latter  also ;  who  has  behaved  very 
kindly  to  me  in  coming  out  of  town  to  see  me,  contrary 
to  his  general  rule. 

He  said  to  Allen,  that  he  had  never  known  an  in- 
stance of  a  consumptive  disease  of  the  lungs  without 
,  fever ;  and  also,  that  he  had  never  known  such  a  case 
occur  without  loss  of  flesh.  My  total  freedom  from 
fever,  and  my  recovery  of  flesh  while  I  was  in  Scot- 


iET.  39.]  CORRESrONDENCE.  381 

land,  of  which  there  is  no  doubt,  he  considers  accord- 
ingly as  affording  great  encouragement  to  the  most 
favourable  expectations. 

Leonard  is  making  every  preparation  for  our  travels ; 
for  though  not  formally  decided  upon  by  the  doctors 
yet,  I  look  upon  it  as  next  to  decided  that  we  shall 
go.  And  by  all  accounts  Pisa,  or  some  one  of  the  towns 
in  that  part  of  Tuscany,  such  as  Massa,  will  be  our  best 
residence  for  the  winter.  My  kindest  love  to  my 
mother  and  all  my  sisters  and  nieces. 

Most  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CCLXXXIII.    FROM  THE  REV.  SYDNEY  SMITH. 

My  dear  and  excellent  Friend,       Howiek,  loth  Oct.  isic. 
I  have  seldom  received  any  piece  of  intelligence 
with  more  sorrow  than  that  of  your  intended  journey 
to  the  Continent,  and  of  the  state  of  your  health  which 
makes  it  necessary. 

No  man  ever  left  his  country  more  honoured  and 
more  beloved  by  all  good  people,  or  more  followed  by 
their  earnest  wishes  for  his  safety. 

If  you  wish  to  make  Mrs.  Sydney  and  me  happy,  you 
will  tell  us  of  your  welfare.  We  shall  both  bless  the 
day  wdien  we  see  you  again  in  your  ancient  health. 

God  grant  it  may  soon  come. 

S.  Smith. 


Letter  CCLXXXIV.     TO  IMRS.  L.  HORNER. 
Mv  dear  Anne  Calais,  22cl  Oct.  half  past  3. 

I  am  safely  deposited  in  the  inn  on  this  side  of 
the  water ;  our  passage  was  four  hours  and  a  half,  with 


382  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1816. 

a  fine  wind  at  first,  which  fell  calm  for  some  time,  but 
rose  again,  so  that  we  made  the  harbour  without  losing 
our  tide.  Leonard  was  for  some  time  very  sick,  but  was 
quite  fresh  and  well  before  we  quitted  the  ship.  He 
remained  on  deck.  I  had  myself  laid  in  a  hirth  at  once, 
(I  w^onder  they  do  not  call  it  a  death  rather,)  and  re- 
signed myself  to  my  fate  in  a  recumbent  posture  ;  but 
all  my  wretchedness  is  over  now,  so  I  will  not  keep  up 
the  recollection  of  it.  We  shall  not  start  till  to-morrow 
morning,  and,  as  we  do  not  mean  to  attempt  to  travel 
more  than  fifty  English  miles  a  day,  it  will  be  Saturday 
forenoon  before  we  arrive  in  Paris ;  where  I  have  apart- 
ments already  secured  to  me  in  the  Place  Vendome,  and 
orders  gone  before  me  to  have  fires  lighted ;  by  the  po- 
liteness of  a  French  gentleman  whom  I  met  with  at 
Lord  Holland's,  whose  lodgings  these  are.  There  is 
no  end  to  the  kindness  of  every  body ;  but  Leonard's 
is  greater  than  all.  He  is,  I  think,  quite  well ;  indeed, 
remarkably  so,  not  a  tinge  of  yellow,  of  the  breadth 
of  a  hair,  in  any  part  of  his  face.  He  will  probably 
add  something  in  the  other  page ;  he  is  at  present 
busy  at  the  quay.  We  shall  not  hear  of  you  till  we 
reach  Paris ;  but  there  I  trust  w^e  shall  have  good 
and  full  accounts.  My  tenderest  remembrances  to 
dearest  Mary  :  I  hope  the  other  two  children  will  be 
like  her,  I  cannot  wish  them  to  be  better.  God  bless 
you. 

Affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Mt.  39.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  353 


Letter  CCLXXXV.    LORD   HOLLAND  TO  MR.  HORNER'S 

FATHER. 

Dear  Sir  Holland  House,  24th  Oct.  1816. 

Your  letters  shall  be  duly  forwarded  to  your  son. 
All  his  friends  here  are  sensible  of  the  advantage  of  his 
kind  and  affectionate  brother  Leonard  being  with  him, 
and  cannot  but  admire  the  disinterestedness  of  Mrs.  L. 
Horner  in  promoting  such  an  arrangement. 

We  had  the  satisfaction  of  finding  the  opinions  of  the 
London  physicians  less  unflxvourable  than  those  of  Edin- 
burgh had  been  represented  to  us ;  and  though  I  am  not 
sanguine  enough  to  think  there  is  no  cause  for  uneasi- 
ness, I  certainly  parted  with  him  with  a  better  opinion 
of  his  prospects  than  I  entertained  from  the  reports  I 
had  heard.  His  countenance  was  better,  and  both  he 
and  his  brother  maintain  that  he  has  gained  flesh,  which, 
if  w^ell  ascertained,  is  a  very  consolatory  symptom  in- 
deed, and  one  that  outweighs  very  many  of  a  less 
favourable  description.  No  thanks  are  due  to  us  from 
him  or  his  friends.  I  am  quite  sure  that  nothing  would 
make  Lady  Holland  or  myself  happier  than  the  power 
in  any  degree  of  promoting  the  recovery  or  contributing 
to  the  comfort  of  one  of  the  best  friends  and  best  men 
I  ever  knew.  You  may  depend  upon  it,  my  dear  Sir, 
that  there  is  no  man  in  England  who  has  more  sincere 
friends,  as  there  is  certainly  none  who  deserve  them 
more ;  and  there  is  none  who  has  greater  pride  in  reck- 
oning himself  one,  than  your 

Obhged  humble  servant, 

Vassall  Holland. 


384  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1816. 


Letter  CCLXXXYI.     TO  LADY  HOLLAND. 

My  dear  Lady  Holland,  P^^^'  20th  Oct.  18I6. 

Several  little  things  to  be  done  have  kept  us  one 
day  longer  in  Paris  than  we  meant ;  but  I  think  we  shall 
certainly  be  off  to-morrow,  early  enough  to  reach 
Nemours.  I  have  just  received  your  packet  of  last 
Thursday ;  it  is  a  vast  comfort  to  both  of  us  to  get  our 
letters  so  surely  and  frequently,  and  I  am  particularly 
pleased  on  my  brother's  account  that  his  separation  from 
Mrs.  Horner  and  his  children  should  be  relieved  as  much 
as  possible  from  any  continued  anxiety.  I  find  I  must 
trouble  Allen  with  a  medical  epistle,  so  I  shall  not  bur- 
den you  with  any  more  egotism  of  that  sort  to-day. 

Ward  *  lives  within  three  doors  of  us,  and  has  been 
here  repeatedly ;  very  pleasant  and  entertaining ;  he  sat 
by  my  bedside  yesterday,  that  is  my  sofa,  while  Leonard 
went  to  see  Talma  in  Hamlet.  His  master,  he  says,  is 
to  remain  some  time  longer  here ;  a  fortnight  or  more  : 
and  he  seems  to  suspect,  that  Canning,  besides  re-con- 
ducting his  lady  home,  has  some  political  reason  for 
being  here  at  this  time ;  but  he  evidently  makes  no  con- 
fidences of  that  sort  with  Ward.  Canning  is  of  opinion, 
that  the  Ultras  are  about  to  commit  a  great  fault,  in 
declaring  themselves  for  a  free  press  ;  and  he  tells  them 
so :  the  spirit  of  a  party  question  carries  them  for  the 
moment  so  far  out  of  their  own  element,  that  an  old 
emigrant  magistrate,  whom  I  knew  in  London,  a  Presi- 
deiit  a  moHier  of  one  of  the  Parliaments,  and  who,  in  all 
his  opinions,  is  for  every  thing  of  the  old  regime,  main- 
tains that  nothing  will  save  France  but  the  liberty  of 

*  The  Hon.  J.  W,  T\' ard,  the  late  Earl  Dudley. 


JEt.  39.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  335 

the  press.  This  is  not  founded,  that  I  can  hear,  upon 
any  speculation  that  the  country  might  be  roused  by  the 
press  to  any  declaration  in  favour  of  their  views;  but 
was  suggested  first  by  the  proceedings  against  Chateau- 
briand's pamphlet,  and  is  kept  up  by  feeling  that  they 
have  here  a  change,  and  a  general  question  to  debate, 
in  which  they  will  have  the  general  feeling  of  the  nation 
with  them  against  the  ministers.  But  besides  this,  and 
accusations  of  midue  and  unconstitutional  influence  in 
the  elections,  with  which  they  are  to  open  their  cam- 
paign, they  talk  of  other  popular  questions,  such  as 
abolishing  the  qualification  of  age  for  the  chamber  of 
deputies,  enlarging  the  number  of  that  assembly,  and 
giving  it  the  initiative.  I  am  afraid  the  Ultras  have 
more  of  the  discipline,  as  well  as  zeal  of  a  party,  than 
any  of  their  rivals. 

I  told  3^ou  of  Madame  de  Souza's  kindness  to  me,  in 
preparing  for  my  arrival,  and  coming  to  see  me  immedi- 
ately ;  she  has  paid  me  a  visit  every  day,  and  while  she 
had  the  goodness  to  amuse  me  by  conversing  in  my 
hearing,  she  enforced  your  instructions  in  prohibiting 
me  from  taking  a  part.  There  is  something  very  pleas- 
ing in  her  affection  for  her  son/^'  and  her  anxiety  on  his 
account.  Pray  take  some  opportunity  of  saying  to  her 
soon  how  gratefully  I  feel  her  unexampled  kindness  to 
a  stranger.  We  shall  write  from  the  road  in  a  day  or 
two. 

Yours  ever  most  affectionately, 

Era.  Horner. 

*  General  de  Flahault. 
VOL.  II.  33 


386  CORRESPONDENCE.  [181G. 


Letter  CCLXXXVII.     TO  MRS.  DUGALD  STEWART. 

My  dear  Mrs.  Stewart,  ^yons,  cth  Nov.  isie. 

I  know  you  will  be  glad  to  hear  that  I  have  got 
over  so  much  of  my  long  journey,  without  suffering 
from  it  in  the  least ;  either  by  fatigue,  or  by  fresh  colds, 
from  which  I  have  been  hitherto  wholly  exempted.  I 
am  therefore  altogether  as  well  as  when  I  left  London, 
and  by  that  time  my  general  health  w^as  improved,  in 
many  respects,  from  the  condition  it  was  in  when  I  went 
into  Scotland.  The  pulmonary  symptoms,  whatever  be 
their  real  nature,  remain  much  the  same ;  but  of  course 
I  was  not  led  to  expect  any  rapid  amendment  in  that 
particular,  or  before  I  am  quietly  fixed  in  some  sheltered 
sunny  spot.  We  have  had  delightful  weather  for  cross- 
ing France;  ever  since  Sunday  the  27th,  mild  air,  and  a 
bright  sky.  They  call  it  the  summer  of  St.  Martin, 
which  I  do  not  remember  to  have  heard  of  in  our  island ; 
I  suppose  because  we  want  the  season,  for  we  have  the 
Saint.  The  superstition  of  the  thing  is,  that  it  lasts  till 
the  11th  of  this  month ;  and  as  in  all  these  matters  the 
day  named  is  inclusive  always,  it  is  the  very  day  we 
shall  have  for  crossing  Mont  Cenis,  for  passing  the  snowy 
ridge  which  bounds  that  land  of  the  sun,  where  we  shall 
know  ourselves  to  be  independent  of  all  your  frosts  and 
fogs,  in  which  you,  on  the  wrong  side  of  the  mountains, 
lose  half  your  lives  and  half  your  genius.  That  day's 
work  seems  the  most  formidable  part  of  our  undertak- 
ing ;  but  having  done  it  before,  I  know  it  is  only  the 
business  of  five  or  six  hours,  and  we  have  a  carriage 
which  is  perfectly  closed  against  cold  air.  "We  are  not 
sure  yet  where  we  shall  fix ;  for  nothing  can  be  more 
contradictory  than  the  reports  we  have  received,  upon 


Mt.  39.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  387 

apparently  good  authority,  respecting  every  place  we 
have  thought  of.  It  is  now  reduced  to  a  choice  between 
Pisa  and  Rome ;  and  in  our  present  state  of  information 
the  balance  is  in  favour  of  the  latter ;  independently  of 
all  little  by-arguments  for  it,  such  as  the  probable  resi- 
dence of  Mr.  Playfair  and  the  Lansdownes  there  for  part 
of  the  winter. 

I  saw  Ward  at  Paris,  where  he  talks  of  remaining 
during  the  winter;  and  I  could  not  help  envying  him 
the  opportunity  of  seeing  so  near  at  hand  the  pro- 
ceedings of  a  most  critical  era  in  the  history  of  French 
liberty.  Not  that  we  should  probably  take  the  same 
sort  of  interest  in  the  same  things.  When  I  talk  of 
the  moment  as  critical  for  French  freedom,  it  is  not 
that  I  expect  any  sudden  turn  of  affairs,  or  that  I 
have  heard  of  any  thing  like  a  party  politically  formed 
in  flxvour  of  liberal  institutions;  quite  the  reverse. 
The  few  friends  of  rational  liberty  that  are  to  be  heard 
of  seem  broken-hearted,  and  they  are  systematically 
excluded  from  the  public  assemblies.  But  I  cannot  be- 
lieve that  a  deliberative  assembly,  with  a  party  in  oppo- 
sition to  the  existing  administration,  can  regularly  meet 
and  debate  in  the  present  circumstances  of  this  country, 
without  gaining  some  ground  for  the  action  of  public 
opinion ;  however  ill  the  assembly  may  be  constituted, 
and  however  miserable  the  views  and  intrigues  of  the 
contending  factions  that  compose  it.  The  accidental 
jostling  of  their  wretched  interests  has  produced  this 
whimsical  and  fortunate  combination,  that  the  Ultra- 
royalists  are  to  attack  the  ministers  for  breaches  of  the 
law  in  the  late  elections,  and  to  press  upon  them  the 
urgency  of  more  freedom  for  the  press,  and  of  a  better 
constitution  for  the  chamber  of  deputies.  Is  it  not  rea- 
sonable to  conclude  that  these  things  are  considered  as 


388  CORRESrONDENCE.  [1816. 

deeply  seated  in  the  wishes  of  the  nation  at  large,  when 
such  a  party  as  the  Ultras  force  themselves  into  topics 
so  revolting  to  their  real  sentiments,  in  order  to  play 
the  game  of  popularity  against  their  antagonists  ?  The 
nation  at  large  seems  quite  idle  and  calm  upon  all 
those  political  discussions ;  but  there  is  a  preponderat- 
ing weight  of  settled  opinions  and  habits ;  and,  what  is 
as  good,  of  proprietary  interests,  all  leaning  one  way.  I 
am  inclined  to  think  that  it  is  as  much  at  this  day,  as  it 
was  in  1789,  a  question  between  the  whole  people  on 
one  side,  and  a  handful  of  nobles  and  priests  on  the 
other ;  with  this  difference,  that  the  contest  is  not  with 
the  nation  wild  and  zealous  and  full  of  ardour  for  im- 
mediate action  in  politics,  but  with  the  nation  in  full 
possession  of  equal  rights  sanctioned  by  law,  and  con- 
scious of  a  real  enjoyment  in  the  possession  of  that  civil 
equality.  No  counter-revolution  can  destroy  this ;  how- 
ever the  presence  of  foreign  forces  may  retard  the  acqui- 
sition by  the  people  of  a  direct  share  in  the  political  ad- 
ministration of  their  affairs.  It  is  impossible  to  see  and 
hear  of  the  present  condition  of  the  French  people  in 
detail,  without  a  conviction  that  the  solid  benefits  sought 
by  the  Revolution  for  them  are  permanently  secured 
and  already  substantially  enjoyed. 

I  hope  you  will  write  to  me ;  send  your  letters  to 
Charlotte  Square.  When  we  are  settled,  I  will  write 
again,  and  I  will  try  to  keep  out  of  dissertations ;  but  in 
going  through  such  a  country,  one's  heart  gets  full ;  and 
there  are  so  few  but  yourself  to  whom  I  can  vent  my 
sanguine  illusions. 

My  kindest  regards  at  Kinneil. 

Ever  afiectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


-^T.  39.]  CORRESPONDENCE, 


Letter  CCLXXXVIII.    MR.  L.  HORNER  TO  LADY  HOLLAND. 

Dear  Lady  Holland,  Susa,  nth  Nov.  isic. 

As  I  find  the  courier  for  Lyons  passes  through 
Susa  to-morrow  morning,  I  will  not  lose  the  opportunity 
of  giving  yon  the  earliest  information  of  our  having 
this  day  got  over  Mont  Cenis  safely  and  well.  We  left 
Lans  le  bourg  at  half  past  nine,  were  on  the  summit  in 
three  hours,  at  Molaret  at  half  past  two,  and  at  this  place 
a  quarter  before  four.  The  day  was  clear  and  beautiful. 
Yesterday  there  was  a  fall  of  snow  and  rain,  and  to- 
night there  is  a  very  high  wind,  so  that  we  have  been 
exceedingly  fortunate  in  passing  during  a  favourable 
moment. 

We  meant  to  have  slept  at  Lans  le  bourg  last  night, 
but  got  no  farther  than  Modane  for  want  of  horses,  from 
which  place  we  started  at  six,  not  to  lose  a  day.  The 
thermometer  at  that  time  was  30°,  at  Lans  le'  bourg  at 
half  past  nine  31°,  at  Molaret  at  three  o'clock  38° ;  but 
by  keeping  a  candle  burning  in  the  carriage  all  day, 
according  to  Mrs.  Abercrombie's  direction,  and  with  the 
vessel  of  boiling  water,  the  air  of  the  carriage  was  not 
under  60°  the  whole  day.  My  brother  has  not  coughed 
at  all  to-day,  and  he  is  now  (8  o'clock)  fast  asleep  in 
bed,  I  think  I  may  safely  say  in  no  degree  injured  by 
the  journey,  beyond  the  fatigue  which  a  journey  so  long 
continued,  and  with  so  little  enjoyment,  might  be  ex- 
pected to  create. 

I  am,  dear  Lady  Holland, 

Very  faithfidly  yours, 

Leonard  Horner. 

o  • 


390  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1816. 


MR.  HORNER  TO  LADY  HOLLAND. 

(On  the  same  paper.) 

I  confirm  all  this;  after  a  night's  rest,  from 
which  I  have  awaked  without  any  symptom  whatever 
of  having  caught  cold.  The  journey  from  Lyons  has 
been  fatiguing,  particularly  in  the  long  La  Maurienne, 
where  his  Sardinian  Majesty's  postes  royales  are  but 
very  poorly  provided.  The  Mont  Cenis  is  nothing  of 
an  exertion,  the  road  is  so  admirable  ;  our  ascent  took 
exactly  three  hours,  with  snow  upon  the  road  all  the 
way,  but  not  more  than  ankle-deep  ;  the  descent  to  this 
place,  which  is  near  three  thousand  feet  lower  than 
Lans  le  bourg,  on  the  other  side,  was  a  pleasant  trot  of 
two  hours  and  a  half,  without  ever  using  the  drag,  or 
thinking  of  it. 

Most  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Lettek   CCLXXXIX.    TO  MRS.  SYDNEY  SMITH. 
Dear  Mrs.  Sydney,  Turin,  isth  Nov.  18I6. 

For  the  same  reason  that  I  wrote  to  you  from 
Calais,  I  send  you  these  few  lines,  to  give  you  the  earli- 
est intelligence  of  my  farther  progress.  We  are  fairly 
across  the  Alps,  and  I  have  neither  caught  any  fresh 
cold  in  the  course  of  this  long  journey,  nor  suffered 
any  increase  of  my  unfavourable  symptoms,  from  the 
irritation  and  irksomeness  of  travelling  as  an  invalid 
such  a  length  of  way.  You  see  how  literally  I  have 
understood  all  your  kind  expressions,  when  I  send  you 
a  letter  from  such  a  distance  merely  to  give  a  word 
about  myself.     Had  there  been  any  thing  new  to  learn 


^T.  39.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  39I 

about  the  places  I  have  passed  through,  I  could  not 
have  learned  it ;  for  I  step  from  my  carriage  to  my 
bed,  without  looking  about  me.  I  am  quite  well  enough, 
both  in  the  carriage  and  in  my  little  bed  or  crib,  to 
read  a  good  deal,  and  to  occupy  myself  with  much  plea- 
sant reflection  on  the  kind  friends  in  England  who  have 
made  my  past  life  so  agreeable,  and  with  dreams  of  pro- 
bably returning  to  that  life  and  my  friends,  with  as 
much  health  to  enjoy  them  as  before.  I  shall  have 
some  virtue  to  practise  in  order  to  deny  myself  the  gra- 
tification of  as  much  English  society  in  Italy  as  I  might 
find ;  for  part  of  the  regimen  prescribed  to  me,  is  a  de- 
gree of  silence  worthy  of  a  disciple  of  Pythagoras. 

Do  write,  and  make  your  letter  very  detailed  and 
particular  about  every  person  and  thing  at  Thornton : 
yoii  do  not  know  what  a  luxury  it  is  abroad  to  receive 
English  gossip  respecting  those  we  love,  and  the  relish 
of  this,  which  I  knew  before,  is  prodigiously  increased 
by  the  restraint  and  imprisonment  of  my  present  condi- 
tion. 

We  are  not  yet  arrived  at  a  warm  climate.  This  is  a 
bright  day,  with  a  clear  keen  air  —  the  thermometer  at 
40°  ;  I  dare  say  it  is  not  lower  at  Thornton. 

With  kindest  regards  to  Sydney, 

Very  truly  yours. 

Era.  Horner. 


Letter  CCXC.     TO  LADY  HOLLAND. 

My  dear  Lady  Holland,  Turin,  isth  Nov.  18I6. 

Though  we  had  the  precaution  to  write  to  you 

from  Susa,  as  soon  as  we  were  fairly  over  Mont  Cenis,  I 

question  if  that  letter  will  reach  you  sooner  than  this ; 

for  in  all  probability  the  passage  of  the  mountain  is  at 


392  COERESPONDENCE.  [1816. 

present  stopped.  We  had  not  been  two  hours  in  our 
inn  at  Susa,  when,  a  httle  after  sunset,  a  violent  wind 
rose  all  at  once,  which  blew  a  hurricane  ;  and  they  told 
tis  it  must  be  a  ionrmcnie  upon  Mont  Cenis,  and  that  we 
were  fortunate  in  having  passed.  Next  morning,  be- 
tween seven  and  eight,  just  after  I  had  despatched  my 
letter  to  you,  there  began  a  thick  shower  of  snow,  as 
serious  as  I  have  seen  it  at  Edinburgh  on  Christmas-day ; 
and  this  accompanied  us  all  the  way  down  the  valley 
for  more  than  twenty-five  miles ;  the  snow  lay  near  a 
foot  deep  on  the  ground.  Before  we  got  to  Rivoli, 
which  is  the  exit  of  the  valley,  w^e  found  it  lying  thinner 
and  thinner,  and  the  light  to  the  eastward  under  the 
clouds  brightening,  till  we  emerged  at  once,  at  the  head 
of  the  plain  of  Lombardy,  to  a  clear  sky  and  green 
fields.  AVe  have  found  it  pretty  cold  here,  however ;  a 
keen  air,  with  the  thermometer  as  low  as  forty  degrees, 
which  w^e  should  be  ready  to  complain  of  in  London  on 
this  day  of  November,  ay,  or  at  Edinburgh.  I  have 
nothing  to  say  about  my  health  different  from  the  last 
account,  and  I  rejoice  for  your  sake,  and  my  own,  that 
we  may  pass  by  that  subject  for  once. 

1  think  we  have  told  you  that  we  shall  not  decide 
upon  our  winter  quarters  till  we  get  to  Bologna ;  where 
we  shall  halt  a  day  or  two.  I  have  heard  something  to- 
day, wdiich  is  in  favour  of  Pisa  again  ;  from  M.  Grassi,  a 
gentleman  to  whom  Foscolo  gave  us  a  letter.  Pray  tell 
him  that  we  are  pleased  with  his  friend,  and  that  we  are 
obliged  to  him  for  taking  much  trouble  to  give  us  infor- 
mation. He  has  himself  been  obliged  to  reside  on  the 
other  side  of  the  Apennines  for  health ;  and  though  he 
prefers  wintering  in  Naples,  as  a  place  where  it  is  impos- 
sible to  die,  he  gives  Pisa  the  preference  over  Rome. 
Pisa,  he  says,  has  occasional  cold  winds  in  the  winter ; 


JEt.  39.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  393 

but  not  above  three  or  four  times,  for  three  or  four 
hours  at  a  time.  Rome  has  no  cold  winds;  but  a 
humidity  during  the  rains,  which  penetrates  the  skin. 
If  that  j^is  a  true  account  of  the  matter,  that  sort 
of  wet  must  be  the  worst  sort  of  cold.  He  says  one 
must  leave  Pisa  by  the  middle  of  March,  the  spring 
there,  as  all  over  Tuscany,  being  variable  in  the 
extreme. 

I  have  been  reading  Sismondi's  Republics,  by  way  of 
preparing  myself  in  the  geography  and  history  of  Italy. 
After  going  through  about  five  volumes,  I  am  forced  to 
say  he  seems  to  me  a  very  poor  writer,  and  greatly 
below  the  name  he  has  got :  his  sentiments  and  princi- 
ples are  in  general  correct,  and  all  lean  the  right  way ; 
but  there  is  a  want  of  mind  in  the  book,  and  a  j^overty 
of  composition  that,  in  spite  of  his  subject,  make  the 
reading  of  it  fatiguing.  I  have  accordingly  made  a 
jump  from  him  to  Machiavel,  and  shall  not  be  soon 
tempted  again  to  break  one  of  my  oldest  rules  about 
reading  history  —  to  keep  to  the  original,  and,  where 
they  are  to  be  had,  the  contemporary  authorities. 

Being  arrived  in  the  capital  of  a  great  state,  I  sent 
round  to  the  booksellers'  shops  for  new  publications; 
but  the  universal  answer  was,  there  were  none.  I  sent 
for  a  bookseller,  from  what  they  call  the  best  shop,  and 
asked  him  if  there  were  no  pamphlets,  no  dissertations 
upon  their  trade,  or  their  manufactures,  or  their  agricul- 
ture, or  their  new  laws,  or  their  old  laws  revived ;  he 
crossed  himself,  and  said  it  was  forbidden,  they  had  none 
of  these  things,  there  had  not  been  a  new  publication 
in  Turin  he  did  not  know  the  time.  Yet  this  is  the 
country  of  Alfieri  and  La  Grange. 

It  is  now  quite  the  latest  moment;  and  the  courier 
having  arrived  about  an  hour  ago,  we  have  this  moment 


394  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1816. 

received  the  delightful  packet  of  letters  so  carefully  put 
up  by  you.  I  have  only  had  time  to  run  my  eye  over 
them,  to  see  if  there  was  any  thing  to  answer  immedi- 
ately :  much  I  see  to  amuse  me  this  morning,  and  much 
for  our  consideration  about  Pisa,  to  which  you  see  I  am 
already  more  than  half  inclined  again.  It  is  distressing 
to  hear  how  much  Lord  Holland  is  suffering.  We  shall 
stay  another  day  at  this  place,  and  perhaps  I  may  write 
again.  The  courier  was  stopped  on  Mont  Cenis  by  the 
snow. 

Ever,  my  dear  Lady  Holland, 

Most  affectionately  yours, 

Era.  Horner. 

Letter  CCXCI.    TO  HIS  MOTHER. 

My  dear  Mother,  Genoa,  isth  Nov.  isie. 

My  last  letter  was  to  my  father  from  Turin  on 
the  14th ;  when  I  told  him  that  we  had  that  day,  after 
full  consideration,  made  up  our  minds  to  go  to  Pisa,  at 
least  in  the  first  instance,  and  to  make  it  our  winter 
quarters,  unless  we  shall  find  it  colder  than  we  have 
reason  to  expect.  We  took  three  days  to  come  here, 
though  we  might  have  made  the  journey  in  two,  had 
we  been  more  accurately  informed  as  to  the  time 
required,  and  as  to  the  inns  where  we  could  sleep.  We 
stopped  at  Asti,  and  the  following  night  at  Novi.  The 
road  all  the  way  from  Turin  to  this  last  place,  that  is,  to 
the  foot  of  the  Apennines,  for  it  lies  immediately  under 
them,  is  quite  level ;  and,  in  the  present  dry  season,  as 
smooth  a  gravel  road  as  was  ever  seen,  and  the  posting 
upon  it  excellent.  Asti  is  one  of  the  oldest  towns  in 
Italy,  and  looks  more  like  former  ages  than  the  present. 
Their  greatest  poet  of  modern  day,  Alfieri,  was  a  gran- 


^T.  39.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  395 

dee  of  this  town,  and  had  a  palace  belonging  to  his 
family,  which  his  sister  is  at  present  living  in.  As  Leon- 
ard went  to  see  it,  you  will  have  some  description  of  it 
in  the  journal  he  sends  to  Anne.  Between  Asti  and 
Novi,  we  travelled  over  some  very  famous  ground  in  the 
military  history  of  modern  Italy ;  first,  the  fortress  of 
Alessandria,  which  was  constructed  in  the  middle  ages, 
by  the  free  cities  of  Lombardy,  when  they  were  strug- 
gling for  their  independence,  and  they  chose  the  situa- 
tion w^ith  so  correct  a  judgment  that  it  opposed  an 
effectual  bulwark  against  the  last  invasion  of  the  Empe- 
ror Barbarossa,  and  forced  from  him  the  recognition  of 
their  liberties ;  since  that  period,  it  has  been  always  an 
important  place  in  the  wars  of  Italy ;  and  Bonaparte, 
when  he  demolished  all  the  other  fortresses,  preserved 
this  and  Mantua,  as  the  two  bulwarks  of  his  empire  on 
that  side.  After  Alessandria,  we  passed  over  the  plain 
of  Marengo,  where  he  gained  the  most  celebrated  of  his 
victories ;  and  in  the  neighbourhood  of  Novi,  where  we 
stopped  for  the  night,  Suwarrow  gained  his  great  battle 
against  the  French,  in  which  their  general  Joubert  was 
killed.  The  road  from  Novi  here  is  over  the  Apennines, 
by  a  bad  paved  road,  which  is  fatiguing,  though  the 
whole  height  is  not  very  great.  We  had  a  fine  bright 
day,  and  from  the  eminence,  called  the  Bochetta,  (or  lit- 
tle mouth,  from  the  narrow  aperture  by  which  the  road 
passes  from  the  one  side  to  the  other,)  we  had  a  noble 
view  of  the  Mediterranean,  smooth  and  bright  as  a  look- 
ing-glass, beyond  the  brown  mountains  lying  below  us. 
It  is  indeed  a  very  striking  prospect ;  but  I  shall  not 
attempt  to  describe  it  more  particularly,  or  to  give  you 
any  notion  of  the  grandeur  of  the  first  sight  of  this 
town. 

I  have  for  the  last  four  days  felt  myself  remarkably 


396  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1816. 

well  and  alert,  and  quite  free  from  cougliing,  though  we 
have  had  a  good  deal  of  cold.  I  do  not  say  that  my 
breathing  is  easier,  but  my  general  feeling  of  health  has 
been  better,  and  I  have  not  put  the  breathing  to  any 
severe  trial ;  for  as  the  staircases  here  are  remarkably 
high,  I  had  recourse  to  a  sedan  chair,  in  which  I  was 
carried  wp  to  my  apartment.  I  have  had  the  pleasure 
to  find  all  the  Minto  family  here,  who  have  been  good 
enough  to  waive  all  ceremony  and  visit  me  in  my  inn. 

We  shall  probably  leave  this  place  for  Leghorn  to- 
morrow ;  for  I  find  that  by  far  the  easiest  and  best  way 
of  transporting  ourselves  to  Pisa,  is  to  take  that  coasting 
voyage,  which  we  shall  probably  perform  within  twenty- 
four  hours.  At  Leorhorn  we  shall  not  be  much  more 
than  a  dozen  miles  from  Pisa ;  so  that  in  all  probability, 
we  shall  keep  to  the  time  I  mentioned,  and  arrive  at  our 
final  destination  in  the  course  of  Thursday.  You  shall 
have  a  letter  by  the  first  post  that  leaves  Leghorn  after 
our  landing ;  but  as  we  shall  then  be  a  good  many  miles 
more  to  the  south,  you  must  not  be  uneasy  if  there 
should  be  some  intervals  between  your  getting  the  pre- 
sent letter  and  the  next.  God  bless  you,  my  dear 
mother. 

Most  affectionately  yours, 

Era.  Horner. 

Letter  CCXCII.    TO  LADY  HOLLAND. 

My  dear  Lady  Holland,  K^^'  29th  Nov.  i8i6. 

"We  are  at  last  arrived  here.  I  expected  to  have 
announced  this  to  you  a  week  ago,  but  we  were  a  week 
detained  at  sea  in  coming  from  Genoa  to  Leghorn.  We 
arrived  here  yesterday,  and  are  occupied  in  searching 
for   lodgings,  which   seem   difficult   to   be  had  on  the 


JEr.  39.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  397 

proper  side  of  the  river.  The  weather  is  at  present 
JDeautiful,  and  the  temperature  of  the  air  mild,  so  that 
my  first  impression  is  in  flivour  of  the  place. 

Perhaps  we  exaggerated  to  ourselves  the  discom- 
forts and  exposure  of  the  road  over  the  Apennines  by 
Bologna,  when  we  decided,  upon  that  consideration,  to 
leave  the  high  road,  and  come  by  Genoa.  And  we 
were  misinformed  a  little  at  Turin,  both  as  to  the 
state  of  the  Corniche,  and  as  to  the  duration  of  a 
coasting  voyage.  Between  these  two,  I  hesitated  a 
good  deal  at  Genoa;  and  though  my  voyage  proved 
much  longer  than  was  promised,  I  believe  it  is  fortunate 
that  we  made  that  choice.  Lord  Carnarvon,  with  his 
young  party,  came  by  land,  with  mules  and  a  portan- 
tine  in  case  of  accidents :  they  found  it  perfectly  prac- 
ticable in  three  days  to  Sarzanne ;  but  they  found  no 
accommodation,  scarcely  shelter,  at  the  places  where 
they  stopped  for  the  night;  the  road  ascends  often 
great  heights,  and  brought  them  into  very  cold  air ;  and 
there  are  parts  of  the  road,  he  thinks,  where  the  por- 
teurs  could  not  carry  their  load,  but  would  be  compelled 
to  make  him  carry  himself,  and  sometimes  for  a  consi- 
derable way. 

We  had  bad  Aveather  during  part  of  our  voyage,  that 
is,  heavy  rains  and  a  swell  of  the  sea ;  it  was  never  cold, 
however ;  and  what  delayed  us,  was  the  want  of  a 
steady  wind,  the  land  breezes,  which  made  the  sea  so 
beautiful  to  look  at,  being  light  and  variable,  on  account 
of  the  height  of  the  coast  and  the  narrowness  of  the  bay. 
I  did  not  suffer  from  sickness,  for  I  persevered  in  my 
horizontal  recumbent  posture  all  the  six  days.  I  cannot 
yet  speak  of  any  improvement  in  that  oppression  of  my 
breath,  which  I  dislike  more  than  the  cough,  because  it 
has  never  been  explained  to  me  by  any  of  my  physi- 

VOL.  II.  34 


398  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1816. 

cians ;  it  is  not  getting  worse,  however,  thougli  just  at 
present,  while  I  am  weaker,  in  consequence  of  my  con- 
finement at  sea,  I  feel  the  inconvenience  of  any  exer- 
tion more  immediately.  But  now  that  rest  is  in  my 
power,  I  mean  to  have  absolute  repose  till  I  feel  strong 
again,  and  probably  in  a  week's  time  I  shall  be  able  to 
make  a  favourable  report  in  all  respects.  I  find  there 
are  some  acquaintances  of  mine  here,  but  I  have  not 
seen  any  of  them  yet,  as  going  wp  stairs  still  incom- 
modes me ;  and  besides,  I  have  a  mind  to  practise  the 
silence  that  was  prescribed  for  me. 

I  am  planning  what  I  shall  read  during  the  winter ; 
my  idea  is,  to  go  through  some  of  the  best  authors  of 
the  country,  and  to  keep  myself,  if  I  can,  from  the 
temptations  of  their  minor  literature.  I  have  not  yet 
been  to  the  booksellers'  shops,  but  I  ascertained  there 
was  a  pretty  good  one  at  Leghorn. 

Lord  Lansdowne  says  he  shall  remain  at  Eome  till 
after  Christmas,  and  then  go  to  Naples  for  a  month  or 
two.  Dumont  is  in  great  force,  and  buys  marbles.  By 
the  way.  Lord  Lansdowne,  after  very  full  inquiries 
about  climates,  wrote  to  me  in  the  most  decided  terms, 
against  my  coming  to  Rome,  and  in  favour  of  Pisa ;  and 
Lord  King,  who  is  very  knowing  in  such  matters,  con- 
curred with  him  in  opinion  against  Rome.  So  that  I 
have  at  present  the  satisfaction  of  believing  that  I 
have  chosen  for  the  best ;  at  present,  the  air  is  delight- 
ful, and  the  sky  blue  without  a  cloud. 

Very  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


iEx.  39.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  309 


Letter   CCXCIII.    TO  J.  A.  :\IURRAY,  ESQ. 

My  dear  Murray,  i''^^'  ^<^^-  ^^^'^  ^^i*^- 

I  have  never  written  to  you,  because  I  knew  you 
would  be  made  acquainted  with  all  the  accounts  we  sent 
to  Charlotte  Square,=-=  and  because  my  health  and  my 
way  of  travelling  left  me  no  opportunity  of  learning 
any  thing  to  tell.  In  crossing  France,  we  came  the  road 
that  I  had  the  pleasure  of  travelling  with  you  two  years 
ago,  —  through  the  Bourbonnais  to  Lyons ;  it  is  a  bad 
road  in  point  of  travelling,  but  it  leads  through  some 
pretty  countr}',  and  I  was  particularly  struck,  indeed 
much  more  than  I  was  the  first  time,  with  the  beauty  of 
that  which  lies  between  Mont  Tarare  and  Lyons.  Many 
of  the  places  all  along  the  way,  and  some  of  the  wretched 
inns,  revived  in  my  mind  very  agreeably  the  particulars 
of  that  pleasant  journey,  some,  probably,  which  would 
never  have  occurred  again,  but  for  this  driving  over  the 
same  ground.  I  felt  a  second  time  the  regret  of  passing 
within  a  few  miles  of  the  Grande  Chartreuse,  without 
turning  off  to  see  it ;  and  I  could  not  help  thinking  it 
rather  an  odd  accident,  that  I  should  be  twice  in  my  life 
at  such  a  city  as  Turin,  and  both  times  too  unwell  to 
walk  about  and  see  it. 

^Ye  have  written  so  amply  and  minutely  on  the  sub- 
ject of  my  health,  that  I  have  nothing  new  to  say  at 
present ;  the  result  is,  that  I  am  pretty  much  in  the 
same  state  as  when  I  left  Scotland.  I  had  a  longer 
interval  of  relief  from  coughing  nearly  the  last  three 
weeks  of  the  journey,  than  I  had  ever  had ;  but  I  had 
hardly  announced  this  when  it  came  back,  though  not 

*  His  fatlier's  house  in  Edinburirh.  —  Ed. 


400  CORRESPONDENCE.  [ISIG. 

SO  bad  as  before ;  I  have,  for  the  ^Yeek  we  have  been 
here,  had  a  httle  of  it  ahnost  every  day.  My  weakness 
of  breathing  is  not  worse.  Except  for  the  first  two  or 
three  days,  we  have  had  cokl  weather  ever  since  we 
came  here ;  an  eager  wind  blowing  from  the  north-east, 
the  thermometer  below  the  freezing  point  most  nights, 
and  not  much  above  forty  degrees  at  any  time  of  the 
day.  It  wonld  be  delightful  weather  to  enjoy  in  health 
and  exercise,  for  the  sky  is  beautiful,  and  even  this  air 
must  be  pleasant  to  those  who  can  keep  themselves 
warm ;  but  it  certainly  is  not  what  I  came  abroad  for. 
They  tell  us  it  will  change,  and  that  we  shall  have  a 
warmer  temperature  soon,  for  a  long  while  together ;  but 
if  I  were  not  more  anxious  for  rest  and  repose  than  any 
thing  else,  and  if  I  did  not  place  much  confidence  in  the 
efficacy  of  mere  tranquillity,  I  should  regret  that  the 
lateness  of  the  season  would  not  allow  me  to  seek 
warmth  much  farther  south.  If  Naples  does  not  give 
it,  my  conviction  is,  that  it  is  not  to  be  had  in  Italy.  I 
have  not  yet,  on  account  of  this  chilliness  of  the  air, 
got  into  the  v/ay  of  taking  exercise  regularly;  which 
was  one  thing  I  mainly  relied  on :  I  talve  a  drive  now 
and  then  in  a  close  carriage,  which  always  does  me 
good,  at  least  gives  me  spirits  for  the  day ;  and  I  have 
a  warm  sunny  walk  in  the  street  where  I  live,  but  it  is 
not  longer  than  the  turn  upon  the  quarter  deck,  for  the 
first  cross  street  is  a  funnel  of  cold  air,  and  the  mixture 
of  beG:2:ars  and  of  convicts  in  chains  (who  work  in  the 
streets)  makes  it  sometimes  too  disagreeable  to  stay  long. 
We  have  got  very  comfortable  rooms  in  the  best  situa- 
tion, having  the  sunshine  from  its  rising,  nearly  all  day : 
and,  what  consoles  me  for  all  other  ill,  I  find  I  can  read 
with  as  much  enjoyment,  and  as  much  activity  of  mind, 
as  at  any  former  period  of  my  life  -,  indeed,  this  vaca- 


iET.  39.]  CORRESrONDENCE.  401 

tion  from  professional  reading,  and  the  entire  liberty  of 
study  and  reflection,  almost  brings  back  to  me  the  days 
of  youth,  which  the  other  circumstances  of  my  condi- 
tion seem  to  throw  to  such  a  distance. 

I  have  cast  myself  headlong  into  Italian  literature, 
meaning,  however,  to  confine  myself  to  their  first-rate 
authors  among  the  historians  and  poets,  and  to  resist  all 
the  temptations  of  their  minor  literature,  as  well  as  the 
idleness  of  their  antiquities  and  art.  At  present,  I  am 
eno-aired  with  Dante  and  Machiavel ;  but,  as  I  have  felt 
before  in  other  historical  writers  of  this  country,  Machi- 
avel makes  me  feel  so  much  their  want  of  heart,  and  all 
generous  sentiment,  that  I  have  some  symptoms  of  a 
sort  of  nostalgia,  and  am  quite  impatient  for  the  arrival 
of  a  box  of  books  at  Leghorn,  in  which  I  put  up  Addi- 
son's Spectators,  and  Smith's  Moral  Sentiments. 

It  gives  me  great  pain  to  hear  such  distressing 
accounts  as  are  sent  from  England  and  Scotland  of  the 
scarcity,  and  the  want  of  employment  for  the  people. 
Their  sufferings  are,  I  fear,  most  severe,  and  will  not 
admit  of  relief  for  months  to  come.  In  addition  to 
other  evils,  we  shall  experience  on  this  occasion  one  of 
the  worst  consequences  of  that  sad  job  of  the  country 
gentlemen,  the  corn  bill ;  for  England  will  by  its  opera- 
tion get  no  foreign  grain  till  the  prices  are  at  the  high- 
est, and  after  all  other  countries  have  supplied  their 
wants ;  and  that  means  nearly  all  Europe.  At  Leghorn 
there  is  great  activity  in  the  corn  trade,  bringing  wheat 
from  the  Levant  and  the  Black  Sea,  the  most  from  Alex- 
andria :  Leghorn  is  no  doubt  a  port  of  deposit,  where 
our  merchants  may  still  find  it,  when  the  declaration  of 
the  average  at  the  end  of  the  right  number  of  months 
(such  formal  nonsense  makes  one  angry  at  the  words) 
shall  apprise  them  that  they  may  send  out  orders  ;  but, 

34* 


402  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1816. 

from  what  I  could  learn,  what  was  brought  from  the 
East  was  sent  away  agam  very  quickly  to  the  coasts 
wdthin  the  straits,  Italy  itself,  the  south  of  France,  and 
to  Spain,  in  all  of  which  countries  the  harvest  is  short. 
Always,  my  dear  Murray, 

Ever  most  truly  yours. 

Era.  Horner. 


Letter  CCXCIV.     TO  LADY  HOLLAND. 

Pisa,  13tli  Dec.  1816. 

Both  yesterday  and  this  morning,  my  dear  Lady 
Holland,  have  shone  upon  us  by  the  charming  arrival  of 
your  letters,  after  the  interval  of  a  month.     I  dare  say 
the  post  has  contributed  not  a  little  to  raise  the  temper- 
ature of  the  air  to  my  feelings ;  but  the  real  fact  is,  that 
after  some  six  or  eight  hours  of  rain,  such  as  I  never 
witnessed  before,  we  have  got  much  warmer  weather, 
and  the  thermometer  has  made  a  jump  of  about  fifteen 
degrees,  both  during  the  day  and  during  the  night.     It 
has  been  as  high  as  fifty-four  to-day,  and  was  not  lower 
in  the  night  than  forty-four.     I  hear  Dumont  is  returned 
to  Geneva,  delighted  with  his  Italian  tour.     I  wish  I 
could  have  crossed  him  in  his  w^ay ;  I  should  like  too  to 
read  one  of  the  two  books  he  has  lately  published,  that 
on  the  "sophistries"  practised  in  the  debates  of  public 
assemblies ;  this  is  a  subject  of  which  a  little  might  be 
made,  both  for  amusement  and  use,  and  where  his  fun 
and  good  writing  must  now  and  then  break  the  fetters 
he  has  put  upon  them,  in  the  name  of  '^'- iwincipcs  "  and 
method ;  like  some  other  things  he  has  undertaken  to 
dress,  nothing  could  in  his  hands  spoil  it  for  the  public 
taste,  but  his  way  of  putting  every  thing  upon  Ben- 
tliam's  gridiron,  to  be  scored  and  scorched  in  lines  and 
rules. 


iEr.  39.J  CORRESPONDENCE.  403 

There  is  a  little  society  here  with  Avliich  I  could  di- 
versify my  quiet  reading  life  much  to  my  satisfaction, 
but  I  abstain  altogether;  never  knocking  at  any  one's 
door,  and  shutting  mine  almost  every  day  to  every 
body. 

I  am  making  a  study  of  Dante,  which  is  rather  too 
big  a  word  for  any  reading  of  mine  now ;  but  I  do  not 
find  it  a  task,  and  he  will  make  all  other  writers  more 
easy  to  me.=^     I  have  run  through  some  of  Machiavel's 
Legations;    they  are  highly   entertaining,   particularly 
that  to  Ca3sar  Borgia,  with  whose  insinuating  manners 
and   eloquence    in   conversation   he  seems  certainly  to 
have  been  captivated,  as  well  as  by  his  force  of  charac- 
ter.    The   details,  given  from  day  to  day  in  despatches 
to  his  government,  while  the  affiiir  of  Sinigaglia  was  in 
train,  up  to  its  execution,  have  the  interest  of  a  tragedy; 
one  has  luckily  no  need  of  assistance  to  feel  the  horrors 
of  it,  for  the  writer  does  not  drop  a  phrase  that  could 
excite  it.     The  new  edition  of  his  familiar  letters  con- 
tains some  that  are  said  to  have  been  before  unpub- 
lished ;  the  edition,  I  mean,  of  Italia  (Florence),  1813, 
in  eight  volumes ;  the  three  last  volumes,  which  contain 
these  additions,  are  to  be  had    separately.     There  are 
some  very  pleasant  letters  between  him  and  Guicciar- 
dini.     I  have  read  over  again  an  old  acquaintance,  the 
Mandragola,  with  increased   amazement ;  how   he    has 
mixed  with   the  irresistible  buffoonery  of  the  story  his 
indignant  satire  against  the  priests !     There  is  one  jDas- 
sage  as  keen  as  the  Provincial  Letters,  and  very  like 
them.     The    Prince    (which   you   may   think   strange) 
I  have  read  for  the  first  time  in  my  life ;  and  with  such 
disgust,  that  I  do  not  know  I  shall  ever  be  able  to  open 

*  See  Appendix  D. 


404  COERESrONDENCE.  [1816. 

it  again.  It  has  not  prevented  me,  however,  from  going 
on  with  his  History,  in  which  I  own  I  find  nothing  in- 
consistent with  the  sort  of  mind  that  produced  The 
Prince ;  and  what  I  remember  of  the  Discourses  on 
Livy  would  not  alter  this  judgment ;  but  these  I  mean 
to  read  once  more.  Alfieri's  life,  up  to  the  French  Re- 
volution, has  made  me  hate  him;  he  loved  liberty 
very  much  in  Machiavel's  way,  and  understood  it  so. 
His  two  tragedies  ^Sald  and  Mirrci,  which  I  was  told  were 
his  best,  have  made  me  admire  and  wonder,  but  with- 
out much  dramatic  interest :  this  is  a  very  rash  judg- 
ment, and  I  shall  perhaps  have  to  retract  it ;  but  though 
the  conduct  of  his  plot  and  scenes  is  skilfully  pursued 
for  effect,  his  personages  have  no  character  of  their  own ; 
and  though  they  always  speak  the  proper  and  very 
forcible  language  of  the  passions,  they  never  say  any 
thing  but  what  one  seems  to  have  heard  before,  and  ex- 
pects them  to  say  in  their  circumstances.  There  is  con- 
summate art  in  the  Jlirra ;  but  it  has  not  a  touch  of 
that  pathetic  with  which  Ovid  tells  the  story,  and  with 
which  Dryden  has  translated  one  speech,  and  with 
which  Eacine  has  imitated  the  same  speech  in  Phedre. 
Could  there  be  a  stronger  trait  of  a  want  of  original 
genius,  than  his  resolution  not  to  read  Racine  any  more, 
for  fear  of  spoiling  his  originality !  But  I  am  falling 
into  very  old  stories :  do  not  let  Foscolo  hear  of  my 
heresies. 

During  the  long  interval  of  our  not  hearing  from  3'ou, 
we  heard  of  Whishaw  and  the  Romillys  being  well,  by 
a  letter  from  Mr.  Mallet  to  Madame  Achard ;  he  gave 
us  the  right  history,  too,  of  those  riots,  and  of  the  good 
conduct  of  the  suffering  people,  which  our  friend  Louis's 
government  takes  some  pains  to  misrepresent  in  their 
newspapers.    I  do  not  believe  that  you  knoAV  Mr.  Mai- 


JEt.  30.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  405 

let*,  at  least  not  much  ;  I  wish  3^011  did :  ho  is  a  very 
amiable  person,  and  to  me  quite  agreeable,  with  a  clear 
right  head,  which  he  nses  very  much  upon  what  is 
passing  in  the  world. 

Your  reproof  about  Sismondi's  history  is  deserved ; 
and  though  I  have  not  gone  l)ack  to  the  work,  I  had 
felt,  in  some  measure,  the  harshness  of  my  criticism,  be- 
fore I  received  yours,  which  is  just  and  excellent.  His 
conversation  had  made  me  milder  towards  his  book,  and 
almost  will  persuade  me  to  resume  it.  AYhat  had  set 
me  off,  was  many  childish  pages  of  seeming  philosophy, 
signifying  nothing ;  Parisian  generalities,  heated  up  at 
Geneva :  but  I  ought  at  the  same  time  to  have  remem- 
bered, that  he  has  embodied  into  his  composition  a  great 
deal  of  the  good  and  useful  philosophy  of  the  last  age, 
on  important  political  questions,  though  without  origi- 
nality or  any  good  writing  in  his  manner  of  doing  it. 

And  now  good  night,  iny  dear  Lady  Holland :  what 
a  blab  I  am  become  on  paper,  since  my  vow  of  vocal 
taciturnity.     My  kind  regards  to  Lord  Holland. 
Ever  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CCXCV.     TO  MRS.  DUGALD  STEWART. 

My  dear  Mrs.  Stewart,  ^'^'^^  i^t'^  ^^"^^  i^i^- 

I  ought  to  have  told  you  long  ago  how  well  I 
found  all  the  Mintos  and  Elliots  at  Genoa ;  where  I 
halted  for  two  days  on  my  way  here  ;  and  what  a  plea- 
sure it  was  to  have  for  two  days  the  faces  of  English 
friends.     They  were  all  in  perfect  health. 


*  John  Lewis  Mallet,  Esq.,  son  of  the  celebrated  INIallet  clu  Pan.  See 
SmijtJt's  Lectures  on  the  French  Revolution,  vol.  i.  p.  96,  and  vol.  ii.  p.  219, 
227.     He  has  been  for  many  years  Secretary  of  the  Audit  Board.  —  Ed. 


40G  CORRESrONDENCE.  [1816. 

I  can  of  course  tell  you  nothing  of  this  place,  except 
that  we  are  at  present  enjoying  beautiful  weather,  and 
that  the  general  look  of  the  town  is  striking  and  pe- 
culiar. But  my  present  mode  of  existence  is  so  like  a 
dream,  that  I  do  not  venture  to  talk  of  things  as  real ; 
to  have  been  brouiirht  over  near  a  thousand  miles  of 
foreign  country,  and  not  allowed  to  look  about,  and  then 
set  down  in  a  very  famous  place,  without  having  breath 
to  ask  a  question,  puts  me  in  a  manner  beside  myself 

In  a  bookseller's  catalogue  this  morning,  I  met  with 
the  title  of  a  work,  which  may  have  been  originally 
written  by  your  ancient  friend  Lord  Woodhouselee  ;  it 
is  a  "  disquisition  upon  the  doubt  which  had  arisen  how 
it  happened  that  Petrarca  did  not  expressly  praise  Laura 
for  her  nose!"  If  you  have  any  curiosity  to  see  it,  I 
will  send  for  it  to  Florence. 

Pray  tell  Mr.  Stewart  there  is  a  very  remarkable 
letter  of  Machiavel's  lately  published,  written  to  a  pri- 
vate friend  at  the  very  time  he  was  engaged  in  the 
composition  of  The  Prince,  and  not  only  fixing  the 
date  of  that  work,  but  explaining,  in  a  manner  disgrace- 
ful to  the  author,  the  use  at  least  he  made  of  it,  in  put- 
ting it  into  the  hands  of  the  Medicis  family ;  the  letter, 
besides,  is  full  of  character,  and  describes,  in  a  very  lively 
manner,  the  life  he  was  leading  when  driven  away  from 
Florence.  This  particular  letter  may  be  read  at  the 
end  of  the  last  volume  but  one  of  "  Pignotti's  Storia 
della  Toscana,"  a  book  published  here,  but  which  was  in 
all  the  London  shops  before  I  came  away ;  it  is  to  be 
found  also,  with  several  others,  which  are  entertaining 
and  curious,  in  a  new  collection  published  at  Florence,  in 
1814,  of  Machiavel's  public  despatches  and  familiar 
letters.  By  the  way  I  must  likewise  tell  Mr.  Stewart, 
that  my  late  reading  has  suggested  a  slight  criticism 


JEt.  39.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  407 

upon  one  exj)ression  of  his  with  regard  to  "  Machiavel's 
Prince,"  where  he  calls  it  "  one  of  the  latest  of  his  ^j*??!^//- 
cations"  The  fact  is,  that  his  three  great  works  were 
none  of  them  published  in  his  lifetime,  nor  for  four  years 
after  his  death  •  they  appear  to  have  been  all  written  at 
the  same  period  of  his  life,  during  the  eight  or  ten  years 
of  leisure  that  were  forced  upon  him ;  and  I  believe  it 
may  be  made  out  from  the  works  themselves,  that  The 
Prince  was  composed  and  finished  first  of  the  three, 
then  the  Discourses,  and  last  of  all  the  History.  This 
and  the  first  having  been  written  for  the  Medicis  family, 
the  MSS.  were  in  their  hands,  and  they  published  them ; 
the  Discourses  were  printed  by  the  care  of  some  of  his 
personal  friends.  If  Mr.  Stewart  washes  to  have  the 
proof  of  all  this  in  detail,  I  can  draw  it  out  without  any 
trouble.  You  see  that  the  Dissertation  is  one  of  my 
companions  in  my  travels. 

The  last  I  heard  of  Mr.  Playfair  was  in  a  letter  from 
Lord  Lansdowne,  at  Kome,  of  the  18th  November,  in 
which  he  mentioned  his  arrival ;  of  course  you  have 
later  accounts.  Remember  me  to  all  at  Kinneil,  and 
believe  me,  dear  Mrs.  Stewart, 

Very  affectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CCXCVI.     TO  J.  A.  MURRAY,  ESQ. 

My  dear  Murray,  P^sa,  2ist  Dec.  isic. 

I  got  yours  of  the  2d  instant  yesterday.     You 

say  nothing  of  Mrs.  Murray's  health.     By  other  accounts, 

I  find  she  had  been  ailing  and  confined  to  her  room,  but 

w\as  better ;  I  hope  and  trust  by  this  time  quite  well. 

Mr.  Clerk's  opinion  will  not  make  me  think  that  there 


408  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1816. 

"was  no  injustice  done  in  the  Ayrshire  case  *  There  was 
an  absolute  failure  of  justice,  upon  a  point  of  form/ after 
infinite  delay.  If  he  and  others  think  nothing  wrong 
in  the  existing  laws,  I  am  certain  that  was  not  the  opin- 
ion of  Lord  Eldon  in  that  cause ;  and  I  should  have  ex- 
pected some  of  those  you  name  to  have  been  at  least  as 
quick  as  he  to  see  and  admit  defects  that  touch  the  lib- 
erty of  the  subject.  Of  all  persons,  those  who  give  you 
the  least  aid,  wdien  any  thing  is  to  be  done  by  legisla- 
tion, are  your  ancient  barristers ;  the  two  operations  of 
mind,  knowing  what  the  laws  are,  and  seeing  what  they 
had  better  be,  seem  almost  incompatible. 

But  it  is  idle  to  regret  the  obstacles  that  exist  to  any 
amelioration  of  the  constitational  laws  of  Scotland. 
Similar  improvements  in  England  have  seldom  been  the 
work  of  lawyers,  but  have  been  forced  upon  them,  or 
carried  through  in  spite  of  them,  by  the  public  voice 
upon  some  crying  instance,  like  that  Ayrshire  case,  or 
by  the  efforts  of  individuals  unconnected  with  the  legal 
profession.  In  Scotland  you  have  no  public  voice ;  for 
you  have  neither  a  popular  meeting  nor  a  political  press. 

You  leave  me  in  doubt,  whether  you  adopt  Clerk's 
opinion,  when  you  state  it,  that  the  laws  of  Scotland  and 
their  administration  are  particularly  lenient  to  all  per- 
sons liable  to  imprisonment.  Under  the  actual  adminis- 
tration, ought  to  be  included  the  state  of  your  prisons ; 
which,  from  what  I  have  seen  of  some,  and  heard  of 
many  others,  are  a  reproach  to  a  civilised  country. 
Another  branch  of  actual  administration  is  the  practice, 
upon  your  circuits,  of  "  deserting  the  Diet,"  at  the  dis- 

*  Tills  Avas  an  action  for  wrongous  imprisonment  on  the  statute  of  1701,  c. 
C,  by  John  Andrew,  a  slioemaker,  in  the  village  of  jMaybole  in  Ayrshire, 
accused  of  seditious  practices,  against  John  Murdoch,  Sheriff-Substitute  of 
that  county.  — Doic's  Reports  of  Appeals,  vol.  ii.  p.  402.  —  Ed. 


^T.  39.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  409 

cretion  of  an  Advocate-Depute ;  by  which,  I  have  been 
assured,  in  numberless  instances,  the  imprisonment  of 
persons  accused  has  been  prolonged  from  year  to  year, 
until  it  appeared  that  they  had    suffered  confinement 
long  enough  even  for  guilt,  and  upon  that  principle  they 
were  discharged  as  persons,  not  tried  indeed,  but  pun- 
ished.    You  have  the  means  of  correcting  me,  if  these 
are  fictions.      Another  rigour  in  the  administration  of 
your  laws,  is  the  practice  of  committing  indefinitely  for 
further  examination ;  under  which  I  have  been  informed 
there  have  been  recent  abuses  to  a  great  extent.     Let 
me  add  one  more ;  the  power  your  magistrates  exercise, 
if  legally  or  not  I  do  not  know,  of  condemning  to  long 
and  even  solitary  imprisonment,  upon  their  own  convic- 
tion, without  a  jury,  persons  charged  with  police  offences, 
or  even  offences  of  another  description,  such  as  that  of 
the  servant  who  assaulted  and  kissed  his  mistress.     The 
things  I  have  spoken  of  actually  do  happen ;  so  much 
for  lenient  administration.     I  am  not  one  of  those  theo- 
retical innovators  who  are  for  squaring  the  letter  of  the 
laws  to  the  ideal  rules  of  a  perfect  justice ;  the  correc- 
tion and  prevention  of  practical  grievances  is  the  best 
we  need  aim  at.     But  there  are  some  branches  of  the 
law,  in  which  the  possibility  of  wrong  ought  to  be  pre- 
vented, if  by  fresh  guards  the  law  can  effect  it;  and 
the  most  important  of  these  is  the  liberty  of  the  subject. 
A  single  instance  of  abuse  and  oppression,  like  that  from 
Ayrshire,  on  which  I  must  insist  still,  ought  to  raise 
every  voice  for  a  law  to  make  the  repetition  of  such 
conduct  impossible.     To  quit  that  instance,  the  capital 
defect  of  your  law  of  imprisonment   upon  a  criminal 
charge  is,  that  it  does  not  provide  a  certain  infillible 
course   of  proceeding,  to  bring  the  accused  person  to 
trial,  as  early  as  the  preparation  of  evidence  will  admit 
VOL.  II.  35 


410  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1816. 

of.  The  law,  'wliicli  throws  an  innocent  man  into  gaol, 
ought  of  itself  to  determine  speedily  whether  he  ought 
to  be  discharged  or  punished.  Then  you  tell  me  of  3^our 
act  1701,  and  that  every  man  may  run  his  letters;  that 
is,  with  money  he  may,  if  he  sets  about  it  with  good 
professional  advice.  But  why  should  it  be  rendered 
necessary  for  him  to  take  any  steps  ?  why  do  not  his  let- 
ters run  by  operation  of  law,  without  any  movement  or 
payment  on  his  part  ?  The  law  has  made  the  first  move, 
in  taking  him  from  his  labour,  his  family,  his  liberty ; 
ought  it  not  to  go  on,  and,  with  every  degree  of  speed 
that  is  consistent  w^ith  a  due  execution  of  justice,  ascer- 
tain a  point  so  important  to  this  man,  if  he  is  innocent, 
the  question  of  his  innocence  or  guilt  ?  Here  then  is  a 
principle,  the  introduction  of  which  would  be  a  practical 
improvement  of  your  law ;  keep  the  phraseology  of  the 
act  1701,  but  let  the  letters  run  by  operation  of  the 
statute.  Reverting  here  to  the  actual  administration 
again,  I  speak  with  very  imperfect  information,  but  my 
impression  is,  that  it  is  not  a  matter  of  course  for  every 
prisoner  to  take  immediate  steps  for  running  his  letters; 
that  when  he  has  recourse  to  it,  there  are  difficulties 
and  delays  from  his  having  already  lost  time,  and  from 
the  formalities  of  the  law ;  that  there  is  a  sufficient  field 
for  the  chicane  of  such  practitioners  as  minister  to  the 
wants  of  prisoners ;  and  that  the  amount  of  fees  is  such 
as  cannot  fall  light  upon  a  man  in  the  condition  of  liv- 
ing by  his  daily  labour. 

I  see  nothing  in  Clerk's  other  arguments  :  he  dreads 
discussion :  you  will  not  learn  that  of  him.  Is  any 
good  ever  done  in  England  but  by  discussion  ?  This  is 
a  hint  worthy  of  some  of  my  present  acquaintance  in 
ecclesiastical  habits  on  the  Lung'-Arno.  But  juriscon- 
sults, after  a   certain  age,  get   wonderfully  ecclesiastic 


^T.  39.]  CORRESrONDEXCE.  411 

in  their  ways  of  tliinking.  "  It  Avill  be  a  long  time  be- 
fore the  new  law  is  understood  and  executed,"  —  that  is 
an  argument  I  will  not  answer.  He  thinks  it  better 
to  preserve  the  present  severity  of  penalties  against  the 
magistrate  who  misconducts  himself;  that  is  the  part 
of  the  new  bill  on  which  I  am  least  anxious.  One  use 
of  it  was  to  conciliate  the  magistrates  in  favour  of  the 
rest.  I  question,  however,  the  solidity  of  Clerk's  rea- 
soning ;  he  ought  to  show  that  the  penalties  have,  in 
any  instance,  been  enforced,  and  that  the  court  has 
never  shrunk  from  doing  justice  upon  a  complaint  on 
account  of  their  severity.  I  believe  they  are  an  instance 
amono;  a  thousand,  that  there  is  no  surer  device  for  im- 
punity,  if  that  is  the  real  drift,  than  to  enact  a  punish- 
ment such  as  nobody  could  think  of  enforcing. 

I  ought  to  ask  your  forgiveness  for  worrying  you  at 
such  length  upon  this  subject.  I  feel  it  to  be  mere 
Utopia,  to  talk  of  improvements  in  the  law  of  Scotland  ; 
one  has  nobody  to  go  to  but  the  lawyers,  and  they 
never  favoured  in  any  country  the  improvement  of  the 
law.  This  would  be  too  saucy,  if  I  were  not  a  bit  of  a 
lawyer  myself;  and  if  I  had  not,  in  more  instances  than 
one,  caught  myself  sliding  down  into  Westminster  Hall 
superstitions. 

Remember  me  to  all  my  friends,  Thomson  and  Jeffrey 
in  particular ;  and  do  not  reproach  them  for  not  writing 
to  me.  for  I  did  not  expect  it.  They  had  left  it  off  when 
I  was  in  a  condition  to  send  them  some  return.  Re- 
member I  am  in  a  place  of  solitary  confinement,  where 
I  hear  nothing  but  by  letters ;  and  it  very  often  hap- 
pens, when  I  am  hungering  for  gossip,  and  all  the  details 
that  become  so  dear  when  one  is  at  a  distance  from  the 
spot,  that  every  one  of  three  or  four  letters  politely  de- 


412  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1816. 

dines  telling  me  what  it  takes  for  granted  must  be  told 
in  the  others. 

My   affectionate   regards   to  Mrs.  Murray  and   Miss 
Murray. 

Ever  yours, 

Era.  Horner. 


Letter   CCXCVII.    TO  LORD  HOLLAND. 

Dear  Lord  Holland,  Pi^a,  2ist  Dec.  isie. 

I  heard,  with  great  pleasure  you  will  believe,  of 
your  being  at  last  relieved  from  the  gout;  by  the  order 
in  which  our  letters  reached  us,  the  first  I  heard  of  your 
amendment  was,  that  you  were  walking  in  the  garden 
at  Petworth ;  and  since  that,  Allen  has  told  me  you  are 
quite  recovered. 

I  rejoice  to  hear  you  say,  that  the  system  of  main- 
taining legitimates  in  foreign  countries,  at  the  expense 
of  English  treasure  and  character,  has  lost  its  popu- 
larity ;  I  feared  it  was  too  early  for  that  subject  to  be 
seen  by  the  English  in  its  true  light,  for  though  they 
always  get  at  the  true  sense  of  things  in  the  end,  they 
rarely  come  to  it  in  time,  nor  until  they  have  paid 
deeply  for  it.  It  is  the  great  theme  for  parliamentary 
discussion,  coupled  with  that  of  the  reduction  of  the 
army,  which  is  closely  connected  with  it,  both  ujDon  the 
grounds  of  economy,  and  upon  all  the  true  and  enlarged 
principles  of  political  liberty.  I  hope  when  parliament 
meets,  these  questions,  so  joined  together,  and  taken 
upon  their  broadest  ground,  will  be  urged  rejDeatedly ; 
not  merely  in  the  protest  of  one  solemn  debate,  which 
saves  the  consciences  of  the  speakers,  but  does  not  work 
upon  the  public.  What  I  dread  is,  that  in  the  House  of 
Commons  there  will  be  nothing  but  the  old  song  of  sine- 


^Et.  39.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  423 

cures  and  reversions ;  which  we  learned  from  the  unrea- 
sonable narrow-minded  democrats,  and  in  our  turn  have 
been  teaching  it  so  exclusively  to  the  excellent  Whig 
party  among  the  gentry  and  middle  orders  of  England, 
that  more  general  and  generous  notions  of  constitutional 
liberty  and  foreign  politics  are  no  longer  so  familiar  or 
acceptable  to  them  as  they  were  formerly.  As  to 
sinecures,  the  line  we  have  hitherto  taken  on  that 
subject  seems  to  me  still  the  most  reasonable,  and  it 
ought  to  be  adhered  to  with  firmness;  to  concur  in 
their  abolition  or  regulation,  but  to  protect  all  existing 
interests  as  property.  As  long  as  the  subject  would 
bear  discussion,  I  think  the  argument  was  much  in 
favour  of  sinecures,  under  our  form  of  government ; 
and  that  their  existence,  as  a  fimd  of  distribution  by 
statesmen  among  themselves,  (to  put  it  in  the  plainest 
terms,)  was  an  additional  security  given  to  the  demo- 
cracy, for  the  efficacy  of  what  we  justly  reckon  one  of 
the  best  marks  of  our  freedom,  that  a  man  may  rise 
from  the  humblest  rank  to  tlie  highest  office :  the 
democracy,  however,  have  scouted  all  such  arguments, 
and  I  take  the  discussion  to  be  at  an  end ;  at  least  while 
the  present  stigma  is  upon  such  places,  no  man,  Avho 
hopes  by  means  of  public  confidence  and  reputation  ever 
to  do  any  public  good,  would  be  indiscreet  enough  to 
come  near  them. 

But  though  this  view  of  the  subject  would  carry 
me  so  far  in  the  cry  against  sinecures,  as  to  join  in 
their  future  abolition,  no  outcry,  nor  any  public  pres- 
sure, should  ever  prevail  upon  me  to  touch  them  in  the 
present  hands  of  those  who  got  them,  and  hold  them 
by  a  legal  title.  I  cannot  see  this  in  any  light  but  rob- 
bery ;  which  may  be  committed  by  parliament,  with 
as  much  injustice  and  violence  as  by  a  highwayman. 

O  r"   <. 


414  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1816. 

It  is  a  ticklish  thing  to  begin  to  draw  subtle  distinctions 
about  property  ;  and  the  last  philosopher  I  would  trust 
with  such  a  perilous  experiment,  is  a  popular  assembly 
in  an  hour  of  national  necessity  and  heat.  Perhaps  one 
grudges  such  a  man  as  Lord  Camden  his  vast  drafts  of 
public  money;  with  the  same  feeling,  one  might  still 
grudge  the  Pagets,  for  instance,  their  exorbitant  grants 
from  Henry  VIIL,  for  no  one  service  rendered  to  the 
people,  and  no  one  memorable  action  performed  by  the 
family  in  any  age  of  our  history.  If  the  House  of  Com- 
mons take  away  Lord  Camden's  grant  of  the  tellership, 
which  was  given  him  perhaps  fifty  years  ago,  why 
should  not  they  proceed  to  take  back  also  to  the  crown, 
Lord  Somers's  manor  of  Ryegate,  which  was  granted 
about  fifty  years  earlier  ?  The  greater  length  of  time 
is  nothing  in  the  argument ;  for  prescription  is  the  mere 
creature  of  law,  which  by  the  argument  is  to  have  no 
efficacy  against  reasons  of  state  necessity ;  besides,  the 
law  has  created  no  prescription  in  this  case,  judging  it 
unnecessary ;  the  grants  being  good  in  law  from  the 
first  moment.  Then  it  may  be  said.  Lord  Somers's  an- 
cestor did  great  things  for  the  country,  and  earned  great 
rewards :  will  it  be  for  the  democratic  purists  of  the  pre- 
sent day  to  say,  that  the  first  Lord  Camden  deserved 
none  ?  I  think  this  is  a  point  of  the  very  first  impor- 
tance, considering  what  sort  of  discussions  may  be 
broached  in  the  ensuing  session ;  and  the  principles, 
by  which  property  is  guarded  from  public  rapine,  ought 
to  be  inculcated  with  authority  and  a  strong  hand. 

The  question  of  parliamentary  reform  is  with  me  a 
far  more  doubtful  one,  and  attended  with  many  difficul- 
ties, which  I  have  never  yet  solved  to  my  own  satisfac- 
tion ;  at  least  that  part  of  it  which  respects  the  rotten 
burghs,  which  is  the  only  thing  the  democrats  are  strug- 


2Et.  39.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  4^5 

gling  for,  and  that  out  of  their  envy  and  hatred  of  the 
aristocracy,  not  from  jealousy  of  the  crown.  I  have 
sometimes  thought  their  object  a  salutary  one  for  our 
liberties  upon  the  whole,  but  I  am  ashamed  to  say  I  have 
no  clear  nor  fixed  opinion  yet  upon  that  joart  of  the 
subject.  There  are  others,  and  important  ones,  in  which 
the  reformers  are  clearly  right ;  though  for  other  rea- 
sons, than  they  commonly  assign.  I  do  not  know  what 
I  should  think  justifiable,  if  I  were  a  radical  reformer, 
and  were  bold  enough  to  make  the  experiment  of  a  new 
scheme  of  representation,  but  in  my  present  views  of 
that  question,  there  is  nothing  I  would  do  more  reso- 
lutely, than  to  disclaim,  if  I  had  ;  ny  nrme  to  carry 
weight  with  it,  the  idea  of  forcing  this  subject  upon  par- 
liament, when  such  mighty  difficulties  of  immediate 
pressure  demand  all  its  attention,  and  the  folly  (in  some 
individuals,  the  palpable  wickedness)  of  connecting  the 
present  sufferings  of  the  people  with  any  thing  in  the 
state  of  the  representation.  Pitt  was  the  first  dema- 
gogue who  propagated  this  fallacy,  which  has  been  flung 
back  upon  his  own  course  of  measures,  with  amj^le  retri- 
bution. It  is  used  at  present  so  falsely,  in  my  opinion, 
that,  ever  since  I  have  sat  in  the  House,  I  should  say, 
that,  in  its  worst  vote,  upon  all  great  state  questions  of 
peace  and  war,  it  has  been  in  unison  with  the  passions 
of  the  people :  there  is  but  one  seeming  exception,  the 
vote  on  the  Walcheren  business,  but  which,  when  looked 
at  a  little  deeper  than  the  surface,  instead  of  proving 
the  power  of  the  ministers  of  that  day  to  carry  a  ques- 
tion in  the  House  against  the  sense  of  the  public,  really 
proved  the  sense  which  the  House  had  of  its  own  power 
at  that  crisis  to  choose  ministers,  and  its  decided  prefer- 
ence, in  concurrence  wath  the  public  one  must  say,  of 
one  set  of  men  over  the  other. 


416  COREESPONDENCE.  [1816. 

I  am  not  at  all  surprised  to  hear  that  Lords  Egremont 
and  Sheffield,  two  names  oddly  coupled,  but  very  well 
for  this  service,  are  declared  arainst  the  sinkino;  fund : 
they  are  just  for  the  expedient  of  the  day  that  will  help 
things  on  another  year,  at  whatever  sacrifices  of  the 
reasons,  and  pledges  too,  involved  in  their  former  votes. 
To  the  extent  of  a  certain  sum,  there  is  a  positive  pledge 
of  parliament  to  the  creditors  that  the  fund  shall  not  be 
touched.  Taking  what  remains  beyond  that,  is  only 
shifting  for  half  a-year,  and  giving  up  for  that  the  cer- 
tainty of  a  great  future  relief,  for  wdiich  we  have  been 
paying  annually,  for  thirty  years,  large  sums.  If  the 
sinking  fund  is  let  alone  for  a  few  years,  there  will  be  in 
our  financial  history  a  rare  example  of  provident,  perse- 
vering, and  successful  forbearance ;  if  it  is  violated,  and 
by  Pitt's  own  creatures,  it  will  be  just  as  remarkable  an 
instance  of  extravagance,  facility,  and  deception.  While 
there  is  a  regiment  or  an  office  to  reduce,  I  would  not 
touch  a  hair  of  its  head.  The  country  gentlemen  in  the 
House  of  Commons,  are,  upon  this  subject,  some  of  them, 
the  most  arrant  Jacobins ;  they  consider  the  whole  body 
of  the  stockholders  as  fair  game ;  that  is,  they  have 
gone  on  borrowing  from  monied  men,  campaign  after 
campaign,  without  thinking  of  the  consequences ;  and 
when  the  whole  amount  of  interest  to  be  paid  for  the 
money  they  have  spent  presses  hard  upon  them,  they 
say,  these  men  who  ask  for  their  interest  are  a  set  of 
plunderers,  who  have  been  making  money  by  the  war. 
■  On  the  reduction  of  the  army,  it  seems  to  me  we  can- 
not wish  for  any  thing  better  in  debate,  than  that  the 
ministers  should  dare  to  use  as  an  arfifument  for  their 
high  establishment  the  existence  or  probability  of  riots. 
That  would  put  the  discussion  upon  great  topics,  such  as 
the  public  ought  once  more  to  hear  from  their  Whigs  in 


2Et.  39.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  42y 

i^arliament.  The  civil  force  must  of  course  look  for  its 
radical  support  to  military  hands ;  but  to  pretend,  that 
England  needs  for  that  purpose  any  thing  like  so  many 
forces  as  we  should  consent  for  other  reasons  to  vote, 
would  be  a  sound  so  new  in  the  English  parliament,  that 
I  hope  you  will  make  the  whole  land  ring  with  it. 

I  begin  to  be  ashamed  of  my  tediousness :  I  had  some 
other  things  I  wished  much  to  say,  but  I  cannot  for  my 
life  say  a  thing  concisely ;  and  you  must  be  sick  of  this 
bad  paper  and  small  writing,  not  to  speak  of  the  other 
bad  qualities  of  this  letter. 

Ever  yours,  most  faithfully. 

Era.  Horner. 

Letter  CCXCVIII.     TO  IIIS  MOTHER. 

My  dear  Mother,  Pisa,  4th  Jan.  1817. 

It  is  not  too  late  yet  to  wish  you  all  the  happi- 
ness that  this  and  many  new  years  can  bring.  I  cannot 
say  Leo  and  I  have  had  a  merry  Christmas,  but  it  has 
not  been  very  sad;  for  we  have  heard  pretty  regu- 
larly from  home,  and  believe  you  are  all  in  perfect 
health. 

The  winter  here  is  at  present  very  mild,  and  indeed 
delightful ;  Leonard  has  got  a  little  horse  for  me,  and  I 
have  had  my  first  ride  to-day,  for  a  couple  of  miles  out 
of  town ;  and  I  found  I  could  bear  a  little  ambling  pace 
for  a  considerable  way,  without  losing  breath.  If  I  can 
go  on  with  this,  I  have  much  faith  in  its  efficacy ;  and 
there  is  no  reason  apparent  at  present  why  I  should  not, 
for,  except  that  we  may  expect  a  little  cold  weather  in 
the  beginning  of  February,  they  tell  us  our  winter  is 
nearly  over.  From  what  we  have  heard  from  time  to 
time  of  the  severe  cold  of  the  winds  at  Florence,  and  at 


418  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1817. 

Rome,  the   climate  of  this  place  seems  to  have  been, 
this  season,  far  milder.     I  have  a  little  nosegay  npon 
the  table  now,  taken  from  an  open  garden  in  the  town, 
in  which,  besides  China  roses  and  a  lily,  there  is  the 
most  perfumed  double  jasmine  ;  and  Leo  brings  in  from 
the  way  side  in  his  walks,  buds  of  spring.     All  this  I 
hope  is  soon  to  do  me  good ;  for  I  am  rendered  so  selfish 
by  illness,  and  the  care  taken  of  me,  that  I  think  only 
of  myself,  you  see,  in  these  blessings  of  the  sun.     The 
last  ride  I  had  was  with  dear  little  Mary  j  and,  upon 
recollection,  I  should  have  been  better  company  for  her 
to-day,  than  on  that  occasion ;  for  I  have  no  longer  that 
feeling  of  mortal  lassitude,  which  hung  upon  me  at  Dry- 
den,  and  seemed  to  wither  me  within  :  that  sensation  is 
gone,  though  I  am  weaker  now  and  leaner,  and  blow 
still  a  very  bad  pair  of  bellows.     Rest,  however,  has 
done  this  for  me. 

All  the  world  over,  one  hears  of  nothing  but  the  suf- 
ferings of  the  poor  from  scarcity.  They  have  their 
share  of  it  in  Tuscany;  not  that  their  corn  harvest 
failed,  for  that  seems  to  have  been  a  middling  one; 
but  in  the  mountains  the  people  live  altogether  upon 
chesnuts,  and  bread  made  of  that  fruit,  which  did  not 
ripen  this  summer  for  want  of  heat.  This  has  thrown 
them  upon  the  produce  of  the  plains,  which  is  in- 
sufficient for  both  sets  of  inhabitants.  An  additional 
suffering  is  occasioned  by  the  Mure  of  the  grapes 
and  olives.  The  price  of  grain,  accordingly,  and  of 
maize  among  the  rest,  is  very  high.  This  sort  of  pro- 
duce has  been  prodigiously  increased  in  Tuscany  of  late 
years ;  and  what  is  curious,  it  seems  to  have  been  en- 
couraged by  that  very  change  of  the  seasons,  within  the 
last  eight  or  ten  years,  which  is  said  to  have  been 
remarked  all  over  Europe,  and  is   so  much  lamented. 


JEt.  39.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  419 

For  maize  requires  more  rain  for  its  growth  than  an 
Itahan  summer  used  to  afford,  so  that  if  they  were  to 
become  as  dry  and  hot  as  before,  this  cultivation  must 
be  discontinued.  Tlie  chesnut-eaters  in  the  hills  are  be- 
ginning to  have  patches  of  j^otatoes  under  the  shade  of 
their  great  trees,  but  with  much  prejudice  against  them ; 
in  a  little  while,  that  "  modest "  vegetable,  as  some  senti- 
mental French  traveller  called  the  root  of  Ireland,  will 
gain  upon  the  other,  and  make  an  important  change 
in  the  habits  of  that  peasantry. 

Farewell,  my  dear  mother ;  give  my  kindest  love  to 
my  father  and  all  the  rest. 

God  bless  you. 

Ever  affectionately  yours, 

Era.  Horner. 


Letter  CCXCIX.    FROM  MR.  ALLEN. 

Dear  Horner,  London,  7th  Jan.  isiz. 

As  your  breathlessness  seemed  not  to  be  at  all 
relieved  either  by  the  change  of  climate,  or  by  the 
treatment  recommended  to  you  by  Baillie  and  Warren, 
I  made  out  a  state  of  your  case  at  present,  as  well  as  I 
could  collect  the  particulars  from  your  own  letters  and 
your  brother's,  and  sent  copies  of  it  yesterday  to  both 
those  physicians,  with  a  request  that  they  would  take 
it  into  consideration,  and  give  me  their  opinion  this 
morning.  The  enclosed  paper  is  the  result  of  their  de- 
liberation, in  addition  to  which,  Baillie  desires  me  to 
say,  they  are  both  satisfied  that  your  difficulty  of  breath- 
ing does  not  arise  from  water  in  the  chest,  and  from  the 
history  of  your  illness,  they  are  equally  persuaded  it 
does  not  proceed  from  tubercles,  but  they  are  not  so 
clear  as  to  what  is  the  real  cause  of  it.  Baillie  thinks  it 
may  proceed  from  a  consolidation  of  part  of  the  sub- 


420  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1817. 

stance  of  the  lungs,  in  consequence  of  which  there  is 
less  space  for  air,  or  it  may  arise  from  a  change  of  struc- 
ture in  the  air  cells,  by  which  they  are  become  larger, 
and  in  the  same  proportion  afford  a  smaller  surface  for 
the  oxygenation,  or  whatever  else  we  may  call  it,  of  the 
blood.  In  either  of  the  last  suppositions  there  is  no 
danger  from  the  complaint,  though  there  may  be  much 
inconvenience.  If  the  cause  is  nothing  but  muscular 
debility  in  the  organs  of  respiration,  you  will  obtain  re- 
lief from  it  as  your  strength  returns.  They  recommend 
to  you,  as  you  will  observe,  to  resume  the  use  of  the 
mercurial  pill,  and  to  try  the  effect  of  the  supercar- 
bonate  of  potassa. 

I  have  not  time  for  more,  lest  I  should  be  too  late 
for  the  post.  How  much  we  all  regret  your  absence, 
and  how  much  more  the  cause  of  it !  Every  thing  has 
the  appearance  of  a  very  active  session ;  but  till  people 
begin  to  assemble  in  town,  it  is  impossible  to  form  a 
guess  what  is  the  real  feeling  of  the  country. 

Yours  ever, 

J.  Allen. 


Letter  CCC.     TO  LADY  HOLLAND. 

My  dear  Lady  Holland,  P^^^'  ''^'^  J^°-  '^' '■ 

After  some  disappointment,  this  day's  post 
brought  me  your  Nos.  17,  18,  and  19,  together;  a  most 
gratifying  budget,  and  full  of  interest.  Nobody  knows 
half  so  well  w^hat  to  write,  and  how  to  write  it. 

Though  I  leave  the  medical  department  for  Leonard, 
there  are  some  points  on  which  I  may  perhaps  answer 
you  more  distinctly  myself  About  ten  days  ago,  I  sent 
for  Dr.  Yacca ;  and  not  only  find  him  very  agreeable  in 
conversation,  but  have  taken  an  impression  of  confidence 
in  him  as  a  physician.     Perhaps  in  some  measure,  from 


iET.  39.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  421 

the  rational  degree  of  scepticism  he  seems  to  entertain 
as  to  the  powers  and  reach  of  medicine ;  and  still  more, 
from  the  frankness  with  which  he  has  given  me  to  under- 
stand, that  he  is  very  much  in  the  dark  about  my  case. 
When  I  first  saw  him,  I  told  him  I  had  come  here  with 
instructions  from  my  English  physicians,  which  I  meant 
to  follow  without  variation ;  but  that  I  wished  him  to 
come  and  see  me  from  day  to  day,  for  some  time,  and 
then  give  me  his  opinion  of  my  illness,  as  well  as  enable 
me  to  make  a  report  of  my  present  state  to  those  I  con- 
fide in  at  home  ;  by  whom  it  was  my  intention  still  to 
be  directed,  whether  I  should  persevere  in  the  course 
they  had  recommended,  or  change  it  for  another.  He 
entered  readily  into  my  view,  and  has  been  with  me 
almost  every  day  :  in  the  course  of  next  w^eek,  I  mean 
to  write  either  a  letter  to  Dr.  Baillie  which  I  shall 
transmit  through  Allen's  hands,  or  some  statements 
which  I  will  ask  Allen  to  lay  before  him.  Until  I  re- 
ceive his  response,  I  shall  go  on  as  I  have  done.  I 
may  postpone  till  that  communication  any  more  parti- 
cular account  of  myself  than  Leonard  will  give  you  in 
his  letter. 

I  hear  Lady  Morpeth  has  been  confined ;  I  hope  do- 
ing w^ell.  Remember  me  to  Lord  Morpeth  with  all  the 
kindness  and  respect  you  know  I  feel  for  him  :  in  these 
times,  w^ould  he  would  take  the  trouble  to  communicate 
and  impress  more  publicly  the  sound  sense  and  pure  feel- 
ings he  always  has  about  public  affairs.  I  will  get  the  best 
information  for  you  I  can  about  the  art  of  Niello  and 
the  Laurentino  MS.  In  the  meantime,  let  me  refer  you 
to  half  a  page  in  Pignotti's  History  of  Tuscany,  vol.  v. 
p.  175,  where  there  is  a  professed  explanation  of  the 
sort  of  work  called  Niello ;  it  may  be  right  or  wrong ; 
but  it  makes  me  perfectly  comprehend  your  statement 

VOL.  11.  36 


422  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1817. 

of  Benvennto  Cellini's  account  of  it,  consistently  with 
there  being  such  an  impression  or  cast,  as  you  say  Mr. 
Grenville  has  purchased. 

My  copy  of  Pignotti  has  no  such  preliminary  volume 
as  you  speak  of,  giving  an  account  of  villas  and  palaces 
belonging  to  the  grand  duchy,  and  anecdotes  of  the 
Medici  family ;  I  want  very  much  to  see  something  of 
their  conduct  after  they  made  themselves  grand-dukes, 
and  do  not  know  where  to  look  for  it. 

I  shall  not  write  to  Allen  till  this  day  week,  to  give 
Vacca  more  time  than  enough. 

Ever  most  affectionately  yours. 

Era.  Horner. 


Letter  CCCI.     FROM  LORD  HOLLAND. 
Dear   Horner  Holland  House,  lOth  Jan.  1817. 

I  have  your  long,  kind,  and  interesting  letter  to 


answer,  and  though  I  cannot  make  an  adequate  return, 
I  can  :*  t  least  answer  it ;  but  Lady  Holland  being  half 
ill  with  a  headache,  and  more  lazy  than  ill,  (for  it  is 
merely  a  slight  cold,)  is  in  a  terrible  fidget  at  missing  a 
post,  and  has  deputed  me  to  write  for  her,  which  I  know 
I  cannot  do,  for  I  have  not  probably  heard  one  half  of 
the  things  she  could  tell  you ;  hearing  them,  could  not 
recollect  them ;  and  recollecting,  could  not  tell  you  them 
in  so  short  and  entertaining  a  manner. 

We  had  persuaded  Grey  to  come  up  soon,  and  pre- 
pared plans  for  consultation  on  the  course  of  proceed- 
ing for  the  session,  as  well  as  the  measures  to  be  taken, 
both  about  men  and  things,  if  beyond  our  expectation, 
but  not  beyond  all  probability,  the  ministers  should  be 
beat.  But,  alas !  the  only  time  that  I  ever  saw  a  pros-, 
pect  of  good  sound  previous  deUberation,  a  fortnight 


^T.  39.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  423 

before  the  meeting  of  Parliament,  Lord  Grey  is  most 
painfully  detained  at  Milton,  nursing  Lady  Grey,  who  is 
taken  ill  of  the  scarlet  fever,  and  fretting  about  his 
children,  whom  he  has  separated  from  her  and  the 
infection. 

I  agree  with  you  in  most  of  your  points,  but  not  quite 
in  the  same  degree.  Retrenchment  and  economy,  which 
must  include  suppression  of  sinecures  in  future,  and  as 
far  as  the  rights  of  property  (established  by  legal  deci- 
sion) admit,  the  reform  of  those  now  existing,  as  well  as 
the  reduction  of  many  useless  places,  miscalled  the 
splendour  of  the  crown,  are  absolutely  necessary  to  give 
any  party,  who  wishes  to  do  good,  authority  and  weight 
with  the  people.  They  must  go.  The  community  are 
punished,  and  severely  punished,  for  their  base  acquies- 
cence in  liberticide  wars,  by  their  present  distresses.  I 
am  not  so  sorry  for  that  as  I  ought  to  be.  But  let 
ministers  and  the  court  be  punished  too,  and  a  useful 
lesson  will  be  inculcated,  that  rash  and  unprincipled  wars 
cannot  be  entered  into  without  (even  in  the  case  of  suc- 
cess) the  people  risking  their  prosperit}^,  ministers  their 
power  and  influence,  and  kings  and  courts  a  part  of  their 
beloved  splendour.  It  is  through  the  unpopularity  of 
the  expenditure  that  we  must  get  at  the  foreign  system 
of  politics,  which,  in  my  conscience,  I  think  the  cause  of 
it.  As  to  parliamentary  reform,  the  industry  of  the  vio- 
lent party,  and  the  talents,  I  must  own,  of  one  among 
them,  seem  to  have  made  a  deep  impression ;  but  I  do 
not  despair  of  getting  over  that  difficulty  well.  There 
are  many  of  our  best  friends  out  of  parliament,  and 
many,  too,  who  were  not  our  friends  till  now,  who  are 
anxious  to  support  retrenchment,  and  to  change  foreign 
policy,  and  to  dismiss  ministers,  and  yet,  though  re- 
formers, are  no  great   sticklers   for  any  very  violent 


424  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1817. 

reform,  and  are  both  disgusted  and  alarmed  at  the  lan- 
guage of  Cobbett,  Hunt,  and  Cochrane.  They  are,  I 
hear,  of  their  own  accord,  and  without  any  concert  wnth 
us,  to  have  a  great  dinner  in  Westminster,  at  which  their 
resolutions  Avill  be  such  as  we  must  all  approve ;  though 
perhaps,  on  the  subject  of  sinecures,  some  of  them  will 
be  a  little  more  peremptory  than  we  could  wish ;  but 
the  fact  is,  they  are  eyesores,  neither  beautiful  to  the 
sight  nor  useful  to  the  body ;  while  they  remain,  we  can 
make  no  progress  in  courting  the  community,  and  they 
must  be  lopped  off.     But  enough  of  politics. 

Whatever  your  other  grumblings  may  be,  you  would 
not  fret  about  climate,  if  by  a  second  si(/M  you  could  see 
the  cold  thick  frosty  fog  of  this  day. 

Yours, 

V.  Holland. 


Letter  CCCII.    TO  EARL  GREY. 
My  dear  Lord,  Pisa,  i4th  Jan.  i8i7. 

You  must  permit  me  to  congratulate  you,  because 
I  have  so  much  pleasure  in  doing  so,  upon  an  event  of 
which  I  have  just  heard,  the  marriage  of  Lady  Louisa. 
Nothing  can  affect  so  nearly  j^our  happiness  and  that  of 
your  family,  in  which  I  shall  not  always  feel  a  most  sin- 
cere interest.  I  beg  to  be  remembered,  upon  this  occa- 
sion, particularly  to  Lady  Grey. 

You  will  think  it  natural  for  me  to  look  forward,  with 
great  anxiety,  to  the  meeting  of  parliament :  the  future 
safety  of  the  country  depends  so  much,  not  only  upon 
the  measures  relative  to  finance  and  expenditure  which 
shall  be  adopted  in  the  ensuing  session,  but  upon  the 
views  of  their  real  situation,  which  the  intelligent  and 
effective  part  of  the  community  may  be  taught,  by  those 


^T.  39.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  425 

statesmen  in  Parliament  to  whose  opinions  they  look. 
Our  financial  embarrassments,  I  fear,  are  now  of  a  very 
serious  nature.  Those  in  trade  and  agriculture,  I  am 
persuaded,  have  already  past  the  worst,  and  at  all  events 
cannot  be  otherwise  than  of  a  temporary  nature ;  the 
other  difficulties,  if  not  met  on  the  part  of  the  country 
with  great  firmness,  and  on  the  part  of  the  legislature 
with  the  right  measures,  may  endanger  the  government 
itself  and  the  whole  system  of  our  liberties.  I  have 
vast  confidence,  however,  in  the  resources  which  are 
found  in  the  freedom  of  our  government  for  a  contest 
with  political  calamities,  and  in  the  soundness  of  public 
opinion  in  England,  when  it  is  honestly  instructed  and 
trusted.  The  delusions,  which  appear  to  have  spread 
among  the  lower  classes  of  the  people,  unemployed  and 
suffering,  respecting  the  efficacy  of  indefinite  reforms, 
as  a  cure  for  their  actual  misery,  may,  by  neglect,  and 
in  a  long  continuance  of  such  distress,  rise  higher,  and 
threaten  us  with  convulsions. 

But  this  is  an  evil  for  which  a  sure  preventive  has 
always  been  found  hitherto  in  parliament.  AVhen  the 
first  day  of  the  session  is  over,  I  shall  feel  great  impa- 
tience to  know  what  has  passed ;  for  the  sentiments  and 
views  given  by  leading  men  that  day  have  more  weight 
with  the  public,  than  the  result  of  many  subsequent 
debates.  What  I  trust  is,  besides  giving  a  right  direc- 
tion to  the  public  anxiety,  that  the  opposition  to  large 
votes  of  supply  and  establishment  will  be  pursued  in 
detail,  from  day  to  day,  in  the  House  of  Commons,  and 
that  time  will  not  be  given  to  the  ministers,  by  proposi- 
tions of  inquiry  upon  a  large  scale,  which  have  always 
ended  in  nothing.  It  is  very  presumptuous,  however,  in 
me,  at  this  distance  from  what  is  going  on,  to  suggest 
even  my  wishes  upon  these  subjects. 

36* 


426  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1817. 

I  have  heard  to-day  of  the  Duke  of  Wellington's  sud- 
den journey  from  Cambray  to  London,  and  thence  to 
Paris.  This  looks  like  a  prelude  to  some  immediate 
measure  of  importance.  The  suspension  of  the  contri- 
butions is  a  more  important  event,  for  the  restoration  of 
common  sense  in  England  upon  foreign  politics  and  mili- 
tary establishments,  than  one  durst  have  hoped  for  so 
early. 

Believe  me  ever,  my  dear  Lord, 

Yours,  faithfully  and  sincerely, 

Era.  Horner. 


Letter  CCCIII.    TO  LADY  HOLLAND. 
My  dear  Lady  Holland,  P^^a,  29tli  Jan.  i8i7. 

My  reason  for  writing  is,  as  usual,  only  to  tell 
you  about  myself  I  am  now  entirely  recovered  from 
all  the  effects  and  weakness  of  the  accidental  fever  I 
was  attacked  with  the  beginning  of  last  week;  and  I  have 
resumed  the  opium,  with  the  same  good  effect  as  before. 
How  long  this  will  last,  remains  to  be  seen.  I  have  taken 
it  three  nights  running,  a  grain  of  the  gum  extract  on 
going  to  bed ;  and  this  morning  I  have  begun  to  take 
the  same  dose  before  getting  up.  The  power  of  the 
evening's  dose  is  nearly  exhausted  next  morning;  all  day, 
however,  I  felt  my  breathing  a  good  deal  more  easy  and 
tranquil.  The  effect  of  what  I  have  taken  this  morning 
has  perfectly  corresponded  with  what  I  expected  from 
the  other  trials ;  the  relief  seems  to  me  quite  marvel- 
lous, and  I  could  fall  do\Yn  and  worship  my  pill  like  a 
Turk;  Avhat  is  very  new  to  me  indeed,  I  have  got 
through  the  labours  of  my  toilet  not  only  without  pain 
and  palpitations,  but  with  scarcely  any  feeling  of  exer- 
tion ;  and  I  am  altogether  a  stronger  and  better  man 


iEx.  39.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  427 

than  I  have  been  a  great  while.  You  will  think  I  write 
this,  under  the  delirium  of  ray  drug,  and  the  alteration 
of  my  condition  looks  something  like  a  reverie ;  hut  I 
really  consider  the  experiment  now  as  having  Ijeen 
fairly  tried,  the  result  being  uniform  of  all  that  I  have 
made,  before  my  fever,  and  since.  Even  if  it  should  be 
but  a  transient  effect,  what  has  taken  place  must  surely 
throw  some  light  on  the  nature  of  my  disease;  Dr. 
Vacca  will  not  speak  out  yet  about  it,  except  in  con- 
jectures ;  but  he  seems  to  watch  me  with  a  real  curiosity. 
By  Saturday  next,  I  shall  be  entitled  to  include  what 
we  have  observed  with  regard  to  the  operation  of  opium, 
in  the  statement  which  I  wish  Allen  to  consider  and  lay 
before  Dr.  Baillie.  The  weather  has  been  very  fine  for 
a  w^eek  past ;  here  again,  you  will  suspect  me  of  giving 
the  "couleur  de  rose,"  because  I  happen  to  feel  well 
myself;  the  last  three  days  have  been  delicious,  as  this 
is,  and  I  have  not  failed  to  take  my  drive. 

If  I  had  not  been  very  deep  in  Father  Paul  and  his 
debates,  I  should  have  thought  more  than  I  did  last 
night  of  the  House  of  Commons.  I  could  not  help 
wandering  there  now  and  then.  In  return  for  the 
flowers  of  speech  you  are  despatching  for  me  at  this 
moment,  I  send  you  an  offering  of  the  earliest  violets 
from  the  Val  d'Arno.  If  they  are  intercepted,  they  will 
go  far  to  convict  two  such  suspicious  characters,  of  trea- 
son against  the  state  of  Europe. 

I  have  not  yet  received  the  Tales  of  my  Landlord ; 
1  longed  for  them  last  week,  when  I  was  just  in  the 
state  for  a  novel.  Boccaccio  was  my  resource,  but  his 
stories  are  too  short,  and  his  style  too  good  for  a  sick 
head. 

Tuesday.  I  am  shocked  to  have  to  interrupt  the 
letter  I  was  writing  on  the  other  leaf,  in  order  to  tell 


428  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1817. 

you  what  I  liave  just  learnt  that  poor  Lord  Guildford 
died  this  morning  at  eight  o'clock.  It  is  a  very  sudden 
event,  if  it  could  be  so  in  so  broken  a  constitution. 
Vacca  says,  Lord  Guildford's  constitution  was  completely 
broke  up;  "une  machine  fracassee;"  and  it  must  be  a 
ereat  satisfaction  to  his  friends  to  know,  that  he  was 
attended  from  the  first  by  this  excellent  physician,  who 
deserves  the  first  confidence,  and  watches  his  patients 
with  unremitting-  care. 

Yours  affectionately, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CCCIV.    TO  LADY  HOLLAND. 

My  dear  Lady  Holland,  ^'''^^  ^th  Feb.  1817. 

The  date  of  our  latest  accounts  from  you  is  now 
very  old,  the  30th  of  December;  your  letter  from  Wo- 
burn,  No.  21.  It  is  provoking  to  think  that  letters  from 
you,  probably  several,  are  upon  the  road  for  us,  which 
we  might  have  received. 

We  have  had  the  finest  weather  possible,  for  a  fort- 
night now.  I  have  had  two  rides,  upon  excellent  turf 
at  the  Cassino,  in  a  wood  of  ilexes,  and  in  sight  of  the 
Massa  mountains;  and  mean  to  ride  now  every  day, 
whilst  this  warmth  lasts.  I  have  been  out  every  day  in 
a  carriage,  since  I  recovered  from  the  fever ;  and  my  re- 
port of  myself  in  all  respects  is  very  favourable.  The 
use  of  the  opium  is  still  but  an  experiment,  and  I  wish 
to  have  a  little  more  certainty  and  longer  observation 
before  I  give  you  a  formal  account  of  it  for  the  doctors. 

I  told  you,  I  am  reading  the  Council  of  Trent.  It  en- 
gages me  deeply,  and,  making  allowance  for  the  subject, 
which  can  suit  very  few  tastes,  is  one  of  the  best  of  his- 
tories.    If  you  saw  me  take  Father  Paul  into  bed,  as 


iET.  39.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  429 

soon  as  I  heave  had  my  early  tea,  you  would  exclaim 
that  none  but  a  dull  Scotsman,,  bred  upon  all  the 
chopped  straw  of  learning,  could  so  take  to  so  dry  a 
book.  That  may  be  the  true  cause  of  it,  but  it  is  so. 
I  have  always  had  a  relish  for  works  that  treat  of  the 
history  of  opinions.  There  is  a  sameness  in  Father 
Paul's  subject,  and  the  characters  are  few  for  so  long  a 
book  j  but  he  gives  it  more  even  of  dramatic  interest 
than  could  have  been  expected.  I  should  like  some- 
thing more  of  elegance  and  imagination  in  the  style, 
even  for  history ;  but  it  has  the  other  merits  of  histori- 
cal style  in  the  highest  degree.  I  have  always  thought 
one  of  Mackintosh's  chief  difficulties  in  his  undertaking 
was  to  put  into  narrative  the  deliberations  of  an  assem- 
bly ;  Father  Paul  has  shown  how  many  of  these  diffi- 
culties are  to  be  overcome,  and  some  indeed  peculiar  to 
his  assembly.  But  you  have  had  more  than  enough  of 
this  stuff! 

Yours  ever  most  affectionately, 

Fra.  Horner. 


Letter  CCCV.    TO  HIS  FATHER. 

My  dear  Sir,  risa,4th  Feb.  1817. 

I  am  not  going  to  trouble  you  yet  with  the 
formal  medical  report  which  I  promised ;  because  I  con- 
sider the  use  of  the  opium  as  still  a  matter  of  experiment, 
and  one  goes  on  from  day  to  day  observing  its  effect ; 
so  that  I  become  unwilling  to  give  any  thing  like  a  de- 
finitive account  of  it  till  I  have  more  certainty.  I  have 
still,  however,  a  favourable  report  to  make,  both  of  the 
continued  operation  of  that  medicine,  and  of  my  present 
state  of  health. 

I  am  undoubtedly  better  upon  the  whole  in  all  re- 


430  CORRESPONDENCE.  "    [1817. 

spects.  The  weather  is  at  present,  and  for  above  a  fort- 
night has  been,  like  the  finest  spring  season  ever  known 
in  England,  in  April  or  May ;  so  that  I  get  out  every 
day,  for  above  two  hours,  and  the  last  two  days  I  have  been 
one  of  these  hours  on  horseback.  After  driving  two  or 
three  miles  from  the  town  to  a  farm  of  the  grand-duke's, 
we  get  a  good  green  ride  within  his  inclosures  upon  a 
light  sandy  turf  It  is  a  dead  flat  indeed,  but  in  sight  of 
magnificent  mountains ;  the  Pisan  hills  on  the  one  side, 
which  are  round  and  brown,  grown  with  trees  to  the 
top,  half  way  up  olives,  and  above  them  the  pines  and 
firs  of  the  country,  among  which  appear  a  great  many 
white  houses  and  small  villages,  on  all  x)arts  of  the  hill ; 
on  another  side,  we  have  the  mountains  of  Massa  and 
Carrara,  which  are  much  higher,  and  are  of  a  different 
aspect,  having  the  rugged  sides  and  edge  and  sharp 
peaks  of  an  alpine  ridge.  I  give  you  this  description, 
that  you  may  have  the  better  notion  of  the  rides  we  can 
take;  nobody  knows  better  than  yourself,  how  much 
the  efficacy  of  that  sovereign  m§dicine  depends  upon 
the  eye  being  fed.  as  one  jogs  on,  with  cheerful  scenery 
and  great  prospects.  We  shall  have  still  greater  enjoy- 
ment, when  we  can  extend  our  ride  to  the  hills  them- 
selves. At  present  I  go  out  in  a  little  carriage,  and  Leo- 
nard gives  me  his  pony  when  we  get  to  the  turf;  but  I 
feel  now  so  strong,  that  I  have  set  Leo  to  inquire  for  a 
second  pony,  that  we  may  take  the  whole  in  company. 
The  riding  does  his  stomach  a  great  deal  of  good ;  since 
he  has  been  regularly  on  horseback,  he  has  complained 
much  less  of  acid  and  other  evils. 

The  opium  has  certainly  a  very  signal  effect  upon  my 
breathing  ;  within  an  hour  after  I  take  my  pill,  if  I  have 
been  panting,  and  coughing,  and  irritated  before,  I  be- 
come quite  tranquillised,  and  all  these  symptoms  are 


^T.  30.]  CORRESPONDENCE.  43]^ 

suspended,  so  that  I  not  only  have  perfect  ease  while  I 
remain  at  rest,  but  I  may  even  move  about,  and  use  a 
degree  of  muscular  exertion  with  freedom  and  impunity, 
for  which  I  should  be  speedily  checked  by  palpitations 
and  short  breath,  if  I  had  not  the  drug  in  me.  Dr.  A^acca 
tells  me,  he  is  of  opinion,  we  have  every  reason  to  be 
satisfied  for  the  present ;  he  appears  to  me  to  proceed 
with  the  utmost  caution,  and  it  would  be  impossible  for 
any  man  to  bestow  a  more  sedulous  and  watchful  atten- 
tion on  a  patient,  than  he  gives  me.  I  have  long  con- 
sidered it  a  settled  point,  that  my  complaints  were  not 
consumptive ;  Dr.  Vacca  thinks  they  bear  none  of  the 
appearances  with  which  consumption  is  ever  known  to 
commence.  From  the  distinct  and  strong  effect  which 
opium  has  had  upon  them,  he  thinks  it  reasonable  to 
infer  that  an  affection  of  the  nerves  of  the  lungs  forms 
a  part  at  least,  and  a  considerable  part,  of  the  disease  ; 
at  present  he  does  not  carry  his  inference  farther. 

Of  all  this,  however,  I  mean  to  write  to  you  still  more 
in  detail,  when  I  have  had  a  little  more  time  for  closer 
observation  under  his  directions :  that  accident  of  the 
fever  was  an  inconvenient  interruption,  and  lost  me 
much  time.  I  would  rather  you  would  not  mention 
these  particulars  to  any  but  our  medical  friends,  who 
take,  I  believe,  a  real  interest  in  my  case ;  you  know 
how  much  I  hate  the  thoughts  of  having  my  story  and 
my  infirmities  served  about  as  gossip  ;  I  believe  you  will 
hmnour  me  in  this,  even  if  you  look  upon  it  as  an  un- 
reasonable shame,  which  I  do  not  think  you  will. 

Since  writing  this  letter,  I  have  had  my  ride  ;  we  are 
just  come  in.  The  air  blows  fresh,  but  the  sun  is  warm, 
and  the  sky  without  a  cloud.  There  are  the  most  active 
appearances  of  spring ;  a  strong  vegetation  in  all  the 
winter-sown  crops,  and  that  bustle  of  field  labour  which 


432  CORRESPONDENCE.  [1817. 

at  no  season  of  the  year  is  more  enlieartening  than  at 
the  present.  The  great  variety  of  occupations  here, 
makes  it  still  more  cheering  and  interesting ;  in  one 
field,  they  are  still  gathering  the  olives,  in  another  prun- 
ing the  vines,  in  a  third  ploughing  for  their  Turkey 
wheat,  in  a  fourth  preparing  the  ground  with  the  spade 
for  some  other  sowing.  Labourers  are  mingled  of  both 
sexes.  The  plough  is  most  primitively  rude  ;  the  grey 
oxen  have  a  primitive  beauty,  that  seems  to  suit  it. 
Nothing  makes  me  more  impatient  of  my  restraints,  than 
the  sight  of  these  fields ;  for  I  feel  far  greater  curiosity 
to  know  the  ways  and  habits  of  this  peasantry  and  their 
husbandry,  and  to  understand  a  little  the  frame  of  a 
society,  so  unlike  what  we  have  at  home  in  the  most 
essential  respects,  than  to  penetrate  into  the  Campo 
Santo,  with  all  its  treasures  of  art.  I  regret  that  we 
have  lost  Mr.  Oswald,  to  whose  assistance  I  looked  for- 
ward in  walking  out  to  the  Pisan  farms,  when  I  can 
walk  ;  he  is  gone  to  Rome. 

We  have  not  heard  of  you  later  than  the  7th  ult.,  the 
date  of  Fanny's  kind  and  entertaining  letter  to  me.  But 
we  trust  you  are  well,  and  we  hope  getting  off  with  a 
mild  winter.  My  best  love  to  my  mother,  and  all  the 
rest. 

My  dear  Sir, 

Most  afiectionately  yours, 

Fra.  Horner. 


The  cheering  hopes  of  renovated  strength,  and  of 
future  enjoyment  of  health,  expressed  in  this  letter,  were 
also  apparent  in  the  greater  degree  of  confidence  with 
which  Mr.  Horner  looked  forward  to  his  future  plans  for 


-S:t.  39.J  HIS  LAST  ILLNESS.  433 

the  spring ;  and  he  even  spoke  of  behig  unable  to  resist 
a  visit  to  Kome,  before  he  returned  to  England.  He  at 
no  time  appeared  to  despair  of  ultimate  recovery,  and 
never  uttered  a  word  indicating  apprehension  that  he 
was  labouring  under  a  fatal  disease  ;  but  on  more  than 
one  occasion  he  expressed  a  belief,  that  his  recovery 
would  be  slow  ;  and  that  he  should  have  a  long  interval 
of  repose,  before  he  should  be  al)le  to  resume  his  active 
duties.  Under  the  influence  of  those  feelings,  he  drew 
out  a  sketch  of  a  plan  for  the  occupation  of  that  expect- 
ed period  of  retirement,  in  a  small  book  wdiich  he  headed, 
"Designs,"  adding,  "At  Fisa,  2d  Felniarf/,  1817,  wider 
ilic  auspices  of  opium  and  returning  springT  The  whole  of 
this  curious  and  interesting  document  will  be  found  in 
the  Appendix  to  this  volume.^-' 

But  it  was  ordained,  that  none  of  these  designs  should 
ever  be  accomplished  ;  his  feelings  of  improving  health 
were  an  illusion  ;  his  disease  was  fast  approaching  to  its 
fatal  termination  ;  and  in  four  days  from  the  date  of  the 
preceding  letter,  he  closed  his  earthly  career. 

Two  days  after  he  had  written  the  last  letter  to  his 
father,  the  difficulty  of  breathing  and  the  cough  reap- 
peared with  some  severity  ;  on  the  following  morning 
they  were  somewhat  abated ;  but  towards  the  evening 
they  returned,  accompanied  by  drowsiness.  I  slept  in  a 
room  next  to  his  own,  with  an  open  door  between  us. 
In  the  night  I  heard  him  moaning,  and  on  going  to  him, 
he  said,  that  he  moaned  from  difficulty  of  breathing; 
but  that  he  wished^  to  be  left  to  sleep.  I  sent  for  Dr. 
Vacca,  w^ho  came  at  seven  in  tlie  morning ;  —  it  was 
Saturda}',  the  8th  of  February.  He  found  his  patient 
labouring  greatly  in  his  breathing,  with  strong  palpita- 


*  Appendix  E. 

VOL.  II.  37 


434  ins  DEATH.  [1817. 

tioiLs  of  the  heart,  and  a  low,  intermittent,  and  irregular 
pulse  ;  his  forehead  covered  with  a  cold  sweat,  and  his 
face  and  hands  of  a  leaden  colour.  He  was,  however, 
perfectly  sensible,  and  spoke  in  a  clear,  distinct  manner ; 
expressing  neither  apprehension  nor  anxiety  about  him- 
self Various  stimulating  applications  were  tried,  but 
they  afforded  no  relief;  the  difficulty  of  breathing 
gradually  increasing. 

Although  I  had  entire  confidence  in  the  skill  of  Dr. 
Yacca,  I  requested,  towards  the  afternoon,  that  there 
might  be  a  consultation  with  another  physician.  They 
came  together  soon  after  four  o'clock,  and  I  left  the 
bed-side  of  the  patient,  to  receive  them  in  the  adjoining 
room;  I  was  absent  about  ten  minutes,  and  returned 
alone,  to  prepare  him  for  seeing  the  new  physician.  On 
drawing  aside  the  curtain,  I  found  his  face  deadly  pale, 
his  eyes  fixed,  and  his  hand  cold ;  for  a  few  moments  I 
flattered  myself  that  he  had  only  fainted  from  weakness ; 
but  the  sad  reality  was  soon  revealed  to  me,  —  the  pre- 
cious object  of  my  care  w\as  taken  from  us  for  ever. 

On  the  following  Monday  I  assented  to  the  request  of 
Dr.  Yacca,  that  there  might  be  an  examination  of  the 
body.  It  was  then  discovered  that  his  disease  was  not 
consumption,  but  an  enlargement  of  the  air  cells,  and  a 
condensation  of  the  substance  of  the  lungs,  (which  the 
sagacity  of  Baillie  had  suggested  as  the  probable  cause 
of  the  worst  symptoms,)  a  malady  which  no  medical 
skill  could  have  cured.'"'' 

Notwithstanding  the  symptoms  of 'organic  disease,  and 
their  long  continuance,  I  had  no  serious  apprehensions 
of  a  fiital  termination ;  on  the  contrary,  I  felt  an  assu- 

*  For  the  information  of  medical  men,  I  have  given  in  the  Appendix  (F) 
a  copy  of  Dr.  Vaccu's  report,  together  witli  some  observations  made  upon  it  by 
Dr.  Warren. 


^T.  39.]  INTERMENT.  435 

ranee  that  renovated  health  would  come  with  the  genial 
weather  of  spring  in  that  climate.  My  brother's  cheer- 
fulness, his  activity  of  mind,  and  the  absence  of  all  alarm 
about  himself,  had  deluded  me  into  this  belief;  nor  had 
any  warning  expression  of  his  acute  and  watchftd  phy- 
sician prepared  me  for  the  sudden  and  afflicting  blow 
which  fell  upon  me,  aggravated  as  it  was  by  all  that  my 
imagination  brought  before  me,  of  the  agony  of  those 
in  my  distant  home  when  the  sad  intelligence  should 
arrive.  I  should  do  injustice  to  my  feelings,  were  I  to 
omit  to  say  that,  upon  this  trying  occasion,  I  derived  the 
greatest  comfort  from  the  more  than  friendly  attentions 
of  Mrs.  Drewe,  (the  sister  of  Lady  Mackintosh,)  her 
daughters,  and  the  Miss  Aliens,  her  sisters,  who  had 
come  to  Pisa  on  a  similar  melancholy  errand.  They  did 
not  leave  the  last  duties  to  their  departed  friend  to  be 
performed  by  strangers;  and  they  stood  by  my  side, 
when  I  laid  the  mortal  remains  of  my  dear  brother  in 
his  grave,  in  the  Protestant  cemetery  at  Leghorn. 


TRIBUTES 


MEMORY 


FRANCIS    HORNER. 


Q*?* 


TEIBUTES. 


"finis  vit^  ejus 

nobis  ltjctuosus,  amicis  tristis, 

extra.neis  etiam  ignotisque  non  sine  cura  fuit. — 

ipse  quidem, 

quanquam  medio  in  spatio  ^tatis  ereptus, 

quantum  ad  gloriam, 

longissimum  ^vum  peregit." 

The  first  public  announcement  of  Mr.  Horner's  death, 
in  England,  was  by  the  following  notice  in  the  Morning 
Chronicle  of  the  28th  of  February,  which  was  written 
by  his  friend  Mr.  Allen,  the  Master  of  Dulwich  College : — 

"It  is  with  deep  concern  we  have  to  announce  the 
death  of  Francis  Horner,  Esq.,  Member  of  Parliament 
for  St.  Mawes.  This  melancholy  event  took  place  at 
Pisa,  on  the  eighth  instant.  We  have  had  seldom  to 
lament  a  greater  loss,  or  to  bewail  a  more  irreparable 
calamity.  With  an  inflexible  integrity,  and  ardent 
attachment  to  liberty,  Mr.  Horner  conjoined  a  temper- 
ance and  discretion  not  always  found  to  accompany  these 
virtues.  The  respect  in  which  he  was  held,  and  the 
deference  with  which  he  was  listened  to  in  the  House  of 
Commons,  are  a  striking  proof  of  the  effect  of  moral 
qualities  in  a  popular  assembl}^  Without  the  adventi- 
tious aids  of  station  or  fortune,  he  had  acquired  a  weight 
and  influence  in  Parliament  which  few  men  whose  lives 


440  TRIBUTES. 

were  passed  in  Opposition  have  been  able  to  obtain ;  and 
for  this  consideration  he  was  infinitely  less  indebted  to 
his  eloquence  and  talents,  eminent  as  they  were,  than 
to  the  opinion  imiversally  entertained  of  his  public  and 
private  rectitude.  His  understanding  was  strong  and 
comprehensive ;  his  knowledge  extensive  and  accurate  ; 
his  judgment  sound  and  clear;  his  conduct  plain  and 
direct  His  eloquence,  like  his  character,  was  grave  and 
forcible,  without  a  particle  of  vanity  or  presumption, 
free  from  rancour  and  personality,  but  full  of  deep  and 
generous  indignation  against  fraud,  hypocrisy,  or  injus- 
tice. He  was  a  warm,  zealous,  and  affectionate  friend ; 
hio-h-minded  and  disinterested  in  his  conduct ;  firm  and 
decided  in  his  opinions ;  modest  and  unassuming  in  his 
manners.  To  his  private  friends  his  death  is  a  calamity 
they  can  never  cease  to  deplore.  To  the  public  it  is  a 
loss  not  easily  to  be  repaired,  and  in  times  like  these 
most  severely  to  be  felt.  Mr.  Horner  was  born  in  1778, 
admitted  a  Member  of  the  Faculty  of  Advocates  in  1800, 
and  called  to  the  English  Bar  in  1807.  He  came  first 
into  the  House  of  Commons  in  1806,  and  has  been 
member  of  three  successive  parliaments. 

"  The  only  official  situation  he  ever  held  was  the  la- 
borious office  of  Commissioner  for  the  Liquidation  of 
the  Carnatic  Claims,  which  he  kept  only  for  a  short  time, 
having  resigned  it  many  years  ago,  because  he  found 
the  duties  which  it  imposed  on  him,  were  incompatible 
with  the  application  due  to  his  professional  pursuits." 

LETTER  FROM  MR.  ALLEN  TO  MR.  HORNER'S  FATHER. 
Dear  Sir  Arlington  Street,  3d  March,  1817. 

After  the  loss  you  have  sustained  of  so  excellent 
a  son  —  so  admirable  a  man  —  so  suddenly  and  unex- 


MR.  ALLEN.  441 

pectedly  taken  from  us,  at  the  moment  when  every 
recent  account  held  out  to  us  such  plausible,  though  fal- 
lacious, hopes  of  his  amendment,  it  would  be  in  vain,  at 
present,  to  address  to  you  any  topics  of  consolation  ;  and 
if  it  were  otherwise,  I  am  myself  too  great  a  sufferer  by 
this  calamity,  to  undertake  the  alleviation  of  another's 
sorrow.  I  have  lost  a  friend  of  twenty  years'  standing, 
whose  advice  I  have  for  many  years  been  accustomed  to 
use  on  every  event  and  project  of  my  life,  to  whose  ap- 
probation I  looked  forward  as  the  reward  and  incentive 
of  all  my  labours  and  occupations,  in  whose  judgment  I 
had  the  most  perfect  reliance,  and  whose  integrity  of 
character,  and  benevolence  of  heart,  I  had  every  day 
more  reason  to  admire.  The  prospect  of  life  before  me, 
though  uncertain,  is  long  enough  to  make  me  feel 
severely  the  loss  of  such  a  friend  and  counsellor,  and 
too  short  to  allow  me  to  indulge  a  hope,  that  I  can  ac- 
quire another  of  the  same  value,  if  such  another,  as  he 
was,  is  to  be  found. 

Time  alone  can  make  3^ou  submit  with  resignation  to 
this  calamity ;  but  it  may  be  some  alleviation  of  your 
grief  to  hear,  how  much,  and  how  generally,  he  is 
lamented.  I  do  not  speak  merely  of  his  private  friends, 
but  of  the  public  at  large,  and  more  particularly  of  the 
House  of  Commons,  where  men  of  all  parties  join  in  ex- 
tolling his  merits,  and  lamenting  his  loss.  So  strong  and 
general  is  this  feeling,  that,  on  the  strength  of  it,  his 
friends  have  thoughts  of  venturing  on  a  measure,  which, 
though  not  quite  unprecedented,  is  nevertheless  unusual, 
and  somewhat  irregular.  In  moving  the  customary  writ 
for  the  borough  wdiich  he  represented,  it  is  intended  to 
say  a  few  words  on  his  merits  and  character.  Lord  Mor- 
peth has  most  kindly  undertaken  this  office,  and  it  is  some 
consolation  to  think,  that  if  poor  Horner  could  have 


442  TRIBUTES. 

looked  forward  to  the  possibility  of  such  a  measure,  there 
is  no  man  in  the  House  of  Commons  he  would  have 
selected  in  preference  to  Lord  Morpeth,  for  the  discharge 
•of  this  tribute  to  his  memory.  Some  others  may  possibly 
follow  Lord  Morpeth,  and  even  from  the  opposite  side  of 
the  House  :  my  only  fear  is,  that  too  many  will  come 
forward. 

Both  Lord  and  Lady  Holland  have  been  in  the  deepest 
affliction,  since  this  melancholy  event  was  conveyed  to 
us.  The  loss  to  Lord  Holland  is  very  great,  as  there  was 
no  man  in  the  House  of  Commons,  since  the  death  of  his 
uncle,  with  whom  he  consulted  on  more  confidential 
terms  than  Avitli  your  son.  Lady  Holland  intends  to 
WTite  to  Mrs.  Leonard  Horner,  but  has  not  yet  found 
herself  equal  to  the  task. 

I  need  say  nothing  of  this  fatal  malady,  as  the  cause 
of  it  has  been  ascertained,  and  communicated  by  your 
son  Leonard  to  Dr.  Gordon.  It  appears  that  those 
physicians  were  in  the  right,  who,  from  the  first,  thought 
there  were  little  or  no  hopes  of  his  recovery  :  we,  who 
w^ere  willing  to  think  otherwise,  were  blinded  by  our 
washes. 

Mr.  Leonard  Horner  is  to  be  in  Paris  about  the  10th 
of  March.  He  appears  to  be  satisfied  with  the  manner 
in  which  every  thing  was  conducted  at  Leghorn,  and 
expresses  great  sense  of  obligation  to  the  kindness  of 
Mrs.  Drewe  and  the  Miss  Aliens. 

With  kind  remembrances  to  Mrs.  Horner  and  the  rest 
of  your  family, 

I  remain,  dear  Sir, 

Yours  faithfully, 

John  Allen. 


MR.  WIIISIIAW.  443 


BY    JOHN    AVIIISIIAW,    ESQ. 


Extract  from  a  Letter  from  Mr.  Winshaiv  to  Thomas  Smith,  Esq.,  of 
Easton-Grey,  Wilts,  dated  the  Isl  of  March,  1817. 

"  I  cannot  yet  write  or  speak  with  any  tolerable  degree 
of  composure  on  the  subject  of  the  loss  of  my  invaluable 
friend  Horner.  It  has  spread  a  gloom  over  our  whole 
circle  of  society.  Nor  is  this  feeling  confined  to  Horner's 
immediate  friends.  It  is  universally  and  strongly  ex- 
pressed, especially  in  that  place  where  he  was  pursuing 
so  honourable  a  career,  and  where  his  loss  is  truly  irre- 
parable, —  the  House  of  Commons.  All  parties  and  all 
individuals  unite  in  bearing  testimony  to  his  distinguished 
talents,  his  manly  and  impressive  eloquence,  and  the 
simplicity,  independence,  and  integrity  which  marked 
every  part  of  his  conduct.  You  will  be  glad  to  hear  that 
by  a  general  understanding  throughout  the  House,  and 
at  the  suggestion  of  the  Speaker  himself,  an  opportunity 
will  be  taken  of  giving  a  public  expression  to  these  feel- 
ings, on  moving  the  writ  for  the  vacant  scat." 


PROCEEDINGS  IN  THE  HOUSE  OF  COxMMONS,  ON  THE  MOTION  FOR 
A  NEW  WRIT  FOR  THE  BOROUGH  OF  ST.  MAWES,  ON  MONDAY, 
MARCH    3,    1817. 

Lord  Morpeth'-'  rose,  and  spoke  as  follows  :  —  I  rise  to 
move  that  the  Speaker  do  issue  his  writ  for  a  new  Mem- 
ber to  serve  in  Parliament  for  the  borough  of  St.  Mawes, 
in  the  room  of  the  late  Francis  Horner,  Esq. 

*  The  present  Earl  of  Carlisle. 


444  TKIBUTES. 

In  making  tliis  motion,  I  trust  it  will  not  appear  pre- 
sumptuous or  officious,  if  I  address  a  few  words  to  the 
House  upon  this  melancholy  occasion.  I  am  aware  that  it 
is  rather  an  unusual  course  -,  but^w^ithout  endeavouring  to 
institute  a  parallel  with  other  instances,  I  am  authorised 
in  saying  that  the  course  is  not  wholly  unprecedented. 

My  lamented  friend,  of  whom  I  never  can  speak  with- 
out feelings  of  the  deepest  regret,  had  been  rendered 
incapable  for  some  time  past,  in  consequence  of  the  bad 
state  of  his  health,  of  applying  himself  to  the  labours  of 
his  profession,  or  to  the  discharge  of  his  parliamentary 
duties.     He  was  prevailed  upon  to  try  the  effects  of  a 
milder  and  more  genial  climate,  —  the  hope  was  vain 
and  the  attempt  fruitless  :  he  sunk  beneath  the  slow  bat 
destructive  effect  of  a  lingering  disease,  which  baffled 
the  power  of  medicine  and  the  influence  of  climate  ;  but 
under  the  pressure  of  increasing  infirmity,  under  the  in- 
fliction of  a  debilitating  and  exhausting  malady,  he  pre- 
served undiminished  the  serenity  of  his  amiable  temper, 
and  the  composure,  the  vigour,  and  firmness  of  his  excel- 
lent and  enlightened  understanding.    I  may,  perhaps,  be 
permitted,  without  penetrating  too  far  into  the  more 
sequestered  paths  of  private  life,  to  allude  to  those  mild 
virtues  —  those  domestic   charities,   which   embellished 
wdiile  they  dignified  his  private  character.     I  may  be 
permitted  to  observe,  that,  as  a  son  and  as  a  brother,  he 
Avas  eminently  dutiful  and  affectionate  :  but  I  am  aware 
that  these  qualities,  however  amiable,  can  hardly,  with 
strict  propriety,  be  addressed  to  the   consideration  of 
Parliament.     When,  however,  they  are  blended,  inter- 
w^oven,  and  incorporated  in  the  character  of  a  public 
man,  they  become  a  species  of  public  property,  and,  by 
their  influence  and  example,   essentially  augment  the 
general  stock  of  public  virtue. 


HOUSE  OF  COMMONS.  445 

For  his  qualifications  as  a  public  man  I  can  confi- 
dently appeal  to  a  wider  circle  —  to  that  learned  pro- 
fession of  which  he  was  a  distinguished  ornament  —  to 
this  House,  where  his  exertions  will  be  long  remembered 
with  mingled  feelings  of  regret  and  admiration.  It  is 
not  necessary  for  me  to  enter  into  the  detail  of  his 
graver  studies  and  occupations.  I  may  be  allowed  to 
say  generally,  that  he  raised  the  edifice  of  his  fair  fame 
upon  a  good  and  solid  foundation  —  upon  the  firm  basis 
of  conscientious  principle.  He  was  ardent  in  the  pursuit 
of  truth ;  he  was  inflexible  in  his  adherence  to  the  great 
principles  of  justice  and  of  right.  Whenever  he  de- 
livered in  this  House  the  ideas  of  his  clear  and  intelli- 
gent mind,  he  employed  that  chaste,  simple,  but  at  the 
same  time  nervous  and  impressive  style  of  oratory,  which 
seemed  admirably  adapted  to  the  elucidation  and  discus- 
sion of  important  business :  it  seemed  to  combine  the 
force  and  precision  of  legal  argument  with  the  acquire- 
ments and  knowledge  of  a  statesman. 

Of  his  political  opinions  it  is  not  necessary  for  me 
to  enter  into  any  detailed  statement :  they  are  suffi- 
ciently known,  and  do  not  require  from  me  any  com- 
ment or  illustration.  I  am  confident  that  his  political 
opponents  will  admit  that  he  never  courted  popularity 
by  any  unbecoming  or  unworthy  means :  they  will  have 
the  candour  to  allow,  that  the  expression  of  his  political 
opinions,  however  firm,  manly,  and  decided,  Avas  untinc- 
tured  with  moroseness,  and  unembittered  with  any  per- 
sonal animosity  or  rancorous  reflection.  From  these 
feelings  he  was  effectually  exempted  by  the  operation 
of  those  qualities  which  formed  the  grace  and  the  charm 
of  his  private  life. 

But  successful  as  his  exertions  were,  both  in  this 
House   and  in  the   courts  of  law,  considering  the  con- 

VOL.  II.  38 


446  TRIBUTES. 

traded  span  of  his  life,  they  can  only  be  looked  upon  as 
the  harbingers  of  his  maturer  fame,  as  the  presages  and 
the  anticipations  of  a  more  exalted  reputation.  But  his 
career  was  prematurely  closed.  That  his  loss  to  his 
family  and  his  friends  is  irreparable,  can  be  readily  con- 
ceived ;  but  I  may  add,  that  to  this  House  and  the  coun- 
try it  is  a  loss  of  no  ordinary  magnitude  :  in  these  times 
it  will  be  severely  felt.  In  these  times,  however,  when 
the  structure  of  the  constitution  is  undergoing  close  and 
rigorous  investigation,  on  the  part  of  some  with  the  view 
of  exposing  its  defects,  on  the  part  of  others  with  that  of 
displaying  its  beauties  and  perfections ;  we  may  derive 
some  consolation  from  the  reflection,  that  a  man  not 
possessed  of  the  advantages  of  hereditary  rank  or  of 
very  ample  fortune,  was  enabled,  by  the  exertion  of  his 
own  honourable  industry  —  by  the  successful  cultivation 
of  his  native  talents,  to  vindicate  to  himself  a  station  and 
eminence  in  society,  which  the  proudest  and  wealthiest 
might  envy  and  admire. 

I  ought  to  apologize  to  the  House,  not,  I  trust,  for 
having  introduced  the  subject  to  their  notice,  for  of 
that  I  hope  I  shall  stand  acquitted,  but  for  having  paid 
so  imperfect  and  inadequate  a  tribute  to  the  memory  of 
my  departed  friend. 

Mr.  Canning.  —  Of  all  the  instances  wherein  the  same 
course  has  been  adopted,  as  that  which  my  noble  friend 
has  pursued  with  so  much  feeling  and  good  taste  on  this 
occasion,  I  do  not  remember  one  more  likely  than  the 
present  to  conciliate  the  general  approbation  and  sym- 
pathy of  the  House. 

I,  Sir,  had  not  the  happiness  (a  happiness  now  coun- 
terbalanced by  a  proportionate  excess  of  sorrow  and  re- 
gret) to  be  acquainted  personally,  in  private  life,  with 
the  distinguished  and  amiable  individual  whose  loss  we 


HOUSE  OF  COMMONS.  447 

have  to  deplore.  I  knew  him  only  within  the  walls  of 
the  House  of  Commons.  And  even  here,  from  the  cir- 
cumstance of  my  absence  during  the  last  two  sessions,  I 
had  not  the  good  fortune  to  witness  the  later  and  more 
matured  exhibition  of  his  talents  j  which  (as  I  am  in- 
formed, and  can  well  believe)  at  once  kept  the  promise 
of  his  earlier  years,  and  opened  still  wider  expectations 
of  future  excellence. 

But  I  had  seen  enough  of  him  to  share  in  those  ex- 
pectations; and  to  be  sensible  of  what  this  House  and 
the  country  have  lost  by  his  being  so  prematurely  taken 
from  us. 

'  He  had,  indeed,  qualifications  eminently  calculated  to 
obtain  and  to  deserve  success.  His  sound  principles 
—  his  enlarged  views  —  his  various  and  accurate  knowl- 
edge—  the  even  tenour  of  his  manly  and  temperate 
eloquence  —  the  genuineness  of  his  warmth,  when  into 
warmth  he  was  betrayed  —  and,  above  all,  the  singular 
modesty  with  which  he  bore  his  faculties,  and  wdiich 
shed  a  grace  and  lustre  over  them  all ;  these  qualifica- 
tions, added  to  the  known  blamelessness  and  purity  of 
his  private  character,  did  not  more  endear  him  to  his 
friends,  than  they  commanded  the  respect  of  those  to 
whom  he  was  opposed  in  adverse  politics ;  they  ensured 
to  every  effort  of  his  abilities  an  attentive  and  favouring 
audience ;  and  secured  for  him,  as  the  result  of  all,  a 
solid  and  unenvied  reputation. 

I  cannot  conclude.  Sir,  without  adverting  to  a  topic 
in  the  latter  part  of  the  speech  of  my  noble  friend,  upon 
which  I  most  entirely  concur  with  him.  It  would  not 
be  seemly  to  mix  with  the  mournful  subject  of  our  pre- 
sent contemplation  any  thing  of  a  controversial  nature. 
But  when,  for  the  second  time  within  a  short  course  of 
years,  the  name  of  an  obscure  borough  is  brought  before 


448  TRIBUTES. 

US  as  vacated  by  the  loss  of  conspicuous  talents  and  cha- 
racter =^',  it  may  be  permitted  to  me,  with  my  avowed 
and  notorious  opinions  on  the  subject  of  our  parliamen- 
tary constitution,  to  state,  without  offence,  that  it  is  at 
least  some  consolation  for  the  imputed  theoretical  de- 
fects of  that  constitution,  that  in  practice  it  works  so 
well.  A  system  of  representation  cannot  be  wholly 
vicious,  and  altogether  inadequate  to  its  purposes,  which 
sends  to  this  House  a  succession  of  such  men  as  those 
whom  we  have  now  in  our  remembrance,  here  to  deve- 
lope  the  talents  with  which  God  has  endowed  them,  and 
to  attain  that  eminence  in  the  view  of  their  country, 
from  which  they  may  be  one  day  called  to  aid  her 
counsels,  and  to  sustain  her  greatness  and  her  glory. 

Mr.  Manners  SuTTON.f  —  I  know  not  whether  I 
ought,  even  for  a  moment,  to  intrude  myself  on  the 
House:  I  am  utterly  incapable  of  adding  any  thing  to 
what  has  been  so  well,  so  feelingly,  and  so  truly  stated 
on  this  melancholy  occasion ;  and  yet  I  hope,  without 
the  appearance  of  presumption,  I  may  be  permitted  to 
say,  from  the  bottom  of  my  heart,  I  share  in  every  sen- 
timent that  has  been  expressed. 

It  was  my  good  fortune,  some  few  years  back,  to  live 
in  habits  of  great  intimacy  and  friendship  with  Mr. 
Horner :  change  of  circumstances,  my  quitting  the  pro- 
fession to  which  w^e  both  belonged,  broke  in  upon  those 
habits  of  intercourse  ;  but  I  hope  and  believe  I  may 
flatter  myself  the  feeling  was  mutual.  For  myself,  at 
least,  I  can  most  honestly  say,  that  no  change  of  circum- 
stances—  no  difference  of  politics  —  no  interruption  to 
our  habits  of  hitercourse,  even  in  the  shghtest  degree 


*  ]Mr.  Windliam,  who  represented   St.  Mawes  in   180G,  died  member  for 
Higham  Ferrers  in  1810. 
f  Afterwards  Speaker  ;  the  present  Viscount  Canterbury. 


HOUSE  OF  COMMONS.  449 

diminished  the  respect,  the  regard,  and  the  affection  I 
most  sincerely  entertained  for  him. 

This  House  can  well  appreciate  the  heavy  loss  we 
have  sustained  in  him,  as  a  public  man.  In  these  times, 
indeed  in  all  times,  so  perfect  a  combination  of  com- 
.manding  talents,  indefatigable  industry,  and  stern 
integrity,  must  be  a  severe  public  loss :  but  no  man, 
who  has  not  had  the  happiness  —  the  hkssing,  I  might 
say,  to  have  known  him  as  a  friend  -,  who  has  not 
witnessed  the  many  virtues  and  endearing  qualities  that 
characterized  him  in  the  circle  of  his  acquaintance,  can 
adequately  conceive  the  irreparable  chasm  in  private 
life  this  lamentable  event  has  made. 

In  my  conscience  I  believe  there  never  lived  the  man, 
of  whom  it  could  more  truly  be  said,  that,  whenever  he 
was  found  in  public  life,  he  was  respected  and  admired 
—  whenever  he  was  known  in  private  life,  he  was  most 
affectionately  beloved. 

I  will  no  longer  try  the  patience  of  the  House  :  I 
was  anxious,  indeed,  that  they  should  bear  with  me  for 
a  few  moments,  whilst  I  endeavoured,  not  to  add  my 
tribute  to  the  regard  and  veneration  in  which  his 
memory  ought,  and  assuredly  will  be  held  ;  but  whilst  I 
endeavoured,  however  feebly,  to  discharge  a  debt  of 
gratitude,  and  do  a  justice  to  my  own  feelings. 

Mr.  Wynn'^  said,  that  his  noble  friend  (Lord  Mor- 
peth,) and  his  right  honourable  friend  who  had  last 
spoken  (Mr.  M.  Sutton,)  had  expressed  themselves  con- 
cerning their  departed  friend  with  that  feeling  of  affec- 
tion and  esteem  which  did  them  so  much  honour,  and 
which  was  heightened  by  their  habits  of  intimacy,  and 
their  opportunities  of  observing  his  character ;  but  the 

*  The  Right  Hon.  Charles  Williams  Wynn. 
38* 


450  TRIBUTES. 

virtues  by  which  he  was  distinguished  were  not  confined 
within  the  circle  of  his  acquaintance^  or  concealed  from, 
the  view  of  the  world.  Every  one  who  saw  Mr.  Horner 
had  the  means  of  judging  of  his  temper,  his  mildness, 
and  his  personal  virtues ;  for  they  were  seen  by  all.  He 
carried  with  him  to  public  life,  and  into  the  duties  and 
the  business  of  his  public  station,  all  that  gentleness  of 
disposition,  all  that  amenity  of  feeling,  which  adorned 
his  private  life,  and  endeared  him  to  his  private  friends. 
Amidst  the  heats  and  contests  of  the  House,  amidst  the 
vehemence  of  political  discussion,  amidst  the  greatest  con- 
flicts of  opinion  and  opposition  of  judgment,  he  main- 
tained the  same  mildness  and  serenity  of  disposition  and 
temper.  No  eagerness  of  debate,  no  warmth  of  feeling, 
no  enthusiasm  for  his  own  opinions,  or  conviction  of  the 
errors  of  others,  ever  betrayed  him  into  any  uncandid 
construction  of  motives,  or  any  asperity  towards  the 
conduct  of  his  opponents.  His  loss  was  great,  and  would 
long  be  regretted. 

Sir  Samuel  Romilly  said,  that  the  long  and  most  inti- 
mate friendship  which  he  had  enjoyed  with  the  honour- 
able member,  whose  loss  the  House  had  to  deplore, 
might,  he  hoped,  entitle  him  to  the  melancholy  satisfac- 
tion of  saying  a  few  words  on  this  distressing  occasion. 
Though  no  person  better  knew,  or  more  highly  estimated, 
the  private  virtues  of  Mr.  Horner  than  himself,  yet,  as 
he  was  not  sure  that  he  should  be  able  to  utter  what  he 
felt  on  that  subject,  he  would  speak  of  him  only  as  a 
public  man. 

Of  all  the  estimable  qualities  which  distinguished  his 
character,  he  considered  as  the  most  valuable,  that  inde- 
pendence of  mind  which  in  him  was  so  remarkable.  It 
was  from  a  consciousness  of  that  independence,  and  from 
a  just  sense  of  its  importance,  that,  at  the  same  time 


HOUSE  OF  COMMONS.  45]^ 

that  he  was  storing  his  mind  with  the  most  various 
knowledge  on  all  subjects  connected  with  our  internal 
economy  and  foreign  politics,  and  that  he  was  taking  a 
conspicuous  and  most  successful  part  in  all  the  great 
questions  which  have  lately  been  discussed  in  Parlia- 
ment, he  laboriously  devoted  himself  to  all  the  painful 
duties  of  his  profession.  Though  his  success  at  the  bar 
was  not  at  all  adequate  to  his  merits,  he  yet  steadfastly 
persevered  in  his  labours,  and  seemed  to  consider  it  as 
essential  to  his  independence  that  he  should  look  for- 
ward to  his  profession  alone  for  the  honours  and  emolu- 
ments to  which  his  extraordinary  talents  gave  him  so 
just  a  claim. 

In  the  course  of  the  last  twelve  years  the  House  had 
lost  some  of  the  most  considerable  men  that  ever  had 
enlightened  and  adorned  it :  there  was  this,  however, 
peculiar  in  their  present  loss.  When  those  great  and 
eminent  men  to  whom  he  alluded  were  taken  from  them, 
the  House  knew  the  whole  extent  of  the  loss  it  had 
sustained,  for  they  had  arrived  at  the  full  maturity  of 
their  great  powers  and  endowments.  But  no  person 
could  recollect  —  how  in  every  year  since  his  lamented 
friend  had  first  taken  part  in  their  debates,  his  talents 
had  been  improving,  his  faculties  had  been  developed, 
and  his  commanding  eloquence  had  been  rising  with  the 
important  subjects  on  which  it  had  been  employed  — 
how  every  session  he  had  spoken  with  still  increasing 
weight  and  authority  and  eftect,  and  had  called  forth 
new  resources  of  his  enlightened  and  comprehensive 
mind  —  and  not  be  led  to  conjecture,  that,  notwithstand- 
ing the  great  excellence  which,  in  the  last  session,  he 
had  attained,  yet  if  he  had  been  longer  spared,  he  would 
have  discovered  powers  not  yet  discovered  to  the  House, 
and  of  which  perhaps  he  was  unconscious  himself     He 


452  TRIBUTES. 

should  very  ill  express  what  he  felt  upon  this  occasion, 
if  he  were  to  consider  the  extraordinary  qualities  which 
Mr.  Horner  possessed  apart  from  the  ends  and  objects  to 
which  they  Avere  directed.  The  greatest  eloquence  was 
in  itself  only  an  object  of  vain  and  transient  admira- 
tion ;  it  was  only  when  ennobled  by  the  uses  to  which  it 
was  applied,  when  directed  to  great  and  virtuous  ends, 
to  the  protection  of  the  oppressed,  to  the  enfranchise- 
ment of  the  enslaved,  to  the  extension  of  knowledge, 
to  dispelling  the  clouds  of  ignorance  and  superstition,  to 
the  advancement  of  the  best  interests  of  the  country, 
and  to  enlarging  the  sphere  of  human  happiness,  that  it 
became  a  national  benefit  and  a  public  blessing ;  that  it 
was  because  the  powerful  talents,  of  which  they  were 
now  deprived,  had  been  uniformly  exerted  in  the  pursuit 
and  promoting  of  such  objects,  that  he  considered  the 
loss  which  they  had  to  lament  as  one  of  the  greatest 
which,  in  the  present  state  of  this  country,  it  could  pos- 
sibly have  sustained. 

Mr.  W.  Elliot.*  —  Amongst  his  other  friends.  Sir,  I 
cannot  refuse  to  myself  the  melancholy  consolation  of 
paying  my  humble  tribute  of  esteem  and  affection  to  the 
memory  of  a  person,  of  whose  rich,  cultivated,  and  en- 
lightened mind  I  have  so  often  profited,  and  whose  ex- 
quisite talents  —  whose  ardent  zeal  for  truth  —  whose 
just,  sedate,  and  discriminating  judgment  —  whose  forci- 
ble, but  chastened  eloquence  —  and,  above  all,  whose 
inflexible  virtue  and  integrity  rendered  him  one  of  the 
most  distinguished  members  of  this  House,  one  of  the 
brightest  ornaments  of  the  profession  to  which  he  be- 
longed, and  held  him  forth  as  a  finished  model  for  the 
imitation  of  the  rising  generation. 

The  full  amount  of  such  a  loss,  at  such  a  conjuncture, 

*  The  Right  Hon.  William  Elliot.    See  Vol.  H.  p.  148. 


HOUSE  OF  COMMONS.  453 

and  under  all  the  various  circumstances  and  considera- 
tions of  the  case,  I  dare  not  attempt  to  estimate.  My 
learned  friend  (Sir  S.  Romilly)  has  well  observed,  that,  if 
the  present  loss  be  great,  the  future  loss  is  greater  :  for, 
by  dispensations  far  above  the  reach  of  human  scrutiny, 
he  has  been  taken  from  us  at  a  period  when  he  was  only 
in  his  progress  towards  those  high  stations  in  the  state, 
in  which,  so  far  as  human  foresight  could  discern,  his 
merits  must  have  placed  him,  and  which  would  have 
given  to  his  country  the  full  and  ripened  benefits  of  his 
rare  and  admirable  qualities. 

Mr.  C.  Grant f  had  known  his  lamented  friend  before 
he  had  distinguished  himself  so  much  as  he  had  subse- 
quently done  ;  and  could  not  be  silent  when  such  an 
opportunity  occurred  of  paying  a  tribute  to  his  memory. 
Whatever  difference  of  opinion  they  might  have  on  pub- 
lic questions,  he  could  suspend  that  difference  to  admire 
his  talents,  his  worth,  and  his  virtues.  It  was  not  his 
talents  alone  that  were  developed  in  his  eloquence.  His 
eloquence  displayed  his  heart :  through  it  were  seen  his 
high-minded  probity,  his  philanthropy,  his  benevolence, 
and  all  those  qualities  which  not  only  exacted  applause, 
but  excited  love.  It  was  the  mind  that  appeared  in 
speeches  that  gave  them  character.  He  would  not  enter 
into  the  account  of  his  private  life,  although  his  private 
virtues  w^ere  at  least  on  a  level  with  his  public  merits. 
Amidst  all  the  cares  and  interests  of  public  life,  he  never 
lost  his  relish  for  domestic  society  or  his  attachment  to 
his  flimily.  The  last  time  that  he  (Mr.  G.)  conversed 
with  him,  he  was  anticipating  with  pleasure  the  arrival 
of  a  season  of  leisure,  when  he  could  spend  a  short  time 
in  the  bosom  of  his  family,  and  amid  the  endearments  of 
his  friends.     When  he  looked  at  his  public  or  private 

t  The  present  Lord  Glenelg. 


454  TRIBUTES. 

conduct,  his  virtues,  or  his  talents,  he  would  be  allowed 
to  have  earned  applause  to  which  few  other  men  ever 
entitled  themselves. 

Lord  Lascelles===  hoped  to  be  excused  for  adding  a  few 
words  to  what  had  been  said,  though  he  had  not  the 
honour  of  a  private  acquaintance  with  Mr.  Horner,  whom 
he  knew  only  in  this  House,  where  they  had  almost  uni- 
formly voted  on  opposite  sides  on  every  great  question. 
Notwithstanding  these  differences,  he  had  often  said  in 
private,  that  Mr.  Horner  was  one  of  the  greatest  orna- 
ments of  his  country,  and  he  would  now  say  in  public, 
that  the  country  could  not  have  suffered  a  greater  loss. 
The  forms  of  Parliament  allowed  no  means  of  expressing 
the  collective  opinion  of  the  House  on  the  honor  due  to 
his  memory ;  but  it  must  be  consolatory  to  his  friends 
to  see,  that  if  it  had  been  possible  to  have  come  to  such 
a  vote,  it  would  certainly  have  been  unanimous. 


These  speeches  in  the  House  of  Commons  were 
printed  for  private  circulation.  They  were  translated 
into  Italian  by  Ugo  Foscolo,  and  a  few  copies  of  the 
translation  were  also  printed,  to  which  M.  Foscolo  pre- 
fixed the  following  dedication :  — 

"  AL   :\OBILE    GIOVINETTO 

ENRICO  FOX, 

FIGLIO    DI   LORD    HOLLAND. 

"  So  di  mandarvi  un  dono  che  vi  rinnovera  amaro 
neir    anima   il   desiderio    di    Francesco    Horner.      Ma 

*  The  late  Earl  of  Harewood. 


FRANCIS  JEFFREY,  ESQ.  ,  455 

quanto  e  piu  lunga  e  piu  generosa,  tanto  h  piii  utile  a 
noi  r  afflizione  per  gli  uomini  egregj,  i  quali  dopo  d' 
averci  amati  e  istruiti,  sanno  beneficarci  anche  dalla  lor 
sepoltura.  La  morte  non  fu  al  tutto  immatura  per 
esso  ;  non  gli  lascio  meritare  la  invidia,  la  ingratitudine, 
e  la  sazieta  de'  mortali ;  e  nol  ritolse  alia  terra,  ye  non 
quando  ei  s'  era  gia  fatto  degno  die  i  suoi  concittadini 
ponessero  molte  speranze  in  lui  solo.  Or  da  che  non  v' 
e  concediito  d'  essere  spettatore  delle  sue  azioni,  conteni- 
platele  nelle  sue  lodi.  Potrete  emularle,  perclie  vivete 
in  libera  patria,  e  vedete  le  pubbliche  virtii  venerate 
nella  memoria  del  vostro  zio,  ed  amate  nel  padre  vostro : 
e  la  Natura  vi  ha  dotato  d'  indole  si  gentile,  da  non  sen- 
tirvi  felice  se  non  quando  procaccierete  fama  a  voi,  ed 
utile  agli  altri.  Ricordatevi  dell'  amico  rapito  nel  vigor 
deir  eta,  ed  affretatevi.  E  mentre  voi,  giovinetto,  rical- 
cando  i  vestigj  di  quel  cittadino,  salirete  animoso  per  le 
vie  della  vita,  io  stanco,  e  privo  di  patria,  andro  ripen- 
sando  al  sicuro  riposo  e  all'  aniraa  divina  di  quel  mortale, 
e  non  mi  rincrescera  di  discenderle.     Addio. 

"  Ugo  Foscolo. 

"  Soho  Square,  12  Maggio;  1817." 


BY   FRANCIS    JEFFREY,   ESQ.* 

1.  Extract  from  a  letter  to  Mr.  Wilkes  of  New  York,  dated  March,  1817. 

"  The  greatest  calamity  which  the  country  has  suf- 
fered is  in  the  loss  of  my  admirable  friend  Horner.  I 
never  looked  for  any  other  catastrophe  -,  but  the  ac- 
counts which  had  come  home  very  recently  before  had 
excited  great  hopes  in  many  of  his  friends ;  I  have  not 
known  any  death  in  my  time  which  has  occasioned  so 
deep  and  so  general  a  regret,  nor  any  instance  in  which 


456  TRIBUTES. 

there  has  been  so  warm  and  so  hononrable  a  testimony 
from  men  of  all  parties  to  the  merits  of  a  private  indivi- 
dual. Pray  read  the  account  of  what  passed  in  the 
House  on  moving  the  new  writ  for  his  borough,  and  con- 
fess that  we  are  nobler,  more  fair  and  generous  in  our 
political  hostility,  than  any  nation  ever  was  before.  It 
is  really  quite  impossible  to  estimate  the  loss  which 
the  cause  of  liberal  and  practical  opinions  has  sustained 
by  this  death.  That  of  Fox  himself  was  less  critical  or 
alarming,  for  there  is  no  other  person  with  such  a  union 
of  talent  and  character  to  succeed  him.  I  for  my  part 
have  lost  the  kindest  friend,  and  the  most  exalted  model, 
that  ever  any  one  had  the  happiness  of  possessing.  This 
blow  has  quite  saddened  all  the  little  circle  in  which  he 
was  the  head,  of  which  he  has  ever  been  the  pride  and 
the  ornament,  but  it  is  too  painful  to  say  more  on  such 
a  subject." 


2.  Extract  from  a  letter  to  John  Allen,  Esq.,  dated  1-ith  March,  1817. 

"  I  could  not  write  to  you  with  any  comfort  during 
the  hurry  of  the  session ;  indeed,  after  the  sad  news  of 
Horner's  death,  I  had  not  the  heart  to  address  any  thing 
to  you  either  upon  that  or  upon  indifferent  subjects. 
On  the  former  there  is  nothing  new  to  be  said.  Strangers 
have  already  said  all  that  even  friends  could  desire ;  and 
it  seems  enough  to  be  one  of  the  public  to  feel  the  full 
weight  of  this  calamity.  What  took  place  in  Parliament 
seems  to  me  extremely  honourable  to  the  body ;  nor  do 
I  believe  that  there  is  or  ever  was,  a  great  divided  poli- 
tical assembly  where  so  generous  and  just  a  testimony 
would  have  been  borne  unanimously  to  personal  merit, 
joined  especially  as  it  was  in  that  individual,  with  a 
stern  and  unaccommodating  disdain  of  all  sorts  of  base- 


MR.  DUGALD  STEWART.  457 

ness  or  falsehood.  It  is  also  a  national  trait,  not  less 
honourable,  I  think,  to  all  parties,  that  so  great  a  part 
of  the  eulogium  of  a  public  man,  and  in  a  public  assem- 
bly, should  have  been  made  to  rest  on  his  domestic 
virtues  and  private  affections." 

BY   MR.    DUGALD    STEWART. 

In  the  second  part  of  his  "  Dissertation  on  the  Progress 
of  Metaphysical,  Ethical,  and  Political  Philosophy,  since 
the  Revival  of  Letters  in  Europe,"  prefixed  to  the 
seventh  edition  of  the  Encyclopasdia  Britannica,  edited 
by  Professor  Napier,  (note  c.  p.  236,)  Mr.  Stewart  has 
quoted  the  passage  relating  to  Machiavel,  in  the  letter 
of  Mr.  Horner  to  Mrs.  Stewart  of  the  ITtli  of  Decem- 
ber, 1816,  beginning  with  the  words  "  Pray  tell  Mr. 
Stewart  that  there  is  a  very  remarkable  letter  of  Ma- 
chiavel's  lately  pubHshed,  &c.,"  and  has  added  the  follow- 
ing tribute  to  the  memory  of  his  departed  friend  :  — 

"  The  foregoing  passage  will  be  read  by  many  with  no 
common  interest,  when  it  is  known  that  it  formed  part 
of  a  letter  from  the  late  Francis  Horner,  written  a  very 
few  weeks  before  his  death.  Independently  of  the  satis- 
faction I  feel  in  preserving  a  memorial  of  his  kind  at- 
tention to  his  friends,  at  a  period  when  he  was  himself 
an  object  of  such  anxious  solicitude  to  his  country,  I  was 
eager  to  record  the  opinion  of  so  perfect  and  accom- 
plished a  judge  on  a  question  which,  for  more  than  two 
centuries,  has  divided  the  learned  world ;  and  which, 
his  profound  admiration  of  Machiavel's  genius,  combined 
with  the  most  unqualified  detestation  of  Machiavel's 
principles,  had  led  him  to  study  with  peculiar  care. 

"  The  united  tribute  of  respect  already  paid  by  Mr. 

VOL.  IL  39 


458  TRIBUTES. 

Horner's  political  friends  and  his  political  opponents,  to 
his  short  but  brilliant  and  spotless  career  in  public  life, 
renders  all  additional  eulogies  on  his  merits  as  a  states- 
man, equally  feeble  and  superfluous.  Of  the  extent 
and  variety  of  his  learning,  the  depth  and  accuracy  of 
his  scientific  attainments,  the  classical  (perhaps  some- 
what severe)  purity  of  his  taste,  and  the  truly  philosophi- 
cal cast  of  his  whole  mind,  none  had  better  opportunities 
than  myself  to  form  a  judgment,  in  the  course  of  a 
friendship  which  commenced  before  he  left  the  uni- 
versity, and  which  grew  till  the  moment  of  his  death. 
But  on  these  rare  endowments  of  his  understanding,  or 
the  still  rarer  combination  of  virtues  wdiich  shed  over  all 
his  mental  gifts  a  characteristical  grace  and  a  moral  har- 
mony, this  is  not  the  proper  place  to  enlarge.  Never, 
certainly,  was  more  completely  reahzed  the  ideal  por- 
trait so  nobly  imagined  by  the  Roman  poet :  '  A  calm 
devotion  to  reason  and  justice,  the  sanctuary  of  the 
heart  undefiled,  and  a  breast  glowing  with  inborn 
honour.' 

'  Compositum  jus  fasque  animo,  sanctosque  recessus 
Mentis,  et  incoctum  generoso  pectus  honesto.' " 


BY    SIR   JAMES    MACKINTOSH. 

In  the  Second  Preliminary  Dissertation  prefixed  to 
the  seventh  edition  of  the  Encyclopaedia,  on  the  Pro- 
gress of  Ethical  Philosophy  during  the  Seventeenth  and 
Eighteenth  Centuries,  by  Sir  James  Mackintosh,  and  in 
the  section  on  the  writings  of  Dugald  Stewart,  (p.  386,) 
the  following  passage  occurs  :  — 

"  Perhaps  few  men  ever  lived,  who  poured  into  the 
breasts  of  youth  a  more  fervid  and  yet  reasonable  love 


SIR  JAMES  MACKINTOSH.  459 

of  liberty,  of  truth,  and  of  virtue.  How  many  are  still 
alive,  in  different  countries,  and  in  every  rank  to  which 
education  reaches,  who,  if  thay  accurately  examined 
their  own  minds  and  lives,  would  not  ascribe  much  of 
whatever  goodness  and  happiness  they  possess,  to  the 
early  impressions  of  his  gentle  and  persuasive  eloquence ! 
He  lived  to  see  his  disciples  distinguished  among  the 
lisrhts  and  ornaments  of  the  council  and  the  senate.  He 
had  the  consolation  to  be  sure  that  no  words  of  his  pro- 
moted the  growth  of  an  impure  taste,  of  an  exclusive 
prejudice,  of  a  malevolent  passion.  Without  derogation 
from  his  writings,  it  may  be  said  that  his  disciples  were 
amono;  his  best  works."  He  adds  in  a  note  —  "  As  an 
example  of  Mr.  Stewart's  school,  may  be  mentioned 
Francis  Horner,  a  favourite  pupil,  and,  till  his  last  mo- 
ment, an  affectionate  friend.  The  short  life  of  this  ex- 
cellent person  is  worthy  of  serious  contemplation,  by 
those  more  especially,  who,  in  circumstances  like  his, 
enter  on  the  slippery  path  of  public  affairs.  Without 
the  aids  of  birth  or  fortune,  in  an  assembly  where  aris- 
tocratical  propensities  prevail,  —  by  his  understanding, 
industry,  pure  taste,  and  useful  information,  —  still  more 
by  modest  independence,  by  steadiness  and  sincerity, 
joined  to  moderation,  —  by  the  stamp  of  unbending  in- 
tegrity, and  by  the  conscientious  considerateness  which 
breathed  through  his  well-chosen  language,  —  he  raised 
himself,  at  the  early  age  of  thirty-six,  to  a  moral  aiif/io- 
rity  which,  without  these  qualities,  no  brilliancy  of 
talents  or  power  of  reasoning,  could  have  acquired.  No 
eminent  speaker  in  Parliament  owed  so  much  of  his  suc- 
cess to  his  moral  character.  His  high  place  was  there- 
fore honourable  to  his  audience  and  to  his  country. 
Regret  for  his  death  was  expressed  with  touching 
unanimity  from  every  part  of  a  divided  assembly,  un- 


4G0  TRIBUTES. 

used  to  manifestations  of  sensibility,  abhorrent  from 
theatrical  display,  and  whose  tribute,  on  such  an  occa- 
sion, derived  its  peculiar  value  from  their  general  cold- 
ness and  sluggishness.  The  tears  of  those  to  whom  he 
was  unknown,  were  shed  over  him ;  and  at  the  head  of 
those  by  whom  he  was  '^  praised,  wept,  and  honoured/ 
was  one,  whose  commendation  would  have  been  more 
enhanced  in  the  eye  of  Mr.  Horner,  by  his  discernment 
and  veracity,  than  by  the  signal  proof  of  the  concur- 
rence of  all  orders,  as  well  as  parties,  which  was  afforded 
by  the  name  of  Howard." 


BY    THE   REVEREND    JOHN   HEWLETT.* 

It  is  stated  in  the  first  volume  of  these  Memoirs,  page 
45,  that  a  translation  of  Euler's  Algebra  was  made  by 
Mr.  Horner,  w^hile  he  was  under  Mr.  Hewlett's  care.  In 
the  preface  to  a  new  edition  of  the  w^ork,  published 
after  Mr.  Horner's  death,  the  affectionate  preceptor  pays 
the  following  tribute  to  the  memory  of  his  pupil  and 
friend : 

"The  English  nation  will  long  remember,  and  ever 
estimate,  as  they  ought,  his  manlj^  eloquence  in  the 
senate ;  his  lofty  spirit  of  independence,  which  had  no 
mixture  of  pride  or  affectation ;  his  enlarged  views  and 
inflexible  integrity ;  his  vigilance  and  activity  in  the  dis- 
charge of  public  duties ;  his  fairness  and  liberality,  his 
temperance  and  firmness  in  debate ;  his  accurate,  vari- 
ous, and  extensive  knowledge ;  the  soundness  of  his 
argumentation,  and  the  sagacity  with  which  he  unveiled 
deception,  without  coveting  any  triumph,  or  wishing  to 
inflict  disgrace ;  and  his  calm,  but  dignified  opposition; 

*  See  Vol.  I.  p.  G. 


IIEV.  JOHN  HEWLETT.  4G1 

which  often  confuted  the  errors,  and  exposed  the  misap- 
prehensions of  his  opponents ;  but  without  ever  provok- 
ing resentment,  or  making  an  enemy. 

"  All  these  qualities,  however  rare,  when  united,  it  is 
well  known,  he  possessed ;  and,  on  this  subject,  many 
members  on  both  sides  of  the  House  of  Commons  have 
borne  the  most  ample  testimony :  but  those  only  who 
enjoyed  the  happiness  of  being  numbered  among  his 
intimate  friends,  could  form  any  adequate  idea  of  the 
uncommon  afecUonatencss  of  his  character ;  his  lasting, 
disinterested,  and  sincere  attachments ;  his  gentle,  unas- 
suming manners ;  and  his  readiness,  at  all  times,  to  do 
good,  and  to  relieve  the  distressed,  without  the  slightest 
tincture  of  vanity  or  ostentation.  In  the  discharge  of 
his  duties  as  a  son  and  a  brother,  it  is  almost  needless 
to  add,  that  his  conduct  was  most  exemplary. 

"  His  loss  as  a  public  character  will  be  long  felt  and 
deplored ;  and,  in  private  life,  it  has  produced  a  chasm 
that  can  never  be  filled  np.  To  have  had  some  share 
in  directing  the  studies,  cultivating  the  talents,  and 
forming  the  taste  of  such  a  man,  will  always  be  to  me  a 
source  of  the  greatest  satisfaction.  That  he  should  have 
fallen  a  victim  to  lingering  disease,  in  the  prime  of  man- 
hood, and  before  he  had  reached  the  meridian  of  his 
brilliant  and  useful  career,  is  truly  deplorable ;  yet  we 
should  be  thankful  for  what  we  once  possessed.  He  is 
indeed  gone;  'but  though  dead  he  still  liveth.'  All 
regret  for  his  premature  death  is  vain ;  and  it  should  be 
remembered,  that  humble  resignation  to  the  Divine  Will 
is  one  of  the  first  duties  of  every  human  being. 

"  His  saltern  accumulem  donis,  et  fungar  inani 
Munere." 

39* 


462  TRIBUTES. 

BY    THE   REV.    DR.    PARR. 
Letter  from  Dr.  Parr  to  Mr.  L.  Horner. 

Dear  Mr.  Hornerj  Hatton,  25th  July,  i8i7. 

I  would  not  venture  to  answer  your  polite  and 
candid  letter,  till  I  could  have  the  aid  of  a  scribe  who 
writes  more  legibly  than  myself.  The  oldest  of  your 
late  brother's  friends,  the  nearest  of  his  relations,  the 
warmest  of  his  admirers  cannot  hold  a  higher  opinion 
than  I  do  of  his  attainments,  talents,  and  virtues.  I 
thought  his  knowledge  various,  correct,  and  ready  for 
use.  In  his  language,  he  united  the  precision  of  a  phi- 
losopher with  the  elegance  of  a  scholar.  He  had  cheer- 
fulness without  levity,  and  seriousness  without  austerity. 
He  was  sincere  in  his  principles  and  steady  in  his  attach- 
ments. But  his  manners  were  mild,  his  temper  w^as 
benevolent,  and,  with  a  becoming  zeal  in  the  support  of 
his  own  opinions,  he  was  perfectly  exempt  from  intole- 
rance to  those  who  thought  differently  from  himself. 

In  truth,  dear  Sir,  I  have  rarely  seen  so  many  amiable 
and  so  many  respectable  qualities  blended  together  in 
the  same  mind,  and  each  giving  additional  lustre  to  the 
operations  of  the  other.  One  decisive  proof  of  the  in- 
tellectual and  moral  discipline  which  distinguished  him, 
was  to  be  found  in  the  phraseology  and  the  spirit  with 
which  he  often  spoke  of  Scottish  learning,  and  Scottish 
science.  He  never  depreciated  nor  exaggerated  the  merits 
of  either ;  and  in  commending  the  excellencies  of  English 
writers,  there  was  a  promptness,  and  there  was  a  sincerity, 
and  there  was  an  ardour,  which  I  have  not  often  perceived 
in  his  countrymen.  Such  magnanimity  was  worthy  of  his 
most  enlightened  mind  and  uncorrupted  heart ;  and  per- 


REV.  SYDNEY  SMITH.  463 

mit  me  to  add,  that  the  praise  which  I  now  unfeignedly 
bestow  upon  Mr.  Horner,  is,  for  the  same  reason,  and  in 
the  same  extent,  to  be  given  to  our  common  friend,  Mr. 
Dugald  Stewart.  You  know  very  well  the  disgust  and 
the  displeasure  which  I  feel  for  that  scantiness  of  com- 
mendation which  Englishmen  grant  to  their  northern 
neiofhbours. 

We  live  in  an  age  when  every  studious  and  well-in- 
formed man  should  lift  up  his  voice  against  national 
prejudices,  where  they  would  lead  us  to  undervalue  the 
improvements  of  the  human  understanding. 
I  have  the  honour  to  be,  dear  Sir, 

Your  faithful  wellwisher,  and 

respectful,  obedient  servant, 

Samuel  Parr. 


BY    THE    REV.    SYDNEY    SMITH. 
Letter  from  Mr.  Smith  to  Mr.  L.  Ilorncr. 
My  dear    Sir  Combe  Florey,  2GtIi  August,  1842.  ' 

You  desire  me  to  commit  to  paper  my  recollec- 
tions of  your  brother,  Francis  Horner.  I  think  that  the 
many  years  which  have  elapsed  since  his  death,  have 
not  at  all  impaired  my  memory  of  his  virtues,  at  the 
same  time  that  they  have  afforded  me  more  ample 
means  of  comparing  him  with  other  important  human 
beings  with  whom  I  have  become  acquainted  since  that 
period. 

I  first  made  the  acquaintance  of  Francis  Horner  at 
Edinburgh,  where  he  was  among  the  most  conspicuous 
young  men  in  that  energetic,  and  infragrant  city.  My 
desire  to  know  him,  proceeded  first  of  all  from  being 
cautioned  against  him  by  some  excellent  and  feeble  peo- 


4G4  TKIBUTES. 

pie  to  whom  I  had  brought  letters  of  introduction,  and 
who  represented  him  to  me  as  a  person  of  violent  politi- 
cal opinions ;  I  interpreted  this  to  mean  a  person  who 
thought  for  himself — who  had  firmness  enough  to  take 
his  own  line  in  life,  and  who  loved  truth  better  than  he 
loved  Dundas,  at  that  time  the  tyrant  of  Scotland.  I 
found  my  interpretation  to  be  just,  and  from  thence  till 
the  period  of  his  death,  w^e  lived  in  constant  society, 
and  friendship  with  each  other. 

There  was  something  very  remarkable  in  his  counte- 
nance—  the  commandments  were  written  on  his  face, 
and  I  have  often  told  him  there  was  not  a  crime  he  might 
not  commit  with  impunity,  as  no  judge  or  jury  who  saw 
him,  would  give  the  smallest  degree  of  credit  to  any 
evidence  against  him :  there  was  in  his  look  a  calm  set- 
tled love  of  all  that  was  honourable  and  good  —  an  air 
of  wisdom  and  of  sweetness ;  you  saw  at  once  that  he 
was  a  great  man,  whom  nature  had  intended  for  a  leader 
of  human  beings ;  you  ranged  yourself  willingly  under 
his  banners,  and  cheerfully  submitted  to  his  sway. 

He  had  an  intense  love  of  knowledge  ;  he  wasted  very 
little  of  the  portion  of  life  conceded  to  him,  and  was 
always  improving  himself,  not  in  the  most  foolish  of  all 
schemes  of  education,  in  making  long  and  short  verses 
and  scanning  Greek  choruses,  but  in  the  masculine  pur- 
suits of  the  pliilosophy  of  legislation,  of  political  econ- 
omy, of  the  constitutional  history  of  the  country,  and 
of  the  history  and  changes  of  Ancient  and  Modern 
Europe.  He  had  read  so  much,  and  so  well,  that  he  was 
a  contemporary  of  all  men,  and  a  citizen  of  all  states. 

I  never  saw  any  person  who  took  such  a  lively  interest 
in  the  daily  happiness  of  his  friends.  If  you  were  un- 
well, if  there  was  a  sick  child  in  the  nursery,  if  any  death 
happened  in  your  family,  he  never  forgot  you  for  an 


REV.  SYDNEY  SMITH.  405 

instant !  You  always  found  there  was  a  man  with  a 
good  heart  who  was  never  far  from  you. 

He  loved  truth  so  much,  that  he  never  could  bear  any 
jesting  upon  important  subjects.  I  remember  one  eve- 
ning the  late  Lord  Dudley  and  myself  pretended  to  jus- 
tify the  conduct  of  the  government  in  stealing  the 
Danish  fleet;  we  carried  on  the  argument  with  some 
wickedness  against  our  graver  friend ;  he  could  not 
stand  it,  but  bolted  indignantly  out  of  the  room ;  we 
flung  up  the  sash,  and,  with  loud  peals  of  laughter,  pro- 
fessed ourselves  decided  Scandinavians ;  we  offered  him 
not  only  the  ships,  but  all  the  shot,  powder,  cordage,  and 
even  the  biscuit,  if  he  would  come  back :  but  nothing 
could  turn  him ;  he  went  home ;  and  it  took  us  a  fort- 
night of  serious  behaviour  before  we  were  forgiven. 

Francis  Horner  was  a  very  modest  person,  which  men 
of  great  understanding  seldom  are.  It  was  his  habit  to 
confirm  his  opinion  by  the  opinions  of  others :  and  often 
to  form  them  from  the  same  source. 

His  success  in  the  House  of  Commons  was  decided 
and  immediate,  and  went  on  increasing  to  the  last  day 
of  his  life.  Though  put  into  Parliament  by  some  of  the 
Great  Borough  Lords,  every  one  saw  that  he  represented 
his  own  real  opinions :  without  hereditary  wealth,  and 
known  as  a  writer  in  the  Edinburgh  Review,  his  inde- 
pendence was  never  questioned :  his  integrity,  sincerity, 
and  moderation,  were  acknowledged  by  all  sides,  and 
respected  even  by  those  impudent  assassins  who  live  only 
to  discourage  honesty  and  traduce  virtue.  The  House 
of  Commons,  as  a  near  relation  of  mine  once  observed, 
has  more  good  taste  than  any  man  in  it.  Horner,  from 
his  manners,  his  ability,  and  his  integrity,  became  a  gen- 
eral favourite  with  the  House  ;  they  suspended  for  him 
their  habitual  dislike  of  lawyers,  of  political  adventurers, 


466  TRIBUTES. 

and  of  young   men   of  conseederdble  taalents   from  the 
North. 

Your  brother  was  wholly  without  pretensions  or  affec- 
tation. I  have  lived  a  long  time  in  Scotland,  and  have 
seen  very  few  affected  Scotchmen ;  of  those  few  he  cer- 
tainly was  not  one.  In  the  ordinary  course  of  life,  he 
never  bestowed  a  thought  upon  the  effect  he  was  pro- 
ducing; he  trusted  to  his  own  good  nature,  and  good 
intention-,  and  left  the  rest  to  chance. 

Having  known  him  well  before  he  had  acquired  a 
great  London  reputation,  I  never  observed  that  his  fame 
produced  the  slightest  alteration  in  his  deportment :  he 
was  as  affable  to  me,  and  to  all  his  old  friends,  as  when 
we  were  debating  metaphysics  in  a  garret  in  Edinburgh. 
I  don't  think  it  was  in  the  power  of  ermine  or  mace,  or 
seals,  or  lawn,  or  lace,  or  of  any  of  those  emblems  and 
ornaments  with  which  power  loves  to  decorate  itself,  to 
have  destroyed  the  simplicity  of  his  character.  I  believe 
it  would  have  defied  all  the  corrupting  appellations  of 
human  vanity :  Serene,  Honourable,  Right  Honourable, 
Sacred,  Reverend,  Right  Reverend,  Lord  High,  Earl, 
Marquis,  Lord  Mayor,  Your  Grace,  Your  Honour,  and 
every  other  vocable  which  folly  has  invented  and  idola- 
try cherished,  would  all  have  been  lavished  on  him  in 
vain. 

The  character  of  his  understanding  was  the  exercise 
of  vigorous  reasoning,  in  pursuit  of  important  and 
difficult  truth.  He  had  no  wit ;  nor  did  he  condescend 
to  that  inferior  variety  of  this  electric  talent  which  pre- 
vails occasionally  in  the  north,  and  which,  under  the 
name  of  Wid,  is  so  infinitely  distressing  to  persons  of 
good  taste  :  he  had  no  very  ardent  and  poetical  imagina- 
tion, but  he  had  that  innate  force,  which, 


KEV.  SYDNEY  SMITH.  4^7 

Qucmvis  pcrferrc  laborcm 


Suasit,  ct  induxit  noctes  vigilarc  sercnas 
Qiuirenteni  dictis  (^uibus,  et  (jiio  carmine  doiuum 
Clara  suim  possit  praipanderc  luniina  mentl. 

Your  late  excellent  father,  though  a  very  well  informed 
person,  was  not  what  would  be  called  a  literary  man,  and 
you  will  readily  concede  to  me  that  none  of  his  family 
would  pretend  to  rival  your  brother  in  point  of  talents. 
I  never  saw  more  constant  and  high  principled  attention 
to  parents  than  in  his  instance ;  more  habitual  and  re- 
spectful deference  to  their  opinions  and  wishes.  I  never 
saw  brothers  and  sisters,  over  whom  he  might  have 
assumed  a  family  sovereignty,  treated  with  more  cheer- 
ful, and  endearing  equality.  I  mention  these  things, 
because  men  who  do  good  things  are  so  much  more 
valuable  than  those  who  say  wise  ones;  because  the 
order  of  human  excellence  is  so  often  inverted,  and 
great  talents  considered  as  an  excuse  for  the  absence  of 
obscure  virtues. 

Francis  Horner  was  always  very  guarded  in  his  politi- 
cal opinions ;  guarded  I  mean  against  the  excesses  into 
which  so  many  young  men  of  talents  were  betrayed  by 
their  admiration  of  the  French  revolution.  He  was  an 
English  whig,  and  no  more  than  an  English  whig.  He 
mourned  sincerely  over  the  crimes,  and  madness  of 
France,  and  never  for  a  single  moment  surrendered  his 
understanding  to  the  novelty  and  nonsense  which 
infested  the  world  at  that  strange  a3ra  of  human  aftairs. 

I  remember  the  death  of  many  eminent  Englishmen, 
but  I  can  safely  say,  I  never  remember  an  impression 
so  general  as  that  excited  by  the  death  of  Francis  Hor- 
ner. The  public  looked  upon  him  as  a  powerful  and 
safe  man,  who  was  labouring  not  for  himself  or  his  party, 


4G8  TRIBUTES. 

but  for  them.  They  were  convinced  of  his  talents,  they 
confided  in  his  moderation,  and  they  were  sure  of  his 
motives  ;  he  had  improved  so  quickly,  and  so  much,  that 
his  early  death  was  looked  on  as  the  destruction  of  a 
great  statesman,  who  had  done  but  a  small  part  of  the 
good  which  might  be  expected  from  him,  who  would 
infallibly  have  risen  to  the  highest  offices,  and  as  infalli- 
bly have  filled  them  to  the  public  good.  Then  as  he 
had  never  lost  a  friend,  and  made  so  few  enemies,  there 
was  no  friction,  no  drawback ;  public  feeling  had  its  free 
course  ;  the  image  of  a  good  and  great  man  was  broadly 
before  the  world,  unsullied  by  any  breath  of  hatred ; 
there  was  nothing  but  pure  sorrow  !  Youth  destroyed 
before  its  time,  great  talents  and  wisdom  hurried  to  the 
grave,  a  kind  and  good  man,  who  might  have  lived  for 
the  glory  of  England,  torn  from  us  in  the  flower  of  his 
life !  —  but  all  this  is  gone  and  past,  and,  as  Galileo  said 
of  his  lost  sight,  "  It  has  pleased  God  it  should  be  so, 
and  it  must  please  me  also." 

Ever  truly  yours, 

Sydney  Smith. 


BY   LORD    DUDLEY.'^ 

Extract  from  a  letter  to  Mr.  Ticjlie. 

"  At  Leghorn  I  visited  the  tomb  of  poor  Horner.  He 
was  by  far  the  best  and  wisest  man  with  whose  friend- 
ship I  ever  was  honoured  ;  my  experience  does  not  teach 
me  that  the  qualities  of  the  heart  and  understanding 
are  often  united ;  men  of  great  abilities  are  apt  to  be 
vicious,  and  very  hard-hearted ;  an  affectionate  disposi- 
tion and  a  faithful  discharge  of  all  the  duties  of  life, 


MOXUMENT  IN  WESTMINSTER  ABHIA'.  4G9 

great  and  small,  are  chiefly  to  be  looked  for  in  a  certain 
mediocrity  of  talent,  but  Horner  was  as  kind  and  amia- 
ble, as  if  he  had  been  quite  undistinguished  ;  he  did  not 
take  advantage  of  his  talents  and  fiime,  to  be  excused 
from  the  practice  of  iiny  virtue." 


BY    THE    SPECULATIVE    SOCIETV    OF    EDINBURGH. 

On  the  25th  of  March,  1817,  it  was  resolved,  "That 
to  express  and  perpetuate  the  respect  of  the  Society'  for 
the  memory  of  Francis  Horner,  Esq.  a  member  of  tliis 
Society,  a  portrait  of  Mr.  Horner  be  procured,  to  be 
hung  up  in  the  Society's  Hall,  with  an  appropriate  in- 
scription." 

A  copy  was  made  by  Sir  Henry  Raeburn  of  the  por- 
trait he  had  painted  for  Mr.  L.  Horner  in  1812,  and 
from  which  the  engraving  that  forms  the  frontispiece  of 
Vol.  I.  is  taken.  It  was  placed  in  the  Hall  of  the  Society, 
in  the  College  of  Edinburgh,  with  the  following  inscrip- 
tion: 

"placed  in  the  year  1820 

liV    THE 

speculative  society 

in  honour  of 

FRANCIS  HORNER,  ESQ.  INI.  V. 

FIRST    THE    ORNAMENT    OF    THIS    INSTITUTION, 
AND    THEN    OF    HIS    COUNTRY'." 


MONUMENT    IN    WESTMINSTER    ABCEV. 

The  beautiful  marble  statue  of  Mr.  Horner,  which 
forms  a  conspicuous  object  in  the  north  transept  of  the 
abbey,  was  placed  there  under  the  direction  of  A^iscount 

VOL.  II.  40 


470  TRIBUTES. 

Morpetli,  the  Mar  [ui?  of  Lansdowne,  Lord  Holland, 
Lord  Auckland,  and  the  Honourable  James  Abercromby. 
The  names  of  the  Subscribers  are  given  in  the  Appen- 
dix (G).  It  was  executed  by  Sir  Francis  Chantrey,  and 
is  considered  to  be  one  of  his  most  successful  productions. 
The  following  is  the  inscription  on  the  pedestal : 

"  TO    THE    MEMORY    OF 

FRANCIS  HORNER,  • 

■VVIIO,    BY    THE    UKIOX    OF    G1!EAT    AND    VARIOUS    ACQUIREMENTS 

WITH    INFI.EXinLE     INTEGRITY    AND    UNWEARIED    DEVOTION' 

TO    THE    INTERESTS    OF    THE    COUNTRY, 

RAISED   HIMSELF    TO    AN    EMINENT    STATION    IN    SOCIETY, 

AND    WAS   JUSTLY    CONSIDERED    TO    BE    ONE    OF    THE 

MOST    DISTINGUISHED    MEMBERS    OF    THE    HOUSE    OF    COMMONS. 

HE    AVAS    BORN    AT    EDINBURGH    IN    1778, 

AVAS    CALLED    TO    THE    BAR,    BOTH    OF    ENGLAND    AND    SCOTLAND, 

AND    CLOSED    HIS    SHORT    BUT    USEFUL    LIFE    AT    PISA    IN    1817. 

HIS    DEATH    AVAS     DEEl'LA'    FELT 

AND    PUBLICKLA:    deplored    in    PARLIAMENT. 

HIS    AFFECTIONATE    FRIENDS    AND    SINCERE    AD.AIIRERS, 

ANXIOUS    THAT    SOAIE    MEMORIAL    SHOULD    EXIST 

OF    MERITS    UNIA'ERSALLi:    ACKNOWLEDGED, 

OF   EXPECTATIONS    WHICH    A    PREMATURE    DEATH 

COULD    ALONE    IIAA'E    FRUSTRATED,    ERECTED    THIS    MONU.MENT, 

A,    D.    1823." 


MONUMENT    AT    LEGHORN. 

A  marble  monument,  erected  by  his  Father,  covers 
Mr.  Horner's  grave  in  the  Protestant  Cemetery  at  Leg- 
horn. It  was  designed  by  Sir  Henry  C.  Englefield, 
Baronet ;  and  at  one  of  the  ends  there  is  a  likeness  of 
Mr.  Horner,  in  relief,  the  size  of  life,  which  was  executed 
bv  Sir  Francis  Chantrey. 


MONUMENT  AT  LKOIIOllN. 


471 


On   one  of  the   skies  there  is  the  following  inscrip- 
tion : 

^'FRANCISCUS  HORNER, 

SENATOll    15UITAXNICUS  ; 
NAT.    1:DIMUR(;I    PUID.   id.    AUG.    MOCCI.XXVllI, 

(»n.  I'lsis  VI.  ID.  rKHurAK.  mdcccwu. 

I'LBLK  !■; 
CO.NSI'K   li:i!ANTUH    KNGEMl'M    EJUS    KXCKL.SUM, 
FIDKS    IXTKMEKATA: 

I'KIVATIM, 

FILIUS,    FKATEH,   AMICUS, 

PIUS,    AMAXS,    SIXCERUS. 

HOC    MONUMEXTIM 

MEMOltEE    TALIS   XATI 

SACRAVIT    PATER." 


APPENDIX. 


40* 


APPENDIX   D.  (Page  408.) 


NOTES    ON    DANTE. 


When  we  landed  at  Leghorn,  where  we  remained  only  a 
few  hours,  my  brother  sent  for  a  bookseller's  catalogue,  and 
bought  a  copy  of  Dante.  It  was  the  edition  in  four  volumes 
8vo.,  by  Poggiali,  Livorno,  1807  ;  and  it  was  this  copy  he 
used  in  the  "  study  of  Dante,"  of  which  he  speaks  in  his  letter 
to  Lady  Holland  of  the  13th  of  December.  He  made  some- 
what copious  notes  on  the  "  Inferno ; "  and  these  I  recently 
showed  to  my  friend  Mr.  Herman  Merivale,  of  whose  familiar 
acquaintance  with  the  works  of  the  great  poet  I  was  aware. 
The  impression  which  the  perusal  of  them  made  upon  him  he 
has,  at  my  request,  described  in  the  following  letter :  — 

Mv  dear  Sir  Regent's  rark,  February  13,  1843. 

I  am  much  obliged  for  the  opportunity  which  you  have 
given  me  of  looking  over  the  records  of  Mr.  Horner's  first  im- 
pressions while  studying  the  great  poem  of  Dante,  and  en- 
joying the  pleasure  of  travelling  again  over  that  favourite 
ground  in  the  company  of  a  critic  of  so  much  taste  and 
acuteness. 

I  had  understood  from  you  that  Mr.  Horner  only  took  up 
this  pursuit  during  leisure  hours  in  his  visit  to  Italy,  and 
under  the  pressure  of  his  last  fatal  illness.  Of  course,  there- 
fore, I  did  not  expect  to  find  him  conversant  with  the  "  Com- 
media"  after  the  fashion  of  Italian  scholars,  who  make  it  a 
study  of  years,  and  seem  often  to  become  so  exclusively 
Dantesquc  in  their  mode  of  regarding  the  poet,  that  they 
never  judge  him  at  all  by  ordinary  rules,  and  illustrate  him,  as 
Scripture  is  illustrated,  only  on  a  system  of  concordances.  I 
do  not  know  from  what  source  he  derived  the  conjecture  as 
to  the  allegorical  meaning  of  the  Wolf  in  the  first  canto  : 
if  original,  it  was  a  curious  anticipation  on  his  part  of  the 


47G  APPENDIX    D. 

doctrines  which  Professor  Rosetti  has  since  set  forth  with 
such  abundance  of  ingenuity.  But,  with  this  exception,  I  do 
not  perceive  that  he  troubled  himself  with  the  inner  meaning 
or  meanings  of  the  poem,  more  than  a  casual  reader  for  the 
first  time  may  be  expected  to  do.  And  it  is  plain  enough 
that  he  noted  down  his  observations  as  he  read,  and  did  not 
revise  them.  For  example,  I  do  not  think  that  he  would  have 
expressed  himself  as  he  has  done  in  a  note  on  canto  10,  re- 
specting Dante's  want  of  philosophical  sentiment  on  general 
human  aftairs,  if  he  had  then  read  the  "  Purgatorio"  and 
"  Paradiso,"  and  am  very  certain  that  he  would  not  have  ac- 
cused him,  a  little  farther  on,  of  deficiency  in  love  of  country, 
in  the  modern  or  classical  sense  of  the  phrase,  when  he  had 
got  as  far  as  the  15th  canto  of  the  latter  cantica.  It  was  not, 
however,  as  an  exercise  on  Dante  that  these  remarks  have 
chiefly  interested  me;  but  from  the  illustrations  they  afford  of 
the  taste  and  genius  of  the  writer  himself, —  of  the  manner  in 
which  the  principal  characteristics  of  the  Italian  poet  struck 
him  on  the  first  reading,  coming  to  the  task  with  little  or  no 
especial  preparation,  but  with  a  mind  full  of  literary  wealth,  a 
strong  sense  of  beauty  of  style,  and  an  acute  and  practised 
•critical  discernment.  Nothing  can  be  happier  than  his  appre- 
ciation of  some  of  the  peculiar  beauties  of  Dante's  style.  I 
have  an  hundred  times  read  the  remark,  that  he  is  the  most 
picturesque  of  poets  ;  but  I  do  not  know  when  I  have  seen 
the  meaning  of  the  phrase  so  well  explained,  or  the  trick  of 
Dante's  pictures,  if  I  may  use  the  phrase,  so  neatly  described, 
as  in  the  following  passage  :  — 

"  This  is  an  instance  (I  have  passed  by  many  much  finer) 
of  the  talent  which  this  poet  possessed  of  placing  before  the 
very  eye  of  the  reader  the  object  he  represents.  In  point  of 
execution,  the  success  of  such  passages  greatly  depends  on  a 
well  ordered  conciseness ;  for  a  difference  in  the  relative  posi- 
tion of  two  words,  and  the  use  or  omission  of  some  very  ordi- 
nary phrase,  may  make  the  whole  obscure  or  bright  as  a  pic- 
ture. All  great  writers,  indeed,  must  possess  this  graphical 
powder,  or  they  fail  in  an  essential  part  of  writing;  but  their 
manner  varies  :  some  erring  by  having  aimed  at  brevity,  and 


NOTES    ON    DANTE.  477 

forcing  the  parts  of  their  description  too  close  upon  one 
another;  others,  by  aiming  at  a  prolongation  of  the  eftect  by 
a  succession  of  pictures  running  into  one  another,  like  the 
circle  of  a  panorama.  Both  fail  to  give  their  reader,  if  I  may 
say  so,  a  point  of  sight :  the  former  seems  confused  and  ob- 
scure ;  the  latter  becomes  weak,  lax,  and  obscure  too.  A 
selection  of  instances,  not  only  perfect  ones,  but  of  some  that 
are  defective  both  ways,  taken  from  the  best  classics  of  dif- 
ferent languages,  and  accompanied  with  a  criticism  in  search 
of  what  this  defect  or  excellence  turns  on,  would  be  a  useful 
exercise  for  the  student  who  made  it.  .  .  .  One  cause  of  the 
vividness  of  Dante's  pictures  is,  I  think,  that  lie  generallij 
chooses  one  inoment  of  time,  and  rarely  attempts  to  represent 
successive  actions." 

Another  instance  (to  my  mind)  of  the  same  intuitive  cor- 
rectness of  judgment  occurs  in  the  comparison  of  Dante  with 
Tacitus,  the  only  ancient  writer  of  whom  Mr.  Horner  found 
himself  in  the  least  degree  reminded  by  the  subject  of  his  new 
studies.  It  is  plain  that  the  rhetorical  excellences  of  the  poet 
are  those  which  impressed  him  most ;  and  I  think  Lord 
Brougham  says,  that  the  study  of  Dante  formed  an  important 
part  of  his  own  discipline  as  an  orator.  I  am  struck,  too, 
with  the  evident  preference  with  which  he,  fresh  from  the  po- 
litical excitement  of  English  state  commotions,  fixes  on  the 
magnificent  episode  of  Farinata  degli  Uberti :  for  in  Dante, 
as  in  Shakspeare,  every  man  selects  by  instinct  that  which 
assimilates  with  the  course  of  his  own  previous  occupation 
and  interests.  As  to  Mr.  Horner's  criticisms  on  the  defects  of 
taste  and  style  which  pervade  the  "  Commedia,"  I  believe 
that  in  these  days,  when  it  is  the  fashion  to  view  the  poet 
through  a  medium  of  transcendentalism,  such  criticisms  are 
considered  a  kind  of  leze-majesty,  as  much  as  in  the  case  of 
Shakspeare  aforesaid  :  but  I  am  not  ashamed  to  confess  that 
all  my  affection  for  him  does  not  save  me  from  feeling  often 
oppressed  under  the 

"In  eterno  faticoso  maiito'' 

of  far-fetched  extravagance,  in  which  so  much  of  his  nobler 
thought  is  enveloped. 


478  APPENDIX    D. 

One  thing  only  I  was  sorry  to  meet  with  :  I  mean  the  de- 
preciation of  the  "  Purgatorio."  I  fancy  it  is  not  uncommon 
on  a  first  reading  to  regard  it  as  much  less  interesting  than 
the  first  division ;  but  not,  I  should  have  imagined,  with  one 
of  Mr.  Horner's  taste  and  feeling.  But  am  I  wrong  in  sus- 
pecting that  the  gradual  depression  of  long  illness  acted  in 
tiiis  instance  on  his  judgment,  rendering  him  averse  from  that 
steady  and  minute  attention,  that  labour  of  love,  by  which 
■alone  the  deep-seated  beauties  of  this  part  of  the  poem  are  to 
be  reached?  Certainly,  of  all  undertakings,  I  should  have 
thought  the  first  perusal  of  Dante  least  calculated  for  the 
relaxation  of  a  sick  chamber,  and  that  of  a  man  in  the  full 
tide  of  life,  whose  heart  must  have  been  wrapt  up  in  interests 
of  a  far  more  stirring  character.  I  never  knew  the  Florentine 
heartily  studied,  except  when  taken  up  in  youth,  while  there 
are  yet  time  and  energy  to  spare,  and  with  no  call  on  the 
mind  to  husband  its  resources ;  but,  when  once  mastered, 
what  a  mine  of  wealth  to  resort  to  in  after  days!  The  more 
reason  (though  of  all  men  I  ought  least  to  say  so  to  yourself) 
for  regretting  a  little  the  rabbia  Tedesca,  which  seems  to  have 
invaded  our  education  of  late  years  to  such  an  extent  as  to 
have  thrown  the  great  Italian  masters  somewhat  in  the  back- 
ground. 

Believe  me,  with  many  thanks. 
Very  sincerely  yours, 

Herman   Merivale. 


MANUSCRIPT    BOOK. 


470 


APPENDIX  E.     (Page  433.) 

MANUSCRIPT    BOOK 

Begun  within  six  days  of  Mr.  Horner's  Death.  On  the  first 
page  is  written,  '•  Designs,  at  Pisa,  2d  February,  1817, 
under  the  auspices  of  opium  and  returning  spring." 

CONTENTS. 


A.  Designs. 

a.  Theory  of  Jurisprudence  1 

b.  Hints  for  a  History          -  23 

]>.  Political  Preparations 

and  Discipline. 

a.  Character  of  our  own  Times       43 

h.  Political  Books             -  -     Gl 

c.  Questions  : 

1.  ForeiiTn  Politics     -  -     63 

2.  Ami)"        -             -  -     CD 

3.  Catholics   -             -  -     71 

4.  Currency  -              -  -     73 

5.  Funds        -             -  -     79 

6.  Trade  and  Economy  -     83 


V.WV. 

7.  Poor  Laws 

-     8!) 

8.  Parliamentary  Reform 

91 

9.  Church  -       '      - 

-     97 

10.  West  India  Slaves 

-  101 

11.  Ileforms  in  the  Law 

-  105 

C.   Classical  Studies. 

a. 

Languages 

-  113 

h. 

English  ^irammar 

-  iir. 

c. 

English  Composition 

-  117 

d. 

List  of  Classics 

D.  Detached  Subjects  for 

-  I'il 

Studi/     -         '    - 

-   125 

E.  Detached  Sidy  eels  for 

Comp)osition 

-  129j 

These  several  subjects  form  titles  to  the  pages  of  the  book, 
as  indicated  in  this  Table  of  Contents,  and  under  several  of 
them  Mr.  Horner  had  written  a  few  notes  relating  to  that  par- 
ticular branch  of  his  plan  of  study.  The  most  complete  are 
the  following:  — 

{Page  1.)  A.  Phil  Designs. 

a.  Arrangement  of  the  general  principles  of  justice,  and 
theory  of  laws. 

b.  Views  set  down,  as  hints  for  a  general  history  of  our 
own  times ;  L  e.  from  the  accession  of  (;}eorge  HI.  in  England, 
to  the  close,  when  it  may  be,  of  the  events  which  have  grown, 
out  of  the  French  Revolution. 


480  APPENDIX    E. 


A.  a.  "  Theory  of  Laws'"" 

1.  Of  the  principles  that  ought  to  regulate  the  constitution 
of  courts  of  justice. 

2.  Of  the  foundation  of  the  voluntary  law  of  nations  in 
the  natural  principles  of  justice. 

A.  a.   Theory  of  Justice. 

Solon  is  said  to  have  been  the  first  inventor  of  the  Atlantic 
fable,  and  to  have  written  an  idea  of  a  perfect  republic  under 
that  title.  It  was  probably  the  philosophical  romance  of  his 
youth.  But  it  is  remarkable  that  an  Utopia  should  have  been 
composed  by  the  author  of  the  famous  maxim,  which  is 
ascribed  to  him,  which  limits  to  actual  existing  circumstances 
the  aim  of  the  legislative  reformer. 

The  line  which  separates  criminal  from  civil  jurisprudence, 
is  perhaps  not  to  be  marked  by  any  more  fixed  principle  or 
permanent  distinctidn,  than  the  conveniency  of  treating  some 
of  the  injuries  that  may  be  done  to  individuals  as  so  import- 
ant, that  the  public  ought  to  take  up  the  injury  into  their  own 
hands,  make  a  common  cause  of  it,  and  consider  retribution 
to  the  injured  individual  as  less  to  be  thought  of  than  the 
punishment  of  the  wrong-doer.  The  prevention  of  such  inju- 
ries in  future,  by  the  terror  of  punishment,  is  the  object  of 
criminal  law;  that  of  civil  justice,  retribution  to  the  person 
injured  out  of  the  means  and  substance  of  the  wrong-doer. 
This  conveniency,  that  is,  the  sort  of  injuries  which  will  be 
included  by  such  a  line,  and  marked  out  for  the  objects  of 
criminal  law,  will  vary  in  different  conditions  of  society:  the 
history  of  criminal  law  from  rude  times  is  in  general  a  pro- 
gressive increase  in  the  number  of  objects  so  selected. 

{Page  23.)  A.  b.  History. 

As  a  subject  of  history,  the  period  would  admit  of  immense 
variety,  both  in  point  of  narration,  and  for  the  principles  of 


DESIGNS.  481 

politics  that  would  be  illustrated  by  the  events.  If  treated  as 
an  English  history,  there  is  scarcely  a  constitutional  question 
which  would  not  come  in  by  way  of  narrative.  The  true 
principles  of  political  innovation,  and  of  political  liberty, 
would  unavoidably  be  the  moral  of  the  work.  The  comple- 
tion of  the  American  Revolution,  the  formation  of  our  East 
Indian  empire,  and  our  maxims  there,  Grattan's  Irish  Revolu- 
tion in  1782,  the  origin  and  termination  of  the  slave  trade 
question,  the  origin  and  progress  of  the  Catholic  question,  of 
the  question  of  parliamentary  reform,  the  excesses  of  the 
funding  system. 

The  Spanish  war,  the  Russian  campaign;  —  the  characters 
of  Washington,  Fox,  — 

The  remarkable  state  of  Europe  on  the  eve  of  the  French 
Revolution,  after  the  interval  of  peace  from  1783. 

{Page  43.)     B.  PoUtical  Preparations  and  Exercise. 

a.  Spirit  of  the  times,  and  character  of  passing  events.  (In 
part  coincides  with  A.  h.) 

b.  Works  to  be  studied,  with  an  eye  to  present  times  and 
circumstances. 

c.  Series  of  questions  for  discussion  and  practical  adjust- 
ment in  our  politics. 

B.  a.  Times. 

Effect  of  war  in  throwing  discredit  upon  political  economv 
Revival  of  such  speculations  on  the  return  of  peace,  when 
men's  minds  are  engaged  in  the  repair  of  the  disorders  caused 
by  war.     This  over  Europe  now. 

War  throws  discredit  upon  all  sober  speculations  of  trade, 
by  bringing  into  activity  a  new  race  oi practical  men. 

(Page  61.)     B.  b.  Books. 

Aristotle's  Politics.     The  Lettres  Persanes,  and  Grandeur 
des  Romains.     De  Retz.     Cicero's  Familiar  Letters. 
VOL.  II.  41 


482  APPENDIX  E. 


(Page  63.)     B.  c.    Questions.     House  of  Conunons. 

1.  Principles  and  views  of  foreign  politics. 

2.  Standing  army. 

3.  Catholic  claims. 

4.  Currency. 

5.  Sinking  fund  and  debt. 

6.  Policy  for  England,  in  present  circumstances,  with  regard 
to  trade,  shipping,  manufactures,  and  husbandry. 

7.  Poor  laws,  and  state  of  the  labouring  orders. 

8.  Parliamentary  reform. 

9.  Clergy  residence,  and  progress  of  the  fanatics. 

10.  Slaves  in  West  Indies. 

11.  Reforms  in  the  law. 

{Page  71.)     B.  c.  3.   Catholic  Claims. 

Lord  Eldon's  position,  that  the  State  is  essentially  Pro- 
testant. 

To  reconcile  Catholic  Emancipation  with  the  views  and 
principles  of  the  Whigs  at  the  Revolution. 

(Page  79.)     B.  c.  5.   Sinking  Fund,  Debt,  and  Revenue. 

Wm.  Sm.'s  (William  Smith)  language  in  last  session  about 
funds,  and  Dick's  prejudices  about  stockholders  and  landhold- 
ers. Multitude,  and  various  classes  of  persons,  throughout 
England,  who  hold  property  in  the  funds ;  in  very  small  sums. 
Alarm. 

{Page  91.)     B.  c.  8.  Parliamentary  Reform. 

In  such  a  country,  two  contending  prejudices  generally  at 
work ;  each  has  its  fits  of  greater  violence  occasionally,  Avhich 
brings  about  a  re-action  of  the  other;  a  passion  for  novelties 
for  the  sake  of  improvement,  and  zeal  against  innovation. 
Their  conflict  insures  discussion.     The  stability  of  our  institu- 


DESIGNS.  483 

tions  founded  upon  the  improvements  which  work  themselves 
out  mature,  from  such  conflict  and  discussion. 


{Paffc  105.)     B.  c.  11.  Reforms  in  the  Laiu. 

Insolvent  debtors. 

Extents  in  aid. 

Gaol  delivery  in  corporations. 

Judgments  on  misdemeanour  at  nisi  pr ins. 

Statute  of  stabbing. 

Statute  of  William,  for  treason  trials,  to  Ireland. 

{Page  113.)    C.   Course  of  Critical  Studies  to  he  pursued;  ivith 
Vlcivs  bearing'  iqjon  A.  and  B. 

a.  Exact  knowledge  of  the  languages  I  already  read. 
h.  More  critical  knowledge  of  the  grammatical  proprieties 
of  English. 

c.  Studies  in  English  composition. 

d.  Classical  authors  to  be  familiarly  acquainted  with. 

{Page  111.)     C.  c.  Composition. 

Collect  in  standard  authors  those  turns  of  common  expres- 
sion, wdiich  constitute  the  permanent,  unvarying  body  of 
English  idiom :  works,  in  which  to  collect  these,  —  the  Bible, 
Shakspeare,  Clarendon,  Tillotson,  Addison's  Spectators,  Dry- 
den,  Pope. 

1.  Recent  authors,  from  whose  writings  some  knowledge  of 
the  appropriate  idioms  of  English  phraseology  may  be  gleaned, 
but  with  more  danger  of  mistaking  temporary  fashion  for  per- 
manent modes :  — 

Blackstone,  but  not  in  his  shew  passages;  Soame  Jenyns ; 
Uvedale  Price;  Abram  Tucker;  White  of  Selborne ;  Sir  J. 
Reynolds  ;  Cowpcr's  Letters,  and  Lady  Mary's  ;  George 
Ellis. 

2.  The  rhythm  of  English  prose  ;  to  adjust  it  to  the  sense. 


484  APPENDIX    E. 

as  well  as  to  the  sentiment.  Of  the  former,  very  few  ex- 
anijDles  to  be  produced ;  and  those  only  in  detached  pas- 
sages :  — 

Shaftesbury ;  Essay  on  Virtue;  very  harmonious,  but  the 
melody  rather  set  to  the  sentiment  of  the  work,  than  adjusted 
to  the  variations  of  argument  and  meaning.  But  examine  it 
in  detail. 

Boling'broke ;  various. 

Middleton;  aims  at  a  Latin  tune. 

Junius ;  some  fine  instances.  But  in  that  tone  of  sentiment, 
the  rhythm  suggested  by  the  sentiment  more  easily  adjusts 
itself  to  the  sense. 

Johnson;  in  The  Rambler,  no  adjustment;  the  rhythm  dic- 
tates what  is  said.  In  his  greater  works,  some  excellent 
instances.     No  ear  for  varied  harmony. 

{Page  121.)     C.  d.    Classics. 

1.  Poets  to  be  habitually  studied,  the  principles  of  their 
works  to  be  thoroughly  examined :  — 

Iliad  and  Odyssey;  tragedies  of  Euripides;  Virgil,  both 
works ;  Ovid,  the  Metamorphoses ;  Dante,  Inferno ;  Ariosto, 
Orlando  Furioso ;  E-acine,  Moliere,  Shakspeare,  Milton. 

2.  Historians.  —  Xenophon,  Thucydides,  Polybius,  Tacitus, 
Sallust,  CsBsar,  Livy,  Guicciardini,  Sarpi,  Davila,  Machiavel, 
Hume. 

3.  For  the  resources  of  rhetoric,  or  for  the  power  of  diction 
and  expression  in  their  respective  languages  —  Demosthenes, 
Plato,  Cicero,  Rousseau,  Massillon,  Bossuet. 

The  orations  of  Demosthenes  and  Cicero  especially. 

4.  3IoraIists,  and  masters  in  the  art  of  thinking:  —  Lord 
Bacon's  logical  writings;  Cicero's  philosophical  dialogues; 
Aristotle's  Ethics  and  Poetics ;  Epictetus,  Antoninus,  and 
the  other  remains  of  the  Stoics;  Sir  J.  Reynolds's  Discourses; 
Addison's  Spectators ;  Smith's  Theory  of  Moral  Sentiments ; 
Dugald  Stewart's  works  ;  Plutarch  ;  Butler's  Analogy  ;  Paley's 
Natural  Theology ;  and  Hume's  Dialogues. 


DESIGNS.  485 


(Pag-c  125.)     D.    Detached  Subjects  for  Inquiry  and  Study. 

1.  Books  for  the  history  of  opinions:  —  CudivortlCs  Intellec- 
tual System ;  Beaiisobre,  Histoire  des  Manichdes ;  Plutarch's 
Morals. 

2.  Aristotle's  Politics,  compared  with  Machiavel's  Dis- 
courses, as  a  digest  of  the  principles  and  sentiments  of 
their  respective  times.  The  notions  of  political  justice  and 
public  morality,  current  among  the  small  republics  of  Greece, 
compared  with  those  of  the  Italians  in  their  similar  circum- 
stances. 

3.  Plato's  Style. 

4.  Of  the  exact  adjustment  of  the  rhythm  of  composition 
to  the  sense  as  it  runs  and  varies,  as  well  as  to  the  character 
of  the  subject.  Different  great  masters  of  writing  examined 
in  respect  of  this  quality  of  composition.  Conclusions  with 
reference  to  English  prose. 

5.  To  read  over  all  the  Orations  of  Cicero,  critically ;  and 
afterwards  run  over  RoUin's  Quintilian,  for  the  particular 
study  of  the  passages  to  which  he  refers. 

{Page  129.)     E.  Detached  Subjects  for  Composition. 

1.  An  introduction  to  the  art  of  reasoning,  for  the  use  of 
students. 

2.  A  translation,  into  pure  English,  of  the  best  parts  of 
Aristotle's  Politics. 

3.  Of  the  dialects  of  a  cultivated  language. 


41* 


486  APPENDIX   F. 


APPENDIX  F.     (Page  434.) 

RESULTAT    De' LA    SECTION    DU    CADAYRE    DU    FEU    M.    FRANCOIS 

HORNER. 

Son  corps  n'etait  pas  tres  maigre,  et  sa  peau,  surtout  celle 
de  la  face,  avait  une  teiiite  plombde ;  aux  extremites  des 
doigts  elle  etait  noire. 

L'ouverture  du  bas  ventre  fit  voir  tous  les  visceres  et  organes 
contenus  dans  cette  cavite  .parfaitement  sains ;  on  remarqua 
seulement  le  systeme  veneux  gorge  de  sang. 

La  section  de  la  poitrine  laissa  voir  les  poumons  singu- 
lierement  rapetisses,  et  particulierement  le  poumon  droit. 
Leur  couleur  etait  livide,  et  leur  superficie  tres  inegale :  cette 
inegalitd  naissait  d'un  tres  grand  nombre  de  corps  blancs, 
transparens,  de  forme  et  de  volume  tres  inegal;  les  plus  petits 
ctaient  comme  des  lentilles,  les  plus  gros  commedes  amandes. 
De  ces  corps  on  en  voy  ait  beaucoup  a  la  face  anterieure  des 
poumons,  peu  a  la  face  posterieure.  Ces  corps  etaient  de 
petits  vesicules  reraplis  d'air ;  sous  la  compression  elles  dis- 
paraissaient,  et  Pair  passait  dans  les  bronches ;  elles  reparais- 
saient,  si  on  poussait  de  Fair  dans  la  trachde-artere.  Ces  ves- 
sies  n'avaient  aucune  communication  avec  le  tissu  cellulaire, 
qui  unit  les  cellules  adriennes  entre  elles,  de  maniere  qu'il  ne 
s'agissait  pas  d'emphyseme,  mais  de  dilatation  morbifique  des 
cellules  aeriennes. 

Une  grande  partie  de  la  substance  pulmonairc,  et  speciale- 
ment  la  partie  posterieure  de  ces  organes  etait  condensde, 
durcie,  et,  dans  beaucoup  de  points,  entierement  hepatisee. 
Les  lobes  des  poumons  n  etaient  pas  adherents  entre  eux;  il 
n'y  avait  pas  d'adherences  entre  les  poumons  et  la  pleure. 
Les  glandcs  lympliatiques  des  bronches  (Etaient  plus  volumi- 
neuses  qu'a  Tordinaire,  la  membrane  des  bronches  legerement 
engorgde. 


POST-MORTEM   EXAMINATION.  487 

Lc  pericarde  dtait  sain;  entre  cette  membrane  ct  le  cocur  il 
y  avait  une  petite  quantit<}  de  sdrosite.  Le  coeur  dtait  extrcnrie- 
mcnt  fiasque,  et  se  laissait  facilemcnt  decliirer  par  les  doigts. 
L'oreillctte  droitc  6tmt  tres  dilatee,  et  remplie  de  sang.  Le 
ventricule  correspondant  avait  des  parois  tres  amincics,  et 
c'dtait  spdcialement  dans  les  parois  de  ce  ventricule  que  I'on 
pouvait  rdmarquer  le  peu  de  tdnacite  de  la  substance  muscu- 
laire  que  nous  avons  not6  plus  liaut.  Ce  ventricule  dtait 
rempli  d'une  substance  blanche,  assez  compacte,  fibreuse,  forte- 
mcnt  adherente  aux  colonnes  musculaires  du  ventricule.  Cette 
substance  etait  probablement  de  la  lymphe  plastique,  formee 
dans  les  derniers  moments  de  la  vie. 

Les  deux  autres  cavitcs  du  ccrur  nc  presenterent  rien  de  par- 
ticulier. 

Baillie  (Anatomic  Pathologique,  cli,  iv.  sect.  vi.  et  suiv.)  et 
Lieutaud  (Historia  Antomica-Medica)  rapportent  quelques 
excmples  d'affections  pathologiques,  qui  ont  des  rapports  avec 
ccllc  que  nous  avons  dc'crite  ;  mais  je  n^en  trouve  pas  une,  ou 
Ton  ait  remarqu6  dans  le  meme  individu  le  rapotissement  des 
poumons,  la  dilatation  d'une  partie  des  cellules  aeriennes, 
I'hdpatisation  d'une  grande  partie  des  poumons,  et  Tatlection 
du  coeur. 

(Signed)  Doctfar  Vacca  Bkrlinghieri. 

Pisa,  le  12  Fe'vrier,  1817. 


Remarks  hij  Dr.  PrUidin  Warren  on  the  aborr,  in  a  Letter  to 
John  Alfen,  Esquire. 

Dear  Sir  31,  Lower  r.mok  street,  5th  MaiTh,  ISir. 

I  have  shown  VaccVs  account  to  Dr.  Baillie,  who  con- 
siders the  case  as  exhibiting  a  very  unusual  form  of  disease, 
and  one  which  is  evidently  o^t  of  the  reach  of  medicine. 
The  state  of  the  heart  presented  no  unusual  appearances;  the 
flaccidity  and  tender  structure  of  its  fibres  being  met  with 
very  frequ^ently  in  individuals  whose  constitutional  powers 
have  failed  by  slow  decay:  the  appearance  within  the  right 
ventricle  was  a  coagulum  of  blood,  not  unconimonly  found 


488  APPENDIX   F. 

in  that  situation  after  death.  The  condensation  of  the  lung 
is  also  not  unfrequently  met  with,  and  justifies  the  opinion 
which  Dr.  Baillie  held  to  you  of  such  an  alteration  of  struc- 
ture being  the  probable  cause  of  Mr.  Horner's  difficulty  of 
breathing,  which  was  never  attributed  to  water  in  the  chest, 
but  to  an  obstruction  of  the  circulation  of  the  blood  through 
the  lungs,  arising  from  some  cause  not  easily  distinguishable. 
The  enlargement  of  the  air  cells  to  the  extent  mentioned  by 
Dr.  Vacca  is  a  disorder  so  rare,  that  there  are  only  three  in- 
stances to  be  found  in  the  anatomical  collections  with  which 
Dr.  Baillie  is  acquainted.  The  immediate  cause  of  death 
appears  to  have  been  owing  to  the  increase  of  the  obstruction 
of  the  lungs  to  such  an  extent,  as  to  have  prevented  the  free 
passage  of  the  blood  through  the  branches  of  the  pulmonary 
artery,  by  which  the  right  side  of  the  heart  became  gradually 
gorged  with  blood,  and  its  action  was  slowly  suspended. 

Yours  faithfully, 

Pelham  Warren. 


MONUMENT. 


489 


APPENDIX  G.  (Page  470.) 

NAMES     OF     THE     SUBSCRIBERS     TO     THE     MONUMENT     IN 
WESTMINSTER     ABBEY. 


H.  R.  II.  tlie  Duke  of  Gloucester. 

The  Duke  of  Devonshire. 

The  Duke  of  Bedford. 

The  Duke  of  Somerset. 

The  Duke  of  Buckingham. 

The  JMarcjuis  of  Lansdowne. 

The  Earl  of  Essex. 

Earl  (;rey._   _ 

Earl  Fitzwilliam. 

Earl  of  Kosslyn. 

Earl  of  Darnley. 

Earl  of  Dunmore. 

Earl  of  Caernarvon. 

Earl  Spencer. 

Earl  of  Lauderdale. 

Earl  of  ]\Iinto. 

Eai-1  Cowper. 

Earl  of  Jersey. 

Lord  Holland. 

Lord  King. 

Lord  Auckland. 

Lord  Carrington. 

Lord  Grenville. 

Lord  Kinnaird. 

jNIarquis  of  Tavistock. 

Viscount  Ebrington. 

Viscount  Morpeth. 

Viscount  ^lilton. 

Viscount  Duncannon. 

Lord  Althorp. 

Lord  Webb  Seymour. 

Lord  John  Russell. 

Lord  Robert  Spencer. 

Lord  George  Cavendish. 

The  Hon.  Wm.  Lamb. 

The  Hon.  J.  W.  Ward. 

The  Hon.  Geo.  Ponsonbv. 

The  Hon. Wellesley. 

The  Hon.  Frederick  Douglas. 
The  Hon.  Jas.  Abercromby. 
The  Rt.  Hon.  George  Tierney. 
The  Rt.  Hon.  C.  Manners  Sutton. 
Sir  John  Majoribanks,  Bart.,  M.  P. 


Sir  Coutts  Trotter,  Bart. 
Sir  Samuel  Romiily,  M.  P. 
Sir  James  Mackintosh. 
Sir  Robert  Gitl'ord. 
Sir  Ronald  Ferguson. 
Alexr.  Baring,  Escp,  ]M.  P. 
I.  N.  Fazakerley,  Estp,  M.  P. 
^\m.  Elliott,  Esq.,  ]\I.  P. 
Pascoe  Grenfell,  Esq.,  M.  P. 
J.  Calcraft,  Esq.,  :M.  P. 
Georije  Phillips,  Esip,  'SI.  P. 
Wm.'Orde,  Esq.,  M.  P. 
Chas.  Grant,  Jun.,  Esq.,  M.  P. 
Frankland  Lewis,  Esq.,  M.  P. 
Jas.  Macdonald,  Es(i.,  M.  P. 
Richard  Sharp,  Esq.,  M.  P. 
Henry  Brougham,  Esq.,  i\I.  P. 
Wm.  Courtenay,  Esq.,  M.  P. 
James  Scarlett,  Esq.,  M.  P. 
U.  A.  Tavlor,  Esip,  M.  P. 
John  Smith,  Esq.,  M.  P. 
Richard  Ileber,  Esq.,  M.  P. 
Lady  Carnegie. 
John  A.  Murray,  Esq. 
Francis  Jeffrey,  Esq. 
Thomas  Thomson,  Escj. 
James  Loch,  Esq. 
Ilcnrv  Hallam,  Esq. 
W.  G.  Adam,  Esf]. 
John  Whishaw,  Es(|. 
AVilliam  ^lurray,  Es(j. 
John  Allen,  J>sq. 
Phihp  ^^'illiams,  Esq. 
Professor  Play  fair. 
^Ir.  Sergeant  Lens. 
Dr.  Lushington. 
Professor  Smyth. 
Robert  Ferguson  of  Raith,  Esq. 
Charles  Grant,  Esq. 
Richard  Oswald,  Es([. 
Frederick  Pifjou,  Esq. 
The  Rev.  [Mr^  Douglas. 
Tripp,  Esq. 


490  APPENDIX   G. 


The  following-  List  of  Subscribers  at  Bombay  was  transmitted 
by  Mr.  William  Erskine*  the  early  Friend  of  Mr.  Horner, 
accompanied  by  the  folloioing-  Letter  to  Lord  Auckland. 

Mv  Lord  Bombay,  30th  June,  1818. 

I  had  the  honour  of  receiving  your  letter  of  August 
3d  some  time  ago,  and  your  Lordship  only  did  me  justice,  in 
supposing  that  I  should  be  gratified  by  any  opportunity  of 
showing  my  respect  for  the  memory  of  one  whom  I  admired 
and  loved  so  much,  as  I  did  Mr.  Horner. 

Though  not  quite  certain  from  the  expressions  of  the  letter, 
whether  the  number  of  the  subscribers  w^as  intended  to  be 
limited  or  indefinite,  yet  as  several  gentlemen,  some  of  them 
his  friends,  and  all  of  them  admirers  of  his  public  and  private 
virtues,  expressed  a  desire  to  be  permitted  to  contribute  for 
an  object  so  congenial  to  their  feelings,  I  have  received  their 
subscriptions. 

I  annex  a  list  of  the  subscribers  who  would  have  been  more 
numerous,  at  this  presidency,  but  for  circumstances  which  it 
is  unnecessary  to  detail. 

I  have  the  honour  to  be,  my  Lord, 

Your  faithful  servant, 

William  Erskine. 

Names  of  the  Subscribers. 


The  Hon.  Monntstuart  Elphinstone. 
Brig.  Gen.  Sir  John  jNIalcolm. 
Wm.  Erskine,  Esq. 
John  Wedderburn,  Esq. 
Robert  Stewart,  Esq. 
Olgcth  "^^''oodhouse,  Esq. 
J.  H.  Crawford,  Esq. 
R.  E.  Stephenson,  Esq. 


]\Iansfield  Forbes,  Esq. 
]\Iichie  Forbes,  Esq. 
Theodore  Forbes,  Esq. 
Wra.  Ashbnrner  INIorgan,  Esq. 
John  Taylor,  ]\I.  D. 
Captain  Vans  Kennedy. 
James  Henderson,  Esq. 
Edward  Eden  Elliot,  Esq. 


*  See  Vol.  I.  p.  99. 


SPEECHES 

or 

MR.  HORNER 
IN    THE     HOUSE    OF    COMMONS, 

REFERKED    TO    IX   THE   TEXT. 


SPEECHES 

OF 

MR.  HORNER 
IN    THE     HOUSE    OF    COMMONS, 

REFERRED    TO    IX    THE    TEXT.* 


I.   ON  THE   REGENCY. 

Dec.  20,  1810. 
(Vol.  ir.  p.  44.) 

"  The  Solicitor- General  (Sir  Thomas  Plomer)  contended, 
that  the  proceeding  in  the  appointment  of  a  Regent,  '  to  exer- 
cise the  powers  and  authorities  of  the  Crown,  in  the  name 
and  on  behalf  of  the  King,  dm-ing  the  continuance  of  his 
Majesty's  present  indisposition,'  by  way  of  a  Bill,  and  that  by 
way  of  an  Address,  were  substantially  the  same  thing,  and 
only  differed  in  the  mode  of  efi'ecting  the  same  object.  It 
was  said,  that  to  use  the  King's  name  in  assenting  to  the  Bill 
was  a  fiction.  But  even  in  the  Address  proposed  by  the 
right  honourable  gentleman,  was  not  the  Regent  desired  to 
act  in  the  name  and  on  the  behalf  of  the  King  ?  Even  under 
a  Regency,  was  not  every  act  of  the  government  still  to  pro- 
ceed in  the  King's  name?  All  this  was  perfectly  proper; 
and  where,  then,  was  the  impropriety  of  the  two  Houses 
ordering  the  Chancellor  to  put  the  Great  Seal  to  a  legislative 
measure  in  the  name  of  the  King  ?  If  the  Regent  was  to  act 
in  the  name  of  the  King,  why  also  might  not  the  Chancellor? 

*  From  Hansard's  Debates.     Sec  note,  Vol.  I.  p.  445.  —  Ed. 

VOL.  II.  42 


494  SPEECHES    IN   PARLIAMENT. 

Suppose  the  King  an  infant,  substantially  no  act  could  be 
done  by  him,  yet  all  the  transactions  of  government  would  be 
conducted  in  his  name ;  though  naturally  incapable,  his  politi- 
cal capacity  would  still  exist ;  and  it  was  precisely  on  this 
ground  that  the  two  Houses,  in  a  case  of  necessity,  were 
authorised  to  order  the  Chancellor  to  affix  the  Great  Seal  to 
an  act  of  legislature." 

Mr.  Horner  then  rose  and  said :  —  Considering  the  prin- 
ciples and  views  of  the  constitution  professed  by  the  learned 
gentleman  who  had  spoken  last,  it  was  no  wonder  he  preferred 
whatever  mode  of  proceeding  was  proposed  by  the  mmister. 
Were  it  not  for  such  authority,  the  learned  gentleman,  con- 
sistently with  his  own  opinions,  might  be  quite  indifferent  to 
the  question,  whether  the  Houses  of  Parliament  ought  to 
proceed  in  this  great  transaction,  by  Bill  or  by  Address.  For, 
in  the  beginning  of  his  speech  he  had  declared,  that  if  this 
House  pretended  to  give  away  the  whole  sovereign  authority 
to  a  particular  person  by  mere  Address,  it  might  as  well  usurp 
to  itself  the  whole  of  the  sovereign  power  in  all  its  branches; 
and  that  he  could  see  no  difference  between  the  one  usurpa- 
tion and  the  other.  What  difference  the  learned  gentleman 
was  able  to  perceive  between  them  in  the  instance  of  a  Bill, 
Avliich  he  could  not  discern  in  an  Address,  he  had  not  ex- 
plained. The  distinction,  however,  between  assuming  the 
royal  power  and  conferring  it  was  so  essential,  that  the  two 
Houses  could  not  lose  sight  of  it  for  an  instant  in  providing 
for  the  necessities  of  the  present  emergency,  without  con- 
founding all  the  functions  of  the  constitution,  and  without 
danger  of  subverting  the  very  foundations  of  the  monarchy. 
It  was  their  duty,  on  the  one  hand,  to  abstain  from  any  the 
smallest  usurpation  of  executive  authority ;  and,  on  the  other, 
to  provide,  with  the  least  possible  delay,  the  means  of  sup- 
plying the  defect  which  had  unhappily  occurred  in  the  per- 
sonal exercise  of  that  authority  by  his  Majesty.  The  learned 
gentleman  had  stated  one  doctrine,  which,  if  correct,  might 
be  thought  a  decisive  objection  at  once  to  the  measure  of  con- 
ferring the  powers  of  Regency  by  Address :  he  said,  that  the 
office  of  Regent  was  one  of  which  the  functions  were  not 


REGENCY    QUESTION.  495 

known  nor  defined,  and  the  authority  of  which  coukl  not  be 
judicially  recognized  in  Westminster-hall;  and  he  demanded, 
in  what  book  of  the  common  law  the  judges  were  to  look  for 
the  description  of  this  officer  and  his  capacities?  He  had 
put  this  question  with  an  air  of  triumph;  yet  the  most  satis- 
factory negative  he  could  receive  in  answer  would  furnish  no 
adequate  reason  for  the  inference  which  he  meant  to  convey. 
The  nature  of  the  office  of  Regent,  and  the  description  of  its 
authority  and  functions,  do  not  belong  to  the  common  law  of 
the  ordinary  courts  of  justice,  but  are  to  be  sought,  where 
they  will  most  distinctly  be  found,  in  the  law  and  custom  of 
parliament.  It  was  too  much  the  practice  both  of  the  right 
honourable  and  the  learned  gentlemen  on  the  Treasury  bench, 
to  make  reference  to  the  common  law  and  the  learning  of  the 
courts  below,  upon  subjects  which  lie  altogether  within  the 
compass  of  the  law  of  parliament ;  a  law,  not  known  at  all 
to  the  professors  of  the  common  law  in  that  capacity ;  of 
which  the  sources  were  coeval  in  antiquity  with  the  common 
law,  and  necessarily  anterior  to  the  statutes ;  which  was  to 
be  collected  only  from  the  Rolls  and  Journals  of  parliament ; 
and  the  supreme  authority  of  which,  within  its  proper  sphere, 
had  been  submitted  to  with  reverence  by  the  most  ancient  as 
well  as  by  all  modern  judges,  and  had  been  appealed  to  by 
the  best  friends  of  liberty  in  the  House  of  Commons  in  all 
former  times.  So  far  was  the  learned  gentleman  from  being 
accurate,  when  he  supposed  that  the  office  of  Regent  was  not 
known  to  the  constitution,  that  the  most  ancient  instance 
preserved  in  our  history  of  what  may  be  called  a  parliamentary 
proceeding,  to  supply  a  defect  in  the  personal  exercise  of  the 
royal  authority,  is  the  nomination  of  a  Regent;  in  the  case 
of  the  Earl  of  Pembroke,  who,  upon  the  accession  of  King 
Henry  the  Third,  an  infant  of  nine  years  of  age,  was  ap- 
pointed Regent  by  the  Great  Council  of  the  Nation  assem- 
bled at  Bristol,  and  carried  on  the  whole  administration  of  the 
government,  with  the  full  authority  of  the  crown,  by  the 
style  and  title  of  "  Rector  Regis  et  Regni."  That  the  office 
of  Regent  was  known  in  all  times  to  the  constitution  and 
the  law  of  parliament,  was  well  proved  by  an  entry  upon 


496  SPEECHES    IN    PARLIAMENT. 

the  Rolls,  respecting  the  appointment  of  Richard  Dake  of 
York  to  be  Protector  during  the  illness  of  Henry  the  Sixth. 
The  Parliament  of  that  day  thought  fit  to  give  him  only  a 
limited  authority ;  and  to  that  effect  entered  a  declaration 
upon  the  Roll,  that  they  would  not  confer  upon  him  the 
name  of  Regent,  because  it  imported  authority  of  govern- 
ment of  the  land,  but  only  the  name  of  Protector,  which  im- 
ported a  personal  duty  of  attendance  to  the  defence  of  the 
kingdom.  It  was  not  to  be  doubted,  that  if  the  Prince  of 
Wales  should  take  the  style  and  authority  of  Regent  in  pur- 
suance of  an  Address  of  the  two  Houses,  the  courts  of  law 
would  be  bound  to  recognize  his  authority  as  that  of  the 
crown.  And  though  it  might  be  fit,  after  he  had  assumed  the 
royal  style,  and  had  met  his  parliament,  that  an  act  should 
pass  to  confirm  his  title,  and  to  ratify  those  proceedings  of 
the  two  Houses;  yet  it  was  no  more  to  be  supposed,  that, 
prior  to  such  ratification,  the  judges  would  dispute  an  au- 
thority which  the  two  Houses  had  directed  his  royal  highness 
to  assume,  than,  if  the  two  Houses  should  prefer  the  fiction 
of  a  Bill,  that  the  judges  would  presume  to  canvass  the  va- 
lidity of  the  fiction.  The  difficulty  which  the  learned  gentle- 
man had  raised,  with  respect  to  the  legal  authority  of  a 
Regent  appointed  by  Address,  was  never  felt  with  respect  to 
the  authority  of  the  Guardians  and  Lords  Justices,  who,  re- 
peatedly since  the  Revolution,  have  been  appointed  by  com- 
mission from  the  King.  By  the  terms  of  such  commissions, 
they  were  invested  with  power  to  execute  the  office  of  Guar- 
dians and  Justices,  and  to  order  all  acts  of  government  which 
by  virtue  of  that  office  had  been  usual  or  might  be  lawfully 
performed.  The  books  of  common  law,  however,  furnish  no 
special  delineation  of  the  legal  capacity  and  functions  of  such 
officers ;  the  nature  and  extent  of  whose  authority  must  be 
gathered  from  the  usage  and  practice  of  the  realm,  as  recorded 
in  the  memorials  of  parliament  and  in  the  archives  of  the 
state.  —  The  same  learned  gentleman  had  urged  as  an  objec- 
tion, what  if  the  House  of  Lords  should  not  agree  to  your 
Address?  To  this  argument,  it  was  enough  to  answer  by 
another  objection,  what  if  the   House   of  Lords   should   not 


REGENCY     QUESTION.  497 

agree  to  your  Bill?  Were  such  a  difficulty  to  arise  in  either 
case,  we  must  trust  in  the  prudence  and  public  spirit  of  both 
Houses,  and  in  their  mutual  disposition  sincerely  to  effect 
what  must  be  a  joint  transaction,  and  which  may  therefore 
require  some  concessions. 

He  would  admit  to  the  Chancellor  of  the  Exchequer,  that 
the  present  qu(?stion  was  to  be  debated  upon  the  ground  of 
parliamentary  precedents;  understanding  always,  that  iio 
single  precedent  could  over-rule  either  express  law,  or  settled 
and  fundamental  principles.  In  this  point  of  view,  the  ques- 
tion was  nearly  reduced  to  a  choice  between  the  precedent  of 
the  Revolution,  and  that  of  the  year  1788.  But  as  something 
had  been  said  by  the  Attorney-General,  of  the  proceedings 
which  took  place  in  the  reign  of  King  Henry  the  Sixth,  he 
would  advert  shortly  to  the  history  of  those  proceedings ;  be- 
cause, in  all  the  circumstances,  which  could  be  considered  as 
applicable  to  the  present  situation  of  the  two  Houses  of  Par- 
liament, that  history  would  be  found  full  of  instruction,  in 
opposition  to  the  arguments  of  those  who  would  urge  the  two 
Houses  to  usurp  the  prerogative  of  the  third  branch  of  the 
legislature.  The  transactions,  which  occurred  in  the  reign  of 
Henry  VI.,  consisted  of  two  parts  :  the  provision  made  for  the 
executive  administration  during  his  infancy,  and  the  measures 
taken  by  parliament  towards  the  close  of  his  reign,  when  he 
fell  into  a  malady  similar  to  that  with  which  his  present  Ma- 
jesty is  afflicted.  The  case  of  the  minority  of  Henry  the  Sixth 
differed  wholly  from  the  present:  by  the  demise  of  the  pre- 
ceding king,  the  parliament  then  in  being  expired ;  and  when 
a  nev/  parliament  met,  to  consider  of  the  means  of  providing 
for  the  infant  king's  minority,  it  was  a  full  parliament  regu- 
larly convoked  and  opened,  at  which  all  the  three  branches  of 
the  legislature  were  present.  As  soon  as  the  news  of  Henry 
the  Fifth's  death  reached  England,  several  peers  of  the  realm 
held  a  council  at  Windsor ;  and,  taking  it  upon  themselves 
under  their  responsibility  to  provide  for  the  imminent  neces- 
sity of  the  State,  they  put  the  Great  Seal  to  a  writ  for  sum- 
moning a  parliament,  and  authorising  Humphrey  Duke  of 
Gloucester  to  hold  that  parliament  as   Commissioner  in  the 

42* 


498  SPEECHES    IN    PARLIAMENT. 

King's  name.  In  the  parliament,  so  held,  the  crown  was 
fully  represented  in  its  legislative  capacity  by  the  DuUe  of 
Gloucester :  and  with  perfect  regularity  according  to  all  the 
forms  of  law,  after  an  indemnity  to  those  who  had  acted  in 
this  emergency  and  a  confirmation  of  their  acts,  the  parlia- 
ment (consisting  of  the  King  represented  by  his  Commis- 
sioner, the  Lords  spiritual  and  temporal,  and  the  Commons,) 
appointed  the  Duke  of  Bedford  Protector  of  the  realm.  Such 
appointment,  by  a  full  parliament,  is  no  precedent  to  justify 
the  proposed  appointment  by  the  two  Houses  alone  in  the 
name  of  a  full  parliament.  The  same  observation  applies  to 
the  proceedings  which  took  place,  in  the  nomination  of  a 
Protector,  when  King  Henry  the  Sixth  fell  into  a  state  of 
imbecility  or  lethargy,  which  disabled  him  from  personally 
exercising  the  functions  of  government.  But  it  is  important 
to  attend  to  the  course  of  those  proceedings.  Before  the 
king  sunk  into  that  unhappy  state,  he  had  opened  his  parlia- 
ment in  person;  which,  after  several  prorogations  under  the 
authority  of  regular  commissions,  was  actually  assembled  at 
the  time  when  the  disorder  seized  him.  It  was  still  a  full 
parliament,  though  he  was  himself  unable  to  attend  it,  be- 
cause he  was  legally  represented  there  by  his  Commissioner, 
or  lieutenant  for  holding  the  parliament,  the  Duke  of  York, 
appointed  by  letters  patent  from  the  king  himself.  And  it  is 
material  to  observe,  that  the  Commissioner  for  holding  par- 
liaments, at  that  period  of  our  constitution,  had,  by  the  terms 
of  his  written  authority  and  by  the  constant  practice  of  the 
state,  the  entire  legislative  powers  of  the  king;  he  opened 
the  causes  of  summons,  he  could  prorogue,  he  could  dissolve 
it,  he  gave  the  royal  assent  or  negative  to  bills  and  petitions 
according  to  his  own  ministerial,  and,  no  doubt,  responsible 
discretion.  At  a  subsequent  period,  it  became  the  settled 
practice  of  the  constitution,  that  the  royal  assent  was  never 
given  in  the  absence  of  the  king  himself,  except  under  a 
special  commission  reciting  that  his  majesty  had  seen  and 
perfectly  understood  the  particular  bill  assented  to :  but  prior 
to  the  accession  of  the  Tudor  line,  and  during  the  whole 
reign  of  Henry  VI.,  the  constitution  of  parliament  was  dif- 


REGENCY     QUESTION.  499 

fercnt  in  this  respect;  the  Commissioner,  authorised  by  the 
king's  letters  patent  to  hold  the  parliament,  having  jKnver  to 
give  the  royal  assent  without  taking  the  king's  ])leasi:ire. 
When  Henry  VI.  therefore  became  deranged,  the  Duke  of 
York  being  Commissioner,  there  was  no  imperfection  in  the 
parliament ;  it  was  complete  in  all  its  branches,  and  com- 
petent for  all  legislative  measures.  We  find  accordingly, 
that,  notwithstanding  the  incapacity  of  the  king  to  attend 
his  parliament,  its  proceedings  went  on  without  interruption  ; 
and  it  was  not  deemed  necessary  to  supply  the  defect  in  the 
exercise  of  the  royal  authority.  An  event  at  length  occurred, 
which  imposed  upon  parliament  the  necessity  of  interposing, 
in  order  to  provide  the  means  of  supplying  that  defect.  The 
keeper  of  the  Great  Seal  died  ;  parliament  was  not  competent 
to  appoint  a  new  one ;  that  must  be  a  personal  act  of  the 
king  himself.  It  was  necessary  to  vest  the  royal  authority 
in  some  person,  who,  by  virtue  of  that  authority,  could  de- 
liver the  Great  Seal  and  create  a  Lord  Chancellor.  In  this 
emergency,  the  parliament,  consisting  of  all  its  three  branches, 
(the  Duke  of  York  as  Commissioner  or  lieutenant  of  the 
King,  the  Lords  spiritual  and  temporal,  and  the  Commons, 
in  full  parliament  assembled,)  by  Bill,  which  passed  the  two 
Houses,  and  to  which  the  Commissioner,  as  in  the  ordinary 
course,  gave  the  royal  assent,  nominated  the  Duke  of  York 
during  the  incapacity  of  the  king,  to  be  Protector  of  the 
kingdom,  and  first  of  the  council.  It  is  clear,  that  this 
furnishes  nothing  like  a  precedent  for  proceeding,  in  the  two 
Houses,  without  the  presence  of  the  third  branch,  actual  or 
represented,  to  manufacture  a  royal  assent ;  while,  on  the  other 
hand,  it  shows  how  scrupulous  the  two  Houses  were,  at  that 
period,  of  assuming,  or  pretending  to  exercise  in  their  own 
capacity,  any  of  the  executive  prerogatives  of  the  crown. 

With  respect  to  the  great  precedent  of  the  Revolution  in 
1688,  the  Chancellor  of  the  Exchequer  had  contented  himself 
with  disposing  of  it  in  the  most  summary  manner.  Premis- 
ing in  general  terms,  that  if  there  is  a  direct  precedent  we 
ought  not  to  resort  to  one  which  holds  only  by  analogy 
(which,    as  a   general   maxim,  was    not  to  be  denied) ;    the 


500  SPEECHES    IN    PARLIAMENT. 

Chancellor  of  the  Exchequer  was  then  pleased  to  affirm  that 
the  case  of  1788  was  direct,  and  that  of  the  Revolution  a  pre- 
cedent only  by  analogy  ;  but  without  showing,  why  it  was  to 
be  regarded  as  no  more  than  analogical.  So  far  as  the  mode 
and  order  of  proceeding  were  concerned,  the  measures  taken 
by  the  Convention  Parliament  formed  strictly  a  direct  prece- 
dent. True,  the  political  capacity  of  the  king  was  then  sus- 
pended, which  at  present  suffers  no  discontinuance  ;  the  Con- 
vention of  that  day  had  a  greater  defect  to  supply,  than  is 
HOW  to  be  provided  for.  But  the  principle,  which  authorises 
an  extraordinary  interposition  of  the  states  of  the  realm,  is  in 
both  cases  precisely  the  same  ;  the  necessity  is  of  the  same 
kind;  the  proceeding  must  bear  the  same  character ;  the  dif- 
ference in  the  extent  of  the  defect  that  is  to  be  supplied  does 
not  require  a  different  mode  and  form  of  supplying  it.  Or  if 
a  stricter  adherence  to  the  established  forms  of  legislation 
were  required  in  one  case  than  in  the  other,  and  if  procrastina- 
tion were  more  justifiable  ;  delay  was  more  to  be  justified, 
and  solemn  formality  more  to  be  desired,  where  the  work  to 
be  accomplished  was  of  greater  magnitude,  where,  instead  of 
naming  a  provisional  Regent,  they  had  to  raise  a  new  line  of 
succession  to  the  crown.  And  if,  upon  the  abstract  principles 
of  the  constitution,  any  difference  could  be  stated,  between 
the  situation  of  the  Convention  and  that  of  the  two  Houses 
at  present,  it  would  be  this ;  that  when  the  political  capacity 
of  the  crown  was  in  the  former  instance  discontinued,  the 
whole  power  of  the  crown,  legislative  as  well  as  executive, 
might  theoretically  be  considered  as  devolving  upon  the  states 
of  the  realm,  so  that  without  usurpation  they  might  have 
used,  and  have  affixed  to  their  proceeding,  the  forms  of  assent 
by  the  third  branch  of  the  legislature ;  whereas,  while  the 
throne  is  full,  it  is  mere  usurpation  to  seize  the  king's  legisla- 
tive power,  as  it  is  an  absurdity  in  terms  that  the  means  of 
supplying  the  royal  incapacity  must  have  the  sanction  of  the 
form  of  royal  assent.  The  great  statesmen  and  lawyers,  who 
accomplished  the  Revolution,  were  incapable  of  such  fictions 
and  unsound  refinements  as  compose  the  proceedings  of 
1788  ;   they  went  straight  to   their  object,  guided  by  those 


REGENCY    QUESTION.  501 

analogies  of  the  constiiution  which  preserve  the  spirit  of  its 
rules  in  the  exceptions  that  seem  most  wide.  Those  to  whom 
the  contrivances  of  1788  ought  to  be  ascribed,  had  secretly  no 
predilection  for  the  event  of  the  Revolution  or  for  the  charac- 
ters that  were  engaged  in  it.  Indeed  on  this  day  it  had  been 
spoken  of  more  than  once  with  a  slight,  which  no  former 
House  of  Commons  would  have  borne.  The  Chancellor  of 
the  Exchequer  called  it  a  taking  precedent ;  a  sneer,  however 
unbecoming,  which  he  trusted  they,  at  whom  it  was  directed, 
would  long  continue  to  merit,  by  their  adherence  to  those 
memorable  principles,  and  by  their  determination  to  act  upon 
the  same  in  all  similar  emergencies.  Another  right  honour- 
able gentleman  (Mr.  Canning)  had  spoken  of  the  leaders  of 
the  Revolution,  in  terms  of  praise  indeed,  but  with  such 
qualifications  as  if  forsooth  they  stood  in  need  of  pardon,  for 
the  length  to  which  they  had  gone,  impelled  by  a  just  neces- 
sity. Yet,  not  the  talents  which  shone  among  those  illus- 
trious men,  nor  even  the  flame  of  liberty  by  which  they  were 
inspired,  were  more  admirable,  than  the  moderation  with 
which  they  proceeded  through  their  great  work.  And  when 
the  Committee  is  called  upon  to  compare  their  proceedings 
with  those  of  1788,  and  to  choose  between  them,  it  is  impos- 
sible not  to  contrast  the  virtuous  forbearance  of  all  parties  at 
the  Revolution  in  concurring  to  provide  for  the  public  in- 
terests, with  the  struggle  that  was  made  for  power  in  the 
other  instance  ;  and  above  all,  to  contrast  the  studied  delays 
by  which  power  was  then  so  factiously  retained,  with  the 
despatch  with  which  our  ancestors  finished  in  one  short  month 
their  task  of  establishing  at  once  the  succession  to  the  crown, 
reducing  its  prerogatives  within  limitations  by  law,  and 
founding  the  whole  structure  of  oin*  civil  and  religious  liber- 
ties. The  right  honourable  gentleman  (Mr.  Canning)  had 
said,  that  some  of  the  arguments,  used  in  the  debates  at  the 
Revolution,  furnished  a  sort  of  authority  in  favour  of  our 
proceeding  in  the  present  instance  by  a  Bill  rather  than  by 
Address  ;  because  the  Tories,  who  dissented  from  the  famous 
vote  of  abdication,  insisted,  that  the  case  ought  to  be  pro- 
vided for  as  if  the   king  had  become  a  lunatic,  and  urged  the 


502  SPEECHES    IN    PARLIAMENT. 

propriety  of  appointing  a  regent  for  the  life  of  King  James, 
according  to  the  ancient  laws  and  practice  of  the  realm.  The 
topic,  however,  as  used  then,  had  no  bearing  upon  the  present 
question.  It  was  not  used  with  reference  to  the  form  of 
proceeding;  no  question  of  that  sort  was  raised,  and  no  one 
objected  then  to  the  Address.  It  was  urged  by  the  Tories 
in  illustration  of  their  doctrine,  in  which  they  fundamentally 
differed  from  the  others,  that  the  misconduct  of  the  king 
was  to  be  held  as  making  a  forfeiture  only  for  his  own  life, 
without  breaking  the  succession.  The  just  conclusion  to  be 
drawn,  was  therefore  the  reverse  of  that  of  the  right  honour- 
able gentleman ;  that  when  the  Tories  of  that  day  supposed 
a  case  of  lunacy  in  the  sovereign,  they  considered  it  fit 
indeed,  that  the  vacancy  should  be  filled  by  a  regent  accord- 
ing to  the  ancient  practice  of  the  realm,  but  it  never  occurred 
to  them  that  an  Address  was  not  the  most  proper  mode  of 
appointing  him.  And  from  this  the  Solicitor-General  might 
learn,  that  the  Tories  at  the  Revolution,  some  of  whom  were 
most  eminent  lawyers,  had  no  difficulty  in  recognising  a 
regency  as  an  office  known  to  the  laws  and  the  constitution. 

Opposed  to  the  high  authority  of  the  Convention  Parlia- 
ment, stood  the  single  precedent  of  1788  and  1789.  He  was 
at  that  period  too  young  a  man,  to  have  received  any  of  the 
impressions,  which  the  agitation  and  resentments  of  that  time 
may  have  left  upon  those  who  took  a  part  in  the  scene.  He 
had,  without  any  bias  upon  his  mind,  endeavoured  to  judge 
candidly  of  the  whole  proceeding,  and  of  its  historical  circum- 
stances, no  unimportant  part  of  every  parliamentary  precedent. 
And  he  had  no  hesitation  to  say,  that  the  Resolution,  which 
asserts  the  right  of  the  two  Houses  to  provide  for  the  exigency, 
commanded  his  full  assent,  both  as  the  true  result  of  more 
ancient  precedents,  and  as  a  principle  of  constitutional  law : 
provided  it  be  understood  in  the  sense,  in  which  it  was  clear 
that  the  Houses  of  1788  understood  it,  as  declaratory  of  their 
right  and  duty  to  vest  the  royal  authority  in  proper  hands,  but 
carrying  no  implication  that  the  two  Houses  can  ever  them- 
selves legally  assume  the  exercise  of  any  of  the  functions  of 
royal  authority.     AVith   regard,  however,  to   the  other  part  of 


REGENCY    QUESTION.  503 

the  precedent  of  1788,  the  Resolution  to  which  the  comnnittec 
was  now  called  to  assent,  and  by  which  the  two  Houses  pro- 
posed to  raise  the  fiction  of  a  royal  assent  by  usurping  the 
king's  Great  Seal,  that  appeared  to  him  so  repugnant  to  the 
fundamental  maxims  of  the  constitution,  if  not  a  direct  viola- 
tion of  express  law,  that  no  weight  of  precedent  could  ever 
sanction  it,  far  less  a  single  case  so  discredited  by  its  own  cir- 
cumstances as  that  of  1788.  The  Chancellor  of  the  Exche- 
quer had  attempted  to  show,  that  the  proceedings  of  1788 
were  more  than  a  precedent  of  the  two  Houses  assembled  as 
at  present ;  as  if,  by  what  passed  subsequently,  they  had  been 
converted  into  a  precedent  of  the  full  parliament.  His  first 
argument  for  this  purpose  was,  that  various  bills  were  brought 
in,  and  proceeded  through  their  several  stages  in  both  Houses, 
while  the  parliament  sat  under  the  commission  (as  it  may  be 
described)  from  the  two  Houses,  which  bills,  after  the  King  had 
met  his  parliament  by  a  regular  commission,  received  the 
royal  assent,  without  again  going  through  the  previous  stages. 
But  the  argument  was  incomplete,  unless  the  right  honour- 
able gentleman  denied,  that  the  two  Houses,  as  assembled  in 
their  present  circumstances,  were  incompetent  to  receive  bills 
and  to  forward  through  all  the  proper  steps,  to  await  the  royal 
assent.  The  right  honourable  gentleman,  he  was  persuaded, 
would  be  deterred,  by  the  practical  consequences  of  such  a 
proposition,  from  maintaining  it ;  nor  could  it  be  maintained. 
The  parliament  was  in  legal  existence,  by  force  of  the  original 
writ  of  summons ;  the  two  Houses  of  Parliament,  though  not 
now  in  parliament  assembled  on  account  of  the  absence  of  the 
King,  were  regularly  assembled  here  by  authority  of  the 
King's  last  writ  of  prorogation,  which  called  them  to  West- 
minster on  the  1st  November  last.  Their  adjournment  on 
that  day  was  as  much  an  act  of  the  parliamentary  capacity  of 
each  House,  as  any  vote  upon  a  bill  could  be.  Here  as- 
sembled, under  the  writ  of  prorogation,  they  had  all  their 
privileges  and  capacities  in  full  force ;  though  the  proceedings 
which  they  might  hold  by  bill  could  not  be  completed,  with- 
out the  King's  assent.  If  the  two  Houses,  as  now  met  with- 
out any  commission,  could  pass  a  bill  through  the  stages  of 


504  SPEECHES    IN    TARLIAMENT. 

each  House,  there  was  an  end  of  the  argument  of  the  right 
honourable  gentleman  that  the  subsequent  assent  in  1789  to 
certain    bills,  sanctioned   the   commission  given  by  the  two 
Houses;    and  that  they   could   entertain    bills    without    any 
commission  at  all,  was  implied  in  the  whole  of  the  proceeding 
which  he  himself  recommended.     The  other  argument  of  the 
right    honourable   gentleman    to   this    point    was    still    more 
inconclusive ;  he  went  so  far  as  to  say,  that  the  Resolution 
having  been  agi-eed  to  by  both  Houses,  and  the  King,  after 
his  recovery    having,  in   the    speech    of    his    commissioners, 
thanked  the  Houses  for  the  additional  proof  they  had  given 
of  attachment  to  his  person,  it  was  to  be  inferred  that  the 
resolution    had    thus    received   the   assent   of    all   the   three 
branches  of  parliament.     If  this   had  any  meaning,  the  argu- 
ment  was    this,  that  the    expression    in    the    King's    speech 
echoed  by  the    addresses,  should    be    considered    as    having 
ratified,  by   the    voice  of  the    three    branches    assembled    in 
parliament,  the   irregular   proceedings  of  the  two   Houses  in 
their    preceding    irregular   assembly.     It   was    the    first  time 
that  the   King's   speech  and  its  address  were  stated  to  have 
the  character  and  efficacy  of  an  act  of  parliament;  if  a  ratifi- 
cation or  an  indemnity  had  been  required,  that  was  surely 
no  act  of  ratification  and  indemnity ;  but  assuming,  as  the 
right  honourable  gentleman   assumed  by  his   argument,  that 
the  proceedings  stood  in  need  of  such  confirmation,  the  true 
inference  was,  that,  as  there  had  been  no  indemnity  granted 
and  no  ratification  passed,  those  proceedings  were  left  and 
still  remained  in  all  their  original  irregularity.     Though  the 
precedent  of  1788,  however,  could  not  be  argued  as  high  as 
the  Chancellor  of  the  Exchequer  wished  to  raise  it;  though 
it  was  not  a  precedent  in  full  parliament,  it  was  certainly,  in 
point  of  form,  a  precedent  for  the  two  Houses  assembled  in 
the    peculiar   circumstances   of  their  present    situation.      As 
such,  it  stands  in  opposition  to  that  of  the  Revolution ;  and 
it  was  for  the   Committee  to  weigh  and  compare  them  to- 
gether; to  compare    a  precedent,   to   the    form  of  which  no 
objection  was  larged  at  the  time  by  those  who  most  disliked 
its  substance,  which  had  been  stamped  with  the  sanction  of 


REGENCY    QUESTION.  505 

an  ap)3roving  posterity,  to  which  no  objection  in  point  of 
principle  could  even  now  be  stated,  with  another  precedent 
which  at  the  time  and  ever  since  had  been  condemned  by- 
high  parliamentary  authorities,  and  which  was  liable  to  the 
strongest  objections  both  from  express  laws  and  from  consti- 
tutional principles. 

The  statute  of  the  13th  of  Charles  11.  made  it  a  praemunire 
to  maintain,  that  both  Houses  of  Parliament,  or  either,  had  a 
legislative  power  without  the  king:  yet  the  object  of  this  Re- 
solution was,  to  assume  a  legislative  power  by  the  two  Houses 
without  the  king.  That  statute  was  levelled  at  the  doctrines 
as  well  as  the  conduct  of  the  Long  Parliament ;  nor  since 
the  time  of  that  parliament,  had  such  doctrine  and  such  lan- 
guage been  heard  within  these  walls,  as  the  ministers  had  this 
day  used  to  serve  the  purpose  of  the  day.  The  Long  Parlia- 
ment, indeed,  did  not  scruple  to  make  a  Great  Seal  for  them- 
selves ;  to  justify  the  measure,  they  resorted  to  many  of  the 
topics  which  had  been  urged  this  day;  their  antiquarian 
pamphleteer  Prynne  used  and  perverted  his  toilsome  industry 
and  obscure  erudition,  in  an  argument  for  the  parliament;  and 
some  of  the  expressions  which  fell  from  the  Chancellor  of  the 
Exchequer  seemed  to  have  been  taken  from  the  title  of  Prynne's 
pamphlet,  which  is,  That  the  Great  Seal  attends  the  Parlia- 
ment. In  speaking  of  the  Long  Parliament,  he  wished  not  to 
be  misunderstood,  or  to  be  supposed  deficient  in  veneration 
for  those  able  patriots,  who,  in  the  commencement  of  the 
struggle,  disappointed  as  it  was  in  the  end,  and  stained  by 
lawless  ambition  and  atrocious  violence,  had  stood  forth  to 
vindicate  our  just  liberties,  and  to  bring  delinquents  to  con- 
dign punishment.  The  flight  of  King  Charles  to  York,  and 
his  stealth  of  the  Great  Seal,  justified  their  subsequent  step; 
it  was  justified  by  the  necessities  of  the  state,  which  must 
over-rule  other  considerations ;  but  let  not  those,  who  neither 
have  the  necessities  of  the  Long  Parliament  to  plead,  nor  are 
actuated  by  their  constitutional  principles,  imitate  their  usurp- 
ation where  there  is  no  similar  necessity,  and  borrow  their 
language  and  arguments  to  give  practical  effect  to  principles 
of  a  very  different  description.     Besides  the  evidence,  which 

VOL.  II.  43 


50G  SPEECHES    IN    PARLIAMENT. 

the  statute  of  Charles  II.  aflbrded,  of  the  great  doctrine  of  the 
law,  that  there  is  no  legislative  power  in  the  Houses  of  Parlia- 
ment without  the  king,  there  were  express  acts  of  parliament 
which    prescribed   the  mode,  and   prohibited   every  other,  of 
giving  the  royal  assent  to  bills  passed  by  the  two  Houses. 
The  33d  of  Henry  VIII.,  chapter  21,  declares,  that  the  king's 
assent  by  his  letters   patent,  notified  in  his  absence  to  both 
Houses   assembled  together  in   the  upper  chamber  of  parlia- 
ment, is  of  the  same   force  as  if  personally  and  publicly  de- 
clared by  himself;  bat  the  letters  must  not  only  be  under  his 
Great  Seal,  but  they  must  be  signed  with  his  own  hand.     The 
act  of  the   first   year  of  Philip  and    Mary  respecting  the   at- 
tainder of  the  Duke   of  Norfolk,  which   is   a  public   statute, 
contains  a  still  more  explicit  declaration  of  the  law,  that  letters 
patent  for  giving  the  royal  assent  to  bills   have  no  validity  or 
efficacy,  unless  signed  with  the  king's  own  hand,  as  well  as 
passed  under  the  Great  Seal.     The  commission,  under  which 
the  royal  assent  was  pretended  to  be  given,  on  the  last  day  of 
Henry  the  Eighth's  life,  to  the  bill  for  attainting  the  Duke  of 
Norfolk,  had  the   Great   Seal  in  due  form;  it  had  also  the 
kino-'s  name  affixed  by  a  stamp:  but  at  the  time  these  forms 
were  o-one  through,  King  Henry  was  insensible  and  incapable 
of  attending  to  public  business.     In  the  first  year  of  Philip 
and  Mary,  after  an  inquiry  into  the  transaction  respecting  this 
commission,   and  upon   a  confession  of  these  circumstances 
before  the  House  of  Commons  by  Lord  Paget,  who  had  been 
King    Henry's    Secretary   of    State  at   the    time,   parliament 
removed  the  attainder ;  not  in  the  ordinary  form,  by  a  bill  to 
reverse  the  act  of  attainder,  but,  which   is  most  material  in 
the   present  argument,  by  a  bill  declaring  that  act  to  have 
been  void  from  the  beginning,  expressly  for  want  of  the  royal 
assent  in  due  form.     Before  this  proceeding  took  place  in  par- 
liament,  a   question  had  been  raised   in    Westminster  Hall, 
whether  that  act  of  attainder  could  be  regarded  even  there  as 
a  perfect  statute,   on   account  of  the   manner  in  which   the 
assent    had   been    given.      The    Solicitor-General,    who    had 
called  so  loudly  for  references  to  the  law  books,  would  find  in 
Sir  James  Dyer's  Reports  that  the  question  was  much  debated 


REGENCY    QUESTION.  -307 

among  the  justices,  in  a  suit  between  the  duke  and  certain 
purchasers  of  some  of  his  forfeited  estates ;  and  although  the 
judicial  determination  of  the  point  was  superseded  by  the 
parliamentary  reversal,  it  might  be  well  for  the  learned  gentle- 
man to  consider,  whether  to  his  mind  the  existence  of  such  a 
judicial  doubt  ought  not  to  hold  good  as  an  argument  against 
proceeding  to  make  a  regent  by  a  bill  in  the  manner  proposed, 
lest  the  justices  hereafter  might  take  it  into  debate  whether  a 
bill  assented  to  by  the  phantom  were  a  perfect  statute. 

But  how  strong  soever  the  reasons  against  such  a  proceed- 
ing might  be  thought,  founded  upon  the  express  statute  law 
of  the  land,  it  was  still  more  strongly  condemned  by  the 
essential  first  principles  of  the  constitution  of  the  monarchy. 
It  was  a  proposal  to  break  down  and  confound  all  the  boun- 
daries of  legislative  authority,  as  distributed  among  the  three 
independent  branches  of  parliament;  to  usurp  the  legislative 
power  of  the  crown ;  and,  by  a  gross  and  illegal  fiction,  to 
steal  the  semblance  of  an  assent  where  there  could  be  no 
negative,  with  the  absurdity  of  affecting  to  sanction  by  the 
royal  assent  itself,  the  remedy  made  necessary  by  the  inca- 
pacity of  the  King  to  assent  to  any  thing.  Such  was  the 
measure,  which  the  Committee  were  called  upon  to  prefer  to 
the  direct  and  clear  precedent  of  the  Revolution.  .  They  had 
to  choose  between  a  contrivance,  the  purpose  of  which,  though 
denied,  was  palpable;  a  fiction,  which  could  only  be  executed 
by  a  parliamentary  falsehood  and  fraud,  which  must  be 
attended  with  indefinite  delay,  which  would  involve  their  pro- 
ceedings in  a  maze  of  complex  and  inconsistent  forms ;  the 
invention,  it  was  well  known,  of  a  refining  lawyer,  more  ad- 
dicted to  scholastic  subtilties  and  the  caprices  of  ingenuity, 
than  remarkable  for  enlargement  of  mind:  they  had  to  choose 
between  this,  and  the  explicit,  plain,  prompt  course  adopted 
at  the  Revolution,  by  the  best  of  our  ancestors  at  the  best 
sera  of  our  history,  a  precedent  formed  by  statesmen  of  much 
experience  and  large  views,  and  by  lawyers,  who,  with  all  the 
learning  of  their  profession,  were  found  no  unequal  associates 
to  such  statesmen. 


508  SPEECHES   IN   PARLIAMENT. 


II.     CORN  LAWS. 

1.3th  and  16tli  May,  1814. 
(Vol.  II.  p.  IGO.) 

Tin:  House  having  resumed  the  consideration  of  a  report 
respecting  the  Corn  Laws,  the  Chancellor  of  the  Exchequer 
(Mr.  Vansittart)  said,  —  "He  was  of  opinion  that  some  of  the 
resolutions  that  had  been  proposed  would  require  further  de- 
liberation, and  he  should  wish  the  subject,  so  far  as  related  to 
them,  to  be  postponed :  but  so  convinced  was  he  of  the  pro- 
priety of  the  resolution  for  allowing  an  unrestrained  export, 
that  he  should  be  unwilling  to  postpone  it  for  a  single  day." 
After  some  other  members  had  spoken, 

Mr.  HoRxNER  rose,  and  said:  —  He  thought  that  when  the 
House  came  to  consider  the  other  resolutions,  it  would  see 
the  propriety  of  pausing,  at  least  for  some  time,  before  it  went 
to  a  decision  on  so  very  important  a  measure  ;  he  wished  that, 
once  for  all,  the  House  would  now  decide  on  the  interest  by 
which  thos.e  were  actuated  who  opposed  the  resolutions.  The 
real  interests  of  the  consumer  and  of  the  landlord  were  one 
and  the  same.  But  what  did  the  committee  profess  to  do  ? 
Why  to  raise  the  price  to  the  consumer — (a  member  called 
out  No!  no!).  He  would  ask  whether  the  honourable  mem- 
ber for  the  Queen's  County  (Sir  H.  Parnell)  had  not  acknowl- 
edged this  on  a  former  occasion ;  and  if  the  honourable 
member  who  favoured  him  with  the  interruption  took  pains 
to  inquire,  he  would  find  it  was  so.  The  necessary  effect  of 
the  measure  was  permanently  to  increase  the  price  of  corn. 
He  approved,  however,  of  some  parts  of  the  view  which  his 
right  honourable  friend  the  Chancellor  of  the  Exchequer  had 
taken  of  the  question. 

[The  first  resolution  was  agreed  to,  and  a  bill  to  permit  the 
exportation  of  corn  from  any  part  of  the  United  Kingdom, 
without  payment  of  duty  or  receiving  of  bounty,  was  ordered 


THE   CORN    LAWS.  509 

to  be  brought  in.  This  was  done  by  the  Chancellor  of  the 
Exchequer  on  the  16th  of  May,  when  it  was  read  a  first  time. 
The  same  day  Mr.  Hnskisson  moved  the  farther  consideration 
of  the  resolutions  of  the  Corn  Committee.  On  the  5th  of 
May  he  had  proposed  the  adoption  of  a  graduating  scale, 
between  24^.  per  quarter,  when  wheat  should  be  at  or  under 
635.  per  quarter,  and  Is.  when  the  price  should  rise  to  86^.  and 
upwards.  The  second  resolution  now  proposed  contained  the 
terms  of  that  graduating  scale ;  the  third  resolution  proposed 
that  foreign  corn  should  at  all  times  be  imported  and  ware- 
housed free  of  all  duty,  until  taken  out  for  home  consumption, 
and  should  at  all  times  be  reexported  free  of  all  daty.] 

Mr.  Horner  on  this  occasion  said:  —  He  was  anxious  to 
show  his  reasons  for  the  vote  he  should  give  that  night,  begging 
this  only  to  be  kept  in  view,  that  if  the  principle  of  prevent- 
ing the  importation  of  grain  was  to  be  adopted,  the  most 
effectual  mode  in  which  it  could  be  adopted  was  the  best. 
The  right  honourable  gentleman  on  the  other  side  had  failed 
in  convincing  him,  that  there  was  any  occasion  for  departing 
from  that  system,  in  regard  to  the  corn  laws,  which  had  hith- 
erto prevailed.  He  was  far  from  thinking  that  freedom  in 
any  trade  was  bad  in  itself,  or  that  such  a  system  was  imprac- 
ticable in  regard  to  corn ;  but  he  thought  it  best  that  the  sys- 
tem now  in  practice  as  to  the  corn  trade  should  be  kept  in 
view,  unless  reasons  were  made  out  for  the  departure  from  it. 
He  was  aware  that  commerce  should  always  give  way  to 
higher  reasons  of  state;  but  it  appeared  to  him  that  there  was 
here  no  such  reason  ;  and,  in  addition,  it  also  appeared  to  him 
that  the  present  was  the  very  worst  season  for  proposing  any 
change  in  this  system.  He  could  not  help  particularly  re- 
marking the  great  difference  of  opinion  that  prevailed  on  this 
second  resolution,  as  to  which  no  two  members  who  approved 
of  it  concurred  in  the  reasons  on  which  that  concurrence  was 
founded.  He  was  unwilling,  therefore,  to  go  into  a  detail  of 
his  reasons  why  he  wished  this  resolution  to  be  postponed.  He 
did  so,  taking  into  consideration  the  state  of  the  manufactures 
of  this  country,  and  the  persons  in  foreign  markets  whom  we 
were  to  meet  with.     He  thought  that  this  resolution  ought  to 

43* 


510  SPEECHES    IN   PARLIAMENT. 

be  postponed,  not  because  there  was  not  time  enough  to  con- 
sider it;  but  because  of  the  change  of  circumstances  which 
might  be  expected  to  take   place  with  regard  to  our  foreign 
relations ;  and  because  there  was  not  now  time  for  us  to  see 
in  what  posture  the  trade  of  this   country  as  to  our  foreign 
relations  was  likely  to  stand.     If  the  House  were  to  postpone 
this   part  of  the   subject,  he  should  have  the  satisfaction   of 
thinking,  from  reflecting  on  the  Bill  which  had  been  brought 
in  this  day,  and  to  which  there  was  likely  to  be  little  or  no 
opposition  in  any  quarter,  that  the  House  had  done  enough 
in  the  present  session  on  this  important  subject,  in  the  recog- 
nition of  the  principle  of  a  free  trade  in  so  essential  a  point. 
If  that  Bill  was  to  be  maintained  and  carried  through,  as  he 
trusted  it  would,  it  would  eventually,  he  hoped,  improve  one 
principal  part  of  the  trade  of  this  country,  particularly  of  that 
part  of  the  kingdom  in  which  he  was  satisfied  every  member 
of  that  House  felt  a  deep  interest  —  Ireland.     That  there  was 
no  danger  that  supplies  of  corn  could  at  any  time  be  withheld 
from  us  when  we  required  them  :  he  argued  from  this  consider- 
ation, that  at  the  very  period  when  our  enemy  had  vowed 
our  destruction  —  when  our  crops  had  failed,  and  when  the 
continental  system  was  in  full  vigour,  we  were,  in  spite  of 
that  system,  in  full  supply  of  corn.     If  so,  what  reason  had 
we  to  be  afraid  of  our  agricultural  interests  on  account  of  the 
cheapness  at   home  ?      It  was    impossible  that   importation 
could  ever  be  carried  to  such  a  pitch,  as  to  drive  out  our  home- 
grown corn.     The  expense  of  the  carriage  of  so  bulky  an  ar- 
ticle alone  must  always  render  that  next  to  impossible,  added 
to  which,  there  was  the  expense  of  double  shipping  from  the 
one  country  to  the  other.     As  to  the  agriculturist,  he  would 
gain  just  nothing  at  all  from  the  proposition  of  the  right  hon- 
ourable gentleman ;  and  as  to  poor-rates,  there  would,  at  no 
great  distance  of  time,  be  occasion  for  a  revision  of  them,  for 
at  present  they  could  be  regarded  in  no  other  light  than  as  an 
inefficacious    and    circuitous    way  of   paying   the  wages   of 
labour.     The  extension  of  home  demand  and  home  market 
was  the  true  stimulus  of  all  agricultural  improvement.     He 
should  conclude  with  stating,  that  this  was  not  a  merely  agri- 


THE    CORN    LAWS.  511 

cultural  country,  but  that  wc  depended  principally  on  our 
commerce  and  manufactures  for  that  distinguished  rank  and 
preeminence  which  we  held  in  the  scale  of  nations;  and  he 
therefore  thought  it  impolitic  to  adopt  any  measure,  the  ten- 
dency of  which  might  be  ultimately  to  throw  discouragements 
on  the  commercial  prosperity  and  resources  of  the  country, 
from  an  exclusive  and  unwise  preference  of  our  agricultural 
interests. 

[The  amendment,  that  the  consideration  of  the  resolutions 
be  postponed  to  that  day  three  months,  was  lost  by  a  division 
of  144  against  27.  The  resolutions  were  ordered  to  be  re- 
committed next  day,  when  the  second,  containing  the  gradua- 
ting scale,  was  agreed  to.] 


512  SPEECHES   IN    PARLIAMENT. 


m.     SLAVE  TRADE. 

28th  June,  1814. 
(Vol.  II.  p.  160.) 

Mr.  Horner  moved,  "  That  the  several  entries  in  the  votes 
of  this  House  on  the  3d  day  of  May  last,  and  the  3d  day  of 
this  instant  June,  and  of  the  Address  agreed  to  by  this  House, 
to  be  presented  to  his  Royal  Highness  the  Prince  Regent, 
relative  to  the  abolition  of  the  slave  trade,  and  of  his  Royal 
Highness's  Answer  thereto,  that  it  would  be  the  earnest  en- 
deavour of  his  Royal  Highness  to  accomplish  the  object  of  it, 
might  be  read :  "  and  the  same  having  been  read, 

Mr.  Horner  said, —  That  the  motion  which  he  had  to  sub- 
mit to  the  House,  though  it  related  to  the  same  subject  as  the 
motion  which  had  been  last  night  discussed,  differed  essen- 
tially from  it,  for  instead  of  calling  on  the  House  to  come  to 
any  conclusion,  it  merely  contained  a  call  for  the  information 
necessary  to  a  correct  judgment  on  the  question  which  would 
be  submitted  to  the  House  to-morrow.  In  the  Address  of  the 
last  night,  he,  for  one,  had  concurred  most  cordially,  nor  was 
he  disposed  to  under-rate  the  good  effect  which  that  Address 
would  produce  ;  for  he  did  not  doubt  that,  if  there  was  further 
opportunity  of  exertion  on  the  subject  of  the  abolition  of  the 
slave  trade,  those  who  directed  his  Majesty's  councils  would 
go  to  the  discussion  with  additional  power,  from  the  reiterated 
expression  of  the  wish  of  parliament. 

But  there  was  another  business  to  be  done ;  they  had  to 
express  their  opinions,  not  prospectively,  but  on  the  treaty 
which  had  put  an  end  to  the  misery  of  that  protracted  war,  with 
which  Europe  had  been  so  long  desolated.  This  treaty  was 
to  be  discussed  in  all  its  bearings ;  but  if  there  was  one  point 
more  interesting  than  another,  it  was  the  stipulation  with  re- 
lation to  African  slavery,  and  to  inquire  how  far  ministers  had 
acted  up  to  the  wishes  of  the  parliament  and  the  country.    As 


Till']    SLAVE    TRADE.  513 

to  what  had  been  done  by  the' noble  lord  opposite  to  him,  he 
was  wholly  iininformed,  and  the  object  of  his  motion  was  to 
require  this  information  in  which  he  was  deficient  —  to  know 
how  far  the  noble  lord,  acting  under  the  direction  of  the 
House,  and  the  sense  of  his  own  duty,  had  wisely  taken  those 
measures  which  were  calculated  to  give  effect  to  the  benevo- 
lent disposition  of  the  whole  nation  on  this  subject. 

He  wished  distinctly  to  be  understood  as  to  a  point  which 
had  been  mentioned  in  the  discussion  of  last  night;  it  had 
then  been  said  by  the  noble  lord,  that  it  was  the  argument  of 
those  who  disapproved  of  the  stipulation,  that  the  abolition  of 
the  slave  trade  should  be  a  sine  qua  non  of  a  treaty  of  peace. 
He  did  not  know  that  such  an  alternative  had  been  suggested 
as  proper,  nor  should  he  have  supported  such  an  alternative. 
If  he  were  informed  the  peace  would  have  been  impracticable, 
without  such  a  stipulation  as  had  been  adopted,  it  would, 
without  doubt,  be  wise  to  postpone  wdiat  was  the  object  of  all 
our  wishes :  but  it  was  necessary  that  he  should  have  much 
more  information  on  the  subject  before  him  than  he  already 
had,  before  he  could  believe  that  such  an  alternative  was  at  any 
time  necessary.  That  such  an  argument  might  have  been  ad- 
duced by  the  negotiators,  any  one  who  had  ever  had  curiosity 
enough  to  look  into  diplomatical  transactions,  could  well  be- 
lieve;  but  propositions  were  often  laid  down  in  the  com- 
mencement of  a  negotiation,  which  were  departed  from  at  the 
conclusion  without  difficulty.  There  was  another  point  in  the 
discussion  of  last  night,  which  he  thought  it  necessary  to 
allude  to.  It  had  been  said  by  the  noble  lord  opposite,  that 
the  question  of  the  abolition  could  not  have  been  mixed  in 
the  negotiation  with  the  stipulation  for  the  cession  of  the 
colonies  in  our  possession.  The  reason  of  this  he  could  not 
comprehend.  The  criterion  of  the  policy  of  a  proposition  was 
the  effect  of  that  measure  on  the  power  with  whom  we  had  to 
negotiate.  Now,  so  far  as  it  appeared  from  the  statement  of 
the  noble  lord,  he  had  voluntarily  thrown  away  the  only  bene- 
fit which  we  could  throw  into  the  scale  against  the  abolition 
of  the  slave  trade  on  the  part  of  France.  Though  the  House 
could  not  decide  in  the  actual  state  of  their  knowledge,  that 


514  SPEECHES    IN    PARLIAMENT. 

the  noble  lord  had  acted  unadvisedly,  yet  they  could  say  that 
they  did  not  possess  information  enough  to  enable  them  to 
judge  fairly. 

Why,  in  this  state  of  ignorance,  should  the  House  depart 
from  the  old  practice  of  demanding  information  ?  The  only 
reason  adduced  to  the  contrary  was,  that  the  pretensions  ad- 
vanced during  the  negotiations  would,  by  being  published, 
bind  the  different  powers  to  support  them.  But  at  least  the 
House  should  be  permitted  to  know  what  the  conduct  of  the 
noble  lord  himself  had  been.  They  knew  the  grounds  on 
which  the  noble  lord  must  have  urged  the  immediate  aboli- 
tion, and  the  futile  reasons  by  which  they  must  have  been 
opposed.  These  arguments  might  be  wrapped  in  the  mystery 
of  diplomacy  ;  but  it  was  quite  improbable  that  any  thing 
could  have  been  adduced  which  had  not  for  the  last  twenty 
years  been  known  to  every  man  of  education  in  this  kingdom  ; 
there  could  be  nothing  of  novelty  in  the  reasoning.  Why, 
therefore,  should  not  these  discussions  be  published?  for  if 
there  was  any  sincerity  in  the  wish  of  the  French  government 
to  undeceive  the  public  in  France  on  this  question,  they  could 
desire  nothing  more  than  that  the  reasoning  against  the  abo- 
lition should  be  published  for  the  purpose  of  being  refuted. 
It  would  be  curious  to  see  what  reasoning  had  been  made  use 
of  by  the  Prince  of  Benevento  on  this  subject  —  what  new 
views  he  entertained  on  the  subject  of  the  rights  of  man  —  so 
contrary  as  they  must  have  been  to  those  which  he  had  for- 
merly entertained  I  It  was  certainly  much  to  be  desired  that  an 
opportunity  should  be  given,  to  apply  the  sense  of  this  coun- 
try to  dispel  the  senseless  prejudices  which  existed  in  France 
on  this  subject.  Yet  if  there  was  nothing  in  this  argument, 
the  House  could  recur  to  its  constant  usage  ;  this  usage  was, 
that  when  they  were  dissatisfied  with  a  treaty,  they  should 
require  information  on  the  subject.  It  was  incumbent,  how- 
ever, to  show  by  the  production  of  the  documents,  that  there 
were  such  insurmountable  obstacles  to  the  immediate  aboli- 
tion, that  the  House  might  with  justice  to  itself  and  the 
country,  say  "  Aye  I  "  to  the  demand  which  the  noble  lord  was 
to  make  of  an  acquittal  on  this  article. 


THE  SLAVE  TRADE.  51-5 

The  House,  on  the  3d  of  May,  had  unanimously  desired, 
that  care  should  be  taken  in  the  Treaty  of  Peace  to  bring 
about  an  universal  abolition.  The  general  wish  —  was  it 
necessary  to  say  the  general  expectation  ?  —  was,  that  a  total 
abolition  might  take  place.  How  different  the  result  I  The 
traffic  of  one  of  the  greatest  nations  in  Europe  had  been 
renewed  (for  during  twenty  years  it  had  been  interrupted)  — 
renewed  to  an  extent  of  which  the  House  perhaps  had  no 
conception.  From  the  best  authorities  it  appeared,  that  pre- 
viously to  the  Revolution,  the  black  population  of  the  French 
colonies  amounted  to  800,000  persons,  to  maintain  which 
40,000  negroes  were  annually  imported.  Could  any  man 
without  horror  and  shame  contemplate  the  misery  thus  im- 
mediately produced  by  a  treaty,  into  the  grounds  of  which,  if 
they  did  not  inquire,  they  virtually  became  parties  ?  But  this 
was  not  all.  In  many  colonies,  the  population  had  been 
wasted  since  the  Revolution,  though,  extraordinary  as  it  might 
appear,  in  St.  Domingo,  during  the  dismal  period  of  revolt  and 
rebellion  there,  the  population  had  increased  —  so  superior  was 
the  worst  species  of  liberty  to  slavery!  Extraordinary  impor- 
tations would,  therefore,  be  made  to  those  colonies  where  the 
population  had  diminished.  Even  here  the  evil  produced  by 
the  treaty  did  not  end.  By  the  vigorous  manner  in  which  the 
abolition  laws  of  this  country  had  been  carried  into  effect,  the 
slave  trade  had  been  rooted  out  in  a  great  part  of  the  coast  of 
Africa  —  there  being  only  one  small  island  north  of  the  line, 
Bissaos,  possessed  by  the  Portuguese.  But  now^  Senegal, 
Goree,  and  their  dependencies,  having  been  restored  to  the 
French,  all  that  coast  would  be  thrown  back  into  its  former 
state  of  misery  and  desolatioij.  Not  only  would  this  unhappy 
country  be  subjected  to  the  evils  of  this  terrible  traffic  on  the 
part  of  the  French,  but  on  the  part  of  the  Portuguese ;  for, 
under  a  treaty  which  had  been  concluded  with  the  Prince 
Regent  of  Portugal,  under  pretence  of  abolishing  the  slave 
trade  by  degrees,  that  nation  was  permitted  to  trade  in  slaves 
with  any  settlement  where  this  traffic  was  continued  by  the 
power  which  possessed  it. 

Thus  much  evil  had  been  done  by  the  treaty,  and  should 


516  SPEECHES    IN   PARLIAMENT. 

they  say,  in  the  ;ccal  of  their  parliamentary  confidence,  that 
the  noble  lord  had  acted  zealously  and  wisely?  It  was  quite 
improper  to  place  such  an  extravagant  confidence  in  the  noble 
lord  without  a  knowledge  of  the  reasons  or  facts  on  which  he 
had  acted.  It  was  not,  however,  to  the  transactions  at  Paris 
that  the  object  of  his  motion  was  limited.  There  had  been 
repeated  addresses  from  that  House  to  the  throne,  which  had 
always  been  most  graciously  answered,  on  the  same  subject 
as  that  of  the  address  of  the  3d  of  May,  namely,  to  pray  the 
crown  to  endeavour,  in  any  arrangements  entered  into  with 
foreign  powers,  to  adopt  measures  for  the  universal  abolition 
of  the  slave  trade.  It  was,  therefore,  important  to  learn 
whether,  before  our  armies  had  entered  into  France,  arrange- 
ments had  been  made  with  the  allied  powers  on  this  subject, 
and  whether,  in  the  discussions  at  Frankfort  and  other  pieces, 
no  time  had  been  lost  in  coming  to  a  distinct  understanding 
on  the  subject,  and  making  known  that  the  colonies  which  we 
held  we  were  ready  to  restore  for  the  sake  of  peace,  but  not 
unless  that  peace  were  coupled  with  an  abolition  of  the  slave 
trade.  He  held  it  perfectly  proper,  that  the  abolition  should 
not  be  miade  a  sine  quel  non  of  peace ;  but  that  it  was  also 
most  desirable  that  the  restoration  of  the  colonies  by  us,  and 
the  abolition  of  the  slave  trade  on  the  part  of  our  late  ene- 
mies, should  always  have  been  put  forward  together.  It  was 
too  great  a  stretch  of  confidence,  he  repeated,  for  the  House 
to  suppose,  that  in  all  these  particulars  the  members  of  his 
Majesty's  government  had  acted  wisely,  without  having  the 
least  information  on  the  subject. 

As  to  the  assertion  of  the  noble  lord,  that  the  French  were 
generally  ignorant  upon  this  subject,  he  admitted  the  possi- 
bility of  such  ignorance,  so  far  as  regarded  a  certain  portion  of 
the  people.  That  the  upper  circles  had  become  so  depraved 
in  moral  sentiment,  so  ignorant,  or  so  indifferent  with  respect 
to  whatever  concerned  the  interests  of  liberty  and  humanity, 
he  thought  not  improbable ;  but  he  felt  it  difficult  to  believe 
that  the  great  body  of  a  civilised  and  enlightened  nation  like 
France  could  bo  uninformed  or  insensible  upon  a  question  of 
sucli  importance  as  the  abolition  of  the  slave  trade.     There 


THE    SLAVE    TRADE.  517 

must,  indeed,  be  somctliing  preternatural  about  France,  if 
such  insensibility  existed  in  sucii  a  nation.  Then,  assuming 
the  contrary,  what  peculiar  sense  of  interest  could  prompt  the 
French  people  to  be  so  peculiarly  tenacious  of  the  continua- 
tion of  the  slave  trade?  For  several  years  they  had,  in  fact, 
known  nothing  about  it,  or  about  the  colonies  in  which  it  had 
been  carried  on,  that  could  induce  any  popular  solicitude  to 
maintain  or  revive  it.  Two  of  the  colonies  restored  to  France, 
namely,  Guadaloupe  and  Martinique,  notoriously  required  no 
importation  of  slaves,  and  of  St.  Domingo,  the  present  gene- 
ration of  the  French  knew  nothing  but  that  which  was  cal- 
culated to  excite  their  horror,  from  a  recollection  of  the  fate  of 
that  gallant  army  which  was  sent  there  to  perish,  because  it 
was  attached  to  a  rival  general. 

But,  notwithstanding  these  circumstances,  the  noble  lord 
had  acceded  to  the  article  under  consideration,  stating,  how- 
ever, that  the  French  government  assured  him  of  its  dispo- 
sition and  purpose  to  mitigate  the  evils,  and  limit  the  e:xtent, 
of  the  slave  trade.  If,  however,  this  assurance  were  sincere, 
and  should  be  fulfilled,  what  must  become  of  the  plea  of 
reverence  for  public  prejudice  and  national  sentiment,  for  that 
prejudice  and  sentiment  were  but  too  likely  to  derive  strength 
from  the  embarkation  of  capital,  and  the  acquisition  of  profit  ? 
That  was,  should  any  profit  arise.  For  really  the  prospect 
of  profit  to  France  seemed  very  questionable,  particularly 
from  the  difficulties  that  must  attend  the  re-acquisition  of  St. 
Domingo.  Considering,  then,  that  no  such  prospect  could 
be  much  relied  upon,  and  that  France  was  not  therefore  likely 
to  insist  upon  the  maintenance  of  this  odious  traffic ;  consi- 
dering also  the  situation  of  France,  the  concurrence  of  the 
Allies  in  one  sentiment  upon  this  subject,  he  could  not  help 
thinking  that  our  government  was  entitled,  as  it  w^as  bound, 
to  press  for  the  entire  abolition  of  the  slave  trade,  which  was 
a  proposition  it  would  be  idle  to  suppose  that  the  French  go- 
vernment, in  its  defeated  and  humble  state,  could  have  suc- 
cessfully resisted.  He  could  not,  indeed,  persuade  himself  to 
believe,  that  if  the  zeal  and  talents  of  the  noble  lord  had  been 
effectually  employed  with  that  view,  the  complete  acquies- 

voL.  II.  44 


518  SPEECHES    IN    PARLIAMENT. 

cence  of  the  French  government  in  the  abolition  of  the  slave 
trade  could  not  have  been  obtained.  At  least  such  a  case  as 
he  had  stated  required  explanation,  as  to  the  conduct  of 
ministers  in  pursuance  of  the  addresses  of  parliannent,  and  the 
wishes  of  the  country  upon  this  important  question.  He 
should  therefore  conclude  with  moving,  "  That  an  humble 
Address  be  presented  to  his  Royal  Highness  the  Prince 
Regent,  That  he  will  be  graciously  pleased  to  give  directions, 
that  there  be  laid  before  this  House  copies  of  all  representa- 
tions made  on  the  part  of  his  Majesty's  government  during  the 
late  negotiations  for  peace,  and  of  all  communications  which 
passed  between  his  Majesty's  minister  and  the  allied  powers, 
relative  to  the  abolition  of  the  African  slave  trade." 


TRANSFER    OF    GENOA   TO    SARDINIA.  519 

IV.  TRANSFER  OF  GENOA  TO  THE  KING  OF  SARDINIA. 

21st  Fchruiu-y,  1815. 
(Vol.  II.  p.  228.) 

Mr.  Lambton  moved  for  the  production  of  a  variety  of 
papers  relative  to  the  transfer  of  the  Genoese  people;  and 
after  several  members  had  spoken,  (the  Chancellor  of  the  Ex- 
chequer, Sir  James  Mackintosh,*  Mr.  Wellesley  Pole,  Mr. 
Whitbread,  and  Mr.  Bathurst,) 

Mil.  Horner  rose,  and  said: — If  the  House  rightly  felt 
the  question  then  before  them,  they  would  be  aware  that  it 
depended  in  no  manner  whatever  upon  any  information  with 
respect  to  the  proceedings  of  Congress.  He  certainly  did  not 
understand  the  doctrine  of  the  right  honourable  gentleman 
(Mr.  Bathurst,)  that  the  House  of  Commons  had  no  right  to 
interfere  in  any  acts  resulting  from  negotiations  still  in  pro- 
gress. Would  it  be  said,  that  it  was  not  the  duty  of  that 
House,  when  a  measure  had  been  adopted  which  involved 
the  honour  and  good  faith  of  the  country,  to  raise  its  voice, 
and,  if  possible,  stop  the  course  of  those  proceedings  which 
tended  to  degrade  the  British  name?  He  would  boldly 
affirm,  that  what  had  been  done  was  contrary  to  the  honour 
and  dignity  of  the  nation  ;  and  he  cared  not  by  what  nego- 
tiations, or  by  what  motives  of  policy,  that  act  was  preceded. 
The  apparent  breach  of  fiiith,  the  apparent  violation  of  na- 

*  Sir  James  Mackintosh,  in  his  journal,  mentions  this  speech  in  the  follow- 
ing terms :  — 

''  Horner  rose  about  a  quarter  before  eleven,  and  spoke  till  half  past  twelve 
—  admirably  well.  His  earnest  gravity  of  manner,  his  sincerity  in  the  avowal 
of  his  own  opinions,  though  unpopular,  and  the  temperance  with  which  he  de- 
livered them,  and  avoided  or  evaded  their  dangerous  consecjuences,  were 
equally  perfect.  The  success  was  astonishing.  It  re-animatcd  our  spirits, 
and  at  the  same  time  commanded  the  most  profound  attention  of  our  o])po- 
nents,  often  e.x.torting  involuntary  proofs  of  their  approbation.  I  am  hai)py 
to  say  that  I  was  able  most  heartily  to  concur  in  the  general  homage,  ancl  to 
feel  Horner's  speech  as  a  consolation  for  ni}'  own  failure. 

"  21st  (22d  V).  Horner  called,  and  walked  with  me  to  Lord  Grcnville's;  he 
had  all  the  overflowing  kindness  of  victory."  —  Life  of  Sir  James  Mackintosh, 
vol.  ii.  p.  339.  —  Ed. 


520  SrEECHES   IN   PARLIAMENT. 

tional  honour,  the  apparent  cruelty  and  perfidy  of  the  deed, 
might  be  explained;  but  he  was  sure  it  never  could  be  ex- 
plained, without  the  abandonment  of  all  that  constituted  the 
moral  greatness  and  political  dignity  of  the  nation.  It 
seemed  to  be  acknowledged,  on  the  other  side,  that  the  trans- 
action bore,  on  the  face  of  it,  the  appearance  of  a  breach  of 
faith;  but  it  was  hinted,  that  the  general  policy,  or  the  tran- 
quillity of  Europe,  might  have  required  it.  He  would  argue 
it  in  away  exactly  the  reverse;  and  would  assert,  that  the 
remote  considerations  of  policy  could  not  be  admitted  into 
the  question  at  all,  without  an  utter  abandonment  of  every 
moral  principle.  No  view  of  expediency,  political,  financial, 
or  military,  could  ever  alter  his  opinion  of  the  transaction 
which  had  taken  place  at  Genoa.  It  was,  indeed,  reviving 
the  old  revolutionary  language.  If  countries  were  to  be  par- 
titioned according  to  the  will  of  the  sovereigns  assembled  at 
the  Congress  —  if  they  were  to  indulge  in  the  same  unscru- 
pulous practices  which  disgraced  the  worst  periods  of  the 
French  Revolution,  wherein  did  they  differ  from  those  men, 
who,  with  philanthropy  in  their  mouths,  were  the  scourges  of 
society  ?  Was  this  to  be  the  kind  of  general  peace  that  was 
promised  to  Europe  ?  Was  the  attachment  of  people  to  their 
sovereign,  to  their  ancient  laws  and  constitutions,  to  be 
totally  disregarded?  That  such  principles  were  acted  upon, 
was  manifest  from  the  case  of  Saxony  and  Genoa  ;  but  never 
till  the  latter  event,  was  England  a  party  to  such  enormities. 
The  partition  of  Poland,  though  unfortunately  not  opposed, 
was  at  least  not  sanctioned  by  this  country  ;  but  now  we 
could  only  feel  remorse  and  self-reproach,  for  our  share  in  the 
perpetration  of  as  great  an  act  of  injustice,  as  any  that  the 
annals  of  revolutionary  France  could  display.  Knowing  as 
we  did,  what  it  was  to  possess  an  ancient  government  of  free 
and  equal  laws,  conscious  of  all  the  hereditary  feelings  of 
attachment,  which  such  a  government  was  calculated  to  in- 
spire, was  the  House  now  to  sanction  a  crime  of  this  magni- 
tude, with  a  full  impression  on  their  minds,  of  all  the  sufferings 
which  it  must  have  inflicted  on  the  people  of  Genoa?  He 
had  to  request  the  attention  of  the   House,  to  the  effect  pro- 


TRANSFER    OF    GENOA    TO    SARDINIA.  521 

duced  by  these  proclamations  on  the  mind.s  of  tlio  Genoese 
people,  and  the  military  occurrences  that  succeeded.  IIow 
diflerent  were  the  hopes  of  Genoa  last  year  from  her  present 
condition  I  When  Lord  William  Bentinck  landed  in  Italy, 
and  proclaimed  the  independence  of  that  country,  the  animat- 
ing cry  spread  from  village  to  village,  till  it  pierced  the  walls  of 
Genoa,  and  decided  the  fate  of  the  French  army  \vithin  them. 
It  was  the  moral  influence  of  that  sentiment  which  produced 
the  effect,  not  the  point  of  the  bayonet.  Genoa  was  sur- 
rendered by  the  French,  because  the  people,  trusting  to  the 
proclamation  of  a  British  officer,  would  not  defend  the  place ; 
and  what  were  the  advantages  which  our  perfidy  obtained 
for  us  ?  By  giving  us  possession  of  the  territory  round 
Genoa,  it  gave  us,  in  effect,  possession  of  the  whole  of  the 
north  of  Italy.  By  our  promises  we  gained  that  advantage  ; 
and  having  gained  it,  we  violated  those  promises.  To  the 
latest  day  of  her  servitude,  Genoa  could  never  forget  that  she 
owed  her  bondage  to  the  perfidy  of  Great  Britain.  This 
might  throw  them  into  the  hands  of  France,  who,  as  the 
strongest  part  of  Italy  had  been  transferred  to  the  weakest 
power  in  Europe,  might  obtain  the  surrender  of  Genoa,  when- 
ever they  pleased,  from  the  King  of  Sardinia,  who  would  sign 
its  transfer  in  order  to  preserve  his  crown.  It  was  to  France 
alone  the  Genoese  could  hereafter  look;  and  it  was  to  France 
that  we  had  probably  consigned  the  future  government  of 
this  unfortunate  people.  Such  a  consideration  was,  however, 
in  his  mind,  of  far  inferior  moment  to  the  paramount  ques- 
tion respecting  which  the  House  was  called  on  to  decide. 
Had  the  faith  of  this  country  been  violated  —  aye  or  no? 
All  the  facts  on  which  such  a  decision  ought  to  be  founded 
were  before  them ;  they  were  contained  in  two  documents, 
the  genuineness  and  authenticity  of  which  it  had  not  been 
attempted  to  deny.  If  the  facts  were  admitted,  no  considera- 
tions of  policy  could  alter  or  justify  them.  That  man  must 
have  a  peculiar  constitution  of  mind,  wiio  could  sufler  any 
notions  of  political,  commercial,  military,  or  financial  expe- 
diency, to  enter  at  all  into  his  estimate  of  the  character  and 
justification  of  a  direct  breach  of  a  moral  obligation.     Some- 

44* 


522  SPEECHES   IN   PARLIAMENT. 

thing  had  been  said  of  the  effect  that  might  be  produced 
elsewhere,  by  such  discussions  as  the  present.  He  cared  not 
what  effect  might  be  produced  :  on  such  an  occasion  he  con- 
sidered it  to  be  the  bounden  duty  of  every  member  to  state 
his  impressions,  and  leave  those  impressions  to  produce  the 
effect  that  belonged  to  them  in  this  country  and  in  Europe. 


THE   CORN   LAWS.  523 

V.   THE   CORN   LAWS. 

23(1  Febnuiry,  1815. 
(Vol.  II.  p.  229.) 

The  House  having  resolved  itself  into  a  Committee  to  re- 
.sume  the  debate  of  the  preceding  evening,  on  the  state  of  the 
Corn  Laws,  and  after  Sir  John  Newport,  Mr.  Frankland 
Lewis,  Mr.  Calcraft,  and  several  other  members  had  spoken, 

Mr.  Horner  addressed  the  House,  and  said  :  —  He  should 
not  pay  much  attention  to  the  calculations  on  either  side. 
From  the  manner  in  which  the  question  was  opened,  he  had 
no  hesitation  in  saying,  that  the  right  honourable  gentleman 
(Mr.  Robinson)  had  manifested  a  more  statesman-like  mind 
than  any  of  those  by  whom  his  propositions  were  supported  ; 
for  that  right  honourable  gentleman  had  fully  recognised  the 
great  principles  which,  according  to  the  highest  authorities, 
ought  to  regulate  our  commercial  policy,  admitting  that  a 
case  of  necessity  should  be  made  out  for  any  deviation  from 
those  principles,  and  that  the  House  had  only  to  balance 
between  difficulties  —  between  the  nature  of  the  necessity 
and  the  deference  that  was  due  to  the  great  radical  principle 
of  a  free  trade.  That  this  principle  was  entitled  to  respect, 
■was  not,  he  maintained,  the  opinion  of  what  were  denomi- 
nated mere  modern  spcculatists,  but  of  the  soundest  thinkers 
upon  commercial  policy,  aided  by  the  experience  of  practical 
men,  who  most  naturally  deemed  the  success  of  agriculture 
as  the  main  basis  of  commercial  prosperity.  Those,  then, 
who  concurred  with  such  thinkers,  could  not  be  regarded  as 
theorists  only,  nor  were  they  fairly  liable  to  the  attempts  made 
to  depreciate  their  judgment.  He  was  indeed  surprised  at 
these  attempts,  as  if  the  denomination  of  "  political  econo- 
mists" could  detract  from  the  authority  of  any  gentleman 
who  opposed  the  measure  before  the  committee.  But  who 
were  they  who  resorted  to  nicknames  upon  this  occasion? 
Why,  the  very  men  who  admitted  that  the  knowledge  of  po- 
litical  economy  required  deep   reading,  and,  that   what  ap- 


524  SPEECHES   IN   PARLIAMENT. 

peared  paradoxes  to  superficial  observers  were,  upon  further 
investigation,  proved  to  be  just  and  rational  views.  Those, 
indeed,  who  used  the  nickname  alluded  to,  endeavoured 
themselves,  by  the  legerdemain  of  figures,  and  a  complication 
of  details,  to  confer  a  rational  character  upon  a  proposition 
which  had  all  the  complexion  of  a  paradox,  which,  in  fact, 
appeared  utterly  irreconcilable  with  reason.  But  in  reviewing 
these  extravagances,  he  was  glad  to  find  that  the  report  of  the 
committee  of  that  House  was  not  disfigured  by  such  observa- 
tions as  appeared  in  the  report  of  the  other  House  of  Parlia- 
ment ;  for,  in  the  latter,  he  was  really  astonished  to  find  these 
statements:  —  first,  that  the  price  of  provisions  had  truly 
nothing  to  do  with  the  price  of  labour;  and,  secondly,  that 
the  amount  of  rents  had  no  material  influence  upon  the 
charges  of  agriculture.  But  there  was  another  theory,  still 
more  extraordinary,  from  the  advocates  of  the  proposition 
before  the  committee,  and  which,  he  believed,  had  never 
been  broached  since  the  days  of  Cromwell ;  namely,  that  the 
land  did  not  really  belong  to  the  proprietors,  but  to  the  com- 
munity.—  Nay,  in  addition  to  these  strange  doctrines,  an 
honourable  friend  of  his  (Mr.  Preston),  who  was  among  those 
by  whom  theorists  had  been  decried,  had  that  day  sent  him 
the  tract  of  the  Marquis  de  Mirabeau  upon  political  economy, 
which  he  had  alluded  to  in  his  speech,  calculating,  no  doubt, 
that  it  would  serve  to  produce  an  impression  upon  his  mind: 
but  his  honourable  friend  was  under  a  serious  mistake  as  to 
the  nature  of  that  celebrated  writer's  opinion ;  for  the  Mar- 
quis de  Mirabeau  belonged  to  that  class  of  economists,  who 
maintained  quite  an  opposite  doctrine  to  that  of  the  honour- 
able gentleman  ;  and  also  that  all  the  taxes  necessary  to  the 
support  of  the  state  should  be  drawn  directly  from  the  land. 

But  as  to  political  economy  generally,  upon  what  ground 
could  gentlemen  pretend  to  depreciate  its  character,  unless 
they  meant  to  deprecate  the  exercise  of  reasoning  upon  the 
subject  under  the  consideration  of  the  committee!  However, 
in  consistency  with  their  system  of  depreciation  as  to  political 
economy,  they  had  thought  proper  to  treat  wth  levity  the 
treatise  of  Dr.  Adam  Smith,  which  was,  in  fact,  but  a  collec- 


THE   CORN    LAAVS.  ,525 

tion  or  digest  of  maxims,  which,  instead  of  being  any  innova- 
tion, had  long  been  held  sacred  among  the  best  writers  this 
country  had  ever  known.  But  it  was  also  well  known,  that 
the  opinions  contained  in  the  work  of  Dr.  Adam  Smith  were, 
after  full  examination,  recommended  by  the  sanction  of  our 
most  distinguished  statesmen,  —  by  Mr.  Pitt,  for  instance, 
and  also  by  Mr.  Burke,  who  traced  the  history  of  Dr.  Smith's 
opinions,  demonstrating  that  those  opinions,  instead  of  being, 
as  some  alleged,  mere  plagiarisms  from  those  of  the  French 
economists,  were  the  original  growth  of  our  own  country, 
from  which  they  had  been  borrowed  by  the  economists  of 
France.  The  justice,  however,  of  Dr.  Smith's  great  principles 
was  recognised  by  the  statesman-like  view  of  the  right  hon- 
ourable opener  of  this  question,  who  had  not  given  the  weight 
of  his  authority  to  the  untenable  proposition,  that  because  the 
manufacturers  enjoyed  some  protecting  duties,  the  agricultu- 
rists were  entitled  to  the  measure  he  proposed,  which  was  a 
kind  of  arsrumenlum  ad  hominem.  Still  less  did  the  right 
honourable  gentleman  manifest  any  disposition  to  support  the 
assertion,  that  the  agriculturists  suflered  by  the  protecting 
duties  granted  to  the  manufacturers  ;  and  in  what  instance,  he 
would  ask,  could  the  British  agriculturists  be  conceived  so  to 
suffer?  From  what  country  could  they  obtain  any  article  of 
manufacture  necessary  for  their  consumption,  at  a  cheaper 
rate  than  they  could  purchase  it  at  home,  supposing  trade  per- 
fectly free,  and  that  protecting  duties,  as  to  manufactures, 
were  totally  done  away?  Could  coarse  woollen  cloihs,  for 
instance,  be  purchased  cheaper  any  where  than  in  England? 
or  could  any  other  article  be  had  on  better  terms  elsewhere  ? 
The  only  article,  indeed,  which  could  be  supposed  cheaper 
elsewhere  w^as  linen,  which  was  the  manufacture  of  Ireland. 
For  himself,  however,  he  had  no  difficulty  in  declaring,  that 
all  the  protecting  duties  (as  they  were  called)  at  present  in 
existence  in  this  country,  were  but  so  many  clogs  and  impedi- 
ments to  our  commercial  prosperity;  and  that,  whatever  might 
be  the  gain,  which  must  be  partial  and  comparatively  insigni- 
ficant, derived  probably  to  the  most  insignificant  in  trade,  the: 


526  ,  SPEECHES    IN   TARLIAMENT. 

effect  of  the  whole  system  must  be,  that  the  produce  of  our 
natural  wealth  was  considerably  diminished. 

But,  reverting  to  the  main  question,  and  bearing  in  mind 
the  grounds  stated  by  the  right  honourable  opener,  he  main- 
tained that  no  necessity  was  made  out  for  any  departure  from 
the  main  principles  of  trade,  to  the  justice  of  which  that  right 
honourable  gentleman  bore  testimony.  Tf  the  proposition 
before  the  committee  were  merely  a  temporary  measure,  to 
relieve  any  temporary  pressure  upon  the  farmers,  he  confessed 
that  he  should  have  felt  much  more  difficulty  in  opposing  it ; 
but,  as  a  measure  of  permanent  legislation,  he  could  not  hesi- 
tate to  enter  his  protest  against  it.  Sympathy  for  the  suffer- 
ing of  individuals  would  naturally  dispose  one  to  plead  for 
the  former ;  but  every  consideration  of  sound  national  policy, 
which  he  was  able  to  appreciate,  urged  him  to  resist  the  latter. 
But  the  object  of  granting  temporary  relief  to  individual  dis- 
tress had  been  disclaimed  by  the  advocates  for  the  proposition 
before  the  committee,  who  thought  proper  to  rest  their  preten- 
sions upon  considerations  of  permanent  policy ;  and  here  he 
was  at  issue  with  them.  He  was  aware  of  the  distress  of  the 
agriculturists  under  existing  circumstances,  and  he  had  all 
due  feeling  for  their  situation  ;  but,  then,  he  recollected  the 
cause  of  that  situation,  which  recollection  was  necessary  to  a 
due  estimate  of  the  policy  of  this  measure.  The  present  dis- 
tress of  the  agriculturists  was  owing  to  the  great  stimulus 
which  the  circumstances  of  the  war  had  given  to  agriculture ; 
which  stimulus  was  now  withdrawn.  The  operation  of  that 
stimulus,  which  offered  a  strong  proof  of  the  prosperity  and 
health  of  our  commercial  system,  encouraged  the  farmers  to 
offer  exorbitant  rents  for  land,  and  also  to  lay  out  large  sums 
upon  that  land ;  they  must  naturally  suffer  by  the  cessation  of 
such  a  stimulus.  They  had,  in  fact,  been  too  sanguine  in 
their  speculations,  and  hence  the  losses  of  which  they  now 
complained.  But  the  farmers  were  not  the  only  persons  who 
suffered  from  too  extensive  speculations.  Such  sufferings, 
also,  too  frequently  happened  in  every  branch  of  trade,  and 
did  it  therefore  follow  that  an  application  should  be  made  to 


THE   CORN   LAWS.  527 

parliament  to  repair  the  loss?  It  would,  indeed,  be  impossi- 
ble for  parliament  to  make  good  such  losses;  and  it  would  be 
unjust  to  make  an  attempt  to  withdraw  from  the  profits  of 
other  classes  of  the  community,  to  repair  the  losses  sustained 
by  any  class  of  unsuccessful  speculators. 

But  in  considering  the  case  of  the  agriculturists  (as  an  ex- 
ception was  demanded  in  their  favour),  in  looking  at  their 
present  difficulties  or  losses,  the  House  was  called  upon,  in 
justice,  to  look  also  to  the  cause  of  that  loss,  which  naturally 
brought  into  view  their  antecedent  profits.  The  most  inter- 
esting distress  among  the  farmers  —  that  which  in  his  mind 
was  most  entitled  to  commiseration,  was  certainly  the  case  of 
the  agriculturists  of  Ireland  :  but  that  case  also  was  the 
result  of  the  artificial  stimulus  given  to  Irish  agriculture  by 
the  peculiar  circumstances  of  the  war.  No  one,  he  believed, 
felt  a  more  lively  concern  for  the  interest  of  Ireland  than  that 
of  which  he  was  sensible,  and  which  should  aKvays  regulate 
his  conduct,  as  he  thought  it  must  the  mind  of  every  man  who 
duly  appreciated  the  general  interests  of  the  empire.  He  was 
therefore  happy  to  witness  the  pregnant  proof  which  the  pre- 
sent situation  of  Ireland  afforded  of  its  advancing  prosperity. 
For  that  situation  served,  in  his  view,  to  demonstrate  that  its 
commercial  enterprise  had  of  late  years  been  considerably 
exerted,  and  that  a  great  quantity  of  capital  had  been  em- 
ployed in  that  most  useful  branch  of  industry,  its  agricultural 
pursuits.  Ireland  had  therefore  experienced  a  check  from  the 
conclusion  of  peace  —  (a  smile  on  the  other  side  of  the  House) 
—  Gentlemen  might  smile,  he  said,  but  he  would  maintain 
that  this  check  afforded  a  proof  of  the  advanced  prosperity  of 
Ireland.  For  the  present  was  notoriously  the  first  instance  on 
record,  in  the  history  of  Ireland,  in  which  that  country  had  ex- 
perienced any  check  in  its  domestic  circumstances,  from  the 
conclusion  of  peace  by  the  mother  country  ;  and  this  check  he 
regarded  as  an  evidence  that  it  partook  of  our  prosperity,  the 
interruption  of  which  naturally  occasioned  a  participation  of 
our  losses.  Then,  as  to  the  disadvantage  resulting  to  the 
lands  lately  applied  to  tillage  in  this  country,  upon  which  a 
large  sum  must  have  been  expended,  he  was  fully  aware  that 


528  SPEECHES    IN   PARLIAMENT. 

that  disadvantage  was  entitled  to  consideration.  This  dis- 
advantage must  be  universally  regretted.  But  what  relief 
could  be  expected  by  the  sufferers  from  the  proposed  measure, 
especially  if  it  were  true,  as  the  advocates  of  this  measure 
alleged,  that  the  effect  of  it  must  be  to  reduce  the  price  of 
corn  ?  According  to  the  deposition  of  witnesses  before  the 
committee,  965.  per  ([uarter  was  necessary  to  enable  farmers  to 
grow  that  article  ;  nay,  according  to  the  allegation  of  some 
gentlemen,  less  than  135s.  would  be  insufficient ;  and  how 
then,  in  the  name  of  common  sense,  could  the  sum  be  deemed 
an  adequate  remuneration  for  this  species  of  culture  ?  Or 
still  more,  how  could  the  proposed  regulation  operate  to 
reduce  the  price  of  corn  ?  How,  indeed,  could  gentlemen  who 
supported  these  depositions  and  allegations,  plead  for  a  mea- 
sure so  self-destructive  as  the  present?  The  light  lands,  or 
those  lately  devoted  to  agriculture,  must  still  sutler  all  the  dis- 
tress that  was  deprecated,  especially  through  the  competition 
of  the  more  fertile  soil  of  Ireland,  and  the  richer  lands  of  this 
country;  and  the  result  must  still  be  to  throw  those  light 
lands  out  of  cultivation. 

With  respect  to  our  independence  of  foreign  supply,  he  was 
ready  to  admit,  that  if  a  dependence  upon  foreign  supply 
were  likely  to  be  the  result  of  the  existing  system,  that  likeli- 
hood would  form  a  legitimate  ground  for  the  proposed  mea- 
sure. [A.nd  here  the  honourable  and  learned  gentleman  took 
notice  of  the  exception  of  Dr.  Smith  with  regard  to  our  navi- 
gation law,  which  exception  referred  to  a  provision  for  our 
national  safety,  which  was,  in  all  cases,  a  predominant  con- 
sideration. But  returning  to  the  apprehension  of  our  depend- 
ence upon  a  foreign  supply  of  corn,  the  honourable  and 
learned  member  treated  that  apprehension  as  quite  exaggerated 
and  visionary.]  Indeed  it  had  been,  he  observed,  most  tena- 
ciously maintained  by  the  advocates  for  this  apprehension, 
that  it  would  be  impossible  for  the  whole  navy  of  England  to 
import  any  very  large  proportion,  much  less  an  adequate  sup- 
ply of  corn,  for  our  subsistence.  This,  however,  these  gentle- 
men seemed  to  feel  an  admission  hostile  to  their  own  propo- 
sition, and  therefore,  in  order  to  take  off  the  weight  of  such 


THE    CORN   LAWS.  529 

admission,  tlioy  asserted  that  even  a  small  quantity  of  im- 
ported corn  would  have  a  material  effect  upon   the  market 
price.     This,  however,  he  could  not  admit.     A  comparatively 
small  quantity  of  imported  corn  might  affect  the  market  price 
upon  a  particular  day,  or  for  a  few  days ;  but  the  price  must 
ultimately  and  permanently  depend  upon  the   proportion  of 
the  supply  to  the  demand,  and  the  proportion  of  supply  from 
abroad  was  in  no  degree  likely  to  be  considerable.     But  sup- 
posing the  supply  to  be  even  considerable,  the  apprehensions 
expressed  on  this  subject  were  still,  in  his  mind,  exceedingly 
exaggerated  and  fallacious ;  nor  was  it  even  probable  that  we 
should  have  to  depend  upon  foreign  supply  to  such  an  extent 
as  to  endanger  the  interests  of  our  own  agriculture.     A  great 
deal  of  this  apprehension  had  been  propagated,  which  was  nega- 
tived by  the  papers  on  the  table,  especially  with  regard  to  the 
supply  derived  from  what  was  called  our  natural  enemy.     He 
would  readily  admit,  that  if  it  could   be  rendered   apparent, 
that  in  any  event  we  should  have  to  depend  upon  France  for 
food,  a  protecting  duty,  as  it  was  termed,  should  be  imme- 
diately granted  to  avert  such  a  calamity;  and  to  this  grant  he 
would  accede,  not  from  any  commercial  jealousy,  which  he 
should  always  deprecate,  but  from  political  jealousy,  to  which 
it  would,   in  such  a  case,  be  our  duty  to  attend.     But  what 
was  the  fact?     Was  France  a  corn-exporting  country  ?     Did 
it  not  appear  from  the  papers  on  the  table  that  our  great 
import  of  corn  had  been,  not  from  France,  but  from  Holland 
and  from  Belgium,  the  sovereign  of  which  was  of  our  own 
creation  ?     Thus  we  derived  a  supply  of  corn,  not  from  a 
natural  enemy,  as   France  was  denominated,  but  from  our 
own  probably  permanent  ally.     But  France  could  never  be 
regarded  as  a  great  exporting  country  of  corn.     If  she  were,  it 
would  be  a  proof  of  her  impoverishment;  for  no  rich  country 
was  ever  a  great  exporter  of  corn.     No  ;  the  poor  country  was 
always  the  exporter  of  that  article  to  the  rich,  for  which  she 
received  manufactures  in  return.     France  had,  in  fact,  become 
for  the  last  year  an   exporter  of  corn,  in   consequence  of  an 
exceedingly  redundant  harvest,  and  from  the  same  cause  she 
was  an  exporter  in  the  year  1810.     But  France  could  never 
VOL.  IL  45 


530  SPEECHES    IN    PARLIAMENT. 

be  expected  to  rival  this  country  in  agriculture  ;  for  from  every 
information  that  had  reached   us,  her  system  of  agriculture 
was  exceedingly  inferior  to  our  own,  while  her  grain  was  also 
materially  inferior  in  quality.     How,  then,  could  it  be  appre- 
hended that  we  should  have  to  depend  upon  that  nation   for 
supply  in  any  event,  especially  when  we  had  to  look  not  only 
to    Holland  as  a  medium   for  furnishing  the  produce  of  the 
banks  of  the  Rhine,  but  to  Flanders,  to  the  Baltic,  to  Poland, 
and  to  America  also  ?     With  a  peace,  indeed,  so  consolidated, 
as  the  gentlemen  on  the  other  side  promised,  he  thought  all 
apprehension  on  this  score  quite  visionary.     But  even  calcu- 
lating upon  the  renewal  of  war,  or  the  reappearance  of  some 
extravagant  tyrant,  who,  with  a  combination  of  all  the  powers 
of  Europe,  should  speculate  upon  our  total  exclusion   from 
continental  commerce,  he  should  still  think  such  an  apprehen- 
sion groundless.     For  it  was  notorious  from  experience,  that 
even  when  the  experiment  of  this  exclusion  was  made,  namely 
from  1810  to  1812,  a  larger  importation  had  taken  place  into 
this  country,  especially  from  France,  than  was  ever  known 
within  the  same  compass  at  any  former  period.     The  appre- 
hension, then,   of   depriving  this  country  of  foreign  supply 
must,  under  any  circumstances,  be  regarded  as  totally  chime- 
rical.   As  to  a  provision  to  guard  against  fluctuation  of  prices, 
which  the  advocates  of  the   measure  before  the  committee 
promised,  it  would  be  found  that  for  the   last  seven   years, 
when  our  importation  of  corn  was  greater  than  at  any  former 
period,  the  fluctuation  was  much  less  than  during  any  period 
of  the  same  duration  since  the  Revolution  ;  and  this  fact  he 
had  ascertained  by  examining  the  Eton  tables.     Within   the 
last  seven  years,  too,  it  was  notorious  that  our  agriculture  had 
been  in  the  most  flourishing  state,   much   more  flourishing, 
indeed,  than  when  it  was  most  the  fashion  to  grant  bounties 
upon  the  export,  and  to  impose  restrictions  upon  the  import 
of  corn.     So  much  as  to  the  pretence  of  a  steady  price,  which 
was  looked  for  by  some  gentlemen  as  the  result  of  the  pro- 
posed measure.     In  his  opinion,  however,  the  best  security  for 
a  steady  price — that  is,  for  a  fair  price  to  the  consumer,  was 
not  a  measure  the  witnesses  adduced  to  support  which  de- 


THE    CORN    LAWS.  531 

posed  that  80.S-.  or  oven  9Gs.  was  necessary  to  enable  the 
farmer  to  grow  corn,  while  its  advocates  argued  that  its  ten- 
dency would  be  to  reduce  the  price  of  that  article,  but  to  leave 
the  dealer  in  corn  subject  to  this  impression,  that  if  he  raised 
his  price  to  an  undue  rate,  corn  would  be  imported.  This 
impression,  he  conceived,  and  common  sense  would  sanction 
the  conception,  would  be  the  best  means  of  keeping  corn  at  a 
fair  price,  and  correcting  all  excesses.  On  these  grounds  he 
felt  himself  called  upon  by  an  imperious  sense  of  duty  to 
resist  the  proposition  before  the  committee,  more  especially  as 
no  ground  of  necessity  was  shown  to  support  it,  and  as  all 
the  arguments  adduced  in  its  favour  appeared  to  him  utterly 
fallacious.  At  the  same  time  he  begged  it  to  be  understood, 
that  he  was  most  anxious  for  the  interest  of  agriculture,  which 
he  conceived  essentially  important  to  our  domestic  trade, 
compared  to  which  indeed  he  regarded  every  other  branch  of 
trade  as  nugatory.  But  the  proposition  before  the  committee 
was  in  his  view  materially  adverse  to  that  interest. 

Having  said  thus  much  as  to  agriculture,  he  thought  it 
proper,  as  connected  with  this  subject,  to  advert  shortly  to  the 
state  of  our  manufactures,  the  condition  of  our  labourers  in 
husbandry,  and  the  nature  of  our  fmances.  As  to  the  first  of 
these,  namely,  our  manufactures,  he  would  ask,  was  it  neces- 
sary at  this  moment  to  enhance  the  price  of  our  manufactured 
articles  ?  The  necessary  requisites  to  enable  us  to  preserve 
our  superiority  in  our  manufactures  were  two,  capital  and 
skill.  These  were  not  necessarily  domiciled  in  this  country ; 
but  might,  like  any  of  the  other  goods  of  fortune,  take  to 
themselves  wings  and  fly  away;  and  it  was  no  unfair  or  un- 
reasonable thing  to  conjecture,  that  if  to  the  difficulties  under 
which  our  manufactures  now  laboured,  were  added  the  pro- 
posed regulations  as  to  the  price  of  corn,  those  would  be 
speedily  followed  by  a  departnre  from  this  country  of  the  capi- 
tal and  skill  which  had  hitherto  given  life  to  our  manufactures, 
seeing  we  were  about  in  the  same  breath  to  multiply  the 
taxes  on  our  manufactures,  and  to  increase  the  price  of  corn. 
The  second  point  to  which  he  had  referred,  was  the  condition 


532  SPEECHES    IN    PARLIAMENT. 

of  labourers  engaged  in  the  aflairs  of  husbandry.     This,  he 
agreed,  did  not  depend  on  any  defect  in  the  system  itself,  but 
on   the   poor  laws,  and  the   mal-administration   of  thena,  by 
which  part  of  the  wages  of  the  agricultural  labourers  was  in 
some  districts  paid  out  of  the  poor-rates.     There  could,  he 
thought,  be  no  difficulty  in  framing  a  law  to  reach  this  sub- 
ject; but  certain  gentlemen  thought  it  more  meritorious  to 
pay  such   labourers  out  of  the  poor-rates,  than  to  suffer  an 
advance  of  wages  to  take  place ;  and  the  very  same  persons 
who  were  outbidding  each  other  in  the  purchase  of  leases  of 
lands,  seemed  the  most  misgiving  as  to  the  price  of  labour. 
It  was  the  high  price  of  corn  which  had   produced  this,  and 
would  continue  it.     There  was  no  other  way  of  liberating  our 
peasantry  from  a  state  of  villanage  than  by  restraining  the 
price  of  corn.     What  could  be  more  degrading  than   that  a 
man  in  the  vigour  of  healthful  labour  should  receive  the  allow- 
ance of  a  pauper?     It  reduced  our  free  labourers  to  a  state  of 
bondage;  and  this   enormous  mischief  the   present  measure 
had   the  strongest  tendency  to  increase.     The  third   point   to 
which  he  had  alluded,  was  that  of  our  financial  arrangements. 
The  price  of  the  necessaries  of   life  must  either  enter  into 
consideration  in  all  the  arrangements  of  government,  or  of  the 
greater  part  of  them.     It  might  be  asked,  How  would  you 
pay  the  dividends  on  the   national   debt,  unless   you  were  to 
keep  the  rate  of  provisions  high  ?     To  this  he  could  only  say, 
that  it  was  true  the  country  had  raised  large  sums  at  a  dimin- 
ished rate,  and  that  they  would  have  to  pay  them  at  a  higher 
rate  on  account  of  the  artificial  state  of  their  money;  but  was 
any  man  hardy  enough  to  say,  that  that  artificial  state  ought 
to  be  kept  up?   .  If  so,  that  man  must  be  guilty  of  a  continual 
fraud  on  those  great  creditors  of  the  country  on  whom   this 
deceit  had   originally  been   practised.      Observe,   then,    what 
was   our  situation.     With   exhausted   manufactures,  with   a 
debt  accumulating  out  of  all  proportion,  and  with  our  labour- 
ers paid  out  of  our  poor-rates,  were  we  still  to  lengthen  out 
this  artificial  mode  of  proceeding?     The  man  who  could  look 
such  a  situation  in  the  face,  had  stronger  nerves  than  he  had. 


THE    CORN    LAWS.  533 

The  best  course,  according  to  his  idea,  was  to  do  nothing. 
Eighty  shillings  per  (quarter  was  a  minimum  whieh,  he  was 
satisfied,  even  from  the  evidence  before  the  committee,  it  was 
not  necessary  to  fix ;  but  the  ?ninimum  might  have  been  safely 
fixed  at  a  much  smaller  sum.* 

*  Oh  tlio  20th  of  jrarch,  tlio  Common  Council  of  tho  City  of  London  voted  tlmnks  to 
Alexander  Barincr,  Esq.  and  Francis  Honicr,  Esq.,  "  for  their  able  and  imlefatigable 
exertions  in  opposing  the  corn  bill  in  the  honourable  house  of  coramous."  —  Kv. 


45* 


534  SPEECHES    IN   PARLIAMENT. 


YI.    JURY  TRIAL  IN  SCOTLAND. 

6th  March,  1815. 

Tins  speech  is  not  mentioned  in  Hansard's  Debates;  but 
Mr.  Horner,  in  a  postscript  to  a  letter  to  Mr.  Murray,  dated 
the  3d  of  April,  says  :  —  "  Kirkman  Finlay  urged  me  to  give 
him  a  note  of  what  I  was  surprised  into  saying  upon  the  Jury 
Bill,  when  Sir  George  Clerk  presented  his  petition  from  Mr. 
Justice  Macfarlane  and  others  against  that  measure ;  and  he 
now  informs  me  that  he  had  sent  me  a  Glasgow  newspaper 
in  which  the  note  I  gave  him  is  printed." 

The  copy  of  the  speech,  here  given,  is  that  which  appeared 
in  the  Glasgow  Courier  of  the  25th  of  March.  It  was  intro- 
duced with  the  following  note  from  the  Editor:  — 

"  The  speech  of  Mr.  Horner,  in  the  House  of  Commons,  on 
the  reading  of  a  petition  from  a  number  of  the  freeholders  and 
justices  of  the  peace  of  the  county  of  Edinburgh,  against 
some  of  the  clauses  of  the  Scotch  Jury  Bill,  having  been 
imperfectly  reported  in  the  London  papers,  we  are  happy  to 
have  it  in  our  power  to  give  a  correct  statement  of  what  he 
said,  which  we  have  received  from  a  gentleman  who  was  pre- 
sent on  the  occasion." 

Mr.  Horner  said,  that  nothing  could  be  more  unfounded 
than  the  statement  made  in  behalf  of  the  petitioners,  that 
time  had  not  been  allowed  for  the  consideration  of  this  mea- 
sure. The  Bill  had  been  introduced  in  the  other  House  on 
the  1st  day  of  December  last,  and  copies  of  it  were  in  circu- 
lation through  Scotland  before  Christmas;  there  had  been  the 
whole  interval,  an  unusually  long  adjournment,  for  the  con- 
tents of  the  Bill  to  be  examined,  as  he  knew  they  had  been 
with  the  utmost  care,  and  with  the  best  results,  by  those  per- 
sons in  Scotland,  who  were  most  capable  of  understanding 
and  discussing  them,  and  of  stamping,  by  their  approbation, 
an  authoritalive  sanction  on  a  legislative  measure  of  this  de- 
scription.    It  was  in  consequence  of  discussion  in   Scotland 


JURY    TRIAL    IN    SCOTLAND.  535 

that  Ihe  Bill  had  received  many  useful  and  important  amend- 
ments in  detail.  Nothing  could  be  less  reasonable,  than  to 
suppose,  because  such  suggestions  were  adopted  into  the  Bill, 
and  other  alterations  for  the  better  occurred  in  its  progress 
through  the  other  House,  that  therefore  further  delay  may  be 
asked  for,  until  all  these  alterations  might  be  considered  by 
the  country  at  large.  Such  an  expectation  was  wholly  un- 
warranted by  the  practice  of  Parliament,  the  discretion  of 
which  would  in  a  manner  be  superseded,  if  in  any  stage  of  a 
Bill  when  amendments  were  made,  there  was  to  be  a  halt 
until  an  appeal  could  be  had  to  persons  at  a  distance.  Before 
this  petition  came  in,  the  committee  had  been  postponed  to 
the  4th  of  April,  and  he  trusted  that  beyond  that  day  there 
would  be  no  further  procrastination. 

Objections  were  made  in  this  petition  to  three  different 
points  in  the  detail  of  the  Bill,  on  which  he  would  take  the 
present  opportunity  of  flaying  a  few  words.  The  first  re- 
spected the  qualification  of  the  judges  of  the  new  court ;  one 
of  whom,  as  it  now  stands,  may  be  an  English  barrister,  not 
legally  qualified  to  be  appointed  a  senator  of  the  College  of 
Justice.  Upon  this  point,  as  he  had  hinted  on  a  former  ocrca- 
sion,  his  opinion  coincided  with  that  which  was  intimated  in 
this  petition ;  and  when  the  House  went  into  a  committee,  he 
would  propose  to  amend  the  Bill  in  that  respect,  and  to 
relieve  it  from  what  he  thought  a  well-founded  objection. 

lie  knew  well,  that  like  all  the  other  provisions,  this  one  in 
particular  had  originated  in  the  most  sincere  and  conscientious 
anxiety  to  render  the  Bill  effectual  for  its  great  purpose,  of 
engrafting  trial  by  jury  upon  the  law  of  Scotland;  with  such 
regulations  in  the  first  instance  as  were  calculated  to  ensure 
success  in  so  material  a  change.  But  after  much  reflection 
he  had  convinced  himself,  that  it  would  be  unadvisable  to 
have  an  opening  for  the  nomination  of  any  person  to  be  a 
judge  of  the  jury  court,  who  was  not  qualified  according  to 
the  present  law  to  be  a  senator  of  the  College  of  Justice.  It 
seemed  to  him  of  the  highest  expediency,  looking  as  far  for- 
ward as  one  could,  that  the  independent  jurisprudence  of 
Scotland,  according  to  its   ancient  custom    of  property  and 


536  SPEECHES    IN   PARLIAMENT. 

private  right,  should  be  maintained  unimpaired  and  unmixed, 
entire  and  ch^ar.  The  integrity  and  independency  of  that 
law  are  a  fundamental  part  of  the  constitution  of  these  king- 
doms, solemnly  fixed  at  the  Union,  wisely  so  fixed.  The 
diversity  of  laws,  in  kirigdoms  united  like  these,  though  at- 
tended with  some  inconvenience,  is  a  disadvantage  not  to  be 
compared  in  magnitude  with  the  evils  of  uncertainty  and 
fluctuation  in  tiie  rules  of  property  and  private  rights.  Upon 
the  uniformity  and  steadiness  of  the  leading  doctrines  of  the 
common  law  in  every  country,  the  eificacy  and  authority  of 
justice  mainly  depend  ;  and  there  is  no  reasonable  security  for 
the  uniform  tradition  of  the  great  rules  and  doctrines  of  law, 
except  in  the  lineal  succession  of  judges  professionally  bred 
and  practised  in  that  particular  system.  Men  taken  from  the 
practice  of  another  system  must  be  expected  to  carry  with 
them  the  habits  of  that  which  they  leave,  and  cannot  refrain 
from  inoculating  their  settled  notions  upon  the  new  one  to 
which  they  are  appointed.  Such  foreign  admixture  would 
throw  loose  settled  authorities  and  known  rules,  and  no  ade- 
quate compensation  can  be  gained.  The  excellencies  that 
are  proper  to  separate  codes  of  municipal  justice  are  not  com- 
municable in  this  way  to  each  other,  for  the  merit  really  lies 
not  in  a  single  principle  of  the  law  taken  by  itself,  but  in  its 
harmony  with  many  others,  which  in  process  of  time  have 
gained  a  mutual  adaptation. 

He  said  that  one  of  the  reasons  which  weighed  jnost  with 
him,  for  giving  Scotland  the  benefit  of  juries  in  civil  causes, 
was  that  he  regarded  that  form  of  trial  as  so  congenial  to  the 
spirit  of  the  Scotch  jurisprudence,  that  he  expected  it  would 
be  found  in  the  end  to  contribute  to  the  preservation  of  that 
jurisprudence  in  all  its  peculiar  principles  and  maxims.  But 
to  make  sure  of  this,  he  was  satisfied  it  was  necessary  that 
juries  should  not  be  set  to  the  trial  of  issues,  except  under  the 
guidance  and  discretion  of  judges  well  versed  and  skilled  in 
all  ihe  doctrines  and  learning  of  the  law  of  that  country. 

With  regard  to  the  next  objection  urged  in  the  petition 
against  the  agreement  required  of  the  jury  in  their  verdict,  he 
entirely  concurred  in  the  sentiments  of  the  right  honourable 


JURY    TRIAL   IN    SCOTLAND.  537 

gentleman  (Mr.  Dundas),  that  this  requisite  was  of  the  very 
essence  of  the  measure,  and  that  if  the  prejudices  of  the 
country,  for  want  of  information,  were  as  strong  as  was  repre- 
sented, it  would  be  better  to  postpone  to  another  time  this 
great  improvement,  than  to  introduce  the  institution  into 
Scotland  mutilated,  and  wanting  what  gives  it  all  its  vigour. 
We  have  known  it  in  this  country  for  more  than  seven  centu- 
ries, a  larger  experience  than  the  usual  course  of  human  atfairs 
admits  of;  and  we  were  not  prepared  to  admit  to  modern 
casuistry,  that  in  this  long  tract  of  time  all  the  juries  of  Eng- 
land had  been  administeringjustice  through  perjury.  No  one 
who  had  a  practical  knowledge  of  English  juries  in  their 
actual  operation,  entertained  the  slightest  doubt,  that  the 
agreement  required  of  them  before  their  verdict  can  be  taken, 
conduces  to  the  true  and  just  trial  of  the  issue,  to  the  more 
patient,  considerate,  and  reasonable  discussion  of  the  evidence 
among  themselves,  and  to  the  more  satisfactory  and  conclu- 
sive authority  of  the  verdict  when  pronounced.  It  was  upon 
the  experience  of  England,  that  this  noble  institution  was 
recommended  to  be  adopted,  or  rather  to  be  revived,  in  Scot- 
land ;  but  it  would  be  casting  aside  the  true  result  of  that  ex- 
perience, if  a  tribunal  of  quite  another  constitution  should  be 
introduced. 

If  the  Scots  will  have  verdicts  to  be  decided  by  a  majority 
of  the  jurymen,  they  ought  to  be  made  aware,  that  in  that 
case  they  are  receiving  a  novelty  which  has  no  experience  in 
its  favour,  and  which  assuredly  is  not  the  trial  by  jury,  that 
we  know  in  England.  But  Scotland  itself  is  not  without  its 
own  experience  in  favour  of  unanimous  verdicts.  For  a  hun- 
dred years  and  more,  they  have  had  a  court  of  exchequer  in 
that  country,  in  which  all  verdicts  must  be  so  taken  ;  and  the 
clause  complained  of  in  the  present  Bill  is  in  the  very  words 
of  the  act  of  Queen  Anne,  which  established  the  court  of  ex- 
chequer. The  most  important  of  all  issues  that  can  be  sub- 
mitted to  a  jury,  the  deliverance  between  the  king  and  a 
subject  indicted  of  high  treason,  must,  in  Scotland,  as  in  Eng- 
land, be  found  by  a  jury  all  agreed  in  their  verdict,  whether  it 
be  a  verdict  of  guilty  or  not  guilty.     Even  in  the  court  of 


538  SPEECHES    IN    PARLIAMENT. 

justiciary,  a  recent  act  of  parliament,  allowing  of  oral  verdicts 
when  the  jury  are  agreed,  shows  that  there  is  a  tendency  in 
the  modern  course  of  the  criminal  law  of  Scotland,  which  that 
useful  statute  will  confirm,  in  favour  of  verdicts  formed  by 
agreement. 

The  last  objection  made  by  these  petitioners  to  the  present 
Bill,  was,  that  it  did  in  terms  confine  the  trial  by  jury  to  mere 
issues  in  matters  of  fact,  as  it  was  originally  expressed. 
There  was  a  danger,  the  petition  would  have  it,  that  Scotch 
juries  would  be  allowed  to  try  what  the  petition  calls  general 
issues.  He  said  he  should  be  apt  to  conjecture,  that  this  ob- 
jection did  not  come  from  any  person  who  knew  much  either 
of  the  law  of  England,  or  the  law  of  Scotland.  The  alteration 
of  expression  that  had  been  made  in  the  Bill,  by  leaving  out 
the  words  "  matters  of  fact,"  was  necessary  to  render  it  con- 
sistent, and  to  render  its  enactments  applicable  to  their  pur- 
poses. 

If  the  jury  could  never  have  any  occasion  to  be  directed  in 
matters  of  law,  why  any  provisions  for  securing  to  parties  an 
appeal  against  misdirections  of  the  judge  at  the  trial?  No 
human  being  would  ever  think  of  ascertaining,  by  the  verdict 
of  a  jury,  any  thing  but  fact.  Yet  it  required  very  little  in- 
sight into  law,  to  be  made  sensible,  that  perfectly  to  detect 
the  fact  of  an  issue  from  all  matter  of  law,  was  in  most  cases 
a  process  of  nicety,  and  in  many  instances  was  wholly  im- 
practicable. To  say  that  no  issue  shall  be  sent  to  a  jury,  in 
which  they  can  possibly  stand  in  need  of  the  direction  of  the 
judge  in  points  of  law,  is  nearly  equivalent  to  a  negative  of 
all  trials  of  issues  by  a  jury.  It  is  the  business  of  the  judge 
to  clear  for  the  jury  the  mixed  question  of  law  and  fact,  when 
the  question  for  their  consideration  is  unavoidably  a  mixed 
one,  as  it  is  the  duty  of  the  jury  to  take  the  law  from  the  di- 
rection of  the  judge.  To  eflfect  the  separation  of  facts  in  an 
issue  from  the  law  bearing  upon  them  is,  as  far  as  it  can  be 
effected,  the  province  of  what  is  technically  called  pleading, 
which  more  or  less  forms  a  part  of  every  system  of  law,  but 
has  never  been  carried  to  any  great  degree  of  accuracy  and 
precision,  except  where  trial  by  jury  is  established.     And  one 


JURY    TRIAL    IN    SCOTLAND.  539 

of  tlio  chief  advantages  of  civil  trial  by  jury,  with  a  view  to 
fixing  the  rules  of  law  with  greater  certainty,  is,  that  more 
than  any  other  contrivance,  it  facilitates  the  analysis  of  com- 
plex issues  into  the  matter  of  fact  and  matter  of  law.  This 
was  an  objection  which  could  not  be  insisted  upon  by  any 
lawyer  who  was  friendly  to  the  object  of  the  Bill,  and  under- 
stood it. 

He  concluded  with  expressing  his  conviction,  that  the  final 
object  which  the  Bill  had  in  view,  was  the  greatest  improve- 
ment of  which  the  administration  of  justice  in  Scotland  was 
susceptible;  and  that  the  present  provisions  of  the  Bill,  with 
the  single  exception  he  had  before  adverted  to,  were  framed 
with  much  wisdom  for  attaining  that  object.  It  had  cost  him 
at  first  some  difficulty  to  assent  to  the  discretionary  power, 
which  is  entrusted  to  the  Court  of  Session  of  directing  issues. 
But  he  saw  that  the  change  could  not  with  safety  be  made, 
unless  it  was  made  gradually  and  experimentally  under  the 
eye  of  Parliament  watching  the  progress  of  the  experiment, 
and  he  was  reconciled  to  this  unavoidable  compromise  of 
principle  by  the  express  declaration  on  the  face  of  the  Bill, 
that  it  was  only  for  the  period  of  this  temporary  act,  and  for 
the  sake  of  trying  the  experiment  with  more  caution,  that  a 
discretion  of  such  a  nature  was  thus  entrusted  to  the  court. 


540  SPEECHES    IN   PARLIAMENT. 

TIT.   TREATIES    OF   PEACE. 

20tli  February,  1816. 
(Vol.  II.  p.  340.) 

Mr.  Horner  began  by  apologising  for  troubling  the  House 
at  a  late  hour,  and  for  entering  on  a  discussion  so  entirely 
above  his  powers.  Nothing,  he  said,  would  have  induced  him 
to  do  so,  but  an  anxiety  to  have  his  opinions  on  the  subject 
of  the  treaties  clearly  understood  ;  and  though  these  opinions 
must,  in  many  material  points,  difier  from  the  opinions  of 
some  who  had  preceded  him,  yet  there  was  one  point  on 
which,  though  it  might  seem  already  hackneyed,  he  wished 
for  a  moment  to  touch ;  for,  whatever  his  opinions  might  be 
as  to  the  principle  of  the  war,  and  the  negotiations  by  which 
it  had  been  terminated,  he  was  not  slower  than  any  other  man 
to  exult  at  the  splendid  success  of  our  efforts  in  arms.  Our 
gallant  servants  had  performed  their  duty  with  an  heroism 
unexampled  ;  they  had  not  only  given  us  a  leader  of  unrivalled 
eminence,  but  had  placed  the  character  of  the  British  army 
above  all  comparison.  It  had,  since  the  Battle  of  Waterloo, 
been  admitted,  even  by  the  confession  of  an  enemy,  that  the 
infantry  of  England  had  no  equal.  He  did  look  on  this  as  a 
great  acquisition  of  glory,  a  great  acquisition  of  strength  ; 
and  his  prayer  was,  that  the  military  strength  thus  acquired 
might  be  properly  made  use  of.  The  proper  use  of  that 
strength  was,  first,  to  reserve  it  for  the  defence  of  our  country; 
and,  next,  in  foreign  interposition,  when  that  interposition 
should  be  clearly  and  absolutely  necessary  to  our  welfare; 
but  we  were  to  remember  that  it  would  be  employed  un- 
necessarily in  continental  quarrels,  or  in  projects  of  unjustifi- 
able ambition.  It  was  obvious  that  they  had  mixed  up  the 
whole  of  their  transactions  with  French  politics ;  and  though 
it  was  impossible  for  the  House  not  to  entertain  some  feelings 
on  that  subject,  yet  they  ought  to  interfere  with  it  as  little  as 
possible.  By  an  unnecessary  interposition,  they  would  be 
unavoidably  led   to   involve   themselves  in  the  factions  and 


TREATIES    OF    PEACE.  541 

views  of  their  neighbours,  and  be  drawn  out  of  the  circle;  of 
their  own  aflairs,  which  were  quite  enough  for  them  without 
considering  whether  this  or  that  form  of  government  was 
most  beneficial  to  the  people.  Ilis  main  objections,  however, 
to  the  treaties  were,  that  they  did  not  provide  that  security 
which  the  country  had  a  right  to  expect;  and  it  demanded 
the  most  serious  consideration,  that  in  prosecuting  the  war  to 
an  end,  his  Majesty's  ministers  had  at  last  disclosed  that  im- 
portant project  which  they  had  so  anxiously  disavowed  at 
first;  namely,  the  determination  of  forcing  the  Bourbon  family 
on  the  throne  of  France,  contrary  to  the  faith  of  the  crown, 
contrary  to  the  pledge  which  had  been  given  to  parliament, 
and  in  direct  violation  of  the  solemn  engagement  and  promise 
to  the  nation  of  France  at  large.  On  former  occasions  the 
noble  lord  had  expressly  avowed,  that  the  professed  object  of 
the  war  was  of  a  very  different  nature.  The  idea  of  forcing 
any  particular  person  on  the  French  had  been  repeatedly  dis- 
claimed, on  the  principle  that  it  was  carrying  their  measm-es 
further  than  the  justice  of  the  case  allowed  :  but  now,  for- 
sooth, it  was  openly,  and  without  a  blush,  acknowledged,  that 
however  the  national  honour  had  been  violated,  it  had  always 
been  considered  that  such  a  result  of  the  contest  would  be 
satisfactory.  It  was  now  too  late,  indeed,  to  say,  that  they 
had  not  resolved  to  interfere  with  the  internal  government  of 
France  ;  but  they  excused  themselves  by  saying,  that  they 
might  interpose  on  a  necessary  occasion. 

It  must,  indeed,  be  within  the  recollection  of  the  House, 
that  when  it  was  put  to  the  noble  lord,  whether  the  restora- 
tion of  the  Bourbons  was  the  object  of  the  war,  he  distinctly 
and  repeatedly  disclaimed  it.  It  was  notorious,  that  upon 
this  understanding,  several  gentlemen  in  that  House  voted  for 
the  war.  Yet  it  was  now  evident  from  the  treaties  upon  the 
table,  that  the  restoration  of  the  Bourbons  and  their  mainte- 
nance upon  the  throne  of  France,  was  really  and  truly  the 
object  of  the  war.  Why,  then,  was  not  this  object  openly 
and  manfully  avowed  at  the  outset?  With  what  view  was  it 
disguised?  Why,  obviously  for  the  purpose  of  obtaining 
votes  in  that  House,  and  practising  delusion  upon  England, 

VOL.  II.  46 


542  SPEECHES   IN   PARLIAMENT. 

upon  France,  and  upon  Europe.     The  effect  of  this  delusion 
and    duplicity  upon    France   was,  as  he  understood  from  the 
best  authority,  to  dispose  the  well-informed  and  the  reflecting 
part  of  France,  who  belonged  to  no  faction — who  were  as 
hostile  to  Bonaparte  as  they  were  indifferent  to  the  Bourbons 
—  to  look  to  the  allied  armies  as  deliverers,  as  about  to  afford 
the  French  nation  an  opportunity  of  choosing  a  government 
agreeable  to   its  own  wishes   and  interests.     The  effect  was 
indeed  such  as  to  neutralise  a  great  and  respectable  proportion 
of  the  French,  who,  instead  of  supporting  Bonaparte,  rather 
endeavoured  to  keep  down  the  spirit  of  the  people,  and  induce 
them   to    confide    in    the    declarations   of  the    allies.      Many 
Frenchmen  believed  those  declarations,  confirmed  as  they  so 
often  were  by  the  solemn  pledges  of  the  ministers  of  England. 
But   the    believers  were   dupes.     For  himself  as  well  as  for 
several  of  his  friends,  he  could  state  that  he  never  was  duped 
by  these  declarations,  or  by  the  pledges  of  the    noble  lord, 
because  he  always  thought  that  to  be  the  sole  object  of  the 
war,    which   events    had   demonstrated.     But   he   would    ask 
some   gentlemen  in   that  House  who  thought  differently,  who 
grounded   their  votes  upon   an  entire  credit  in  the  professions 
of  the   noble  lord,  how  they  now  felt?     He  would  appeal  to 
the  whole  House,  to  parliament,  and  the  country,  what  ought 
to  be  the  feeling  of  a  proud  and  honest  nation,  tenacious  of  its 
character  for  good   faith,  upon  comparing  the  pledges  of  its 
government  at  the  commencement  of  the  war,  with  the  con- 
duct of  that  government  at  its  conclusion.     Was  there  to  be 
no  faith, then,  in  these  solemn  promises?     Could  it  be  a  satis- 
factory feeling  to    any    honest  member,   who   possessed    the 
generous  spirit  of  an   Englishman,  to  know  that  the  engage- 
ments of  ministers  with  the  French  nation  had  not  been  kept  ? 
His  Majesty's  government  had  declared  manfully,  boldly,  and 
plainly,  what  their  purposes  were ;  but  it  was  one  of  the  most 
melancholy  features  of  the  times  that  the  bonds  of  political 
faith  were  not  so  strong  as  they  used  to  be.     Whatever  doubt 
might  exist  in  some  minds  as  to  the  import  of  the  declaration 
on  which  the  war  was  commenced,  there  could  be  no  possible 
misunderstanding  as  to  the  object  of  the  treaties.     It  was  no 


TREATIES    OF   PEACE.  543 

longer  to  get  rid  of  the  dangerous  ambition  of  Bonaparte  ;  it 
was  not  to  prevent  the  military  power  of  France  from  en- 
croaching on  neighbouring  states.  No!  it  was  to  maintain 
the  family  of  the  Bourbons  on  the  throne,  whatever  might  be 
the  feelings  of  the  people  towards  them.  If  it  were  pre- 
tended, as  he  understood  it  had  been  somewhere  said,  that  the 
conduct  of  the  French  army  in  invading  the  Netherlands 
released  the  Allies  from  their  pledges  not  to  force  a  govern- 
ment upon  France,  he  would  ask  the  noble  lord  and  his  col- 
leagues, whether  they,  who  always  alleged  that  the  French 
people  were  hostile  to  Bonaparte,  and  that  he  was  supported 
only  by  the  army,  could  consistently  maintain  that  the  con- 
duct of  that  army  could  release  the  Allies  from  their  solemn 
pledges  to  the  people,  not  to  force  any  particular  government 
upon  them  ?  But  yet  this  government  was  imposed  upon 
France,  and  it  appeared  that  with  a  view  to  maintain  it,  cer- 
tain precautionary  measures,  as  the  noble  lord  termed  them, 
were  adopted.  Among  those  measures  a  large  pecuniary  con- 
tribution was  levied,  and  this  contribution  the  noble  lord 
called,  rather  singularly,  a  main  feature  of  the  tranquillising 
policy  to  be  acted  upon  towards  France.  This  was  really  a 
most  extraordinary  view,  perhaps  peculiar  to  the  mind  of  the 
noble  lord;  for  it  was  the  first  time  he  had  heard,  that 
to  subject  any  people  to  a  large  pecuniary  contribution  was 
a  good  mode  of  producing  their  tranquillity.  Certainly 
the  noble  lord  could  not  have  learned  that  doctrine  in 
England,  where  a  large  pecuniary  contribution  was  not 
very  apt  to  produce  popular  tranquillity.  Indeed,  he  rather 
apprehended  that  an  opposite  feeling  would  arise  in  this  coun- 
try, if  that  contribution  were  enforced  by  a  foreign  army. 
Why,  then,  should  the  noble  lord  calculate  upon  a  different 
result  in  France  ?  But  upon  this  point  it  seemed  that  accord- 
ing to  the  doctrine  of  some  gentlemen,  the  contribution  raised 
in  France,  instead  of  falling  into  the  pockets  of  the  people, 
and  being  placed  under  the  controul  of  parliament,  was  to 
become  the  property  of  the  privy  purse,  to  be  applied,  per- 
haps, to  enable  the  Pope  to  carry  home  some  works  of  art 
from  Paris,  or  to  erect  a  statue  to  Henry  IX.  (Cardinal  York.) 


54*4  SPEECHES    IN   PARLIAMENT. 

He  wished,  however,  that  this  novel  doctrine  might  now  be 
repelled,  as  inconsistent  with  the  constitution  and  laws  of  this 
country.  But  as  a  further  precautionary  measure  to  keep  the 
Bourbons  upon  the  throne,  it  appeared  that  150,000  men,  com- 
posed of  different  nations,  were  placed  in  France.  So  it  was 
calculated  that  the  presence  of  this  foreign  force,  under  the 
command  of  a  general,  who  was  a  native  of  a  country  always 
the  rival  of  France,  was  likely  by  degrees  to  reconcile  the 
French  people  to  the  government  which  that  force  had  imposed 
upon  them.  But  what  could  be  the  character  of  the  minds 
which  entertained  such  a  calculation  ?  Would  not  every  ra- 
tional being  rather  conclude  that  the  presence  of  such  a  force 
must  serve  to  form  a  perpetual  fester  in  the  breast  of  France, 
instead  of  contributing  to  the  tranquillity  and  contentment  of 
that  country?  But,  according  to  the  express  opinion  of  some 
gentlemen,  that  which  was  most  galling  and  offensive  to  the 
French  formed  an  argument  to  justify  the  expectation  of  order 
and  repose.  Those  only,  however,  who  entertained  such  a  sin- 
gular notion  could,  he  believed,  concur  in  the  views  of  the 
Allies  in  placing  an  armed  force  in  France.  And  what  estimate 
must  those  gentlemen  have  formed  of  the  character  of  the 
French  people  —  distinguished  as  that  people  always  were  for 
national  pride  and  military  spirit?  How,  he  would  ask,  was 
that  proceeding  likely  to  operate  upon  them,  which  was  calcu- 
lated to  rouse  the  most  sluggish  nation  upon  earth  ?  How 
were  the  French  people  to  feel  towards  a  sovereign  twice 
forced  upon  them  by  an  army  of  foreign  bayonets  ?  For  when 
that  army  was  on  the  first  instance  withdrawn,  that  sovereign 
was  soon  compelled  to  quit  the  country ;  and  he  would  put  it 
to  the  candour  of  any  man,  if  the  French  people  were  friendly 
to  that  sovereign,  why  should  it  be  necessary  to  maintain  him 
on  the  throne  by  the  assistance  of  a  foreign  army  ?  The  di- 
lemma was  obvious;  —  either  the  French  were  friendly  to  the 
king,  or  they  were  not.  Tf  the  former,  the  foreign  army  was 
unnecessary  to  the  maintenance  of  the  king;  but  if  unfriendly, 
the  presence  of  this  army  was  calculated  to  augment  their  dis- 
like. For  what  could  be  more  galling  to  a  Frenchman,  than  to 
suppose  his  king  guilty  of  that  which  was  the  greatest  treason 


TREATIES    OF    PEACE.  545 

any  sovereign  could  commit,  namely,  that  of  inviting  the  assist- 
ance of  a  foreign  force?  While  the  French  were  our  active 
enemies  in  war,  we  must  rejoice  in  their  defeat;  but  now 
that  they  were  completely  fallen,  must  not  every  considerate 
man  feel  for  a  people  so  circumstanced  ?  Was  there,  besides, 
no  danger  to  be  apprehended  from  the  result  of  a  national 
movement  against  the  army  by  which  the  French  were  so 
grievously  oppressed?  The  great  power  of  the  Allies  would 
no  doubt  defeat  such  a  movement ;  and  could  any  man  doubt 
that  the  eflect  of  such  defeat  would  be  the  dismemberment 
and  partition  of  France  ?  What,  then,  would  be  the  conse- 
quences ?  It  would,  perhaps,  be  said  that  no  danger  whatever 
was  to  be  apprehended  from  the  ambition  of  any  of  the 
Allies  —  that  none  of  them  were  capable  of  meditating 
any  wrong.  But  the  noble  lord  had  written  much  against  the 
plans  of  aggrandizement  entertained  by  Prussia.  His  letter 
to  Count  Hardenberg,  on  this  subject,  was  in  the  recollection 
of  the  House,  as  was  the  treaty  which  he  concluded  in  January, 
1815,  with  France  and  Austria,  to  guard  against  the  danger  of 
those  plans.  And  here  he  must  observe  in  passing,  that  wiiile 
the  noble  lord  himself  declaimed  against  the  views  of  Prussia, 
he  was  quite  in  a  rage  if  any  observation  whatever  against  any 
of  our  foreign  allies  happened  to  proceed  from  the  opposition 
side  of  the  House.  But  to  return  to  France.  If  that  country 
should  be  dismembered  —  if  it  should  cease  to  be  a  substantial 
power  in  Europe,  by  the  division  of  its  territory  among  the 
despots  of  the  North,  what  then  would  be  the  state  of  this 
country  ?  In  such  an  event  what  must  be  the  amount  of  our 
establishments,  both  naval  and  military,  in  order  to  guard 
against  the  dangers  naturally  to  be  apprehended  from  the 
occupation  of  France  by  those  formidable  powers  ?  Now,  as 
to  another  point.  It  was  stated  by  the  noble  lord,  that  he 
was  pressed  by  several  reflecting  persons  in  France  to  secure 
the  guarantee  of  the  Allies  to  the  maintenance  of  the  con- 
stitutional  charter.  But  to  this  the  noble  lord  refused  to 
accede,  while  an  unreserved  guarantee  was  granted  to  maintain 
the  king  upon  the  throne.  No  stipulation  was  made  to  support 
the  constitution,  which,  by  the  bye,  had  since  been  repeatedly 

46* 


546  SPEECHES    IN   PARLIAMENT. 

violated.  While  every  arrangement  was  made  that  appeared 
to  the  Allies  necessary  to  provide  for  the  maintenance  of  the 
king,  nothing  was  done  to  preserve  the  privileges  of  the 
people.  The  Allies,  in  their  eagerness  to  support  the  former, 
overlooked  the  conciliation  of  the  latter,  although  that  con- 
ciliation  would  have  been  the  best  policy.  But  such  policy 
was  not  within  the  consideration  of  despots.  —  Here  he  felt  it 
necessary  to  make  a  few  remarks  upon  the  assertion  of  the 
noble  lord,  that  the  whigs  of  the  present  day  forgot  or  de- 
parted from  the  doctrines  of  those  whom  the  noble  lord  called, 
their  progenitors.  But  this  assertion  was  grossly  erroneous, 
as  would  appear  upon  a  review  of  the  address  moved  by  Mr. 
Fox  in  1793.  For  in  this  address  that  great  man  did  not 
propose  to  protest  against  our  interference  in  the  affairs  of 
any  foreign  state  as  a  general  principle,  but  against  such 
interference  under  existing  circumstances.  The  effort,  there- 
fore, to  fix  any  imputation  upon  those  whom  the  noble  lord 
denominated  the  modern  whigs,  by  contrasting  their  conduct 
with  that  of  the  old  whigs,  was  totally  ineffectual.  The 
noble  lord's  cry  of  victory  was  quite  groundless  —  was 
indeed  clumsy.  But  it  was  strange  that  the  noble  lord 
should  quote  precedents  from  those  whom  he  never  before 
affected  to  admire.  It  happened,  however,  that  in  all  the 
noble  lord's  reference  to  the  conduct  of  the  whigs,  he  be- 
trayed a  total  want  of  historical  accuracy.  This  want  of 
accuracy  was  indeed  particularly  evident  in  the  noble  lord's 
reference  to  the  quadruple  and  triple  alliances,  for  neither 
furnished  any  precedent  in  favour  of  the  noble  lord's  cause. 
On  the  contrary,  it  was  notorious  that,  in  the  former,  the  whigs 
obtained  a  guarantee  from  the  Allies,  that  they  should  not  in- 
terfere with  the  right  of  this  country  to  choose  its  own  govern- 
ment, which  choice  was  made  decidedly  against  the  doctrine 
of  legitimacy  and  the  divine  right  of  kings ;  for  this  country 
on  that  occasion  dismissed  king  James  with  his  hereditary 
rights,  and  selected  William,  with  a  view  to  establish  a  govern- 
ment congenial  to  the  constitution  and  assent  of  the  people. 
Then,  again,  as  to  the  triple  alliance,  the  object  of  that  con- 
federacy formed  by  the  whigs,  was  to  withstand  the  principle 


TRExVTIES    OF    TEACE.  547 

of  legitimacy  by  preventing  the  House  of  Bourbon  from  be- 
coming possessed  of  the  throne  of  Spain.  How,  then,  could 
either  of  those  alliances  be  said  to  furnish  any  precedent  in 
favour  of  the  conduct  of  the  noble  lord  and  the  AUies,  in 
forcing  a  government  upon  France  according  to  the  doctrine 
of  legitimacy  ?  But  there  was  a  precedent  on  the?  occasion  of 
the  triple  alliance,  which  the  noble  lord  might  have  quoted  in 
support  of  his  views :  for  Louis  XIV.  at  that  time  sought  to 
force  a  government  u]ion  Spain,  according  to  the  principle  of 
legitimacy  ;  and  the  noble  lord,  in  overlooking  this  circum- 
stance, showed  that  he  was  quite  as  ill  versed  in  tory  as  he 
was  in  whig  precedents.  The  noble  lord  should,  therefore, 
before  he  ventured  to  quote  again,  study  history  with  more 
attention.  But,  with  respect  to  the  principle  of  legitimacy, 
he  fully  concurred  in  what  the  House  had  heard  go  eloquently 
urged  in  an  early  stage  of  the  debate  by  an  honourable  mem- 
ber (Mr.  Law)  upon  that  subject,  namely,  that  hereditary 
right  was  not  essential  to  the  maintenance  of  monarchy.  It 
was,  in  fact,  but  subsidiary  to  that  object,  as  our  own  histofy 
demonstrated.  For  the  maintenance  of  this  principle  was 
subordinate  to  the  preservation  of  the  constitution  and  laws 
of  any  country,  and  meant  not  that  the  direct  lineal  descend- 
ant should  be  preferred,  but  that  some  such  member  of  the 
family  of  the  monarch  should  be  selected,  as  might  be  best  dis- 
posed and  best  calculated  to  maintain  the  laws  and  liberties 
of  the  country.  This  was  the  true  sound  doctrine  sanctioned 
by  the  wise  example  of  England.  But  the  sole  object  of  the 
late  war  and  of  the  treaties  which  followed  it  manifestly  was, 
to  place  a  monarch  upon  the  throne  of  France,  without  any 
regard  to  the  laws,  the  liberties,  or  the  wishes  of  the  people. 
The  restoration  of  that  monarch  was,  no  doubt,  thought  a 
most  desirable  object,  with  a  view  to  re-establish  the  peace  of 
Europe,  by  some  great  statesman,  both  in  that  and  the  other 
house  of  parliament,  who  maintained  that  this  object  ought  to 
have  been  avowed  at  the  outset  as  the  great  end  of  the  war. 
But  this  object  was  disguised  by  the  noble  lord  from  the  con- 
sideration of  the  House,  although  it  was  now  evident  that  it 
was  really   the   chief  end   of  the  war.     The  noble  lord,  no 


548  SPEECHES    IN    PAKLIAMENT. 

doubt,  also  wished  to  put  down  all  the  principles  of  the 
Revolution,  which  he  might  conceive  a  very  desirable  end, 
and  it  was  consistent  with  his  views  that  every  thing  that 
could  be  accomplished  should  be  done  for  sovereigns,  and 
nothing  for  the  people.  That  such  was  the  intention  was 
pretty  evident  from  what  had  taken  place  within  the  last  two 
years.  A  great  statesman  had  often  observed,  that  of  all 
revolutions  a  restoration  was  the  greatest,  and  that  of  all  in- 
novators an  arbitrary  monarch  was  the  most  dangerous.  This, 
indeed,  was  fully  evinced  in  what  had  taken  place  in  Wurtem- 
berg,  in  Prussia,  and  in  certain  states  upon  the  Rhine,  where 
nothing  whatever  of  right  was  restored  to  the  people,  while 
the  authority  of  sovereigns,  whether  crowned  since  or  before 
the  Revolution,  was  established  and  confirmed.  The  total 
disregard,  indeed,  of  popular  rights  was  manifested  in  various 
parts  of  the  recent  arrangements  ;  but  it  was  sufficient  to 
refer  to  the  instances  of  Venice  and  Genoa.  But  the  most 
odious  part  of  the  late  arrangements,  which  appeared  from  a 
tr'baty  on  the  table,  was,  the  league  of  arbitrary  sovereigns  to 
meet  annually  for  the  purpose  of  considering  their  interests  ; 
for  what  rational  man  could  doubt  what  such  sovereisrns 
would,  in  the  long  run,  consider  their  interests,  how  they 
would  decide  upon  every  indication  of  popular  feeling,  or 
upon  any  movement  in  favour  of  popular  principles?  The 
noble  lord  even,  who  was  the  advocate  of  every  act  of  those 
sovereigns  —  who  was  ready  to  take  up  the  gauntlet  in  that 
House  for  every  one  of  them,  could  not  be  much  at  a  loss  to 
decide  upon  their  probable  views,  if  he  would  only  take  the 
trouble  of  looking  with  but  common  attention  to  history. 
Let  him  look,  for  instance,  to  the  conduct  of  Austria  towards 
Hungary  and  the  Low  Countries;  let  him  look  at  the  con- 
duct of  three  of  those  sovereigns  with  respect  to  Poland. 
Hence  it  might  be  concluded  how  these  sovereigns  were  likely 
to  decide  for  their  own  interests,  and  against  the  privileges  of 
the  people.  But  it  appeared,  from  the  noble  lord's  own  state- 
ment, how  these  sovereigns  felt  with  regard  to  popular  privi- 
leges, from  the  jealousy  which  they  expressed  respecting  the 
freedom  of  debate  in  that  House.     He  should  like  to  know 


TREATIES    OF    PEACE.  549 

whether  these  sovereigns  expressed  that  jealousy  in  the  noble 
lord's  presence,  and  whether  they  obtained  his  acquiescence. 
It  would,  indeed,  be  surprising  if  the  noble  lord,  who  had 
himself  acquired  so  much  distinction  as  a  parliamentary 
orator,  especially  in  favour  of  popular  privileges,  and  who  was 
said  to  have  made  such  long  speeches  to  these  sovereigns 
themselves,  no  doubt  in  the  same  strain,  could  silently  listen 
to  such  an  expression  of  jealousy  with  regard  to  the  freedom 
of  the  British  parliament.  Yet  the  noble  lord  had  observed, 
that  these  arbitrary  monarchs  were  truly  indisposed  to  follow 
up  some  arrangements  which  they  had  in  contemplation  for 
the  establishment  of  popular  privileges,  in  consequence  of 
some  speeches  in  that  House.  What  a  compliment  did  the 
noble  lord  thus  record  in  favour  of  the  virtue  and  firmness  of 
these  sovereigns.  So,  they  were  dissuaded  from  doing  that 
which  they  themselves  thought  proper,  in  consequence  of 
parliamentary  speeches  in  England  !  They  declined  to  do 
right,  because  some  of  them  might  have  been  censured  for 
doing  wrong  —  because,  for  instance,  such  an  able  senator  as 
the  late  Mr.  Whitbread  —  because  that  great  man,  who  had, 
perhaps,  more  of  the  good  man  in  his  composition  than  any 
great  man  that  ever  existed,  felt  it  his  duty  to  expose  and  re- 
probate some  act  of  oppression  or  injustice.  He  trusted, 
however,  that  such  a  feeling  of  duty  would  ever  be  found  to 
prevail  in  that  House.  But,  seriously,  could  it  be  believed 
that  the  sovereigns  alluded  to  could  have  been  prevented  from 
making  arrangements  in  favour  of  popular  liberty,  by  any 
thing  that  happened  to  fall  from  an  obscure  minority  in  that 
House,  seconded  as  their  disposition  must  have  been  by  the 
noble  lord  himself  at  the  head  of  his  immense  majorities  ? 
The  opinions  of  these  military  despots,  on  this,  as  well  as 
upon  other  subjects,  he  entirely  disregarded.  No  prospect 
could  be  entertained  that  any  thing  would  be  done  by  them  for 
the  rights  of  mankind.  His  hopes  of  improvement  were  de- 
rived from  a  different  quarter.  They  were  not  directed  to  in- 
novation, but  to  a  beneficial  change  effected  through  the  me- 
dium of  constitutional  organs,  and  the  wholesome  operation 
of  public  opinion.     Even  though  there  was  reason  to  believe 


550  SPEECHES   IN   PARLIAMENT. 

that  the  sovereigns  appointed  their  meetings  with  no  pre- 
concerted designs  against  the  liberties  of  the  world  —  even 
although  they  formed  no  deliberate  conspiracy  against  the 
rights  of  their  subjects,  still  he  could  not  but  view  the  close 
association,  that  would  appear  to  be  established  between  such 
great  military  powers,  without  great  jealousy.  The  great  ob- 
ject of  our  late  struggle  was  avowed  to  be  the  destruction  of 
the  military  principle  in  Europe,  which  was  incompatible  with 
the  liberties,  the  happiness,  and  the  social  tranquillity  of  man- 
kind. By  unparalleled  efforts,  by  persevering  and  heroic 
sacrifices,  we  had  extinguished  the  great  military  despotism, 
which  agitated  and  conquered  and  oppressed  the  nations  of 
the  Continent;  but  was  the  situation  of  Europe  much  im- 
proved, if  the  present  system  was  to  be  carried  into  complete 
effect,  and  the  late  arrangements  were  henceforward  to  be 
universally  adhered  to  ?  We  had,  indeed,  annihilated  the 
most  extensive,  the  universally  felt  military  despotism,  but 
there  were  now  three  or  four  to  spring  up  and  to  occupy  its 
place.  Their  union,  for  purposes  connected  with  their  own 
support  and  extension,  might  be  nearly  as  dangerous  as  the 
one  from  which  we  congratulated  ourselves  on  being  delivered. 
These  military  sovereigns  were  to  meet  and  consult  for  their 
common  security  or  mutual  interests,  and  nothing  could  be 
done,  or  permitted  to  exist  in  Europe,  without  their  consent. 
[The  hon.  and  learned  gentleman  then  went  into  an  examina- 
tion of  the  securities  established  in  the  treaties.]  He  wished 
to  meet  the  question  of  security  fairly  and  impartially  ;  but 
he  could  not  help  inquiring  at  first,  what  were  the  evils 
against  which  security  and  guarantee  were  required  ?  What 
were  we  to  guard  against  ?  We  were  at  the  end  of  five  and 
twenty  years  of  convulsion,  revolution,  and  war.  In  that 
period  the  institutions  of  society,  the  political  arrangements, 
and  the  relative  condition  of  the  different  orders  in  the  civil 
state,  had  undergone  great  changes.  A  new  spirit  was  cre- 
ated, and  had  operated  powerfully  in  bringing  about  the 
present  circumstances.  There  might  be  different  views  enter- 
tained, and  there  were  certainly  very  different  opinions  de- 
livered on  our  present  situation.    Some  thought  that  the  revo- 


TREATIES    OF   PEACE.  551 

lutionary  spirit,  which  produced  such  atrocities  in  its  first  dis- 
phiy  and  subsequent  operations,  still  existed  in  France  in  all 
its  malignity,  and  that  its  existence,  in  any  degree,  was  incon- 
sistent with  national  tranquillity  or  civil  order.  This  opinion 
had  been  declared  by  many  members  in  the  House,  and  was 
entertained  by  a  great  party  out  of  it ;  but  he  thought  that  it 
was  entertained  upon  false  and  narrow  views.  There  were 
other  persons  who  took  views  entirely  opposite,  but  equally 
distant  from  reason  and  sound  policy.  They  would  not  be 
satisfied,  if  France  did  not  at  once  carry  into  practice  all  those 
ideas  of  political  freedom  that  they  entertained :  they  would 
not  be  contented  with  less  than  seeing  France  in  possession  of 
all  those  institutions,  and  that  free  constitution,  that  this 
country  enjoyed,  without  taking  into  consideration  the  differ- 
ence that  existed  between  the  state  and  the  ideas  of  the  two 
nations.  It  was  needless  to  say  that  he  disapproved  of  both 
these  extremes.  Whether  the  Revolution  in  France  was  good 
or  bad,  whether  it  had  contributed  to  promote  the  liberties  and 
rights  of  the  nation  or  not,  it  could  not  be  denied  that  there 
had  arisen  out  of  it  a  state  of  things  which  could  not  be  al- 
tered, a  spirit  which  could  not  be  entirely  extinguished.  If 
the  restoration  of  the  Bourbons  proceeded  upon  the  suppo- 
sition that  every  thing  was  to  be  restored  to  its  former  con- 
dition, and  that  every  new  interest  was  to  be  destroyed,  the 
project  could  not  be  realised ;  and  those  who  entertained  it 
were  not  aware  of  the  obstacles  they  would  have  to  encounter 
in  attempting  its  execution.  Every  thing  was  changed  in  the 
Revolution —  property  had  been  transferred  to  new  hands  — 
the  people  had  acquired  new  ideas — the  privileged  orders  had 
been  abolished,  or  their  claims  reduced  —  political  institu- 
tions were  altered,  and  a  new  distribution  of  political  power 
had  established  a  spirit  of  inquiry,  and  a  disposition  to  dis- 
cuss the  conduct  of  rulers  was  every  where  diffused.  It  was 
difficult  to  calculate  the  power  of  these  changes.  We  might 
guard  against  the  effects  of  them,  but  we  could  not  bring 
things  back  to  their  former  situation.  Happily  this  was  not 
necessary  for  our  security,  as  it  certainly  was  not  practicable; 
in  its  execution.     The  real  security  which  was  required  from 


552  SPEECHES    IN    PARLIAMENT. 

France,  after  the  destruction  of  that  nnilitary  monarchy  which 
oppressed  the  greatest  part  of  the  continent  of  Europe,  com- 
bined the  integrity  of  that  Idngdom  with  the  establishment  of 
a  government   agreeably  to  the  wishes,  and  deserving  of  the 
confidence  of  the  people.     The  hon.  and  learned  gentleman 
said  he  would  decline  entering  upon  a  discussion  of  the  other 
kinds  of  security  required   against  France.     The  question  of 
territorial  cession   had  been  discussed  at  great  length,  and  he 
would  merely  state,  that  in  his  opinion   any  attempt  to  dis- 
member France,  instead  of  being  likely  to  afford  any  security 
for  the  continuance  of  peace,  would  be  the  certain  source  of 
inquietude  and  danger.     Pie  would  not  enter  upon  the  pro- 
priety of  demanding  a  barrier  on  the  side  of  the  Netherlands, 
as  that  seemed  to  be  of  the  same  nature  with  territorial  ces- 
sions ;  but  he  would  say  that  he  would  place  no  reliance   on 
any  guarantee   founded  on  the  basis  of  reduction  or  dismem- 
berment.    There  was  no  chance  of  the  stability  of  peace,  if 
guarantees  were  sought  for  in  measures  that  must  be  galling 
and  irritating  to  the  French  people ;  there  was  no  chance  of 
continued  tranquillity  but  in  conciliatory  arrangements  ;  there 
was  no  chance  of  reconciling  them  to  Europe  but  by  allowing 
them    to    establish    the  government   they    liked.     We    could 
never  rationally  entertain  confidence  in  the  pacific  dispositions 
of  people   on  whom  we  forced   a  government  by  conquest, 
which  we  maintained  by  arms.     The  sentiments  of  the  people 
could  not  manifest  themselves  while  a  powerful  army  occu- 
pied a  part  of  their  territory,  and  might  be  called  in  to  repress 
them.     There    had  been    a  good  deal    said  by  a  right    hon. 
friend  of '  his   (Mr.  Elliot)  concerning  the  Chamber  of  Depu- 
ties ;  but  he  could  not  agree  with  him  in  supposing,  that  that 
body  could  be  considered  as  an   organ  for  the  expression  of 
popular  feeling  and  opinion.    How  was  the  Chamber  elected  ? 
It  was  elected  by  the  influence  of  the  royal  power  —  it  was 
filled  by  that  execrable  person  Fouchd,  a  name  connected  with 
the    greatest    atrocities   of    his  country.     That  immaculate 
statesman,  during  the  short  period  that  he  served  his  sover- 
eign, had   performed   for  him  the   office  of  selecting  the  depu- 
ties.    The  French  Revolution  had  exhibited  many  scenes  of 


TREATIES    OF    PEACE.  553 

cruelty,  atrocity,  and  horror,  and  its  principles  had  been  often 
dishonoured  by  the  profligacy  of  those  who  held  them,  or 
professed  to  carry  them  into  execution ;  but  it  arose  at  first 
from  a  love  of  liberty,  and  had  been  attended  by  consequences 
of  the  most  important  kind.  Any  man  who  had  examined 
the  state  of  France  before  the  Revolution,  and  after  it,  would 
perceive  the  good  effects  that  it  had  produced.  The  great 
body  of  the  people,  whose  interests  were  the  most  important, 
were  raised  by  it  in  education,  in  character,  in  property,  and 
in  independence.  No  revolution  since  the  Protestant  Reform- 
ation appeared  so  important  as  that  of  France.  The  people 
of  France  might,  therefore,  expect  that  some  attention  would 
be  paid  to  their  wishes,  and  that  all  the  advantages  for  which 
they  had  suffered  would  not  be  extorted  from  them.  They 
might  expect  that  they  should  be  allowed  a  free  constitution, 
and  would  it  be  honourable  in  us  to  obstruct  them  in  that 
object  ?  The  first  men  in  this  country  had  anticipated  great 
good  from  the  Revolution.  Having  thus  delivered  his  opinion 
on  our  foreign  policy,  he  would  refrain  at  that  late  hour  from 
any  discussion  on  our  military  establishments  to  support  it. 


After  what  I  have  said  of  the  impression  this  speech  had 
made  (page  341,)  had  been  printed,  I  was  favoured  with  the 
following  extract  from  a  letter  addressed  by  John  Whishaw, 
Esq.,  to  Thomas  Smith,  Esq.,  of  Easton-Grey,  Wilts,  dated 
the  2Stli  of  February,  1816. 

Speaking  of  the  debates  on  the  treaties,  he  says,  —  "  But 
the  most  fortunate  circumstance  in  these  debates,  and  which 
has  contributed  more  than  any  thing  else  to  keep  up  the 
spirits  of  the  Opposition,  was  the  admirable  speech  of  Horner ; 
which,  both  in  the  style,  manner,  and,  above  all,  in  the  excellent 
principles  with  which  it  abounded,  was  universally  acknowl- 
edged to  be  one  of  the  completest  performances  that  has 
been  witnessed  in  parliament  for  a  great  number  of  years.  It 
derived  great  weight  from  the  opinion  universally  and  justly 

VOL.  II.  47 


554  SPEECHES   IN    PARLIAMENT. 

entertained  of  the  sincerity  and  high  honour  of  the  speaker; 
and  produced  so  considerable  an  impression  as  to  mark  him 
out  for  the  future  leader  of  the  whigs,  if  that  station  had  been 
consistent  with  his  professional  pursuits.  Probably  this  speech 
did  not  influence  a  single  vote  ;  but  it  lowered  the  tone  of  the 
treasury  bench,  and  took  away  all  the  triumph  of  the  reply. 
It  was  the  universal  topic  of  conversation  for  two  or  three 
davs." 


ALIEN    BILL.  555 

VIII.   ALIEN   BILL. 

25th  and  29th  April,  lOtli  and  31st  May,  181G. 
(Vol.  II.  p.  3,')4.) 

Lord  Castlereagh,  on  the  25th  of  April,  having  moved 
for  leave  to  bring  in  this  bill, 

Mr.  Horner  rose,  and  said:  —  He  was  not  aware  that  any 
such  motion  had  been  fixed  for  this  night;  but  he  was 
anxious,  in  the  very  first  instance,  to  give  it  his  decided 
negative.  He  had  opposed  the  Alien  Bill  of  1814,  because  he 
thought  it  not  only  uncalled  for,  but  unconstitutional;  and 
if  at  that  time  it  was  not  required,  there  was  now  even  still 
less  excuse  for  such  a  measure.  The  noble  lord  had  talked 
in  his  usual  style — a  style  that  had  now  become  fashionable 
—  of  a  peace  alien  bill,  and  a  war  alien  bill.  The  House  had 
heard  lately  of  peace  regulation  bills,  and  war  regulation 
bills  ;  of  peace  bank  restriction  bills,  and  war  bank  restriction 
bills ;  and  now  it  was  once  more  to  be  told,  that  extraordinary 
powers  were  required  to  enable  ministers  to  send  foreigners 
out  of  the  country.  To  the  constitution  such  a  measure  was 
unknown,  for  it  allowed  ingress  and  egress  of  foreigners 
without  restriction ;  and  the  reason  stated  by  Mr.  Pitt  for 
the  Alien  Act  of  1792  was,  that  it  was  merely  to  secure  inter- 
nal tranquillity,  and  not  to  be  applied  to  such  purposes  as 
those  to  which  it  had  of  late  years  been  perverted  —  the  con- 
finement and  transportation  of  individuals  who  had,  for  some 
cause  or  other  not  assigned,  become  obnoxious  to  ministers. 
In  1793  certain  principles  were  afloat  which  might  be  sup- 
posed dangerous  to  the  repose  of  the  nation  ;  but  where  would 
the  noble  lord  now  discover  any  such  peril  ?  If  the  noble 
lord  could  furnish  any  from  his  fertile  imagination,  he  would 
not  find  a  man  in  the  country  to  agree  with  him.  Pie  trusted, 
now  the  possibility  of  injury  from  the  interference  of  the 
inhabitants  of  other  states  was  removed,  that  the  ancient  and 
wholesome  system  of  policy  would  be  pursued,  and  that  Great 
Britain  would  treat  strangers  with  her  wonted  liberality  and 


556  SPEECHES   IN   PARLIAMENT. 

confidence,  without  dreading  that  a  few  foreigners,  even  if 
they  were  ill-disposed,  would  be  able  to  disturb  her  tran- 
quillity and  happiness.  He  must  therefore  solemnly  protest 
against  the  introduction  of  this  peace  alien  bill. 

[On  the  29th  of  April  Sir  Samuel  Romilly  said,  that, 
understanding  that  the  second  reading  of  the  Alien  Bill 
was  fixed  for  this  day,  he  begged  to  state  that  there  were 
some  accounts  for  which  he  was  desirous  of  moving,  and  the 
production  of  which  he  thought  indispensable  to  the  House, 
before  this  Bill  proceeded  through  any  further  stage.  He 
alluded  to  an  account  of  the  number  of  aliens  sent  out  of 
this  country  at  the  instance  of  the  minister  of  any  other 
country.] 

Mr.  Horxer  said,  he  thought  it  important  that  some  day 
should  be  fixed  for  the  second  reading  of  this  Bill,  when 
gentlemen  might  come  down  with  a  certainty  of  entering  upon 
the  discussion.  This  was  impossible,  he  thought,  to-morrow, 
and  therefore  some  more  distant  day  ought  to  be  appointed. 
He  could  not  here  help  alluding  to  the  manner  in  which  this 
Bill  had  been  introduced  to  the  House.  Leave  was  moved 
for,  on  one  night,  after  a  long  discussion,  and  when  very  few 
members  were  in  the  House.  It  was  subsequently  brought 
in,  and  read  a  first  time,  under  similar  circumstances,  and  at 
two  o'clock  in  the  morning  the  second  reading  was  fixed  for 
this  day.  This  was  a  sort  of  precipitation  which  he  could 
not  help  thinking  savoured  of  a  disposition  to  steal  a  march, 
which,  with  a  bill  of  so  much  importance,  he  considered 
extremely  reprehensible.  This  was  a  Bill  which  should  be 
discussed  in  all  its  stages ;  he  therefore  hoped  some  distant 
day  would  be  named,  on  which  they  might  all  come  prepared 
to  meet  the  question  fairly. 

[On  the  10th  of  May  Lord  Castlereagh  moved  the  order  of 
the  day  for  the  second  reading  of  this  Bill. 

Lord  Archibald  Hamilton  moved  that  it  be  read  a  second 
time  that  day  three  months,  and  the  amendment  was  sup- 
ported by  jNIr.  Brougham  and  Sir  Samuel  Romilly,  who  were 
answered  by  Lord  Castlereagh.] 

Mr.  Horner  then  rose,  and  said,  —  The  noble  lord  had  set 


ALIEN    BILL.  557 

out  with  dwelling  emphatically  on  the  circumstances  in  which 
the  measure  of  1793  had  originated  —  diflcring  altogether  as 
those  circumstances  did  from  the  circumstances  of  the  pre- 
sent time.  But  the  noble  lord  had  erroneously  stated  the  argu- 
ments of  those  who,  in  1793,  opposed  the  measure.  No  man 
had  ever  denied  that  an  actual  case  of  danger  to  the  internal 
tranquillity  of  the  realm  would  be  a  sufficient  warranty  for 
the  enactment  of  such  a  measure.  Mr.  Fox  had  made  this 
statement  most  distinctly,  and  iiad  founded  his  opposition  to 
the  Bill  on  the  ground  that  no  danger  existed.  But  he  would 
pass  this  by,  and  ask  the  noble  lord  if  there  was,  at  the  present 
moment,  such  danger  as  that  which  was  assumed  to  exist  in 
1793  by  the  friends  of  the  Bill  of  that  day?  Would  the  noble 
lord  say  that  the  same  danger  now  existed  which  was  assumed 
in  1793  by  the  friends  of  the  Bill?  The  noble  lord  said  no 
such  thing.  He  could  not  say  so,  and  it  would  be  for  the 
House  to  judge  how  far  the  existence  of  any  danger  was  made 
out  on  which  the  present  bill  should  rest.  The  noble  lord 
had  said,  that  gentlemen  on  his  (Mr.  Horner's)  side  of  the 
House  were  insensible  to  the  dangers  of  the  country  in  their 
opposition  to  this  Bill.  This  he  denied.  They  considered 
that  for  any  misconduct  of  aliens  in  this  country  the  operation 
of  the  common  law  would  be  a  sufficient  remedy.  It  was  so 
considered  by  our  ancestors,  who,  until  1793,  never  sought 
any  other  protection  against  the  conduct  of  aliens  but  the 
common  law.  But  would  it  be  argued  that  before  that  period 
the  country  was  in  no  danger  from  the  practices  of  aliens  ? 
He  could  state  several  periods  of  our  history  when  real  danger 
existed  from  aliens,  and  yet  no  such  power  as  that  conferred 
by  an  alien  act  was  thought  necessary  against  it.  In  remote 
periods,  when  this  country  was  disturbed  by  contests  for  the 
crown,  and  when  the  influence  of  aliens  was  known  to  be  ex- 
erted against  the  government,  this  extraordinary  power  was 
not  resorted  to.  The  common  law  was  then  thought  sufficient. 
In  times  when  religious  differences  excited  disturbances,  and 
when  foreigners  were  known  to  be  hostile  to  the  views  of 
government,  when  so  many  alarms  of  danger  were  spread  from 
the  interference  of  the  pope  and  the  Jesuits,  it  was  not  thought 

47* 


558  SPEECHES    IN   PARLIAMENT. 

necessary  to  vest  such  a  power  in  the  crown.  The  common 
law  was  then  deemed  sufficient.  But  to  come  to  more  modern 
times,  during  the  whole  period  from  the  Revolution  down  to 
the  reign  of  his  present  Majesty,  would  it  be  said  that  this 
country  was  in  no  danger  from  aliens?  There  was,  during 
the  whole  of  that  time,  a  pretender  to  the  throne,  and  one  in 
whose  favour  it  was  known  some  foreign  nations  were  pre- 
judiced, and  to  support  whom  foreign  factions  were  formed  in 
this  country ;  yet  during  all  that  time,  and  amidst  all  those 
dangers,  an  alien  act  was  not  thought  necessary.  No,  the 
common  law  was  resorted  to,  as  a  sufficient  remedy  against 
the  effijrts  of  aliens  in  those  times  to  disturb  the  public  tran- 
quillity. This  then,  he  conceived,  was  an  answer  to  the  noble 
lord's  charge  of  insensibility  to  the  danger  of  the  country. 
The  opposition  of  gentlemen  on  his  (Mr.  Horner's)  side  did 
not  proceed  from  insensibility,  but  from  a  wise  sensibility  of 
the  danger  to  be  dreaded  from  aliens  on  the  one  hand,  and 
from  the  extraordinary  and  arbitrary  power  of  the  crown  on 
the  other.  But  the  noble  lord  had  taken  an  extended  view 
of  the  subject,  and  in  his  mind  the  arguments  which  the  noble 
lord  had  used  were  more  against  than  in  favour  of  the  Bill. 
The  noble  lord  had  taken  a  very  extended,  and  indeed  a  very 
surprising  view  of  the  necessity  of  the  measure;  one  different 
altogether  from  that  which  had  been  taken  by  Mr.  Pitt.  Mr. 
Pitt's  grounds  were  narrow,  but  they  were  defined  and  intelli- 
gible. He  had  introduced  the  Bill  as  a  war  measure,  but  the 
noble  lord  had  made  his  a  peace  alien  bill ;  and  for  what  ?  To 
protect  the  essential  interests  of  British  policy  against  the 
machinations  of  foreigners.  But  what  were  those  essential 
objects  of  British  policy  ?  Did  they  consist  in  supporting  the 
policy  of  the  assembled  monarchs  at  Vienna,  or  in  affording 
secure  and  uncontrolled  sway  to  legitimate  sovereigns,  or 
rather  to  sovereigns  newly  created?  Was  it  one  essential  ob- 
ject of  British  policy,  that  a  certain  number  of  persons  who 
had  composed  the  constituent  assembly,  who  had  so  much 
enthusiasm  as  to  think  they  could  reform  the  constitution  of 
their  country,  should  not  have  power  to  reside  in  any  other 
kingdom  than  Russia,  Prussia,  or  Austria  ?     These  might  be 


ALIEN    BILL.  559 

considered  essential  objects  of  British  policy  by  tlic  noble 
lord  ;  but  would  the  House  sanction  or  approve  them  ?  Would 
they,  by  passing  this  Bill,  give  to  the  crown  the  power  of  ban- 
ishing from  our  shores  the  foreign  merchant,  mechanic,  or 
artist,  whose  exertions  and  industry  contribute  so  much  to  our 
commercial  wealth  and  national  splendour?  Would  it  invest 
the  noble  lord  with  a  power,  which  he  might,  in  order  to  pro- 
tect the  policy  of  Russia,  Austria,  France,  or  Spain,  exert  in 
sending  such  persons  to  the  wilds  of  Siberia,  or  the  dungeons 
of  Ccnta  ?  He  trusted,  that  before  they  gave  such  a  power, 
they  would  seriously  consider  the  grounds  on  which  it  had 
been  conferred  in  1793.  In  the  act  which  was  then  passed, 
what  was  the  cause  stated?  Was  it  the  undefined  term  "to 
protect  the  essential  objects  of  British  policy?"  No,  but  to 
guard  against  internal  danger,  not  from  some  supposed  extreme 
cause,  but  from  danger, —  actually  existing  danger.  [Here 
Mr.  Horner  read  the  preamble  to  the  Alien  Bill  of  1793,  which 
stated,  that  "  whereas  an  unusual  number  of  persons,  not 
natural-born  subjects  of^his  Majesty,  resided  in  the  kingdom; 
and  whereas  danger  may  arise,"  Sec.  &c.]  (Hear,  hear,  from 
Lord  Castlereagh.)  The  noble  lord  may  cheer  (continued  Mr. 
Horner.)  but  would  he  contend  that  any  danger  to  this  country 
was  to  be  dreaded  from  the  foreigners  who  were  now  in  it? 
He  (Mr.  H.)  did  not  call  on  the  noble  lord  to  show  that  dan- 
ger might  not  exist ;  but  if  it  did,  it  might  be  to  the  Bourbons, 
not  to  this  country.  Then  as  to  the  statement  of  the  solicitor- 
general,  that  the  crown  possessed  the  power  of  sending  aliens 
out  of  the  country,  he  contended  that  such  an  opinion  was 
erroneous,  and  that  the  loose  opinion  of  Blackstone  on  the 
subject  was  no  authority,  unsupported  as  it  was  by  an  express 
act  or  by  precedent.  If  such  a  prerogative  of  the  crown  was 
to  be  proved,  it  should  be  proved  positively  and  not  negatively. 
In  1794,  when  such  great  research  was  used  in  order  to  prove 
that  this  prerogative  was  vested  in  the  crown,  the  only  instance 
of  its  ever  having  been  exercised  was  found  to  have  occurred 
in  the  reign  of  Henry  the  Fourth.  It  had  been  said  that  though 
the  king  had  not  the  power  to  deport  an  alien,  he  had  a  right  to 
order  him  out  of  the  country  by  proclamation,  and  the  person 


560  SPEECHES   IN   PAKLIAMENT. 

refusing  to  obey  such  proclamation  was  liable  to  punishment. 
But  what  was  the  punishment  prescribed  in  this  case  ?  a 
month's  imprisonment,  and  to  be  sent  out  of  the  country. 
Undoubtedly  obedience  should  be  paid  to  the  lawful  procla- 
mation of  the  king,  but  in  this  case  the  legality  of  such  procla- 
mation might  be  objected  to,  and  it  would  not  be  proved  by 
the  punishment  of  the  offender  against  the  proclamation  itself. 
The  opinion  of  Sir  Edward  Northey  in  support  of  this  right, 
he  considered  in  the  same  light  as  that  of  judge  Blackstone ; 
it  was  not  supported  by  authority.  [Mr.  Horner  then  contrasted 
the  object  of  the  war  alien  bill  with  that  of  the  one  now  pro- 
posed.] The  former,  he  observed,  was  to  preserve  the  external 
tranquillity  of  the  country,  but  the  latter  was  intended  to  sup- 
port foreign  tyranny.  It  was  in  this  view  the  noble  lord 
viewed  it,  and  it  was  for  this  purpose  he  wished  the  House  to 
sanction  it.  It  was  an  absurd  argument  in  its  favour,  to  say 
that  it  was  not  likely  to  be  abused,  because,  unless  a  strong 
case  of  its  necessity  were  made,  such  argument  would  go  for 
nothing.  But  he  contended  it  might  be  abused,  and  he  would 
suppose  three  cases  where  such  abuse  might  happen.  Suppose, 
in  the  first  place,  envoys  were  to  arrive  from  Holland  to  sue 
the  Russian  ambassador  for  the  debt  due  from  his  government ; 
that  ambassador  might  find  it  convenient  to  apply  to  the  noble 
lord  to  prevent  this  demand,  and  the  noble  lord  might  discover 
that  it  was  an  essential  principle  of  British  policy,  to  send  the 
unlucky  Dutchmen  out  of  the  country  by  means  of  this  Alien 
Bill.  Suppose,  in  the  second  place,  a  body  of  merchants,  the 
subjects  of  Ferdinand  the  Beloved,  resident  in  England,  should 
be  desirous  of  proceeding  upon  business  to  South  America; 
the  Spanish  ambassador  might  give  a  hint  that  they  were 
friendly  to  the  revolutionary  party  in  New  Spain,  and  the 
noble  lord  might  politely  take  the  hint,  and  send  these  unof- 
fending traders  to  Spain,  to  be  dealt  with  according  to  the 
tender  mercy  of  the  monarch  of  that  country.  Such  an  occur- 
rence was  not  impossible,  though  he  did  not  mean  to  assert 
that  it  would  occur,  or  that  there  would  be  any  foundation 
for  his  third  case ;  whicli  supposed  that  some  of  the  persecuted 
Protestants  of  Nismes  should  seek  refuge  in  Great  Britain, 


ALIEN    IJILL.  .J  01 

with  a  clergyman,  who  had  formerly  belonged  to  the  consti- 
tuent body  at  their  head :  the  Catholic  French  ambassador, 
perhaps  of  the  Angoulcnie  party,  might  ap[)ly  to  have  them 
instantly  sent  abroad  again,  and  the  noble  lord  would  have  no 
power  of  refusal,  since,  by  the  passing  of  this  Bill,  he  would 
deprive  himself  of  the  answer,  that  the  laws  of  the  country 
gave  him  no  such  authority ;  in  such  a  case,  even  the  noble 
lord  must  lament  that  he  had  been  armed  with  a  measure 
which  precluded  him  from  giving  protection,  which  his  own 
heart  would  yearn  to  afford.  He  (Mr.  Horner)  said,  he  would 
not  enter  into  the  question,  either  economically  or  commer- 
cially, but  he  protested  in  the  strongest  terms  against  inflicting 
upon  the  national  character  of  the  empire  a  lasting  reproach 
by  the  passing  of  this  peace  alien  bill.  He  cared  not  for  the 
opinions  of  foreign  courts,  who  might  with  reason  rejoice  at 
the  measure,  since  it  was  for  their  benefit  it  was  passed :  in 
truth,  the  noble  lord  was  lending  himself  as  an  instrument  to 
foreign  powers  in  the  persecution  of  their  subjects,  and  in 
hunting  them  from  one  end  of  Europe  to  the  other.  It  was 
not  difficult  to  understand  why  ministers  of  a  certain  charac- 
ter could  not  vary  their  measures  with  the  varying  circum- 
stances of  the  times.  In  1793,  the  House  gave  extraordinary 
powers  to  an  extraordinary  man ;  and  because  the  present 
govermnent  found  the  Alien  Bill  upon  the  statute  book,  and 
learnt  that  it  was  about  to  expire,  its  revival  was  immediately 
determined  upon  ;  ministers  were  determined  to  follow  the 
steps  of  Mr.  Pitt,  and  the  discontinuance  of  the  act  would  be 
an  innovation  upon  their  system.  What  he  required  was, 
that  the  House  should  no  longer  allow  this  innovation  upon 
the  constitution  ;  for  until  the  French  Revolution  no  such  law 
was  ever  passed  :  he  trusted  that  the  good  sense  of  parliament 
would  prevail  over  this  attempt  to  substitute  an  arbitrary 
statute  for  the  common  law  of  the  land. 

[The  Bill  was  read  a  third  time  and  passed  on  the  31st  of 
May.  On  that  occasion  Sir  Samuel  Romilly  moved  that  the 
continuance  of  the  Act  be  limited  to  one  year  instead  of  two, 
and  after  he  had  spoken,] 


562  SPEECHES    IN   PARLIAMENT. 

Mr.  HoRXER  said,  —  he  trusted  that  the  supporters  of  the 
measure  would  see  the  propriety  of  acquiescing  in  this  amend- 
ment ;  as  he  could  not  suppose  they  acted  from  a  blind  confi- 
dence in  the  ministers  of  the  crown.  He  had  patiently  waited, 
but  in  vain,  for  some  explanation  from  the  noble  lord,  of  a 
law  which  was  a  reproach  and  a  stain  on  the  character  of  the 
country.  Nothing,  however,  was  advanced  beyond  this,  — 
that  from  mere  confidence  in  the  noble  lord,  such  as  they  knew 
him  to  be,  they  were  to  depart  from  the  ancient  law  and  policy 
of  the  country,  and  withdraw  from  strangers  that  hospitable 
and  generous  reception  which  it  had  been  the  pride  of  our 
ancestors  to  afford  them.  The  Bill  was  a  disgrace  to  the 
character  of  the  country,  and  the  manner  of  passing  it  a  dis- 
grace to  the  character  of  that  House. 

The  House  divided  on  this  amendment,  when  29  voted  in 
favour  of  it,  and  79  against  it. 


BANK   OF   ENGLAND.  563 


IX.     BANK  OF  ENGLAND. 

24th  of  April,  and  1st  of  Ma  v. 
(Vol.  II.  p.  354.) 

Mr.  Horner  gave  notice  that,  on  the  1st  of  May  he  should 
move  for  the  appointment  of  a  committee  to  inquire  into  the 
expediency,  on  the  part  of  the  Bank  of  England,  of  renewing 
their  Cash  payments,  and  into  the  means  best  calculated  for 
effecting  that  object.  He  then  moved,  "  that  there  be  laid 
before  the  House  an  account  of  the  nett  weekly  amount  of 
the  Bank  of  England  notes  in  circulation,  from  the  9th  of 
February,  1815,  to  the  latest  period  to  which  the  same  could 
be  made  out,  distinguishing  post  bills  from  notes,  and  dis- 
tinguishing those  under  the  value  of  5/." 

On  the  1st  of  May  he  brought  forward  his  promised  motion, 
and  said, — 

It  was  a  matter  of  great  convenience  that  he  had  been 
enabled  to  bring  forward  the  proposition  which  he  had  then  to 
submit  to  the  House  before  the  bill  for  continuing  the  restric- 
tion act  came  under  discussion,  because  it  was  his  opinion,  as 
it  had  been  that  of  many  gentlemen  in  the  House,  that  when 
it  was  proposed  to  renew  the  restriction  on  the  bank  pay- 
ments for  two  years,  their  attention  should  be  called  in  detail, 
and  on  a  specific  motion,  to  the  reasons  why  this  restriction 
should  be  continued  under  the  present  circumstances ;  and  on 
what  principles,  or  under  what  motives,  it  was  adopted  as  a 
permanent  part  of  our  peace  system  of  finance.  The  surprise 
which  he  had  felt  when  he  heard  of  the  proposition  to  renew 
the  restriction  on  cash  payments  in  time  of  peace,  had  been 
generally  felt  throughout  the  House  and  the  country ;  because 
if  any  thing  could  bo  collected  from  the  former  declarations 
of  ministers,  and  from  the  enactments  themselves,  it  was  this 
—  that  at  the  end  of  the  war  the  system  adopted  in  time  of 
war  should  be  abandoned,  and  that  we  should  revert  to  that 


564  SPEECHES    IN   PARLIAMENT. 

state  of  law  and  practice,  on  which  alone  any  secure  system 
of  finance  could  be  founded.  The  proposal  to  renew  the  Bank 
restriction,  for  so  long  a  period  as  two  years,  had  had  this 
effect  —  that  he  doubted  the  sincerity  of  the  professions  which 
had  been  all  along  made  by  ministers,  of  their  desire  to  effect 
the  renewal  of  the  cash  payments.  The  professions  of  the 
ministers  had  always  been,  that  at  the  termination  of  the  war 
the  restriction  should  cease.  Yet  now,  after  the  enjoyment  of 
peace  in  reality,  for  nearly  twelve  months,  and  six  months 
after  the  ratification  of  the  definitive  treaty,  the  House  was 
called  on,  as  a  matter  of  course,  to  continue  the  restriction, 
not  for  such  a  short  period  as  would  enable  the  Bank  to  make 
arrangements  for  the  renewal  of  their  payments,  but  for  a 
period  of  two  years.  This  they  were  requested  to  do,  without 
any  one  step  being  taken  to  facilitate  the  resumption  of  cash 
payments.  Looking,  therefore,  to  the  manner  in  which  his 
right  hon.  friend  the  Chancellor  of  the  Exchequer,  had  pro- 
posed the  measure,  he  entertained  very  great  doubts  of  the 
professions  of  ministers.  But,  if  he  felt  a  doubt  with  respect 
to  ministers,  no  doubt  whatever  existed  in  his  mind  with  re- 
spect to  the  Bank  of  England.  Were  they  not  told,  year  after 
year,  until  they  scarcely  could  hear  the  declaration  with  gra- 
vity, by  gentlemen  connected  with  the  Bank,  that  their  not 
resuming  their  cash  payments  was  all  a  matter  of  compulsion 
—  that  it  was  against  their  system  —  that  nothing  was  so 
painful  to  their  feelings,  as  their  being  prevented  from  paying 
their  notes,  of  every  denomination,  in  gold  and  silver?  He 
always  thought,  if  it  were  a  measure  of  compulsion,  that 
never  was  resistance  so  weak  as  that  which  was  opposed  to  it 
by  the  Bank.  And  he  was  of  opinion,  that  if  they  were 
really  desirous  to  renew,  as  soon  as  government  would  permit 
them,  their  payments  in  silver  and  gold,  they  had  given,  under 
the  resistance  which  ministers  opposed  to  their  wishes,  an 
example  of  the  passive  grace  of  fortitude  which  never  had 
been  exceeded.  Therefore,  from  this  day  forth  he  should 
think,  whatever  professions  that  body  might  please  to  make, 
that  they  would  be  very  well  contented  to  enjoy  all  those  vast 
and  almost  incalculable  profits  which  grew  out  of  the  adoption 


BANK    OF   ENGLAND.  5G5 

of  this  measure.  P'or,  from  the  trammels  created  by  it,  arose 
a  subserviency  in  the  government  to  the  Bank,  which  rendered 
ministers  incapable  of  fairly  going  into  the  money  market. 
He  would  not  go  farther  into  this  subject,  because  it  had 
already  been  ably  discussed  by  an  hon.  member  (Mr.  Grenfell,) 
whose  luminous  statement,  founded  on  the  most  authentic 
documents,  was  on  record  upon  their  journals,  and  showed 
such  an  example  of  rapacity  on  the  part  of  a  corporate  body, 
and  of  acquiescence  on  the  part  of  a  government,  as  stood  un- 
rivalled in  the  financial  history  of  any  country  in  Europe. 

He  believed,  that  his  right  hon.  friend,  the  Chancellor  of  the 
Exchequer,  had  no  settled  system  of  opinions  at  all  on  this 
subject.  He  had  a  sort  of  notion,  that  if  cash  payments 
could  be  resumed,  without  altering  his  plan  of  finance,  it 
would  be  as  well  if  things  were  restored  to  their  old  order. 
But  sooner  than  attempt  this  reform,  he  thought  it  was  better 
to  rub  over  this  year  and  the  next  year,  and  to  make  up,  by 
the  assistance  of  the  Bank,  any  defalcations  that  might  arise 
in  the  finances  of  the  country,  however  exorbitantly  he  was  to 
pay  for  the  accommodation.  He  had  no  doubt,  from  the  re- 
newal of  this  measure,  being  for  two  years,  that  it  was  inti- 
mately connected  with  the  financial  arrangements  of  his  right 
hon.  friend.  His  right  hon.  friend  said,  that  his  plans  and  the 
renewal  of  the  restriction  were  coincident  in  point  of  time, 
and  had  no  other  connexion.  But  any  man  who  recollected 
what  took  place  at  the  meeting  of  the  Bank  proprietors,  would 
form  a  different  opinion.  Early  in  the  year,  when  the  first 
bargain  was  about  to  be  entered  into,  the  proprietors  were 
told  that  ministers  meant  to  renew  the  Bank  Restriction  Act. 
Why  was  this  statement  made,  unless  to  induce  the  proprie- 
tors to  agree,  with  a  better  grace,  to  the  loan  which  was 
demanded  of  them  ?  But  what  other  effect  had  the  informa- 
tion which  was  given  on  this  subject?  When  it  was  after- 
wards stated  that  the  bill  was  introduced,  there  was  an 
immense  and  an  immediate  rise  in  the  price  of  Bank  slock. 
It  was  said,  that  the  Bank  had  no  interest  in  the  renewal  of 
the  restrictions.  If  that  were  so,  it  was  strange  that  the 
most  ignorant  person  in  the  market  should  at  once  perceive 

VOL.  II.  48 


566  SPEECHES   IN   PARLIAMENT. 

that  his  property  would  bo  benefited  by  it,  and  that,  there- 
fore, it  was  advisable  for  him  to  speculate.  He  believed  on 
the  occasion  to  which  he  alluded,  that  Bank  stock  rose  about 
18  per  cent.  The  proposal  to  renew  the  Bank  Restriction 
Act  for  two  years  was  a  most  extraordinary  measure,  when 
compared  with  the  extension  of  it  at  a  former  period.  It  was 
known  with  what  trembling  anxiety,  in  1797,  six  weeks  and 
six  weeks  had  been  added  to  the  term  of  the  act;  and  with 
what  caution  in  1802,  the  government,  suspecting  the  peace 
of  that  year  to  be  precarious,  had  proposed  short  extensions  of 
the  restriction.  Even  after  the  principle  (a  mischievous  and 
fatal  principle  he  conceived  it  to  be)  of  making  the  restriction 
a  war  measure  had  been  adopted,  it  had  always  been  deter- 
mined that  it  should  cease  six  months  after  the  conclusion  of 
a  general  peace.  And  last  year,  when  surely  the  peace  did 
not  present  such  a  prospect  of  duration  as  at  present,  it  was 
only  extended  to  a  fixed  day  —  the  5th  of  July  —  in  the  fol- 
lowing session.  But  now  it  was  to  be  extended  two  years, 
without  any  reason,  unless  it  was  to  be  understood  as  the 
price  of  the  loan  which  the  Bank  was  to  advance. 

The  question  of  the  restriction  had  of  late  been  put  on  a 
new  ground,  by  connecting  it  with  the  agricultural  distresses. 
But  if  the  Bank  restriction  was  to  be  grounded  on  the  agri- 
cultural distresses,  why  was  it  to  be  continued  for  two  years  ? 
Was  not  every  one  more  and  more  convinced  every  day,  that 
the  distress  would  be  a  temporary  evil  ?  Why,  then,  was  not 
the  restriction  of  a  short  duration  ?  —  Only  with  a  view  to  the 
bargain  between  the  Bank  and  the  treasury.  He  knew  this 
would  not  be  avowed  ;  but  he  would  put  it  to  all  who  were 
anxious  for  the  security  of  the  country,  or  desirous  of  preserv- 
ing their  own  property,  whether,  after  they  had  considered  the 
circumstances  he  had  explained,  they  could  imagine,  that  this 
measure  had  nothing  to  do  with  the  bargain  entered  into  be- 
tween government  and  the  Bank?  Would  they  vote  for 
inquiry  this  evening,  or  give  their  assistance  to  a  measure,  the 
true  object  of  which  was  not  avowed,  and  the  only  reason  for 
proposing  which  he  conceived  he  had  stated  ?  On  what 
ground  did  his  right  hon.  friend  mean  to  call  on  them  to  accede 


BANK    OF   ENGLAND.  567 

to  these  restrictions?  And  how  did  he  mean  to  defend 
himself  from  the  charge  of  not  having  taken  any  steps  to 
compel  the  resumption  of  cash  payments  ?  These  were 
points  on  which  the  House  was  ignorant,  but  on  which  it 
ought  to  be  informed.  And  iiere  he  wished  to  correct  an 
error  which  had  been  unjustly  imputed  to  him  and  to  those 
gentlemen  who  coincided  with  him  in  opinion.  It  was  said, 
that  they  wished  the  cash  payments  to  be  immediately  re- 
sumed. They  never  harboured  such  a  sentiment.  They 
always  stated  that  it  could  not  be  done,  without  precautionary 
measures  ;  but  they  conceived  that  no  time  should  be  lost  in 
giving  the  country  full  assurance  that  payments  would  be 
renewed,  and  in  taking  speedy  measures  that  this  might  be 
done  with  safety.  The  measures  which  had  been  successively 
proposed  to  Parliament,  were  to  put  ofT,  not  only  the  cash 
payments,  but  the  consideration  of  the  means  of  again  bring- 
ing them  about. 

He  would  ask  the  House,  did  they  not  feel  some  anxiety 
on  this  head?  Had  they  felt  no  evils  from  the  long  suspen- 
sion of  cash  payments?  Were  they  sensible  of  no  evils  after 
all  that  had  passed  in  the  course  of  the  discussions  of  the 
agricultural  distress,  during  which  no  one  had  been  hardy 
enough  to  deny  that  a  great  evil  had  arisen  from  the  sudden 
destruction  of  the  artificial  prices  ?  Would  any  man  say  that 
there  had  not  been  a  great  change  in  the  value  of  money  ? 
What  this  was  owing  to  might  be  disputed  ;  but,  for  his  own 
part,  he  had  not  the  least  doubt.  From  inquiries  which  he 
had  made,  and  from  the  accounts  on  the  table,  he  was  con- 
vinced that  a  greater  and  more  sudden  reduction  of  the  circu- 
lating medium  had  never  taken  place  in  any  country  than  had 
taken  place  since  the  peace  in  this  country,  with  the  excep- 
tion of  those  reductions  which  had  happened  in  France  after 
the  Mississippi  scheme,  and  after  the  destruction  of  the 
assignats.  He  should  not  go  into  the  question  how  this  re- 
duction had  been  effected,  though  it  was  a  very  curious  one, 
and  abounded  in  illustrations  of  the  principles  which  had  been 
so  much  disputed  in  that  House.  The  reduction  of  the  cur- 
rency had  originated  in  the  previous  fall  of  the  prices  of  agri- 


568  SPEECHES    IN    PARLIAMENT. 

cultural  produce.  This  fall  had  produced  a  destruction  of 
the  country  bank  paper  to  an  extent  which  would  not  have 
been  thought  possible  without  more  ruin  than  had  ensued. 
The  Bank  of  England  had  also  reduced  its  issues ;  as  ap- 
peared by  the  accounts  recently  presented.  The  average 
amount  of  their  currency  was  not,  during  the  last  year,  more 
than  between  twenty-five  and  twenty-six  millions ;  while  two 
years  ago  it  had  been  nearer  twenty-nine  millions,  and  at  one 
time  even  amounted  to  thirty-one  millions.  But  without 
looking  to  the  diminution  of  the  Bank  of  England  paper,  the 
reduction  of  country  paper  was  enough  to  account  for  the  fall 
which  had  taken  place. 

Another  evil  which  had  resulted  from  the  state  of  the  cur- 
rency, which  he  had  foreseen  and  predicted,  but  which  had 
been  deemed  visionary,  was.  that  during  the  war  we  had  bor- 
rowed money,  which  was  then  of  small  value ;  and  we  were 
now  obliged  to  pay  it  at  a  high  value.  This  was  the  most 
formidable  evil  which  threatened  our  finances ;  and,  though 
lie  had  too  high  an  opinion  of  the  resources  of  the  country,  and 
of  the  wisdom  of  the  government  to  despair,  he  was  appalled 
when  he  considered  the  immense  amount  of  the  interest  of 
the  debt  contracted  in  that  artificial  currency,  compared  with 
the  produce  of  the  taxes.  These  were  the  two  grand  incon- 
veniences which  had  resulted ;  and  it  was  to  be  remembered, 
that  the  great  difference  during  the  former  discussions  on 
these  subjects,  was  not  so  much  in  the  theoretical  as  in  the 
practical  question.  The  late  minister,  Mr.  Percival,  who  had 
no  general  principle  on  the  subject,  thought,  that  to  revert  to 
cash  payments  in  time  of  war  would  be  so  difficult  that  it 
was  not  worth  the  hazard.  But  he  (Mr.  Horner),  though 
he  thought  that  the  renewal  of  the  cash  payments  was 
a  matter  which  required  caution  and  preparation,  thought 
that  the  true  policy  was  to  meet  the  difficulty  at  once,  and 
that  it  was  a  fallacy  pregnant  with  evil  to  suppose  that  any 
lasting  benefit  could  be  derived  from  so  factitious  a  state  of 
the  currency.  The  event  had  decided  the  question.  But, 
turning  from  these  results,  and  looking  forward  to  the  opera- 
tion of  this  restriction  in  time  of  peace,  it  would  be  found  to 


BANK    OF   ENGLAND.  Oby 

leave  us  without  any  known  or  certain  standard  of  money  to 
regulate  the  transactions,  not  only  between  the  public  and  its 
creditors,  but  between  individuals.  The  currency  which  was 
to  prevail  was  not  only  uncertain,  but  cruel  and  unjust  in  its 
operation  —  at  one  time,  upon  those  whose  income  was  fixed 
in  money,  and  to  all  creditors  —  at  another  time,  when  by 
some  accident  it  was  diminished  in  amount,  to  all  debtors. 
"Was  not  this  an  evil  sufficient  to  attract  the  attention  of  a 
wise,  a  benevolent,  and  a  prudent  government?  If  they 
looked  at  the  agricultural  interest,  was  not  a  fluctuation  of 
prices  the  greatest  of  evils  to  the  farmer?  For,  supposing 
prices  were  fixed  and  steady,  it  was  indifferent  to  him  what 
was  the  standard.  As  long  as  wc  had  no  standard  —  no  fixed 
value  of  money  —  but  it  was  suffered  to  rise  and  fall  like  the 
quicksilver  in  the  barometer,  no  man  could  conduct  his  pro- 
perty with  any  security,  or  depend  upon  any  sure  and  certain 
profit.  Persons  who  were  aware  of  the  importance  of  this 
subject  must  be  surely  anxious  to  know  whether  there  were 
any  imperative  reasons  for  continuing  the  present  system,  to 
know  whether  it  was  intended  to  revert  to  the  old  system, 
and  if  not  now,  when  that  system  would  be  reverted  to,  and 
what  would  be  the  best  means  for  bringing  about  that  mea- 
sure. This  was  the  object  for  which  he  proposed  to  appoint 
the  committee,  that  the  House  might  know  something  of  the 
true  state  of  the  case  before  they  plunged  headlong  into  the 
system  of  the  Chancellor  of  the  Exchequer. 

He  hoped  they  should  hear  the  opinion  of  his  right  hon- 
ourable friend,  and  learn  from  him  on  what  grounds  the 
bill  was  now  proposed,  and  what  were  the  circumstances 
under  which  they  might  revert  to  cash  payments.  If  he 
looked  at  the  professions  of  former  times,  he  was  at  a  loss 
to  know  how  to  apply  them.  The  reasons  for  continuing 
the  restriction  had  been  said  to  be  our  great  foreign  ex- 
penditure, the  necessity  of  importing  corn,  the  high  price 
of  the  precious  metals,  and  the  unfavourable  state  of  the 
exchange.  These  subjects  had  created  much  controversy, 
which  he  should  not  now  renew,  but  which  he  did  not  shrink 
from,  and  which  he  thought  it  probable  he  might  have  an 

48* 


570  SPEECHES   IN   PARLIAMENT. 

opportunity  again  to  discuss ;  for,  if  the  present  system  were 
persisted  in,  the  exchange  and  the  price  of  gold  would  be  very 
unsatisfactory  to  the  Bank  and  the  Chancellor  of  the   Exche- 
quer.    The  opinions  which  he  had  formerly   given   had  re- 
ceived a  strong  and  unexpected  confirmation  by  late  events ; 
but  he  had  already  modified  the  opinion  which  he  had  formerly 
given  as  to  the   price  of  gold.     When,  by  the  depreciation  of 
the  currency,  gold  was  permanently  separated  from  paper,  it 
was  subject  to  all  the  variations  in  price  of  any  other  article 
of  merchandise.     On  this  subject  it  was  to  be  remarked,  that 
in  the  last  year,  a  year  of  peace,  gold,  though  lower  than  it 
had  previously  been,  was  never  below  4/.  85.,  which  was  equal 
to  the  whole  of  the  alleged  depreciation  ;   but  now  that  the 
country  banks  had  called  in  their  paper,  it  had  fallen  nearly  to, 
and  would  soon  be  quite  as  low  as,  the  Mint  price.   Let  not  the 
right  hon.  gentleman  flatter  himself  that  if  the  Bank  of  Eng- 
land were  to  issue  their  notes  to  that  extent,_  which  they  were 
likely  to  do  upon  the  enactment  of  his  bill,  the  country  banks 
would   not  return  to  their  former  practice,  and  the  rate  of 
prices  be  affected  by  that  practice.     The  House  should  there- 
fore be  prepared  for  such  consequences,  and  in  due  time  con- 
sider how  to  provide  against  them.     To  afford  an  opportunity 
for  that  consideration  was  the  object  of  his  motion,  and  he 
hoped  the  House  would  see  the  propriety  of  acceding  to  it. 
The  high  price  of  bullion,  the  rate  of  exchange,  the  importa- 
tion  of  foreign  grain,  and  the   amount  of  our  foreign  pay- 
ments, which  were  on   a  former  occasion  pleaded  as  reasons 
for  the  restrictions  of  cash  payments  by  the  Bank,  could  not 
now   be   urged,    because    those   reasons    no    longer    existed. 
Therefore   his  right  hon.  friend,  who  urged  those  reasons  on 
the  occasion  alluded  to,  was  called  upon  in  consistency  to  sup- 
port the  present  motion,  in  order  to  ascertain  how  it  became 
necessary,  after  the  cessation  of  those  reasons,  to  continue  the 
restriction.     For  himself,  he  could  not   conceive,  after  those 
reasons  had  ceased  to  exist,  the   measure  could  be  justified. 
He  had  heard  of  publications,  copies   of  which  were  pretty 
widely  circulated,  and  the  object  of  which  was  to  show,  that 
if  bank  notes  were  issued  in  the  same  abundance  as  they  for- 


BANK    OF   ENGLAND.  571 

merly  were,  prices  would  again  rise,  and  the  farmers  be  con- 
sequently benefited;  that  this  therefore  would  be  a  good 
thing  for  the  country,  and  that  grain  might  probably  again 
rise  to  lOO^-.  a  quarter.  But  he  (Mr.  Horner)  could  not  sup- 
pose the  right  lion,  gentleman  prepared  to  support  his  mea- 
sure upon  such  grounds ;  or  that  he  would  be  an  advocate  for 
the  issue  of  bank  notes,  with  a  view  to  raise  the  price  of 
grain.  For  if  the  right  hoti.  gentleman  would  do  so,  he  must 
become  the  advocate  of  one  of  the  most  monstrous  projects 
that  had  ever  been  imagined.  Projects  somewhat  similar  had 
no  doubt  been  brought  forward  and  tried  during  the  Regency 
in  France,  and  about  the  same  time  in  this  country,  but  the  re- 
sult proved  their  fallacy.  Both  governments  were,  however, 
in  these  cases,  the  dupes  and  projectors.  But  if  his  right  hon. 
friend  should  press  such  a  project  as  that  to  which  he  alluded, 
he  would  not  be  the  dupe  —  but  the  fallacious  projector  him- 
self. This  course,  however,  he  could  not  suppose  the  right 
hon.  gentleman  prepared  to  pursue. 

In  what  he  had  said,  he  did  not  wish  it  to  be  understood 
that  his  object  was  to  have  cash  payments  resumed  imme- 
diately, but  that  steps  should  be  immediately  taken  with  a 
view  to  that  resumption  —  that  the  Bank  should  set  about  it 
—  that  the  directors  should  prepare  for  the  resumption  — 
that  indeed  both  Government  and  the  Bank  should  set  about 
measures  to  relieve  the  right  hon.  gentleman  from  the 
dilemma  in  which  he  was  placed  by  the  removal  of  those 
causes  which  he  had  formerly  assigned  to  justify  this  restric- 
tion, lie  would  not  specify  any  time  within  which  this  re- 
striction should  be  removed —  he  would  not  even  mention  two 
years  —  but  he  could  not  help  thinking  that  it  was  the  duty 
of  Government  and  the  Bank  at  once  to  set  about  the  means 
of  accomplishing  that  object  which  the  public  had  a  right 
to  expect.  Necessity  was  the  only  reason  ever  urged  in 
justification  of  this  restriction  ;  and  when  the  necessity  ceased, 
the  country  naturally  expected  that  the  restriction  should 
cease  also. 

He  should  now  proceed  to  discuss  the  second  branch  of 
his    motion ;    namely,  the  best   means   by  which  the    Bank 


572  SPEECHES    IN   TARLIAMENT. 

might  be  enabled  to  resume  its  payments  in  cash.  He  had 
ah-eady  observed,  that  he  would  not  specify  any  time 
at  which  that  resumption  should  take  place,  but  he  felt  it 
highly  desirable  that  measures  should  be  taken  with  a  view 
to  that  resumption.  For  instance,  he  thought  it  should  be 
enacted,  that  the  Bank  should  gradually  pay  its  several  notes 
according  to  their  value.  Thus,  as  the  Restriction  Act  was 
to  expire  in  July,  it  might  be  provided  tliat  the  Bank  should 
pay  all  notes  of  11.  within  six  months;  afterwards,  its  21. 
notes  within  the  next  six  months  ;  its  51.  notes  within  the 
succeeding  six  months ;  and  all  its  notes  above  51.  after  that 
period.  By  such  an  arrangement,  the  Bank  would  be 
guarded  against  the  consequences  of  any  sudden  change,  while 
the  just  claims  and  expectations  of  the  public  would  be  grati- 
fied. But  before  the  committee  which  he  proposed,  this  sub- 
ject might  be  fully  considered,  after  an  examination  of  wit- 
nesses, including  the  directors  of  the  Bank  and  others,  com- 
petent to  afford  every  necessary  information. 

Another  subject,  which  would  properly  come  under  the 
consideration  of  such  a  committee,  would  be  the  state  of  our 
metallic  currency.  He  had  heard  that  it  was  in  the  contem- 
plation of  government  to  have  a  new  silver  coinage,  with  a 
view  to  relieve  the  country  from  that  sort  of  bad  English,  and 
still  worse  French  silver,  with  which  it  was  at  present  inun- 
dated. This  silver  was  indeed  so  very  base,  that  it  would 
probably  be  better  for  the  country  to  have  no  currency  at  all, 
than  be  subject  to  suffer  by  such  a  circulating  medium.  But, 
in  considering  this  subject,  it  would  be  very  material  to 
ascertain  whether  the  new  silver  coinage  should  be  according 
to  the  old  standard,  or  whether  any  new  standard  should  be 
established.  For  if  the  system  of  paper  currency  were  to  be 
restored  to  the  rate  at  which  it  sometime  since  prevailed,  it 
might  be  inconvenient  and  unjust  to  re-establish  the  old  Mint 
standard  of  silver  ;  for  by  such  re-establishment,  government, 
as  well  as  individuals  who  sent  silver  to  the  Mint  for  coinage, 
would  be  very  likely  to  suffer  a  considerable  loss.  It  was  idle 
to  expect  that  good  money  and  bad  would  circulate  together. 
The  Mint  might  be  constantly  at  work,  but  not  for  the  benefit 


BANK   OF   ENGLAND.  573 

of  the  public ;  its  new  coinage  might  be  poured  into  circula- 
tion, but  it  would  not  continue  in  circulation.  It  would,  if 
some  regulation  with  respect  to  our  standard  did  not  take 
place,  immediately  vanish,  and  the  expense  would  be  in- 
curred in  vain. 

He  had  now  come  to  an  end  of  the  two  objects  of  his  mo- 
tion —  the  expediency  of  resuming  cash  payments,  and  the 
most  proper  method  of  doing  this.  He  hoped  that  the  House 
would  make  some  inquiry  on  the  subject :  he  did  not  ask 
them  to  adopt  his  opinions,  but  at  least  to  make  some  in- 
quiry, and  not  to  pass  on  as  a  matter  of  course.  If  the  House 
did  grant  what  the  Chancellor  of  the  Exchequer  proposed, 
they  would  in  fact  pass  a  bill  to  continue  the  restriction  for 
ever.  He  must  be  an  idle  dreamer  who  could  suppose,  after 
what  had  passed,  that  the  Chancellor  of  the  Exchequer  or  the 
Bank  directors  ever  meant  to  resume  cash  payments  at  all. 
If,  then,  this  bill  were  sanctioned,  as  a  matter  of  course,  they 
made  the  system  permanent.  They  set  their  seal  to  it,  and 
must  answer  to  the  country  for  the  consequences.  He  should 
now  move,  "  That  a  Select  Committee  be  appointed  to  in- 
quire into  the  expediency  of  restoring  the  Cash  Payments  of 
the  Bank  of  England,  and  the  safest  and  most  advantageous 
means  of  effecting  it." 

The  Chancellor  of  the  Exchequer  opposed  the  motion,  and, 
after  a  long  discussion,  in  which  Mr.  Frankland  Lewis,  Lord 
Castlereagh,  Sir  John  Newport,  Mr.  Manning,  the  Bank 
director,  Mr.  Ponsonby,  Mr.  Alexander  Baring,  and  Mr.  Hus- 
kisson  spoke,  Mr.  Horner  made,  it  is  said,  "  a  luminous  reply." 

He  said,  —  that  in  any  thing  which  he  had  advanced  on 
this  question,  he  had  meant  no  personal  disrespect  to  the  di- 
rectors of  the  Bank,  or  to  their  organs  in  that  House.  He 
had  spoken  of  them  merely  collectively  as  a  corporation,  and, 
considering  them  in  that  capacity,  he  had  no  hesitation  in 
repeating,  that  he  put  no  confidence  in  their  declarations, 
when  they  expressed  an  anxiety  for  the  resumption  of  cash 
payments.  He  would  not  take  up  much  of  the  time  of  the 
House  at  that  late  hour,  and  therefore  would  forego  the  tempt- 
ing opportunity  of  exposing  the  inconsistency  of  the  argu- 


574  SPEECHES    IN   PARLIAMENT. 

mcnts  which  had  been  urged  in  support  of  restriction  by  the 
right  hon.  gentleman  opposite  (Mr.  Huskisson),  who,  though 
he  admitted  the  sound  poHcy  of  a  speedy  resumption  of  cash 
payments,  seemed  by  his  speech  to  leave  that  question  in  the 
same  state  which  it  had  been  for  some  years  past.  As  to 
what  had  been  said  on  the  subject  by  the  noble  lord  (Castle- 
reagh),  he  was  unable  to  comprehend  its  precise  tendency. 
He  would  therefore,  from  inability,  abstain  from  following 
him.  The  noble  lord  had  thrown  out  such  a  mass  of  lan- 
guage and  ideas,  and  had  made  such  a  novel  combination  of 
twisted  expressions,  that  it  was  difficult  in  the  many  theories 
he  had  urged,  to  understand  that  one  which  applied  to  the 
resumption  of  cash  payments,  or  to  the  manner  in  which  they 
might  be  most  speedily  effected.  It  was  possible  that  the 
noble  lord  held  the  thread  which  would  guide  him  through  the 
labyrinth  of  theory  and  phraseology  into  which  he  had  gone  ; 
but,  as  that  thread  was  not  visible  to  him,  he  would  not  ven- 
ture to  plunge  into  the  inextricable  abyss. 

Mr.  Horner  then  took  a  view  of  the  arguments  which  had 
been  urged  on  the  other  side  of  the  House  in  favour  of  re- 
striction, and  observed,  —  that  if  the  expediency  of  the  resump- 
tion of  cash  payments  at  the  end  of  two  years,  which  had 
been  admitted,  was  put  into  the  bill,  if  it  was  made  part  of 
the  bill  that  the  Bank  should  resume  its  payments  in  that 
time,  and  that  the  intermediate  period  should  be  spent  in 
making  preparatory  arrangements  for  that  purpose,  he  would 
withdraw  his  motion,  and  lend  his  aid  to  the  forwarding  of 
such  arrangements.  But  this  was  not  the  intention  of  minis- 
ters, and  by  the  present  bill  they  left  the  time  of  resuming 
cash  payments  as  undefined  as  it  was  in  1797.  The  Bank 
directors  had  once  expressed  themselves  anxious  to  attend  to 
the  directions  of  the  House  ;  it  therefore  now  became  the 
House,  if  they  sincerely  wished  for  the  resumption  of  cash 
payments,  to  give  such  directions  as  would  most  speedily  con- 
duce to  that  object.  He  had  asked  of  the  gentlemen  ojipo- 
site,  what  were  those  fortunate  circumstances  under  which 
cash  payments  would  be  more  easy  than  at  present  ?  To  this 
question  no  answer  had  been  given.     No  one  efficient  reason 


BANK    OF   ENGLAND.  575 

had  been  given  why  those  payments  should  not  now  be 
resumed.  Under  these  circumstances,  then,  he  put  it  to  those 
members  who  were  present,  whether,  after  all  they  had  heard, 
they  did  not  conscientiously  believe  that  an  inquiry  was  neces- 
sary. If  after  what  had  passed  they  did  not  vote  for  inquiry, 
they  must  stand  to  the  consequences.  The  noble  lord  had 
talked  of  the  bill  being  formed  on  the  permissive  system.  Did 
he  mean  by  this  that  the  Bank  would  not  be  precluded  from 
resuming  cash  payments  if  they  thought  proper  ?  What  he 
objected  to  in  the  bill  was,  that,  instead  of  intimating  the  wish 
of  the  House  that  preparations  for  resuming  cash  payments 
should  be  made  in  the  interval  of  two  years,  during  which  it 
was  to  last,  it  left  these  preparations  to  be  made  after  the 
expiration  of  the  bill,  and  thus  removed  to  an  indefinite  period 
the  resumption  of  money  payments.  The  inevitable  effect  of 
it  would  be,  by  prolonging  the  uncertainty  and  vacillation  of 
our  circulating  medium,  to  subvert  all  property,  both  public 
and  private.  If  the  committee  on  the  bill  were  pressed  that 
night,  he  should  move  some  clauses,  in  consequence  of  what 
had  fallen  from  the  noble  lord. 

The  House  divided :  for  Mr.  Horner's  motion  73  ;  against 
it  146. 


THE    END. 


A  SELECTED   LIST 


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£()  9s),  £2  2S. 

The  Modern  Cupid  (en  Chemin  de  Fer),  by  M.  Mounet- 
.Sully,  of  the  Comedie  Frani;ais,  illustrations  by  Ch.  Daux.  A 
Bright,  Attractive  Series  of  Verses,  illustrative  of  Love  on  the  Rail, 
with  dainty  drawings  reproduced  in  photogravure  plates,  and 
printed  in  tints,  folio,  edition  limited  to  350  copies,  each  copy 
numbered.      Estes  &  Lauriat. 

Proofs  on  Japan  paper,  in  parchment  paper  portfolio,  only  65 

copies  jirinted  (pub  63s),  £\  is. 
Proofs  on  India  paper,  in  white  vellum  cloth  portfolio,  65  copies 

printed  (pub  50s),  i6s. 
Ordinary  copy  proofs  on  vellum  ]")aper,  in  cloth  portfolio,  250 
copies  printed  (pub  30s),  lOs  6d. 
The    Costumes   of   all    Nations,    Ancient    and  Modern, 
exhibiting  the  Dresses  and  Habits  of  all  Classes,  Male  and  Female, 
from  the  Earliest  Historical  Records  to  the  Nineteenth  Century, 
by  Albert  Kretschmer   and   Dr  Rohrbach,    104  coloured    plates 
displaying  nearly  2000  full-length  figures,  complete  in  one  hand- 
some volume,  4to,  half  morocco  (pub  ^4  4s),  45s.       Sotheran. 
Walpole's    {Horace)  Anecdotes  of  Tainting  in  England, 
with  some  Account  of  the    Principal  Artists,   enlarged  by  Rev. 
James  Dallaway  ;  and  Vertue's  Catalogue  of  Engravers  who  have 
Ijeen  born  or  resided  in  England,  last  and  best  edition,  revised 
with  additional  notes    by    Ralph   N.   Wornum,    illustrated    with 
eighty  portraits  of  the  principal  artists,  and  woodcut  portraits  of 
the  minor  artists,  3  handsome  vols,  Svo,  cloth  (pub  27s),  14s  6d. 
Bickers. 

— The  same,  3  vols,  half  morocco,  gilt  top,  by  one 

of  the  best  Edinburgh  binders  (pub  45s),  ^^i  Ss. 


John  Grants  Bookseller, 


Works  on  Edinburgh  :— 

Edi7iburgh  and  its  Neighbourhood  in  the  Days  of  our 
Grandfathers,  a  Series  of  Eighty  Illustrations  of  the  more  remark- 
able Old  and  New  Buildings  and  Picturesque  Scenery  of  Edin- 
burgh, as  they  appeared  about  1S30,  with  Historical  Introduction 
and  Descriptive  Sketches,  by  James  Gowans,  royal  8vo,  cloth 
elegant  (pub  12s  6d),  6s.     J.  C.  Nimmo. 

"  The  chapters  are  brightly  and  well  written,  and  are  all,  from  first  to  la^t, 
readable  and  full  of  information.  The  volume  is  in  all  respects  handsome." — 
Scotsman. 

Edinburgh  University — Account  of  the  Tercentenary  Fes- 
tival of  the  University,  including  the  .Speeches  and  Addresses  on 
the  Occasion,  editecl  by  R.  Sydney  Marsden,  crown  8vo,  cloth 
(pub  3s),  IS.      Blackwood  &  Sons. 

Historical  Notices  of  Lady   Yesters  Church  and  Parish, 
by  James  J.  Hunter,  revised  and  corrected  by  the  Rev.  Dr  Gray, 
crown  8vo,  cloth  (pub  2s  6d),  gd. 
Of  interest  to  the  antiquarian,  containing  notices  of  buildings  and  places  now 

fast  disappearing. 

History  of  the  Queai s  Edinburgh  Rifle  Volunteer  Brigade, 
with  an  Account  of  the  City  of  Edinburgh  and  Midlothian  Rifle 
Association,  the  Scottish  Twenty  Club,  &c. ,  by  Wm.  Stephen, 
crown  Svo,  cloth  (pub  5s),  2s.  Blackwood  cS:  Sons. 
"  This  opportune  volume  has  far  more  interest  for  readers  generally  than  might 
have  been  expected,  while  to  members  of  the  Edinburgh  Volunteer  Brigade  it 
cannot  fail  to  be  very  interesting  indeed." — St  James's  Gazette. 

Leightotis  (Alexander)  Mysterious  Legends  of  Edinbutgh, 

illustrated,  crown  Svo,  boards,  is  6d. 

Contents  : — Lord  Karnes'  Puzzle,  Mrs  Corbet's  Amputated  Toe,  The  Brownie 
of  the  West  Bow,  The  Ancient  Bureau,  A  Legend  of  Halkerstone's  Wynd,  Deacon 
Macgillvray's  Disappearance,  Lord  Braxfield's  Case  of  the  Red  Xight-cap,  The 
Strange  Story  of  Sarah  Gowanlock,  and  John  Cameron's  Life  Policy. 

Steven's  (Dr  William)  History  of  the  High  School  of 
Edinburgh,  from  the  beginning  of  the  .Sixteenth  Century,  based 
upon  Researches  of  the  Town  Council  Records  and  other  Authentic 
Documents,  illustrated  with  view,  also  facsimile  of  a  School 
Exercise  by  Sir  Walter  Scott  when  a  pupil  in  17S3,  crown  Svo, 
cloth,  a  handsome  volume  (pub  7s  6d),  2s. 
Appended  is  a  list  of  the  distinguished  pupils  who  have  been  educated  in  this 

Institution,  which  has  been  patronised  bj-  Royalty  from  the  days  of  James  VL 
The  Authorised  Library  Edition. 

Trial  of  the  Dii-ectors  of  the  City  of  Glasgow  Bank,  before 
the  Petition  for  Bail,  reported  by  Charles  Tennant  Couper, 
Advocate,  the  Speeches  and  Opinions,  revised  by  the  Council  and 
Judges,  and  the  Charge  by  the  Lord  Justice  Clerk,  illustrated 
with  lithographic  facsimiles  of  the  famous  false  Balance-sheets, 
one  large  volume,  royal  Svo,  cloth  (pub  15s),  3s  6d.     Edinburgh. 

IVilsofis  {Dr  Daniel)  Memorials  of  Edinburgh  in  the 
Olden  Tivie,  with  numerous  fine  engravings  and  woodcuts,  2  vols, 
4to,  cloth  (pub  £^  2s),  i6s  6d. 

Sent  Carriage  Free  to  any  part  of  the  United  Kingdom  on 
receipt  of  Postal  Order  for  the  amount. 

JOHN  GRANT.  25  &  34  George  IV.  Bridge,  Edinl3iirg]i. 


2S  e-  J4  George  IV.  Bridge,  Edinburgh. 


"Works  on  the  Highlands  of  Scotland :  - 

Disruption  WortJiies  of  tlie  Higlilands,   a  Series  of  Bio- 
graphies of  Eminent  Free  Church  .Ministers  who  Sufiered  in  the 
North  of  Scotland  in   1843  for  the  Cause  of  Religious  Liberty, 
enlarged  edition,  with  additional  Jjiograj^hies,  and  an  Introduc- 
tion by  the  Rev.  Dr  Duff,  illustrated  with  24  full-page  portraits 
and  facsimiles  of  the  autographs  of  eminent  Free  Churchmen, 
4to,  handsomely  bound  in  cloth,  gilt  (pub  £\  is),  8s  6d. 
Gaelic  N'ames  of  Plants,  Scottish  a>id  Irish,  Collected  and 
Arranged  in  Scientific   Order,   with   Notes  on    the    Etymology, 
their    Uses,    Plant    Superstitions,    &c.,    among    the    Celts,    with 
Copious  Gaelic,  English,  and  Scientific  Indices,  by  John  Came- 
ron, 8vo,  cloth  (pub  7s  6d),  3s  6d.     Blackwood  &  Sons. 
"  It  is  impossible  to  withhold  a  tribute  of  admiration  from  a  worVc  on  which 
the  author  spent  ten  years  of  his  life,  and  which  necessitated  not  only  voluminous 
reading  in  Gaelic  and  Irish,  but  long  journeys  through  the  Highlands  in  search 
of  Gaelic  names  for  plants,  or  rather,   in  this  case,   plants  for  names  already 
existing. " — Scotsman. 

Grant  {Mrs,  of  laggan) — letters  from  the  Mountains, 
edited,  with  Notes  and  Additions,  by  her  son,  J.  P.  Grant,  best 
edition,  2  vols,  post  Svo,  cloth  (pub  21s),  4s  6d.     London. 
Lord  Jeffrey   says  :—"  Her  'Letters   from    the   Mountains'  are    among   the 
most  interesting  collections  of  real  letters  that  have  been   given  to  the  public  : 
and  being  indebted  for  no  part  of  their  interest  to  the  celebrity  of  the  names 
they  contain,  or  the  importance  of  the  events  they  narrate,  afford,  in  their  suc- 
cess,  a  more  honourable  testimony  of  the   talents    of   the  author.     The  great 
charm  of  the  correspondence  indeed    is  its  perfect  independence   of  artificial 
helps,  and  the  air  of  fearlessness  and  originality  which    it  has   consequently 
assumed." 

Historical  Sketches  of  the  Highland  Clans  of  Scotland, 
containing  a  concise  account  of  the  origin,   vSic,   of  the  Scottish 
Clans,  with  twenty-two  illustrative  coloured  plates  of  the  Tartan 
worn  by  each,  post  8vo,  cloth,  2s  6d. 
"  The  object  of  this  treatise  is  to  give  a  concise  account  of  the  origin,  seat, 

and  characteristics  of  the   Scottish   Clans,  together  with  a  representation  of  the 

distinguishing  tartan  worn  by  each." — Pre/ace. 

Keltic  {John  S.) — A  History  of  the  Scottish  Highlands, 
Highland  Clans,  and  Highland  Regiments,  with  an  Account  of 
the  Gaelic  Literature  and  Music  by  Dr  M'Lauchlan,  and  an 
Essay  on  Highland  Scenery  by  Professor  Wilson,  coloured  illus- 
trations of  the  Tartans  of  Scotland,  also  many  steel  engravings,  2 
vols,  imperial  Svo,  half  morocco,  gilt  top  (pub;^3  los),  ^i  17s  6d 
Mackenzie  {Alexander) — The  History  of  the  Highland 
Clca7-ances,  containing  a  reprint  of  Donald  Macleod's '' Gloomy 
Memories  of  the  Highlands,"  "Isle  of  Skye  in  1S82,"  and  a 
Verbatim  Report  of  the  Trial  of  the  Brae  Crofters,  thick  vol, 
crown  8vo.  cloth  (pub  7s  6d),  3s  6d.      Inverness. 

"  Some  people  may  ask,  Why  rake  up  all  this  iniquity  just  now?  We  answer, 
Thatthe  same  laws  which  permitted  the  cruelties,  the  inhuman  atrocities) 
described  in  this  book,  are  still  the  laws  of  the  country,  and  any  tyrant  who  may 
be  indifferent  to  the  healthier  public  opinion  which  now  prevails,  may  Ic^ratly 
repeat  the  same  proceedings  whenever  he  may  take  it  into  his  head  to  do  so." 

Stewarfs  {Ge/ieral  David,    of    Garth)    Sketches   of  the 

C/iaractdi;  Institutions,  atid  Customs  of  tlie  Highlanders  of  Scot- 
laud,  crown  8vo,  cloth  (pub  5s),  2s.      Inverness. 

Stewart's  sketches  of  the  Highlands  and  Highland  regiments  are  worthy  to 
rank  beside  the  Highland  works  of  Sir  Walter  Scott,  or  even  more  worthy,  for 
facts  are  stronger  than  fiction.  Every  Scottish  lad  should  have  the  book  in'  his 
hands  as  soon  as  he  is  able  to  read. 


Johfi  Grant,  Bookseller^ 


Scottish  Literature  :— 

The  i^c-uia!  Author  of  "  N'odus  Ainl'rosiaiiie." 
Christopher  North — A  Memoir  of  Professor  John  Wilson, 

compiled  from  Family  Papers  and  other  sources,  by  his  daughter, 

Mrs  Gordon,  new  edition,  with  portrait  and  illustrations,  crown 

8vo,  cloth  (pub  6s),  2s  6d. 

"  A  writer  of  the  most  ardent  and  enthusiastic  genius.'' — Henry  Hallam. 

"  The  whole  literature  of  England  does  not  contain  a  more  brilliant  series  of 
articles  than  those  with  which  Wilson  has  enriched  the  pages  of  Blackwood's 
Magazine." — Sir  Archibald  Alison. 

Cockburn  {Hen?y)— Journals  of,  being  a  Continuation  of 
the  Memorials  of  his  Time,  1831-1854,  2  vols,  8vo,  cloth  (pub 
2is),  8s  6d.     Edinburgh. 

Cochran- Patrick    {R.     IF.)  —  Records   of  the  Coinage  of 

Scotland,  from  the  Earliest  Period  to  the  Union,  numerous 
illustrations  of  coins,  2  vols,  4to,  half  citron  morocco,  gilt  top, 
£^  los.     David  Douglas. 

Also  ttniform. 

Cochran- Patrick  {R.  IV.)— The  Medals  of  Scotland,  a 
Descriptive  Catalogue  of  the  Royal  and  other  Medals  relating  to 
Scotland,  4to,  half  citron  morocco,  gilt  top,  £2  5s.  David 
Douglas. 

Also  uniform. 

Cochran-Patrick  {R.  IV.) — Early  Records  relating  to 
Mining  in  Scotland,  4to,  half  citron  morocco,  £\  Js  6d.  David 
Douglas. 

"The  future  historians  of  Scotland  will  be  very  fortunate  if  many  parts  of 
their  materials  are  so  carefully  worked  up  for  them,  and  set  before  them  in  so 
complete  and  taking  a  forai." — Athcnicitm. 

"  We  have  in  these  records  of  the  coinage  of  Scotland  not  the  production  of  a 
dilettante  but  of  a  real  student,  who  with  rare  pains  and  the  most  scholarly  dili- 
gence has  set  to  work  and  collected  into  two  massive  volumes  a  complete  history 
of  the  coinage  of  Scotland,  so  far  as  it  can  be  gathered  from  ancient  records." — 
A  cadciny.  , 

"  Such  a  book  ....  revealing  as  it  does  the  first  developments  of  an 
industry  which  has  become  the  mainspring  of  the  national  prosperitj',  ought  to 
be  specially  interesting  to  all  patriotic  Scotsmen." — Saturday  Review. 

Crieff :  Its  Traditions  and  Characters,  with  Anecdotes  of 
Strathearn,  Reminiscences  of  Obsolete  Customs,  Traditions,  and 
Superstitions,  Humorous  Anecdotes  of  Schoolmasters,  Ministers, 
and  other  Public  Men,  crown  Svo,  Is. 

"A  book  which  will  have  considerable  value  in  the  eyes  of  all  collectors  of 
Scottish  literature.  A  gathering  up  of  stories  about  well-known  inhabitants, 
memorable  local  occurrences,  and  descriptions  oi  manners  and  customs." — 
Scotsman 

Sent  Carriage  Free  to  any  part  of  the   United  Kingdom  ofz 
receipt  of  Postal  Order  for  the  amount. 

JOHN  GRANT,  25  &  34  George  IV.  Bridg-e,  Edinburgli. 


25  ^  34  (^cct'ge  IV.  Britii^c,  Edinburgh.  7 

Scottish  Literature— co/?///7wec^.— 

Douglas'  ( Gavin,  Bis/iop  of  Dunkdd,  1475-1522)  Poetical 
Works,  edited,  with  Memoir,  Notes,  and  full  Glossary,  by  John 
Small,  M.A.,  F.S.A.  Scot.,  illustrated  with  specimens  of  manu- 
script, title-pay;e,  and  woodcuts  of  the  early  editions  Ih  facsimile, 
4  vols,  beautifully  printed  on  thick  paper,  post  Svo,  cloth  (pub 
£1  3s),  £1  2s  6d.     W.  Paterson. 

"The  latter  part  of  the  fifteenth  and  beginning  of  the  sixteenth  centur>-,  a 
period  almost  barren  in  the  annals  of  English  poetry,  was  marked  by  a  remark- 
able series  of  distinguished  poets  in  Scotland.  During  this  period  flourished 
Dunbar,  Henryson,  Mercier,  Harry  the  Min-trel,  (Javin  Douglas,  Bellenden, 
Kennedy,  and  Lyndesay.  Of  these,  although  the  palm  of  excellence  must  beyond 
all  doubt  be  awarded  to  Dunbar,— next  to  Burns  probably  the  greatest  poet  of 
his  country. — the  voice  of  contemporaries,  as  well  as  of  the  age  that  immediately 
followed,  pronounced  in  favour  of  him  who, 

'  In  barbarous  age, 
Gave  rude  Scotland  Virgil's  page,' — 
Gavin  Douglas.  We  may  confidently  predict  that  this  will  long  remain  the  standard 
edition  of  Gavin  Douglas  ;  and  we  shall  be  glad  to  see  the  works  of  other  of  the 
old  Scottish  poets  edited  with  equal  sympathy  and  success,."— At  he  iwum. 

Lyndsafs  {Sir  David,  of  the  Mount,  14^0-1568)  Poetical 
'Works,  best  edition,  edited,  with  Life  and  Glossary,  by  David 
Laing,  3  vols,  crown  Svo,  cloth  (pub  63s),  iSs  6d. 

Another  cheaper    edition   by  the  same  editor, 

2  vols,  i2mo,  cloth  (pub  15s),  5s.     W.  Paterson. 

"When  it  is  said  that  the  revision,  including  Preface,  Memoir,  and  Notes, 
has  been  executed  by  Dr  David  Laing,  it  is  said  that  all  has  been  done  that 
is  possible  Ijy  thorough  scholarship,  good  judgment,  and  conscientiousness." — 
Scotsiitan. 

Lytteil  {William,   M. A.)— Landmarks  of  Scottish    Life 

and  Language,  crown  Svo,  cloth  (pub  7s  6d),  2s.      Edinburgh. 

Introductory  Observations  ;  Cumbrae  Studies,  or  an  "  Alph.abet "  ofCumbrae 
Local  Names;  .A.rran  Studies,  or  an  "Alphabet"  of  Arran  Local  Names; 
Lochranza  Places ;  Sannox  Scenes  and  Sights ;  Short  Sketches  of  Notable 
Places;  A  Glance  Round  Bute  ;  Symbols;  Explanations,  &c.  &c. 

APKerlie's  {P.  H.,  F.S.A.  Scot.)  History  of  the  Lands  and 
their  Owners  in  Gallo'vay,  illustrated  by  woodcuts  of  Notable 
Places  and  Objects,  with  a  Historical  Sketch  of  the  District,  5 
handsome  vols,  crown  Svo,  roxburghe  style  (pub  ^3  15s),  26s  6d. 
W.  Paterson. 

Ramsay  {Allan) — The   Gentle  Shepherd,    New    Edition, 

with  Memoir  and  Glossary,  and  illustrated  with  the  original 
grajihic  plates  by  David  Allan  ;  also,  all  the  Original  Airs  to  the 
Songs,  royal  4to,  cloth  extra  (pub  2 Is),  5s.  W.  &  A.  K. 
Johnston. 

The  finest  edition  of  the  celebrated  Pastoral  ever  produced.  The  paper  has 
been  made  expressly  for  the  edition,  a  large  clear  type  has  been  selected,  and 
the  printing  in  black  and  red  is  of  the  highest  class.  The  original  plates  by 
David  .Mian  have  been  restored,  and  are  here  printed  in  tint.  The  volume  con- 
tains a  Prologue,  which  is  published  for  the  first  time. 


Sent  Carriuj^e  Free  to  any  part  of  the   United  Kingdom  on 
receipt  of  Postal  Order  for  the  amount. 

JOHN  GRANT,  25  &  34  George  lY.  Bridge,  Edinburgli. 


John  Gra/if,  Bookseller, 


Scottish  Literature— co/7f/A?i/efl'; — 

77/e  Earliest  kno7vn  Printed  English  Ballad. 

Scottysehe  Kyiige — A  Ballad  of  the,  written  by  John 
Skelton,  Poet  Laureate  to  King  Henry  VIII.,  reproduced  in 
facsimile,  with  an  Historical  and  Biographical  Introduction,  by 
John  Ashton,  beautifully  printed  on  thick  paper,  small  4to,  cloth, 
uncut  edges  (pul)  i6s),  3s  6d.  Elliot  Stock. 
Southey  says  of  him  :— "The  power,  the  strangeness,  the  volubility  of  his 

language,  the  audacity  of  his  satire,  and  the  perfect  originality  of  his  manner, 

made  Skelton  one  of  the  most  extraordinary  writers  of  any  age  or  country." 
This  unique  ballad  was  printed  by  Richard  Fawkes,  the  King's  printer,   in 

1513,  immediately  after  the  battle  of  Flodden  Field,  wnich  is  described  in  it,  and 

is  of  great  interest. 

Every  justice  has  been  done  to  the  work  in  this  beautiful  volume,  the  paper, 

printing,  and  binding  of  which  are  all  alike  e.xcellent. 

One  of  the  Earliest  Presidents  of  the  Court  of  Session. 
Seton  {Alexander,  Earl  of  Dunfermline,  Chancellor  of 
Scotland,  1555-1622)  —  Memoir  of,  with  an  Appendi.x  contain- 
ing a  List  of  the  various  Presidents  of  the  Court,  and  Genealogical 
Tables  of  the  Legal  Families  of  Erskine,  Hope,  Dalrymple,  and 
Dundas,  by  George  Seton,  Advocate,  with  exquisitely  etched 
portraits  of  Chancellor  Seton,  and  George,  seventh  Lord  Seton, 
and  his  family  ;  also  the  Chancellor's  Signatures,  Seals,  and  Book- 
Stamp  ;  with  etchings  of  Old  Dalgety  Church,  Fyvie  Castle,  and 
Pinkie  House,  small  4to,  cloth  (pub  21s)  6s  6d.   Blackwood  i  Sons. 

"  We  have  here  everything  connected  with  the  subject  of  the  book  that  could 
interest  the  historical  student,  the  herald,  the  genealogist,  and  the  archajologist. 
The  result  is  a  book  worthj'  of  its  author's  high  reputation.'' — Motes  and  Qru-ries. 

JFarden's  {Alex.  J.)  History  of  Angus  or  Forfirshii-e,  its 

Land  and  People,    Descriptive   and    Historical,    illustrated  with 

maps,  facsimiles,  &c.,  5  vols,  4to,  cloth  (published  to  subscribers 

only  at  £2  17s  6d),  £\  17s  6d.     Dundee. 
Sold   separately,   vol   2,    3s   6d  ;  vol  3,   3s  6d  ;  vols  4  and  5,  7s  6d  ; 

vol  5,  3s  6d. 

A  most  useful  U'ork  of  Reference. 
Wilson's  Gazetteer   of  Scotland,    demy    Svo    (473    pp.), 

cloth  gilt  (pub  7s  6d),  3s.     W.  &  A.  K.  Johnston. 

This  work  embraces  every  town  and  village  in  the  country  of  any  importance 
as  existing  at  the  present  day,  and  is  portable  in  form  and  very  moderate  in 
price.  In  addition  to  the  usual  information  as  to  towns  and  places,  the  work 
gives  the  statistics  of  real  property,  notices  of  public  works,  public  buildings, 
churches,  schools,  &c.,  whilst  the  natural  history  and  historical  incidents  con- 
nected with  particular  localities  have  not  been  omitted. 

The  Scotstnan  says  : — "  It  entirely  provides  for  a  want  which  has  been  greatly 
felt." 

Youtiger  (John,  shoemaker,  St  Boswells,  Author  of  "  River 
Angling  for  Salmon  and  Trout,"  "  Corn  Law  Phymes,"  &'c.)  — 
Autobiography,  with  portrait,  crown  Svo  (457  pages),  cloth  (pub 
7s  6d),  2s. 

"  'The  shoemaker  of  St  Boswells,'  as  he  was  designated  in  all  parts  of  Scot- 
land,_  was  an  excellent  prose  writer,  a  respectable  poet,  a  marvellously  gifted 
man  in  conversation.  His  life  will  be  read  with  great  interest  ;  the  simple  heart- 
stirring  narrative  of  the  life-struggle  of  a  highly-gifted,  humble,  and  honest 
mechanic, — a  life  of  care,  but  also  a  life  of  virtue." — London  Review. 

Sent  Carnage  Free  to  any  part  of  the   United  Kijtgdom  on 
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JOHN  GMNT,  25  &  34  George  IV.  Bridge,  Edinburgh. 


25  ^2^'  24  George  IV,  Bridge,  Edinburgh. 


Grampian  Club  Publications,  of  valuable  MSS. 
and  Works  of  Original  Research  in  Scottish 
History,  Privately  printed  for  the  Members  :— 

The  Diocesan  Registers  of  Giasgow — Liber  ProtocoUorum 
M.  Cuthberti  Simonis,  notarii  et  scribce  capituli  Glasgiicnsis,  A. P. 
1 499"  1 5 13;  also,  Rental  Book  of  the  Diocese  of  Glasgow,  A.D. 
1509-1570,  edited  by   Joseph    Bain   and    the   Rev.    Dr   Charles 

Rogers,  with  facsimiles,  2  vols,  8vo,  cl,  1S75  (pub  £2  2s),  7s  6d. 


Rental  Book  of  the  Cistercian  Abbey  of  Coitpar- Angus, 
liiitli  tlie  Bi-cviary  of  the  Register,  edited  by  the  Rev.  Dr  Charles 
Rogers,  with  facsimiles  of  MSS.,  2  vols,  8vo,  cloth,  1S79-S0  (pub 
£2  I2S  6d),  los  6il. 


The   same,   vol   II.,   comprising  the  Register  of 


Tacks  of  the  Abbey  of  Cupar,  Rental  of  St  Marie's  Monastery,  and 
Appendix,  8vo,  cloth  (pub  £\  is),  3s  6d. 


Estimate  of  the  Scottish  Avbility  during  the  Minority  of 
fames  VI.,  edited,  with  an  Introduction,  from  the  original  MS. 
in  the  Public  Record  Office,  by  Dr  Charles  Rogers,  8vo,  cloth 
(pub  lOs  6d),  IS.  6d. 

The  reprint  of  a  manuscript  discovered  in  the  Public   Record   Office.     The 
details  are  extremely  curious. 


Gefiealogical  Memoirs  of  the  Families  of  Colt  and  Coutts, 
by  Dr  Charles  Rogers,  Svo,  cloth  (pub  los  6d),  2s  6d. 

An  old  Scottish  family,  including   the  eminent  bankers  of  that  name,    the 
Baroness  Burdett-Coutts,  &c. 


Rogers'  {Dr  Charles)  Memorials  of  the  Earl  of  Stirling 

and  of  the  House  of  Alexander,   portraits,   2  vols,  Svo,  cloth  (pub 
^■3  3s),  los  6d.      Edinburgh,  1877. 

This  work  embraces  not  only  a  history  of  Sir  William  .-Mexander,  first  Earl  of 
Stirling,  but  also-  a  genealogical  account  of  the  family  of  Alexander  in  all  its 
branches  ;  many  interesting  historical  details  connected  with  Scottish  State  affairs 
in  the  seventeenth  century  ;  also  with  the  colonisation  of  America. 


Sent  Carriage  Free  to  any  part  of  the  United  Kingdom  on 
receipt  of  Postal  Order  for  the  amount. 

JOM  GRANT,  25  &  34  George  IV.  Eridg^e,  Eclinl3urgli. 


John  Grant,  Bookseller, 


Histories  of  Scotland,  complete  set  in  10  vols 
for  £3  3s. 

This  grand  national  series  of  the  Early  Chronicles  of  Scotland,  edited  by  the 
most  eminent  Scottish  antiquarian  scholars  of  the  present  day,  is  now  completed, 
and  as  sets  are  becoming  few  in  number,  early  application  is  necessary  in  order 
to  secure  them  at  the  reduced  price. 

The  Series  comprises  :  — 
Scoticrojiico?i  of  JoJui  de  Fordnn,  from  the  Contemporar}' 
MS.  (if  not  the  author's  autograph)  at  the  end  of  the  Fourteenth 
Century,  i)reserved  in  the  Lil^rar}-  of  Wolfenlnittel,  in  the  Duchy 
of  Brunswick,  collated  with  other  known  MSS.  of  the  original 
chronicle,  edited  by  W.  F.  Skene,  LL.  D.,  Historiographer-Royal, 
2  vols  (pub  30s),  not  sold  separately. 

The  Metrical  Chronicle  of  Andrezv  JVyntoun,  Prior  of  St 
Serfs  Inch  at  Lochleven,  who  died  about  1426,  the  work  now 
printed  entire  for  the  first  time,  from  the  Royal  MS.  in  the  British 
Museum,  collated  with  other  MSS.,  edited  by  the  late  D.  Laing, 
LL.D.,  3  vols  (pub  50s),  vols  l  and  2  not  sold  separately. 
Vol  3  sold  separately  (pub  21s),  los  6d. 

Lives  of  Saint  Ninian  and  St  Kentigern,  compiled  in  the 
1 2th  century,  and  edited  from  the  best  MSS.  by  the  late  A.  P. 
Forbes,  D.C.L.,  Bishop  of  Brechin  (pub  15s),  not  sold  separately. 

Life  of  Saint  Coliimba,  founder  of  Hy,  written  by  Adamnan, 
ninth  Abbot  of  that  Monastery,  edited  by  Wm.  Reeves,  D.D., 
M.R.I. A.,  translated  by  the  late  A.  P.  Forbes,  D.C.L.,  Bishop 
of  Brechin,  with  Notes  arranged  by  W.  F.  Skene,  LL.D. 
(pub  15s),  not  sold  separately. 

The  Book  of  Pluscarden,  being  unpublished  Continuation 
of  Fordun's  Chronicle  by  ^L  Buchanan,  Treasurer  to  the  Dauphi- 
ness  of  France,  edited  and  translated  by  Skene,  2  vols  (pub  30s), 
I2s  6d,  sold  separately. 

A  Critical  Essay  on  the  Ancient  Inhabitants  of  Scotland, 
by  Thomas  Innes  of  the  Sorbonne,  with  Memoir  of  the  Author  by 
George  Grubb,  LL.D.,  and  Appendix  of  Original  Documents  by 
Wm.  F.  Skene,  LL.D.,  illustrated  with  charts  (pub  21s), 
los  6d,  sold  separately 

In  connection  with  the  Society  of  Antiquaries  of  Scotland,  a  uniform  series  of 
the  Historians  of  Scotland,  accompanied  by  English  translations,  and  illustrated 
by  notes,  critical  and  explanatory,  was  commenced  some  years  since  and  has 
recently  been  finished. 

So  much  has  recently  been  done  for  the  historj'  of  Scotland,  that  the  necessity 
for  a  more  critical  edition  of  the  earlier  historians  has  become  very  apparent. 
The  history  of  Scotland,  prior  to  the  15th  century,  must  always  be  based  to  a 
great  extent  upon  the  work  of  Fordun  ;  but  his  original  text  h.-is  been  made  the 
basis  of  continuations,  and  has  been  largely  altered  and  interpolated  by  his  con- 
tinuators,  whose  statements  are  ur.ually  quoted  as  if  they  belonged  to  the  original 
work  of  Fordun.  An  edition  discriminating  between  the  original  text  of  Fordun 
and  the  additions  and  alterations  of  his  continuators,  and  at  the  same  time  trac- 
ing out  the  sources  of  Fordun's  narrative,  would  obviously  be  of  great  importance 
to  the  right  understanding  of  Scottish  history. 

The  complete  set  forms  ten  handsome  volumes,  demy  8vo,  illustrated  with 
facsimiles. 

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2j  6-  34  George  IV.  Bridge^  Edinburgh.  1 1 

Campbell   {Colin,    Lord    Clyde) — Life  of,   illustrated    by 

Extracts   from   his    Diary    aiul    Corresjiondence,   by   Lieut. -Gen. 

Shad  well.   C.P>.,    with    portrait,   inajis,   and   plans,   2    vols,   8vo, 

clotli  (pub  36s),  6s  6d.     Blackwood  &  Sons. 

"In  .ill  the  annals  of '  Self-Help,' there  is  not  to  be  found  a  life  more  truly 
worthy  of  study  than  that  of  the  gallant  old  soldier.  The  simple,  self-denying, 
friend-helping,  brave,  patriotic  soldier  stands  proclaimed  in  every  line  of  General 
Sh.adwell's  admirable  memoir." — Dtack\voOii's  Magazine. 

De   U'itfs  {John,   Grand  Pensionary  of  Holland)  Life; 

or,  Tiventy  Years  of  a  Parliaiiienlary  RefidHic,  by  M.   A.    Pon- 

talis,   translated  by  S.   E.   Stephenson,   2  vols,  8vo,  cloth  (pub 

36s),  6s  6d.     Longman. 

Uniform  with  the  favourite  editions  of  Motley's  "  Netherlands"  and  "John  of 
Barnveld,"  &c. 

Johtison  {Doctor)  :  His  Friends  and  his  Critics,  by 
George  IJirkbcck  Hill,  D.C.L.,  crown  8vo,  cloth  (pub  8s),  2s. 
Smith,  Elder,  &  Co. 

"The  public  now  reaps  the  advantage  of  Dr  Hill's  researches  in  a  most 
readable  volume.  .Seldom  has  a  pleasanter  commentary  been  written  on  a 
literary  masterpiece.  .  .  .  Throughout  the  author  of  this  pleasant  volume 
has  spared  no  pains  to  enable  the  present  generation  to  realise  more  completely 
the  sjjhere  in  which  Johnson  talked  and  taught." — Sai2irday  Kevie-.v. 

Mathetvs    {Charles  James,   the   Actor) — Life   of,    chiefly 
Autobiographical,  with  Selections  from  his  Correspondence  and 
Speeches,  edited  by  Charles  Dickens,  portraits,  2  vols,  8vo,  cloth 
(pub  25s),  5s.    Macmillan,  1879. 
"  '1  he  book  is  a  charming  one  from  first  to  last,  and  Mr  Dickens  deserves  a 

full  measure  of  credit  for  the  care  and  discrimination  he  has  exercised  in  the 

business  of  editing." — Globe. 

Brazil  and  Java — The  Coffee  Culture  in  America,  Asia, 
and  Africa,    by  C.    F.    Van    Delden    Lavine,    illustrated    with 
numerous  plates,  maps,  and  diagrams,  thick  8vo,  cloth  (pub  25s), 
3s  6d.     Allen. 
.-^  useful  work  to  those  interested  in  the  production  of  coffee.     The  author  was 

charged  with  a  special  mission  to  Brazil  on  behalf  of  the  coffee  culture  and  coffee 

commerce  in  the  Dutch  possessions  in  India. 

Smith  {Captain  John,  1579-1631) — The  Adventures  and 
Discoveries  of.  sometime  President  of  Virginia  and  Admiral  of  New 
England,  newly  ordered  by  John  Ashton,  with  illustrations  taken 
by  him  from  original  sources,  i')ost  8vo,  cloth  ([lub  5s),  2s. 
Cassell. 

"  Full  of  interesting  particulars.  Captain  John  Smith's  life  was  one  peculiarly 
adventurous,  bordering  almost  on  the  romantic  ;  and  his  adventures  are  related 
by  himself  with  a  terse  and  rugged  brevity  that  is  very  charming." — Ed. 

Pinup's  Handy  General  Atlas  of  America,  com|jrising  a 
series  of  23  beautifully  executed  coloured  ma]is  of  the  United 
States,  Canada,  vS:c.,  with  Index  and  Statistical  Notes  by  John 
Bartholomew,  E.  R.G.S.,  crown  folio,  cloth  (pub  £\  is),  5s. 
Philip  &  .Son. 
Embraces  .Alphabetical  Indices  to  the  most  important  towns  of  Canada  and 

Newfoundland,  to  the  counties  of  Can.-ida,  the  principal  cities  and  counties  of  the 

United  States,  and  the  most  important  towns  in  Central  America,  Me.\ico,  the 

West  Indies,  and  South  America. 


Sent  Carriage  Free  to  atty  part  of  the  United  Kingdom  ofi 
receipt  of  Postal  Order  for  the  amount. 

JOHN  GRANT,  25  &  34  George  IV.  Bridge,  Edinburgh. 


JoJui  Grant,  Bookseller. 


Little's  (/.  Stanley)  South  Africa,  a  Sketch-Book  of  Men 

and  Manners,  2  vols,  Svo,  cloth  (pub  2 is),  3s  6d.     Sonnenschein. 

Oliphant  {Laurence) — The  Land  of  Gilead,  with  Ex- 
cursions in  the  Lebanon,  iUustrations  and  maps,  Svo,  cloth  (pub 
2is),  8s  6d.     Blackwood  &  Sons. 

"A  most  fascinating  book." — Oiserz'er. 

"A  singularly  agreeable  narrative  of  a  journey  through  regions  more  replete, 
perhaps,  with  varied  and  striking  associations  than  any  other  in  the  world.  The 
writing  throughout  is  highly  picturesque  and  effective." — Athemeum. 

"  A  most  fascinating  volume  of  travel.  .  .  .  His  remarks  on  manners,  customs, 
and  superstitions  are  singularly  interesting." — St  James's  Gazette. 

'  The  reader  will  find  in  this  book  a  vast  amount  of  most  curious  and  valuable 
information  on  the  strange  races  and  religions  scattered  about  the  country." — 
Saturday  Rcviciu. 

"An  admirable  work,  both  as  a  reeord  of  travel  and  as  a  contribution  to 
physical  science." — J'anity  Fair. 

Patterson  {B.  IL.) — The  New  Golden  Age,  and  Lnfiiience 

of  the  Precioits  Metals  tipoji  t/ie   IVar,   2  vols,  Svo,  cloth   (pub 
31S  6d),  6s.     Blackwood  &  Sons. 

COXTENTS. 

Vol  I. — The  Period  of  Discoverv  and  Ro.manxe  of  the  New  Golden 
Age,  1848-56. — The  First  Tidings — Scientific  Fears,  and  General  Enthusiasm — 
The  Great  Emigration— General  Effects  of  the  Gold  Discoveries  upon  Commerce 
— Position  of  Great  Britain,  and  First  Effects  on  it  of  the  Gold  Discoveries — The 
Golden  Age  in  California  and  Australia — Life  at  the  Mines.  A  Retrospect. — 
History  and  Influence  of  the  Precious  Metals  down  to  the  Birth  of  Modern 
Europe — The  Silver  Age  in  America — Effects  of  the  Silver  Age  upon  Europe — 
Production  of  the  Precious  Metals  during  the  Silver  Age  (1492-1810)— Effects  of 
the  Silver  Age  upon  the  Value  of  IMoney  (1492-1800). 

Vol  II. — Period  of  Renewed  Scarcitv. — Renewed  Scarcity  of  the  Precious 
Metals,  A.D.  1800-30— The  Period  of  Scarcity.  Part  XL— Effects  upon  Great 
Britain— The  Scarcity  lessens — Beginnings  of  a  New  Gold  Supply-— General 
Distress  before  the  Gold  Discoveries.  "Cheap"  and  "Dear"  Monev— On 
the  Effects  of  Changes  in  the  Quantity  and  Value  of  Money.  The  New  Golden 
Age.  — First  Getting  of  the  New  Gold— First  Diffusion  of  the  New  Gold— Indus- 
trial Enterprise  in  Europe— V.ast  E.xpansion  of  Trade  with  the  East  (a.d.  1855- 
75)— Total  Amount  of  the  New  Gold  and  Silver— Its  Influence  upon  the  World 
at  large— Close  of  the  Golden  Age.  1876-80— Total  Production  of  Gold  and 
Silver.  Period  1492-1848.— Production  of  Gold  and  Silver  subsequent  to  1848— 
Changes  in  the  Value  of  INIoney  subsequent  to  a.d.  1492.  Period  a.d.  1848 
and  subsequently.  Period  a.d.  1782-1865.— Illusive  Character  of  the  Board  of 
Trade  Returns  since  1S33— Growth  of  our  National  Wealth. 

Tunis,  Fast  and  Present,  with  a  Narrative  of  the  French 
Conquest  of  the  Regency,  by  A.  M.  Broadley,  Correspondent  of 
the  7'i7>ies  during  the  War  in  Tunis,  with  numerous  illustrations 
and  maps,  2  vols,  post  Svo,  cloth  (pub  25s),  6s.   Blackwood  &  Sons. 

"  Mr  Broadley  has  had  peculiar  facilities  in  collecting  materials  for  his 
volumes.  Possessing  a  thorough  knowledge  of  Arabic,  he  has  for  years  acted  as 
confidential  adviser  to  the  Bey.  .  .  .  The  information  which  he  is  able  to  place 
before  the  reader  is  novel  and  amusing.  ...  A  standard  work  on  Tunis  has 
been  long  required.  This  deficiency  has  been  admirably  supplied  by  the  author." 
— Morninsr  Post. 


Sent  Carriage  Free  to  a/ty  part  of  the  United  Kingdom 
on  receipt  of  Postal  Order  for  the  amount. 

JOHN  GRANT,  25  &  34  George  IV.  Bridge,  Edinburgli. 


2  J    O- 


J4  George  IV.  Bridge,  Edinburgh.  13 


Biirnct  {BisJiop) — History  of  tlie  RcforDiation  of  tJie 
Cliurch  of  England,  with  numerous  Illustrative  Notes  and  copious 

Index,  2  vols,  royal  8vo,  cloth  (pub  20s),  los.     Reeves  &  Turner, 

18S0. 

"  Burnet,  in  his  immortal  History  of  the  Reformation,  has  fixed  the  Protestant 
religion  in  this  country  as  long  as  any  religion  remains  among  us.  Burnet  is, 
without  doubt,  the  English  Eusebius." — Dr  Ai-thohpe. 

Burnefs  Histo7-y  of  ids  Own  Time,  from  the  Restoration 
of  Charles  II.  to  the  Treaty  of  the  Peace  of  Utrecht,  with 
Historical  and  Biographical  Notes,  and  a  copious  Index,  com- 
plete in  I  thick  volume,  imperial  Svo,  portrait,  cloth  (pub  £\  5s), 
5s  6d. 

"  I  am  reading  Burnet's  Own  Times.  Did  you  ever  read  that  garrulous 
pleasant  history?  full  of  scandal,  which  all  true  history  is  ;  no  palliatives,  but  all 
the  stark  wickedness  that  actually  gave  the  iiiotncntuni  to  national  actors  ;  none 
of  that  cursed  Hicincian  indifference,  so  cold,  and  unnatural,  and  inhuman,"  &c. 
— Charles  Lamb. 

Creasy  {Sir  Edward  S.) — History  of  England,  from  the 
Earliest  Times  to  the  End  of  the  Middle  Ages,  2  vols  (520  pp 
each),  Svo,  cloth  (pub  25s),  6s.       Smith,  Elder,  &  Co. 

Crime — Fii^es  [Lulie  Owen)  History  of  Crime  in  England, 
illustrating  the  Changes  of  the  Laws  in  the  Progress  of  Civilisa- 
tion from  the  Roman  Invasion  to  the  Present  Time,  Index,  2 
very  thick  vols,  Svo,  cloth  (pub  36s)  los.     Smith,  Elder,  &  Co. 

Globe  {The)  Encydopadia  of  Useful  Information,  edited 
by  John  j\I.  Ross,  LL.D.,  with  numerous  woodcut  illustrations,  6 
handsome  vols,  in  half-dark  persian  leather,  gilt  edges,  or  in  half 
calf  extra,  red  edges  (pub  £/\  l6s),  £2  8s.      Edinburgh. 
"  A  work  of  reference  well  suited  for  popular  use,  and  may  fairly  claim  to  be 

the  best  of  the  cheap  encyclopaedias.'' — Atheni/'jt/ii. 

History  of  the  War  of  Frederick  I.  against  the  Communes 
of  Lonihardy,  by  Giovanni  B.  Testa,  translated  from  the  Italian, 
and  dedicated  by  the  Author  to  the  Right  lion.  W.  E.  Gladstone, 
(466  pages),  Svo,  cloth  (pub  15s)  2s.     Smith,  Elder,  &  Co. 

Freemasonry — Eaton's  {Brother  C.  I.)  Freemasonry  and 
its  furispnidence,  according  to  the  Ancient  Landmarks  and 
Charges,  and  the  Constitution,  Laws,  and  Practices  of  Lodges 
and  Grand  Lodges,  Svo,  cloth  (pub  los  6d),  3s  6d.  Reeves  & 
Turner. 

Freemasonry,  its  Symbolism,  Religious  Nature,  and 

La-LL'  of  Perfection,  Svo,  cloth  (pub  los  6(.l),  2s  6d.      Reeves  & 
Turner, 

Freemasonry,  its   Two   Great  Doctrines,  The  Exist- 


ence of  God,   and  A    Future    State ;   also,   Its   Three    Masonic 

Graces,  Faith,  Hope,  and  Charity — in  I  vol,  Svo,  cloth  (pub  los), 

2s  6d.     Reeves  &  Turner. 

The  fact  that  no  such  similar  works  exist,  that  there  is  no  standard  of  autho- 
rity to  which  reference  can  be  made,  notwithstanding  the  great  and  growing 
number  of  Freemasons  and  Lodges  at  home,  and  of  those  in  the  British 
Colonies  and  other  countries  holding  Charters  from  Scotland,  or  affiliated  with 
Scottish  Lodges,  warrants  the  author  to  hope  that  they  may  prove  accept.-ible  to 
the  Order.  All  the  oldest  and  best  .luthorities — the  ablest  writers,  home  and 
foreign — on  the  history  and  principles  of  Freemasonry  have  been  carefully  con- 
sulted. 

Sent  Carriage  Free  to  any  part  of  the  United  Kingdom  on 
receipt  of  Postal  Order  for  the  amoutit. 

JOHN  GRANT,  25  &  34  George  IV.  Bridge,  Edinljurgli. 


14  /('^^'^  Gratit,  Bookseller^ 

Arnold's  {Cecil)  Great  Sayuigs  of  Shakesieare^  a  Com- 
prehensive Index  to  Shakespearian  Thought,  being  a  Collection 
of  Allusions,  Reflections,  Images,  Familiar  and  Descriptive  Pas- 
sages, and  Sentiments  from  the  Poems  and  Plays  of  Shakespeare, 
Alphabetically  Arranged  and  Classified  under  Appropriate  Head- 
ings, one  handsome  volume  of  422  pages,  thick  Svo,  cloth  (pub 
7s  6d),  3s.     Bickers. 

Arranged  in  a  manner  similar  to  Southgate's  "  Many  Thoughts  of  Many 
Minds."  This  index  differs  from  all  other  books  in  being  much  more  com- 
prehensive, while  care  has  been  taken  to  follow  the  most  accurate  text,  and  to 
cope,  in  the  best  manner  possible,  with  the  difficulties  of  correct  classification. 

The  most  Beautiful  and  Cheapest  Birthday  Book  Published. 

Birthday  Book — Friendship's  Diary  for  Every  Day  in  the 
Year,  with  an  appropriate  A'erse  or  Sentence  selected  from  the 
great  Writers  of  all  Ages  and  Countries,  each  page  ornamented  by 
a  richly  engraved  border,  illustrated  throughout,  crown  Svo,  cloth, 
bevelled  boards,  exquisitely  gilt  and  tooled,  gold  edges,  a  perfect 
gem  (pub  3s  6d),  is  gd.  Hodder  &  Stoughton. 
■J  his  book  practically  has  never  been  published      It  only  requires  to  be  seen 

to  be  appreciated. 

Dohson  (  W.  T.) — The  Classic  Poets,  their  Lives  and  their 
Times,  with  the  Epics  Epitomised,  452  pages,  crown  Svo,  cloth 
(pub  9s),  2s  6d.      Smith,  Elder,  &  Co. 
Contents. — Homer's  Iliad,  'I'he  Lay  of  the  Nibelungen,  Cid  Campeador, 

Dante's  Divina  Commedia,  Ariosto's  Orlando  Furioso,  Camoens'  Lusiad,  lasso's 

Jerusalem  Delivered,  Spenser's  Fairj'  Queen,  Milton's  Paradise  Lost,   Milton  s 

Paradise  Regained. 

English  Literatin-e :  A  Study  of  the  Prologue  and 
Epilogue  in  English  Literature,  from  Shakespeare  to  Uryden,  by 
G.  S.  B.,  crown  Svo,  cloth  (pub  5s),  is  6d.      Kegan  Paul,  1S84. 

Will  no  doubt  prove  useful  to  writers  undertaking  more  ambitious  researches 
into  the  wider  domains  of  dramatic  or  social  history. 

Bibliographer  {The),  a  Magazine  of  Old-Time  Literature, 
contains  Articles  on  Subjects  interesting  to  all  Lovers  of  Ancient 
and  Modern  Literature,  complete  in  6  vols,  4to,  antique  boards 
(pub  £2  5s),  15s.     Elliot  Stock. 

"  It  is  impossible  to  open  these  volumes  anywhere  without  .-ilighting  on  some 
amusing  anecdote,  or  some  valuable  literary  or  historical  note.' — Saturday 
RcviL  -M. 

Book-Lore,  a  ]Magazine  devoted  to  the  Study  of  BibHo- 

graphy,  complete  in  6  vols,  410,  antique  boards  (pub  f,z  5s),  15s. 
Elliot'Stock. 

A  vast  store  of  interesting  and  out-of-tht-way  information,  acceptable  to  the 
lover  of  books. 

Antiquary  {The),   a   >Lagazine  devoted  to  the  Study  of 
the  Past,  complete  set  in    15  vols,  410,   anticjue  Ijoards  (pub  ^5 
I2s6d),  ;i^i  15s.     Elliot  Stock. 
A  perfect  mine  of  interesting  matter,  for  the  use  of  the  student,  of  the  times  of 

our  forefathers,  and  their  customs  and  habit.s. 


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Oriental  Pottery  and  Porcelain,  with  Historic.il  Notices  of  each 
Manufactory,  preceded  by  an  Introductory  Essay  on  the  \'asa 
Fictilia  of  the  Greek,  Romano- British,  and  .Media-val  Eras,  7th 
edition,  revised  and  considerably  augmented,  with  upwards  of 
3000  jiotters'  marks  and  illustratious,  royal  8vo,  cloth  extra,  gilt 
top,  A I  15s.     London. 

Civil   Costume  of  England,  from    the    Conquest   to    the 
Present    Time,     drawn    from    Tapestries,    JNIonumental    Effigies, 
Illuminated  MS.S.,  by  Charles  Martin,  Portraits,  &c.,  61  full-page 
plates,  royal  8vo,  cloth  (pub  lOs  6d),  3s  6d.      Bohn. 
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Greek  costume  by  '1'.  Hope. 

Dyer  (Thomas  H.,  LL.D.) — Imitative  Art,  its  Principles 
and  Progress,  with  Preliminary  Remarks  on  Beauty,  Sublimity, 
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Great   Diamonds    of   the     World,    their    History    and 

Romance,  Collected  from  Official,  Private,  and  other  Sources, 
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Hamilton's  (Lady,  the  Mistress  of  Loid  Nelson)  Attitudes, 
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Jeivitt  {Llewellyn,  E.S.A.)  —  HalfHours  among  some 
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8vo,  cloth  gilt  (pub  (5s),  2s.     Allen  &  Co. 

Contents  : — Cromlechs.  Implements  of  p'lint  and  Stone,  Hron/e  Implements 
among  the  Celts,  Roman  Roads,  'I'emples.  Altars,  Sepulchral  Inscriptions,  An- 
cient Po'ttery,  .^rms  and  .Armour,  >labs  and  Brasses,  Coins,  Church  Bells,  Glass, 
Encaustic  Tiles,   Tapestry,  Persojial  Ornaments,  &c.'&c. 

King  {Rev.  C  IK) — Natural  History  of  Gems  and 
Decorative  Stones,  fine  paper  edition,  post  Svo,  cloth  (pub  lOs  6d), 
4s.     Bell  &  Sons. 

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work  .  .  .  by  far  the  best  treatise  on  this  branch  of  mineralogy  we  possess 
in  this  or  any  other  language." — Alhenii'utti. 

Leech's  {John)  Children  of  the  Mobiliiy,  Drawn  from 
Nature,  a  Series  of  Humorous  Sketches  of  our  Young  Plebeians, 
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Smith  {J.  Aioyr) — Ancient  Greek  Female  Costume,  illus- 
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Bacon  {F?-a)icis,  Lord) —  JForks,  both  English  and  Latin, 
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pub  £2  2s, )  I2S.      1879. 
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"Lord    Bacon   was  more   and   more  known,  and  his  books   more  and  more 

delighted   in ;    so   that   those   men   who   had   more   than   ordinary  knowledge  in 

human  affairs,  esteemed  him  one  of  the  most  capable  spirits  of  that  age." 

Burn  {R.  Scott) — The  Practical  Directory  for  the  Im- 
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Marti ?ieau  {IIa?'riet) — The  History  of  British  Pule  in 
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A  concise  sketch,  which  will  give  the  ordinary  reader  a  general  notion  of 
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since  it  first  became  connected  with  England.  The  book  will  be  found  to  state 
the  broad  facts  of  Anglo-Indian  history  in  a  clear  and  enlightening  manner;  and 
it  cannot  fail  to  give  valuable  information  to  those  readers  who  have  neither  time 
nor  inclination  to  study  the  larger  works  on  the  subject. 

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(pub  6s),  Is.      Smith,  Elder,  &  Co. 

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Southefs  {Robert)  Commonplace  Book,  the  Four  Series 
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Jones'  {Professor  T.  Ryvier)  General  Outline  of  the  Or- 
i^anization  of  the  Animal  Alii,i(dom,  and  Manual  of  Com])arative 
Anatomy,  illustrated  with  571  engravings,  thick  8vo,  half  roan, 
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Jones'  {Professor  T.  Rynie?-)  Natural  History  of  Animals, 
Lectures  delivered  before  the  Royal  Institution  of  Great  Britain, 
209  illustrations,  2  vols,  post  Svo,  cloth  (pub  24s),  3s  6d.  Van 
Voorst. 

Hunter's  {Dr  John)  Essays  on  Natural  History,  Ana- 
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Lectures  on  the  Hunterian  Collection  of  Fossil  Remains,  edited 
by  Professor  Owen,  portrait,  2  vols,  Svo,  cloth  (pub  32s),  5s. 
Van  Voorst. 

Forestry  and  Forest  Products  —  Prize  Essays  of  the 
Edinburgh  International  Forestry  Exhibition,  1884,  edited  by 
John  Rattray,  i\I.A.,  and  Hugh  Robert  Mill,  illustrated  with  10 
plates  and  21  woodcuts,  Svo,  cloth  (pub  i6s),  5s.     David  Douglas. 

Comprises  :— 

Brace's  Formation  and  Management  of  Forest  Tree  Nurseries. 

The  same,  by  Thomas  Berwick. 

Stalker's    Formation   and    Management   of    Plantations    on    different    Sites, 

Altitudes,  and  Exposures. 
The  same,  by  R.  E.  Hodson. 
Milne's  Afforesting  of  Waste  Land  in  Aberdeenshire  by  Means  of  the  Planting 

Iron. 
MacT-ean's  Culture  of  Trees  on  the  Margin  of  Streams  and  Lochs  in  Scotland, 

with  a  View  to  the  Preservation  of  the  B.inks  and  the  Conservation  of  Fish. 
Cannon's  Economical  Pine  Planting,  with  Remarks  on  Pine  Nurseries  and  on 

Insects  and  Fungi  destructive  to  Pines. 
Alexander  on  the  Various  Methods  of  Producing  and  Harvesting  Cinchona 

Bark. 
Robertson  on  the  Vegetation  of  Western  Australia. 
Brace's  Formation  and  INIanagement  of  Eucalypus  Plantations. 
Carrick's  Present  and  Prospective  Sources  of  the  Timber  Supplies  of   Great 

Britain. 
Oldrieve  on  the  best  Method  of  Maintaining  the  Supply  of  Teak,  with  Remarks 

on  its  Price,  Size,  and  Quality  ;  and  on  the  Best  Substitutes  for  Building 

Purposes. 
On  the  same,  by  J.  C.  Kemt. 

Alexander's  Notes  on  the  Ravages  of  Tree  and  Timber  Destroying  Insects. 
Webster's  Manufacture  and  Uses  of  Charcoal. 
Boulger's  Bye-Products,   Utilisation   of  Coppice  and  of  Branches    and  other 

Fragments  of  Forest  Produce,  with  the  View  of  Diminishing  Waste. 
Stonhill's  Paper  Pulp  from  Wood,  Straw,  and  other  Fibres  in  the  Past  and 

Present. 
Green's  Production  of  Wood  Pulp. 

T.  Anderson  Reid's  Preparation  of  Wood  Pulp  by  the  Soda  Process. 
Cross  and  Bevan's  Report  on  Wood  Pulp  Processes. 
Yoshida's   Lacquer  (Unts/ii),  Description,  Cultivation,  and  Treatment  of  the 

Tree,  the  Chemistry  of  its  Juice,  and  its  Industrial  Applications. 


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Scientific  Industries  Explained,  showing  how  some  of  the 
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excursions  over  the  whole  field  of  applied  science  ;  .  .  one  of  the  best  is  that 
on  'gilding  watch-movements.  A  systematic  arrangement  of  the  subjects  has 
been  purposely  avoided,  in  order  that  the  work  maj'  be  regarded  as  a  means  of 
intellectual  recreation." — Academy. 


Scientific  Industries  Explained,  Second  Series,  containing 
Articles  on  Electric  Light,  Gases,  Cheese,  Preservation  of  Food, 
Borax,  Scientific  Agriculture,  Oils,.  Isinglass,  Tanning,  Nickel- 
plating,  Cements  and  Glues,  Tartaric  Acid,  Stained  Glass,  Arti- 
ficial Manures,  Vulcanised  India-rubber,  Ozone,  Galvanic  Batteries, 
Magnesia,  The  Telephone,  Electrotyping,  &c.  &c.,  with  illustra- 
tions, crown  8vo,  cloth  (pub  2s  6d),  is. 

Mechanical  Industries  Explained,  showing  how  many 
useful  Arts  are  practised,  with  illustrations,  by  Alexander  Watt, 
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Iron,  Cutlery,  Goldbeating,  Bookbinding,  Lithography,  Jewellery, 
Crayons,  Balloons,  Needles,  Lapidary,  Ironfounding,  Pottery  and 
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ander Watt,  crown  8vo,  illustrated  boards  (pub  is),  6d. 
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Amalgams. — To   Produce  Artificial  Ices. — Attraction  :   Capillary  Attraction. — 
Carbon. — Carmine. — How  to  Make  Charcoal. — To  Prepare  Chlorine. — Contrac- 
tion of  Water — Crj'stallisation. — Distillation. — Eflect  of  Carbonic  Acid  on  Animal 
Life. — Electricity. — Evaporation, — E.xpansion  by  Heat,  &c. — Heat. — Hydrogen 
Gas. — Light. — To  Prepare  O.xygen. — Photographic  Printing.  —  How  to  Make  a 
Fountain. — Refractive    Power    of  Liquids.  —  Refrigeration. — Repulsion. — Solar 
Spectrum. — Specific  Gravity  Explained. — Structure  of  Crystals  —  Sympathetic 
Ink,  &-c.  &c. 


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'■  As  the  names  of  Thomas  Reid,  of  Dugald  Stewart,  and  of  Sir  William  Hamil- 
ton will  be  associated  hereafter  in  the  history  of  Philosophy  in  Scotland,  as 
closely  as  those  of  Xenophanes,  Parmenidcs,  and  Zeno  in  the  School  of  Elea,  it 
is  a  singular  fortune  that  Sir  William  Hamilton  should  be  the  collector  and 
editor  of  the  works  of  his*  predecessors.  .  .  .  The  chair  which  he  filled 
for  many  years,  not  otherwise  undistinguished,  he  rendered  illustrious." — 
Athetueiim. 

Dante — The  Divina  Com  media,  translated  into  English 
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cannot  refraiin  from  acknowledging  the  many  good  qualities  of  Mr  Ford's  trans- 
lation, and  his  labour  of  love  will  not  have  been  in  vain,  if  he  is  able  to  induce 
those  who  enjoy  true  poetry  to  study  once  rtlore  the  masterpiece  of  that  literature 
from  whence  the  great  founders  of  English  poetry  drewrso  much  of  their  sweet- 
ness and  power." — Atkeiueiiin. 

Polloks  i^Robert)   The  Course  of  Time,  a  Poem,  beauti- 
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achievement." — D.  M.  MoiR. 

Monthly  Interpreter,  a  N'cio  Expository  Magazine,  edited 
by  the  Rev.  Joseph  S.  Exeli,  M.A.,  joint-editor  of  tlie  "Pulpit 
Commentary,"  iS:c.,  complete  from  the  commencement  to  its  close, 
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and  accessible  form  with  what  is  being  said  and  done  by  the  ablest  British ,  Ameri- 
can, and  foreign  theologians,  thinkers,  and  Biblical  critics,  in  matters  Biblical, 
theological,  scientific,  philosophical,  and  social. 

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his  own  casks  ;  this  will  give  a  permanent  value  to  his  works,  when  the  produc- 
tions of  copyists  will  be  forgotten." — C.  H.  Si'I.kgko.n. 

Skene  {IVilliam  P.,  LL.D.,  Historiographer-Royal  for 
Scotland) — The  fjospel  History  for  the  Voung,  being  Lessons  on  the 
Life  of  Chris.l,  adapted  for  use  in  Families  and  in  Sunday  Schools, 
3  maps,  3  vols,  crown  Svo,  cloth  (pub  15s),  6s.  Douglas. 
"  In  a  spirit  altogether  unsectarian  provides  for  the  young  a  simple,  interest- 
ing, and  thoroughly  charming  history  of  our  Lord." — Literary  ll'ortd. 

"  The  '  (lospel  History  for  the  Voung  '  is  one  of  the  most  valuable  books  of 
the  kind."      'J he  Cliurclunan. 


John  Grant,  Bookseller,  Edinburgh. 


By  the  Authoress  of  '■^  The  Land  a'  the  Leal."  £     s.   D. 

Nairne's   (Baroness)    Life  and   Songs,  with   a 

Memoir,  ami  Poems  of  Caroline  Oliphant  the  Younger,  edited 
by  Dr  Charles  Rogers,  portrait  and  other  illustrations,  crown 
8vo,  cloth  (pub  5s)  Griffin       026 

"  This  publication  is  a  good  service  to  the  memorj-  of  an  excellent  and  gifted 
lady,  and  to  all  lovers  of  Scottish  Song." — Scotsntan. 

Ossian's   Poems,  translated   by   Macpinerson, 

24mo,  best  red  cloth,  gilt  (pub  2s  6d)  0     I     6 

A  dainty  pocket  edition. 

Pertiishire— Woods,   Forests,  and    Estates  of 

Perthshire,  ^vith  Sketches  of  the  Principal  families  of  the 
County,  by  Thomas  Hunter,  Editor  of  the  Pe>ihshire  Consti- 
tutional and  Journal,  illustrated  li'ith  jo  iciood  engravings, 
crown  8vo  (564  pp),  cloth  (pub  12s  6d)  Perth       0     4     6 

"Altogether  a  choice  and  most  valuable  addition  to  the  County  Histories  of 
Scotland." — Glasgoiij  Daily  Mail. 

Duncan  (John,  Scotch  Weaver  and  Botanist) 

— Life  of,  with  Sketches  of  his  Friends  and  Notices  of  the 
Times,  by  Wm.  Jolly,  F.R.S.E.,  H.M.  Inspector  of  Schools, 
etched  portrait,  crown  8vo,  cloth  (pub  9s)  Kegan  Paul       0     3     6 

"We  must  refer  the  reader  to  the  book  itself  for  the  many  quaint  traits  of 
character,  and  the  minute  personal  descriptions,  which,  taken  together,  seem  to 
give  a  life-like  presentation  of  this  humble  philosopher.  .  .  .  The  many  inci- 
dental notices  which  the  work  contains  of  the  weaver  caste,  the  workman's 
esprit  de  corps,  and  his  wanderings  about  the  country,  either  in  the  performance 
of  his  work  or,  when  that  was  slack,  taking  a  hand  at  the  harvest,  form  an  interest- 
ing chapter  of  social  history.  The  completeness  of  the  work  is  considerably 
enhanced  by  detailed  descriptions  of  the  district  he  lived  in,  andof  his  numerous 
friends  and  acquaintance." — Atkcncen»i. 

Scots  (Ancient)— An  Examination  of  the  An- 
cient History  of  Ireland  and  Iceland,  in  so  far  as  it  concerns 
the  Origin  of  the  Scots  ;  Ireland  not  the  Hibernia  of  the 
Ancients  ;  Interpolations  in  Bede's  Ecclesiastical  History  and 
other  Ancient  Annals  affecting  the  Early  History  of  Scotland 
and  Ireland — the  three  Essays  in  one  volume,  crown  Svo,  cloth 
(pub  4s)  Edinburgh,  1883       O     I     O 

The  first  of  the  above  treatises  is  mainly  taken  up  with  an  investigation  of  the 
early  History  of  Ireland  and  Iceland,  in  order  to  ascertani  which  has  the  better 
claim  to  be  considered  the  original  country  of  the  Scots.  In  the  second  and 
third  an  attempt  is  made  to  show  that  Iceland  was  the  ancient  Hibernia,  and 
the  country  from  which  the  Scots  came  to  Scotland  ;  and  further,  contain  a 
review  of  the  evidence  furnished  by  the  more  genuine  of  the  early  British  Annals 
against  the  idea  that  Ireland  was  the  ancient  Scuti-.. 

Traditional  Ballad  Airs,  chiefly  of  the  North- 
Eastern    Districts    of    Scotland,    from   Copies 

gathered  in  the  Counties  of  Aberdeen,  Banft",  and  Moray,  by 
Dean  Christie,  and  William  Chrh^tie,  Monquhitter,  with  the 
Words  for  Singing  and  the  Music  arranged  for  the  Pianoforte 
and  Harmonium,  illustrated  with  Notes,  giving  an  Account  of 
both  Words  and  Music,  their  Origin,  &c. ,  2  handsome  vols, 
4to,  half  citron  morocco,  gilt  top,  originally  published  at 
£^  4s  by  Edmonston  &  Douglas,  reduced  to  I   10     0 


Sent  Carriage  Free  to  any  part  of  the  United  Kingdom  on 
receipt  of  Postal  Order  for  the  arnoujit. 

JOM  GEMT,  25  &  34  George  lY.  Bridge,  Eclinburgli. 

/ 


UNIVERSITY  OF  CALIFORNIA  LIBRARY 

Los  Angeles 

This  book  is  DUE  on  the  last  date  stamped  below. 


NOV  03 


1978 


SSl  Jf  f  178 


^1* 


)\}n  i 


Form  L9-25jn-9,'47(A5618)444 


AT 

LOS  ANGELES 

LIBRARY 


^i  Kill 

3  1158  00310  0566' 


SOUTHERN  REGIONAL  LIBRARY  FACILITY 


AA    000  799  891     7 


